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Lets Talk about the Jets Receivers (1 Viewer)

Detroit Revival

Detroit Revival

Footballguy
I thought I'd do a little bit of a conglomeration of a couple of interesting stats that were floated out there today. Firstly was the stat that Santonio Holmes was targeted on 30% of all passes thrown. Now throw in the fact that he's possibly gone for the season Link. The Jets want to be a ground and pound team but it just hasn't happened. Also throw in the fact that their pass to run ratio is trending upards link. The question is, who gets the benefit of the targets? Bilal Powell, Kerley, Hill? Schillens?someone else? or does the injury turn a dumpsterfire of an offense into a tire fire? Discuss...

 
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Look for Kerley to be a nice PPR play. Guy has a lot of Jerrico Cotchery in him (in that he's a lunchpail, move the chains guy that a qb can really grow to trust.)

 
Is Cromartie really a threat to play iron man ball? I only ask because this would be a huge boon in IDP leagues that count the offensive stats for the defensive players.

 
I don't think Kerley has any value with Tebow. He's listed at 5'9 but he's probably more like 5'7 and half.
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I agree he would take a hit with Tebow, but he measured 5-9.5 at both the combine and his Pro Day. If Sanchez keeps the job he should be the go-to guy.
 
Kerley and Keller when he gets back are probably the only reliable options. I expect they will be 1a/1b in targets.

 
Jets sign Lex Hillard and waive Patrick Turner.

After watching Hillard run in pre-season, this move makes no sense to me.

 
I think Stephen Hill is a nice dynasty hold. He does have a disturbing tendency to let the ball get into his body; he doesn't attack the ball or fight for it the way you would like a guy his size to do. The measurables are impressive - tremendous potential to break out in a year or two. Short term health concerns and the instability of the offense make him too risky for most redraft formats.

Kerley has more playmaker ability than almost anyone on that side of the ball, but it's questionable how much he will be used.

No mystery to Schillens (who will probably catch 40-55 balls this year) or Keller once his hammy is better. You could plug them in as a matchup bye week play, but either one is just as likely to give you the ill afforded 2-20-0 line at anytime.

They're a mess, and have probably already hit the 50% mark of their season win total.

 
what they should do is line up mcknight in the slot, use lots of motions to split him out from the backfield he shares with greene to use two rbs with one of which can be a wr.

sort of a poor mans percy harvin.

either that or run the triple option with tebow a la the service academies and only throw the ball 3 times in a game.

thats all i got.

 
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the Jets passing offense had like 100 yards last week but Chaz had 45. This man Is the jets passing offense. Not that gets you much.

fwiw Turner was targeted 5x and caught 0. that's why he was cut. Sanchez has been bad, but it's not _all_ on Sanchez.

 
'Kool-Aid Larry said:
they signed jason hill
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Interesting guy. Probably is the most like Holmes in term of running. I was always interested in this guy. coming out of college, I thought he reminded me a lot of Reggie Wayne but it obvously never panned out.Like most, I guess this looks irrelevant in terms of fantasy production but at least we can say Hill did have 3 TDs with Blaine Gabbert last year so A)he is used to a crappy situation, and B)he has done SOMETHING in a very bad situation.
 
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Anything new to see here, when Geno takes over?

WR:

Holmes

Hill

Kerley

TE:

Cumberland

Winslow (?)

Or, are Holmes & Hill worth drafting?

 
Kerley is one of those players who I would be happy to target as a WR4 in PPR leagues. The situation was terrible last year, hard to imagine it worse this year, and he seems to be a player on the rise.

 
Honestly the Jets WR's should just be removed from all draft projections as a service to the community. No one should even mistakenly draft any of these bums. Black hole.

 
Chase Stuart said:
Kerley is one of those players who I would be happy to target as a WR4 in PPR leagues. The situation was terrible last year, hard to imagine it worse this year, and he seems to be a player on the rise.
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What changed? Sure looks just as bad, if not worse without Brandon Moore.

