*** Official Michael Turner 2007 offseason thread *** (1 Viewer)

[Maurile Tremblay]

(Never mind. It seems to have been posted before the start of the draft.)

[Deleted]

 

[grind]

Michael Turner to the Browns in 2008 free agency.

Houston will be all over Turner next year also ...

I would assume DEN would be also. All the more reason to franchise him.

Why would the chargers want to pay $7.5M for Mike Turner to backup LT for one year?

They could franchise him with the intention of trading him no?

If no one gave up a 1st and 3rd this year, what makes you think they will next year. AJ has said Turner is worth a 1st and 3rd. I'm sure he wouldn't backpeddle.

 

[yellowdog]

I think the Titans and Chargers spent too much time working on this trade instead of preparing for the draft. at Craig Davis, Eric Weddle, and Chris Henry.

Maybe Atlanta is the mystery team offering a 2008 1st.

 

[zamboni]

As an LT/Turner owner, I'm obviously disappointed that Turner wasn't moved. I do think that AJ got a bit too greedy if he wasn't willing to take a 1st next year (in a presumably better draft), but I also recognize his need to insure that they'd have MT in case something happened to LT.

It's easy for us to say "why don't they just get someone in the 2nd or 3rd rounds?", but based upon the guys that actually went there, one must assume that AJ didn't see anyone in those rounds that could adequately replace MT as insurance. AJ obviously thinks VERY highly of Turner not to take a 1st for him, and we, as armchair fantasy players, need to accept that coming from one of the best GMs in the biz.

Bottom fantasy line: if you own LT and Turner, there should be some solace knowing that you don't have to sweat too much if the unthinkable happens and LT gets hurt. If you just own Turner, unless his value declines this time next year, he'll get his payday next year.

I think we can now put this thread on hiatus until after the season ends.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

It is easy to claim now that you believe Turner will have an impact. A select few of us on this board we're beating the drum LAST YEAR and had predicted he would be traded as an RFA. Those owners who listened got Turner at a fairly reasonable price through trade or last year's draft (keeper or dynasty). Now the hype machine has kicked in and it is too late unless you're swimming in a league with a pool of guppies.

At this point, anybody who is still claiming Turner won't be a stud is deluded and should hand over their footballguys decoder ring and Blackeyed Joe tee shirt. Membership does have its privileges.

I don't think Turner will be a stud in 2007. Who do I need to see to turn in my decoder ring?

 

[-OZ-]

As an LT/Turner owner, I'm obviously disappointed that Turner wasn't moved. I do think that AJ got a bit too greedy if he wasn't willing to take a 1st next year (in a presumably better draft), but I also recognize his need to insure that they'd have MT in case something happened to LT.

It's easy for us to say "why don't they just get someone in the 2nd or 3rd rounds?", but based upon the guys that actually went there, one must assume that AJ didn't see anyone in those rounds that could adequately replace MT as insurance. AJ obviously thinks VERY highly of Turner not to take a 1st for him, and we, as armchair fantasy players, need to accept that coming from one of the best GMs in the biz.

Bottom fantasy line: if you own LT and Turner, there should be some solace knowing that you don't have to sweat too much if the unthinkable happens and LT gets hurt. If you just own Turner, unless his value declines this time next year, he'll get his payday next year.

I think we can now put this thread on hiatus until after the season ends.

There would still be a fall off, but you're right. I don't know, but I would have thought Turner for a 08 1st and Michael Bush or Pittman instead of Anthony Waters would have made sense.

As a LT/Turner owner, I don't mind that he remains a Charger. But then, I get to start Hines Ward during my RBs bye weeks.

As I traded Turner for Lee Evans in another league, I'm thrilled with that deal right now.

 

[el-gato-grande]

It is easy to claim now that you believe Turner will have an impact. A select few of us on this board we're beating the drum LAST YEAR and had predicted he would be traded as an RFA. Those owners who listened got Turner at a fairly reasonable price through trade or last year's draft (keeper or dynasty). Now the hype machine has kicked in and it is too late unless you're swimming in a league with a pool of guppies.

At this point, anybody who is still claiming Turner won't be a stud is deluded and should hand over their footballguys decoder ring and Blackeyed Joe tee shirt. Membership does have its privileges.

I don't think Turner will be a stud in 2007. Who do I need to see to turn in my decoder ring?

