Irvin on Roethlisberger (1 Viewer)

[Leeroy Jenkins]

So if somebody puts out on the first date, they arent allowed to say no?

Certainly they may say no. But at minimum, it would say that she has no moral compunction about putting out on the first date if she's into it.My only point, which we seem to have gotten away from, is that the inclusion of Ben's "Satan shirt" is strictly gratuitous and its inclusion is meant to - literally - demonize him in the reading public's mind. If he had a shirt on that said "I like to punch girls in the back of the neck with my keys if they say no" then I would say it has some bearing upon the events. It doesn't mean the statement is true or that he chose such course of action in this case, but it at least has some relation to the facts at hand. The "Satan shirt" does not. Strictly inflammatory.As for the rest of your post, I agree with most of it...except to say that if he's guilty of F1, I would hope and expect the punishment to be far more severe.

Oh, if he's found guilty, hell yes. Under my scenario he was only charged with it and plead out.

 

[fatness]

Wrong. See the title of the thread! Perhaps Ben wanted his bodyguards as close by as possible as witnesses to what went down, fearing potential false accusations from crazy money hungry women.

Perhaps he wanted that. But honestly, trying to present witness testimony in court from someone hired to listen to your sexual encounters in public rest rooms is something I'd bet won't go across to well.

 

[E_Smith]

Wrong. See the title of the thread! Perhaps Ben wanted his bodyguards as close by as possible as witnesses to what went down, fearing potential false accusations from crazy money hungry women.

Perhaps he wanted that. But honestly, trying to present witness testimony in court from someone hired to listen to your sexual encounters in public rest rooms is something I'd bet won't go across to well.

maybe, maybe not. he could present it as "I instructed my bodyguards to make sure I wasn't alone with any women that night." Then he could say that the woman invited him to the restroom, which was very small and obviously couldn't handle more than two people. He made a mistake of judgment by entering the bathroom with her, but his bodyguards were just doing their assigned jobs as best they could.

 

[ScottyFargo]

Wrong. See the title of the thread! Perhaps Ben wanted his bodyguards as close by as possible as witnesses to what went down, fearing potential false accusations from crazy money hungry women.

Perhaps he wanted that. But honestly, trying to present witness testimony in court from someone hired to listen to your sexual encounters in public rest rooms is something I'd bet won't go across to well.

maybe, maybe not. he could present it as "I instructed my bodyguards to make sure I wasn't alone with any women that night." Then he could say that the woman invited him to the restroom, which was very small and obviously couldn't handle more than two people. He made a mistake of judgment by entering the bathroom with her, but his bodyguards were just doing their assigned jobs as best they could.

Another way he could twist this is to say that the bodyguards are his gay lovers (and then wink; "I now pronounce you Chuck and Larry-type deal) and that the woman tricked him into entering the room by telling him she wanted to show him purses, and then she forced herself on him.

 

[E_Smith]

Wrong. See the title of the thread! Perhaps Ben wanted his bodyguards as close by as possible as witnesses to what went down, fearing potential false accusations from crazy money hungry women.

Perhaps he wanted that. But honestly, trying to present witness testimony in court from someone hired to listen to your sexual encounters in public rest rooms is something I'd bet won't go across to well.

maybe, maybe not. he could present it as "I instructed my bodyguards to make sure I wasn't alone with any women that night." Then he could say that the woman invited him to the restroom, which was very small and obviously couldn't handle more than two people. He made a mistake of judgment by entering the bathroom with her, but his bodyguards were just doing their assigned jobs as best they could.

Another way he could twist this is to say that the bodyguards are his gay lovers (and then wink; "I now pronounce you Chuck and Larry-type deal) and that the woman tricked him into entering the room by telling him she wanted to show him purses, and then she forced herself on him.

LOL. I like that version a lot. This might just be what happened! Poor gay Ben.

 

[5-ish Finkle]

Salt being poured into ones game IS very painful and should be feared

But it is not to be feared as much as salt being poured into one's womb. *shudder*

by IB:I checked. Some dude from Wal-Mart has already copyrighted the phrase.

I'm not really surprised.At all.Jerks.

 

[5-ish Finkle]

Poor gay Ben.

'Stop calling me that, or I'll give you SUCH a pinch!!!'

 

[fatness]

Jason LaCanfora

Steelers star quarterback Ben Roethlisberger flew to Georgia on Saturday to cooperate with an investigation into a recent sexual assault charge filed against him, according to a source with knowledge of the situation. According to the source, Roethlisberger and other associates who were with him the night that the alleged incident took place, spent Saturday answering questions from the Georgia Bureau of Investigations.

At this point there has been no meeting scheduled between Roethlisberger and Commissioner Roger Goodell, according to sources, though Roethlisberger did fly back to Pittsburgh after leaving Georgia to meet with ownership and team officials about the matter.

 

[ScottyFargo]

Jason LaCanfora

Steelers star quarterback Ben Roethlisberger flew to Georgia on Saturday to cooperate with an investigation into a recent sexual assault charge filed against him, according to a source with knowledge of the situation. According to the source, Roethlisberger and other associates who were with him the night that the alleged incident took place, spent Saturday answering questions from the Georgia Bureau of Investigations.

