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Jerry Sandusky accused of child molestation (2 Viewers)

'The Future Champs said:
'Reepicheep said:
'Parrothead said:
lots of rumors on the PSU messageboard that the next shoe to drop is Sandusky's (and the PSU admin) role in the death of Ray Gricar (the DA that investigated the 1998 incident)..

probably made up, but you never know :unsure:
I would expect this to start to get more attention. http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/sandusky-investigator-center-mystery/story?id=14905668#.TrnPW0OIk8k

It does not add up that a DA would see all this and then not move forward with the process. You legal guys please chime in as to what the DA does there and how he does it. But no charges and a mysteriously missing DA does not sound good either.

J
The DA's brother had killed himself in a similar fashion 9 years earlier. The brother had suffered from bipolar disorder, and it has been speculated that the DA suffered from something similar.Nonetheless, it's very troubling that the DA had done web searches on how to erase a hard drive, and a few weeks later his erased hard drive was found in the river. :unsure:
This is pure speculation. The DA in the 1998 case goes missing in 2005, and his hard drive from his laptop turns up damaged beyond all repair. He searched from his home two weeks before he went missing for information on how to destroy hard drives. Fill in the missing pieces that somehow wraps this into the Sandusky scandal.
Something on the HD that linked him back to a cover-up in '99? Maybe he got paid off? Then couldn't live with it anymore, and decided to trash the evidence and commit suicide? Or somewhere along the line more allegations came up, and he was getting more heat from Sandusky, and decided to cover up any connection and just disappear? So his kids can keep the $ and he can live? Just a couple ideas off the top of my head.I agree it's a stretch, and there are so many different kinds of crazy dealings that a DA can end up neck-deep in. But there is some serious $$$ at stake in college football, this is no joke.
So he sits on the evidence for seven years, and then decides to disappear? But he also decides the evidence THAT HE LEFT ON HIS LAPTOP FOR SEVEN YEARS is now too dangerous to possess once he goes into hiding? There's a whole lot of fail in that reasoning.
Good grief, I acknowledged it's a stretch, calm down. It didn't have to be on a specific laptop for 7 years. We know Sandusky's crimes didn't stop in '99, there could have easily been continued contact/connection/leads/cover-up/whatever on this whole deal through 2005.
So why would he destroy the evidence if he was going into hiding, after sitting on it for 7 years? Don't you think he would take it with him as a potential bargaining chip? And, to address Crosseyed's speculation, why would he search for info on destroying hard drives two weeks before he disappeared, if in fact he was murdered to hush him up? He knew he was going to be murdered, and that the murderer would destroy his hard drive? Fail.
seriously folks, if you were sitting on some old evidence, would you carry it around in your laptop? Dude probably wanted to hide the pron sites he'd been surfing.

 
Maybe more info kept coming to light. Who knows? What we do know is that there was info on his computer that he felt he needed to destroy. Maybe someone threatened his family if the information ever became public. All speculation.
or perhaps he was killed because he was prosecuting the biggest heroin bust in the history of pennsylvania?
Any chance that members of the Penn State athletic department were dealing heroin?
I'm sure some in here will think so. :tinfoilhat:
 
'The Future Champs said:
'Reepicheep said:
'Parrothead said:
lots of rumors on the PSU messageboard that the next shoe to drop is Sandusky's (and the PSU admin) role in the death of Ray Gricar (the DA that investigated the 1998 incident)..

probably made up, but you never know :unsure:
I would expect this to start to get more attention. http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/sandusky-investigator-center-mystery/story?id=14905668#.TrnPW0OIk8k

It does not add up that a DA would see all this and then not move forward with the process. You legal guys please chime in as to what the DA does there and how he does it. But no charges and a mysteriously missing DA does not sound good either.

J
The DA's brother had killed himself in a similar fashion 9 years earlier. The brother had suffered from bipolar disorder, and it has been speculated that the DA suffered from something similar.Nonetheless, it's very troubling that the DA had done web searches on how to erase a hard drive, and a few weeks later his erased hard drive was found in the river. :unsure:
This is pure speculation. The DA in the 1998 case goes missing in 2005, and his hard drive from his laptop turns up damaged beyond all repair. He searched from his home two weeks before he went missing for information on how to destroy hard drives. Fill in the missing pieces that somehow wraps this into the Sandusky scandal.
Something on the HD that linked him back to a cover-up in '99? Maybe he got paid off? Then couldn't live with it anymore, and decided to trash the evidence and commit suicide? Or somewhere along the line more allegations came up, and he was getting more heat from Sandusky, and decided to cover up any connection and just disappear? So his kids can keep the $ and he can live? Just a couple ideas off the top of my head.I agree it's a stretch, and there are so many different kinds of crazy dealings that a DA can end up neck-deep in. But there is some serious $$$ at stake in college football, this is no joke.
So he sits on the evidence for seven years, and then decides to disappear? But he also decides the evidence THAT HE LEFT ON HIS LAPTOP FOR SEVEN YEARS is now too dangerous to possess once he goes into hiding? There's a whole lot of fail in that reasoning.
Good grief, I acknowledged it's a stretch, calm down. It didn't have to be on a specific laptop for 7 years. We know Sandusky's crimes didn't stop in '99, there could have easily been continued contact/connection/leads/cover-up/whatever on this whole deal through 2005.
So why would he destroy the evidence if he was going into hiding, after sitting on it for 7 years? Don't you think he would take it with him as a potential bargaining chip? And, to address Crosseyed's speculation, why would he search for info on destroying hard drives two weeks before he disappeared, if in fact he was murdered to hush him up? He knew he was going to be murdered, and that the murderer would destroy his hard drive? Fail.
Personally, I think the fact that he searched for how to destroy a HD makes it more likely that he was planning to disappear (perhaps out of fear for his life or shame for something he had done) or commit suicide (only shame factor comes into play here).
 
