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Karlos Williams, RB (BUF) (1 Viewer)

Rotoworld blurb credits the fumble recovery TD to Karlos. Wouldn't that be a nice little addition for users of Karlos if he was also scoring TDs on defense/special teams!

You would think rotoworld would do a little fact checking.

 
VikingFrog said:
Rotoworld blurb credits the fumble recovery TD to Karlos. Wouldn't that be a nice little addition for users of Karlos if he was also scoring TDs on defense/special teams!

You would think rotoworld would do a little fact checking.
Agreed, although to be fair, Buffalo has 5 guys with the last name Williams on their team so it can get a little confusing.

 
VikingFrog said:
Rotoworld blurb credits the fumble recovery TD to Karlos. Wouldn't that be a nice little addition for users of Karlos if he was also scoring TDs on defense/special teams!

You would think rotoworld would do a little fact checking.
Agreed, although to be fair, Buffalo has 5 guys with the last name Williams on their team so it can get a little confusing.
Glad that was cleared up. Thanks. Took Roto's word for it and thought my league scoring was messed up.

 
If McCoy is gone and they don't bring in anyone else significant, I think Karlos goes late 2nd-early 3rd in standard redraft leagues.

 
I'm not sure Karlos is cut out to be a 20-touch per game workhorse.

And why wouldn't LeSean be back? They just signed him this season.

 
That was a bailout TD last night where two defenders screwed up but I'll certainly take it. He wasn't close to getting one on the ground and McCoy isn't going anywhere and in fact looked great. Now Shady gets extra rest to boot. As good as Karlos is, it will be a crapshoot from here on out unless McCoy goes down.

I wouldn't get too excited unless we are talking dynasty. Then you're set, he's the real deal.

 
That was a bailout TD last night where two defenders screwed up but I'll certainly take it. He wasn't close to getting one on the ground and McCoy isn't going anywhere and in fact looked great. Now Shady gets extra rest to boot. As good as Karlos is, it will be a crapshoot from here on out unless McCoy goes down.

I wouldn't get too excited unless we are talking dynasty. Then you're set, he's the real deal.
Karlos is not a crapshoot. He is going to get 50-60 yards with a good chance for a TD. Bills offense can support both of them and Karlos is getting plenty of RZ work.

With the RB landscape now you can certainly do worse. If you have better options, then yeah he's a sit, but he absolutely has some redraft utility as RB3/Flex with RB1 upside if something happens to McCoy.

 
That was a bailout TD last night where two defenders screwed up but I'll certainly take it. He wasn't close to getting one on the ground and McCoy isn't going anywhere and in fact looked great. Now Shady gets extra rest to boot. As good as Karlos is, it will be a crapshoot from here on out unless McCoy goes down.

I wouldn't get too excited unless we are talking dynasty. Then you're set, he's the real deal.
Karlos is not a crapshoot. He is going to get 50-60 yards with a good chance for a TD. Bills offense can support both of them and Karlos is getting plenty of RZ work.
Disagree. You can't just pencil him in for that and saying he has a good chance at a TD is also overly optimistic. And if he doesn't get that TD you're counting on, then what? You get your clunker. You're basically counting on the TD's to keep coming. Careful with that.

The Bills also might not be in every game, allowing the run so much. 4 of their next 6 are on the road and they're not the Patriots. It most certainly is a crapshoot.

 
That was a bailout TD last night where two defenders screwed up but I'll certainly take it. He wasn't close to getting one on the ground and McCoy isn't going anywhere and in fact looked great. Now Shady gets extra rest to boot. As good as Karlos is, it will be a crapshoot from here on out unless McCoy goes down.

I wouldn't get too excited unless we are talking dynasty. Then you're set, he's the real deal.
Karlos is not a crapshoot. He is going to get 50-60 yards with a good chance for a TD. Bills offense can support both of them and Karlos is getting plenty of RZ work.
Disagree. You can't just pencil him in for that and saying he has a good chance at a TD is also overly optimistic. And if he doesn't get that TD you're counting on, then what? You get your clunker. You're basically counting on the TD's to keep coming. Careful with that.