At this point there has been no meeting scheduled between Roethlisberger and Commissioner Roger Goodell, according to sources, though Roethlisberger did fly back to Pittsburgh after leaving Georgia to meet with ownership and team officials about the matter.

This is a lot of movement without any charges filed. Does this indicate that charges are less likely? Feels that way to me.

 

[road warrior]

Wrong. See the title of the thread! Perhaps Ben wanted his bodyguards as close by as possible as witnesses to what went down, fearing potential false accusations from crazy money hungry women.

Perhaps he wanted that. But honestly, trying to present witness testimony in court from someone hired to listen to your sexual encounters in public rest rooms is something I'd bet won't go across to well.

maybe, maybe not. he could present it as "I instructed my bodyguards to make sure I wasn't alone with any women that night." Then he could say that the woman invited him to the restroom, which was very small and obviously couldn't handle more than two people. He made a mistake of judgment by entering the bathroom with her, but his bodyguards were just doing their assigned jobs as best they could.

Another way he could twist this is to say that the bodyguards are his gay lovers (and then wink; "I now pronounce you Chuck and Larry-type deal) and that the woman tricked him into entering the room by telling him she wanted to show him purses, and then she forced herself on him.

Now we have a new meaning for Ben Gay.

 

[Godsbrother]

Wrong. See the title of the thread! Perhaps Ben wanted his bodyguards as close by as possible as witnesses to what went down, fearing potential false accusations from crazy money hungry women.

Perhaps he wanted that. But honestly, trying to present witness testimony in court from someone hired to listen to your sexual encounters in public rest rooms is something I'd bet won't go across to well.

maybe, maybe not. he could present it as "I instructed my bodyguards to make sure I wasn't alone with any women that night." Then he could say that the woman invited him to the restroom, which was very small and obviously couldn't handle more than two people. He made a mistake of judgment by entering the bathroom with her, but his bodyguards were just doing their assigned jobs as best they could.

Another way he could twist this is to say that the bodyguards are his gay lovers (and then wink; "I now pronounce you Chuck and Larry-type deal) and that the woman tricked him into entering the room by telling him she wanted to show him purses, and then she forced herself on him.

Now we have a new meaning for Ben Gay.

NTTAWT

 

[E_Smith]

Jason LaCanfora

Steelers star quarterback Ben Roethlisberger flew to Georgia on Saturday to cooperate with an investigation into a recent sexual assault charge filed against him, according to a source with knowledge of the situation. According to the source, Roethlisberger and other associates who were with him the night that the alleged incident took place, spent Saturday answering questions from the Georgia Bureau of Investigations.

At this point there has been no meeting scheduled between Roethlisberger and Commissioner Roger Goodell, according to sources, though Roethlisberger did fly back to Pittsburgh after leaving Georgia to meet with ownership and team officials about the matter.

This is a lot of movement without any charges filed. Does this indicate that charges are less likely? Feels that way to me.

I don't think thats what it means. All it means is that Ben agreed to be interviewed. I'm sure this was tightly monitored by his attorney and he likely only spoke about certain things that could not further incriminate him. The general rule is that there is never any benefit to speak to authorities investigating you...they are not "neutral" in any way, and will use anything you say against you if they can.

 

[Godsbrother]

I don't think thats what it means. All it means is that Ben agreed to be interviewed. I'm sure this was tightly monitored by his attorney and he likely only spoke about certain things that could not further incriminate him. The general rule is that there is never any benefit to speak to authorities investigating you...they are not "neutral" in any way, and will use anything you say against you if they can.

I don't this really tells you anything other than this investigation is still ongoing.

 

[ScottyFargo]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/...er-the-weekend/

Though Roethlisberger indeed was in Georgia, a source with knowledge of the situations tells us that he did not speak with investigators. Instead, Roethlisberger met with his legal representatives.

 

[Godsbrother]

More info:

Though reports surfaced that Ben Roethlisberger flew to Georgia over the weekend to cooperate with his sexual assault investigation, Profootballtalk reports the quarterback was only in town to meet with his legal team.

That being the case, Roethlisberger has not met with investigators since the alleged incident occurred. His attorney has promised to meet with police and provide a DNA sample, though the probe could take weeks or even months to come to a conclusion

From purely a Steelers fan perspective this sucks. It would certainly be helpful to the Steelers to find out the fate of their starting QB before the draft...

 

[E_Smith]

More info:

Though reports surfaced that Ben Roethlisberger flew to Georgia over the weekend to cooperate with his sexual assault investigation, Profootballtalk reports the quarterback was only in town to meet with his legal team.

That being the case, Roethlisberger has not met with investigators since the alleged incident occurred. His attorney has promised to meet with police and provide a DNA sample, though the probe could take weeks or even months to come to a conclusion

From purely a Steelers fan perspective this sucks. It would certainly be helpful to the Steelers to find out the fate of their starting QB before the draft...