'Chase Stuart said:
'timschochet said:
Attorneys out there- if you are the parents of one of the molested children, whom could you justifiably sue in this situation? Can you sue the University, or Paterno? (I realize that technically you can sue anybody, but I'm talking about suing with reasonable expectations of some kind of award.)
Unless there's a statute to sue under -- and I have no idea if there is -- I think you're left with common law negligence.One of the elements of negligence is duty of care; it would be hard to think what duty of care Paterno would owe any of the victims (legally speaking). Same goes for the University. If I'm building you a house, I owe you a duty of care not to negligently build it. If I'm driving my car next to you, I owe you a duty of care to drive safely.But unless Paterno or University officials were putting those kids in rooms with Sandusky, I don't see a duty of care breach.
Oh, come on. Suppose you're a hungry lawyer at a big-time Philadelphia law firm that has just landed all 8 of these victims as clients. Are you really going to go to the senior partner with this? Not if you want to make partner for yourself, you won't. off the top of my head, I would present something more along the lines of Penn State having created an environment that protected personnel who were key players in its most valuable asset - it's lucrative football program. I would find a way to make this an institutional problem, not a Joe Paterno or Jerry Sandusky problem. But a problem that was allowed to exist because of the goals and the culture of the institution. I would then argue that substantial funding for PSU comes from the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania... that, yes, technically it is "state-related", meaning independent control, rather than state control, but the money trail leads straight to the Commonwealth jackpot. perhpas file suit against the University, then... if a big enough suit is won, maybe they have to go to the Commonwealth to pay it... But I cannot really think of not at least taking a shot at the Commonwealth directly.... perhaps naming PSU and the Commonwealth as co-defendants, doing lots of research and creative thinking in order to make a decent argument for a jury to sort out.
What about immunity issues? I'm not really up on sovereign immunity laws but can you sue Pennsylvania for this? Is there a statute that allows PA residents to sue officials and/or the state for negligence? And what about PSU? Does it matter that it is apparently "state-related"?
 
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Joe has also done (intentionally or unintentionally) some unimaginable harm in whatever role he had in this (more by actions taken than not taken, based on the facts I've seen so far).To see him being seemingly vilified as evil incarnate is difficult. I fully get the emotion of this situation and the need (and call) for justice and consequences.I think his resignation is appropriate (and overdue). I have mixed feelings about the game Saturday and whether he should or should not be on the sideline and whether I want him to be there or not.Others will surely disagree with me, but I'm not sure he (or anyone other than Sandusky) deserves this circus. The way many are treating Joe does NOTHING to help anyone or begin the healing process. Now that he is stepping aside, the pain and questions and problems will long endure. Where do we turn next?
If it's true that Spanier is out, Joe's the only one left who has not yet been held accountable for his role in this cover-upI'll keep waving my pitchfork around until that happens, and I can't understand why you and other Penn State alums would notYou don't get a free pass for something as horrible on the human scale as this, I don't care how many tackle football games you've won :rolleyes:
this
 
how can they possibly let him lead his team out onto the field on Saturday?
No way they can, unless they're okay with looking completely out of touch and defiant. Lots of eyes on Penn State as an institution here. This is way beyond football.
exactly.on one hand i want joepa gone immediately...on the other i would love to see him take the field on the road in a couple weeks and see the vitriol coming his way.also, the fact that this story broke the week after he got his win for the record is real convenient.
 
Maybe more info kept coming to light. Who knows? What we do know is that there was info on his computer that he felt he needed to destroy. Maybe someone threatened his family if the information ever became public. All speculation.
or perhaps he was killed because he was prosecuting the biggest heroin bust in the history of pennsylvania?
Given his search for how to destroy a HD, it's much more likely that he committed suicide or is living on some island someplace under a different name.
 
As a person that has loved PSU since childhood, I'm pretty disgusted and horrified that it was basically covered up for this long, GTFO Joe and take your buddies with you.

 
how can they possibly let him lead his team out onto the field on Saturday?
No way they can, unless they're okay with looking completely out of touch and defiant. Lots of eyes on Penn State as an institution here. This is way beyond football.
exactly.on one hand i want joepa gone immediately...on the other i would love to see him take the field on the road in a couple weeks and see the vitriol coming his way.

also, the fact that this story broke the week after he got his win for the record is real convenient.
He doesn't even take the field any more, does he?
 
how can they possibly let him lead his team out onto the field on Saturday?
No way they can, unless they're okay with looking completely out of touch and defiant. Lots of eyes on Penn State as an institution here. This is way beyond football.
exactly.on one hand i want joepa gone immediately...on the other i would love to see him take the field on the road in a couple weeks and see the vitriol coming his way.

also, the fact that this story broke the week after he got his win for the record is real convenient.
He doesn't even take the field any more, does he?
dont know...maybe he rides around in a rascal in the booth. regardless, the treatment that team will get with paterno as the head coach will be really unfair to the current players.mcqueary needs to go too.

 
The article that broke the news on the GJ investigation...

Patriot News (Harrisburg, Pennsylvania)

March 31, 2011

Sandusky faces grand jury probe

Penn State football legend Jerry Sandusky is the subject of a grand jury investigation into allegations that he indecently assaulted a teenage boy.

According to five people with knowledge of the case, a grand jury meeting in Harrisburg has been hearing testimony for at least 18 months about the allegation, which was made in 2009 by a 15-year-old from Clinton County.

The teen told authorities that Sandusky had inappropriate contact with him over a four-year period, starting when he was 10.

Penn State coach Joe Paterno, athletic director Tim Curley and retired university Vice President and Treasurer Gary Schultz were among those who appeared before the grand jury in January at the attorney general's Strawberry Square office complex, according to a person with knowledge of the investigation. Attempts to reach the three for comment were unsuccessful.

It is not clear whether university President Graham Spanier has testified, and he declined comment on the matter when questioned earlier this week.

At one time, Sandusky was considered Paterno's likely successor. During his 32 years on the sidelines, the State College man was credited with turning Penn State into Linebacker U, producing such pro football greats as Jack Ham and LaVar Arrington.

Sandusky, 67, retired from Penn State shortly after the Alamo Bowl in December 1999. In his 2000 autobiography, " Touched: The Jerry Sandusky Story," he says he decided to leave after he "came to the realization I was not destined to become the head football coach at Penn State."

