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Official 2016 GOP thread: Is it really going to be Donald Trump?? (3 Viewers)

Loan Sharks said:
See already talking about it. 
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Yep. They are saying he went and grabbed some standard republican talking points and adapted them for himself as a "plan" because he got called out on being an empty suit with no specific proposals beyond making everything terrific and fantastic. But go ahead and eat it up.

 
RedmondLonghorn said:
Free trade has its positives and negatives. It is still a net benefit to society. And protectionism generally has some pretty bad unintended consequences.

But maybe he isn't suggesting outright protectionism. Maybe he is suggesting offering economic incentives to keep jobs from leaving. A lot of people call that "corporate welfare". And, depending on the form, they may be right.
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If it's such a net benefit then why are the top 1% putting more distance between themselves and the rest of us?  Why are our wages not keeping up with inflation?  Why is the percentage of people out of the job market or under-employed / part time so high?  Why is our national debt increasing?

 
cap'n grunge said:
Yep. They are saying he went and grabbed some standard republican talking points and adapted them for himself as a "plan" because he got called out on being an empty suit with no specific proposals beyond making everything terrific and fantastic. But go ahead and eat it up.
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Oh people will. You know they will. Look deep inside yourself you know it to be true. 

 
BassNBrew said:
If it's such a net benefit then why are the top 1% putting more distance between themselves and the rest of us?  Why are our wages not keeping up with inflation?  Why is the percentage of people out of the job market or under-employed / part time so high?  Why is our national debt increasing?
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Because it's not true free trade. True free trade would mean each country would operate under the same rules. That just doesn't happen.

 
The clown show is coming to Detroit. Its nice and gray, gloomy and snow will fall for them. I hope its a terribly depressing day in the city for them. 

 
BassNBrew said:
If it's such a net benefit then why are the top 1% putting more distance between themselves and the rest of us?  Why are our wages not keeping up with inflation?  Why is the percentage of people out of the job market or under-employed / part time so high?  Why is our national debt increasing?
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Would help if we stopped taxing capital gains at a lower rate than income.  Would also help if we eliminated the carried interested exemption.  

I have no idea what in the world our debt has to do with free trade.

 
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BassNBrew said:
If it's such a net benefit then why are the top 1% putting more distance between themselves and the rest of us?  Why are our wages not keeping up with inflation?  Why is the percentage of people out of the job market or under-employed / part time so high?  Why is our national debt increasing?
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You've just asked a whole slew of interesting and complex economic questions, free trade/job losses touch on a couple of them, but they aren't close to the whole story.

Beware of simplistic answers to complex questions/problems. Not coincidentally, politicians love to offer those as they grub for votes.

 
RedmondLonghorn said:
You've just asked a whole slew of interesting and complex economic questions, free trade/job losses touch on a couple of them, but they aren't close to the whole story.

Beware of simplistic answers to complex questions/problems. Not coincidentally, politicians love to offer those as they grub for votes.
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Politicians don't offer details because it's not in their best interest, the average voter doesn't want to hear it. 

It's all about soundbites now.  Don't hate the player, hate the game.

 
SoBeDad said:
If they don't give it to Trump, the GOP would be more fractured than if they give it to him. Trump displayed some humility and sounded more like a unifier then ever before in tonight's victory speech. If he starts to sound more presidential, he could might be able to overcome the demographic disadvantage Republicans have in the general election. In Florida, Romney lost by less than 1% in 2012.  I'm voting for Hillary, but I have to admit that his speech and Q&A tonight was very good. He reached out to women by talking about the good things done by PP.
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A few speeches displaying humility (which are insincere at best) will not make women and minorities forget his bullying, insults,  and racist comments. It's not just his supporters who will never change their minds; it's also the one's he has offended.

 
sho nuff said:
I think Bernie is doing more good to make real change than Trump can.

And don't give me the BS about sticking it to the establishment...its a crap excuse to support that fool at this point.  And there is nothing logical in voting for Trump.  Want to see someone really screw up the country with his incompetence...get more people to vote for your guy.
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The excuses that some Trump supporters give for supporting him is to avoid being known as someome who is supporting a candidate who has made racist comments. I did not say all, I said some. 

 
Rubiobot said:
The excuses that some Trump supporters give for supporting him is to avoid being known as someome who is supporting a candidate who has made racist comments. I did not say all, I said some. 
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I think there should be a "not" in there somewhere 

 
I guess Trump doesn't even pay attention to his own self. Didn't he just say he wanted to make sure every American was covered by health insurance a couple weeks ago?