The Bills also might not be in every game, allowing the run so much. 4 of their next 6 are on the road and they're not the Patriots. It most certainly is a crapshoot.
The clunker is 50-60 yards and no touchdowns, if its really bad he'll get 30-40 yards. This is better and safer than many RBs, especially one who has RB1 upside. He also can and has been a part of the passing game, so game-flow doesn't hurt him so much.

Based on his performance/utilization this year over 6 games, I believe the chances of him getting 50-60yds with a TD are higher than his odds of getting 30-40 yards with no TDs. His floor is pretty safe around 5 pts with a 20+ pt ceiling.

 
That was a bailout TD last night where two defenders screwed up but I'll certainly take it. He wasn't close to getting one on the ground and McCoy isn't going anywhere and in fact looked great. Now Shady gets extra rest to boot. As good as Karlos is, it will be a crapshoot from here on out unless McCoy goes down.

I wouldn't get too excited unless we are talking dynasty. Then you're set, he's the real deal.
Karlos is not a crapshoot. He is going to get 50-60 yards with a good chance for a TD. Bills offense can support both of them and Karlos is getting plenty of RZ work.
Disagree. You can't just pencil him in for that and saying he has a good chance at a TD is also overly optimistic. And if he doesn't get that TD you're counting on, then what? You get your clunker. You're basically counting on the TD's to keep coming. Careful with that.

The Bills also might not be in every game, allowing the run so much. 4 of their next 6 are on the road and they're not the Patriots. It most certainly is a crapshoot.
No its not. Right now his TD/Game ratio is 100%

 
That was a bailout TD last night where two defenders screwed up but I'll certainly take it. He wasn't close to getting one on the ground and McCoy isn't going anywhere and in fact looked great. Now Shady gets extra rest to boot. As good as Karlos is, it will be a crapshoot from here on out unless McCoy goes down.

I wouldn't get too excited unless we are talking dynasty. Then you're set, he's the real deal.
Karlos is not a crapshoot. He is going to get 50-60 yards with a good chance for a TD. Bills offense can support both of them and Karlos is getting plenty of RZ work.
Disagree. You can't just pencil him in for that and saying he has a good chance at a TD is also overly optimistic. And if he doesn't get that TD you're counting on, then what? You get your clunker. You're basically counting on the TD's to keep coming. Careful with that.

The Bills also might not be in every game, allowing the run so much. 4 of their next 6 are on the road and they're not the Patriots. It most certainly is a crapshoot.
No its not. Right now his TD/Game ratio is 100%
OMG no way REALLY? Nobody knew this and no regression is plausible. TD's are guarantees. Thanks, I'm going to trade for him now while his stock is so low.

 
That was a bailout TD last night where two defenders screwed up but I'll certainly take it. He wasn't close to getting one on the ground and McCoy isn't going anywhere and in fact looked great. Now Shady gets extra rest to boot. As good as Karlos is, it will be a crapshoot from here on out unless McCoy goes down.

I wouldn't get too excited unless we are talking dynasty. Then you're set, he's the real deal.
Karlos is not a crapshoot. He is going to get 50-60 yards with a good chance for a TD. Bills offense can support both of them and Karlos is getting plenty of RZ work.
Disagree. You can't just pencil him in for that and saying he has a good chance at a TD is also overly optimistic. And if he doesn't get that TD you're counting on, then what? You get your clunker. You're basically counting on the TD's to keep coming. Careful with that.

