NFL and Covid Issues - Initially Asked in Shark Pool To Keep it 100% NFL (1 Viewer)

[Bracie Smathers]

Disagree.  Forfeiting is the cleanest way out of this mess.  If a team can't play due to COVID, they should forfeit the game.  Period.  Counts as a loss, and as a win for opponents.  No impact to schedule, no impact on competitive balance.  Offending team is punished with a loss, non-offending team is rewarded with win.

If I ruled the league, 2 COVID teats on a team = shut down team for 10 days & forfeit any game that would occur within that timeframe.  Period.

Competitive balance would definitely be impacted if one team got wins without playing games and cruised into post season completely healthy, no bumps or bruises and not earning wins.

 

[spodog]

The NFL not building in 2-3 byes for each team this year, including one week of all NFC teams on bye and one week of all AFC teams on bye, is the height of incompetence and arrogance.

dumb and dumber in NY running the show

 

[Ted Lange as your Bartender]

This whole affair also makes clear (even though we already knew it) how much political heft Robert Kraft has within the NFL vs owners of other teams like the Broncos and Dolphins, whose schedules are thrown in flux because of Patriots’ positives.

Now imagine the chaos if a Cowboy tests positive

 

[candian fantasy guy]

We just had a league vote on allowing replacements players subbed into lineups. Even though it was ONLY for postponed games that were on Monday-Tuesday and you had to declare before games started Sunday, it got voted down because it wouldn't be fair to the people who suffered through this last week. Again, I didn't mind the work but we had 2-3 people not cool with the late implementation.

Don't need to be a commish to tell this is going to be a complete clusterf*ck of a season.

The contingency didn't come into play last week though. Same issue was raised in my league as I implemented "replacements" last week with no league vote. I really "got it" from 2 owners this week, so I put it up for vote. 10 of 12 said yes and it passed. I stressed how this year is not a normal year  so we shouldn't treat our pass time that way.

It's not perfect, but it works!

 

[moleculo]

Competitive balance would definitely be impacted if one team got wins without playing games and cruised into post season completely healthy, no bumps or bruises and not earning wins.

I say no impact because there are still 16 games played.  One ream gets an easy win - well, maybe they would win anyhow.  

If you want to say they had an easier path - fine.  Call it a reward for doing the right things to stay healthy.

 

[HellToupee]

Disagree.  Forfeiting is the cleanest way out of this mess.  If a team can't play due to COVID, they should forfeit the game.  Period.  Counts as a loss, and as a win for opponents.  No impact to schedule, no impact on competitive balance.  Offending team is punished with a loss, non-offending team is rewarded with win.

If I ruled the league, 2 COVID teats on a team = shut down team for 10 days & forfeit any game that would occur within that timeframe.  Period.

In theory I like this but I don’t like the impact on the draft slot

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

We just had a league vote on allowing replacements players subbed into lineups. Even though it was ONLY for postponed games that were on Monday-Tuesday and you had to declare before games started Sunday, it got voted down because it wouldn't be fair to the people who suffered through this last week. Again, I didn't mind the work but we had 2-3 people not cool with the late implementation.

Don't need to be a commish to tell this is going to be a complete clusterf*ck of a season.

Here’s the thing about that… Using last week as an example and saying it wouldn’t be fair it’s basically saying a that bad thing that happened should set a precedent for future bad things to happen. 

So now all future weeks will also be unfair.

in my humble opinion as a commissioner, I think that’s bad commissioning.

 

[moleculo]

In theory I like this but I don’t like the impact on the draft slot

Interesting take.  Hadn't considered that.  Makes tanking much easier.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Any news on status of the Bills/Titans game scheduled for Tuesday?

None yet. Facility closed. TBD

 

[Drunken Cowboy]

So is the KC game on as scheduled in 3 hours

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Disagree.  Forfeiting is the cleanest way out of this mess.  If a team can't play due to COVID, they should forfeit the game.  Period.  Counts as a loss, and as a win for opponents.  No impact to schedule, no impact on competitive balance.  Offending team is punished with a loss, non-offending team is rewarded with win.

If I ruled the league, 2 COVID teats on a team = shut down team for 10 days & forfeit any game that would occur within that timeframe.  Period.

To some extent I agree, but you have to know that the offending team actually broke protocols. For example, what if NE who has had a couple positives infected KC in that last game. Then KC has an outbreak. Should KC have to forfeit? They wouldn't have done anything wrong at that point.

