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Now Big John,...I didn't say that. But there is a truth in there I think that relying less on the thermometer is a good thing in the sense that it starts to turn cooking from a hard and fast follow these steps for this amount of time at this temperature "science"thing to more of an "art" thing. Not sure if that makes sense.JIn other words, thermometers are for #######!!! YEAH!!!
Do you just mean for smoking or grilling as well?I have that grill. I hate it. Horizontal grills are inherently flawed even if they're made well. The Char-Griller is not made well.Thanks - after reviewing not sure if I'm going to spend the money. I was looking at the DUO from mentioned in another thread. I'm not a big griller, but looking to get started.I think for now I'm going cheap and going to get the gas Char Griller - and get the side smaller box.The first is only a two burner grill and won't get as hot as the second (26000 BTU's compared to 38000). The first is a little smaller. The second has three burners but if the burners are front to back, it makes doing anything other than hot and fast hard. If the burners are side by side by side (and I don't know), then you can do just about anything you can do on a charcoal grill on it. Turn on the burner on one side, take the grill grate off covering it, throw a foil ball full of onsoaked wood chips right on the burner, put the meat on the other side of the grill - instant smoker. But if they are front to back, and my FiL's old one is like this, can't smoke without a rotisserie to keep the meat elevated and away from the hot burner.Ok in the market for a new grill. i grill on occasion but would probably get more into it if I had a newer grill. Family of 4, we don't entertain a lot, would I notice any difference between these 2?
http://www.amazon.com/Weber-4511001-Spirit-Natural-Grill/dp/B001H1HOR8/ref=sr_1_1?m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&s=garden&ie=UTF8&qid=1309261896&sr=1-1
http://www.amazon.com/Weber-6611001-Genesis-Natural-Grill/dp/B0045UBB0Y/ref=sr_1_3?m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&s=garden&ie=UTF8&qid=1309261896&sr=1-3
And if I get the 330 is it worth the extra 100 for the burner?
http://www.amazon.com/Weber-6631001-Genesis-Natural-Grill/dp/B0045UBB2M/ref=sr_1_2?m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&s=garden&ie=UTF8&qid=1309261896&sr=1-2
TIA
ETA: No I'm not getting charcoal so save any ifighting/snobbery
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There is something to be said for this for sure. The only times I use therms are for pork butts (generally because I don't focus much on them on casual cooks) and chicken (safety check, though a done bird is pretty easily checked by hand). Ribs, brisket, etc are almost worthless to use therms on.
Therms are best if you're being lazy or cooking in competitions.In other words, thermometers are for #######!!! YEAH!!!
They're also nice when you have the alarm type, while cooking overnight. Sometimes the cooker gets out of control, either hot or cold. Or so I'm told.'[icon] said:Therms are best if you're being lazy or cooking in competitions.In other words, thermometers are for #######!!! YEAH!!!
Ain't that the truth. I swore off doing briskets after about the first 3 I did. But after a while I felt the calling again to give it another shot. Now, while what I make probably isn't Texas-worthy (yet), at least it is highly edible and much, much better. It just takes practice to get that chunk of meat done right. And don't forget to make the burnt ends from the point....
I take brisket as a challenge to my abilities. I can't find packer cuts, I need to order them, so I haven't smoke a packer cut yet. I have done 2-3 flats with marginal results. I need to order a packer, soon.
Yeah I knew I could do anything on the egg but I felt that with the cost and my experience and what I'd be grilling, it made more sense to go with the two Webers. More than half the time I am just cooking up typical backyard fare (dogs, burgers, chicken) so I felt the egg was excessive for that. Maybe sometime down the line, but I'm happy with the Webers so far. I felt like me going right to a BGE to cook a bunch of hot dogs would be like the guys that are decked out in all of the top of the line running gear to go out and run a 35 minute 5K
I bet you'll find it's TONS better with the packer. The fat in the point cut helps a lot. J
I'm thinking there are quite a few others with better brisket technique than mine. However, I just rubbed with sea salt, course black pepper, garlic and onion powder, chili powder and cayenne. It was a 12# Angus packer.
What is unhealthy about the char?Can't speak for Joe but the outside of the patties frying in their own seasoned fat and forming an slightly crunchy chewy crust is tastier than that fat dripping and flaring and making the unhealthy char we're supposed to be avoiding.Why?