 
Beerguzzler said:
Chase Stuart said:
Kerley is one of those players who I would be happy to target as a WR4 in PPR leagues. The situation was terrible last year, hard to imagine it worse this year, and he seems to be a player on the rise.
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What changed? Sure looks just as bad, if not worse without Brandon Moore.
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Another year of development for Kerley, new OC, Sanchez or Smith should be just as good if not better than the disaster that was 2012.

 
Chase Stuart said:
Beerguzzler said:
Chase Stuart said:
Kerley is one of those players who I would be happy to target as a WR4 in PPR leagues. The situation was terrible last year, hard to imagine it worse this year, and he seems to be a player on the rise.
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What changed? Sure looks just as bad, if not worse without Brandon Moore.
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Another year of development for Kerley, new OC, Sanchez or Smith should be just as good if not better than the disaster that was 2012.
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I don't see it. His O line got worse and he lost his best TE Keller. If Smith starts I think it's a full blown disaster with his accuracy issues.

 
Buffaloes said:
no one likes Stephen Hill in a dynasty format?
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I like him just fine. He's a solid prospect with huge upside. I like getting good prospects with upside on my roster, but at the same time, you have to recognize how common they are. I've got Hill as WR50 in my rankings. The four guys immediately surrounding him are Mike Williams, Kendall Wright, Michael Floyd, and Keenan Allen. Also nearby are Emmanual Sanders, Alshon Jeffery, Golden Tate, and Vincent Brown. All of these guys are quality prospects to keep at the end of your depth chart, but it really just illustrates that 2nd and 3rd round receivers who haven't done anything yet are hardly a rare commodity. Stephen Hill doesn't stand out enough from that crowd for me to declare him a "must own" or anything, but that doesn't mean I don't like him. I own him in a couple of leagues. I'd toss him into a larger deal as a throw-in in a heartbeat if it helped grease the wheels. Otherwise, I'll hold him and see what shakes out.

 
Adam Harstad said:
Buffaloes said:
no one likes Stephen Hill in a dynasty format?
Click to expand...
I like him just fine. He's a solid prospect with huge upside. I like getting good prospects with upside on my roster, but at the same time, you have to recognize how common they are. I've got Hill as WR50 in my rankings. The four guys immediately surrounding him are Mike Williams, Kendall Wright, Michael Floyd, and Keenan Allen. Also nearby are Emmanual Sanders, Alshon Jeffery, Golden Tate, and Vincent Brown. All of these guys are quality prospects to keep at the end of your depth chart, but it really just illustrates that 2nd and 3rd round receivers who haven't done anything yet are hardly a rare commodity. Stephen Hill doesn't stand out enough from that crowd for me to declare him a "must own" or anything, but that doesn't mean I don't like him. I own him in a couple of leagues. I'd toss him into a larger deal as a throw-in in a heartbeat if it helped grease the wheels. Otherwise, I'll hold him and see what shakes out.
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Mike Williams was a solid WR2/WR3 last year. One of these things are not like the others.

 
On the original topic...

Holmes may not be healthy for the start of the season and his motivation/drive has to be questioned.

Hill is still very raw and he's not in an organization known for developing talent on the offensive side of the ball.

Kerley is the safest bet to be productive, but productive enough to be worth rostering outside of deep leagues? Maybe not.

I am a little more interested in Hill once Smith takes over because Smith has a "never say die" attitude about keeping plays alive (and he's very capable from both a physical and mental toughness standpoint), he'll also try bold throws that other QBs may not be willing to try, so Hill could get some "broken play" downfield shots with Smith at the helm - on the other hand, if the Jets try to drill "NO TURNOVERS" into Smith to fit the team blueprint and fix the woes Sanchez caused, that tendency of Smith could cause some tension...