He spent the next 11 years focused on running The Second Mile, a nonprofit he founded in 1977 that reaches 10,000 Pennsylvania youths a year through summer and year-round camp programs.

The charity was honored by President George H.W. Bush in 1990 as a " Point of Light."

Last fall, Sandusky announced that he was retiring from day-today involvement in the charity to spend more time with family and handle personal matters.

Since then, rumors of misconduct by Sandusky have lit up Internet comment threads and message boards that are normally havens for Penn State football fan chatter.

Repeated efforts to reach Sandusky over several weeks to comment on the investigation have been unsuccessful. He has not responded to phone calls and other attempts to reach him at his home or through attorney Joseph Amendola in State College.

As is standard policy, the attorney general's office would neither confirm nor deny whether a grand jury was meeting about Sandusky.

The 2009 investigation

The allegations against Sandusky surfaced in 2009, when he was volunteering as an assistant high school football coach at Central Mountain High School in Clinton County.

It was there the 15-year-old student told school officials that Sandusky had touched him inappropriately while they were alone in a gym.

John DiNunzio, Keystone Central School District's interim superintendent at the time, said the boy's mother reported the incident to the school principal and head football coach. At that point, DiNunzio said he was notified.

DiNunzio said he never spoke to the mother or the child. He said the principal and coach told him the boy alleged the " inappropriate" incident happened while the two were alone in a room on wrestling mats.

" It was strictly a touching type of situation," DiNunzio said of the allegations.

DiNunzio, who is now interim superintendent with the Bellefonte Area School District, called Clinton County Children and Youth Services. Once it left his desk, he says, he never heard a word from police.

" It's been a hush-hush situation," DiNunzio said. " I've actually called [the school] ? they've said they heard nothing about it."

According to sources, the boy told Children and Youth Services that Sandusky had indecent contact with him several times over four years.

Children and Youth Services investigated the boy's story and sent the case to Clinton County District Attorney Michael Salisbury. His office forwarded it to Centre County, where the incidents were alleged to have taken place.

Then-Centre County District Attorney Michael Madeira transferred the case to then-state Attorney General Tom Corbett in March 2009. Corbett, now governor, declined comment through his spokesman.

Kelly Hastings, current superintendent of Keystone Central School District, said she has no firsthand knowledge of the report and that no documents from the school have been subpoenaed by police.

DiNunzio, who has had a long career in education, said he was shocked when he heard the allegation and surprised that he was not contacted again.

" No one has ever called me about it in any way, shape or form," he said.

When Sandusky quit as a volunteer in 2009 with Central Mountain High School, he told officials there he was leaving to devote more time The Second Mile, DiNunzio said. Sandusky retired from The Second Mile about a year and a half later.

Second Mile Executive Director Dr. Jack Raykovitz wrote in an email: " While we are aware of the rumors circulating regarding Mr. Sandusky, we believe it would be inappropriate to respond to rumors. Further ... I am aware of no investigation of The Second Mile or our programs."

A Second Mile Board member, who asked not to be named, said Sandusky informed the board of the allegations against him and the investigation. At that point in time, Sandusky distanced himself from the kids but continued fundraising for the organization for a period of time before he finally retired, the board member said.

" We all know there's an investigation going on," the board member said.

Earlier allegation

Two months ago, state police at Rockview in Centre County began calling witnesses to a May 1998 report by Penn State University police detailing an earlier allegation of inappropriate contact against Sandusky by another boy.

According to several sources, that boy, who was 12 at the time, alleged he and Sandusky were showering in the football building on Penn State's campus when the incident took place.

The boy's mother told The Patriot-News she was specifically instructed by state police at Rockview not to speak with a reporter. Her name is being withheld by The Patriot-News to protect the identity of her son.

According to sources close to the investigation, the boy told police in 1998 that Sandusky had showered with him in a locker room of the Lasch Building ? home to the football program ? during a tour. The boy claimed Sandusky washed his body during the shower, sources said.

As part of the May 1998 investigation, police had the boy's mother call Sandusky to her State College home and confront him while they hid in another room, according to sources.

It was unclear what happened, but no charges were filed against Sandusky.

Another boy, now an adult in the armed forces, was named as a witness in the 1998 Penn State police report and has been contacted by state police, his wife confirmed.

When reached by phone, his mother said she took her son to Penn State police for questioning in 1998 but didn't listen to the interview. She said she never asked her son what happened.

Retired Penn State Police Officer Ron Schreffler handled the 1998 case. When approached recently, Schreffler said he couldn't comment and asked a reporter, " How did you see that report?"

While the grand jury has been hearing testimony, Sandusky has been devoting time to fundraising for The Second Mile.

In January, the organization received the go-ahead from Centre County commissioners to apply for a $ 3 million state grant to pay for an $ 8.5 million learning center on 60 acres near the University Park Airport.

The facility would eventually include housing for up to 100 children.

Sandusky's devotion to the program was the reason he gave for turning down job offers for football head coaching jobs at Temple University and the University of Maryland.

In his autobiography, Sandusky wrote: "Any time you deal with young people, there will be extreme highs and lows. There have been moments of frustration, despair and heartache."
 
'Chase Stuart said:
'timschochet said:
Attorneys out there- if you are the parents of one of the molested children, whom could you justifiably sue in this situation? Can you sue the University, or Paterno? (I realize that technically you can sue anybody, but I'm talking about suing with reasonable expectations of some kind of award.)
Unless there's a statute to sue under -- and I have no idea if there is -- I think you're left with common law negligence.One of the elements of negligence is duty of care; it would be hard to think what duty of care Paterno would owe any of the victims (legally speaking). Same goes for the University. If I'm building you a house, I owe you a duty of care not to negligently build it. If I'm driving my car next to you, I owe you a duty of care to drive safely.

