***Official PSF Moderation Thread*** (1 Viewer)

[KCitons]

The purpose of trying to convince Rock, for me, is that he disagreed it was even an insult, and I like Rock.  

So not thinking something is an insult is worse than knowing something is an insult and telling people to just lighten up?

If Rock knew it was a slur, he would have been okay?

 

[Henry Ford]

So not thinking something is an insult is worse than knowing something is an insult and telling people to just lighten up?

If Rock knew it was a slur, he would have been okay?

No. I said neither of those things. 

 

[KCitons]

No. I said neither of those things. 

The purpose of trying to convince Rock, for me, is that he disagreed it was even an insult, and I like Rock.  

Not sure what your point was then?

 

[Henry Ford]

Not sure what your point was then?

Not sure why not. I don’t know how to explain it better.  
 

The purpose for me was not “make X feel bad.”  It was “explain that this is offensive.”

One person already knew that and was being a misogynist on purpose.  Engaging that person in conversation is like arguing with a chair. I care very little about what that person thinks and conversation with such person is useless.  If you think that makes that person “better” in my eyes, I don’t really know how to respond to that. 

 

[krista4]

This thread desperately needs more italicized lyrics.  @Ilov80s @rockaction    

 

[KCitons]

Not sure why not. I don’t know how to explain it better.  
 

The purpose for me was not “make X feel bad.”  It was “explain that this is offensive.”

One person already knew that and was being a misogynist on purpose.  Engaging that person in conversation is like arguing with a chair. I care very little about what that person thinks and conversation with such person is useless.  If you think that makes that person “better” in my eyes, I don’t really know how to respond to that. 

This doesn't seem to fit with what @Koya was saying about treating each other with respect. 

Am I to assume mob mentality is trying to teach and not shame or guilt s poster for his/her comments?

 

[Ramblin Wreck]

They aren't being defined the same way. You have to be able to see that?

I was giving people the opportunity to respond to my comments before I made my next point. 

Last week @Tom Skerritt made a comment that a poster was acting like a woman. It was disparaging to women and he was called out by me. His response was for me to lighten up. Now, I know very few transgender people, but I know a lot of women. As I'm sure every poster here does. He doubled down on his comments. And was eventually given a timeout. 

There wasn't nearly the outrage. I wonder if it had more to do with the poster, and who the comments were directed towards, more so than being politically correct.

TLR  The mob mentality here doesn't feed on it's own. 

You should have just stopped right here.  It's blatantly obvious.  Skerritt's comments towards women was way worse than rocks.

 

[rockaction]

This thread desperately needs more italicized lyrics.  @Ilov80s @rockaction    

You rang? I'd better make it good. Listening to Vince Staples right now...I'm not sure he's an italicized type of guy...yeah he is.

Hey, I saw the first half of Leonard and Marianne on Amazon. Bought it. I'm a little surprised by it, though I shouldn't be. I'll update in the proper thread when the time is right and I've finished it. 

 

[krista4]

You rang? I'd better make it good. Listening to Vince Staples right now...I'm not sure he's an italicized type of guy...yeah he is.

Hey, I saw the first half of Leonard and Marianne on Amazon. Bought it. I'm a little surprised by it, though I shouldn't be. I'll update in the proper thread when the time is right and I've finished it. 

I'm very interested in your thoughts, given that you've said you relate to him in many ways.  There was a lot in the movie that I didn't much know.  Didn't come out of it loving him any less at all, but understood more of the complexity.

And geez, could she have been any more lovely of a woman?  But yeah, eager to hear when you have a chance.  This might be the right thread.     

 

[Ilov80s]

Rebels been rebels
Since I don't know when
And all she wants to do is dance

 

[rockaction]

The Feds takin' pictures and they tappin' Motorolas
Everybody snitchin', gotta live with paranoia
A soldier since the stroller, ask my mama if you doubt that
Homie where ya clout at? You ain't ever push nobody's scalp back
45, 9s 'round 9 in the AM

 

[Henry Ford]

This doesn't seem to fit with what @Koya was saying about treating each other with respect. 

Am I to assume mob mentality is trying to teach and not shame or guilt s poster for his/her comments?

No, I can’t speak to mob mentality. I can only speak to my own.  

 

[jon_mx]

Lots of people have kids with special circumstances. Lots of people have special circumstances of their own. I get your point that rock didn't necessarily back off his original statement. For that he made amends. That's the best you can hope for in a constantly changing world.

Can we apply the same set if rules across the board? Nearly every day there are posts that could be offensive to a subset of the population. Who decides what's over the line? What is the benchmark for being offended?

