What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

*** OFFICIAL *** COVID-19 CoronaVirus Thread. Fresh epidemic fears as child pneumonia cases surge in Europe after China outbreak. NOW in USA (7 Viewers)

Status
Not open for further replies.
I can't believe your consideration is to keep everything closed up ?   Makes no sense at all 

Your wife had what everyone in this world experiences....a cold, a fever, a flu, a sickness.   Why don't we just close all the doors for the rest of our lives?   Im afraid of what your response would be 
Yes...I think he saw what his wife went through was more than just a little cold or fever or flu...I think he has read stories of those working in hospitals and what they have seen and went through which is more than just a little cold or fever or flu.

As explained...everything isn't all closed up.  And the impact of opening too early are worse than keeping things slowed down a little longer.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
My local Nextdoor is a train wreck. People complaining that the lockdown was extended here until May 15th. A few people saying “it’s not that bad here.” Well, maybe because the lock down is working!!!! :rant:
Nextdoor has gone from mask shaming one direction to now mask shaming for people not wearing them.

 
There are so many "internet" doctors and scientists in this thread it's laughable. The certainty of some people's claims in here is also laughable.  Then you have the ones who say "I know someone who knows someone who said"...blah blah blah. Some act as if they want to see this go on forever, just weird.


This is a pretty great thread, actually.  Sorry you haven’t enjoyed it.
It's great if you like being told there's no hope and things will NEVER be normal again. Or if you like being shot down when presenting anything remotely positive. 

 
There are so many "internet" doctors and scientists in this thread it's laughable. The certainty of some people's claims in here is also laughable.  Then you have the ones who say "I know someone who knows someone who said"...blah blah blah. Some act as if they want to see this go on forever, just weird.
People cope in different ways.  Some prefer the prison they know.

It looks like classic "zero-risk bias" in effect, and it is human and understandable.  Zero-risk bias is a tendency to prefer the complete elimination of a risk in a sub-part even when alternative options produce a greater overall reduction in risk. It often manifests in cases where decision makers address problems concerning health, safety, and the environment.

The reluctance to grant appropriate status to economic concerns is an example of zero-risk bias in effect.

There is an equation out there, which if solved correctly will balance health and economic concerns.  I don't pretend to have solved the equation, but I know the answer isn't "see you in July".

 
The numbers everyone has been using to forecast the end of the world were shown to be off.  Not by a little... by orders of magnitude.  We went from forecasting millions dead to a few10's of thousands overnight... weird right?

Stanford has posited that the disease has been here since the fall and that California may already have herd immunity.
Article is behind a firewall, so i cant read it.  But, how does this square with what we have seen in NY, Italy, and Spain?

To your question though- is it really that weird to note that mitigation factors have been successful?

 
  • Thanks
Reactions: JAA
It's great if you like being told there's no hope and things will NEVER be normal again. Or if you like being shot down when presenting anything remotely positive. 
Yep.   That’s definitely what has been happening in here since the beginning.  Whatever you say.

Others have found it incredibly helpful.  If you don’t like this thread, start your own where facts aren’t allowed unless they support positive projections and perspectives.

 
I also just think people need to realize that there are different psychologies people go through dealing with this stuff. It’s neither right nor wrong. Just recognize it and move on to the next post.
 

I admit I’m the type that gets through this stuff looking for little positive stories or glimmers of hope from potential ‘treatments’ here or there. I like and seek out those stories as it gives me mentally something to just grab onto thinking that stuff is being tried all over and one of these is bound to hit eventually. So I admit @shader (among others)more skeptical posts on these bummed me out.  But i have to remember he likely comes from the other place psychologically where folks want to keep their guards up until it's a more certain thing. They don’t want to get their hopes up and have it crushed... again.
 

I think people need to accept (talking both schools of thought here) the two different psychologies here and just move on when they see a post that embraces the ‘other’ school of thought. We’re all in da same gang.