But unless Paterno or University officials were putting those kids in rooms with Sandusky, I don't see a duty of care breach.
Oh, come on. Suppose you're a hungry lawyer at a big-time Philadelphia law firm that has just landed all 8 of these victims as clients. Are you really going to go to the senior partner with this? Not if you want to make partner for yourself, you won't. off the top of my head, I would present something more along the lines of Penn State having created an environment that protected personnel who were key players in its most valuable asset - it's lucrative football program. I would find a way to make this an institutional problem, not a Joe Paterno or Jerry Sandusky problem. But a problem that was allowed to exist because of the goals and the culture of the institution. I would then argue that substantial funding for PSU comes from the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania... that, yes, technically it is "state-related", meaning independent control, rather than state control, but the money trail leads straight to the Commonwealth jackpot. perhpas file suit against the University, then... if a big enough suit is won, maybe they have to go to the Commonwealth to pay it... But I cannot really think of not at least taking a shot at the Commonwealth directly.... perhaps naming PSU and the Commonwealth as co-defendants, doing lots of research and creative thinking in order to make a decent argument for a jury to sort out.
What about immunity issues? I'm not really up on sovereign immunity laws but can you sue Pennsylvania for this? Is there a statute that allows PA residents to sue officials and/or the state for negligence? And what about PSU? Does it matter that it is apparently "state-related"?
Here's a blurb from at least one PA law firm that may be looking to get in on the action:
In analyzing these allegations from a legal standard, it is abundantly clear that Penn State officials had actual knowledge of Sandusky’s horrific crimes and were negligent in not reporting the allegations or taking adequate measures in preventing future sexual abuse of children. As such, Penn State University is civilly liable to the victims of Sandusky’s alleged reprehensible acts.
 
how can they possibly let him lead his team out onto the field on Saturday?
No way they can, unless they're okay with looking completely out of touch and defiant. Lots of eyes on Penn State as an institution here. This is way beyond football.
exactly.on one hand i want joepa gone immediately...on the other i would love to see him take the field on the road in a couple weeks and see the vitriol coming his way.

also, the fact that this story broke the week after he got his win for the record is real convenient.
He doesn't even take the field any more, does he?
Isn't this the only thing he does?
 
'JZilla said:
'E-Z Glider said:
'JZilla said:
'E-Z Glider said:
'JZilla said:
It's not schadenfreude, it's outrage.
Yeah, nothing says "outrage" quite like childishly mocking pedophilia.
Don't take me out of context, #######. Was not talking about the Pedo State stuff.
Sorry, wasnt meant to refer to you, just used your post. Was referring to the imbeciles who are obviously only in this thread to get a rise out of someone.
Cool. I think acting like the people who are pissed about this are actually enjoying it, by calling it "schadenfreude", is equally toolish.Tressel, now that was schadenfreude
I think 93% of the posters (including you) are both pissed and outraged at the whole situation. I think 5% of the posters here are truly enjoying the downfall of PSU and have little concern about the people involved. I think 2% of the posters here are just plain idiots.
Ooo!! Ooo!! Ooo!! Which one am I?? Which one am I??
My link
:sulk:
 
This may have been covered already, but isn't it mandatory reporting to the authorities when someone suspects child abuse? Or is it just people who work with minors (teachers, camp counselors etc).

I know when I worked with kids at a summer camp they were very explicit that you go to your highest superior and the authorities at the same time. Maybe cause JoPa and the GA aren't regularly working with kids, they aren't 'mandatory reporters'?

This is NO EXCUSE. Just wondering v

 
'bagger said:
just waiting for it to come out that mccreary got the wr coaching job for keeping this quiet all this time.
I really dont think this is the case. He was born and raised in State College PA. He was the star QB at State College High. He was essentially an assistant coach for all 5 years he was on the sidelines, always had the headphones on. Even beck then they talked about his coaching future. He has been Joe's eyes and ears for the past 10 years. He has been running the sidelines for the past 3-4 years. Maybe all this happened because of the "dirt" he had, but I certainly dont think its a given.
Really? Because he lived across the street from me for years in Durham NC.
 
Guy had a lot of people duped...

Centre Daily Times (State College, PA)

April 11, 2011

Accusations are hurtful

My family has known Jerry Sandusky for more than 40 years. His commitment, loyalty and generosity are remarkable and should be commended. I have enormous respect for all he has done for at-risk youth over the years without asking anything in return.

The current accusations are hurtful and destructive not only to Sandusky and his family, but also to The Second Mile organization and the countless at-risk kids it has helped and currently is helping.

Sandusky is a rare treasure in the State College community. God bless him for all he has done and may God’s blessings be with him and his family during this very difficult time.

- Frances Heim-Young Annapolis, Md.
Centre Daily Times (State College, PA)

April 8, 2011

Accusations don’t add up

It has been a week since the story of Jerry Sandusky was published in the CDT. While I understand the need for The Second Mile to separate its good works from any potential outcome of this case, I must say, the silence from his “community” is deafening.

I have known Sandusky for more than 20 years and was involved with The Second Mile as a mentor. You can scour the state and not find very many people who have been more selfless, compassionate and helpful to so many. He has led a life of honor and charity unlike anyone I know. To see him shamed in this manner is disturbing and heartbreaking.

This issue just doesn’t pass the smell test. He has worked with tens of thousands of kids over 30 years, and for him to be accused of anything improper by one person at this stage of his life just makes no sense. Wouldn’t his type of behavior have shown itself sooner?

Accusations and slander like this hold people back from getting more involved in their community, whether it’s starting a charity or running for public office.

Thank you, Jerry, for not just talking about helping others, but for showing me how it’s done.

This will pass and Sandusky’s family, friends and God know the truth. That’s all that matters.

- Mike Bevilacqua Bellefonte
 
Maybe more info kept coming to light. Who knows? What we do know is that there was info on his computer that he felt he needed to destroy. Maybe someone threatened his family if the information ever became public. All speculation.
or perhaps he was killed because he was prosecuting the biggest heroin bust in the history of pennsylvania?
Given his search for how to destroy a HD, it's much more likely that he committed suicide or is living on some island someplace under a different name.
Police think he was lured out to where he parked his car and he was murdered.
 