I don't think Moleculo is wrong in showing the rather clean way to just forfeit games for teams that cannot field a roster safely. I hadn't thought about it much but it's clean and lets the league function this year. 

What I don't appreciate or like as much and I can see Greg sort of dance around it but the word "Punish" needs to be removed. We don't punish people for getting sick. We don't punish people typically for a variety of ailments and many of these folks "Choose" their lifestyles that all of society eventually has to pay for...the Titans made some choices after they tested positive and the results could be/maybe should be a forfeited game but only to protect others, not so much as a punishment like they are "Morally" wrong, I can't cast the entire Tennessee Titans organization including all their players and coaches and the like as immoral people for trying to play football games and entertain us. 

I say this just so everyone is clear, I don't watch TV-News, not a single second of it in the last few months and it's been very empowering, I would encourage others to do likewise and not make such sweeping judgements about people that are doing their best to push forward and not cancel the season. 
It does feel like some would like to see something like that occur, SHUT DOWN THE NFL, definitely not these 2 posters but there's a huge Cancel NFL Culture out there. 

So who do we like in the Vikings-Seahawks game today? 

 

[Smack Tripper]

Kind of bogus New England will only feel the burn of probably one game without cam

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Conspiracy Theory: Patriots lied about a positive test after seeing Stidham & Hoyer’s double disaster to get Cam another week to get healthy. 

 

 

[Bracie Smathers]

I say no impact because there are still 16 games played.  One ream gets an easy win - well, maybe they would win anyhow.  

If you want to say they had an easier path - fine.  Call it a reward for doing the right things to stay healthy.

We've played only a quarter of the season so if they start handing out wins this early then they will be boxed-in to handing out wins the rest of the way.  By the time we get (IF) to the post season some teams will have a major competitive advantage.

Decisions they make now are crucial.  They better tread lightly.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

So is the KC game on as scheduled in 3 hours

Ive been wondering - we haven’t had any update to that & it’s weird. 

 

[Smack Tripper]

I wonder if the nfl would vote would they be pro or anti testing?  They really seem like they don’t want to know 

 

[Drunken Cowboy]

Conspiracy Theory: Patriots lied about a positive test after seeing Stidham & Houer’s double disaster to get Cam another week to get healthy. 

 

it occurred to me. 

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

it occurred to me. 

I mean, not that that Pats have ever done anything shady before...  

 

[moleculo]

We've played only a quarter of the season so if they start handing out wins this early then they will be boxed-in to handing out wins the rest of the way.  By the time we get (IF) to the post season some teams will have a major competitive advantage.

Decisions they make now are crucial.  They better tread lightly.

So team's will have a major competitive advantage because they successfully navigated the COVID landmines?  I'm ok with that.

 

[Insein]

Disagree.  Forfeiting is the cleanest way out of this mess.  If a team can't play due to COVID, they should forfeit the game.  Period.  Counts as a loss, and as a win for opponents.  No impact to schedule, no impact on competitive balance.  Offending team is punished with a loss, non-offending team is rewarded with win.

If I ruled the league, 2 COVID teats on a team = shut down team for 10 days & forfeit any game that would occur within that timeframe.  Period.

It absolutely is a competitive balance issue. Another team is given a conference win and leg up for a tie breaker. Add on to the fact that you can't prove negligence in all cases and this will basically ruin the NFL. There is no point in playing games any more. The league can decide a team can forfeit at any time because the precedent had been set. 

Forfeit is the WORST option they could choose. 

 

[Insein]

If you believe you were infected by another team, you petition the league to to turn the loss into a tie for purposes of standing.  Contact tracing and all that.

That is absurd

 

[Insein]

I say no impact because there are still 16 games played.  One ream gets an easy win - well, maybe they would win anyhow.  

If you want to say they had an easier path - fine.  Call it a reward for doing the right things to stay healthy.

It's not a reward. It's an arbitrary gift. There are 30 other teams that potentially did the right thing and don't get that reward. 

This is why they will never do forfeit.

 

[Pipes]

Disagree.  Forfeiting is the cleanest way out of this mess.  If a team can't play due to COVID, they should forfeit the game.  Period.  Counts as a loss, and as a win for opponents.  No impact to schedule, no impact on competitive balance.  Offending team is punished with a loss, non-offending team is rewarded with win.

