jonessed
Footballguy
He can let the play continue and still give Cech the card. It happens all the time with tackles.
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***Official Soccer Discussion Thread*** (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter jpeace121
- Start date
prefontaine
Footballguy
sorry, specifically meant last man rule. He was last man. He clearly committed a foul. It wasn't a bad foul but if the ball doesn't fall to Bale, the ref has no discretion but to send him off. It's not optional. Apparently because Bale was there it went from straight red to nothing.
But it would still just be a yellow rather than red because a red is warranted only if the attacking team is denied a goal or obvious goal scoring opportunity.
jonessed
Footballguy
That makes sense.
Steve Tasker
Footballguy
Yeah, me too. I was ambivalent before, but no team deserves to potentially lose a game on that crap.
Steve Tasker
Footballguy
Nice finish from Ramires.
jonessed
Footballguy
Well, there goes that. I doubt Spurs even get an apology from the FA. I don't understand the protection of referees in the EPL. I fully expect the media to come out with "Atkinson awards a controversial goal" when it should read "Atkinson makes a guess at a goal he can't see and gets it completely wrong".
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
I bumped Hamid to stand by for the two reasons you mentioned. 1) He looked poor when the semi bright lights came on during Olympic Qualifying, and 2) he is not yet back from injury, at least enough to play. He is suppose to be 100% back but he was not chosen to start last night against the Revs. I believe Klinsmann really likes Hamid though so it would not shock me even a second to see him be the 3rd keeper, and might even make some sense just for the general experience level seeing as the 3rd keeper is never going to play anyway.'Steve Tasker said:
As for Agudelo, I like him, but his recent injury coupled with the fact he is likely to get no time with Cooper and Henry clicking so well once he gets back is going to keep him off my US radar for a while, at least until he forces his way back on. And this is a good thing because we have finally have multiple strikers all clicking at the same time allowing the ability to actually have to make some hard choices for once.
Lets face it, this may be the first time in three years that Jozy is going to actually earn the starting slot based on his club play instead of it just being preordained and if he gets a strike partner, it is going to be real fun to see who gets paired with him.
Also, we you consider that the midfielders are relatively deep, that also may free up Dempsey to play closer to goal if Klinsmann wants to use him as a with drawn striker giving the US another inform goal scorer.
Also good to note that both Landon and Shea scored this weekend, first of the year for both.
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NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Our normally civil conversation always gets waylay-ed with the diving talk 
It must be like our abortion topic or something. We may need to ban any mention of it lol
It must be like our abortion topic or something. We may need to ban any mention of it lol
jonessed
Footballguy
It has nothing to do with diving. Most people here have teams, but are generally soccer fans first. There are a few that are team fans first and soccer fans second. When those two ideologies converge the conversation inevitably goes South. It doesn't happen very often, but it does happen.Our normally civil conversation always gets waylay-ed with the diving talk
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But it's so instrumental in the outcome of so many games.Our normally civil conversation always gets waylay-ed with the diving talk
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
I generally stay out of these conversations but it is pretty clear from reading them, it revolves around only one club team when the arguments start.It has nothing to do with diving. Most people here have teams, but are generally soccer fans first. There are a few that are team fans first and soccer fans second. When those two ideologies converge the conversation inevitably goes South. It doesn't happen very often, but it does happen.Our normally civil conversation always gets waylay-ed with the diving talk
jonessed
Footballguy
At this point in the season rooting against United is like rooting for City, which you would be hard-pressed to find anyone here do. I think most of the EPL fans just want to see it come down to the derby match and/or the best team win. The whole "ABU" thing is just silly, as is the "haters" label.Somehow I got the "ABU" label (which is something I have never even heard of before) when most people know I'm a Tottenham fan and I don't dislike United anymore than I dislike City, Chelsea, or Liverpool. To be honest, right now I do hate Chelsea and I've been called out as biased against Suarez, and I'm naturally supposed to dislike Arseanal so I'm really an "ABUCL". I think I'm going to start calling Tasker an "ABT" as opposed to an Arsenal fan too.Yeah, yeah, Chelsea won because the refs suck and you all are "ABT". Bale doesn't dive. I hate you all! Arggggghhhh!Edit: By the way, I actually like Maverick. Does that still make me "ABU"? I need some clarification.I generally stay out of these conversations but it is pretty clear from reading them, it revolves around only one club team when the arguments start.It has nothing to do with diving. Most people here have teams, but are generally soccer fans first. There are a few that are team fans first and soccer fans second. When those two ideologies converge the conversation inevitably goes South. It doesn't happen very often, but it does happen.Our normally civil conversation always gets waylay-ed with the diving talk
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jonessed
Footballguy
Seems like if that was the case we really would have seen Torres start. I think Chelsea's lineup clearly hinted at winning this game over competing against Barca.
