Have you thought of moving out of the country? (2 Viewers)

[NutterButter]

I also don't understand the sentiment of not wanting to visit other countries.  It's the same mindset of "knowing" you hate a certain food you've never tried.  Believe me, there's a lot of places in the world that aren't scary hell holes like some make them out to be.

Maybe someday, but until I knock off a bunch of places that I want to see in the US, I don't really have the desire to take that additional logistic step, probably an additional cost step as well as the additional layer of unfamiliarity being a solo traveler.   

 

[Manster]

Starting to feel that way as well.  There are some places Id like to see overseas, especially in Europe, but there is SO much to see in this wonderful country that I could spend the rest of my life traveling and probably not see it all.

Backpacking on the west coast........you could spend 10 lifetimes doing it, and never hit all the cool places......I love exploring in my own backyard.

 

[supermike80]

Backpacking on the west coast........you could spend 10 lifetimes doing it, and never hit all the cool places......I love exploring in my own backyard.

We were in San Fran at a little cigar bar and this guy came in.  Started talking to him.  He had been backpacking for the last like 3 weeks all over the place.  Great stories about where he had been and what hed seen.   Sounded so darn cool.

 

[NutterButter]

Backpacking on the west coast........you could spend 10 lifetimes doing it, and never hit all the cool places......I love exploring in my own backyard.

Yup.  Plan on making quite a few trips out there from San Diego all the way up to Vancouver.   Not much of backpacker though.  I don't need luxury, but a comfy bed, hot shower, good wifi is a must.   

 

[PinkydaPimp]

Maybe someday, but until I knock off a bunch of places that I want to see in the US, I don't really have the desire to take that additional logistic step, probably an additional cost step as well as the additional layer of unfamiliarity being a solo traveler.   

Man i think i enjoyed traveling solo the most.  Travel the world. So many great destinations.  And more than that the learning experience and seeing other cultures is something everyone should get a chance to do.  
 

but even seeing all 50 states is nice.  I think i have about 5 left to see.  #bucketlist

 

[The Z Machine]

Most likely candidate would be Dublin.

Kinda boring IMO. 

I think Lisbon, Portugal might be the ticket for you.  Good cost of living, good weather, good food, beaches, euro currency, 1 hour closer to the US time zones compared to the continent, good international airport connections with TAP, decent inexpensive wine...

 

[PinkydaPimp]

Kinda boring IMO. 

I think Lisbon, Portugal might be the ticket for you.  Good cost of living, good weather, good food, beaches, euro currency, 1 hour closer to the US time zones compared to the continent, good international airport connections with TAP, decent inexpensive wine...

+1 for Lisbon. 

 

[Opie]

Its been explained...that explanation gets called "hogwash" "B and S" and "rewriting history".

It's been "explained" by Democrats, trying to distance themselves from their despicable past and putting it all on the Republicans.

The Democrats are the only one's who buy that load of   (butt-sweat).

 

[sho nuff]

It's been "explained" by Democrats, trying to distance themselves from their despicable past and putting it all on the Republicans.

The Democrats are the only one's who buy that load of   (butt-sweat).

Or its quite historically accurate if people look at what actually happened and policies and so on.  Also...gets explained that way by a lot of people who aren't "Democrats".  And what is to distance themselves from?  Most of the people explaining it were not alive.  There was a clear shift...and it seems the opposite of your conclusion here.  It appears to be pushed by people who want to put it all on Democrats...but you do you man...

 

[Opie]

Or its quite historically accurate if people look at what actually happened and policies and so on.  Also...gets explained that way by a lot of people who aren't "Democrats".  And what is to distance themselves from?  Most of the people explaining it were not alive.  There was a clear shift...and it seems the opposite of your conclusion here.  It appears to be pushed by people who want to put it all on Democrats...but you do you man...

It's funny that it's only the Democrats who explain it this way, dontcha think?
Please...show me this explained by anyone who's not a Democrat or from a Democrat rag.

The only "shift" was the Democrats shift to a different kind of plantation when they shifted to a bigger government.

 

[Mile High]

It's been "explained" by Democrats, trying to distance themselves from their despicable past and putting it all on the Republicans.

The Democrats are the only one's who buy that load of   (butt-sweat).