If I ruled the league, 2 COVID teats on a team = shut down team for 10 days & forfeit any game that would occur within that timeframe.  Period.

You can’t be serious.  Even if a team follows all protocols there’s no guarantees they will remain Covid free.  You can argue a Titans forfeit due to their negligence but what exactly did the Pats do wrong.  And it’s only going to get worse.  

 

[Drunken Cowboy]

I don't see how they possibly play Miami v Denver now. I think they are just assuming it won't matter 

 

[Craig_MiamiFL]

Turning into a nightmare. Eventually they're going to have to shut this thing down for a bit IMO

So glad decided to sit out the fantasy football season. What a disaster.

Ugh. As if injuries didn't make fantasy a PITA enough

 

[moleculo]

You can’t be serious.  Even if a team follows all protocols there’s no guarantees they will remain Covid free.  You can argue a Titans forfeit due to their negligence but what exactly did the Pats do wrong.  And it’s only going to get worse.  

That's why I said two positives.  Granted - it's not a perfect solution  but there are no perfect solutions here.

 

[GroveDiesel]

This whole affair also makes clear (even though we already knew it) how much political heft Robert Kraft has within the NFL vs owners of other teams like the Broncos and Dolphins, whose schedules are thrown in flux because of Patriots’ positives.

Now imagine the chaos if a Cowboy tests positive

I loathe the Patriots, but so far I haven’t heard that they’ve really done anything to break protocols like the Titans (and Raiders) did. In fact, I’ve read that they didn’t want to play last week because they didn’t want to fly potentially infected players together to the game and they even asked for a larger locker room in KC and were denied by the NFL. That’s a totally different scenario than what is going on in Tennessee.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

I don't see how they possibly play Miami v Denver now. I think they are just assuming it won't matter 

I mean, will it?  

 

[SoBeDad]

I don't see how they possibly play Miami v Denver now. I think they are just assuming it won't matter 

For draft position, it could make a big difference.

 

[The Frankman]

Here’s the thing about that… Using last week as an example and saying it wouldn’t be fair it’s basically saying a that bad thing that happened should set a precedent for future bad things to happen. 

So now all future weeks will also be unfair.

in my humble opinion as a commissioner, I think that’s bad commissioning.

I'm this commish and I wanted to pass it, but I don't want to alienate multiple team owners. I'm still trying to negotiate it though.

 

[moleculo]

It's not a reward. It's an arbitrary gift. There are 30 other teams that potentially did the right thing and don't get that reward. 

This is why they will never do forfeit.

There are 30 teams that don't get to play the Jets too.  There are 3 teams that have to play the Chiefs twice.  The playing field isn't level already.

 

[Wildcat]

Here’s the thing about that… Using last week as an example and saying it wouldn’t be fair it’s basically saying a that bad thing that happened should set a precedent for future bad things to happen. 

So now all future weeks will also be unfair.

in my humble opinion as a commissioner, I think that’s bad commissioning.

I disagree.  If your league website doesn’t allow for this, managing provisional players is going to be a nightmare for any Commish.  Bad luck is a part of fantasy football. We all knew this was a possibility coming into the season so we should all be prepared to deal with the bad luck that comes as a result.  

 

[Drunken Cowboy]

I mean, will it?  

For fantasy football, yes

 

[Wildcat]

I'm this commish and I wanted to pass it, but I don't want to alienate multiple team owners. I'm still trying to negotiate it though.

You are doing the right thing. If not all owners are on-board, or at least the majority, just leave it as is. 

 

[Bayhawks]

Sorry if this is a honda, but has this been reported?  If so, can someone point me to the posts/discussion?  If not, what do we think will happen?  Tuesday game, but many/most other options are playing today.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/titans-shut-down-facility-once-again-after-staff-member-tests-positive-for-covid-19/

 

[mike11162]

I loathe the Patriots, but so far I haven’t heard that they’ve really done anything to break protocols like the Titans (and Raiders) did. In fact, I’ve read that they didn’t want to play last week because they didn’t want to fly potentially infected players together to the game and they even asked for a larger locker room in KC and were denied by the NFL. That’s a totally different scenario than what is going on in Tennessee.

That’s a good point about the Raiders. People say make the Titans forfeit for breaking protocols, but why are the Raiders exempt just because they didn’t get sick?