 
  • Thanks
Reactions: JAA
There are so many "internet" doctors and scientists in this thread it's laughable. The certainty of some people's claims in here is also laughable.  Then you have the ones who say "I know someone who knows someone who said"...blah blah blah. Some act as if they want to see this go on forever, just weird.
Common sense rules all.  In the end, we are all experts making our own decisions right now.  My Governor can lift the stay at home order, but it doesn't mean I have to leave my house.  I will social distance as long as I decide, and no one will tell me otherwise (although I will be on the safe side, and stay home longer than most). 

 
After reading the entire article, I decided not to sign up, because I have had no symptoms at all.  I think they are looking for folks who either recovered at home or at least had some symptoms.  I haven't had the slightest cough, fever, loss of smell, nothing.  I've also had almost no human contact in 3 weeks.  If I do have it, or had it earlier, it's gotta be the weakest case in the world.
That is what they are looking for, they don't want people that were either diagnosed or had likely symptoms of COVID-19.

 
The numbers everyone has been using to forecast the end of the world were shown to be off.  Not by a little... by orders of magnitude.  We went from forecasting millions dead to a few10's of thousands overnight... weird right?

Stanford has posited that the disease has been here since the fall and that California may already have herd immunity.
No one ever forecasted millions dead if we quarantined.  The fact that we did quarantine is why the forecasts have changed. 

 
QUESTION:

What do you guys think would be worse overall for the economy?

A long initial complete shutdown? Perhaps 100-140 day range? Then afterwards things slowly get back into rhythm.  No more complete shutdowns required.  Obviously lingering regulations will remain like mask requirements, but nothing major.

OR

Multiple shutdowns over a period of 200-280 days. Perhaps every other month, or two months, we're forced to completely close up shop for 30-40 days to slow down another outbreak? 

Thoughts?

 
Last edited by a moderator:
QUESTION:

What do you guys think would be worse overall for the economy?

A long initial complete shutdown? Perhaps 100-140 day range? Then afterwards things slowly get back into rhythm.  No more complete shutdowns required.  Obviously lingering regulations will remain like mask requirements, but nothing major.

OR

Multiple shutdowns over a period of 200-280 days. Perhaps every other month, or two months, we're forced to completely close up shop for 30-40 days to slow down another outbreak? 

Thoughts?
I have no clue.  I feel like I'm being led by the question, frankly.

The multiple-shutdown option needs to have a probability number attached to it.  And I also would need to know what great new things had come along before the 2nd (or 3rd, or 4th) wave - things like tracking, testing, tracing, apps, better data - that would make these new waves more easily dealt with.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
QUESTION:

What do you guys think would be worse overall for the economy?

A long initial complete shutdown? Perhaps 100-140 day range? Then afterwards things slowly get back into rhythm.  No more complete shutdowns required.  Obviously lingering regulations will remain like mask requirements, but nothing major.

OR

Multiple shutdowns over a period of 200-280 days. Perhaps every other month, or two months, we're forced to completely close up shop for 30-40 days to slow down another outbreak? 

Thoughts?
If you could guarantee that there would be no more shutdowns required, I'd take the 100 days.

But I don't think that's realistic. I think we're going to continue to have massive outbreaks no matter what happens.

 
QUESTION:

What do you guys think would be worse overall for the economy?

A long initial complete shutdown? Perhaps 100-140 day range? Then afterwards things slowly get back into rhythm.  No more complete shutdowns required.  Obviously lingering regulations will remain like mask requirements, but nothing major.

OR

Multiple shutdowns over a period of 200-280 days. Perhaps every other month, or two months, we're forced to completely close up shop for 30-40 days to slow down another outbreak? 

Thoughts?
I think multiple shutdowns would be worse. I imagine there are industries where it takes time to get things going and wind things down, so the time will not be fully utilized before they need to shutdown again. I also think it would make people more pessimistic, that they would be hopeful when things open, and a little more pessimistic each time they shut back down. 

 
just stopped off to grab a few items for our easter dinner for 2 tomorrow...

max 10 in the store. lineup outside, properly spaced without any prompting. no compaining. everyone in mask and gloves.

ppl are shopping quicker and more respectfully... in and out. 

nice to see, esp on a holiday weekend.

 
People cope in different ways.  Some prefer the prison they know.

