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Green Bay Packers Thread (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter Interseptopus
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Pip's Invitation
Footballguy
Plz beat the Cowboys. Thx.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Christian Watson, Jayden Reed, Romeo Doubs, Dontayvion Wicks, Luke Musgrave, and Tucker Kraft have a combined cap hit next year of ~$11.1 million.
Allen Lazard's cap hit next year is ~$13.2 million.
Allen Lazard's cap hit next year is ~$13.2 million.
Balco
Footballguy
I have a ton to say about this weird season and roster developments and when I have time I will write my thoughts (I mean I can write a novel on why I was wrong about Jordan Love).
As to this post - the Packers honestly do not have to do a thing regarding their receivers/tight ends next year. It is a really good group with players that haven’t even reached their ceiling yet. Never in a million years would I have thought I would write that.
For the first time in several years, I am really optimistic about this roster. There are fixable holes on defense but there is a solid nucleus of young talent here.
rockaction
Footballguy
I'm really getting the feeling that the coaching staff wanted him to force it to Watson and he wanted to spread it around. That was the feeling I got as a Watson GM in dynasty. Just watching the body language of Love when they would break the huddle and stuff like that. Looked like he was beat if he thought Watson was his first read. That's really wildly speculative, but it's what I saw.
I think he's at his best when he's able to have his first read be somebody who gets open quickly rather than having it be a late developing play from the outset. It might not be Watson but rather the play design itself. He's shown he can hang with his reads through and until pressured, but I get the feeling he's more comfortable with plays where the read is designed to be open quickly rather than open later. And who isn't?
Either way, he's been really good. I'm impressed.
⚡DEADHEAD⚡
Footballguy
I wonder if there's something to be said for not having a true #1 WR but having 4 legit #2 WRs with strong tight-end play. Teams are successful with this model. New England and NYG won Super Bowls with it, KC and Baltimore currently navigate it (Flowers is on his way though).
Thinking of Aaron, I keep thinking to how he kept looking for Devonta in the 49er playoff loss at the expense of hitting open receivers. That needed to change, and I guess that meant those players needed to leave. I think I prefer what we have now to what we had then. Something to be said for balance and youth.
Thinking of Aaron, I keep thinking to how he kept looking for Devonta in the 49er playoff loss at the expense of hitting open receivers. That needed to change, and I guess that meant those players needed to leave. I think I prefer what we have now to what we had then. Something to be said for balance and youth.
The Kerminator
Footballguy
Well it's been a nice season. The season was over as of Sunday. If you wander over to this week's game thread, I'm not sure why the Packers even waste the fuel to San Francisco.
sho nuff
Footballguy
Chicago Hooligan
Footballguy
why what happened
Chicago Hooligan
Footballguy
The Packers have hired Jeff Hafley as defensive coordinator. Considered a surprise choice, Hafley was not publicly rumored to have interviewed for any NFL jobs this year as far as I know. He was head coach at Boston College the past 4 seasons, and before that coached with Ohio State. In the pros he has previously been a defensive backs coach with TB, CLE, SF.
For the record (i.e. so we can get mad about it later), here are the known interviewees for DC prior to this move:
For the record (i.e. so we can get mad about it later), here are the known interviewees for DC prior to this move:
- Brandon Staley - SF hired him as assistant head coach
- Bobby Babich - BUF promoted him to DC
- Aden Durde - SEA hired him as DC
- Christian Parker - PHI hired him as defensive backs coach
- Dennard Wilson - TEN hired him as DC
- Zach Orr - BAL promoted him to DC
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sho nuff
Footballguy
Its a wait and see with any hire. On the surface, I like that he seems philosophically opposed to Barry’s passive style of defense. People who have coached with him or played for him seem to speak highly of him. Head coach experience that shoes he can command the whole room and keep Lafleur focused on the offense. And he has coached with some of go i like the defensive results they have had (mainly Salah).
Concerns…even in today’s world of playing so much nickel, his base would more of a 4-3 and not sure how our personnel align with that. Definitely don’t think we have a safety to play his preferred style at this point.
Concerns…even in today’s world of playing so much nickel, his base would more of a 4-3 and not sure how our personnel align with that. Definitely don’t think we have a safety to play his preferred style at this point.