The Bills also might not be in every game, allowing the run so much. 4 of their next 6 are on the road and they're not the Patriots. It most certainly is a crapshoot.
No its not. Right now his TD/Game ratio is 100%
OMG no way REALLY? Nobody knew this and no regression is plausible. TD's are guarantees. Thanks, I'm going to trade for him now while his stock is so low.
go for it

 
Very fluke td last night and McCoy looked quite a bit better than him. His value will only be there if McCoy gets hurt again, occasionally vulturing a td

 
Very fluke td last night and McCoy looked quite a bit better than him. His value will only be there if McCoy gets hurt again, occasionally vulturing a td
How can you say that when he's averaged 14.4 FP/G in standard scoring while playing behind McCoy in 5 games this year?

I don't think anyone think he's going to score a TD every game as he has, but its not just a fluke that he continues to score TDs. He's clearly a dynamic playmaker, both running and receiving. So happens that he's behind another really good playmaker at RB, but the offense has shown repeatedly it can support both RBs from a fantasy stand point.

Even with some negative regression, I'd have to put his odds of scoring a TD around 50%.

 
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He matched the all time record for TDs in first games played last night. I think regardless of his skill level, (even if you say he is the most talented back of all time, which he isn't) he has been lucky in the TD column. Even the top elite backs of all time have not done what he has in his first games as far as TD production goes. Some of that is luck. Hes very talented but there are a few stinkers waiting out thre as long as he continues to play behind McCoy. He's not Dion Lewis where you dont care if he only gets 7-9 carries. I cried when watching Dion's last game against Wash. Dion was looking so good before he went down aside from that easy TD he dropped) ... but I digress. Honestly McCoy looked very good last night, better than Karlos.

 
He matched the all time record for TDs in first games played last night. I think regardless of his skill level, (even if you say he is the most talented back of all time, which he isn't) he has been lucky in the TD column. Even the top elite backs of all time have not done what he has in his first games as far as TD production goes. Some of that is luck. Hes very talented but there are a few stinkers waiting out thre as long as he continues to play behind McCoy. He's not Dion Lewis where you dont care if he only gets 7-9 carries. I cried when watching Dion's last game against Wash. Dion was looking so good before he went down aside from that easy TD he dropped) ... but I digress. Honestly McCoy looked very good last night, better than Karlos.
I don't care when he gets 9 carries for 110 yards and 2 lucky TDs.

 
He matched the all time record for TDs in first games played last night. I think regardless of his skill level, (even if you say he is the most talented back of all time, which he isn't) he has been lucky in the TD column. Even the top elite backs of all time have not done what he has in his first games as far as TD production goes. Some of that is luck. Hes very talented but there are a few stinkers waiting out thre as long as he continues to play behind McCoy. He's not Dion Lewis where you dont care if he only gets 7-9 carries. I cried when watching Dion's last game against Wash. Dion was looking so good before he went down aside from that easy TD he dropped) ... but I digress. Honestly McCoy looked very good last night, better than Karlos.
Completely agree with both points. But there is a lesser role carved out for Karlos where he shown he can easily score 5 pts as a floor.

If you take away all of his TDs, he's still averaging 6.9 pts per game in standard scoring.

 
Is Rex the kind of guy to call this guys number next week JUST to get the kid the record? Might be worth a start if you're reasonably sure Rex would go out of his way to help him instead of maybe doing what's best for the team.

 
That was a bailout TD last night where two defenders screwed up but I'll certainly take it. He wasn't close to getting one on the ground and McCoy isn't going anywhere and in fact looked great. Now Shady gets extra rest to boot. As good as Karlos is, it will be a crapshoot from here on out unless McCoy goes down.

I wouldn't get too excited unless we are talking dynasty. Then you're set, he's the real deal.
Karlos is not a crapshoot. He is going to get 50-60 yards with a good chance for a TD. Bills offense can support both of them and Karlos is getting plenty of RZ work.