I'll take it and add it to my collection. Dumb luck does not a player evaluator make. The Chargers should have traded Turner for the 2008 1st round pick, but the rest of us can't account for poor decisions by an NFL team's front office. You play the percentages.Bottom line - MT owners (myself included) might have to wait for another year - just like Priest Holmes owners did when he was in Baltimore racking up the same impressive numbers in a limited role there. Anybody who hasn't made a move for MT in dynasty will still have to pay a small ransom for him now that the genie is out of the bottle. In fact, if anything, it will be harder to pry him away from LT owners who know they will definately get value for him next year, but still get the benefit of having a viable RB1 backup if LT get's hurt this year.

 

[Obie Wan]

Lots a bitter fantasy football owners in here that seem to forget a draft pick next year doesnt help the Chargers quest for a title this year

Huh? A 1st next year seemed to help the Browns this year in the acquisition of Brady Quinn? Please explain this one for me. Thanks.

Sure The Browns did not weaken their current team by trading a future first rounder for Quinn.The Chargers trading Turner for a future first rounder does.

Turner is a backup RB. That is what he is for the Chargers. I'd say Gates means a hell of a lot to the Chargers team. Would the Chargers not trade their backup TE for a 1st either? This failure by AJ is comical. Turner, as it relates to the San Diego Chargers, could have been replaced with a 4th round pick this year (Pittman???). He is a backup for the Chargers. Not a starter. I think people forgot this.

I should add that I don't think the Chargers should have just given Turner away just because he is a backup for them. The fact is, they were offered a 1st round pick. In the NFL, that is a ton. Marshall Faulk could only get the Colts a 2nd and 5th. S. Alexander and Edge could even get a 2nd round pick. This is just flat out funny. AJ must have read too many press clippings after the Eli trade he worked out. He failed miserably today.

but he did reach big time for a WR in the 1st round while spending his time trying to salvage the Turner dealv

 

[bo100]

Anyway AJ can franchise tag MT and do a sign and trade with a crappie team like Arizona so that he can screw over Turner even more then he already has?

this move, if the chargers had the balls to do it would backfire i belive, i could be mistaken but i dont belive the franchise tag has ever been used on a backup at any position in the nfl. the tag would also guarantee MT about 8mill for the 08 season, so if aj is going to do this just to trade him to a crappy team, MT and bus cook are going to want thier 8 mill for 08 in any trade deal with another team and why wouldn't they? the chargers could get stuck with an 8 million dollar backup, this would make no since and thats why the franchise tag would only be used on LT not MT.......

 

[Tau837]

Why are charger fans pissy?According the talk around here, he's an elite RB. For 2007 your team is stronger with Turner, then some rookie. Chargers are trying to win the SB. Imagine how deadly a Turner/LT backfield will be.

As far as I can tell, everyone who is pissy about a deal not getting done is a non-Charger fan.

 

[PadresLakers]

Lots a bitter fantasy football owners in here that seem to forget a draft pick next year doesnt help the Chargers quest for a title this year

Huh? A 1st next year seemed to help the Browns this year in the acquisition of Brady Quinn? Please explain this one for me. Thanks.

Sure The Browns did not weaken their current team by trading a future first rounder for Quinn.The Chargers trading Turner for a future first rounder does.

Turner is a backup RB. That is what he is for the Chargers. I'd say Gates means a hell of a lot to the Chargers team. Would the Chargers not trade their backup TE for a 1st either? This failure by AJ is comical. Turner, as it relates to the San Diego Chargers, could have been replaced with a 4th round pick this year (Pittman???). He is a backup for the Chargers. Not a starter. I think people forgot this.

I should add that I don't think the Chargers should have just given Turner away just because he is a backup for them. The fact is, they were offered a 1st round pick. In the NFL, that is a ton. Marshall Faulk could only get the Colts a 2nd and 5th. S. Alexander and Edge could even get a 2nd round pick. This is just flat out funny. AJ must have read too many press clippings after the Eli trade he worked out. He failed miserably today.

but he did reach big time for a WR in the 1st round while spending his time trying to salvage the Turner dealv

Yep reminded me of when they "reached" on Marcus Mcneil over Winston Justice

 

[falconsfan7]

CLICK CLACK

Sorry...couldn't resist.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

The Chargers should have traded Turner for the 2008 1st round pick, but the rest of us can't account for poor decisions by an NFL team's front office.

