What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.

Is Dez Bryant due for a big (negative) stat correction? (1 Viewer)

zftcg

Footballguy
Here's the play, as per the NFL.com game log:

2-10-NYG 49 (12:53) (Shotgun) 9-T.Romo pass short left to 88-D.Bryant to NYG 44 for 5 yards (25-W.Hill). FUMBLES (25-W.Hill), touched at NYG 44, ball out of bounds at DAL 31.
I recall a similar play last year with Danny Amendola where he caught the ball, advanced it 3 yards, fumbled, and the fumble was then returned 6 yards in the other direction. Play was scored as a catch for -3 yards. Here is how that was described in the game log:

2-10-STL 20 (5:10) (Shotgun) 8-S.Bradford pass short right to 16-D.Amendola to STL 23 for 3 yards (29-L.Johnson). FUMBLES (29-L.Johnson), RECOVERED by TB-29-L.Johnson at STL 17. 29-L.Johnson to STL 16 for 1 yard (79-B.Richardson). FUMBLES (79-B.Richardson), RECOVERED by STL-59-R.Turner at STL 5. 59-R.Turner to STL 5 for no gain (59-M.Foster).
This case is slightly different in that with the Amendola fumble, he lost possession immediately, and the defensive player then returned it. Here, the ball was batted (note the "touched at NYG 44"), and went out of bounds before it was recovered, so the Cowboys retained possession.

Still, the fact remains that they completed a pass to Dez, and ended up 20 yards behind the line of scrimmage. How is that not a catch for -20 yards? (In fact, I think you could make an even stronger case for docking yardage on a ball that rolls backward than for one that's returned by a defensive player.) Does anyone know the official rule for plays like this?

 
My inclination is to say that the stat is correct and that it would have required the other team to take possession of the ball, but for fantasy purposes I sincerely hope I'm wrong.

 
I tried to look into it, and the closest thing I could find to apply to this situation is on Section D of Pg. 28 (LINK). It seems that Dez should only be docked the yardage from the spot he fumbled it, to the spot of the first legal "touch, bat, or kick" that moved it backwards, and any negative yardage past that point is considered "loose ball yardage" and not subtracted from the fumbling player's stats.

That's my understanding at least.

 
Interesting. Not saying you're wrong about the rule, but if that's right, it makes no sense. First of all, I don't think the video is online anywhere, but just from memory, Bryant either lost control of the ball or it was punched out, and it flew backwards at least 10 yards before any Giant tried to recover it. I don't know how the scorer can rule that it was "touched" at the point where he fumbled, unless he's prepared to rule that any fumble caused by the defense was "touched" at the point where it was fumbled.

Second, as I said in the OP, it makes no sense that if a Giant strips him of the ball and returns it 20 yards, that counts as -20, but if the ball rolls backward 20 yards, that lost yardage doesn't count. Again, not saying you're wrong, just that it's a very weird rule.

 
Interesting. Not saying you're wrong about the rule, but if that's right, it makes no sense. First of all, I don't think the video is online anywhere, but just from memory, Bryant either lost control of the ball or it was punched out, and it flew backwards at least 10 yards before any Giant tried to recover it. I don't know how the scorer can rule that it was "touched" at the point where he fumbled, unless he's prepared to rule that any fumble caused by the defense was "touched" at the point where it was fumbled.

Second, as I said in the OP, it makes no sense that if a Giant strips him of the ball and returns it 20 yards, that counts as -20, but if the ball rolls backward 20 yards, that lost yardage doesn't count. Again, not saying you're wrong, just that it's a very weird rule.
This can't be right, or every fumble returned for a TD would end up being like -50 yards for the fumbler...

 
Interesting. Not saying you're wrong about the rule, but if that's right, it makes no sense. First of all, I don't think the video is online anywhere, but just from memory, Bryant either lost control of the ball or it was punched out, and it flew backwards at least 10 yards before any Giant tried to recover it. I don't know how the scorer can rule that it was "touched" at the point where he fumbled, unless he's prepared to rule that any fumble caused by the defense was "touched" at the point where it was fumbled.

