NFL To Trial Electronic Measurements For First Downs (1 Viewer)

[GroveDiesel]

This preseason the NFL wil trial using an electronic measurement system to measure for first downs. If it goes well, they may implement it immediately for the 2024 season.

Surprised this isn’t a bigger story. Would be a massive change.

Reported By CBS Sports

 

[5-ish Finkle]

Cant "tech out" refs fast enough, IMO.

Id like to be the first to welcome our officiating robot overlords.

 

[Bri]

Step two of copy the XFL

Waiting on the live feed to the replay review booth next

 

[Deamon]

I

This preseason the NFL wil trial using an electronic measurement system to measure for first downs. If it goes well, they may implement it immediately for the 2024 season.

Surprised this isn’t a bigger story. Would be a massive change.

Reported By CBS Sports

It's about time. They have the technology, why not use it?
But yes, I'm also surprised this isn't being talked about more.

 

[Soulfly3]

But I much prefer the human element of fixing games :(

 

[Deamon]

"The chain gang won't exactly become a thing of the past, though. Sources say the chains will still exist on the sideline, but they'll be used both as a backup for game operations and as a reference point for coaches, players and fans in the stadium."

That is nice that the chain dudes won't lose their jobs.

 

[Leroy Hoard]

"The chain gang won't exactly become a thing of the past, though. Sources say the chains will still exist on the sideline, but they'll be used both as a backup for game operations and as a reference point for coaches, players and fans in the stadium."

That is nice that the chain dudes won't lose their jobs.

Just like the eventual robot umps in baseball. Somebody still has to hand fresh balls to the catcher.

 

[JohnnyU]

I like it

 

[Joe Bryant]

I think it's fine but don't see it as that big a story. Like most everything the league does, I'd expect it to thoughtful, careful and executed well.

I think sometimes people don't give the league enough credit for what a fantastically excellent business it is. They almost always get things right like this.

 

[Joe Schmo]

I'm in the minority but imo the refs to a great job marking the ball even with all the bodies and body parts flying around. Guess we'll wait to see but I'm curious how the digitize the whole length and breadth of the field down to the inch, otherwise the marks may still be off.

 

[Gally]

My question is does it measure based on the ref placement of the ball or will there be some "optical" (that's the word they used in the article) of placing the ball at the point the knee touches down? What about the exact moment the officials blow dead forward progress?

I haven't seen any XFL games (someone said above they are already doing this) so I am wondering how this actually is implemented. Seems like there are many moving parts to it and not sure how real time "optics" will get this done in a timely manner.

 

[zed2283]

About time.

 

[Gruden's Keyboard]

The more non athletes we can get further away from the field the better imo. The compound fracture of the guy on the chain gang that couldn't get out of the path of Alvin Kamara last year was rough.

 

[eighsse2]

So, to be clear ... does this system declare a first down from detecting the ball crossing the first down plane when the play takes place? Or does the ref still spot the ball, and only the chain measurement is replaced by the sensor? If the latter ... this seems largely irrelevant and unhelpful.

ETA: Just realized @Gally just asked this.

 

[eighsse2]

I'm in the minority but imo the refs to a great job marking the ball even with all the bodies and body parts flying around. Guess we'll wait to see but I'm curious how the digitize the whole length and breadth of the field down to the inch, otherwise the marks may still be off.

I'm with you. Honestly I do not get frustrated by bad calls, almost ever. I don't get it. Yeah it sucks. It also helps when they go your way. I don't yell at the wind when it blows a field goal no-good, why would I be mad at a ref for small random error? If the median ball spot error was like 1 yard or more, yeah I'd be like, "this is ridiculous, needs to be fixed". But it's way less than that.

 

[FairWarning]

But I much prefer the human element of fixing games :(

First Down brought to you by Caesers.

 

[zed2283]

But I much prefer the human element of fixing games :(

First Down brought to you by Caesers.

I'm envisioning a beeping sound in the referee's ear if the ball is spotted past the first down marker. So as he's spotting the ball he just moves it back a little until no beep.

 

[renesauz]

Never understood why so many people think an electronic system or chips in the ball would be any real improvement. Most of the time, the issue is figuring out location at the exact moment a BODY PART HITS. Knowing the ball crossed the plane of the goal line is meaningless if you don't know if that knee was touching at the time.