There are certain groups which are allowed to be offended and there are certain groups who are not.  And that's a large part of the problem.   Men or Christians or white people or conservatives are not even allowed to be offended.   When I point out disrespectful or offensive comments, I get called out as a whiner, martyr, woman, sissy, etc.  But it is perfectly ok for every other group to whine and complain.  I just can't comprehend the logic behind being super-sensitive to certain groups, but complete asses to others. 

One of the more absurd examples is it is still somewhat common for a black conservative to be labeled a racially-charged term like Uncle Tom.  Does a black man become less of a human based on political values? 

It is easy to give respect to people you agree with.  But until we learn to extend that same respect to all people, we are doomed to becoming more and more divided. 

 

[Juxtatarot]

There are certain groups which are allowed to be offended and there are certain groups who are not.  And that's a large part of the problem.   Men or Christians or white people or conservatives are not even allowed to be offended.   When I point out disrespectful or offensive comments, I get called out as a whiner, martyr, woman, sissy, etc.  But it is perfectly ok for every other group to whine and complain.  I just can't comprehend the logic behind being super-sensitive to certain groups, but complete asses to others. 

One of the more absurd examples is it is still somewhat common for a black conservative to be labeled a racially-charged term like Uncle Tom.  Does a black man become less of a human based on political values? 

It is easy to give respect to people you agree with.  But until we learn to extend that same respect to all people, we are doomed to becoming more and more divided. 

When you are called a whiner or martyr, it’s not a disparaging term for a white man or Christian . 

Posters shouldn’t call you a sissy or a woman.

Calling a black man an Uncle Tom is disparaging.

We should all be able to agree on the above three points.

 

[FF Ninja]

If you're talking about the f-bomb

We have a young, 80lb, hot, Asian chick at work that uses the f-bomb fairly regularly.

Did f-bomb change? I've always thought it was a four letter word, but from context I'm wondering if you guys are talking about the three/six letter word.

 

[jon_mx]

When you are called a whiner or martyr, it’s not a disparaging term for a white man or Christian . 

Posters shouldn’t call you a sissy or a woman.

Calling a black man an Uncle Tom is disparaging.

We should all be able to agree on the above three points.

Certainly we can agree on the last two, but the first one misinterprets the point I was trying to make. 

It was not about me being called a whiner.  It is that this forum routinely belittles trump supporters, white males, conservatives, sometimes police, and Christians (although most of that has been weeded out).   The worst elements of these groups are used to disparage the group as a whole to delegitimize all their views.   In a way a very similar tactic Trump uses with illegals although he is far more blatant and ridiculous about it.  But the principle is the same.   

I try to defend or express points from a different perspective, but a variety of different tactics are utilized to ignore any legitimate point and make no attempt at understanding.  The goto tactic is usually personalizing and making this discussion about me, but there are many other tactics utilized.  And if I dare to point out the crappy tactics, then I become the problem and not the crappy tactics which include things like guilt by association, strawmen arguements, focusing on some irrelevant aspect of the post, or just some ridiculous personal insult.  And I would put the majority of responses to me in the PSF firmly in the crappy tactics category.  

But the real point is, until we can  treat people who have different values with respect, expecting them to respect people with different values from them is hypocritical.   The biggest differences in the country have nothing to do with color, it has to do with values and beliefs.  And we need to stop hating people who have different values and beliefs and try to treat everyone with the same respect you show from people on your side.  

 

[AAABatteries]

Did f-bomb change? I've always thought it was a four letter word, but from context I'm wondering if you guys are talking about the three/six letter word.

I think they are talking about two different things.  Rock was talking about the derogatory term for a homosexual that a lot of us as kids used (including myself).  I think Tony is just talking about what most people think of as the f-word which, to my knowledge, is not offensive to any groups.  And to be clear, the former usage was one of the words I used to say that I no longer do.  But I share a love for f-bomb word except if I ever hear my kids say it.

 

[identikit]

I think they are talking about two different things.  Rock was talking about the derogatory term for a homosexual that a lot of us as kids used (including myself).  I think Tony is just talking about what most people think of as the f-word which, to my knowledge, is not offensive to any groups.  And to be clear, the former usage was one of the words I used to say that I no longer do.  But I share a love for f-bomb word except if I ever hear my kids say it.

Where do you think they learned it?

 

[AAABatteries]

Where do you think they learned it?

Ha.  I never say it in front of them - that I recall. 

 

[FF Ninja]

I think they are talking about two different things.  Rock was talking about the derogatory term for a homosexual that a lot of us as kids used (including myself).  I think Tony is just talking about what most people think of as the f-word which, to my knowledge, is not offensive to any groups.  And to be clear, the former usage was one of the words I used to say that I no longer do.