Let's put the despicable past not on a name of a  brand but the people who were part of it. 

 

[sho nuff]

It's funny that it's only the Democrats who explain it this way, dontcha think?
Please...show me this explained by anyone who's not a Democrat or from a Democrat rag.

The only "shift" was the Democrats shift to a different kind of plantation when the shifted to a bigger government.

I would disagree that it is only democrats who do...but its not my job to continue to educate you.  Link after link after link has been posted about it...some of you will never accept it...oddly, those who are hook line and sinker in with Donald Trump's version of the GOP.

Its a waste of time trying to ever convince some of you of anything.  Best thing we can do is continue to point out the obvious bogus talking points so they don't spread and become "truth" to some people.

 

[Opie]

I would disagree that it is only democrats who do...but its not my job to continue to educate you.  Link after link after link has been posted about it...some of you will never accept it...oddly, those who are hook line and sinker in with Donald Trump's version of the GOP.

Its a waste of time trying to ever convince some of you of anything.  Best thing we can do is continue to point out the obvious bogus talking points so they don't spread and become "truth" to some people.

oh darn  

"Educate"...or "Indoctrinate"?

Sorry buddy....daddy taught me HOW to think... before people like you could try to "educate" me on WHAT to think.

 

[Opie]

Did you learn to mostly blame others? 
Did you learn that you are under attack by a them? 
Did you learn the white hegemony is more American and Patriotic than others? (no)
Did you learn God smiles more on the Republican Party and it’s ideals?  (Agnostic)

(pssst. If so, you were told what to think.)

I learned about "projection".
I learned that you are responsible for your actions.

 

[Ramblin Wreck]

History is important. I’m mainly concerned with the despicable present. I judge that by a few things:

• Alignment with high principles 
  
• Adherence to Constitution
  
• Adherence to laws
  
• Honesty
  
• Integrity
  
• Empathy
  
• Fair Play
  
• Transparency
  
• Competence 
  
• Who is racist
  
• Who is misogynistic 
  
• Who is xenophobic 
  
• Who is authoritarian 
  
• Who puts good of themselves over public good
  
• Effectiveness at enacting policy in alignment with the above 
  

It’s a pretty good list to gauge despicable, I think. I’ll be voting straight Democrat from President to dog catcher until every Trumpian Republican has been washed from government.

 at your conclusion based on your list

 

[Joe Bryant]

You guys please drop this back and forth. I think we all get it. 

 

[Ramblin Wreck]

Each of the areas on your list that you bolded.. I could give multiple examples from the past week where Trump himself has violated them. Are there outlier examples of where Democrats have as well? Sure, but that doesn’t represent the DNA of the party as Trumpism does to the present GOP.

Although right wing pundits stoke fear and spread disinformation, reality is one party is far more misaligned with my list than the other when you weigh actual evidence. 

Don’t expect to turn you, but encouraged that more Americans are finally measuring the harm done and waking up to these truths.

Outliers.  Oh okay.  And my post had zero to do with Trump

 

[Ramblin Wreck]

Between that and having to worry about our kids being shot from rampant gun violence, it makes sense to start looking for better investments in a prosperous future,

Stay away from Chicago!

 

[Rirruto]

Ultimately, I'm not going anywhere. If I had one of those cool jobs you could do anywhere in the world, it would be fun to think about. 

We have Trump, and his general awfulness. I was going to type a litany of the bad, but it's really too long and has been hashed and re-hashed. Plus the general anti-science/smart person of the far right.

But we also have a movement trying to radically cut funding for police departments. Without taking a position on the mechanics of that policy or the reasoning behind it (it's super complex and doesn't really have anything to do with this topic), it's my belief that it will have the opposite effect of what the people pushing for it want. It's like if we cut funding for schools and magically hoped for better teachers. 

(I'm going to leave out any discussion of White Nationalism or Black athletes and entertainers posting racist stuff that's been getting amplified lately because I believe that it's a small number of dum dums and is getting amplified by people and foreign government with a stake a weaker, more divided US. But I'd be lying if racism wasn't also a reason to think about getting away).

But also we're in the middle of a pandemic with a truly all-time bad leader. Civil unrest, recession, etc. is really to be expected. I think we'll make it through all of this just fine.