 

[enfuego]

bitterburnerturnerowner"click"

The the real person that should be pissed about this trade NOT happening is Michael Turner...Imagine the cash that he lost out on because of AJ's greedy demands?

 

[fruity pebbles]

bitterburnerturnerowner"click"

The the real person that should be pissed about this trade NOT happening is Michael Turner...Imagine the cash that he lost out on because of AJ's greedy demands?

That's what I was thinking. I wouldn't be happy at all if I were him. Especially if the 14 million guaranteed from the Titans is true.

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

Why are charger fans pissy?According the talk around here, he's an elite RB. For 2007 your team is stronger with Turner, then some rookie. Chargers are trying to win the SB. Imagine how deadly a Turner/LT backfield will be.

As far as I can tell, everyone who is pissy about a deal not getting done is a non-Charger fan.

Im pretty sure they should have moved him this draft. And I dont like the first two draft moves either.But I've learned that AJ is smarter then me. So I'll live with it.

 

[grind]

bitterburnerturnerowner"click"

The the real person that should be pissed about this trade NOT happening is Michael Turner...Imagine the cash that he lost out on because of AJ's greedy demands?

That's what I was thinking. I wouldn't be happy at all if I were him. Especially if the 14 million guaranteed from the Titans is true.

Yeah, I'm sure he is mad, but he'll get his money. I'm pretty sure the 30 to 40 carries he gets this entire year isn't much of an injury risk. He'll have plenty fresh legs after this year. Fact is, Norv Turner doesn't use the RBBC. He features one back and one back only, unless of course all the backs on the roster suck, which isn't the case.

 

[Tom Baker]

"I'm pretty sure the 30 to 40 carries he gets this entire year isn't much of an injury risk."

Every carry is an injury risk.

 

[bumpman]

"I'm pretty sure the 30 to 40 carries he gets this entire year isn't much of an injury risk."Every carry is an injury risk.

Yes, but there are only 30-40 of them as opposed to 300. He will get paid next year.

 

[Ditkaless Wonders]

And thus are seeds of discontent sown.

 

[Despyzer]

Why are charger fans pissy?According the talk around here, he's an elite RB. For 2007 your team is stronger with Turner, then some rookie. Chargers are trying to win the SB. Imagine how deadly a Turner/LT backfield will be.

As far as I can tell, everyone who is pissy about a deal not getting done is a non-Charger fan.

Chargers fans are pretty happy to have such a quality KR/backup RB on the roster. Extra picks would have been nice, but the Chargers already had more picks than roster spots anyway.Tired of chasing LT all over the field? Good, we'll bring in Turner to beat the crap out of you.

 

[phthalatemagic]

I haven't been paying attention - is it over?

 

[BoltBacker]

Anyway AJ can franchise tag MT and do a sign and trade with a crappie team like Arizona so that he can screw over Turner even more then he already has?

this move, if the chargers had the balls to do it would backfire i belive, i could be mistaken but i dont belive the franchise tag has ever been used on a backup at any position in the nfl. the tag would also guarantee MT about 8mill for the 08 season, so if aj is going to do this just to trade him to a crappy team, MT and bus cook are going to want thier 8 mill for 08 in any trade deal with another team and why wouldn't they? the chargers could get stuck with an 8 million dollar backup, this would make no since and thats why the franchise tag would only be used on LT not MT.......

Has any team ever been $8mil under the salary cap when the season ended?

 

[RD1967]

bitterburnerturnerowner"click"

The the real person that should be pissed about this trade NOT happening is Michael Turner...Imagine the cash that he lost out on because of AJ's greedy demands?

That's what I was thinking. I wouldn't be happy at all if I were him. Especially if the 14 million guaranteed from the Titans is true.

Yeah, I'm sure he is mad, but he'll get his money. I'm pretty sure the 30 to 40 carries he gets this entire year isn't much of an injury risk. He'll have plenty fresh legs after this year. Fact is, Norv Turner doesn't use the RBBC. He features one back and one back only, unless of course all the backs on the roster suck, which isn't the case.

Hey I wanted him traded too, but Mike is a good Dude I doubt he's looking at that 2.5 Million tender and pissin in the wind about it.