Second, as I said in the OP, it makes no sense that if a Giant strips him of the ball and returns it 20 yards, that counts as -20, but if the ball rolls backward 20 yards, that lost yardage doesn't count. Again, not saying you're wrong, just that it's a very weird rule.
It wouldn't count as -20 unless the ball was fumbled backwards 20 yards. Notice that Amendola fumbled backwards 6 yards and then advanced 1 more yard by the defense. That's why Amendola was credited with -6 instead of -7.

 
Just watched the replay. I expect it will end up being a net negative 11 yard play for Bryant. Ball snapped at the NYG 49. After the fumble it was first touched at the Dallas 40, so loss of 11 yards.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
So what, we're looking at a difference of what in standard leagues?
If it goes the way I think, it will go from a reception for 5 yards, to a reception for -11 yards. So a loss of 16 receiving yards, 1.6 fantasy points in normal scoring under what they currently have for him.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
So what, we're looking at a difference of what in standard leagues?
If it goes the way I think, it will go from a reception for 5 yards, to a reception for -11 yards. So a loss of 16 receiving yards, 1.6 fantasy points in normal scoring under what they currently have for him.
That's not too bad. Was expecting a lot worse when described as "big". In PPR it's barely anything.

 
Interesting. Not saying you're wrong about the rule, but if that's right, it makes no sense. First of all, I don't think the video is online anywhere, but just from memory, Bryant either lost control of the ball or it was punched out, and it flew backwards at least 10 yards before any Giant tried to recover it. I don't know how the scorer can rule that it was "touched" at the point where he fumbled, unless he's prepared to rule that any fumble caused by the defense was "touched" at the point where it was fumbled.

Second, as I said in the OP, it makes no sense that if a Giant strips him of the ball and returns it 20 yards, that counts as -20, but if the ball rolls backward 20 yards, that lost yardage doesn't count. Again, not saying you're wrong, just that it's a very weird rule.
It wouldn't count as -20 unless the ball was fumbled backwards 20 yards. Notice that Amendola fumbled backwards 6 yards and then advanced 1 more yard by the defense. That's why Amendola was credited with -6 instead of -7.
Yes, I think you're right about that.

If it goes the way I think, it will go from a reception for 5 yards, to a reception for -11 yards. So a loss of 16 receiving yards, 1.6 fantasy points in normal scoring under what they currently have for him.
I think the question is what happened at the moment Dez fumbled. If it was punched out, can they rule that the first "touch" occurred at the 44? My memory is that he got hit off balance and kind of threw it backward.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
That play is not being scored as a fumble lost in my CBS league and since Dallas retained possession it should not go down as a turnover. It also should be recorded as a catch with yards.

 
Play by play says this...

(Shotgun) T.Romo pass short left to D.Bryant to NYG 44 for 5 yards (W.Hill). FUMBLES (W.Hill), touched at NYG 44, ball out of bounds at DAL 31.
This matter at all?
If it is correct then it will stay a 5 yard completion.

I don't see anyone touching the ball after the fumble is forced until the ball is another 16 yards back at the Dallas 40 though. The act of forcing the fumble does not count as a touch, according to that stats guide that tdhartis found Great find, by the way, never seen that before.

So anyway, I expect they'll correct it to be first touched at the Dallas 40. Unless they have some replay not in the broadcast that shows otherwise.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Very astute of you, OP:

http://espn.go.com/blog/dallas/cowboys/post/_/id/4720123/nfl-changes-bryants-receiving-totals?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

IRVING, Texas -- NFL officials have changed the statistics on a Dez Bryant reception in the fourth quarter of the Cowboys-Giants game on Sunday.

Bryant, who made a reception, then fumbled the ball backward, is now credited with having minus-11 yards on the play. The Cowboys lost a total of 16 yards on the play.

Instead of finishing with 102 receiving yards, Bryant will now have 91 receiving yards.

Also, Tony Romo loses 16 yards in total passing yards and saw his total drop to 234.

The Cowboys' net passing yards falls to 204.

When the game was over, the Cowboys finished with 327 total yards but it's been decreased to 311.
 