Alex P Keaton
Footballguy
Read an article somewhere that said we played nickel more than 50% of the time anyway, so the base D doesn’t really matter. Biggest issue is we need a safety who can handle the speed and coverage skills to play single-high safety scheme that he prefers.
Love that he typically wants to play aggressive, press man-to-man coverage. Watching Barry continually go with either zone (which the players seemed to struggle with) or man-to-man with a 10-yard cushion was just maddening.
sho nuff
Footballguy
Packers active on day 1?
Josh Jacobs and Xavier McKinney brought in.
Unfortunately Aaron Jones will be gone. Will miss that guy, what he brings as a leader on and off the field.
McKinney deal looks more than I expected GB to pay a safety.
Draft now seems wide open and as likely they go OL than a defensive player (though still need more LBs).
Josh Jacobs and Xavier McKinney brought in.
Unfortunately Aaron Jones will be gone. Will miss that guy, what he brings as a leader on and off the field.
McKinney deal looks more than I expected GB to pay a safety.
Draft now seems wide open and as likely they go OL than a defensive player (though still need more LBs).
Alex P Keaton
Footballguy
Really hate paying a safety that much money. And we will find out now who is better — A Jones or J Jacobs. Think we will find out it is Jones…..gonna miss that dude.
Longtucky Lemmings
Footballguy
I'm crushed to see Jones go. Such a high-character guy who seemed to add a lot to the franchise and locker room.
I'll push back on you a bit, though, @Alex P Keaton . While it is possible (perhaps even likely) Jones is better than Jacobs, I'm not sure the difference is huge...and Jacobs has 3+ years of age benefit over Jones plus Jones' injuries and cap hit were tough to invest in at his age.
massraider
Footballguy
I think that was a slick move for Jacobs, while all those WRs are cheap.
Team friendly deal as well.
Team friendly deal as well.
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
Sad day with Showtyme and #69 gone. We all loved those guys. Runyan Jr. not on the same level but I appreciated his time in GB and he was so emotional at his locker after the season it also hurts.
sho nuff
Footballguy
The downside of it as a business.
Chicago Hooligan
Footballguy
With Campbell, Bakhtiari and Jones cut loose, the Packers' only player older than 30 right now is Preston Smith.
I'm pretty surprised by today's cash splash. Josh Jacobs is a player you legitimately want to handle 300+ touches, which GB's offense hasn't appeared built for in recent years (it's been over a decade since Eddie Lacy last did it). Good YAC receiver, runs power up the gut for TDs, gets to the edge quickly. Jones is still a valuable player and I wish he wasn't leaving... but Jacobs is faster, stronger and only one season removed from a performance far above what Jones can offer at this point. The flipside of that is you're paying for All-Pro production in Jacobs basically at market price. The Packers must agree with the appraisal of the 2024 RB draft class as a weak one. It may be difficult to get "value" out of Jacobs at this price point but it's worth it if he increases the efficiency of the running game. GB only had 10 rushing TDs in 2023 and Jordan Love scored 4 of them.
For all the free agent safeties available this year I was really only looking at Geno Stone, Kamren Curl and Xavier McKinney as the other options are 30+ and/or just not very exciting. Not expecting GB would sign McKinney, when I looked into him he seemed like a solid player but not exceedingly good at anything. This chonky contract indicates the Packers expect McKinney hasn't reached his peak yet and is the perfect fit for Jeff Hafley's defense. Again, it's possible the Packers don't love the top safety prospects in this year's draft (presumably Kamren Kinchens and Tyler Nubin). But now they don't strictly have to draft one.
I'm pretty surprised by today's cash splash. Josh Jacobs is a player you legitimately want to handle 300+ touches, which GB's offense hasn't appeared built for in recent years (it's been over a decade since Eddie Lacy last did it). Good YAC receiver, runs power up the gut for TDs, gets to the edge quickly. Jones is still a valuable player and I wish he wasn't leaving... but Jacobs is faster, stronger and only one season removed from a performance far above what Jones can offer at this point. The flipside of that is you're paying for All-Pro production in Jacobs basically at market price. The Packers must agree with the appraisal of the 2024 RB draft class as a weak one. It may be difficult to get "value" out of Jacobs at this price point but it's worth it if he increases the efficiency of the running game. GB only had 10 rushing TDs in 2023 and Jordan Love scored 4 of them.