'Chase Stuart said:
'timschochet said:
Attorneys out there- if you are the parents of one of the molested children, whom could you justifiably sue in this situation? Can you sue the University, or Paterno? (I realize that technically you can sue anybody, but I'm talking about suing with reasonable expectations of some kind of award.)
Unless there's a statute to sue under -- and I have no idea if there is -- I think you're left with common law negligence.One of the elements of negligence is duty of care; it would be hard to think what duty of care Paterno would owe any of the victims (legally speaking). Same goes for the University. If I'm building you a house, I owe you a duty of care not to negligently build it. If I'm driving my car next to you, I owe you a duty of care to drive safely.

But unless Paterno or University officials were putting those kids in rooms with Sandusky, I don't see a duty of care breach.
Oh, come on. Suppose you're a hungry lawyer at a big-time Philadelphia law firm that has just landed all 8 of these victims as clients. Are you really going to go to the senior partner with this? Not if you want to make partner for yourself, you won't. off the top of my head, I would present something more along the lines of Penn State having created an environment that protected personnel who were key players in its most valuable asset - it's lucrative football program. I would find a way to make this an institutional problem, not a Joe Paterno or Jerry Sandusky problem. But a problem that was allowed to exist because of the goals and the culture of the institution. I would then argue that substantial funding for PSU comes from the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania... that, yes, technically it is "state-related", meaning independent control, rather than state control, but the money trail leads straight to the Commonwealth jackpot. perhpas file suit against the University, then... if a big enough suit is won, maybe they have to go to the Commonwealth to pay it... But I cannot really think of not at least taking a shot at the Commonwealth directly.... perhaps naming PSU and the Commonwealth as co-defendants, doing lots of research and creative thinking in order to make a decent argument for a jury to sort out.
What about immunity issues? I'm not really up on sovereign immunity laws but can you sue Pennsylvania for this? Is there a statute that allows PA residents to sue officials and/or the state for negligence? And what about PSU? Does it matter that it is apparently "state-related"?
And here's a blurb from another child abuse attorney claiming to have been in contact with a number of Sandusky's alleged victims:
Jeff Anderson, a plaintiff's attorney who has represented thousands of sexual abuse plaintiffs over the past 28 years, told OKTC this afternoon that he'd already been in contact with some of the alleged victims of Jerry Sandusky. "Right now we are working on this," Anderson said, "that much I can tell you. We're receiving calls from family members of the victims and consulting with them." Asked whether a civil complaint against Penn State, coaches and administrators was forthcoming, Anderson declined to comment further.

But he did discuss in great detail the unfurling scandal at Penn State and the potential fallout of any civil lawsuit. "This situation is perfectly analogous to all the Catholic church cases I've litigated," Anderson said. "People at the top protected the institution at the peril of children. Here the coaches and administrators of Penn State were acting just like the bishops, cardinals, and archbishops of these dioceses. The same moral and legal quagmire exists. Penn State protected the football program's reputation instead of the children."

He said that Sandusky's alleged acts, just like the Catholic priests, were both "cunning and careful."

As a result, Anderson said, "They (Penn State) clearly face severe legal exposure for institutional failure. They are liable for these incidents."

It's important to note that civil cases exist independent of criminal proceedings. In criminal proceedings defendants face jail time. In civil proceedings monetary damages are assesed rather than guilt or innocence.

Anderson, who is a licensed attorney in Pennsylvania and has litigated multiple child sexual abuses cases there, said that in many ways Penn State is in an even more precarious position than the Catholic churches found themselves in. Churches had issues of condifidentiality that helped to protect the statements and actions of priests. Since Penn State is an educational institution, Anderson said the university faced a daunting legal battle. "Educators are by law required to report any suspicious activity to law enforcement," Anderson said. "If they don't report these issues to law enforcement, then they violate the law." That's because Anderson said that eductators have "an even higher legal duty to protect than clergy do."

Would there be any tort immunity provided because Penn State is a state institution?

Anderson says there will be no immunity. According to the attorney, Penn State is liable above and beyond any tort immunity statutes because the administrators at the school were guilty of "willful indifference and reckless conduct that violated the civil rights of the children." In cases such as these, Anderson said, Penn State had an obligation to protect the children and notify law enforcement if the children were not protected. Penn State did neither. As a result of what Anderson termed "a very serious cover-up," Anderson believes, "Punitive damages will also enter the conversation when a jury begins to deliberate."

Punitive damages exist as a matter of public policy. Jurors who believe that an action is so contrary to the public goodwill that it is indefensible are permitted to add to any actual damages that exist in order to send a message to others of what will not be tolerated.

Asked how much a civil lawsuit might cost Penn State, Anderson said, "It's premature to say exactly how much money that would be, but the university is heavily exposed."

When asked if he believed Penn State coach Joe Paterno would be named as a defendant in any civil lawsuit, Anderson tiptoed around the issue. "That remains to be seen," he said, "For now we have to wait on more details from our investigation."

Asked about any statute of limitations issues for the victims, now much older than when these alleged crimes occurred, Anderson said, "That's a complex issue. There's no clear answer." That's becaue Pennsylvania law typically call for statutes of limitations to end two-three years after a minor reaches the age of majority. Since some of the plaintiffs in this case might be over the age of 30 now, it could be complicated to include some of these plaintiffs. Even still, Anderson believes, "In cases such as these where there has been fraud or a cover-up, courts will have to decide what's appropriate."

What's becoming increasingly clear is that Penn State's legal morass will be pending for the next five years or more. And, depending on the number of plaintiffs and whether punitive damages are applied, we could be talking about damages running into the the hundreds of millions of dollars.

"I don't believe," said Anderson, "that jurors will look too kindly upon the actions of Penn State administrators."
 