 

[Ramblin Wreck]

Love the snarky replies. What is the GOP doing specifically to combat the historical inequities and racist policies that led to the conditions in inner city Chicago? Other than calling for, “Law and Order!”... which is really a dog whistle to crack down further reactively... are they planning anything at all upstream that doesn’t involve writing them off or imprisonment? If so, what? Education? Fair housing? Economic opportunity? Gun control?

(I lived in Chicago in the early 90s and heard a gang murder 6 feet from my window.* Went outside and watched the kid die. Was awful. If only I’d known the remedy all along was... what exactly?)

* I have heard people murdered by guns 3 times that were confirmed. Probably more, since I’ve heard a lot of gunshots followed by wailing, and don’t know the outcome. I think one of the major contributors is lack of gun control, a unique disease we have here. Part of my inkling to leave may be that one shouldn’t expect to hear people shot to death that many times, and it won’t happen in other countries.

Not snarky. You’re the one blaming the GOP for everything.  What has the democrat party done? They run Chicago.  Awful gun problem in Chicago.  I don’t care what you think of trump or GOP I’m laughing at your high and mighty BS that the other party somehow isn’t corrupt as I bolded for you already 

 

[Drunken Cowboy]

Kinda boring IMO. 

I think Lisbon, Portugal might be the ticket for you.  Good cost of living, good weather, good food, beaches, euro currency, 1 hour closer to the US time zones compared to the continent, good international airport connections with TAP, decent inexpensive wine...

I almost moved there in 2009.

 

[Witz]

A NZ retirement for American citizens is a pipe dream for most. It’s financially not realistic 

How come?

 

[acarey50]

SO - to try get back to the point of the thread instead of the back and forth -

Have I ever thought of moving/living elsewhere? - Yes, I've thought about it (reasoning below)

Would the results of the upcoming election change that? No, it would not change that, lessen, or increase the interest.

I've got family in England, Ireland, Australia and New Zealand. Now, all of my immediate family (parents, siblings and of course children) live in California, so I have no immediate desire to move. But once my kids are off to college or at least settled, depending on where they end up, I'd be open to relocating within the US, but not sure how realistic. My wife and kids really enjoy the beach, so southern California is ideal for that absent the cost of living. I don't mind the beach (despite what my wife will tell you), I just don't like the crowds and sand in my crack. I'd much prefer a beach house that opened up onto a beach, where I could stay up at the house enjoying some tasty beverages, manning the barbeque, watching a game and popping out onto the beach when I felt like it to toss a ball/frisbee/etc. around with the kids. But, alas, that is damn expensive. I'm not opposed to settling down into a lower cost of living area, a bit quieter, with a bit more land, 1 story house that still has room for family to visit, etc.

Now, as for out of the country, we've got family in England, Ireland, Australia and New Zealand. While I could conceivable consider moving to one of those places, if it was not with my kids (and presumably their families as they get older) I don't see that as a realistic or desirable option - but a long extended stay in those places would be nice. My mother in law has a house in the southern part of Ireland - I'd love to spend a relaxing 4+ weeks there, preferable with no responsibility other than some meandering walks to the beach or through town, a lot of good books, afternoon naps and just a complete unplugging from everything else. Been there and seen the touristy things, so I wouldn't really feel the need to travel the country and see everything. Doing something similar in England would be good - again, been there enough times that I don't have a strong desire for the touristy things, though I would not mind having some time to truly explore all the great museums they have again - but would prefer spending time with family I don't get to see very often and just unplugging/getting away.

I could also see doing an extended Australia/New Zealand thing - 6 weeks, but as I've never been as an adult (technically lived in New Zealand for about 9 months, but I was 6 months old at the time), I would want to do a lot more exploring there - I suppose it could be scouting if I could see settling down there. But, again, I don't see moving internationally as a realistic thing unless the entire family did it.

 

[skol asylum]

Probably pretty unrealistic to leave the country but I will say we are both getting tired of alot of the political leanings here in AZ. Moved here in 2001 from Fargo and NW Minnesota before that and at the time said might just be a few years. Might be time to explore other parts of the country. Changing jobs scares me somewhat though. So much safer to stay with what you have and what you know. Never been to the Pacific NW and am curious what it's like.