Seriously an hour? Wow, I've done them for about 1/2 hour in the past. How hot is your grill?Why bacon fat or butter? I've been doing the same basic thing, but with olive oil. Just curious if one is better than the other.I like red potatoes on the grilliced upFinely chopped onion and garlicLots of black pepper and your favorite seasoning saltItalian seasoning (I like a lot as well)Parsley flakesBacon fat or butterWrap in havy duty foil, turn often, about an hour.
Awesome, thanks much for the reply and info. Going to try it this weekend.Turn the burners on one side of the grill on until you get an internal temp inside the grill of 300. Put the ribs on the side the burners are not on and remove the grill grates on the side the burners are on. Take a couple handfuls of UNSOAKED wood chips and put them on a sheet of tin foil. Wad the foil up into a ball full of wood chips. Make up about a half dozen of these tin foil balls of chips. Put two of the balls right on the burner under the grate you just removed and close the lid. For baby backs, they'll be done in 2 hours. Spares a little longer. As for a rub. Granulated garlic, paprika, brown sugar, black pepper, salt, maybe some granulated onion, a little dried mustard and you should be good to go. Get creative with whatever you want. I rarely sauce anything. I'm almost always using a rub and a rub only.Grilling rookie here, please don't abuse me, just looking for some tips on grilling pork ribs on a gas grill.Bake before hand? Or is that against the rules? Tips on a rub or use BBQ sauce only? Any advice appreciated.
First, I abhor most food scares, believe saturated fat (bacon fat) is healthier than olive oil for cooking at any real heat, and this has nothing to do with slow cooked bark, but high heat char. Harvard LinkWhat is unhealthy about the char?Can't speak for Joe but the outside of the patties frying in their own seasoned fat and forming an slightly crunchy chewy crust is tastier than that fat dripping and flaring and making the unhealthy char we're supposed to be avoiding.Why?
I've spent enough time in restaurant kitchens to value a flat top grill as a necessity but that thing is ridiculous for the price. I bought commercial quality from a restaurant going out of business as part of a $600 purchase that included a commercial deep fryer. They are both installed in an outdoor kitchen. You could buy four of these for the price of that 30G and one of them would probably prove superior. I use mine for pancakes and french toast more than anything else. Buy one of those and you have money for the sous vide machine.
Interesting. Can you describe in detail exactly how you're cooking these steaks?Thanks.First, I abhor most food scares, believe saturated fat (bacon fat) is healthier than olive oil for cooking at any real heat, and this has nothing to do with slow cooked bark, but high heat char. Harvard LinkWhat is unhealthy about the char?Can't speak for Joe but the outside of the patties frying in their own seasoned fat and forming an slightly crunchy chewy crust is tastier than that fat dripping and flaring and making the unhealthy char we're supposed to be avoiding.Why?
This research has been validated and corroborated so avoiding heterocyclic amines seems like a good idea. I know I am slow cooking more often than not. Chicken produced the most HCAs by a mile when charred, btw.
I'm putting out the best steaks of my life this summer with a slower method and avoiding the flare ups as much as I can. I use the paper towel dry aging technique, allow bacon grease to melt into the top of the meat while on indirect heat, and do my searing with the meat much higher than the coals than in the past. Many serious eaters consider sous vide steaks cooked for 18 hours to be the best in the world, so slowing down the process to avoid the unhealthy char is not bad for the taste of your meat. I like the control I have by slowing down and the process is much more relaxing.