It looks like classic "zero-risk bias" in effect, and it is human and understandable.  Zero-risk bias is a tendency to prefer the complete elimination of a risk in a sub-part even when alternative options produce a greater overall reduction in risk. It often manifests in cases where decision makers address problems concerning health, safety, and the environment.

The reluctance to grant appropriate status to economic concerns is an example of zero-risk bias in effect.

There is an equation out there, which if solved correctly will balance health and economic concerns.  I don't pretend to have solved the equation, but I know the answer isn't "see you in July".
You know the answer isn't "see you in July".  Why?  What evidence are you basing this on?

I agree with the "zero risk bias" part, but there is also a very real underreaction bias being pushed because probability of economic damage is 100% whereas an individual recieving COVID damage is far less than that.

I get it.  We will all be impacted by the down economy, one way or another. 

What I have't heard explained is how the economy comes back by opening things up.  Will people suddenly start goong to bars? Baseball games? Disney? No effin way I'm doing any of that, not as someone with underlying health conditions.  And, I'm not unique...I'd bet most of us have something going on...blood pressure, heart disease, asthma, compromised immune system, diabetes, etc.

So if opening things up with this virus still lurking won't save the economy anyways, is the risk of a second wave worth it?

 
I have no clue.  I feel like I'm being led by the question, frankly.

The multiple-shutdown option needs to have a probability number attached to it.  And I also would need to know what great new things had come along before the 2nd (or 3rd, or 4th) wave - things like tracking, testing, tracing, apps, better data - that would make these new waves more easily dealt with.
Agree with this. We are going to need to establish something other than social distancing in order to avoid huge outbreaks in the coming months if/when we open things back up. Testing in big numbers, for both who currently has the virus and who’s already had it will be a the next thing we need to do. 

 
I just placed my first Instacart order.  Delivery to happen on Tuesday.  Immediately after ordering I started to feel guilty.  While I may not be exposing myself, I am essentially asking someone else to take the risk for me.  Hmmm...

 
I just placed my first Instacart order.  Delivery to happen on Tuesday.  Immediately after ordering I started to feel guilty.  While I may not be exposing myself, I am essentially asking someone else to take the risk for me.  Hmmm...
Don't feel guilty.  You are helping someone else make ends meet.

My 23 yr old got laid off when the coffee shop he worked at closed a couple weeks before things got bad.  He's doing a heck of a job hustling w/ instacart, door dash, etc.  He's young, healthy, and has no comorbidities.  The risk is fairly low for him.

 
Nextdoor has gone from mask shaming one direction to now mask shaming for people not wearing them.
Our's has mask nazis on it. There are a couple girls advertising to make custom face coverings for people and they are charging a reasonable price (like  7-8  bucks). People are destroying them for not giving the masks away. I mean if these people are out of work and are trying to earn a little extra coin, what is the harm? Plus I think the idea of having a Denver Bronco face covering or a Frozen one for a little girl is kind of a cool idea. 

 
I just placed my first Instacart order.  Delivery to happen on Tuesday.  Immediately after ordering I started to feel guilty.  While I may not be exposing myself, I am essentially asking someone else to take the risk for me.  Hmmm...
Yes but you're also paying that person which might enable them to feed their family or keep their residence.

 
I hope they hurry this up because I don’t know how many more people I can read say they had it in December. No, karen, you live in bfe rural north Florida. If you had it in December nyc would have blown up in October. They flat out swear they already had it. 
I'm starting to hear more of this.  We had a nasty situation last night that involved our neighbor lady - sitting in a lawn chair uninvited in our front yard - dropping in casual conversation that she and her husband (a nurse) are convinced they had the virus in Feb.  My wife - who is very calm normally - chewed her a new poop chute and had the lady leaving in tears.  Neither one of us believe they had the virus though I suppose absent a test we'll never know, but she was over at our house with her kids in late Feb, has been hanging around our front yard drinking beers on nice afternoon and only now informed us she thinks she had it?  She said it like you would "nice day outside, huh?". 

