SuperJohn96
RPS World Champion
Not one mention of Jacob beating Ricardo like a rented mule?
He beat the hell out of him there for a minute.
He beat the hell out of him there for a minute.
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*** Official Lost Season 6 *** (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter Twilight
- Start date
SmoovySmoov
The Way of the Samurai
That was my thought at first, too............but then I decided that the ship was out there during the day while Jacob and MIB had their talk, and then Jacob could have brought them in after that. I don't know if that means he can create storms or what. Just saying I noticed the same thing, but could suspend disbelief on that one.
Harry Manback
Footballguy
I mentioned that I loved this badass Jacob.Too bad he's dead.
IDrinkyourMilkshake
Footballguy
I kinda like this idea. But I think its more likely to be Jack and Locke.
Harry Manback
Footballguy
You mean NotLocke.
IDrinkyourMilkshake
Footballguy
I mean UnLocke.
Harry Manback
Footballguy
Or maybe pseudo-Locke?
My memory forgets, but Ben only believed he is protecting the island b/c he made that up in his mind. Jacob never spoke to him at all. He was only the islands leader in his own mind. Maybe I'm rambling here but.....With that, perhaps Widmore and linus are exactly the same......they aren't special at all....they just think they are (or want to be). Charles "broke the rules" by killing Alex....but in fact, those were only the rules that Ben and Charles made up.We know that Jacob and MIB have actual rules that "work" (so to speak) - i.e. it took Ben to kill Jacob.
SuperJohn96
RPS World Champion
Norwood.
Darth Cheney
Footballguy
Didn't Jacob speak to him in the cabin? ( or Smokey...cause in the one epsiode where Locke and him went to the cabin....they flashed an image of a guy who looked like Smokey).
If there was nothing special about ben, there's no reason it had to be him to kill Jacob. We've already seen this with Flocke trying to have Richard kill Jacob. It doesn't need to be a special person to do the deed, but Jacob is pretty good at protecting himself. With Ben, wasn't there a quote from Jacob that he was "hoping I was right about you"? He didn't defend himself against Ben because he thought Ben would prove him right in his little contest with Flocke, that humanity doesn't have to act selfishly all the time. Jacob gave Ben the opportunity to prove Jacob's theory right and Ben failed.
beer 30
Footballguy
Maybe his 1st cousin Lead Pipe will make a cameo?
Darth Cheney
Footballguy
Not completely yet....because Ben seems to be awake in regards to his manipulations AND his past episode shows that in his heart, he isn't the cold hearted, manipulative, bastich that island made him. I
Bill Brasky
Footballguy
I like this theory, it makes sense with some other loose ends. it could explain why the Others were trying to fix the baby issue; perhaps they were being guided by FLocke so that he would have a "body" to get off the island with. also, it could explain why that prophet guy that Claire goes to see in the very beginning is so terrified of Aaron if he sees "evil" using his body as a vessel to get off the island in the future.
kaa
Footballguy
I didn't care for that episode because it didn't really reveal much. Its already been strongly hinted at that Richard Alpert arrived on the island in chains on the ship, and that he was made immortal by being touched by Jacob. So seeing it was nothing new. Unfortunately they wasted about 20 minutes showing us what we already knew. We also already new Jacob and the MiB were warring with each other like gods. We already understood the mechanic that Jacob was the island guardian acting as MiB's jailor, so calling the island a "cork" was no revelation at all. So the interaction between Jacob and MiB didn't tell us anything at all.
The only answer I guess we got was that Alpert will ally against MiB because Isabella wishes it.
The best scene to me was when Jacob attacked Alpert. As he dunked him in the water, it made me think of a baptism. Like Jacob is baptizing Alpert into his new Church of the Island.
The only answer I guess we got was that Alpert will ally against MiB because Isabella wishes it.
The best scene to me was when Jacob attacked Alpert. As he dunked him in the water, it made me think of a baptism. Like Jacob is baptizing Alpert into his new Church of the Island.
David Yudkin
Footballguy
I'm not sure we know this as fact, only that of the Oceanic flight group this is true. Who knows over time if that would still hold true. IIRC. the only caveat was that kids couldn't be both conceived and born on the island.As for Richard, do we collectively still think he can't be killed while on the isalnd, or did that go bye bye with Jacob getting killed? If not, he would be the clear choice to kill not Locke/MIB.