Funny feeling this just adds to the confusion instead of fixing it.

 

[titusbramble]

Never understood why so many people think an electronic system or chips in the ball would be any real improvement. Most of the time, the issue is figuring out location at the exact moment a BODY PART HITS. Knowing the ball crossed the plane of the goal line is meaningless if you don't know if that knee was touching at the time.

Funny feeling this just adds to the confusion instead of fixing it.

Would surely be as trivial as someone in a booth watching the game and pressing a button when the ball carrier is down/forward progress is stopped etc - if it is close you can then go frame by frame to time the exact moment when the play is dead, then look up the ball position accordingly

 

[Gally]

Funny feeling this just adds to the confusion instead of fixing it.

Without really knowing what/how this is implemented this is my exact feeling as well. The real issue is figuring out where the ball is when the knee is down or forward progress is stopped. Nothing I have read on this as clarified what exactly this chip in the ball will be doing with relation to the knee down/progress stopped.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

I don't have a problem with this, but spotting the ball seems to be one of the things that our current crop of officials do well. I can't recall the last time I seriously objected to where the ball was spotted.

 

[dgreen]

I assume the refs will still spot the ball and then the tech will indicate whether it is a first down or not. Basically just eliminating the time used to do an actual chain measurement. Keeping the chains on the sidelines is needed, as someone mentioned above, so the players can have a goal when trying to pick up the first down.

My idea for years has been to round the spot to the nearest full yard after every first down. So, once the ball is spotted, all you need to know is how the spot relates to the yard line and not a stick that's somewhere in between one yard hash and the other. After touchbacks, it's obvious whether there's a first down because they know the first down is the front end of the 30 (or 35) yard line. I don't think they need to put full lines for each yard. Tech should easily be able to draw a very accurate line from one yard hash on one sideline to the one of the other sideline.

 

[Gally]

I assume the refs will still spot the ball and then the tech will indicate whether it is a first down or not. Basically just eliminating the time used to do an actual chain measurement. Keeping the chains on the sidelines is needed, as someone mentioned above, so the players can have a goal when trying to pick up the first down.

If this is indeed how it will be done then the chip will not increase the accuracy whatsoever. The big hurdle is placing the ball accurately (although they do a pretty good job of it most of the time).

 

[Snoopy]

The ball is usually placed to the nearest yard line when spotted.

 

[GregR]

I assume the refs will still spot the ball and then the tech will indicate whether it is a first down or not. Basically just eliminating the time used to do an actual chain measurement. Keeping the chains on the sidelines is needed, as someone mentioned above, so the players can have a goal when trying to pick up the first down.

That's what today's ESPN article basically says. Refs still spot the ball manually, and the system then immediately determines if it's a first down.

 

[eighsse2]

The ball is usually placed to the nearest yard line when spotted.

Is this for real? I have never heard of or noticed that.

 

[GregR]

The ball is usually placed to the nearest yard line when spotted.

Is this for real? I have never heard of or noticed that.

After kickoffs and punt returns to start a possession, yes. Not in the middle of a series of downs though.

 

[Snoopy]

The ball is usually placed to the nearest yard line when spotted.

Is this for real? I have never heard of or noticed that.

After kickoffs and punt returns to start a possession, yes. Not in the middle of a series of downs though.

My observations are that they do that except for 4th down and short yardage situations.

 

[GregR]

The ball is usually placed to the nearest yard line when spotted.

Is this for real? I have never heard of or noticed that.

After kickoffs and punt returns to start a possession, yes. Not in the middle of a series of downs though.

My observations are that they do that except for 4th down and short yardage situations.

Just pulled up recording of the Browns-Texans playoff game I have on the DVR still.

Where I had last stopped it, was middle of a possession. 1st and 10 ball spot is halfway between the 31 and 32 yard lines.

After a run, 2nd and 4 and the ball is spotted 2/3 of the way between yard markers.

Another run, then 3rd and 2 and the ball spotted about 3/4 of the way between the 39 and 40.

First down pass to Amari, ball spotted a ball length beyond the 45 yard line.

So none of the downs mid-possession were put on a yard marker. Rewinding to the start of that possession though, after a punt, it was placed right on a yard line.