So....that friendship is likely over or at the very least tarnished.  My coworker thinks his family had it in Dec.  My boss and I challenged him on that claim but his wife told him they had it and she sells essential oils....who would know better than her?

This is maddening.  What are these folks hoping to attain by claiming they had the virus - self diagnosed, mind you - already?  

 
The numbers everyone has been using to forecast the end of the world were shown to be off.  Not by a little... by orders of magnitude.  We went from forecasting millions dead to a few10's of thousands overnight... weird right?

Stanford has posited that the disease has been here since the fall and that California may already have herd immunity.
It's somewhat sad that it took articles and studies like these to come out for me to feel comfortable sharing the story I'm about to, but it seems like the right time. This is an account from a recent pair of clients of mine so there's no link to share. Just passing along what they told me earlier this week...

I helped an older couple (W and J) from Washington buy a house here in Las Vegas at the end of this past August. I called them this week to caution them about forbearances being offered by lenders and their less publicized downsides. I didn't think they'd be in a position to need a forbearance, and thankfully it turns out they didn't. It was a good way to catch up with a recent client no less. Of course the conversation quickly turned to coronavirus and I asked how both of them were doing. Both are well now but that wasn't the case for the Mrs in January.

Turns out J was very sick in January with tremendous difficulty breathing. She never felt like she could get a deep breath, and at its worst she didn't seem to be able to get a breath at all. Said she felt like her lungs were full. Over the course of 3 weeks, W drove J to 4  different hospital emergency rooms. None could help her as their typical treatments failed. She continually tested negative for both the flu and pneumonia. The obvious leap is to assume coronavirus but what really opened my eyes was W's account of their experience at hospital #3. When they arrived, the emergency room was so full that they were treating people in the waiting area. Mind you this was the 3rd week of January. No news stories that I can recall about Las Vegas hospitals being overwhelmed at that time. I have no reason not to believe him, it simply didn't make the news and I think there's a perfectly good explanation for it. Hospitals do see waves and spikes in the winter months every few years in particularly bad flu seasons. And that's exactly what that hospital told W and J they thought they had on their hands.

After some basic temperature taking in the waiting room, a nurse came to W and J and told them they finally had space in a treatment room. As they were being led to said room, W recalled to me how the hall was littered with beds and patients propped in the upright position on machines helping them with their breathing. It didn't make sense to W or J that the hospital thought they all these cases of the flu, when they were encountering so many people with breathing issues. Nonetheless, patients were indicating breathing troubles so the doctors and nurses were trying to provide the assistance the situation required. When they reached the room where J was to be treated for her breathing troubles, they found a room with 9 other patients all hooked to breathing apparatuses. Apparently there were numerous rooms like this populated 10 per room. The nurse told them that the average amount of time spent on these machines for the people who were put on them was 48 hours. That's when W and J opted to again try and battle whatever J had at home.

When the time came for emergency room visit #4 at hospital #4, J finally got quicker, better care but still went home feeling awful. It wasn't until days later at home after taking CBD oil at the recommendation of her son that J finally got better. In fact the morning after taking CBD oil, J was finally back on her feet and was quite shocked at how quickly she felt better.

I'm not sharing this story to say CBD oil is what did the trick, even though they're convinced it did. J battled this for 3 weeks, she may finally have gotten better simply due to time or by distancing herself from ineffective treatments. I'm relaying this story because I've always been convinced this ran rampant in various parts of this country long before March. It's never made any sense to have the doomsday numbers sharers tell us how many cases we're set to see going forward because of how contagious this virus is, yet somehow not account for how many cases we would've had here if this first appeared in China in November. It can't be this insanely contagious and then not arrive here by December.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying there's not plenty of danger of future spread. I'm saying there's a very good chance that many places have already had their unaccounted spread, as the Stanford study suggests. And with that, it means our numbers fueling current decisions are way, way off. They'd be way off about how many have had this. They'd be way off about how deadly the virus is. And they'd be way off about the projected danger going forward. And this story is a small piece of insight of how just because something didn't make the news in January, it doesn't mean the problem didn't exist. It appears as though in Las Vegas, coronavirus may well have overrun hospitals in January. But since it was assumed to be a surge in the flu, it just didn't spark a news story.