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Don't we know that it isn't true? Rousseau was preggers when she landed on the island and had a kid there. The others then snagged her and raised her as their own.
David Yudkin
Footballguy
Has smokey only taken the form of dead people throughout the show? Does anyone him taking the form of someone still alive?Also, if taken as fact, didn't they say that MIB could no longer take the form of anyone other than Locke? Did they ever explain that, or do we assume that it's because Jacob was killed?
David Yudkin
Footballguy
I believe that we are saying the same think. Kids could be conceived off of but born on the island and kids could be conceived on but birthed off the island. But IIRC kids could not be conceived on and birthed on the island.
kaa
Footballguy
On the blast door map, it marks the Black Rock shipwreck. But the description on the blast door reads: "Known final resting place of Magnus Hanso / Black Rock".
And now we saw that Magnus Hanso did die in the wreck. But how would the person who drew the blast door map know Magnus Hanso died there? That's really weird.
And now we saw that Magnus Hanso did die in the wreck. But how would the person who drew the blast door map know Magnus Hanso died there? That's really weird.
I was just pointing out that stat's claim that aaron is special because he was born on the isalnd is a bit of a misnomer. Alex was also born on the island and she's now wormfood.
Darth Cheney
Footballguy
I'm pretty sure he took the form of Alpert, when Alpert ran into a young Ben in the jungle.
Bill Brasky
Footballguy
I thought fLocke has mentioned that he used to have a body and it was taken from him and now he needs a new one to leave the island. I forgot about the whole Rousseau/Alex thing so I guess Aaron wouldn't be totally unique.I don't think they explained taking form thing.
It was made for us to believe that Jacob spoke to him, but he later admitted that Jacob had never actually spoken to him (hence the surprise on Ben's face when Locke said Jacob spoke to him)
It seemed a little ironic also. Jacob being the champion of good in people attacks Alpert unprovoked.
I don't think it had to be Ben. Ben was just the easiest for unLocke to manipulate. I think the quote from Jacob re: Ben was referring to the fact that he hoped Ben was a "good person"
Which is another potential challenge as in the sideways, he's not born on the island. If the two times ever converge this would create a paradox (another paradox).
Darth Cheney
Footballguy
But he knew of Jacob.....and as the viewer we do see that Locke saw someone else in the cabin. So someone was there. But why would Ben even go to the cabin if he wasn't conversing with Jacob?
SmoovySmoov
The Way of the Samurai
Thought that was a slave he was rooting, but I could be wrong.
Phurfur
Footballguy
He was one of the salves that was killed after the ship wreck.
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Sack-Religious
Footballguy
IMO, it could be one of two things:1) It was shtick to get people to believe he was conversing with someone2) Because he believed he was conversing with Jacob when it was actually Smokey
Sack-Religious
Footballguy
He might have as "Sawyer's boar" a couple season's ago (but it hasn't been proven one way or the other), but last night was likely just a wild pig eating a dead slave.
Sack-Religious
Footballguy
It's possible he took the form of Walt back in Season 1/2, but it hasn't been proven.AFAIK, why MiB can't take another form hasn't been explained, yet.
Sack-Religious
Footballguy
Off the top of my head:Ben, Locke, Eko and Richard.
Sack-Religious
Footballguy
If he's immortal, it would certainly make sense. Isabella also told him that killing MiB is his mission.
Tusken Raider
Footballguy
First off, Nestor Carbonell = 
This was my favorite episode since the finale of Season 3.
Haven't seen this discussed yet, but it caught my attention. Richard's story begins in the Canary Islands, which is a Spanish Autonomous Community off the coast of Morocco. The ship he's on leaves to go to the New World. From this I deduce that the Black Rock is crossing the Atlantic.
Pretty much everything we've learned about the island's location is that in 2004, it was in the Pacific. We also know that the island can "move" when needed.
So, was the island at one point in the Atlantic, at the time the Black Rock crashed on it? This would help explain the Egyptian lore on the island (closer to Africa & Egypt). Or was the Black Rock on the way to the New World by circumnavigating Africa & going through the Pacific. Maybe it fell victim to the "1000 miles off course" syndrome as Oceanic 815.
At this point, who knows.
This was my favorite episode since the finale of Season 3.Haven't seen this discussed yet, but it caught my attention. Richard's story begins in the Canary Islands, which is a Spanish Autonomous Community off the coast of Morocco. The ship he's on leaves to go to the New World. From this I deduce that the Black Rock is crossing the Atlantic.