I can't imagine the probe is going to take months. I just don't see how there is that much evidence to collect and analyze.

 

[CrossEyed]

More info:

Though reports surfaced that Ben Roethlisberger flew to Georgia over the weekend to cooperate with his sexual assault investigation, Profootballtalk reports the quarterback was only in town to meet with his legal team.

That being the case, Roethlisberger has not met with investigators since the alleged incident occurred. His attorney has promised to meet with police and provide a DNA sample, though the probe could take weeks or even months to come to a conclusion

From purely a Steelers fan perspective this sucks. It would certainly be helpful to the Steelers to find out the fate of their starting QB before the draft...

I can't imagine the probe is going to take months. I just don't see how there is that much evidence to collect and analyze.

Ben's lawyer might want to stretch it out as long as he can so that some of the public anger subsides a bit.

 

[E_Smith]

More info:

Though reports surfaced that Ben Roethlisberger flew to Georgia over the weekend to cooperate with his sexual assault investigation, Profootballtalk reports the quarterback was only in town to meet with his legal team.

That being the case, Roethlisberger has not met with investigators since the alleged incident occurred. His attorney has promised to meet with police and provide a DNA sample, though the probe could take weeks or even months to come to a conclusion

From purely a Steelers fan perspective this sucks. It would certainly be helpful to the Steelers to find out the fate of their starting QB before the draft...

I can't imagine the probe is going to take months. I just don't see how there is that much evidence to collect and analyze.

Ben's lawyer might want to stretch it out as long as he can so that some of the public anger subsides a bit.

I think that is true, but he can only do so much to stretch it out...like delaying interviewing Ben or DNA testing perhaps. But I doubt they need this evidence to charge him. Besides, as soon as he is charged, no matter when it happens, the media will go bonkers and the public will be angry all over again.

 

[E_Smith]

More details:

Davis wrote, "The GBI and Milledgeville Police Department did interview a number of the individuals (on Saturday) that were with Ben the night the incident allegedly occurred. We have not been allowed to interview Roethlisberger."

Davis said Ed Garland, Roethlisberger's attorney, has cooperated with the investigation and has made the Steelers quarterback "available for everything we have asked with the exception of interviewing him at this point."

When asked if Garland had told authorities whether Roethlisberger would be made available in the future, Davis told Naqi, "(Garland) has not decided for sure one way or the other."

Davis added, "According to the Bill of Rights, (Roethlisberger) doesn't have to speak with police if he doesn't want to but (Garland) has been very cooperative in every other way."

Davis declined to say whether Garland was considering having Roethlisberger submit a sample of his DNA for testing.

espn article

 

[Godsbrother]

More details:

Davis wrote, "The GBI and Milledgeville Police Department did interview a number of the individuals (on Saturday) that were with Ben the night the incident allegedly occurred. We have not been allowed to interview Roethlisberger."

Davis said Ed Garland, Roethlisberger's attorney, has cooperated with the investigation and has made the Steelers quarterback "available for everything we have asked with the exception of interviewing him at this point."

When asked if Garland had told authorities whether Roethlisberger would be made available in the future, Davis told Naqi, "(Garland) has not decided for sure one way or the other."

Davis added, "According to the Bill of Rights, (Roethlisberger) doesn't have to speak with police if he doesn't want to but (Garland) has been very cooperative in every other way."

Davis declined to say whether Garland was considering having Roethlisberger submit a sample of his DNA for testing.

espn article

Absolutely. The job of the police is to collect enough evidence to bring charges. There is little to be gained in helping them with the process.

 

[ScottyFargo]

More details:

Davis wrote, "The GBI and Milledgeville Police Department did interview a number of the individuals (on Saturday) that were with Ben the night the incident allegedly occurred. We have not been allowed to interview Roethlisberger."

Davis said Ed Garland, Roethlisberger's attorney, has cooperated with the investigation and has made the Steelers quarterback "available for everything we have asked with the exception of interviewing him at this point."

When asked if Garland had told authorities whether Roethlisberger would be made available in the future, Davis told Naqi, "(Garland) has not decided for sure one way or the other."

Davis added, "According to the Bill of Rights, (Roethlisberger) doesn't have to speak with police if he doesn't want to but (Garland) has been very cooperative in every other way."

Davis declined to say whether Garland was considering having Roethlisberger submit a sample of his DNA for testing.

espn article

Absolutely. The job of the police is to collect enough evidence to bring charges. There is little to be gained in helping them with the process.

It goes without saying that holds true even more so if you're actually guilty. That's why I never understand when my wife watches those 48 hours show how easily the criminals talk. I wouldn't say a word if I were questioned. I am too naive and I would talk if I knew for a fact I wasn't guilty but the police don't know either way, they're looking for anything they can get that helps make a sensible case.

 

[CrossEyed]

Davis said Ed Garland, Roethlisberger's attorney, has cooperated with the investigation and has made the Steelers quarterback "available for everything we have asked with the exception of interviewing him at this point."

So then he's been available for what, exactly?

 

[Banger]

He's available for everything except if they want to talk with him. That's funny. The "he's cooperating" even though he clearly isn't spin.