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'bagger said:
just waiting for it to come out that mccreary got the wr coaching job for keeping this quiet all this time.
I really dont think this is the case. He was born and raised in State College PA. He was the star QB at State College High. He was essentially an assistant coach for all 5 years he was on the sidelines, always had the headphones on. Even beck then they talked about his coaching future. He has been Joe's eyes and ears for the past 10 years. He has been running the sidelines for the past 3-4 years. Maybe all this happened because of the "dirt" he had, but I certainly dont think its a given.
Really? Because he lived across the street from me for years in Durham NC.
Biographical details Place of birth State College, Pennsylvania
 
This may have been covered already, but isn't it mandatory reporting to the authorities when someone suspects child abuse? Or is it just people who work with minors (teachers, camp counselors etc).I know when I worked with kids at a summer camp they were very explicit that you go to your highest superior and the authorities at the same time. Maybe cause JoPa and the GA aren't regularly working with kids, they aren't 'mandatory reporters'?This is NO EXCUSE. Just wondering v
yes, that was the focus of the initial discussion we had.JoePa was reportedly not a focus of the investigation due to the fact that he reported this to his superiors so they felt he did the minimum he was legally required to. Morally, however, is a different story.It's the people above him that seem more likely to be in violation of these types of statutes. Their attorney has said it doesn't apply since the child victims were not Penn State students. I think one also argued that the statute of limitations had expired.
 
Penn State alumnus and football season ticket holder here.

Like many others, I've been working through a series of emotions and reactions this week ranging from disbelief to disappointmenent to anger to profound sadness.

I've mostly watched rather than contributed to this thread over the past few days, but after watching what I consider to be repeated "piling on" I just wanted to add my perspective as a potential counterbalance to what appears to be a "lynch mob" mentality.

As a parent, my heart breaks for the victims (known and unknown) of the monster that is Jerry Sandusky. I wish to god that Joe (or Mike or Mike's dad or Tim or Gary or Graham or the janitor or the janitor's boss or the people at Second Mile) would have done more anywhere along the way to stop this. I'd like to think that, in any of their positions, I might have made a different (and better) choice.

As an alumnus, it is devastating to learn that our leaders and role models acted so negligently. It is equally difficult to watch the university I hold so dearly and think so highly of shaken to its' foundation like this. To see the nightly news emanating from Happy Valley under such dark circumstances is surreal.

Having said all that (and in no way attempting to defend the inexcusable inaction of the individuals mentioned above), I am also saddened to see the venom and "black-and-white" rhetoric being bandied about by the self-proclaimed moral police, the torch-and-pitchfork crowd, and the "holier-than-though" bunch. Note: I fully realize that child abuse IS black-and-white. People (and their actions and motivations and thought process) aren't.

Joe Paterno has done an awful lot of good in his life, for Penn State and for the young men who passed through his football program and who he helped mentor and instill life values in. Look at how hard this has been and how this has affected people like Matt Millen, Todd Blackledge, Lavar Arrington, etc.

Joe has also done (intentionally or AND unintentionally) some unimaginable harm in whatever role he had in this (more by actions not taken than taken, based on the facts I've seen so far).

To see him being seemingly vilified as evil incarnate is difficult. I fully get the emotion of this situation and the need (and call) for justice and consequences.

I think his resignation is appropriate (and overdue). I have mixed feelings about the game Saturday and whether he should or should not be on the sideline and whether I want him to be there or not.

Others will surely disagree with me, but I'm not sure he (or anyone other than Sandusky) deserves this circus. The way many are treating Joe does NOTHING to help anyone or begin the healing process. Now that he is stepping aside, the pain and questions and problems will long endure. Where do we turn next?
fixedThat is the problem I see with Paterno.

He has intentionally AND unintentionally harmed many kids by doing nothing, when he knew what was walking amongst his campus.

Please do not say that the way Paterno is being treated does NOTHING for the healing process.

How about closure for one?

If these abused people are walking around thinking they never had the courage to stand up and say something see Paterno still being treated with kid gloves, it only ensures their feeling that they would never be able to stand up to PSU.

 
Maybe more info kept coming to light. Who knows? What we do know is that there was info on his computer that he felt he needed to destroy. Maybe someone threatened his family if the information ever became public. All speculation.
or perhaps he was killed because he was prosecuting the biggest heroin bust in the history of pennsylvania?
Given his search for how to destroy a HD, it's much more likely that he committed suicide or is living on some island someplace under a different name.
Police think he was lured out to where he parked his car and he was murdered.
And that's why he searched for info on how to destroy his hard drive two weeks prior. Got it.
 
Maybe more info kept coming to light. Who knows? What we do know is that there was info on his computer that he felt he needed to destroy. Maybe someone threatened his family if the information ever became public. All speculation.
or perhaps he was killed because he was prosecuting the biggest heroin bust in the history of pennsylvania?
What would compel him to erase his own hard drive?
 
'Sinn Fein said:
'Aaron Rudnicki said:
'Chase Stuart said:
But unless Paterno or University officials were putting those kids in rooms with Sandusky, I don't see a duty of care breach.
what about him and the football program/university giving Sandusky access to facilities, equipment, and whatever else that helped him prey on these kids?
I think you still have a nexus issue to say that Penn State's actions caused the abuse. It helps that Penn State had institutional knowledge that Sandusky, at best, behaved inappropriately with young kids on Penn State property.
Right. Despite popular perception, it's not easy to just sue anyone for anything.
It is easy to sue anyone for anything. It's not easy to win.With that said, if a plaintiff can get past a motion to dismiss, he'll get to do all sorts of discovery and potentially uncover all sorts of shady secrets that Penn State wouldn't want to come out. All the bigwigs including Paterno would get deposed and all sorts of documents and emails would be subpoenaed and get handed over to the media. The defendants would have a big incentive to settle even if they were likely to ultimately win the case.
 
Penn State alumnus and football season ticket holder here.

Like many others, I've been working through a series of emotions and reactions this week ranging from disbelief to disappointmenent to anger to profound sadness.

I've mostly watched rather than contributed to this thread over the past few days, but after watching what I consider to be repeated "piling on" I just wanted to add my perspective as a potential counterbalance to what appears to be a "lynch mob" mentality.