 

[RD1967]

Why are charger fans pissy?According the talk around here, he's an elite RB. For 2007 your team is stronger with Turner, then some rookie. Chargers are trying to win the SB. Imagine how deadly a Turner/LT backfield will be.

As far as I can tell, everyone who is pissy about a deal not getting done is a non-Charger fan.

Dude your like a Genius, cause I dont know any Charger fans, But hey they went to the Super Bowl somtime after 1990, I remeber the "Stiff" game they played against My 49rs, ......................wait..............a.............minute...........I dont think they actually showed up for the game.Yeah thats right the 49rs were waiting on the field, some cheerleaders showed up wearing helmets with Bolts on them....... 49rs rode them like ponies then waited a little while longer, took the trophey and a Steve Young MVP award and left the building. Seriously, I bet the Niners make it back to the Super Bowl before dem Bolts do. I cant believe I just posted that!!!

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

Not trading him was dumb. If the rumors of a 1st/3rd Dallas are true.

 

[RD1967]

Not trading him was dumb. If the rumors of a 1st/3rd Dallas are true.

You know though Atlanta aint drafted a Power Back yet. I think we can continue to speculate for just a few more weeks, hmmmmmmmm.

 

[BoltBacker]

Not trading him was dumb. If the rumors of a 1st/3rd Dallas are true.

I hadn't heard those rumors. I'm not doubting you, but do you have a link to them? I'd like to read.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

Not trading him was dumb. If the rumors of a 1st/3rd Dallas are true.

I hadn't heard those rumors. I'm not doubting you, but do you have a link to them? I'd like to read.

Based on an article yesterday (I think in the Union-Trib, but it's hard to keep track), Dallas just offered to swap firsts with the Chargers, but they revoked the offer before the Chargers could reject it.

 

[BoltBacker]

Not trading him was dumb. If the rumors of a 1st/3rd Dallas are true.

I hadn't heard those rumors. I'm not doubting you, but do you have a link to them? I'd like to read.

Based on an article yesterday (I think in the Union-Trib, but it's hard to keep track), Dallas just offered to swap firsts with the Chargers, but they revoked the offer before the Chargers could reject it.

That's what I had assumed. Seems to me swapping first rounders(unless the first rounder is AWFULLY high) is a lot different than getting a first rounder. Maybe I'm alone in that thinking.

 

[thayman]

"I'm pretty sure the 30 to 40 carries he gets this entire year isn't much of an injury risk."Every carry is an injury risk.

Yes, but there are only 30-40 of them as opposed to 300. He will get paid next year.

bitterburnerturnerowner"click"

The the real person that should be pissed about this trade NOT happening is Michael Turner...Imagine the cash that he lost out on because of AJ's greedy demands?

That's what I was thinking. I wouldn't be happy at all if I were him. Especially if the 14 million guaranteed from the Titans is true.

Yeah, I'm sure he is mad, but he'll get his money. I'm pretty sure the 30 to 40 carries he gets this entire year isn't much of an injury risk. He'll have plenty fresh legs after this year. Fact is, Norv Turner doesn't use the RBBC. He features one back and one back only, unless of course all the backs on the roster suck, which isn't the case.

Hey I wanted him traded too, but Mike is a good Dude I doubt he's looking at that 2.5 Million tender and pissin in the wind about it.

That adds up to about $60K per carry.....I don't think he will be pissing and moaning too much.

 

[Tau837]

Why are charger fans pissy?According the talk around here, he's an elite RB. For 2007 your team is stronger with Turner, then some rookie. Chargers are trying to win the SB. Imagine how deadly a Turner/LT backfield will be.

As far as I can tell, everyone who is pissy about a deal not getting done is a non-Charger fan.

Dude your like a Genius, cause I dont know any Charger fans, But hey they went to the Super Bowl somtime after 1990, I remeber the "Stiff" game they played against My 49rs, ......................wait..............a.............minute...........I dont think they actually showed up for the game.Yeah thats right the 49rs were waiting on the field, some cheerleaders showed up wearing helmets with Bolts on them....... 49rs rode them like ponies then waited a little while longer, took the trophey and a Steve Young MVP award and left the building. Seriously, I bet the Niners make it back to the Super Bowl before dem Bolts do. I cant believe I just posted that!!!