 
Buffaloes said:
no one likes Stephen Hill in a dynasty format?
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I've been steadily adding him in almost every league I participate. Key is not pay a premium.

Most dynasty leagues I'm in are not deep rosters so this may not be so easy in some of those type leagues but I think the play with him now is similar to how I'd be playing Justin Hunter right now. Let someone else spend a rookie pick on them. Let someone else burn a roster spot in year one on them. These guys are raw, have crappy QB's and in Hunters case are buried on the depth chart for at least a year.

Get them when the cost drops and try and excercise some patience. I read a tweet from Lance Zierlien prior to the draft and while I've not checked it for accuracy he mentioned in the last 8 years of the NFL draft only 4 WR's have measured at 6'3", ran a sub 4.5 forty, at least a 39" vertical and 11 foot broad jump. Hill, Hunter, Calvin and Julio. These guys don't grow on trees and you can't teach some of the things they naturally posses.

In Hills case you have to remember how not only raw he is but how young he is and how much growth he still has. He played his entire rookie year at 21, just turning 22 in April. From all accounts I've read he is willing to put in the work. He starts and by default might lead the team in targets. In his first game when the defense did not gameplan for him he caught two TD's. He had an injury plaugued awful rookie year. He's had an awful OTA session. I say so what. For what he costs, for the immense upside he offers and fact he's actually a starter if not the #1 WR on his team I'm buying.

 
Sigmund Bloom said:
Adam Harstad said:
Buffaloes said:
no one likes Stephen Hill in a dynasty format?
Click to expand...
I like him just fine. He's a solid prospect with huge upside. I like getting good prospects with upside on my roster, but at the same time, you have to recognize how common they are. I've got Hill as WR50 in my rankings. The four guys immediately surrounding him are Mike Williams, Kendall Wright, Michael Floyd, and Keenan Allen. Also nearby are Emmanual Sanders, Alshon Jeffery, Golden Tate, and Vincent Brown. All of these guys are quality prospects to keep at the end of your depth chart, but it really just illustrates that 2nd and 3rd round receivers who haven't done anything yet are hardly a rare commodity. Stephen Hill doesn't stand out enough from that crowd for me to declare him a "must own" or anything, but that doesn't mean I don't like him. I own him in a couple of leagues. I'd toss him into a larger deal as a throw-in in a heartbeat if it helped grease the wheels. Otherwise, I'll hold him and see what shakes out.
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Mike Williams was a solid WR2/WR3 last year. One of these things are not like the others.
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Yeah, I didn't mean to imply that Mike Williams was another one of those "2nd and 3rd round receivers who haven't done anything yet", although I realize it came off that way. I only brought Williams up because I was providing some sort of context for my Hill ranking, and Williams is one of the four closest-ranked receivers.

I've always said that the most overrated dynasty assets are young WR prospects with upside. Yes, some of those young prospects turn into untouchable studs (Chad Ochocinco, Terrell Owens, Steve Smith, Vincent Jackson, etc). They're very much worth gambling on, and they have huge potential payoffs. It's just that there are so damn many of them. Everyone picks a handful that they fall in love with, and they value them far above the rest of the huge "prospects with upside" clump. In my mind, this provides a situation that's ripe for arbitrage, rostering young prospects with upside for pennies on the dollar and then constantly selling them to whoever begins to fall in love with one of them. It's a strategy that sometimes gets you killed (I sold Miles Austin, Mike Wallace, Jordy Nelson, Pierre Garcon, and James Jones before their breakout, just for starters), but it's still a strategy I believe in long-term. I never would have had the roster room to add Wallace if I hadn't sold Austin. I never would have had the room to roster Austin if I hadn't sold Jones. I managed to get strong returns on Greg Little, Mike Sims-Walker, and Austin Collie before the bottom dropped out of the market. Over the long run, I have been able to use my prospect churn to generate a large number of incremental improvements at the cost of just one or two roster spots, yielding far greater returns than simple "draft and hold" would have given me.