The Z Machine
Footballguy
Socialist.'Christo said:
prefontaine
Footballguy
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jonessed
Footballguy
In soccer world Christo is a socialist and Spain is a capitalist country.
jonessed
Footballguy
One of the few "justices" in the EPL that may come out of this season is QPR getting relegated. Hughes dumps Fulham to shoot for the Villa job, he doesn't get the job because Villa recognizes he is a dooch for dumping Fulham the way he did, he then moves to a team that ditched the manager that got them into the EPL, and they both get relegated together. Now that would be sweet justice.
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Steve Tasker
Footballguy
Does he step on Young's right foot? I can't tell.
jonessed
Footballguy
No. Young kicks out and hits the defender's ankle as he drags his foot (it's even debatable that contact is made). That's what the commentors are referring to when they say "he's looking for it". You can see it from the front angle (the one they showed most during the game).
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Hey now!
Sue me for wanting to see the best talent actually playing on the field.
Steve Tasker
Footballguy
I didn't see that angle....do you have a link to it?
prefontaine
Footballguy
from looking at the angle they showed on tv, I honestly don't think there was any contact. It looked like Young kicked out for it and whiffed.
jonessed
Footballguy
No. It's the view they showed during the game. They actually didn't show this back view but once I think. They kept showing the front view. I imagine it's out there somewhere.Edit: This video seems to have the most views although the quality isn't that great
Link
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Donsmith753
Footballguy
Can't tell if this has been photoshopped but interesting if it hasn't.
Makes many people look a little silly...
Makes many people look a little silly...
That's not clearly over the line. And it doesn't address the Terry foul.
Ursa M
Footballguy
Looks to me like Young's right foot trips over the defender's left foot and Young then hurls himself forward like he's been shot. If he just fell over, it's less likely there'd be diving claims. Whichever, I wouldn't say that was as bad as the previous week, which clearly was a dive. FWIW, it was me that posted the suggestion that the EPL review all games and retroactively punish diving. They could give a one match suspension for any dive, two if it got a penalty and/or a yellow card for the opponent, three if it got a penalty and/or a red card for the opponent.
There's only one way to stop this business and that's to deprive managers of their players. Because, like everything else, it all goes back to the manager.
Looks to me like Young instigated contact by continuing to kick his left leg toward the defender, while Young was cutting the other way. It looks like an unnatural move my Young - i.e he was trying to make contact with the defender. It was not a situation of the defender not getting out of the way of Young's cut-back.
prefontaine
Footballguy
I honestly don't know how anyone can look at that and conclude it's anything but a dive
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Ursa M
Footballguy
He doesn't if Ferguson knows he'll get suspended. My point is that managers can be made to enforce rules if the penalty for not doing so is sufficiently dire.
The Z Machine
Footballguy
I much prefer soccer Christo to all other Christos.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Was sitting out on my front steps and saw a guy walking his dog in a Sounders shirt (I live in a Boston suburb).
I call out and ask if he is a Sounders fan and he laughs and says no, his brother is from Seattle but that he is a fan of the Revs.
He was telling me his brother was neither a soccer fan or really a sports fan but that he has really got caught up in the Sounders semi-mania out there. His brother said the atmosphere before (the whole march to the game from the city) and during the game is even better than what comes across on tv.
We then both lamented our sorry situation here with the Revs, both said our prayers to the "SSS in Boston" gods and went our seperate ways.
I call out and ask if he is a Sounders fan and he laughs and says no, his brother is from Seattle but that he is a fan of the Revs.
He was telling me his brother was neither a soccer fan or really a sports fan but that he has really got caught up in the Sounders semi-mania out there. His brother said the atmosphere before (the whole march to the game from the city) and during the game is even better than what comes across on tv.
We then both lamented our sorry situation here with the Revs, both said our prayers to the "SSS in Boston" gods and went our seperate ways.
bentley
Footballguy
Liverpooled?
Good Posting Judge
Footballguy
It tips a lot of games. There were three iffy calls in the box alone during the Levante/Barca game the other day: two went Levante's way (Busquets handball, which pretty clearly lacked intent, Iniesta getting leveled by Ballesteros in the box), one went Barca's way (Cuenca dive ---> PK). Compare that to one goal during the run of play.The team I like most does it, and the team I like the least does it. Aside from any built-in prejudices, it's a systemic problem. But the powers that be can't even get goal-line technology right, so I don't think there's much hope to fixing diving. I think if you had a replay official that handed out cards for dives during the game (e.g. next stoppage in play), it would curtail it. But that will never happen. People are inevitably going to ##### when their team gets jobbed.Our normally civil conversation always gets waylay-ed with the diving talk
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
Lucky for all of us that Chels scored 3 more to make it irrelevant.