Sure. I cow pooled on a few hundred pounds of grass fed and finished beef. That stuff is leaner than feedlot beef and cooks faster. First I use Alton Brown's paper towel dry aging in the fridge technique. Basically, I thaw the meat wrapped heavily in paper towels, changing the towels daily for four or five days. This sucks out moisture like the heavy salt and rinse before grilling technique w/o all the salt. I like to marinade my steaks the morning before I cook them. Vinegar, olive oil, red wine, garlic and onion is common, but I might go with beer, garlic, a touch of balsamic and bbq sauce. If you read my link and google for more about these HCAs, marinading is very healthy for all grilled meats. I toss the marinade and pat the meat dry before seasoning with Montreal steak spices. I cook bacon stuffed in a coffee cup in the microwave all the time, great for bits, blts, etc. The guy at Cooking for Engineers did some great tests on the best way to cook bacon and if you like it meaty and chewy the mike was best. It comes out nice once you master it. Four thick pieces go for three minutes, get turned, go for two minutes, get checked and are either done and pulled, still sizzling in a cup of fat and just need to sit, or go for another minute. Put a napkin in the top of the that cup to avoid splatter. I remove the bacon from the coffee cup and strain the liquid fat through cheese cloth for other uses. I set the grill up for indirect heat, coals to one side. I raise the grill to the highest position and set the steaks on the grill away from the coals and smear a pat of yummy white bacon fat atop each one. It melts in around and drips. I turn them and do the other side with the fat, then three of four at a time I take them over the coals for searing and move them back off the heat. I do this after the fat is dripped off clean because I want to minimize flares. This all goes to what you're saying about losing thermometers. I'm doing seven steaks, two rare, three medium rare, one medium and one well done. It is much easier to get right with the slower indirect heat set up, because they rise in temp away from that heat source. Well done stays over the coals a few minutes longer than rare and they all get right eventually. I've pulled rare 2" steaks off with this method that had been out there on the grill 20 minutes, just never over the main heat, 'cept for quickly at the end. My bro manages 5 star restaurants and pokes a piece of meat with his finger and tells you how done it is, so he is often out back with me.
He is gushing over this method this summer. Not bragging, but I am getting crazy good reviews on steaks and a little sick of doing them, antsy to get that brisket right.
Very cool. Thanks for sharing, I'll have to try that.Big fan of using bacon fat. I can see how the coffee cup thing would be good. I usually just bake in the oven. Lay a piece of foil down on a cookie sheet. Put the bacon on that and bake at 400 for about 22 minutes. Or however done you want it. Then pour the fat off the foil into a storage container that stays in the fridge so you always have clean white bacon fat lard to use.Made the bacon burgers again tonight. Also did fried pickles and jalapenos. Came out really good.Keep chugging on the brisket. I think it's mostly finding what works best for your cooker. The last one I did for the 4th , I was really pleased with.JSure. I cow pooled on a few hundred pounds of grass fed and finished beef. That stuff is leaner than feedlot beef and cooks faster. First I use Alton Brown's paper towel dry aging in the fridge technique. Basically, I thaw the meat wrapped heavily in paper towels, changing the towels daily for four or five days. This sucks out moisture like the heavy salt and rinse before grilling technique w/o all the salt. I like to marinade my steaks the morning before I cook them. Vinegar, olive oil, red wine, garlic and onion is common, but I might go with beer, garlic, a touch of balsamic and bbq sauce. If you read my link and google for more about these HCAs, marinading is very healthy for all grilled meats. I toss the marinade and pat the meat dry before seasoning with Montreal steak spices. I cook bacon stuffed in a coffee cup in the microwave all the time, great for bits, blts, etc. The guy at Cooking for Engineers did some great tests on the best way to cook bacon and if you like it meaty and chewy the mike was best. It comes out nice once you master it. Four thick pieces go for three minutes, get turned, go for two minutes, get checked and are either done and pulled, still sizzling in a cup of fat and just need to sit, or go for another minute. Put a napkin in the top of the that cup to avoid splatter. I remove the bacon from the coffee cup and strain the liquid fat through cheese cloth for other uses. I set the grill up for indirect heat, coals to one side. I raise the grill to the highest position and set the steaks on the grill away from the coals and smear a pat of yummy white bacon fat atop each one. It melts in around and drips. I turn them and do the other side with the fat, then three of four at a time I take them over the coals for searing and move them back off the heat. I do this after the fat is dripped off clean because I want to minimize flares. This all goes to what you're saying about losing thermometers. I'm doing seven steaks, two rare, three medium rare, one medium and one well done. It is much easier to get right with the slower indirect heat set up, because they rise in temp away from that heat source. Well done stays over the coals a few minutes longer than rare and they all get right eventually. I've pulled rare 2" steaks off with this method that had been out there on the grill 20 minutes, just never over the main heat, 'cept for quickly at the end. My bro manages 5 star restaurants and pokes a piece of meat with his finger and tells you how done it is, so he is often out back with me.