Ha, that's kind of what I was assuming was going on, but you never know.

Personally, I'm offended by nothing. I don't post often in www.reddit.com/r/wallstreetbets but they use the "six letter f-bomb" in there ALL the time and if I'm being honest, it cracks me up. Nobody is truly being hateful in there. Just a bunch of dudes trying to get rich quickly and talking s*** to each other in the process. 

I missed the thread in question, but two things everyone should keep in mind are (1) context and (2) intent. I know this is the age of virtue signaling, but rock's not a hateful guy and I would hope people would take that into account before piling on.

 

[rockaction]

Did f-bomb change? I've always thought it was a four letter word, but from context I'm wondering if you guys are talking about the three/six letter word.

Six letter for me. I used the terminology wrong. 

 

[KCitons]

No, I can’t speak to mob mentality. I can only speak to my own.  

And this is why there appears to be a mob mentality. You (and perhaps others) try to educate another poster with your comments. While other posters may have a different objective (wanting to treat others with respect, or curb stomping a poster for their opinions/stance; or even payback for a comment in a totally unrelated thread). What your left with is what appears to be "piling on" be the mob. Depending on the receiving party, it can look like a mob mentality. When its tied to political view it looks like a liberal echo chamber.

 

[Henry Ford]

And this is why there appears to be a mob mentality. You (and perhaps others) try to educate another poster with your comments. While other posters may have a different objective (wanting to treat others with respect, or curb stomping a poster for their opinions/stance; or even payback for a comment in a totally unrelated thread). What your left with is what appears to be "piling on" be the mob. Depending on the receiving party, it can look like a mob mentality. When its tied to political view it looks like a liberal echo chamber.

That's certainly one possibility.  There are several. 

 

[KCitons]

There are certain groups which are allowed to be offended and there are certain groups who are not.  And that's a large part of the problem.   Men or Christians or white people or conservatives are not even allowed to be offended.   When I point out disrespectful or offensive comments, I get called out as a whiner, martyr, woman, sissy, etc.  But it is perfectly ok for every other group to whine and complain.  I just can't comprehend the logic behind being super-sensitive to certain groups, but complete asses to others. 

One of the more absurd examples is it is still somewhat common for a black conservative to be labeled a racially-charged term like Uncle Tom.  Does a black man become less of a human based on political values? 

It is easy to give respect to people you agree with.  But until we learn to extend that same respect to all people, we are doomed to becoming more and more divided. 

I would agree that white men are under attack. But, to a degree, I think its justified.(I throw out the Christian or any religion because I'm not sure any religion is better than others). When you think about the privilege that a white Male has had in this country for 200 years, it's difficult to cry about any moderate level of adversity we must face. 

I attended a meeting a couple of years ago where one of the speakers asked everyone to think about how they started their day. Did you have to get up early to prepair yourself to project a better image (makeup, hair, shave legs, etc). Did you have to take steps to help you get make it through the day physically (pregnant, having your period). Did you have to worry about your physical appearance would effect how your treated (black, Muslim attire, etc). The list went on with 20 or so questions about financial, educational and other things that affect a wide range of people. By the end, I think there was one question I could relate to being a white Male that had a negative impact to start my day. It's like giving me a 25 yard head start in a 100 yard race.

You have the right to be offended. People's feelings are their own. What your arguing is that others should feel the same as you. But again, people's feelings are their own.

 

[GoBirds]

I wanted to congratulate Joe for firing/demoting/whatever Bob McGaw.

I just learned in Maurile's thread that McGaw was gone. I knew I hadn't seen his posts in forever, wasn't sure what happened.

He was unhinged during the 2016 election and was banning people left and right solely because they supported Trump. Good riddance!

A recommendation, why not appoint a pro Trump (or at least  neutral) mod to the PSF?

Maurile hates Trump, but is reasonable with his mod duties, which is fine.

The other two mods, Clayton and Aaron, don't even post in the PSF forum. Clayton is somewhat reasonable, but Aaron is widely recognized as extremely biased towards anyone who supports Trump.

I say get rid of Aaron, or at least prevent him from suspending people he disagrees with in a forum he doesn't even post in. Replace him with someone like jon mx or Max or Hell Toupee.

Or if you want to go neutral, appoint ren hoek or rocknation.

I doubt he’s gone from the forum, maybe just not a face of the company any longer. 

 

[sho nuff]

Yes...the mods are all biased and people are just banned solely for supporting Trump.

What a ridiculous accusation with no basis in fact.

 

[Max Power]

Waiting to hear why Bluto got a timeout. 

 

[sho nuff]

Waiting to hear why Bluto got a timeout. 