Big Ben is lawyered up and obviously has something to hide. If she was some crackpot that he had nothing to do with he'd quickly go in there with his lawyer, shake hands with the investigators, sign some Big Ben footballs for them and be on his way. That obviously isn't the case.

Its a shame because I've always liked "the persona of him" without knowing much personally about him but after reading the various reports of what went down, other stories and what happened just a year ago he really seems like a complete scumbag. Its too bad.

I've been a lifelong Steeler fan and it's disappointing seeing so many good Steeler posters lining up behind Ben and defending him just because he wears Black and Gold. I'm not saying he's definitely guilty but I don't think a lot of people can objectivley view a situation without their team colored glasses.

 

[E_Smith]

Davis said Ed Garland, Roethlisberger's attorney, has cooperated with the investigation and has made the Steelers quarterback "available for everything we have asked with the exception of interviewing him at this point."

So then he's been available for what, exactly?

I was wondering that myself. Only thing I can think is that he already gave the DNA sample, but the guy just didn't want to comment on that.

 

[bonesman]

Davis said Ed Garland, Roethlisberger's attorney, has cooperated with the investigation and has made the Steelers quarterback "available for everything we have asked with the exception of interviewing him at this point."

So then he's been available for what, exactly?

I was wondering that myself. Only thing I can think is that he already gave the DNA sample, but the guy just didn't want to comment on that.

Perhaps he's helped supply information like contact #'s of his security/entourage... maybe a timeline of the events.

 

[ScottyFargo]

Davis said Ed Garland, Roethlisberger's attorney, has cooperated with the investigation and has made the Steelers quarterback "available for everything we have asked with the exception of interviewing him at this point."

So then he's been available for what, exactly?

I was wondering that myself. Only thing I can think is that he already gave the DNA sample, but the guy just didn't want to comment on that.

Perhaps he's helped supply information like contact #'s of his security/entourage... maybe a timeline of the events.

And he posed for pictures with the police.

 

[Christo]

He's available for everything except if they want to talk with him. That's funny. The "he's cooperating" even though he clearly isn't spin. Big Ben is lawyered up and obviously has something to hide. If she was some crackpot that he had nothing to do with he'd quickly go in there with his lawyer, shake hands with the investigators, sign some Big Ben footballs for them and be on his way. That obviously isn't the case. Its a shame because I've always liked "the persona of him" without knowing much personally about him but after reading the various reports of what went down, other stories and what happened just a year ago he really seems like a complete scumbag. Its too bad. I've been a lifelong Steeler fan and it's disappointing seeing so many good Steeler posters lining up behind Ben and defending him just because he wears Black and Gold. I'm not saying he's definitely guilty but I don't think a lot of people can objectivley view a situation without their team colored glasses.

The "you have the right to remain silent" thing doesn't just apply to the guilty.

 

[fatness]

Davis said Ed Garland, Roethlisberger's attorney, has cooperated with the investigation and has made the Steelers quarterback "available for everything we have asked with the exception of interviewing him at this point."

So then he's been available for what, exactly?

Going into public bathrooms with women?Buying tequila for his #####es?

 

[Ditkaless Wonders]

He reminds me of Jerry Lundegaard. "I'm cooperating here!"

 

[Tony Jabroni]

His first mistake was the decision to celebrate his birthday by partying around/with a bunch of college kids. You're 28, Ben, grow up.

There are those people who fornicate with 20 something college girls and those who are jealous of those who do.

There certainly are. However, this guy is more than happy to go home to his wife of 17 years and 9-month-old little boy. Amazing as it may sound to you, some of us truly think his actions sound stupid, not enviable.

Because your f'n 42?

 

[Christo]

His first mistake was the decision to celebrate his birthday by partying around/with a bunch of college kids. You're 28, Ben, grow up.

There are those people who fornicate with 20 something college girls and those who are jealous of those who do.

There certainly are. However, this guy is more than happy to go home to his wife of 17 years and 9-month-old little boy. Amazing as it may sound to you, some of us truly think his actions sound stupid, not enviable.

Because your f'n 42?

Nope. Age has nothing to do with it. I'd certainly rather hang out with Big Ben (minus the legal problems) than a wife and kid.

 

[analog_hiss]

With this being an Irvin thread, I just want to point out a few things. First, Irvin was a suspect of sexual assault for nearly three years. His case was eventually thrown out of criminal court due to lack of evidence. His accuser took a bath, washed her clothes, went to an ob/gyn six days after the alleged assault (in private practice and not certified, and went to the police after that exam.

So why does that matter? Roethlisberger's accuser went straight to the hospital.

We do know that the accuser went to the police, the policeman directed her to the hospital, and a detective was sent to do follow up. News reports suggested that a rape kit was administered (rape kit is a colloquial term, they are professionally referred to as sexual assault forensic evidence (SAFE) kits, Sexual Offense Evidence Collection (SOEC) kits, or Vitullo kits). The alleged victim has the right to refuse the kit, so until we hear an official police report from the detective at the hospital, we don't know. Just remember, this accuser went to the hospital immediately.