For the sear, do you do that at the very end right before pulling off the grill? And why do you do the sear - to get the color / crust right?JSure. I cow pooled on a few hundred pounds of grass fed and finished beef. That stuff is leaner than feedlot beef and cooks faster. First I use Alton Brown's paper towel dry aging in the fridge technique. Basically, I thaw the meat wrapped heavily in paper towels, changing the towels daily for four or five days. This sucks out moisture like the heavy salt and rinse before grilling technique w/o all the salt. I like to marinade my steaks the morning before I cook them. Vinegar, olive oil, red wine, garlic and onion is common, but I might go with beer, garlic, a touch of balsamic and bbq sauce. If you read my link and google for more about these HCAs, marinading is very healthy for all grilled meats. I toss the marinade and pat the meat dry before seasoning with Montreal steak spices. I cook bacon stuffed in a coffee cup in the microwave all the time, great for bits, blts, etc. The guy at Cooking for Engineers did some great tests on the best way to cook bacon and if you like it meaty and chewy the mike was best. It comes out nice once you master it. Four thick pieces go for three minutes, get turned, go for two minutes, get checked and are either done and pulled, still sizzling in a cup of fat and just need to sit, or go for another minute. Put a napkin in the top of the that cup to avoid splatter. I remove the bacon from the coffee cup and strain the liquid fat through cheese cloth for other uses. I set the grill up for indirect heat, coals to one side. I raise the grill to the highest position and set the steaks on the grill away from the coals and smear a pat of yummy white bacon fat atop each one. It melts in around and drips. I turn them and do the other side with the fat, then three of four at a time I take them over the coals for searing and move them back off the heat. I do this after the fat is dripped off clean because I want to minimize flares. This all goes to what you're saying about losing thermometers. I'm doing seven steaks, two rare, three medium rare, one medium and one well done. It is much easier to get right with the slower indirect heat set up, because they rise in temp away from that heat source. Well done stays over the coals a few minutes longer than rare and they all get right eventually. I've pulled rare 2" steaks off with this method that had been out there on the grill 20 minutes, just never over the main heat, 'cept for quickly at the end. My bro manages 5 star restaurants and pokes a piece of meat with his finger and tells you how done it is, so he is often out back with me.
Not to speak for Tony, but it depends on a couple things. How big are you cutting the potatoes? How dense are the potatoes you're using? Sweet potato fries cut into steak fries and wrapped in foil take close to an hour even at 400+ to get them tender - which is far and away the most important thing imo. I also like to use a good amount of sea salt to bring the moisture out. Diced potatoes cook a lot quicker, but they're really easy to char, especially using foil, because the unevenness of the foil creates some hot spots. I try to oil the foil, not the potatoes, and then roll the potatoes around on the foil before putting it on the grill - I find that soaks up most of the extra oil to prevent pooling. Once they're oiled up, then I season them, which makes it stick better. I know a lot of people will disagree with this, but I like to use onion and garlic powder instead of fresh, not just because it's easier, but because they stick to the oil and create some nice crumblies that I can shake off over the potatoes to give them some extra flavor.Seriously an hour? Wow, I've done them for about 1/2 hour in the past. How hot is your grill?I like red potatoes on the grill
I was afraid of this question only because nothing is carved in stone by me anyway. I am playing out there with this method. Sometimes I'll go old school and sear them first, then melt the fat into the seared outsides. This is common for 3 or less steaks (easy). Sometimes I'll add fat more than once during the cook. Sometimes I'll sear them in a rotation based on preferences. This is when I am cooking up a mess of steaks for my typical crowd of 7 to 10, all family. My dad (rip) had this Sunday bbq tradition, my mom lives with me now, so I have assumed the position. Well done is seared first, then medium, then med rare, then rare. That is more common and easier for a crowd for me. The more someone wants it cooked, obviously the more time it will spend both over the coals and closer to them than the other meat. But I do try to get the outsides uniform with an even sear on them all. So in a sense there's three cooking zones here. One over the coals, one closer to the coals, one far from the coals. I know the heat gets pretty even away from the coals but there is still some higher heat coming from that middle area than the opposite end. Depending on how slow I am getting them right, rare may not see the coals unti the very end, and then lowered and seared fast while the others rest on the opposite end. Also rare and med rare may just stay inside for a few minutes before hitting the grill in different zones. I do despise my well done orderers, but I have two of them and they hates the blood, but buy plenty of meat and bring desserts.
Pretty sure it was Alton Brown who explained how searing does not sear in juices, but adds flavor and sure some aesthetics, so that is why I sear, and why I do not necessarily sear first.
