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***Official 2014 World Cup Thread*** (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter NewlyRetired
- Start date
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
thanks! I still can't tell but from that view it was impressive that Brooks eve saw the ball. It looks like Cameron was blocking his view.
Sand
Footballguy
Like 98% of the world you'll want to punch Ronaldo in the nose by the end of the game.Thanks. I need to know these things because so far, how much fake agony a team puts on is my primary way of deciding whether I like them or not.Just warning you - nobody rolls around the field and feigns injury more than the Portugese.Some take aways today from a total novice.
Landon Donovan was super cool on TV I thought. If I didn't know better, I'd think he was the retired favorite son. Not the guy cut. Now maybe they're paying him boat load of money I dunno but he acted super classy.
I love our guy that broke his nose and refused the stupid little stretcher boat thing then kept playing. That's the kind of thing that will make me cheer for a guy.
I can't stand the german guy Muller that flopped so hard and taunted the guy into touching his forehead (at that being a "headbutt") I hope Germany sucks but from my vast soccer experience, that's looking kind of like hating the Heat or the Seahawks.
I enjoyed the USA game a lot. At 1-1, my friends were all begging for a tie and I told them they were wimps and that we were going to win. They smiled at poor Joe the Soccer novice. 30 seconds later, we scored.
J
J
renesauz
IBL Representative
This is misleading too though. Ghana had over 20 shots total- a high total for a losing team. Make no mistake about it- Ghana played well today, and the US was lucky to get a W.
Norman Paperman
Footballguy
I think he is looking in that direction - just not enough talent ready to step up. I think we'll continue to pull latino guys into the squad over the course of the next qualifying run.
Notorious T.R.E.
Showdown!™ Administrator
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NewlyRetired
Footballguy
The guy (Jozy) who hurt his hamstring is a big stong dude. His main job with these tactics was to take long passes, absorb punishment and bring other players into play with his hold up ability.
While Jozy is the furthest thing from world class at this particular skill he is the best we have.
The real problem is that JK did not pick a similar skill set as a bench player.
Donovan is a small (used to be lightening fast) skill player. Pretty much the exact opposite of the skill set needed as the target player.
TLEF316
Footballguy
What Mexican kid deserved to make the team? IMO, none of them did. Torres never impressed me and Gomez is past his prime. Orozco is terrible.
I do hope that Junior Flores is ready to compete within the next 2-3 years. Agudelo still has potential as well. Who knows if Diego Fagundez will ever get his green card.
Of course, none of those 3 are Mexican anyway. The only potential contributor we've lost to a hispanic team is Andy Najar.
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The Gator
Footballguy
There are a lot of things I want to do to him, that's not one of themLike 98% of the world you'll want to punch Ronaldo in the nose by the end of the game.Thanks. I need to know these things because so far, how much fake agony a team puts on is my primary way of deciding whether I like them or not.Just warning you - nobody rolls around the field and feigns injury more than the Portugese.Some take aways today from a total novice.
Landon Donovan was super cool on TV I thought. If I didn't know better, I'd think he was the retired favorite son. Not the guy cut. Now maybe they're paying him boat load of money I dunno but he acted super classy.
I love our guy that broke his nose and refused the stupid little stretcher boat thing then kept playing. That's the kind of thing that will make me cheer for a guy.
I can't stand the german guy Muller that flopped so hard and taunted the guy into touching his forehead (
I enjoyed the USA game a lot. At 1-1, my friends were all begging for a tie and I told them they were wimps and that we were going to win. They smiled at poor Joe the Soccer novice. 30 seconds later, we scored.
J
J
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
actually when he first took over, he favored the Americans playing in Mexico.
He saw Liga MX as a stronger league than MLS (which is the correct observation) and gave a bunch of them chances early in the cycle. But they did not work out (and in Herculez Gomez's case, he just got too old).
His ability to recruit the German guys was obviously a strong suit. He has a couple more possibly important recruitment's to make early in the next cycle.
Sorry if honda - is there an article out there that's sort of a "dummies guide to soccer"
Things like what to look for. How to size up a game. That kind of thing.
I've seen a few that are really detailed and in depth. I'm looking for something simpler.
Anything out there?
J
Things like what to look for. How to size up a game. That kind of thing.
I've seen a few that are really detailed and in depth. I'm looking for something simpler.
Anything out there?
J
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Diego got his green card last October. I think you mean when he will get his citizenship. He just has to wait out the process and we have to hope Uruguay does not come calling before then.
The Gator
Footballguy
TLEF316
Footballguy
yeah, that's what I mean (semi drunk at the moment). We also run the risk of him going overseas before he can establish citizenship./
Celph Titled
Footballguy
A good Pepe (the guy on Portugal who head-butted Muller) comparison is Suh. Good defender and a very useful player, but serious anger/dirty play issues, to the point where they deter from the team. It wasn't like he bar head-butted him, but at the same time you can't put your head on another guy's head when he's down like that. Muller was right to be upset, and the refs were right to red-card him.Some take aways today from a total novice.