As a parent, my heart breaks for the victims (known and unknown) of the monster that is Jerry Sandusky. I wish to god that Joe (or Mike or Mike's dad or Tim or Gary or Graham or the janitor or the janitor's boss or the people at Second Mile) would have done more anywhere along the way to stop this. I'd like to think that, in any of their positions, I might have made a different (and better) choice.

As an alumnus, it is devastating to learn that our leaders and role models acted so negligently. It is equally difficult to watch the university I hold so dearly and think so highly of shaken to its' foundation like this. To see the nightly news emanating from Happy Valley under such dark circumstances is surreal.

Having said all that (and in no way attempting to defend the inexcusable inaction of the individuals mentioned above), I am also saddened to see the venom and "black-and-white" rhetoric being bandied about by the self-proclaimed moral police, the torch-and-pitchfork crowd, and the "holier-than-thou" bunch. Note: I fully realize that child abuse IS black-and-white. People (and their actions and motivations and thought process) aren't.

Joe Paterno has done an awful lot of good in his life, for Penn State and for the young men who passed through his football program and who he helped mentor and instill life values in. Look at how hard this has been and how this has affected people like Matt Millen, Todd Blackledge, Lavar Arrington, etc.

Joe has also done (intentionally or unintentionally) some unimaginable harm in whatever role he had in this (more by actions not taken than taken, based on the facts I've seen so far).

To see him being seemingly vilified as evil incarnate is difficult. I fully get the emotion of this situation and the need (and call) for justice and consequences.

I think his resignation is appropriate (and overdue). I have mixed feelings about the game Saturday and whether he should or should not be on the sideline and whether I want him to be there or not.

Others will surely disagree with me, but I'm not sure he (or anyone other than Sandusky) deserves this circus. The way many are treating Joe does NOTHING to help anyone or begin the healing process. Now that he is stepping aside, the pain and questions and problems will long endure. Where do we turn next?
Wow, really?
 
Lots of things still are unexplained.

Key in this is why did McQueary not step in during the act he witnessed? Why call his dad who could do nothing? How do you go on knowing you witnessed this crime go unreported for so many years? This to me smacks of an organization cover-up which was known at least in small part across the whole program. Something that was so heinous that people just hoped it wasn't true. When actually confronted with the hard evidence he figures it was a common thing and shouldn't be remarked upon?

I doubt Paterno knows how to even boot a computer so the odds of an email chain coming out on this are slim to none.

 
Maybe more info kept coming to light. Who knows? What we do know is that there was info on his computer that he felt he needed to destroy. Maybe someone threatened his family if the information ever became public. All speculation.
or perhaps he was killed because he was prosecuting the biggest heroin bust in the history of pennsylvania?
Given his search for how to destroy a HD, it's much more likely that he committed suicide or is living on some island someplace under a different name.
Police think he was lured out to where he parked his car and he was murdered.
And that's why he searched for info on how to destroy his hard drive two weeks prior. Got it.
And how do you know he didn't destroy it for someone else, and then gave them the evidence to prove that it was destroyed, and then they destroyed him (which wasn't part of the deal)? Police believe someone else was there too where his car was found. His car had ashes from cigarettes in it, smelled like smoke, and butts were outside it with someone elses DNA. He didn't smoke.
 
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'Chase Stuart said:
This scandal is a coverup of something else terible, IMO.

Let's walk through this logically.

McQueary -- a former star QB and now grad assistant -- sees an old retired coach prison raping a child. #1 -- HTF do you not stop him? You want to tell me that a former finalist for the Unitas award can't stop a 58-year-old man who's naked with a boy in the shower? He's 30 years younger than him and in much better shape.

But okay, let's think. McQueary sees this, and is sicked/shocked/disgusted. He freezes. He runs, cowardly, but he runs. That happens. Some people flee instead of fighting, I get that.

So he meets with Paterno the next day. How do you think this goes down? Take a second and picture them sitting in Paterno's living room.

MM: Um, Joe. This was really bad. I, uh,... I, uh, saw coach Sandusky. With a boy. In the shower.

JP: [stunned silence.]

MM: Yeah. It was, uh, not good.

JP: When was this?

MM: Last night. Late at night, I went back to the locker room and found them there.

JP: So he was in the shower Saturday night with a young boy when he thought everyone had gone home?

MM: Yes. It was, uh, really bad. I don't even know if I can say it out loud.

JP: Oh my goodness. I don't think I even want to hear this. We need to meet with the AD and Curley and maybe Spanier as soon as possible.

MM: Okay.

JP: This is bad.

MM: Yes.

Now they all meet, and McQueary tells the story. The administration asks him for every detail, and he supplies it to them.

Curley and the AD say "Okay, this is horrible. But stop for a second. If we go to the police, they're going to ask us what evidence do we have. Mike, do you have any evidence?"

MM: No. I just, ya know, saw it. It happened, trust me. But no, I have no evidence.

AD: Okay, let's think this through.

From here, I see three scenarios.

The normal person reaction

Okay, this is bad. But let's go to the police. I am sure there was surveillance video of him entering the building, presumably with the kid. Then at least we can identify him. Then it would be 2 people's word against 1. Plus, maybe once the police start questioning Sandusky, he admits to it?

I mean, I don't know. This is ugly, and could become a circus. But obviously we need to do something. Let's tell the police, and hope we can convict this guy. Once the police are involved, we can find out a lot more. If nothing else, it ruins his reputation and prevents him from ever doing this again.

The cover-up but that's it response

Okay, this is bad. But here's the problem. We have almost no evidence. This is going to look terrible on the school. We don't even know who the kid is. Jerry is a sicko, but we all used to like him. We don't want to see him being remembered like this. Here's what we do: We go to him, tell him what happened, and say he's got to go to the other side of the country. Jerry, we know what happened, we are disgusted by it, we hope you get help, but please GTFO of State College. Immediately. You lose access to everything, immediately. I don't care about your house. Hire someone to sell it for you. You have any problem with this, we go to the police and handle it that way.

What actually happened

Now WHY would that not happen? After Paterno and the administration knew about it, how could they not kick Sandusky out immediately? Why in the world would they not tell him -- at a BARE MINIMUM -- get the F out of State College or we go to the cops. We caught you, you have no leverage, you're done. Leave here and never, ever come back, and this is us being NICE to you.