If there was a :badposting: or :dumbposting: smiley, I'd use it here.

 

[Traders2001]

Not trading him was dumb. If the rumors of a 1st/3rd Dallas are true.

You know though Atlanta aint drafted a Power Back yet. I think we can continue to speculate for just a few more weeks, hmmmmmmmm.

Agreed . Cause between me and you they no NFL RB on their team at the moment ( They have Dunn but he is done and then they have Norwood for a few carries a game cant get more he will break in pieces ) so they actually need a RB to be a contender.

 

[enfuego]

bitterburnerturnerowner

"click"

The the real person that should be pissed about this trade NOT happening is Michael Turner...Imagine the cash that he lost out on because of AJ's greedy demands?

That's what I was thinking. I wouldn't be happy at all if I were him. Especially if the 14 million guaranteed from the Titans is true.

Yeah, I'm sure he is mad, but he'll get his money. I'm pretty sure the 30 to 40 carries he gets this entire year isn't much of an injury risk. He'll have plenty fresh legs after this year. Fact is, Norv Turner doesn't use the RBBC. He features one back and one back only, unless of course all the backs on the roster suck, which isn't the case.

Hey I wanted him traded too, but Mike is a good Dude I doubt he's looking at that 2.5 Million tender and pissin in the wind about it.

Let's take a look at what is and what could have been for Turner and his situation:

Currently = $2.5m salary and riding the pine

vs.

What could have been = MORE than doubling it for 4 to 5 years and 17m GUARANTEED

& walking into the starting gig (meaning endorsements on a local & national level, etc),

not to mention the fact that he won't be in contention for a Pro Bowl unless it's for special teams.

Yeah, you are right...I am confident that Turner is 100% OK with all of this just because AJ Smith is a greedy fool.

 

[RedZone]

There is a post in the Jerious Norwood sell high topic that the Falcons picked him up for 1st and 4th in 2008 posted at 3:40. I can't find anything to support and no link/source. NFL network hasn't said anything yet.

Don't know if early release or fishing? Can't remember the poster.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

There is a post in the Jerious Norwood sell high topic that the Falcons picked him up for 1st and 4th in 2008 posted at 3:40. I can't find anything to support and no link/source. NFL network hasn't said anything yet.Don't know if early release or fishing? Can't remember the poster.

I just deleted that post. It looked like a bad joke.

 

[-OZ-]

There is a post in the Jerious Norwood sell high topic that the Falcons picked him up for 1st and 4th in 2008 posted at 3:40. I can't find anything to support and no link/source. NFL network hasn't said anything yet.Don't know if early release or fishing? Can't remember the poster.

Keep hope alive.

 

[pinda]

I never understood why you guys just don't ban tools like that instead of deleting their posts.

The guy joins less than 3 weeks ago and pulls that off, guy doesn't deserve anything less than a ban.

 

[RedZone]

Thanks Maurile, after checking numerous news sources and falcons board with no confirmation, so I suspected it was smoke. Appreciate the fast response by FBG.

 

[RD1967]

There is a post in the Jerious Norwood sell high topic that the Falcons picked him up for 1st and 4th in 2008 posted at 3:40. I can't find anything to support and no link/source. NFL network hasn't said anything yet.Don't know if early release or fishing? Can't remember the poster.

Sorry that was me.. The talk on the Norwood is = to R.Bush was killing me I went to delete it and it was already Gone. Again sorry about that.

 

[fruity pebbles]

There is a post in the Jerious Norwood sell high topic that the Falcons picked him up for 1st and 4th in 2008 posted at 3:40. I can't find anything to support and no link/source. NFL network hasn't said anything yet.Don't know if early release or fishing? Can't remember the poster.

Sorry that was me..

ignore list

 

[pinda]

There is a post in the Jerious Norwood sell high topic that the Falcons picked him up for 1st and 4th in 2008 posted at 3:40. I can't find anything to support and no link/source. NFL network hasn't said anything yet.Don't know if early release or fishing? Can't remember the poster.

Sorry that was me.. The talk on the Norwood is = to R.Bush was killing me I went to delete it and it was already Gone. Again sorry about that.

Hey Rook, that kind of crap is ok on Yahoo leagues and ESPN boards, but watch what you post here. Won't last too long with that junk and you will lose credibility pretty fast.