It didn't make it irrelevant at all. As the commentators pointed out, that goal completely changed the game. If that's not called there's no telling what happens the rest of the game.
jonessed
Footballguy
Ummmmm, no. Once Chelsea were given the goal Tottenham had to open up. There's no way to know what the real result would have been.
jonessed
Footballguy
It's photoshopped. The shots on the line during the game show it clearly didn't go over. It actually didn't even come very close. This has been universally acknowledged in the media, by the referee, and by every Chelsea player interviewed.
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CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
Of course it changed the game, and it would be a huge issue if the game ended 2-1 or 3-1. This game was 2-1 early in the second half so there really wasn't any great pressure on them to sell out for a goal. Bad calls happen all the time and good players learn to deal with that reality. After Bale's goal I was certain Spurs would draw or win, as Chelsea's late defending has been disastrous all season. But after the Ramires goal, Spurs seemed to give up. Just a couple weeks ago they outplayed Chelsea at Stamford Bridge in a huge league game, but today I don't think anyone can reasonably argue who the better side was.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Rafa Marquez once again showed his utter class as a player and human being in this play.
MLS uses a disciplinary commission that suspends players for plays the ref misses. It will be interesting to see what they do here.
I don't mind the cowardly tackle of Salinas so much as the ultra cheap and dirty kick after they went down. Salinas suffered a broken clavicle on the play.
MLS uses a disciplinary commission that suspends players for plays the ref misses. It will be interesting to see what they do here.
I don't mind the cowardly tackle of Salinas so much as the ultra cheap and dirty kick after they went down. Salinas suffered a broken clavicle on the play.
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CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
I don't agree with the earlier comment that the CL trophy is most important of all for English fans. I think for english football fans, the league comes first, and the FA Cup and CL are both great, but secondary, achievements. As great as the Champions League is, the fact is that the home/away total goals knock-out format creates some bizarre tactical situations that, more often than not, lead to boring football.For me, given the present reality, I would want RDM to focus first on the FA Cup, second on the league - to gain 4th or at least hold 5th - and third on the CL. However, the CL title is the one trophy that Abramovich has never won, and his last two manager hires have clearly been focused on Europe, so its hard to say where the current manager's attention is, but I think you are probably correct with this statement. The other factor is that, of these 4 huge games (Spurs, Barca, Gunners, Barca), the game on Wednesday is the only one at Stamford Bridge, and he can't put a second rate team out there in front of the home fans. The good news is that the home crowd still loves Torres, and I think he loves to play against Barca, so I would not be surprised to see him starting on Wed.
El Floppo
Footballguy
I'm sure it's discussed more later in the thread (I haven't watched the 2nd half of the Spurs CHels FA cup, so I'm stopping reading right here), but replays pretty clearly show (to me, at least) that Young initiated contact and threw himself on the ground. Yeah, the defender's foot was there- but Young kicked it and then went down... not the other way around. It's sad how little shame such good athletes have- especially two weeks in a row.Signed,A neutral who enjoys watching United, and any team that plays quality soccer, play.I find it odd how as this topic has reared it's head for the second time in a week, this is the defense of homerism both times. There's really not a lot of hate here for anyone. A dive by any other name is still a dive and it has nothing to do with what color shirt the diver is wearing.'Ursa M said:ABU = Anybody But United. Apart from being the best supported team in the world (with the exception of maybe Barca), they are also the most hated, by a country mile.'Steve Tasker said:What's an "ABU"?'Ursa M said:I didn't see the dive either, I was in the car. The Sirius/XM announcers didn't make it sound that bad, but they were pretty clearly biased in favor of United. I'll have to see it to judge for myself.
Steve Tasker
Footballguy
Honestly, it kinda looks to me like Young's right foot does make contact with the defender's left foot. Regardless, it appears that Young left his left leg out in an attempt to draw contact (which I don't even know if he did) and clearly embellished the dive.
jonessed
Footballguy
That's crap. If they aren't down 2-1 Defoe doesn't come on, Sandro comes on as a holding replacement for VdV. That creates an entirely different dynamic. Redknapp felt he had to gamble with 15 minutes remaining. That's when it fell apart for Spurs. Ramirez didn't score until the 77th minute.It's easy to say "bad calls happen" when your team is the beneficiary. That's the third goal Chelsea has been gifted in two weeks.
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