 

[Slapdash]

Kinda boring IMO. 

I think Lisbon, Portugal might be the ticket for you.  Good cost of living, good weather, good food, beaches, euro currency, 1 hour closer to the US time zones compared to the continent, good international airport connections with TAP, decent inexpensive wine...

Portugal does have one of the cheaper "Golden Visa" options in the EU

 

[wikkidpissah]

I have a global role that could be based anywhere with good connectivity close to an international airport. Replacing a guy based in the Netherlands. 

If Trump wins, we will likely leave the country. Brought it up to my boss this week, and he says he’d be willing to talk after the election. Move would be on our dime, and might affect my compensation, since region based is a factor. Realistically, anywhere in North America or Europe. New Zealand or Australia would be a great change, and lived in Australia for six months 10 years ago and loved it. But too many expensive long flights and calls in the middle of the night. 

Most likely candidate would be Dublin. 

6-hour days in winter on top of the Wet can really wear down those that aint used to it pretty quickly.

 

[Manster]

I wasn't impressed with Ireland......everything was owned by the wealthy, and it's a pretty small country.......everything was really expensive as well......In Dublin we were told to avoid many of local watering holes based on the locals would be looking to pick fights with Yanks.

I mean, the country is green, and kinda pretty, but everything seemed kind of locked up to the average person.......that was my impression of western Europe in general.....meh

 

[Manster]

Probably pretty unrealistic to leave the country but I will say we are both getting tired of alot of the political leanings here in AZ. Moved here in 2001 from Fargo and NW Minnesota before that and at the time said might just be a few years. Might be time to explore other parts of the country. Changing jobs scares me somewhat though. So much safer to stay with what you have and what you know. Never been to the Pacific NW and am curious what it's like.

Portland and Seattle are expensive S-holes.  Pretty conservative once you get away from those two

 

[acarey50]

I wasn't impressed with Ireland......everything was owned by the wealthy, and it's a pretty small country.......everything was really expensive as well......In Dublin we were told to avoid many of local watering holes based on the locals would be looking to pick fights with Yanks.

I mean, the country is green, and kinda pretty, but everything seemed kind of locked up to the average person.......that was my impression of western Europe in general.....meh

My experience on multiple visits has been quite the opposite - every local pub we went to was full of nice people, looking to chat and just have a good time, sing songs, tell stories, etc. and this is mix of touristy places (Jameson distillery and some places in Dublin) and small local places (small coastal towns, etc.).

 

[Manster]

My experience on multiple visits has been quite the opposite - every local pub we went to was full of nice people, looking to chat and just have a good time, sing songs, tell stories, etc. and this is mix of touristy places (Jameson distillery and some places in Dublin) and small local places (small coastal towns, etc.).

We had a pretty large group, and stood out, apparently.......I liked Scotland more than Ireland.  Although we spent more time in Scotland.  

I couldn't see myself living in either place.  I am hopelessly American, and I'm ok with that.......streets too narrow, cars too small, etc...

 

[acarey50]

We had a pretty large group, and stood out, apparently.......I liked Scotland more than Ireland.  Although we spent more time in Scotland.  

I couldn't see myself living in either place.  I am hopelessly American, and I'm ok with that.......streets too narrow, cars too small, etc...

Could be that - I've been in mixed size groups while there, and, not saying it applies/applied to your group, there is definitely something to the "stereotypical American tourist"  -  loud, boisterous, wondering why everyone doesn't speak English (obviously not for Ireland, but other countries), etc.

Plus the world would be boring if everyone liked exactly the same thing.

 

[urbanhack]

Portland and Seattle are expensive S-holes.  Pretty conservative once you get away from those two

Have you been to Portland? My guess is your ignorant answer is based on what you see on fox news 

I moved here from Chicago four years ago and it’s the furthest thing in the world from a #### hole.  

 

[urbanhack]

This was dumb when right wingers posited it when Obama was president and it's dumb now when lefties posit it with Trump. 

You're not leaving. Get real. 

Well maybe there are just a few things that are different between right now and what happened under Obama’s term...but keep that simple both sides angle going.