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

I'm this commish and I wanted to pass it, but I don't want to alienate multiple team owners. I'm still trying to negotiate it though.

Ah - yeah; I recommend a forceful but gentle approach. Feel free to use my line about bad precedent.  

 

[Gawain]

We just had a league vote on allowing replacements players subbed into lineups. Even though it was ONLY for postponed games that were on Monday-Tuesday and you had to declare before games started Sunday, it got voted down because it wouldn't be fair to the people who suffered through this last week. Again, I didn't mind the work but we had 2-3 people not cool with the late implementation.

Don't need to be a commish to tell this is going to be a complete clusterf*ck of a season.

We had contingent players last week, but our commish said this week was too much of a hassle, so no contingent guys for the rest of the season. Can't pick and choose weeks.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

There are 30 teams that don't get to play the Jets too.  There are 3 teams that have to play the Chiefs twice.  The playing field isn't level already.

Please, enough with the world isn't fair so my ridiculous UNFAIR suggestion is just as 'fair' as the unfairness already existing.  

World wide pandemics have and the NFL have never crossed paths.  To equate an annual schedule competitive inequity that changes by the year to even-out over the years to the biggest one-off the league has ever faced shows how much you want your Broncos to be handed a win this week in order to gain an advantage.

OK, if it happens then in the post season you win games on forfeit and go to the SB but have to forfeit because of a late outbreak then I bet you'd be one happy guy due to everyone playing by the same 'fair' rules, smirk.  

This isn't about short term gain or punishment, its about survival at this stage.

 

[The Frankman]

I disagree.  If your league website doesn’t allow for this, managing provisional players is going to be a nightmare for any Commish.  Bad luck is a part of fantasy football. We all knew this was a possibility coming into the season so we should all be prepared to deal with the bad luck that comes as a result.  

I'm the commish and don't mind doing the work. However I'm beholden to the people in the league; if I had only one owner not like it I maybe could've talked him off the ledge. I had 3 people say no and I've literally been talking to them for half an hour and I'm getting nowhere.

 

[Miro Z]

Sorry if this is a honda, but has this been reported?  If so, can someone point me to the posts/discussion?  If not, what do we think will happen?  Tuesday game, but many/most other options are playing today.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/titans-shut-down-facility-once-again-after-staff-member-tests-positive-for-covid-19/

We don't know what will happen. It may depend on what the test results are Monday/Tuesday. I have a sneaky suspicion that the game might get played after all, but that's purely speculation.

 

[Long Ball Larry]

Sorry if this is a honda, but has this been reported?  If so, can someone point me to the posts/discussion?  If not, what do we think will happen?  Tuesday game, but many/most other options are playing today.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/titans-shut-down-facility-once-again-after-staff-member-tests-positive-for-covid-19/

At this point I feel like that titans game is less than 50% to be played.

even if you think it’s higher, it feels like Russian roulette to try to start someone in fantasy from that game.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

I disagree.  If your league website doesn’t allow for this, managing provisional players is going to be a nightmare for any Commish.  Bad luck is a part of fantasy football. We all knew this was a possibility coming into the season so we should all be prepared to deal with the bad luck that comes as a result.  

But that’s not bad luck. 

it’s a game that gets moved and then cancelled witn no means of subbing anyone in. 

a contingency plan is simple to implement & easy for a commish to move players around after the fact.

Bad luck is your dude breaks his foot, out 6-8 weeks.

having a zero in your lineup when you could have played someone if you’d known in advance that the game would be cancelled is failing to be proactive as a commish.

the reason it matters is that 1 team’s “bad luck” of rostering 4 Titans, 3 bills and 2 Pats is another teams free win.  That destroys the competitive balance of a league. It’s bad enough luck if they have to sub in inferior players.  Why punish teams for something the NFL is handling haphazardly?

The big picture matters. Especially in large roster leagues like IDP with ~16 active starters, or dynasty formats where a cheap win or loss will impact draft picks. 

 

[Wildcat]

I'm the commish and don't mind doing the work. However I'm beholden to the people in the league; if I had only one owner not like it I maybe could've talked him off the ledge. I had 3 people say no and I've literally been talking to them for half an hour and I'm getting nowhere.