With the RB landscape now you can certainly do worse. If you have better options, then yeah he's a sit, but he absolutely has some redraft utility as RB3/Flex with RB1 upside if something happens to McCoy.
He's had 2 carries inside the 10, I'm not sure if that counts as plenty Also he has had less than 25 yards rushing in 2 of his 6 games this year, I don't see how you can say his floor is 50-60 yards even if you count receptions. He has only caught a pass in 3 games. He has done well and he has a ton of talent, but his TD streak this year is one of the biggest flukes I've ever seen and it won't continue with the lack of touches. He could be a star if something happened to McCoy, but of course last time that happened, Karlos missed his opportunity and sat out the next 3 games. He's been on my team all season, but I doubt I have the guts to start him in a single game unless he starts getting more than a small handful of touches a game. Every bit of information points to this guy regressing unless something happens to McCoy.

 
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That was a bailout TD last night where two defenders screwed up but I'll certainly take it. He wasn't close to getting one on the ground and McCoy isn't going anywhere and in fact looked great. Now Shady gets extra rest to boot. As good as Karlos is, it will be a crapshoot from here on out unless McCoy goes down.

I wouldn't get too excited unless we are talking dynasty. Then you're set, he's the real deal.
Karlos is not a crapshoot. He is going to get 50-60 yards with a good chance for a TD. Bills offense can support both of them and Karlos is getting plenty of RZ work.

With the RB landscape now you can certainly do worse. If you have better options, then yeah he's a sit, but he absolutely has some redraft utility as RB3/Flex with RB1 upside if something happens to McCoy.
He's had 2 carries inside the 10, I'm not sure if that counts as plenty Also he has had less than 25 yards rushing in 2 of his 6 games this year, I don't see how you can say his floor is 50-60 yards even if you count receptions. He has only caught a pass in 3 games. He has done well and he has a ton of talent, but his TD streak this year is one of the biggest flukes I've ever seen and it won't continue with the lack of touches. He could be a star if something happened to McCoy, but of course last time that happened, Karlos missed his opportunity and sat out the next 3 games. He's been on my team all season, but I doubt I have the guts to start him in a single game unless he starts getting more than a small handful of touches a game. Every bit of information points to this guy regressing unless something happens to McCoy.
I say that because through 6 games of his career he is averaging about 69 total yards per game.

Nobody is contending the TD streak is here to stay, but to simply ignore it as all fluke is just as silly. He clearly is doing some things right to get in to the end zone, some of that is luck, some if it is playmaking.

 
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That was a bailout TD last night where two defenders screwed up but I'll certainly take it. He wasn't close to getting one on the ground and McCoy isn't going anywhere and in fact looked great. Now Shady gets extra rest to boot. As good as Karlos is, it will be a crapshoot from here on out unless McCoy goes down.

I wouldn't get too excited unless we are talking dynasty. Then you're set, he's the real deal.
Karlos is not a crapshoot. He is going to get 50-60 yards with a good chance for a TD. Bills offense can support both of them and Karlos is getting plenty of RZ work.

With the RB landscape now you can certainly do worse. If you have better options, then yeah he's a sit, but he absolutely has some redraft utility as RB3/Flex with RB1 upside if something happens to McCoy.
He's had 2 carries inside the 10, I'm not sure if that counts as plenty Also he has had less than 25 yards rushing in 2 of his 6 games this year, I don't see how you can say his floor is 50-60 yards even if you count receptions. He has only caught a pass in 3 games. He has done well and he has a ton of talent, but his TD streak this year is one of the biggest flukes I've ever seen and it won't continue with the lack of touches. He could be a star if something happened to McCoy, but of course last time that happened, Karlos missed his opportunity and sat out the next 3 games. He's been on my team all season, but I doubt I have the guts to start him in a single game unless he starts getting more than a small handful of touches a game. Every bit of information points to this guy regressing unless something happens to McCoy.
Careful with logic here, shadyridr will counter that his TD/game ratio is 100%. And that's what you go on.

 
Very fluke td last night and McCoy looked quite a bit better than him. His value will only be there if McCoy gets hurt again, occasionally vulturing a td
How can you say that when he's averaged 14.4 FP/G in standard scoring while playing behind McCoy in 5 games this year?I don't think anyone think he's going to score a TD every game as he has, but its not just a fluke that he continues to score TDs. He's clearly a dynamic playmaker, both running and receiving. So happens that he's behind another really good playmaker at RB, but the offense has shown repeatedly it can support both RBs from a fantasy stand point.