For all the free agent safeties available this year I was really only looking at Geno Stone, Kamren Curl and Xavier McKinney as the other options are 30+ and/or just not very exciting. Not expecting GB would sign McKinney, when I looked into him he seemed like a solid player but not exceedingly good at anything. This chonky contract indicates the Packers expect McKinney hasn't reached his peak yet and is the perfect fit for Jeff Hafley's defense. Again, it's possible the Packers don't love the top safety prospects in this year's draft (presumably Kamren Kinchens and Tyler Nubin). But now they don't strictly have to draft one.
Chicago Hooligan
Footballguy
I'm not doing a mock draft because who cares. However, because I think OL is the way to go this year, I do have these two predictions:
- Round 1: (#25 overall) - Tyler Guyton (OT, Oklahoma) - adding Guyton at RT allows the Packers to potentially move Zach Tom to an interior position.
- Round 3: (#88 or #91 overall) - Brandon Coleman (OL, TCU) - played more LT as a senior and wasn't very good, but has played well at guard. Reflects all the measurables of a likely GB pick.
sho nuff
Footballguy
You feel like who could be in the 2nd? Morgan? Why? Even Belichick was saying teams would have taken him before the end of the 1st. Don't get caught up on pre draft mocks and things...
Also, DeJean went how far down in the 2nd? Seems a lot of teams were not as high on him as all the pre draft stuff...including GB who passed on the chance (apparently looking to trade down even before Philly made their move for him).
I think their draft went pretty well for what they do and are looking for...its always a wait and see. But not sure I get the "not in a good way" with this draft.
SWC
Bromigo
the 7th round defensive back from penn state kalen king is i think going to be a steal he broke up a ton of passes his sophmore year and was thought of as a first rounder but stuck around a year and didnt have a good junior didnt break up as many passes is that just because teams scouted him and stopped throwing to his guy who knows but i like the looks of him a lot take that to the bank brochacho
Drezden
Footballguy
Defense-Offensive tackle, Offensive tackle-Defense, so monotonous and expected. I hope I'm mistaken, but Morgan's choice brings back memories of the Derek Sherrod pick in 2011. I recall doubting that selection and as usual, people would say "You can't go wrong with OT," but guess what? You actually can, my friends. Additionally, the consistent trend of prioritizing Defense in our drafts every year makes me anticipate a Defense that resembles the Berlin Wall. Something seems off here, maybe it's the system?
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
Final comp for the Aaron Rodgers trade is in:
2023 first-round pick - LVN
2023 second-round pick - Musgrave
2023 sixth-round pick - Carlson
2024 second-round pick (could have been a first) - Edgerrin Cooper, Jaco Monk and Evan Williams (after multiple trade-downs)
2023 first-round pick - LVN
2023 second-round pick - Musgrave
2023 sixth-round pick - Carlson
2024 second-round pick (could have been a first) - Edgerrin Cooper, Jaco Monk and Evan Williams (after multiple trade-downs)
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
I'm not expecting much if anything from the rookies this season. The big questions on defense for me are whether Stokes can return, whether some of 2-3 year guys can step up (LVN, Walker, Wyatt) and whether Gary and Alexander can stay healthy.
OrganizedChaos
Footballguy
What do the Packers fans feel about the backup QB and starting K situation? As to the kicker, I am feeling much better now. We had to move on from Carlson (just had no trust he would make it on any kick) and I think Joseph would have been about the same. As to the backup QB, I would have preferred more experience than Willis but I feel he is an upgrade. We had to get better than Clifford and Pratt as backups. Speaking of that I was hoping we would keep Pratt on the practice squad. To me Clifford looked horrible and about the same he looked at Penn State (hated that pick from the moment they drafted him but assumed they must have seen something I didn't in college).
nittanylion
Footballguy
So, no Watson...Wicks was already splitting snaps evenly with him in the one WR position.
Jayden Reed is Jayden Reed, pure slot, only on the field in 3 WR sets.
Doubs suspended. Leaves an opening.