Antibody testing and creative mass testing like analyzing sewage to show just how widespread this already has been can't come soon enough.

 
It's somewhat sad that it took articles and studies like these to come out for me to feel comfortable sharing the story I'm about to, but it seems like the right time. This is an account from a recent pair of clients of mine so there's no link to share. Just passing along what they told me earlier this week...

I helped an older couple (W and J) from Washington buy a house here in Las Vegas at the end of this past August. I called them this week to caution them about forbearances being offered by lenders and their less publicized downsides. I didn't think they'd be in a position to need a forbearance, and thankfully it turns out they didn't. It was a good way to catch up with a recent client no less. Of course the conversation quickly turned to coronavirus and I asked how both of them were doing. Both are well now but that wasn't the case for the Mrs in January.

Turns out J was very sick in January with tremendous difficulty breathing. She never felt like she could get a deep breath, and at its worst she didn't seem to be able to get a breath at all. Said she felt like her lungs were full. Over the course of 3 weeks, W drove J to 4  different hospital emergency rooms. None could help her as their typical treatments failed. She continually tested negative for both the flu and pneumonia. The obvious leap is to assume coronavirus but what really opened my eyes was W's account of their experience at hospital #3. When they arrived, the emergency room was so full that they were treating people in the waiting area. Mind you this was the 3rd week of January. No news stories that I can recall about Las Vegas hospitals being overwhelmed at that time. I have no reason not to believe him, it simply didn't make the news and I think there's a perfectly good explanation for it. Hospitals do see waves and spikes in the winter months every few years in particularly bad flu seasons. And that's exactly what that hospital told W and J they thought they had on their hands.

After some basic temperature taking in the waiting room, a nurse came to W and J and told them they finally had space in a treatment room. As they were being led to said room, W recalled to me how the hall was littered with beds and patients propped in the upright position on machines helping them with their breathing. It didn't make sense to W or J that the hospital thought they all these cases of the flu, when they were encountering so many people with breathing issues. Nonetheless, patients were indicating breathing troubles so the doctors and nurses were trying to provide the assistance the situation required. When they reached the room where J was to be treated for her breathing troubles, they found a room with 9 other patients all hooked to breathing apparatuses. Apparently there were numerous rooms like this populated 10 per room. The nurse told them that the average amount of time spent on these machines for the people who were put on them was 48 hours. That's when W and J opted to again try and battle whatever J had at home.

When the time came for emergency room visit #4 at hospital #4, J finally got quicker, better care but still went home feeling awful. It wasn't until days later at home after taking CBD oil at the recommendation of her son that J finally got better. In fact the morning after taking CBD oil, J was finally back on her feet and was quite shocked at how quickly she felt better.

I'm not sharing this story to say CBD oil is what did the trick, even though they're convinced it did. J battled this for 3 weeks, she may finally have gotten better simply due to time or by distancing herself from ineffective treatments. I'm relaying this story because I've always been convinced this ran rampant in various parts of this country long before March. It's never made any sense to have the doomsday numbers sharers tell us how many cases we're set to see going forward because of how contagious this virus is, yet somehow not account for how many cases we would've had here if this first appeared in China in November. It can't be this insanely contagious and then not arrive here by December.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying there's not plenty of danger of future spread. I'm saying there's a very good chance that many places have already had their unaccounted spread, as the Stanford study suggests. And with that, it means our numbers fueling current decisions are way, way off. They'd be way off about how many have had this. They'd be way off about how deadly the virus is. And they'd be way off about the projected danger going forward. And this story is a small piece of insight of how just because something didn't make the news in January, it doesn't mean the problem didn't exist. It appears as though in Las Vegas, coronavirus may well have overrun hospitals in January. But since it was assumed to be a surge in the flu, it just didn't spark a news story.

Antibody testing and creative mass testing like analyzing sewage to show just how widespread this already has been can't come soon enough.
Where were all the bodies and packed icus in January and February?