Yeah I can see how some owners don’t like it.  I can see both sides of the coin on this matter.   But during the season, I believe rule changes should be unanimous votes. Again, this is one of those situations that we could have, should have, foreseen prior to the season. Any changes should’ve been proposed prior to the season starting

 

[Bayhawks]

We don't know what will happen. It may depend on what the test results are Monday/Tuesday. I have a sneaky suspicion that the game might get played after all, but that's purely speculation.

That would suck; especially with the extra MNF game cancelled, very few options available.  Risky to wait for Tenn/Buff players.

 

[Wildcat]

But that’s not bad luck. 

it’s a game that gets moved and then cancelled witn no means of subbing anyone in. 

a contingency plan is simple to implement & easy for a commish to move players around after the fact.

Bad luck is your dude breaks his foot, out 6-8 weeks.

having a zero in your lineup when you could have played someone if you’d known in advance that the game would be cancelled is failing to be proactive as a commish.

the reason it matters is that 1 team’s “bad luck” of rostering 4 Titans, 3 bills and 2 Pats is another teams free win.  That destroys the competitive balance of a league. It’s bad enough luck if they have to sub in inferior players.  Why punish teams for something the NFL is handling haphazardly?

The big picture matters. Especially in large roster leagues like IDP with ~16 active starters, or dynasty formats where a cheap win or loss will impact draft picks. 

I disagree with much of what you wrote. We all could’ve foreseen this prior to the season starting so mid-season rule changes shouldn’t be needed. Just poor planning on the part of leagues that didn’t think of this. There was potential for this to happen to every/any NFL team, hence the bad luck.  There isn’t an agenda to target specific teams

 

[moleculo]

Please, enough with the world isn't fair so my ridiculous UNFAIR suggestion is just as 'fair' as the unfairness already existing.  

World wide pandemics have and the NFL have never crossed paths.  To equate an annual schedule competitive inequity that changes by the year to even-out over the years to the biggest one-off the league has ever faced shows how much you want your Broncos to be handed a win this week in order to gain an advantage.

OK, if it happens then in the post season you win games on forfeit and go to the SB but have to forfeit because of a late outbreak then I bet you'd be one happy guy due to everyone playing by the same 'fair' rules, smirk.  

This isn't about short term gain or punishment, its about survival at this stage.

GTFO with this.  I don't want an easy win from the Broncos, I want the same thing I have ever wanted - the NFL to continue to play and keep everyone healthy.

What they are doing now isn't working.  Games are going to start getting cancelled - not postponed but cancelled. That's where we are headed.

You want to talk about benefitting teams unfairly - what happens if games are cancelled on teams who stayed clean?  How are you not penalizing teams that handled this well?

 

[The Frankman]

Yeah I can see how some owners don’t like it.  I can see both sides of the coin on this matter.   But during the season, I believe rule changes should be unanimous votes. Again, this is one of those situations that we could have, should have, foreseen prior to the season. Any changes should’ve been proposed prior to the season starting

Pretty much this

I disagree with much of what you wrote. We all could’ve foreseen this prior to the season starting so mid-season rule changes shouldn’t be needed. Just poor planning on the part of leagues that didn’t think of this   

Now see that's not fair either; My league DID foresee this by adding 3 COVID/IR spots, implementing a regular IR and instruction on what happens if the season ends at certain points + waiver limits. Nobody could expect this level of insanity where games get moved multiple times a week.

 

[mike11162]

We don't know what will happen. It may depend on what the test results are Monday/Tuesday. I have a sneaky suspicion that the game might get played after all, but that's purely speculation.

Kind of supports allowing contingency backups to be necessary. It’s one thing to expect owners to react to player injuries, which are known probabilities, but if the NFL can’t give us clarity before all Sunday games are played, that’s another story.

 

[Bracie Smathers]

GTFO with this.  I don't want an easy win from the Broncos, I want the same thing I have ever wanted - the NFL to continue to play and keep everyone healthy.

What they are doing now isn't working.  Games are going to start getting cancelled - not postponed but cancelled. That's where we are headed.

You want to talk about benefitting teams unfairly - what happens if games are cancelled on teams who stayed clean?  How are you not penalizing teams that handled this well?

Don't cancel, suspend games that cannot be played and let the other games play through.  Schedule make-up games after the regular season, if they still cannot be played THEN forfeiture is on the table.  NOT NOW having played only a quarter of the schedule where more games would be forfeited due to precedence or else it would create an unfair situation.