So what does a rape kit include? First, a rape kit is usually administered by a trained/certified nurse or doctor, in order to maintain the integrity of the chain of custody of evidence. Next, there is a sheet of cloth or paper to separate the alleged victim from whatever examining surface they sit or lay upon. This is done to collect any evidence that may fall off the alleged victim. There are bags provided to collect all the clothes the alleged victim is wearing. Photographs are usually taken before the alleged victim has disrobed, and after the alleged victim has disrobed. Vials are included for blood and urine samples. These are used for various tests including STDs, pregnancy (some rape kits include that "day after pill" which wouldn't be administered if alleged victim was already pregnant), or determining drug use/inebriation. Swabs and dental floss are included to collect any ######l, anal, or oral samples. In addition, there a combs to collect hairs from the head and pubic area, and samples are collected from under the fingernails. Glass slides are also provided for the collection of other evidence. Finally, there is the physical exam that might describe physical abuse.

If the DA files charges, he knows how drunk the girl was, what drugs she was on, what DNA was on her. Everything I've read suggests this girl was drunk, and according to everything I've read, an intoxicated individual cannot consent. What might be worse is Roethlisberger contributed to her intoxication, creating a situation where he took advantage of a drunk chick. I don't know if she followed him around that town or if he included her in his entourage. I don't know if his party covered for her being of legal age or not.

What we apparently have is a millionaire buying drinks for women, and one of them didn't like they way she treated. The laws now suggests that an intoxicated woman can't provide consent.

 

[Steelfan7]

Davis said Ed Garland, Roethlisberger's attorney, has cooperated with the investigation and has made the Steelers quarterback "available for everything we have asked with the exception of interviewing him at this point."

So then he's been available for what, exactly?

I was wondering that myself. Only thing I can think is that he already gave the DNA sample, but the guy just didn't want to comment on that.

Perhaps he's helped supply information like contact #'s of his security/entourage... maybe a timeline of the events.

A private jet left Pittsburgh to fly to Georgia I believe yesterday or today. Supposedly it was Big Ben and most everyone who was with him that night to go down and give their views of what they saw or didn't see on that night. Ben was not questioned. I'm pretty sure Ben paid for the flight. That's cooperation, probably not as much as the police would like.

 

[E_Smith]

With this being an Irvin thread, I just want to point out a few things. First, Irvin was a suspect of sexual assault for nearly three years. His case was eventually thrown out of criminal court due to lack of evidence. His accuser took a bath, washed her clothes, went to an ob/gyn six days after the alleged assault (in private practice and not certified, and went to the police after that exam.So why does that matter? Roethlisberger's accuser went straight to the hospital.We do know that the accuser went to the police, the policeman directed her to the hospital, and a detective was sent to do follow up. News reports suggested that a rape kit was administered (rape kit is a colloquial term, they are professionally referred to as sexual assault forensic evidence (SAFE) kits, Sexual Offense Evidence Collection (SOEC) kits, or Vitullo kits). The alleged victim has the right to refuse the kit, so until we hear an official police report from the detective at the hospital, we don't know. Just remember, this accuser went to the hospital immediately.So what does a rape kit include? First, a rape kit is usually administered by a trained/certified nurse or doctor, in order to maintain the integrity of the chain of custody of evidence. Next, there is a sheet of cloth or paper to separate the alleged victim from whatever examining surface they sit or lay upon. This is done to collect any evidence that may fall off the alleged victim. There are bags provided to collect all the clothes the alleged victim is wearing. Photographs are usually taken before the alleged victim has disrobed, and after the alleged victim has disrobed. Vials are included for blood and urine samples. These are used for various tests including STDs, pregnancy (some rape kits include that "day after pill" which wouldn't be administered if alleged victim was already pregnant), or determining drug use/inebriation. Swabs and dental floss are included to collect any ######l, anal, or oral samples. In addition, there a combs to collect hairs from the head and pubic area, and samples are collected from under the fingernails. Glass slides are also provided for the collection of other evidence. Finally, there is the physical exam that might describe physical abuse.If the DA files charges, he knows how drunk the girl was, what drugs she was on, what DNA was on her. Everything I've read suggests this girl was drunk, and according to everything I've read, an intoxicated individual cannot consent. What might be worse is Roethlisberger contributed to her intoxication, creating a situation where he took advantage of a drunk chick. I don't know if she followed him around that town or if he included her in his entourage. I don't know if his party covered for her being of legal age or not.What we apparently have is a millionaire buying drinks for women, and one of them didn't like they way she treated. The laws now suggests that an intoxicated woman can't provide consent.

Regarding consent, the laws vary by state; but generally my understanding is that intoxication does not automatically mean she can't consent. I believe it comes down to how drunk she was and whether she understood what was going on, in other words understood the nature and consequences of consenting. Also, a defense to rape is a reasonable belief in consent. Thus, if she appeared sober enough and consented, then that would be a defense. Of course, Ben's intoxication is no defense, the standard would be whether a reasonable sober person would have had a mistaken belief in consent.