Even with some negative regression, I'd have to put his odds of scoring a TD around 50%.
I don't believe McCoy was very healthy for the early part of the season. If last night is an indication of future carries then Williams is not someone I would be comfortable starting in any format. His value is great only if McCoy is hurt.
 
Very fluke td last night and McCoy looked quite a bit better than him. His value will only be there if McCoy gets hurt again, occasionally vulturing a td
How can you say that when he's averaged 14.4 FP/G in standard scoring while playing behind McCoy in 5 games this year?I don't think anyone think he's going to score a TD every game as he has, but its not just a fluke that he continues to score TDs. He's clearly a dynamic playmaker, both running and receiving. So happens that he's behind another really good playmaker at RB, but the offense has shown repeatedly it can support both RBs from a fantasy stand point.

Even with some negative regression, I'd have to put his odds of scoring a TD around 50%.
I don't believe McCoy was very healthy for the early part of the season. If last night is an indication of future carries then Williams is not someone I would be comfortable starting in any format. His value is great only if McCoy is hurt.
Breakdown of carries in weeks both Karlos & McCoy played..

Week 10: McCoy - 19, Karlos - 7 (63/27% split)

Week 9: McCoy - 16, Karlos - 9 (54/27% split)

Week 3: McCoy - 11, Karlos - 12 (McCoy was injured, 48/52% split)

Week 2: McCoy - 15, Karlos - 6 (62/28% split)

Week 1: McCoy -17, Karlos - 6 (74/26% split)

The utilization this week was about on par for the other games.. If you think that Karlos' role will shrink then we just disagree on that point. I believe that in a perfect world Rex wants to rush 30 times and would like about a 66/33 split between McCoy/Karlos.

Karlos is a backup, you are not going to start him over the 15-20 RBs (complete guess) who are getting many more touches. All I'm saying is that as a RB2 fill-in flex type play you can do way worse, and he has arguably the highest upside of any reserve RB.

 
The guy is electric. Its a double edged sword in that he scores like Murphy hitting HRs in the NLCS, but gets only about 1/3 of a true workload.

Not close to a weekly start, but an upside flex every week which is better than many options in larger leagues.

 
Very fluke td last night and McCoy looked quite a bit better than him. His value will only be there if McCoy gets hurt again, occasionally vulturing a td
To say McCoy looked quite a bit better is just giving him credit for style points. Williams has been decidedly more effective than McCoy, it's just not as pretty. Can't wait until 2017 when Williams will likely have this job to himself.
 
Is Rex the kind of guy to call this guys number next week JUST to get the kid the record? Might be worth a start if you're reasonably sure Rex would go out of his way to help him instead of maybe doing what's best for the team.
I think he is that kind of guy, but I don't think he'd prioritize that over beating the Patriots. He badly wants to beat them. If BUF is getting blown out, I could see him giving Karlos a few extra touches for the record.


 
Very fluke td last night and McCoy looked quite a bit better than him. His value will only be there if McCoy gets hurt again, occasionally vulturing a td
Totally different types of running styles. So your claim that shady looked better is not accurate
 
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Very fluke td last night and McCoy looked quite a bit better than him. His value will only be there if McCoy gets hurt again, occasionally vulturing a td
Totally different types of running styles. So your claim that shady looked better is not accurate
Look, just my opinion from watching last night. In a redraft drafting today, McCoy is clearly the back to own. Williams looks like he may do well long term but time will tell
 
Very fluke td last night and McCoy looked quite a bit better than him. His value will only be there if McCoy gets hurt again, occasionally vulturing a td
Totally different types of running styles. So your claim that shady looked better is not accurate
Look, just my opinion from watching last night. In a redraft drafting today, McCoy is clearly the back to own. Williams looks like he may do well long term but time will tell
It isn't a binary choice though. Nobody is saying that in redraft Karlos is the back to own of the two, just that he has RB2~3/Flex appeal even with McCoy doing his thing.