Was there not a "don't" attached to a post of his?  That would probably be it.

Not sure the mods ever give a real explanation.

 

[Max Power]

Was there not a "don't" attached to a post of his?  That would probably be it.

Not sure the mods ever give a real explanation.

Another poster got the same warning without a timeout.

 

[Ramblin Wreck]

Another poster got the same warning without a timeout.

Bluto was doing what Maurile asked him to do while there's a half dozen posters doing exactly what Maurile asked them to stop doing.  Strange times.

 

[Juxtatarot]

Bluto was doing what Maurile asked him to do while there's a half dozen posters doing exactly what Maurile asked them to stop doing.  Strange times.

I remember Maurile writing something about different rules in the Trump thread but did that include allowing calling people trolls? I searched for Maurile’s post briefly but gave up.  

 

[Ramblin Wreck]

I remember Maurile writing something about different rules in the Trump thread but did that include allowing calling people trolls? I searched for Maurile’s post briefly but gave up.  

https://forums.footballguys.com/forum/topic/776645-trump-2020-hq-the-great-place/?do=findComment&comment=22467227

Here you go.  If you're going to claim calling someone a troll got him a timeout then go look at how many posters are breaking the last rule Maurile laid out.  I think that's what the complaining is about.  One guy gets a timeout and others get a be more cool type response and then continue not being cool.  It is what it is.

 

[Joe Bryant]

I wanted to congratulate Joe for firing/demoting/whatever Bob McGaw.

I just learned in Maurile's thread that McGaw was gone. I knew I hadn't seen his posts in forever, wasn't sure what happened.

He was unhinged during the 2016 election and was banning people left and right solely because they supported Trump. Good riddance!

A recommendation, why not appoint a pro Trump (or at least  neutral) mod to the PSF?

Maurile hates Trump, but is reasonable with his mod duties, which is fine.

The other two mods, Clayton and Aaron, don't even post in the PSF forum. Clayton is somewhat reasonable, but Aaron is widely recognized as extremely biased towards anyone who supports Trump.

I say get rid of Aaron, or at least prevent him from suspending people he disagrees with in a forum he doesn't even post in. Replace him with someone like jon mx or Max or Hell Toupee.

Or if you want to go neutral, appoint ren hoek or rocknation.

Aaron is my guy. No interest in changing anything there. He's also not biased like you're accusing him of. I can see what he suspends or moderates and you are without a doubt wrong there. Drop the accusations. 

The moderating team is not our problem here. 

People acting like kindergarteners is our problem here. Help us do better. 

 

[Juxtatarot]

https://forums.footballguys.com/forum/topic/776645-trump-2020-hq-the-great-place/?do=findComment&comment=22467227

Here you go.  If you're going to claim calling someone a troll got him a timeout then go look at how many posters are breaking the last rule Maurile laid out.  I think that's what the complaining is about.  One guy gets a timeout and others get a be more cool type response and then continue not being cool.  It is what it is.

In my opinion, rereading that, I come to the conclusion that calling someone a troll in the Pro-Trump thread should be allowed by a Trump supporter.  Accordingly, John shouldn’t have been suspended.  I’m not a fan of having different rules in different threads but obviously that’s not up to me.

 

[Slapdash]

In my opinion, rereading that, I come to the conclusion that calling someone a troll in the Pro-Trump thread should be allowed by a Trump supporter.  Accordingly, John shouldn’t have been suspended.  I’m not a fan of having different rules in different threads but obviously that’s not up to me.

Not sure why you should be allowed to call someone a troll in one thread but not another.

 

[dkp993]

I doubt he’s gone from the forum, maybe just not a face of the company any longer. 

I’m not so sure.  His posting style was very distinct.  If he was still around posting we’d absolutely know.  

 

[Max Power]

Not sure why you should be allowed to call someone a troll in one thread but not another.

I would say it depends on the topic. 

 

[sho nuff]

I would say it depends on the topic. 

I would think saying to people not to call other people trolls is pretty much board wide. Been suspended for that before...dont think its really all that controversial or a surprise.

 

[Ramblin Wreck]

I would think saying to people not to call other people trolls is pretty much board wide. Been suspended for that before...dont think its really all that controversial or a surprise.

It's like you read 1/10th of the conversation.  

 

[Joe Bryant]

I wanted to congratulate Joe for firing/demoting/whatever Bob McGaw.

I just learned in Maurile's thread that McGaw was gone. I knew I hadn't seen his posts in forever, wasn't sure what happened.

He was unhinged during the 2016 election and was banning people left and right solely because they supported Trump. Good riddance!