 
Although Trump is leading, he comes across as an underdog....He is not the establishment darling....All the beating on him will only bolster that position and help him....The GOP is too damn stubborn or stupid to realize people have lost respect for their party....Kasich has real answers and solutions yet they continue to ignore him to push their conservative puppets...The fingers should be pointed directly at the GOP, they created Trump...Stop blaming the voters...They are just fed up working class people looking for answers that the GOP is incapable of providing.

 
Getzlaf15 said:
This Romney stuff is just another huge GOP gaffe. They should be working with Trump, not against him.
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Romney and others find Donald Trump to be a dishonorable man. I believe some of them would rather lose the election than see this man become their nominee. Under such circumstances, why should they work with him? 

 
timschochet said:
Romney and others find Donald Trump to be a dishonorable man. I believe some of them would rather lose the election than see this man become their nominee. Under such circumstances, why should they work with him? 
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They should just stay out of it...Working against him is actually working for him...

 
Romney's speech today is better late than never. But Trump will no doubt respond by pointing out that Mitt accepted his endorsement in 2012. 

At the time, in this forum, as a Mitt supporter I criticized Romney for accepting that endorsement and for saying nice words about Trump. I wrote them that he should have condemned Trump and the Birther movement. Perhaps if he had we wouldn't be in this situation now. The GOP establishment was always playing with fire by accepted my extremist views and allowing them to foster; now look what's happened. 

 
timschochet said:
Romney and others find Donald Trump to be a dishonorable man. I believe some of them would rather lose the election than see this man become their nominee. Under such circumstances, why should they work with him? 
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Two reasons. First, they should own up to the fact they let him run as a  Republican. Would he have the same results if he was not in the debates?    Second they should help him defeat Hillary.  

Trump's responses to all this stuff have been awesome.  All he says is the Republicans are coming out in record numbers and growing the party.  Maybe the party needs to wake up and accept the shift.

 
timschochet said:
Romney's speech today is better late than never. But Trump will no doubt respond by pointing out that Mitt accepted his endorsement in 2012. 

At the time, in this forum, as a Mitt supporter I criticized Romney for accepting that endorsement and for saying nice words about Trump. I wrote them that he should have condemned Trump and the Birther movement. Perhaps if he had we wouldn't be in this situation now. The GOP establishment was always playing with fire by accepted my extremist views and allowing them to foster; now look what's happened. 
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:D

 
Ditka Butkus said:
Although Trump is leading, he comes across as an underdog....He is not the establishment darling....All the beating on him will only bolster that position and help him....The GOP is too damn stubborn or stupid to realize people have lost respect for their party....Kasich has real answers and solutions yet they continue to ignore him to push their conservative puppets...The fingers should be pointed directly at the GOP, they created Trump...Stop blaming the voters...They are just fed up working class people looking for answers that the GOP is incapable of providing.
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TripItUp said:
Politicians don't offer details because it's not in their best interest, the average voter doesn't want to hear it. 

It's all about soundbites now.  Don't hate the player, hate the game.
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I understand that. 

It thoroughly explains why we generally end up with the crappier candidates in the general. 

 
Getzlaf15 said:
Two reasons. First, they should own up to the fact they let him run as a  Republican. Would he have the same results if he was not in the debates?    Second they should help him defeat Hillary.  

Trump's responses to all this stuff have been awesome.  All he says is the Republicans are coming out in record numbers and growing the party.  Maybe the party needs to wake up and accept the shift.
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There are some Republicans out there, such as some of the editors of the Wall Street Journal, the Weekly Standard, and the National Review, who would prefer Hillary Clinton over Donald Trump. With good reason, IMO. 

 
Jobber said:
Trump is what the GOP should be, but hasn't been. Socially moderate/liberal & fiscally moderate/conservative.
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I have no idea what Trump is on social issues. He shifts from hour to hour. 

But on fiscal issues you cannot be for high tariffs and opposed to free trade and call yourself a fiscal conservative. 

 
I'm still laughing at people that think trump is a conservative.  The greatest trick he pulled is getting on the GOP ticket in the first place.  

He could easily be running as a Dem right now with the exact same platform (wall even) and nobody would be calling him anything but a liberal.

 
Jobber said:
Trump is what the GOP should be, but hasn't been. Socially moderate/liberal & fiscally moderate/conservative.
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yet, he isn't those things you claim him to be.