Is Bo Melton a legitimate 'Next Man Up"?
Jayden Reed is Jayden Reed, pure slot, only on the field in 3 WR sets.
Doubs suspended. Leaves an opening.
Is Bo Melton a legitimate 'Next Man Up"?
The Kerminator
Footballguy
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Good luck this week, fellas.
Should be a good slugfest. Tough, physical, explosives - y'all got a great team, & it's the best environment to play in anywhere.
Willis has been getting the jobdown done. Your safeties are elite. Offense is humming. I don't think people realize how complete of a team GB is, by far the best team Detroit has faced.
Still a chance Love plays but I am presuming ML opts to give him two weeks to heal up?
Should be a good slugfest. Tough, physical, explosives - y'all got a great team, & it's the best environment to play in anywhere.
Willis has been getting the job
Still a chance Love plays but I am presuming ML opts to give him two weeks to heal up?
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Alex P Keaton
Footballguy
Beating Indy or Tenn with Willis is one thing. Beating Detroit? “Ain’t no ballpark neither. That #### ain’t even the same sport.”
I’m hoping for a tough, competitive game. Somehow squeaking out a win without Love seems like it would take a miracle.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
If you can generate pass rush without blitzing, stop the run, and keep the offense on schedule, should go down to the wire.
Two things Goff is truly excellent at this year is throwing when facing pressure & first down EPA. He’s always been a blitz beater, but typically wilts when the pocket gets compressed. This year he is the best in the NFL v pressure by a good margin. The other thing is they rarely go backwards on first down. Only Mahomes has been better on 1st.
Defensively there are some new faces but same looks. Play a lot of man coverages and expect the guys to win their battles. Branch and Joseph have 9 interceptions and the two highest PFF Grades at Safety. Jack Campbell has improved, as has the finally healthy Levi Onwuzurike (DI we’re using outside since the top 3 ED players are on IR.)
Paschal will be back at the other ED this week. Cancer survivor at age 18, something came up last week in his annual screening so he had a procedure to dig it out (s/b fine.) We’re not the same without Hutch and desperately need Brad Holmes to bring someone in via trade.
Branch moved from Slot Corner to box S, frees him up to he a playmaker, playing at a very high level. The corners are grabby, physical, love to compete in press man. They get flagged a lot but Aaron Glenn can live with it either way, the defense plays as aggressively as the Offense.
Team has a lot of flaws (pass protection - OL is 17th, getting to the QB without blitzing) but if one of the three phases is off the other two pick it up.
Dan Campbell has everyone rowing in the same direction & Brad Holmes reminds me of that Snoop Dog meme (“MFer don’t miss”); refreshing stuff after getting kicked around by GB & everyone else for pretty much the entirety of my existence.
We’re gonna lose some games along the way. This one is a pretty tough challenge though obviously sans Love maybe not as tough as expected.
I have Goff & Love rostered so I’m happy I don’t have to root for the Love-Reed stack this week.
Two things Goff is truly excellent at this year is throwing when facing pressure & first down EPA. He’s always been a blitz beater, but typically wilts when the pocket gets compressed. This year he is the best in the NFL v pressure by a good margin. The other thing is they rarely go backwards on first down. Only Mahomes has been better on 1st.
Defensively there are some new faces but same looks. Play a lot of man coverages and expect the guys to win their battles. Branch and Joseph have 9 interceptions and the two highest PFF Grades at Safety. Jack Campbell has improved, as has the finally healthy Levi Onwuzurike (DI we’re using outside since the top 3 ED players are on IR.)
Paschal will be back at the other ED this week. Cancer survivor at age 18, something came up last week in his annual screening so he had a procedure to dig it out (s/b fine.) We’re not the same without Hutch and desperately need Brad Holmes to bring someone in via trade.
Branch moved from Slot Corner to box S, frees him up to he a playmaker, playing at a very high level. The corners are grabby, physical, love to compete in press man. They get flagged a lot but Aaron Glenn can live with it either way, the defense plays as aggressively as the Offense.
Team has a lot of flaws (pass protection - OL is 17th, getting to the QB without blitzing) but if one of the three phases is off the other two pick it up.