 

[Godsbrother]

Big Ben is lawyered up and obviously has something to hide. If she was some crackpot that he had nothing to do with he'd quickly go in there with his lawyer, shake hands with the investigators, sign some Big Ben footballs for them and be on his way. That obviously isn't the case.

There is no good reason to speak to the police as whatever you say can be used against you, it doesn't matter if you are innocent or guilty.

and then tell me if you still think he should talk to the police.If you ever get questioned by the police for any charge, whether you are innocent or guilty, keep your mouth shut and listen to your attorney. They know the law a heckuva lot better than you and that is what you are paying them for.

 

[Banger]

Big Ben is lawyered up and obviously has something to hide. If she was some crackpot that he had nothing to do with he'd quickly go in there with his lawyer, shake hands with the investigators, sign some Big Ben footballs for them and be on his way. That obviously isn't the case.

There is no good reason to speak to the police as whatever you say can be used against you, it doesn't matter if you are innocent or guilty.

Believe me I completely understand that my wife is an attorney and I watch Law and Order. My point was more that based on the accounts of what happened Ben seems like a complete scumbag with unbelievably bad judgement at a minimum or perhaps a rapist in the worst scenario. Either way I've lost any and all respect for him regardless if they can prove beyond a shadow of doubt that he raped the girl. Just a year ago he was accuesd of a similar situation and based on his stature and the potential liability alone he should be on heightened alert to not put himself in similar situations.

 

[Godsbrother]

Big Ben is lawyered up and obviously has something to hide. If she was some crackpot that he had nothing to do with he'd quickly go in there with his lawyer, shake hands with the investigators, sign some Big Ben footballs for them and be on his way. That obviously isn't the case.

There is no good reason to speak to the police as whatever you say can be used against you, it doesn't matter if you are innocent or guilty.

The accounts on what happened in this instance are mostly speculation and never has the word rape been used to describe the incident. What we know for sure is that Roethlisberger was out on the town with an entourage on his birthday. At one point he and his friends went into a semi-private VIP lounge where a number of young ladies were invited in and one of these women claimed to have been sexually assualted either in or near a bathroom. You can assume what you want but based on the facts as we know them right now it is impossible to say what really happened. I have also lost respect for the man because at the very least he is reckless and puts himself in very bad situations. However that does not make him guilty of sexual assualt. If he is guilty I hope he goes to jail. If he is innocent I hope he has finally wised up.

 

[E_Smith]

timetable:

Davis said he hoped the investigation would be completed in two to three weeks and the findings handed to Milledgeville authorities to decide if they would pursue a criminal case.

One More Witness Remains to be Interviewed in Roethlisberger Case

 

[treat88]

With this being an Irvin thread, I just want to point out a few things. First, Irvin was a suspect of sexual assault for nearly three years. His case was eventually thrown out of criminal court due to lack of evidence. His accuser took a bath, washed her clothes, went to an ob/gyn six days after the alleged assault (in private practice and not certified, and went to the police after that exam.

So why does that matter? Roethlisberger's accuser went straight to the hospital.

We do know that the accuser went to the police, the policeman directed her to the hospital, and a detective was sent to do follow up. News reports suggested that a rape kit was administered (rape kit is a colloquial term, they are professionally referred to as sexual assault forensic evidence (SAFE) kits, Sexual Offense Evidence Collection (SOEC) kits, or Vitullo kits). The alleged victim has the right to refuse the kit, so until we hear an official police report from the detective at the hospital, we don't know. Just remember, this accuser went to the hospital immediately.

So what does a rape kit include? First, a rape kit is usually administered by a trained/certified nurse or doctor, in order to maintain the integrity of the chain of custody of evidence. Next, there is a sheet of cloth or paper to separate the alleged victim from whatever examining surface they sit or lay upon. This is done to collect any evidence that may fall off the alleged victim. There are bags provided to collect all the clothes the alleged victim is wearing. Photographs are usually taken before the alleged victim has disrobed, and after the alleged victim has disrobed. Vials are included for blood and urine samples. These are used for various tests including STDs, pregnancy (some rape kits include that "day after pill" which wouldn't be administered if alleged victim was already pregnant), or determining drug use/inebriation. Swabs and dental floss are included to collect any ######l, anal, or oral samples. In addition, there a combs to collect hairs from the head and pubic area, and samples are collected from under the fingernails. Glass slides are also provided for the collection of other evidence. Finally, there is the physical exam that might describe physical abuse.

If the DA files charges, he knows how drunk the girl was, what drugs she was on, what DNA was on her. Everything I've read suggests this girl was drunk, and according to everything I've read, an intoxicated individual cannot consent. What might be worse is Roethlisberger contributed to her intoxication, creating a situation where he took advantage of a drunk chick. I don't know if she followed him around that town or if he included her in his entourage. I don't know if his party covered for her being of legal age or not.

What we apparently have is a millionaire buying drinks for women, and one of them didn't like they way she treated. The laws now suggests that an intoxicated woman can't provide consent.

That's a good detailed description of one part of the process.Here's the thing I don't understand. The young woman makes the accusation apparently right after whatever happened happened right?