Landon Donovan was super cool on TV I thought. If I didn't know better, I'd think he was the retired favorite son. Not the guy cut. Now maybe they're paying him boat load of money I dunno but he acted super classy.
I love our guy that broke his nose and refused the stupid little stretcher boat thing then kept playing. That's the kind of thing that will make me cheer for a guy.
I can't stand the german guy Muller that flopped so hard and taunted the guy into touching his forehead (
I enjoyed the USA game a lot. At 1-1, my friends were all begging for a tie and I told them they were wimps and that we were going to win. They smiled at poor Joe the Soccer novice. 30 seconds later, we scored.
J
Germany's probably considered the third-biggest favorite to win the WC. They're very good, but they're banged up by injuries and Brazil enjoys a big HFA and are the best team in the world. Argentina enjoys a "continental advantage" (more fans at games, more used to the climate), as no European team has ever won a WC on South American soil.
Diving/flopping is somewhat of a cultural issue/difference, it's seen as more acceptable in Latino/Spanish-speaking countries as it is in US/Western Europe.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
do you mean from a tactical point of view or are you asking about other things?
Like all sports, the statistical analysis for soccer has exploded in recent years. The analysis is fabulous. It can feel like drinking from a fire hose at times but they way new fans seem to do it is just jump in, read what they can and then ask questions in the soccer thread (or here).
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
it is very complicated to say the least
I just wish he would get married, it speeds up the process ten fold.
I still think it is crazy that someone like him who has lived here almost his entire life can't play and yet others who barely set foot in the country can. Yes I understand why, but it just seems backwards to me.
Norman Paperman
Footballguy
Italians tend to have a fondness for the theatrics as well...I'd say England is the only other serious soccer/football country where flopping/embellishment is frowned upon, but almost all top pros know how to hit the ground on contact.A good Pepe (the guy on Portugal who head-butted Muller) comparison is Suh. Good defender and a very useful player, but serious anger/dirty play issues, to the point where they deter from the team. It wasn't like he bar head-butted him, but at the same time you can't put your head on another guy's head when he's down like that. Muller was right to be upset, and the refs were right to red-card him.Some take aways today from a total novice.
Landon Donovan was super cool on TV I thought. If I didn't know better, I'd think he was the retired favorite son. Not the guy cut. Now maybe they're paying him boat load of money I dunno but he acted super classy.
I love our guy that broke his nose and refused the stupid little stretcher boat thing then kept playing. That's the kind of thing that will make me cheer for a guy.
I can't stand the german guy Muller that flopped so hard and taunted the guy into touching his forehead (
I enjoyed the USA game a lot. At 1-1, my friends were all begging for a tie and I told them they were wimps and that we were going to win. They smiled at poor Joe the Soccer novice. 30 seconds later, we scored.
J
Germany's probably considered the third-biggest favorite to win the WC. They're very good, but they're banged up by injuries and Brazil enjoys a big HFA and are the best team in the world. Argentina enjoys a "continental advantage" (more fans at games, more used to the climate), as no European team has ever won a WC on South American soil.
Diving/flopping is somewhat of a cultural issue/difference, it's seen as more acceptable in Latino/Spanish-speaking countries as it is in US/Western Europe.
I guess other things more basic. Like I'm asking here with is time of possession what you look at? How do you know the rankings are meaningless? What do people think of Klinsman? That kind of thing.
I'm guessing people like me are a pretty decent sized market that want a "get you up to speed so you can talk to your soccer loving friends" type of thing.
J
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
#### me!
I just realized I have not eaten a thing since 5:00pm on Sunday :(
This sport is going to be the death of me.
I just realized I have not eaten a thing since 5:00pm on Sunday :(
This sport is going to be the death of me.
shader
Footballguy
I'm a football guy, and when I see a play like that, I immediately think 2 weeks minimum. Which puts him out for the next two games, best case scenario.
I don't thjnk we will see him again in the World Cup. :(
Bonzai
Footballguy
Never want to see a starting CB leave the game.
Even aside from the goal, Brooks looked good. Excited about his potential.
Native
Footballguy
Grantland wrote one thats perfect for you - http://grantland.com/features/how-to-watch-the-world-cup-like-a-true-soccer-nerd/
Celph Titled
Footballguy
:wave:
We're probably in the minority, though. I would think that most people are good with JK in general, but probably disagree that Donovan should've been left off the roster.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
oh then what you are doing is by far the best.
Every WC cycle the soccer thread grows with new fans. Some were complete novices when they started and now follow the game more in depth than the old timers like myself do.