The NFL has deducted 11 yards from Dez Bryant's Week 12 receiving total.
Bryant made a reception in the fourth quarter, fumbled the ball backwards, and is now "credited" with an 11-yard loss. The Cowboys recovered the fumble, but this is a situation that could change the outcome of some Week 12 fantasy head-to-head games. Dez finishes with nine grabs for 91 yards instead of 102. Tony Romo's passing yardage total has also dropped from 250 to 234 because all in all the Cowboys lost 16 yards on the play.
 
Very astute of you, OP:

http://espn.go.com/blog/dallas/cowboys/post/_/id/4720123/nfl-changes-bryants-receiving-totals?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

IRVING, Texas -- NFL officials have changed the statistics on a Dez Bryant reception in the fourth quarter of the Cowboys-Giants game on Sunday. Bryant, who made a reception, then fumbled the ball backward, is now credited with having minus-11 yards on the play. The Cowboys lost a total of 16 yards on the play.

Instead of finishing with 102 receiving yards, Bryant will now have 91 receiving yards.

Also, Tony Romo loses 16 yards in total passing yards and saw his total drop to 234.

The Cowboys' net passing yards falls to 204.

When the game was over, the Cowboys finished with 327 total yards but it's been decreased to 311.
I think that's wrong. He got 5 yards on the catch initially, so -11-yard catch would mean he loses 16 total, and is down to 86.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Very astute of you, OP:

http://espn.go.com/blog/dallas/cowboys/post/_/id/4720123/nfl-changes-bryants-receiving-totals?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

IRVING, Texas -- NFL officials have changed the statistics on a Dez Bryant reception in the fourth quarter of the Cowboys-Giants game on Sunday. Bryant, who made a reception, then fumbled the ball backward, is now credited with having minus-11 yards on the play. The Cowboys lost a total of 16 yards on the play.

Instead of finishing with 102 receiving yards, Bryant will now have 91 receiving yards.

Also, Tony Romo loses 16 yards in total passing yards and saw his total drop to 234.

The Cowboys' net passing yards falls to 204.

When the game was over, the Cowboys finished with 327 total yards but it's been decreased to 311.
I think that's wrong. He got 5 yards on the catch initially, so -11-yard catch would mean he loses 16 total, and is down to 86.
I agree, this is gonna be crazy as it sorts itself out.

 
brutal... at the time I was worried it would be a negative yard play. with a 2pt bonus for 100 yds i lose 3.6 in 2 leagues where currently every point matters, lol.... wish he would have held on to that last throw.

 
Has already been changed in MFL. Current scores reflect the changes -- Dez listed with 86 yards receiving.

Materially improves my chances of winning two undecided games.

 
Looks like this was already updated

NFL deducts 16 yards from Dez Bryant's Wk 12

The NFL has deducted 16 yards from Dez Bryant's Week 12 receiving total.

Bryant made a reception in the fourth quarter, fumbled the ball backwards, and is now "credited" with an 11-yard loss. The Cowboys recovered the fumble, but this is a situation that could change the outcome of some Week 12 fantasy head-to-head games. Dez finishes with nine grabs for 86 yards instead of 102. It could be particularly painful for fantasy leaguers in 100-plus-yard bonus scoring leagues. Tony Romo's passing yardage total has also dropped from 250 to 234, because all in all the Cowboys lost 16 yards on the play.

Source: ESPN Dallas Nov 25 - 4:37 PM

 
Damn, maybe I can get it back on that last play in the DET game where some say it was a catch and fumble by Calvin rather than a INT.

 
Id be up about a point if the correction was already made.

Still have SF D tonight...as it stands Im down just under 4 points.

 
Still no adjustment by CBS. This will be huge for me since Krapernick isn't outplaying Phil F'ing Dawson like a QB should.

 
Speaking of the Dallas game when Dallas got down the field to the end game and kneeled on the ball 2 times the plays looked like this.

1-10-NYG 15 (1:17) 9-T.Romo kneels to NYG 16 for -1 yards.

2-11-NYG 16 :-)35) 9-T.Romo kneels to NYG 16 for no gain.

3-11-NYG 16 :-)04) 5-D.Bailey 35 yard field goal is GOOD, Center-91-L.Ladouceur, Holder-6-C.Jones.
So how does a field goal from the 16 yard line become a 35 yarder? Shoudn't Romo be docked another 2 rushing yards if they were at the 16 and we have a 35 yard field goal.