Cops send her to the hospital and allegedly interview Ben who again, allegedly, admits to sexual contact.

I understand DNA testing can take a short while, (assuming a SEOC was even administered vs simple exam of apparent head injury), but the remainder of the results of her hospital exam would be available very quickly right?

So, if there was some sort of corroborating physical evidence, why was Ben allowed to leave the state?

I'm not an expert by any means, but the initial police report was extremely brief. It makes no mention of injuries, state of mind, witnesses...nothing. Is this typical?

http://unionrecorder.com/local/x1745486284...lease-available

(100% speculation on my part here) Reviewing the apparent timeline, whatever happened apparently happened on March 5 (Fri), the accuser's parents apparently did not come to pick her up until Monday, maybe as late as Tuesday...that doesn't sound like overly concerned parents to me. I know if something serious had happened to my daughter, barring extreme extenuating circumstances, I wouldn't have waited that long if my daughter had been assaulted in anyway.

I understand something very serious could potentially have happened, but from the VERY few facts we know, it sure seems to have been treated casually in the inception of the incident.

 

[zed2283]

Everything I've read suggests this girl was drunk, and according to everything I've read, an intoxicated individual cannot consent.

That's a bunch of b.s., whether it's the law or not.

What might be worse is Roethlisberger contributed to her intoxication, creating a situation where he took advantage of a drunk chick.

If there is you among us who has not contributed to a female's intoxication and/or taken advantage of such a situation, let him cast the first stone.

 

[fatness]

Everything I've read suggests this girl was drunk,

I don't recall reading this in any of the news articles?

 

[fatness]

Agent Davis did confirm that the alleged victim herself filed the police report and named Mr. Roethlisberger as her attacker. An initial police news conference was vague about whether the woman herself or members of her party made the allegations.

Link

 

[E_Smith]

With this being an Irvin thread, I just want to point out a few things. First, Irvin was a suspect of sexual assault for nearly three years. His case was eventually thrown out of criminal court due to lack of evidence. His accuser took a bath, washed her clothes, went to an ob/gyn six days after the alleged assault (in private practice and not certified, and went to the police after that exam.

So why does that matter? Roethlisberger's accuser went straight to the hospital.

We do know that the accuser went to the police, the policeman directed her to the hospital, and a detective was sent to do follow up. News reports suggested that a rape kit was administered (rape kit is a colloquial term, they are professionally referred to as sexual assault forensic evidence (SAFE) kits, Sexual Offense Evidence Collection (SOEC) kits, or Vitullo kits). The alleged victim has the right to refuse the kit, so until we hear an official police report from the detective at the hospital, we don't know. Just remember, this accuser went to the hospital immediately.

So what does a rape kit include? First, a rape kit is usually administered by a trained/certified nurse or doctor, in order to maintain the integrity of the chain of custody of evidence. Next, there is a sheet of cloth or paper to separate the alleged victim from whatever examining surface they sit or lay upon. This is done to collect any evidence that may fall off the alleged victim. There are bags provided to collect all the clothes the alleged victim is wearing. Photographs are usually taken before the alleged victim has disrobed, and after the alleged victim has disrobed. Vials are included for blood and urine samples. These are used for various tests including STDs, pregnancy (some rape kits include that "day after pill" which wouldn't be administered if alleged victim was already pregnant), or determining drug use/inebriation. Swabs and dental floss are included to collect any ######l, anal, or oral samples. In addition, there a combs to collect hairs from the head and pubic area, and samples are collected from under the fingernails. Glass slides are also provided for the collection of other evidence. Finally, there is the physical exam that might describe physical abuse.

If the DA files charges, he knows how drunk the girl was, what drugs she was on, what DNA was on her. Everything I've read suggests this girl was drunk, and according to everything I've read, an intoxicated individual cannot consent. What might be worse is Roethlisberger contributed to her intoxication, creating a situation where he took advantage of a drunk chick. I don't know if she followed him around that town or if he included her in his entourage. I don't know if his party covered for her being of legal age or not.

What we apparently have is a millionaire buying drinks for women, and one of them didn't like they way she treated. The laws now suggests that an intoxicated woman can't provide consent.

That's a good detailed description of one part of the process.Here's the thing I don't understand. The young woman makes the accusation apparently right after whatever happened happened right?

Cops send her to the hospital and allegedly interview Ben who again, allegedly, admits to sexual contact.

I understand DNA testing can take a short while, (assuming a SEOC was even administered vs simple exam of apparent head injury), but the remainder of the results of her hospital exam would be available very quickly right?

So, if there was some sort of corroborating physical evidence, why was Ben allowed to leave the state?

I'm not an expert by any means, but the initial police report was extremely brief. It makes no mention of injuries, state of mind, witnesses...nothing. Is this typical?

http://unionrecorder.com/local/x1745486284...lease-available

(100% speculation on my part here) Reviewing the apparent timeline, whatever happened apparently happened on March 5 (Fri), the accuser's parents apparently did not come to pick her up until Monday, maybe as late as Tuesday...that doesn't sound like overly concerned parents to me. I know if something serious had happened to my daughter, barring extreme extenuating circumstances, I wouldn't have waited that long if my daughter had been assaulted in anyway.