Just keep asking questions if you are interested. You will find the knowledge in the soccer thread is pretty wide and fairly deep (although we do have one enormous gaping hole in terms of the Mexican league which is the highest TV rated soccer league in the country)
Thanks. I'd read that one and that's what I meant about being a little too indepth. I love Grantland and I'm sure it's a great article. I was thinking more "dumb" than that in my "for dummies" :(
J
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NewlyRetired
Footballguy
don't over think the stretcher thing. It has nothing to do with serious injuries. It was just something FIFA employed to get players off the field faster. 99/100 times it is not needed as we think of a stretcher being needed for a broken neck.
There is no question Jozy was hurt though and badly.
The Gator
Footballguy
I don't know of an article off the top of my head, but here is what I find helps friends/family of mine who are new to getting into soccer.
Try not to watch the guy with the ball. May seem odd, but you'll pick up more of how they build things up watching guys move off the ball and the runs they make. You'll then be able to see a play develop sooner than just always watching the pass after the fact. My kid already talks during the game, "Oh, he should have passed to him he was going to be open" It helps so much knowing what's going on off the ball
Watch what a team does when they win/lose the ball. Change of possession is key; defense- what shape do they get into? do they immediately press, or fall back? offense- are they looking to build up slowly or counter attack quickly? Do they always try to get the ball to the same player when they win it?
Just a few things that help imo
The Gator
Footballguy
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
That article is as basic as you will kind of get with out being insulting. Best to ask questions then that you are most interested in like you are doing.
Notorious T.R.E.
Showdown!™ Administrator
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
probably a bad time to take a pollI'm in the minority, but if it's a pole..probably a 70-80% approval rating?
If the US lost today I bet it would have flipped completely from your numbers.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Notorious T.R.E.
Showdown!™ Administrator
Native
Footballguy
No pain no gain Joe. This article compared Arturo Vidal to Lebron James. Doesnt get much more "dumbed down" than that
Will see if I come across anything else...
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
The World Cup 2006 FFA thread had a grand total of 196 posts in it. That was for the entire tournament.
Bonzai
Footballguy
I hear you. Won't have the same impact though, right?
I have German coursing through my veins and am sympathetic to Klinsmann, but I resent him for the Donovan decision. I'm also suspicious of him due to the criticisms that Lahm and others made of him during his time in Germany, but I have to give him credit for his tactical decisions so far this World Cup. Conflicted to say the least.
Norman Paperman
Footballguy
Joe - what do you think of Klinsmann? Why?
As for analytics - soccer is a much more complicated game than most people realize - at least at the club and international level. There are so many different ways to play, that you can't really look at one thing, and say - this is the "right" way. One team may decide to play a counter-attacking game, where they concede possession, and then look to hit on quick counter attacks, while another team might look to play a high defensive line and look to create turnovers high up field, while many teams try to replicate the success of the recent Spanish teams by having a lot of possession and trying to find that killer pass in the offensive end. Chelsea likes to rent big tour busses and park them in front of the goal - a cheeky way of saying they will play a very defensive game, and make the most of the few chances they get.
From a football perspective - I suppose its like saying one team will play the West Coast, another team a variation of the run-and-shoot, and another will be a ground-oriented attack. Measures of success will look different for each style.
Aside from the vast differences in team tactics, you have different skills used at different positions - number of tackles, interceptions, balls recovered are important for defenders, less so for attackers. Pass completion percentage is a good stat to look at for many central midfielders - but may be misleading in that a bad pass could be the result of the player on the other end running in a different direction - much the same way as a WR running a wrong route is an incompletion.
As for analytics - soccer is a much more complicated game than most people realize - at least at the club and international level. There are so many different ways to play, that you can't really look at one thing, and say - this is the "right" way. One team may decide to play a counter-attacking game, where they concede possession, and then look to hit on quick counter attacks, while another team might look to play a high defensive line and look to create turnovers high up field, while many teams try to replicate the success of the recent Spanish teams by having a lot of possession and trying to find that killer pass in the offensive end. Chelsea likes to rent big tour busses and park them in front of the goal - a cheeky way of saying they will play a very defensive game, and make the most of the few chances they get.
From a football perspective - I suppose its like saying one team will play the West Coast, another team a variation of the run-and-shoot, and another will be a ground-oriented attack. Measures of success will look different for each style.
Aside from the vast differences in team tactics, you have different skills used at different positions - number of tackles, interceptions, balls recovered are important for defenders, less so for attackers. Pass completion percentage is a good stat to look at for many central midfielders - but may be misleading in that a bad pass could be the result of the player on the other end running in a different direction - much the same way as a WR running a wrong route is an incompletion.
It's guesswork. You are talking about teams that play a handful of games together a year with changing rosters.
renesauz
IBL Representative
Also be aware that getting kicked in the shin hurts like heck without causing any real or lasting damage. While soccer has a lot of flopping, it's not at all unusual for a guy to be in significant legititmate pain one minute and just fine the next.