Dan Campbell has everyone rowing in the same direction & Brad Holmes reminds me of that Snoop Dog meme (“MFer don’t miss”); refreshing stuff after getting kicked around by GB & everyone else for pretty much the entirety of my existence.
We’re gonna lose some games along the way. This one is a pretty tough challenge though obviously sans Love maybe not as tough as expected.
I have Goff & Love rostered so I’m happy I don’t have to root for the Love-Reed stack this week.
ChiefD
Footballguy
This is one excellent reverse jinx post.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Gjallarhorn
Footballguy
This sounds like Lou Holtz
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Baritone voice but otherwise not too far off.
The internet says he’s an Enneagram 1 - Perfectionist. I’m a solid 8 and it’s hard wired.
Also he’s 87, born a year after my dad. So you think I’m old? You think you’re better than me?
Gjallarhorn
Footballguy
Lou Holtz had a way of making it sound like his Notre Dame teams had no chance of winning before each game. They could be #1 in the nation and playing a directional school and the directional school would be the best team he has ever seen. Kidding of course, but the platitudes towards the Packers' team reminded me of this.
ChiefD
Footballguy
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
I found a glimmer of hope! Although this game appears set up to be a one-sided affair, it seems the Lions have not played a single outdoor game so far this season. Sad!
Although it will be balmy in Titletown on Sunday, it seems likely to be raining through some if not most of the game. According to *some guy on twitter* Jared Goff has not played a football game in the rain since 2021. How is that possible?
Although it will be balmy in Titletown on Sunday, it seems likely to be raining through some if not most of the game. According to *some guy on twitter* Jared Goff has not played a football game in the rain since 2021. How is that possible?
RaidersAreOne
Footballguy
Is Love looking like he'll suit up?
packer_junkie
Footballguy
Crazy to think this would be year 3 in a row without a playoff berth if the field didn't expand.
I don't love how MLF has developed the offense around Jacobs (I love Jacobs) but tons of shot gun runs, not much PA---> passing game never really seems in rythm. He needs to get better. They drafted his guy. Traded Rodgers and wasted his pick on LVN over guys like Gonzalez and JSN. Paid his guy BIG money.
Offensively, I still wonder if they need a big time WR to really break through. I go back and forth. Kraft is really good. The WRs all show flashes but all struggle to 1) stay healthy 2) make contested catches (doubs is the best but the worst seperator) and 3) get open consistently vs the better more physical defenses. Also not sure they can afford what someone like CD or even DK metcalf would potentially cost in terms of draft capital plus contract when the defensive front is so crappy.
Next two years will be make or break.
Defensively, I think if the secondary was fully healthy it would be pretty dang good. Problem is it never was. The Front 4 + edge guys, for what they have invested in them and paid them-- is flat out embarassing. KC has a couple moments but nothing close to a top 8-10 interior guy. Same with Gary. Both being paid BIG money. LVN is a waste. Wyatt is a solid ascending player inside. I would bring 23 back and try to find the guys up front that Hafley needs. The secondary w/ another year and Walker/Cooper should be really solid next year.
I don't love how MLF has developed the offense around Jacobs (I love Jacobs) but tons of shot gun runs, not much PA---> passing game never really seems in rythm. He needs to get better. They drafted his guy. Traded Rodgers and wasted his pick on LVN over guys like Gonzalez and JSN. Paid his guy BIG money.
Offensively, I still wonder if they need a big time WR to really break through. I go back and forth. Kraft is really good. The WRs all show flashes but all struggle to 1) stay healthy 2) make contested catches (doubs is the best but the worst seperator) and 3) get open consistently vs the better more physical defenses. Also not sure they can afford what someone like CD or even DK metcalf would potentially cost in terms of draft capital plus contract when the defensive front is so crappy.
Next two years will be make or break.
Defensively, I think if the secondary was fully healthy it would be pretty dang good. Problem is it never was. The Front 4 + edge guys, for what they have invested in them and paid them-- is flat out embarassing. KC has a couple moments but nothing close to a top 8-10 interior guy. Same with Gary. Both being paid BIG money. LVN is a waste. Wyatt is a solid ascending player inside. I would bring 23 back and try to find the guys up front that Hafley needs. The secondary w/ another year and Walker/Cooper should be really solid next year.
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