He is whatever the wind is blowing that day to pick up a few more supporters.

 
fatguyinalittlecoat said:
:confused:   You do not seem to have your finger on the pulse of the Democratic Party.
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Bernie Sanders doesn't reflect the condition of the democratic party.  The fact he won his home state and a few others is meaningless.  Isolated of the personality and some of the stupid inflammatory comments Trump leans left of center.  He's much closer to Obama than Cruz.  Eventually people will figure that out, or perhaps they have and don't care.  It should be scary that all it takes to get liberal policies to the GOP electorate is an immigration hawk. 

 
culdeus said:
Bernie Sanders doesn't reflect the condition of the democratic party.  The fact he won his home state and a few others is meaningless.  Isolated of the personality and some of the stupid inflammatory comments Trump leans left of center.  He's much closer to Obama than Cruz.  Eventually people will figure that out, or perhaps they have and don't care.  It should be scary that all it takes to get liberal policies to the GOP electorate is an immigration hawk. 
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Bernie Sanders is getting over 40% of the vote of Democrats.  His views are pretty representative of the party.

Trump's positions are pro-life, pro-gun, pro tax cuts for corporations, anti-immigration.  Nobody in the Democratic Party would describe him as a liberal.  Hell, half the Democratic party doesn't even think Hillary is a liberal.

 
sho nuff said:
yet, he isn't those things you claim him to be.

He is whatever the wind is blowing that day to pick up a few more supporters.
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Kind of like Hillary...right?  Although she actually has the ability to change accents depending on what group she is talking to...I don't think Trump has that ability...

 
Boston said:
Kind of like Hillary...right?  Although she actually has the ability to change accents depending on what group she is talking to...I don't think Trump has that ability...
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Sure...a lot like Hillary.  Which is a big reason i don't support her lying crap either.

 
timschochet said:
Romney's speech today is better late than never. But Trump will no doubt respond by pointing out that Mitt accepted his endorsement in 2012. 

At the time, in this forum, as a Mitt supporter I criticized Romney for accepting that endorsement and for saying nice words about Trump. I wrote them that he should have condemned Trump and the Birther movement. Perhaps if he had we wouldn't be in this situation now. The GOP establishment was always playing with fire by accepted my extremist views and allowing them to foster; now look what's happened. 
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So is Romney hoping that there will be a contested convention and he will emerge as the candidate? Is that even possible with the 8 state rule?

 
fatguyinalittlecoat said:
Bernie Sanders is getting over 40% of the vote of Democrats.  His views are pretty representative of the party.

Trump's positions are pro-life, pro-gun, pro tax cuts for corporations, anti-immigration.  Nobody in the Democratic Party would describe him as a liberal.  Hell, half the Democratic party doesn't even think Hillary is a liberal.
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Suggesting Trump is a liberal is kind of funny. He clearly isn't, but he also isn't sufficiently conservative for the hard-core GOP base either. His own statements over time have been so inconsitent, it is hard to say what he is, other than clearly somebody with authoritarian tendencies.

Sanders is intellectually "pure" and pretty darn consistent. There is no question where he lies on the spectrum politically. I question whether his most important policy ideas are really reflective of mainstream democratic ideas (I have seen data suggesting that except among millenials, self-identifying as a "socialist" is more damaging to a candidate's prospects than being a Muslim or *gasp* an atheist), but I guess we will find out. 

What they share in common is that they are both running as outsiders and populists and are tapping in to anger at the political establishment of both parties. 

 
This Romney thing is kind of funny. By again bashing Trump from the platform of the GOP establishment, it further entrenches Trump's supporters and may even garner some independent support.  Some D and I voters may look at this and say "well if the GOP doesn't like him, he can't be all that bad." This will make him more formidable in the general election. I would give the GOP credit for forward thinking but I don't think they meant to do it.

 
Insein said:
This Romney thing is kind of funny. By again bashing Trump from the platform of the GOP establishment, it further entrenches Trump's supporters and may even garner some independent support.  Some D and I voters may look at this and say "well if the GOP doesn't like him, he can't be all that bad." This will make him more formidable in the general election. I would give the GOP credit for forward thinking but I don't think they meant to do it.
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Yea I'm just not sure this hurts Trump. Its only going to embolden his supporters.

 
RedmondLonghorn said:
Suggesting Trump is a liberal is kind of funny. He clearly isn't, but he also isn't sufficiently conservative for the hard-core GOP base either. His own statements over time have been so inconsitent, it is hard to say what he is, other than clearly somebody with authoritarian tendencies.
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Really wouldn't surprise me if Don ends up being a little to the left of Clinton on some issues

 
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