Pretty much everything we've learned about the island's location is that in 2004, it was in the Pacific. We also know that the island can "move" when needed.
So, was the island at one point in the Atlantic, at the time the Black Rock crashed on it? This would help explain the Egyptian lore on the island (closer to Africa & Egypt). Or was the Black Rock on the way to the New World by circumnavigating Africa & going through the Pacific. Maybe it fell victim to the "1000 miles off course" syndrome as Oceanic 815.
At this point, who knows.
Harry Manback
Footballguy
Good point, interesting too.First off, Nestor Carbonell =This was my favorite episode since the finale of Season 3. Haven't seen this discussed yet, but it caught my attention. Richard's story begins in the Canary Islands, which is a Spanish Autonomous Community off the coast of Morocco. The ship he's on leaves to go to the New World. From this I deduce that the Black Rock is crossing the Atlantic.Pretty much everything we've learned about the island's location is that in 2004, it was in the Pacific. We also know that the island can "move" when needed. So, was the island at one point in the Atlantic, at the time the Black Rock crashed on it? This would help explain the Egyptian lore on the island (closer to Africa & Egypt). Or was the Black Rock on the way to the New World by circumnavigating Africa & going through the Pacific. Maybe it fell victim to the "1000 miles off course" syndrome as Oceanic 815. At this point, who knows.
Sundays Rule
Footballguy
Still wondering where all the ghosts come from.
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dead people...What kind of answer are you looking for, that they arrived on the sub during one of Dharma's recruiting drives?
Dr. No
Footballguy
Maybe I don't get it... but I still don't understand the entire "loophole" premise whereby the MiB has to turn into Locke.
Does MiB die at some point and have to be resurrected as Locke?
When Ben and his group and doing everything they can to preserve locke and then put him into the coffin on the Ajira flight do they realize they are reincarnating the MiB?
Does Ben even realize what is actually going on?
Last night's episode wasn't that bad, but Richard's back story took WAY too long.
I guess we'll get a MiB/Jacob type of back story at some point to fill in some story gaps.. but I just really need to know WTF is going on with him having to merge into locke.
Does MiB die at some point and have to be resurrected as Locke?
When Ben and his group and doing everything they can to preserve locke and then put him into the coffin on the Ajira flight do they realize they are reincarnating the MiB?
Does Ben even realize what is actually going on?
Last night's episode wasn't that bad, but Richard's back story took WAY too long.
I guess we'll get a MiB/Jacob type of back story at some point to fill in some story gaps.. but I just really need to know WTF is going on with him having to merge into locke.
I'm not defending it as logical but the only thing that makes sense to me is the Locke appearance provides him some familiarity to most - maybe an implied trust.If your point is that it falls apart under scrutiny, I agree. I am not sure why he waited until that point to make his power play. You would have thought he would be making that play all along. He took Locke's body before Jacob was killed - so I am not sure what the event was that triggered his greater role.
Harry Manback
Footballguy
I think the loophole is that he can't kill him himself, but he can get someone else to.By taking on the body of lock, he gained the legitimacy he needed to garner trust from Ben to go through with it.
Harry Manback
Footballguy
And I don't think it really HAD to be Locke, but rather Locke was the most logical choice, as the flight needed to be as close to the same as it was when the first crashed, and he just so happened to be a vessel MIB could use.
Or, maybe Farraday's mother knew all along that MIB could take over Lockes body, and that was the sole reason for her insistance they all go, they all didn't really need to go, but if she said they did, it explained away why they had to bring a dead body.
Or, maybe Farraday's mother knew all along that MIB could take over Lockes body, and that was the sole reason for her insistance they all go, they all didn't really need to go, but if she said they did, it explained away why they had to bring a dead body.
Sundays Rule
Footballguy
How are they manifesting, is it in the very nature of the island? Is it Jacob, MIB? A combination of all three?
Dr. No
Footballguy
I don't have a problem with MiB morphing into Locke - it's weird, but that's fine.I just want to know how Ben's group and the Others are associated with MiB.Did no one including Eloise have any idea this was going to happen if they did this?I don't see how Ben isn't associated with MiB somehow... i mean, in that one episode when Keamy's group was on the island, he went in and unleashed a switch that let the smoke monster out to wipe those dudes out.So they're like friends and stuff, right?My head hurts. I'm still not sure if this is completely dumb or potentially interesting.