There are federal, unmarked agents pulling people off the streets in the city where I live and my passport issued by our federal government isn’t really worth much at the current moment. I’d say things might radically different, but that’s just me.

https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-is-costing-the-us-passport-its-privileged-status-2020-7

 

[Andy Dufresne]

Well maybe there are just a few things that are different between right now and what happened under Obama’s term...but keep that simple both sides angle going.

There are federal, unmarked agents pulling people off the streets in the city where I live and my passport issued by our federal government isn’t really worth much at the current moment. I’d say things might radically different, but that’s just me.

https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-is-costing-the-us-passport-its-privileged-status-2020-7

We're not talking about taking a trip here. We're taking about leaving America and becoming a citizen somewhere else. You're not going to do that. 

Secondly, that federal agents thing is bad. They shouldn't be doing that.

 

[Manster]

Have you been to Portland? My guess is your ignorant answer is based on what you see on fox news 

I moved here from Chicago four years ago and it’s the furthest thing in the world from a #### hole.  

I'm 45 minutes away.....Oregon born and raised.....maybe relative to Chicago its a lesser S hole, but it's still an S hole....its an S hole with Mt. Hood and the Pacific Ocean close by.......my guess is my definition of an S hole is different than yours........you couldn't pay me enough money to move to chicago

 

[Manster]

My dad actually used to live up off Burnside before it became trendy and artsy fartsy.....back when it was more like skid row.

I don't know where all the homeless live now, cuz when I'm in Portland I'm passing thru to get somewhere else.......I see lots of em living along the freeway though.

 

[TheMagus]

Have you been to Portland? My guess is your ignorant answer is based on what you see on fox news 

I moved here from Chicago four years ago and it’s the furthest thing in the world from a #### hole.  

Portland is one of the most beautiful and pristine cities I've been to in the world and I travel a lot - all over the world. The only thing that bothered me was the rain but that is a big part of what makes it so beautiful and green.

 

[Atomic Punk]

I wasn't impressed with Ireland......everything was owned by the wealthy, and it's a pretty small country.......everything was really expensive as well......In Dublin we were told to avoid many of local watering holes based on the locals would be looking to pick fights with Yanks.

I mean, the country is green, and kinda pretty, but everything seemed kind of locked up to the average person.......that was my impression of western Europe in general.....meh

Just tell everyone you are Canadian and they will treat you like gold!

 

[Manster]

Portland is one of the most beautiful and pristine cities I've been to in the world and I travel a lot - all over the world. The only thing that bothered me was the rain but that is a big part of what makes it so beautiful and green.

Summers in western OR are great.....rest of the year it's dreary, rainy, kind of coldish.......the climate in the rest of the state is much better if you like the sun......a lot of things grow well in western OR if you're into that....

I much prefer less traffic, less expensive cost of living, and four seasons.......

OR is mostly rural and mostly laid back......Portland can kind of reflect that, but it's still a city with city issues.

 

[urbanhack]

Summers in western OR are great.....rest of the year it's dreary, rainy, kind of coldish.......the climate in the rest of the state is much better if you like the sun......a lot of things grow well in western OR if you're into that....

I much prefer less traffic, less expensive cost of living, and four seasons.......

OR is mostly rural and mostly laid back......Portland can kind of reflect that, but it's still a city with city issues.

I played disc golf six times in Jan and Feb this year in shorts and a t-shirt. So you must live in Estacada, Salem, St. Helens, or Sandy?  You said 45 min from PDX, just curious where you live.

 

[Manster]

I played disc golf six times in Jan and Feb this year in shorts and a t-shirt. So you must live in Estacada, Salem, St. Helens, or Sandy?  You said 45 min from PDX, just curious where you live.

I'm in the Salem area

Some years the winters are mild.  Some years it rains, and is coldish, till the 4th of July.  I dig it when it's nice, I just prefer the a drier climate with a lil more extremes......Eastern OR gets snow, wind, great summer thunderstorms, crazy skies, crisp, clear air.......when I moved here it's like.....socked in, drizzly, dank smelling stagnate air.....then we get a nice summer, rinse, repeat.

 

[The Z Machine]

Portland on a nice summer day might be my favorite US city + weather combo.