A recommendation, why not appoint a pro Trump (or at least  neutral) mod to the PSF?

Maurile hates Trump, but is reasonable with his mod duties, which is fine.

The other two mods, Clayton and Aaron, don't even post in the PSF forum. Clayton is somewhat reasonable, but Aaron is widely recognized as extremely biased towards anyone who supports Trump.

I say get rid of Aaron, or at least prevent him from suspending people he disagrees with in a forum he doesn't even post in. Replace him with someone like jon mx or Max or Hell Toupee.

Or if you want to go neutral, appoint ren hoek or rocknation.

And to be clear:

There was zero "firing" or "demotion". The "whatever" for Bob Magaw is I asked him as my friend to not be as overly political as was being. That's it. 

 

[Slapdash]

And to be clear:

There was zero "firing" or "demotion". The "whatever" for Bob Magaw is I asked him as my friend to not be as overly political as was being. That's it. 

Miss having him around with the music discussions.

 

[dkp993]

Miss having him around with the music discussions.

Exactly what I was going to post.  

 

[rockaction]

I tried to engage Bob McGaw outside of politics, but I think the personal became the political. He had a lot of intelligent things to say; I wish it weren't that way, if it was at all. He might not have given it a thought, but I'd written what I thought were thoughtful replies about music, etc., and I don't think he took to it because of who I was. At least, that's the feeling I got, which, like I said, could be erroneous. 

 

[Joe Bryant]

Miss having him around with the music discussions.

Me too. That was a cost of asking him. I'm sure it hurt him. But it was likely the right thing for the company.

That was years ago and still I had people last week saying they stopped being customers over it when they couldn't even remember who it was. Sigh. 

 

[tonydead]

Not sure why you should be allowed to call someone a troll in one thread but not another.

The same reason trolling itself is allowed in there but not the other threads.  MT wasn't interested in moderating it. Then the bait and reporters came along, dispite the new rule.  The guy that got reported gets suspended by a different mod.  That's pretty much the text book for complaints about unfair moderation.  

 

[GoBirds]

I tried to engage Bob McGaw outside of politics, but I think the personal became the political. He had a lot of intelligent things to say; I wish it weren't that way, if it was at all. He might not have given it a thought, but I'd written what I thought were thoughtful replies about music, etc., and I don't think he took to it because of who I was. At least, that's the feeling I got, which, like I said, could be erroneous. 

If you do a search on Facebook most with that name live in Canada.....maybe he was one of the few that held strong to the “If Trump’s elected I’m moving to Canada “ threat?

   

 

[BassNBrew]

Me too. That was a cost of asking him. I'm sure it hurt him. But it was likely the right thing for the company.

That was years ago and still I had people last week saying they stopped being customers over it when they couldn't even remember who it was. Sigh. 

Who stopped being a customer?

 

[Sheriff Bart]

I wanted to congratulate Joe for firing/demoting/whatever Bob McGaw.

I just learned in Maurile's thread that McGaw was gone. I knew I hadn't seen his posts in forever, wasn't sure what happened.

He was unhinged during the 2016 election and was banning people left and right solely because they supported Trump. Good riddance!

A recommendation, why not appoint a pro Trump (or at least  neutral) mod to the PSF?

Maurile hates Trump, but is reasonable with his mod duties, which is fine.

The other two mods, Clayton and Aaron, don't even post in the PSF forum. Clayton is somewhat reasonable, but Aaron is widely recognized as extremely biased towards anyone who supports Trump.

I say get rid of Aaron, or at least prevent him from suspending people he disagrees with in a forum he doesn't even post in. Replace him with someone like jon mx or Max or Hell Toupee.

Or if you want to go neutral, appoint ren hoek or rocknation.

How dare you speak of GB Carlton and my GB Rude in this way sir.  Were I a younger man I would challenge you to a dual! 

 

[dkp993]

Me too. That was a cost of asking him. I'm sure it hurt him. But it was likely the right thing for the company.

That was years ago and still I had people last week saying they stopped being customers over it when they couldn't even remember who it was. Sigh. 

Those just sound like people making excuses Joe. Being in the customer service business my whole life I’ve learned 1 thing.  People will say anything to justify positions.  When you relay feedback like that it reminds me of when I had my restaurant and someone would complain about the steak they had just eaten and be wanting their money back, yet there was not one bite left......

 

[BladeRunner]

How dare you speak of GB Carlton and my GB Rude in this way sir.  Were I a younger man I would challenge you to a dual! 

You're an older dude? Geez, based on some of your posts I would have thought you were a teenage girl.   

BAM!!!!!!!!! 

I'm here till next Tuesday with shows at 7:00 and 9:00.