Cool. Thanks.JI was afraid of this question only because nothing is carved in stone by me anyway. I am playing out there with this method. Sometimes I'll go old school and sear them first, then melt the fat into the seared outsides. This is common for 3 or less steaks (easy). Sometimes I'll add fat more than once during the cook. Sometimes I'll sear them in a rotation based on preferences. This is when I am cooking up a mess of steaks for my typical crowd of 7 to 10, all family. My dad (rip) had this Sunday bbq tradition, my mom lives with me now, so I have assumed the position. Well done is seared first, then medium, then med rare, then rare. That is more common and easier for a crowd for me. The more someone wants it cooked, obviously the more time it will spend both over the coals and closer to them than the other meat. But I do try to get the outsides uniform with an even sear on them all. So in a sense there's three cooking zones here. One over the coals, one closer to the coals, one far from the coals. I know the heat gets pretty even away from the coals but there is still some higher heat coming from that middle area than the opposite end. Depending on how slow I am getting them right, rare may not see the coals unti the very end, and then lowered and seared fast while the others rest on the opposite end. Also rare and med rare may just stay inside for a few minutes before hitting the grill in different zones. I do despise my well done orderers, but I have two of them and they hates the blood, but buy plenty of meat and bring desserts.
Hi Fred.I can say with confidence your worries are justified...Probably true. I don't mind eating unhealthy. I just wonder if it really makes it taste better. I like olive oil. I like butter, too. I've never cooked with bacon fat. I'm worried I might be missing out.You know the answer here, Fred.In manly grilling who cares about health type discussions, it's Bacon Fat >>>>>>>>>Butter>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Olive OilWhy bacon fat or butter? I've been doing the same basic thing, but with olive oil. Just curious if one is better than the other.I like red potatoes on the grill
Finely chopped onion and garlic
Lots of black pepper and your favorite seasoning salt
Italian seasoning (I like a lot as well)
Parsley flakes
Bacon fat or butter
Wrap in havy duty foil, turn often, about an hour.
J
J
Thick Ribeye's, said taters above, corn on the cob, and some coleslaw for tonights Sunday supper.
This one?:http://grillinfools.com/2009/03/03/who-needs-baked-beans-when-you-can-have-grilled-beans/
Diced takes a whle. (I do like them kinda crispy)Sometimes I thinly slice then half. Once again, I like a crispy exterior with some soft taters in the middle.Seriously an hour? Wow, I've done them for about 1/2 hour in the past. How hot is your grill?Why bacon fat or butter? I've been doing the same basic thing, but with olive oil. Just curious if one is better than the other.I like red potatoes on the grill
Awesome. Looks great.
For a first try, I'd say that's outstanding. Main thing is to learn and try things next time. Part of the reason some of these guys are so great at cooking brisket is they've cooked a zillion. You get a feel for the timing as to how it relates to the meat / heat / wind / etc. Great job.
Would you have a link for the griddle you have?What CC said. The crust is fantastic. And you're not losing all the juice dripping down into the flame. For a long time, it seemed folks were split about 50-50 on the griddled vs grill thing but now I'm seeing most of the hot shot type burger chefs leaning more toward the griddle. That doesn't matter to me though. I think it tastes better.JCan't speak for Joe but the outside of the patties frying in their own seasoned fat and forming an slightly crunchy chewy crust is tastier than that fat dripping and flaring and making the unhealthy char we're supposed to be avoiding.Why?
Sure Spike,Would you have a link for the griddle you have?What CC said. The crust is fantastic. And you're not losing all the juice dripping down into the flame. For a long time, it seemed folks were split about 50-50 on the griddled vs grill thing but now I'm seeing most of the hot shot type burger chefs leaning more toward the griddle. That doesn't matter to me though. I think it tastes better.JCan't speak for Joe but the outside of the patties frying in their own seasoned fat and forming an slightly crunchy chewy crust is tastier than that fat dripping and flaring and making the unhealthy char we're supposed to be avoiding.Why?
Guy, NEVER hesitate to share something like this. Some guys here get to grill more than others or have been cooking longer than others but there are no "pros" here. This thread is about sharing and grilling and BBQ. Great post.J
That's a little different than how I grill my onions usually. Gonna have to give it a try. Thanks for posting!
Next time, add a little garlic powder and fresh mushrooms and prepare to taste heaven.
Thanks! The rub, wet injection, and spritz I used are listed below:Awesome. Looks great.
J
I've kind of changed my mind a bit. The cook is this Saturday, there will be about 20 adults and 10 kids. I plan to do:1 9-10lb Butt
Spicy, sweet, just the right amount of heat 