 
Where were all the bodies and packed icus in January and February?
If the death rate, turns out to be well below 1%, then sure Las Vegas hospitals would have seen more deaths than usual but they sound like they were being chalked up a flu deaths. Remember, in the 2017-2018 flu season the US saw 60,000 flu deaths at a time when 40,000 is a high number. Was that 17-18' flu season any more than a 5 minute occasion segment on the nightly news? When that was brought up probably 200 pages ago, we were all reminded how long the flu season lasts. Well, now it's beginning to sound like coronavirus has been around a lot longer than anyone is so far willing to admit.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
There would have been mutliple news stories if a Vegas hospital was treating patients in the waiting room and there would ventilators being used in hallways. 

 
It's great if you like being told there's no hope and things will NEVER be normal again. Or if you like being shot down when presenting anything remotely positive. 
In a way, things won't actually be normal. This disease is now officially a part of the new reality, whether we want it or not. Also, positive stuff is more than welcome, however, if it flies in the face if everything we know scientifically about this virus, what does it accomplish? 

 
There would have been mutliple news stories if a Vegas hospital was treating patients in the waiting room and there would ventilators being used in hallways. 
They weren't ventilators for one. And second, the hospital thought it was the flu. It's not unheard of for hospitals to be overrun in waves during particularly bad flu seasons. And that's what the nurse told my clients they thought this was. Thus no news story. 

If coronavirus has been scattered about the US since at least December, and we sit here in April, then the numbers aren't so world ending are they? When a bad flu season takes out 40,000 and a really bad one takes out 60,000 but it's spread over 5-6 months, then hospitals have busy nights and weeks but manage to keep up for the most part.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Don't feel guilty.  You are helping someone else make ends meet.

My 23 yr old got laid off when the coffee shop he worked at closed a couple weeks before things got bad.  He's doing a heck of a job hustling w/ instacart, door dash, etc.  He's young, healthy, and has no comorbidities.  The risk is fairly low for him.
How does he get paid?  I saw the tip feature, of course, but beyond the tip are they paid by delivery?  by the order amount? or just working for tips?

 
You know the answer isn't "see you in July".  Why?  What evidence are you basing this on?
No evidence whatsoever.  Native wit.

I suspect that a shutdown, at current intensity, from March into July puts 25% of the population into unemployment.  Real unemployment, where those jobs are plain gone.  Economy and money so locked up a restart is impossible.  Now you have liquidity, credit and solvency problems throughout the global economic system.  Great depression time - years to recover.

This has been debated to death and I'm adding nothing original, so I'll shut my pie hole.  Everyone is going to have to compromise, obviously.

 
From the Stanford doctor heading the research attempting to show that the virus has been around longer than anticipated, is and has been far more widespread, and therefore with a much lower fatality rate than speculated. In this article he's trying to re-establish the fact that this virus is primarily a risk for older people...

Stanford University immunologist John Ioannidis calls out media for panicking the public over COVID-19

As an example, he cited a World Health Organization estimate in March that the case-fatality rate was 3.4 percent.

That was based on the number of confirmed COVID-19 deaths being divided by the number of confirmed positive test results.

Ioannidis questioned the accuracy of the WHO estimate, based on a variety of reasons.

He noted that the fatality rate was much lower on the Diamond Princess cruise ship, where 19 percent of passengers were infected.

"Among those who were infected, as of now, one percent had died," Ioannidis said. "One percent is a figure that pertains to a population of mostly elderly people.

"The mean age of the passengers and crew was 58 years old and the median, I believe, was close to 65," he continued. "And we know now that there is a very strong age gradient. People who are older have a higher risk. People who are young have a much lower risk."

Based on this data, Ioannidis estimated that in a country like the United States, the fatality rate from COVID-19 would more likely be between 0.05 to one percent of those infected.


"As we discussed, many of the features of this pandemic, of course, are serious," he emphasized. "But I think that the estimates are exaggerated. And I think that there is a risk of really making some fundamental decisions about the structure of our civilization, of our society, of our future, that may not be appropriate."


What went wrong in Italy?

First is demographics: Italy has the oldest population in Europe. The average age of death from COVID-19 in Italy is 81.