 
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Very fluke td last night and McCoy looked quite a bit better than him. His value will only be there if McCoy gets hurt again, occasionally vulturing a td
Totally different types of running styles. So your claim that shady looked better is not accurate
Look, just my opinion from watching last night. In a redraft drafting today, McCoy is clearly the back to own. Williams looks like he may do well long term but time will tell
It isn't a binary choice though. Nobody is saying that in redraft Karlos is the back to own of the two, just that he has RB2~3/Flex appeal even with McCoy doing his thing.
I agree with this. Very similar to Murray/Mathews

 
Very fluke td last night and McCoy looked quite a bit better than him. His value will only be there if McCoy gets hurt again, occasionally vulturing a td
Totally different types of running styles. So your claim that shady looked better is not accurate
Look, just my opinion from watching last night. In a redraft drafting today, McCoy is clearly the back to own. Williams looks like he may do well long term but time will tell
It isn't a binary choice though. Nobody is saying that in redraft Karlos is the back to own of the two, just that he has RB2~3/Flex appeal even with McCoy doing his thing.
To each his own. I would not be comfortable starting Williams as my rb 2 going forward unless McCoy is hurt
 
Don said:
tone1oc said:
Don said:
rjv said:
Don said:
Very fluke td last night and McCoy looked quite a bit better than him. His value will only be there if McCoy gets hurt again, occasionally vulturing a td
Totally different types of running styles. So your claim that shady looked better is not accurate
Look, just my opinion from watching last night. In a redraft drafting today, McCoy is clearly the back to own. Williams looks like he may do well long term but time will tell
It isn't a binary choice though. Nobody is saying that in redraft Karlos is the back to own of the two, just that he has RB2~3/Flex appeal even with McCoy doing his thing.
To each his own. I would not be comfortable starting Williams as my rb 2 going forward unless McCoy is hurt
What about in your flex spot?

 
GroveDiesel said:
I'm not sure Karlos is cut out to be a 20-touch per game workhorse.
What makes you say that?
I'm not sure about this either. The guy is 6'1" 230 lbs, which also happens to be the same size as guys like Le'Veon Bell, Latavius Murray, and Todd Gurly. I would say he is pretty much the ideal size to be a 20+ touch per game workhorse back in the NFL.

 
Soft melon. More carries = more chances to get another concussion. Which sucks because he looks like the second best back in this class.

 
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Soft melon. More carries = more chances to get another concussion. Which sucks because he looks like the second best back in this class.
This is actually a misconception people have a out concussions, and I dont know where it comes from. ESPN maybe? I dont know. When you get one concussion, as long as you recover, you are not at risk for future concussions. The most at risk time period is 10-14 days following an episode. After that you are no more at risk than yo were before you got your concussion. What puts people at a higher risk is their style of running, tackling, etch. If you lead with your head yeah you are at more risk.

 
Soft melon. More carries = more chances to get another concussion. Which sucks because he looks like the second best back in this class.
This is actually a misconception people have a out concussions, and I dont know where it comes from. ESPN maybe? I dont know. When you get one concussion, as long as you recover, you are not at risk for future concussions. The most at risk time period is 10-14 days following an episode. After that you are no more at risk than yo were before you got your concussion. What puts people at a higher risk is their style of running, tackling, etch. If you lead with your head yeah you are at more risk.
Yeah but then message board tough-guys like Sabertooth wouldn't have anything to bluster about.
 
If playing style can increase the chance of concussion, and I'm not a good judge of whose playing style leads to concussions, then players who have had concussions are more likely to have another one than players who haven't simply because, based on what little data I have, they're more likely to have a running style that leads to them.

It's fine to say that having had one doesn't necessarily mean you'll have another, because that is technically true, but it's also correct to say that it will, because it's functionally true.

 

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