 

[RD1967]

There is a post in the Jerious Norwood sell high topic that the Falcons picked him up for 1st and 4th in 2008 posted at 3:40. I can't find anything to support and no link/source. NFL network hasn't said anything yet.Don't know if early release or fishing? Can't remember the poster.

Sorry that was me.. The talk on the Norwood is = to R.Bush was killing me I went to delete it and it was already Gone. Again sorry about that.

Hey Rook, that kind of crap is ok on Yahoo leagues and ESPN boards, but watch what you post here. Won't last too long with that junk and you will lose credibility pretty fast.

Said I was sorry, but knock off the rook comments, I've been comming here to read the posts for many years, didnt have much interest in posting till late.Just gotta ask, this is the "Shark-Pool" right?, R you always so lame and uppity or you just like to talk tough, you get rattled that easy, I would love to have you over in my League.

 

[cowboy homer]

There is a post in the Jerious Norwood sell high topic that the Falcons picked him up for 1st and 4th in 2008 posted at 3:40. I can't find anything to support and no link/source. NFL network hasn't said anything yet.Don't know if early release or fishing? Can't remember the poster.

Sorry that was me.. The talk on the Norwood is = to R.Bush was killing me I went to delete it and it was already Gone. Again sorry about that.

Hey Rook, that kind of crap is ok on Yahoo leagues and ESPN boards, but watch what you post here. Won't last too long with that junk and you will lose credibility pretty fast.

Said I was sorry, but knock off the rook comments, I've been comming here to read the posts for many years, didnt have much interest in posting till late.Just gotta ask, this is the "Shark-Pool" right?, R you always so lame and uppity or you just like to talk tough, you get rattled that easy, I would love to have you over in my League.

Dont want to start rumors its just a thought and a hope being a turner owner, but how come the Falcons havent drafted a RB with there new power runnng game

 

[Buffalo0987]

Its possible i think but isn't this still good for Turner as LT could miss games this year? Norv Turner??? Maybe this is a good thing but man i wanted him to start this year.

Good point about Atlanta!!! What about CLE and NYG?

 

[cowboy homer]

Its possible i think but isn't this still good for Turner as LT could miss games this year? Norv Turner??? Maybe this is a good thing but man i wanted him to start this year.Good point about Atlanta!!! What about CLE and NYG?

LT can miss a few games but not good for turner. He wants to be a featured back. Cle has J. Lewis and I guess the Giants are happy with Jacobs. I just dont understand how ATL doesnt draft a RB.

 

[pinda]

There is a post in the Jerious Norwood sell high topic that the Falcons picked him up for 1st and 4th in 2008 posted at 3:40. I can't find anything to support and no link/source. NFL network hasn't said anything yet.Don't know if early release or fishing? Can't remember the poster.

Sorry that was me.. The talk on the Norwood is = to R.Bush was killing me I went to delete it and it was already Gone. Again sorry about that.

Hey Rook, that kind of crap is ok on Yahoo leagues and ESPN boards, but watch what you post here. Won't last too long with that junk and you will lose credibility pretty fast.

Said I was sorry, but knock off the rook comments, I've been comming here to read the posts for many years, didnt have much interest in posting till late.Just gotta ask, this is the "Shark-Pool" right?, R you always so lame and uppity or you just like to talk tough, you get rattled that easy, I would love to have you over in my League.

you posted a false trade, keep doing that and see how much people accept it. Yes this is a shark pool, most of us don't have to sink to such low tactics in the hopes that the guy who has Norwood in your league reads your b.s. and trades him to you. did you think it was deleted just for the heck of itif as you state, you've been around here a while, you would know that......grow up dude........no need to battle here, you have no credibility Rook.

 

[phthalatemagic]

I would love to have you over in my League.

I never get tired of this line.OK so..... Mike Turner, he's good right? Does this thread get boarded up until March 3rd 2008?

 

[pinda]

I would love to have you over in my League.

I never get tired of this line.

so true, every rookie that comes in here that faces a challenge to their posts"I would love to have you in my league""You wouldn't last in my league"Like I give a flying f**k about his league, the one of 5,000,000 leagues out there.`I think it's safe to say Turner to whoever is over for this year, but there is always the trade deadline.

 

[zamboni]

I think there should be a pact to let this thread move beyond page 1 for good, or just lock the thing. Time to move on....