"Also, most of these people have lots of other underlying diseases," Ioannidis said in the video. "Italy is a country with a very strong history of smoking."It has very high rates, therefore, of chronic obstructive pulmonary disease. It has very high rates of coronary heart disease. And these are very strong risk factors for having a bad outcome in this infection."

Next, he noted that Italy has a "relatively low number" of intensive-care beds per population, only about one-third per population of the number in the United States. The Italian health-care system runs at near full capacity in most winters. According to Ioannidis, this means that if a little bit more capacity is added, "it can very easily collapse."


Ioannidis said about 60 million people die per year on Earth. But COVID-19 may be the only disease that has a website meter counting every single fatality. And he believes that's fuelling the public's alarm. He also worries that those with financial or other conflicts of interest may try to exploit this situation and "kind of take over the entire agenda", which could put many more lives at risk.

 
I just placed my first Instacart order.  Delivery to happen on Tuesday.  Immediately after ordering I started to feel guilty.  While I may not be exposing myself, I am essentially asking someone else to take the risk for me.  Hmmm...
My wife delivers for Shipt.  She knows the risks and takes major precautions.  I wouldn’t worry about your delivery person, they will be doing it regardless of whether you order.  The less people that are out at grocery stores, the better

As an example, my wife delivered 12 orders yesterday.  That’s 12 people (and perhaps more if they have kids) that weren’t out in the public mixing with others.  Instead it was just 1.

Now there does exist a threat that your delivery person could leave the virus on your belongings, so take whatever precautions you deem appropriate along those lines.  

 
Now Gov. Cuomo says that no decision has been made on NYC schools. Said the closing is the mayor’s opinion. Not sure what the deal is. 
One answer I’ve heard to the question surrounding schools and why they haven’t made the decision to close for the year already is, they’re afraid kids will just give up on their online learning once school is cancelled. It’s kind of like how the government is stringing us along. Instead of saying, we’re closing everything for 2 months, they do it in increments. We’re closed for 15 days. The 15 days runs out, take 15 more. I think most districts understand they’re not going back this year, I’d imagine they’re trying not to let the cat out of the bag early April. 

 
Last edited by a moderator:
If someone thinks the have coronavirus, and wants to give CBD oil a shot, have at it. I don't think it can hurt.
i realize how stupid this sounds, but i take 10/10 thc/cbd oil daily, as well as vaporize (not smoke, also not the "vape" you think of) cannabis every night per my prescription.

and i have asked myself on many occassions... "i wonder if this could help/cure this disease"

i realize the answer is VERY likely a no... but in times like this id hope EVERYTHING is being looked at. 

 
In a way, things won't actually be normal. This disease is now officially a part of the new reality, whether we want it or not. Also, positive stuff is more than welcome, however, if it flies in the face if everything we know scientifically about this virus, what does it accomplish? 
The bolded is part of the problem though.  I have been lurking in this thread from the beginning and look back at the "facts" some were claiming we knew scientifically and were wrong. 

We don't know enough and that is the main part of the problem.  We have spent pages on the numbers and most have come to the conclusion individually as to what numbers are most important: deaths, hospitalizations, positives, tests per 1 Million people, etc.  and we have all I believe realized these numbers are all significantly flawed by the way they are being reported.  Each country and in our case each state are reporting things differently...we are seeing more and more indications of an large increase in deaths at home in the hardest hit areas (NY) and none of them are being labeled as COVID deaths.  Are they?  Don't know and again that is the problem.

The last thing I am going to point out is this article describes one of stories early in January out of Washington where there was strong evidence they were finding indications COVID was present prior to the outbreak at the nursing home and told to stop testing.  https://komonews.com/news/coronavirus/seattle-flu-study-allegedly-tested-samples-for-covid-19-against-federal-state-guidelines

Do we really know this has not been here longer than we think (maybe it was an earlier/weaker strain) and it was misdiagnosed as the flu until the nursing home deaths?  Remember the first two deaths at the nursing home were labeled as pneumonia  and had to be tested in autopsy to verify they were in fact infected with COVID,

 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top