I understand something very serious could potentially have happened, but from the VERY few facts we know, it sure seems to have been treated casually in the inception of the incident.

Just because there might have been corroborating evidence doesn't mean they would arrest him on the spot. They had probable cause at that point to arrest him based on the accusation, but they won't necessarily do that if they don't perceive him to be a present threat to anyone. And if they were unsure if they were actually going to charge him, then there is no reason to arrest him yet (not perceived as a flight risk, not perceived as a danger, they knew his identity and could find him later). Had they arrested him, he would have been detained, then they would have to decide very quickly whether to charge him at that time, then give him a bail hearing, and schedule a preliminary hearing, all before having collected all the evidence. They would rather be able to sit back, collect evidence, and then make a decision.

 

[Stinkin Ref]

only two people know what happened....one of them has been interviewed....the other hasn't....there are no witnesses

place your bets....

 

[E_Smith]

Everything I've read suggests this girl was drunk, and according to everything I've read, an intoxicated individual cannot consent.

That's a bunch of b.s., whether it's the law or not.

What might be worse is Roethlisberger contributed to her intoxication, creating a situation where he took advantage of a drunk chick.

If there is you among us who has not contributed to a female's intoxication and/or taken advantage of such a situation, let him cast the first stone.

I tend to agree w/ you on the intoxication point...However, I think the contributing to the intoxication of a minor could be a real charge here. If she was wearing one of those under 21 bracelets, and Ben was feeding her shots in the VIP room, he could very well be charged with that...and I could see him potentially pleading guilty to that in a plea deal.

 

[az_prof]

Everything I've read suggests this girl was drunk, and according to everything I've read, an intoxicated individual cannot consent.

That's a bunch of b.s., whether it's the law or not.

What might be worse is Roethlisberger contributed to her intoxication, creating a situation where he took advantage of a drunk chick.

If there is you among us who has not contributed to a female's intoxication and/or taken advantage of such a situation, let him cast the first stone.

I tend to agree w/ you on the intoxication point...However, I think the contributing to the intoxication of a minor could be a real charge here. If she was wearing one of those under 21 bracelets, and Ben was feeding her shots in the VIP room, he could very well be charged with that...and I could see him potentially pleading guilty to that in a plea deal.

That's speculation on your part. If she got in with a fake ID and was drinking illegally then that would reflect badly on her.I have never heard this claim that someone who has been drinking cannot give consent. That seems far fetched.

 

[E_Smith]

Everything I've read suggests this girl was drunk, and according to everything I've read, an intoxicated individual cannot consent.

That's a bunch of b.s., whether it's the law or not.

What might be worse is Roethlisberger contributed to her intoxication, creating a situation where he took advantage of a drunk chick.

If there is you among us who has not contributed to a female's intoxication and/or taken advantage of such a situation, let him cast the first stone.

I tend to agree w/ you on the intoxication point...However, I think the contributing to the intoxication of a minor could be a real charge here. If she was wearing one of those under 21 bracelets, and Ben was feeding her shots in the VIP room, he could very well be charged with that...and I could see him potentially pleading guilty to that in a plea deal.

That's speculation on your part. If she got in with a fake ID and was drinking illegally then that would reflect badly on her.I have never heard this claim that someone who has been drinking cannot give consent. That seems far fetched.

It reflects badly on her regardless, if she was drinking. The bar was an 18 and over deal where you probably wear a bracelet if you are under 21. We don't know whether she was wearing one, and we don't know if Ben bought her drinks. We do know he was buying the group drinks though (for the "b*tches").

 

[Tau837]

If she got in with a fake ID and was drinking illegally then that would reflect badly on her.

I disagree with this. Right or wrong, drinking is a huge part of college culture, and underage drinking is common. Sure, it's a violation of the law... but it's a violation that tens of thousands college students commit every weekend, if not every day. It doesn't mean she is of bad character, or, more relevant, that she consented to any form of sexual contact.

 

[CletiusMaximus]

I have never heard this claim that someone who has been drinking cannot give consent. That seems far fetched.

Its obviously a false statement that is strangely propogated in these threads. I don't know where people are getting that from. Intoxication may be a somewhat relevant factor to consider, but I keep reading comments in these threads that suggest it is akin to a "statutory rape" law, in which persons under a certain age are legally incompetant to consent to having sex (even when they knowingly consent).

 

[E_Smith]

If she got in with a fake ID and was drinking illegally then that would reflect badly on her.

I disagree with this. Right or wrong, drinking is a huge part of college culture, and underage drinking is common. Sure, it's a violation of the law... but it's a violation that tens of thousands college students commit every weekend, if not every day. It doesn't mean she is of bad character, or, more relevant, that she consented to any form of sexual contact.

Whether or not everyone does it or not does not mean it doesn't reflect badly on her character...breaking the law generally reflects badly, and a jury may percieve it as a strike against her.