So, all of this is really just a long way of saying that there are a lot of reasons to love Stephen Hill, but really no more than the number of reasons to love any of these other young prospects (Jeffery, Wright, Floyd, Brown, any of this year's rookies). Grab whichever are cheapest, sell them in 2-for-1 or player-for-pick deals whenever anyone comes sniffing around after them, bank an extra roster spot, then rinse and repeat. And if you ever feel strongly enough about a particular player, feel free to disregard this advice entirely and make a stand. I did just that over Randall Cobb, turning down plenty of fair-market offers over the years because I happened to believe in him more than most of the other prospects who make their way onto my roster. I made a similar stand over Ben Tate, which didn't work out nearly as well. I don't feel strongly enough about Stephen Hill to make that particular stand, but I couldn't blame anyone who did- there certainly is a lot to like.

 
I didn't realize the extent of Holmes' injury until the Yahoo headline today. is Hill the heir to the WR1 slot if Holmes can't go?

also, a homer note about rookie Mike Shanahan. the kid could play at Pitt and you can't teach 77 inches. with such a thin corps of WRs, he might make the team.

 
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pecorino said:
I didn't realize the extent of Holmes' injury until the Yahoo headline today. is Hill the heir to the WR1 slot if Holmes can't go?

also, a homer note about rookie Mike Shanahan. the kid could play at Pitt and you can't teach 77 inches. with such a thin corps of WRs, he might make the team.
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Braylon Edwards is likely the forerunner

 
if hare krishna was out there running routes it would not matter when you have a bag of rusty axe handles and busted you know whats throwing the ball at him my favorite thing with the jets is watching there qb roll out look dwnfield and then miss the wr by 20 yards that just makes me sort of chuckle take that to the bank brohans

 
SWC said:
if hare krishna was out there running routes it would not matter when you have a bag of rusty axe handles and busted you know whats throwing the ball at him my favorite thing with the jets is watching there qb roll out look dwnfield and then miss the wr by 20 yards that just makes me sort of chuckle take that to the bank brohans
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zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

 
With Santonio looking like he won't play this year, Gates is someone to keep an eye on.

Gates runs the right routes

July, 28, 2013

CORTLAND, N.Y. After the first day of training camp, Rex Ryan declared wide receiver Clyde Gates the MVP of the Jets offense. Caught after practice, Gates smiled slowly and said a lot of people played well.

Yes, but MVP?

Its just one day, Gates said.

Now starting his second season with the Jets, the publicly soft-spoken, privately funny Gates has filled a void as several of the team's free-agent receivers and running backs sit during team drills at training camp. Ryan again lauded Gates after Day 2, and offensive coordinator Marty Mornhinweg added his praise on Sunday.

You talk about Clyde Gates, most track guys are guys that are super fast, arent route runners, Ryan said. I think Clydes a route runner.

First of all, Clyde isnt his real name. His full name is Edmond Darell Gates. "Clyde" is just a nickname that stuck. He grew up playing basketball, which you can see from the way he goes for the ball. The Miami Dolphins drafted him in 2011 and cut him in 2012. But he impressed enough that former offensive coordinator Tony Sparano brought him to the Jets soon after.

Sparano is gone, but the 5-foot-11, 197-pound Gates is winning over the coaches with speed and acumen.

And with that speed he has, the number one thing -- well, youre going to press him at the line, Ryan said. Well, if you miss him, youre in trouble. The other thing is hes able to get off the press and he does a great job even on the top of his route. So well see. I think the big thing is availability in this league is probably as important as athletic ability and so proving that he can be durable and all that kind of stuff is going to be part of it as well.

Last season, Gates had a concussion that caused him to wear sunglasses indoors to reduce light exposure. He was the player quarterback Greg McElroy confided in on Christmas night before telling the team about his own concussion. Gates advice to McElroy was clear: "You can't go against a concussion injury.