 
2013 CBSSports.com Football Commissioner
Terms of Use


Statistics Corrections. Following the completion of each week's games, all statistics and point totals are verified, and corrections are made where necessary. However, all statistics and point totals for the week are considered FINAL as of 6:00 AM ET on Friday. If a stat correction is announced for the previous weekend's games after 6:00 AM ET on Friday, it will not be included in our statistics and your official Fantasy scoring will be based on the original statistic. For week's including NFL Thursday games, all statistics will be final as of Thursday morning at 6:00 AM ET. In the final week of your fantasy regular season and all fantasy league playoff weeks, statistics will not be changed as of 6:00 AM ET following the final game of the week.

 
I guess someone somewhere lost the 1.6, then also lost a point if they started Romo, his yardage total went from 250 to 234. So someone may have lost 2.6.

 
On nfl.com down 3.7 waiting on this 4.6 adjustment to my opponent, hoping for the update.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Speaking of the Dallas game when Dallas got down the field to the end game and kneeled on the ball 2 times the plays looked like this.

1-10-NYG 15 (1:17) 9-T.Romo kneels to NYG 16 for -1 yards.

2-11-NYG 16 :-)35) 9-T.Romo kneels to NYG 16 for no gain.

3-11-NYG 16 :-)04) 5-D.Bailey 35 yard field goal is GOOD, Center-91-L.Ladouceur, Holder-6-C.Jones.
So how does a field goal from the 16 yard line become a 35 yarder? Shoudn't Romo be docked another 2 rushing yards if they were at the 16 and we have a 35 yard field goal.
Was the field goal spotted at the 25 or the 23?

 
Speaking of the Dallas game when Dallas got down the field to the end game and kneeled on the ball 2 times the plays looked like this.

1-10-NYG 15 (1:17) 9-T.Romo kneels to NYG 16 for -1 yards.

2-11-NYG 16 :-)35) 9-T.Romo kneels to NYG 16 for no gain.

3-11-NYG 16 :-)04) 5-D.Bailey 35 yard field goal is GOOD, Center-91-L.Ladouceur, Holder-6-C.Jones.
So how does a field goal from the 16 yard line become a 35 yarder? Shoudn't Romo be docked another 2 rushing yards if they were at the 16 and we have a 35 yard field goal.
Was the field goal spotted at the 25 or the 23?
Here's the video. He's clearly kicking from the 25. Not positive, but it looks to me like the ball is being snapped from the 16, perhaps slightly behind it. Definitely not the 18. Maybe the holder lined up a couple extra yards back to avoid a block? I know teams routinely kick from 18 back on long FGs (since they have a lower trajectory), though I've never heard of them doing it this close in.

 
Damn, maybe I can get it back on that last play in the DET game where some say it was a catch and fumble by Calvin rather than a INT.
Ugh, that play killed me. First of all, I'm a Lions fan, and that lost them the game. Second, I own Stafford, and he went from getting a 30-yard completion (plus a chance to throw a game-winning TD) to an INT that wasn't in any way his fault. But don't count on that one being corrected. We all know that according to NFL rules, Calvin Johnson must catch the ball, make a football-related move, dance a jig, do the hokey-pokey and turn himself about before it can be considered a catch.

 
I still won by .5, but lost points for both Romo an Dez in an ESPN league.

(It was a Lot closer with those point deductions, cost me 10 points here)

High scoring league with bonus points for 100yd receiving as well there.

Without this thread I would of been wondering what the heck happened.

 
I thought I won 186.5 to 186. Just saw the "correction" and now I lost 186 to 184.5. That 1 play cost me AT LEAST $150 in winnings and eliminates me from competing for $5100 more. I think I will remember this play for a long time.

 
I thought I won 186.5 to 186. Just saw the "correction" and now I lost 186 to 184.5. That 1 play cost me AT LEAST $150 in winnings and eliminates me from competing for $5100 more. I think I will remember this play for a long time.
Damn, that's rough.

 

Users who are viewing this thread

Top