We are sickened by you, and maybe we're being slimy, but we don't want to bring down the school, the program, or even you. Just go far away.

There's only one reason that didn't happen. Sandusky had something on someone. If he had something on JoePa personally, I think the school says F off. He must have had something on the school.

Realistically, he is most likely to have what? Something where he has access, the football program. So he's got something on the football program. And Sandusky probably documented all of this, knowing that he could use it one day as leverage. If you're a sick child-raping monster and are worried that one day you'll be caught by X and Y, as a side-hobby, you're going to do everything you can to get something on X and Y to prevent you from going to jail.

I suspect Sandusky probably kept notes on players being paid or something of that ilk for years. Maybe it was worse -- maybe a player raped or murdered someone, and Sandusky and co. helped sweep it under the rug: but not before Sandusky kept evidence of it. He knew he would need something if he ever got caught.

Now the administration is in a bind. If they go nuclear on Sandusky, he goes to the press/police/ncaa with whatever he has. And what he has is bad. So they threaten him to leave, and he plays hardball. He says F you to Paterno and Spanier and Curley. He says I've got X on you, I'm not leaving. They reach a middle ground, where he stays far in the background but is allowed to stay on campus.

And then all of this breaks.

Is this a conspiracy theory? Of course. But the most likely explanation is the simplest.

Why does the school -- knowing beyond a shadow of a doubt that he was prison raping children -- allow Sandusky to stay on campus, be listed in the phone directory as a member of the administration, have access to the facilities, etc.? Because he had something on them. And he had proof.

Who knows what that is.
It's a fascinating theory, but I think they knew about previous Sandusky crimes. Uncovering it in 2002 would've inevitably uncovered those (or Sandusky would rat them out for knowing) and what has happened recently would've happened in 02. So they continued to cover up. Why else do you cover in 02 when the guy wasn't even a coach or employee anymore? Yeah it would've been embarassing and a big story for a week but that would've been the end of it.

 
'Joe Bryant said:
'timschochet said:
I've been hearing some criticism of the Penn State students on the radio this morning, the ones who went to Paterno's house last night and shouted their loyalty. I don't think this group should be criticized. This is human nature. Someone whom they regard as "one of their own" is under attack nationally, and the common reaction is to rally around him. Bob Knight received the same treatment. Given all of the facts and time to reflect, I'm betting that many if not most of these students will come to regret the fact that they were such vocal supporters of Paterno once this story broke. But let's not blame them for reacting emotionally in the initial stages.
Couldn't disagree more.People get to act however they want and they get a free pass because they're "emotional"? It's ok somehow as long as many of them regret it later?When you hear: "Tough life, when people do certain things to you. Anyway, you've been great. Everything's great, all right." and the very first response is to shout "We love you Joe". I don't give that a free pass. I'm sorry.I think it's a symptom of the bigger picture which looks to me why this was allowed to go on - the power wielded by the football program here allowed it to be above the law. Does anyone for a minute think this kind of thing would have been allowed to continue the same way if Sandusky was a non famous elementary school teacher with no political clout and his boss wasn't a legendary football coach? I don't.The blind loyalty ignoring reality is scary.And the question about turning your back on the guy is fair. But there is a difference between supporting someone you love and going to party on their front yard and yell for their hero. I can see that the decision to turn your friend into the police would be excruciating. That had to be difficult for Paterno. But if he knew about it, allowing it go on is worse in my opinion.J
Millions of people still support Michael Jackson.
 
'Joe Bryant said:
'timschochet said:
I've been hearing some criticism of the Penn State students on the radio this morning, the ones who went to Paterno's house last night and shouted their loyalty. I don't think this group should be criticized. This is human nature. Someone whom they regard as "one of their own" is under attack nationally, and the common reaction is to rally around him. Bob Knight received the same treatment. Given all of the facts and time to reflect, I'm betting that many if not most of these students will come to regret the fact that they were such vocal supporters of Paterno once this story broke. But let's not blame them for reacting emotionally in the initial stages.
Couldn't disagree more.People get to act however they want and they get a free pass because they're "emotional"? It's ok somehow as long as many of them regret it later?When you hear: "Tough life, when people do certain things to you. Anyway, you've been great. Everything's great, all right." and the very first response is to shout "We love you Joe". I don't give that a free pass. I'm sorry.I think it's a symptom of the bigger picture which looks to me why this was allowed to go on - the power wielded by the football program here allowed it to be above the law. Does anyone for a minute think this kind of thing would have been allowed to continue the same way if Sandusky was a non famous elementary school teacher with no political clout and his boss wasn't a legendary football coach? I don't.The blind loyalty ignoring reality is scary.And the question about turning your back on the guy is fair. But there is a difference between supporting someone you love and going to party on their front yard and yell for their hero. I can see that the decision to turn your friend into the police would be excruciating. That had to be difficult for Paterno. But if he knew about it, allowing it go on is worse in my opinion.J
Millions of people still support Michael Jackson.
(I can't believe I'm about to say this). You cannot compare Joe Paterno to Michael Jackson. If anyone is Michael Jackson, its Jerry Sandusky.(Now my ####### head hurts).
 
'timschochet said:
'whoknew said:
I think its impossible to believe that McQueary saw the rape and didn't tell Paterno the full extent. How could he not?
This is one of the two key points that caused me to change my thinking about this situation. Originally, as I posted here, I thought Paterno was being railroaded without evidence. Since he had always been someone I admired, I defended him.The other point, just as large in my mind, is the fact that though the school never notified the authorities about Sandusky, the man who accused him, McQueary, stayed with the program and was eventually promoted to assistant coach. This makes absolutely no sense. Either Paterno thinks Sandusky is guilty, in which case he covered up for him, or he thinks McQueary must be some kind of crazy liar, in which case why was he promoted? There can be logical explanation for this fact except that Paterno is guilty of a cover up.
These exact conclusions were already reached by someone else about 20 pages ago.
 

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