In the spring, an injured hamstring kept him from practices. It was frustrating for him and the coaching staff, judging from Ryans durability comment.

Thats not rough, thats part of the game, Gates said.

Yes, but the rehab part of the game was keeping him from getting to know his new coordinator.

I didnt get to see much at all in the minicamps, Mornhinweg said. He was in the tub. ... The little I did get to see him, towards the end of minicamps, he flashed big.

Gates spent his weeks before camp in Texas with his 5-year-old son. Since then, hes been snatching deep passes from Mark Sanchez and Geno Smith, and giving the diehard fans who have trekked to Cortland this year something to cheer about.

Hes hungry and hes showing it, Sanchez said, Showing that he wants to be on the field. Hes making his presence known. Hes going up and getting the ball. Hes running great routes. You can tell hes really worked in the offseason. Im proud of him.

But just as Gates cautioned against too much optimism after one day, its hard to claim victory after a week.

Up to date, hes done a heck of a job, Mornhinweg said. Up to date. Now his challenge is to continue to progress.

He will have competition as WR Braylon Edwards plays more and TE Kellen Winslow Jr. gets back on the field. At some point, WR Santonio Holmes could create more of a crowd. But Gates seems like he doesnt quite trust that this streak of good practices will hold out, and knows what to do if it doesnt.

Theres going to be bumps in the road, Gates said. And its up to you either youre going to lay down or youre going to bounce back.

And Im going to bounce back regardless.
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As long as the QB is wearing a headband like a 8 year old girl, none of these are going to matter. I like Kerley most when Geno takes over.

 
Sabertooth said:
As long as the QB is wearing a headband like a 8 year old girl, none of these are going to matter. I like Kerley most when Geno takes over.
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I agree. But I wonder if the jets are going to just waste a bunch of time on Sanchez again. Massochists.

I mean do they really want geno to learn about being an NFL QB from Sanchez right now? Move on, focus on geno, let Sanchez try to recover his career / psyche somewhere else. Not happening in NY. Better to move on too early (which is no longer possible) than too hold on too long just throwing good money after bad.

 
TALL hobbit said:
Sabertooth said:
As long as the QB is wearing a headband like a 8 year old girl, none of these are going to matter. I like Kerley most when Geno takes over.
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I agree. But I wonder if the jets are going to just waste a bunch of time on Sanchez again. Massochists.

I mean do they really want geno to learn about being an NFL QB from Sanchez right now? Move on, focus on geno, let Sanchez try to recover his career / psyche somewhere else. Not happening in NY. Better to move on too early (which is no longer possible) than too hold on too long just throwing good money after bad.
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That was my thought on the whole "Jets West" thing. I thought Geno was smart not to go. What is he really going to gain by building a strong relationship with Sanchez? He was brought in to replace Sanchez. Why become friends with the guy?

I think the Jets should just cut Sanchez, let him sign on in New Orleans or Washington or someplace with an establish QB coach. Let Geno sink or swim.

The problem of course is the Rex is the coach and he's on the hot seat. He isn't going to want to have a rookie starting in the season that is going to make or break his head coaching career.

 
Sabertooth said:
He isn't going to want to have a rookie starting in the season that is going to make or break his head coaching career.
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Not an ideal situation for sure - but I still think it's the better option. If Sanchez gets more wins this year - unless it's a lot more - is that really going to save Rex's job. Whereas if Geno showed some promise and seemed to click with this staff - that would probably give Ryan a better shot. And even if Ryan loses his job either way - I think he'd want to start distancing himself from Sanchez so it at least seems he recognizes what's happening on the field.

I used to live in LA and went to a lot of USC games and now I live in NY --- so it's doubly annoying - I get to see what seemed like promising talent wasted and now have all the local news, radio, etc. talk about it all of the time. Sometimes it's like they forget the good team here, the Giants, even exist.

 
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