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***Official Soccer Discussion Thread*** (2 Viewers)

NewlyRetired said:
I feel like there is something else in play because from what little was announced today, it does not make much sense.  I feel this is a piece of bigger plan not yet clear.  Here are some random comments

* Turner is paying $60 million a year for just the English rights (Univision won the Spanish rights).  The $60m for the English rights alone is said to be a SIGNIFICANT jump in rates from the previous number Fox was paying for both the English and Spanish rights combined.

* Turner is going to have a create their soccer infrastructure from scratch since they have none.  The last real soccer game they showed was in the 1990 World Cup from Italy.

* When Turner enters the game, that gives 5 major broadcast players a piece of soccer as Turner will join Univision, NBC, ESPN and Fox leaving I believe only CBS as the loan major player with out a significant soccer property.

* Fox supposedly only offered a token bid to retain the rights.  That seems to indicate to me that they know what kind of revenue they can expect and that the Turner bid is so outrageously high, there has to be something else related else this is almost certainly going to be a money loser for them.

* MLS I am sure is paying close attention to this as they are about to enter year 3 of a 5 year TV deal and if Turner is getting ready to expand their soccer properties, they may very well get involved in the next round of bidding which should be in late 2018.
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hoo-boy. my expectations are far below fox for this. 

remember when they cut to commercial when a goal was scored in that 90 wc? good times.

 
Some interesting points in this article about the league changes in philosophy in how MLS teams build their rosters.  I will copy out a few here to read and link the whole article.

https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2017/02/24/view-couch-hark-mls-roster-revolution-has-already-arrived

Major League Soccer might have just had a revolution. With a nod to Kevin Kinkead's primary legwork, as of Thursday, 81 players had signed during the Primary Transfer Window, all from international leagues. The average age? 25.73. And 58 percent come with an international cap.

Thirteen new Designated Players inked deals. (Jelle Van Damme caught an upgrade after playing for LA last season.) The eldest, New York City FC's midfield addition Maxi Moralez, turns 30 this week. Five are Young DPs, under the age of 23. The baby of the group, Houston Dynamo speedster and budding CONCACAF legend Alberth Elis, just turned 21. Just.

Overall, the Designated Player pool averages 27.68 years, with 12 under 24 and 32 under 30.

"There was a tendency to try to convince the players to come to MLS, that you tried to sell a way of life on what the United States was all about, and why they would benefit," Clavijo says. "You needed to convince some of these players. Today, that's not the case.

"Wherever you travel, Argentina, Uruguay, Brazil, Ecuador or in Europe, MLS is a destination right now. We are a place where people like to come. They know what it is, they know the league, they watch games. That has changed drastically from 20 years ago. Drastically. It's good. Today you can compete with teams around the world to sign those players; before it was not the case."

 
Obviously with it being preseason, you can't take too much from it but it is hard not to notice Chicago's improvement.  They are a perfect 5-0 going into today and are crushing Toronto's first string players 3-0 at the half.

 
Mix missed his calling in life.  I honestly have no idea what his true calling is but this is one warped dude.

Here is Mix's public response to his issues at NYC

Somebody told me I'm not part of a plan

and if he was I - he'd run like the others ran
'cause the budget is tight
and binding contracts might
be broken, to improve 5-6 positions - in exchange for only one man.


He went on to say; "the message is clear -
unless you're clueless - 'cause you've lived it all'year
since the budget is tight
and binding contracts might
not need to be broken if.... you crack, kneel or swear"


Who could tell so straight and clearly
tales of destiny I fight sincerely
when mental games
are attempting aims
to make me rage severely?


On and on the conversation went
about money spent
and special rules
and mgt's tools
and something about allocation being different cent


I wish I had
right there - my pad
'cause then my favorite line
fused by Robin Williams spine
would play dead poets - bad
 
NewlyRetired said:
I feel like there is something else in play because from what little was announced today, it does not make much sense.  I feel this is a piece of bigger plan not yet clear.  Here are some random comments

* Turner is paying $60 million a year for just the English rights (Univision won the Spanish rights).  The $60m for the English rights alone is said to be a SIGNIFICANT jump in rates from the previous number Fox was paying for both the English and Spanish rights combined.

* Turner is going to have a create their soccer infrastructure from scratch since they have none.  The last real soccer game they showed was in the 1990 World Cup from Italy.

* When Turner enters the game, that gives 5 major broadcast players a piece of soccer as Turner will join Univision, NBC, ESPN and Fox leaving I believe only CBS as the loan major player with out a significant soccer property.

* Fox supposedly only offered a token bid to retain the rights.  That seems to indicate to me that they know what kind of revenue they can expect and that the Turner bid is so outrageously high, there has to be something else related else this is almost certainly going to be a money loser for them.

* MLS I am sure is paying close attention to this as they are about to enter year 3 of a 5 year TV deal and if Turner is getting ready to expand their soccer properties, they may very well get involved in the next round of bidding which should be in late 2018.
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I feel disappointed in ESPN for not bidding on it.  In my opinion, ESPN is making a huge mistake in this area.  This is perfect for them.

The problem with the CL on Turner is that they don't have the ability to "expand the game" all that much. 

But ESPN can really expand the game.  I feel like ESPN could devote Sportscenter time to the CL, and could help America realize how big of an event this is worldwide.

Take me for instance.  4 years ago, I honestly never heard of the Champions League.  Had no idea it existed, even though I consider myself an avid sports fan.  ESPN could change that (slowly).  Turner doesnt' have the same ability. 

It's a shame that one of the biggest sporting events in the world is almost unknown by most American sports fans.  There needs to be a general awakening of the public to this event, and then you could see the numbers spike.

 
shader said:
I feel disappointed in ESPN for not bidding on it.  In my opinion, ESPN is making a huge mistake in this area.  This is perfect for them.

The problem with the CL on Turner is that they don't have the ability to "expand the game" all that much. 

But ESPN can really expand the game.  I feel like ESPN could devote Sportscenter time to the CL, and could help America realize how big of an event this is worldwide.

Take me for instance.  4 years ago, I honestly never heard of the Champions League.  Had no idea it existed, even though I consider myself an avid sports fan.  ESPN could change that (slowly).  Turner doesnt' have the same ability. 

It's a shame that one of the biggest sporting events in the world is almost unknown by most American sports fans.  There needs to be a general awakening of the public to this event, and then you could see the numbers spike.
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ESPN is tapped out with an expense model currently in place for 2014-5 subscription numbers.  I seriously doubt they bid on any expensive soccer property save MLS and maybe the WC for the foreseeable future (relatively cheap Euros notwithstanding).

I have no idea what Turner will do, but they are in the NBA, MLB, and the NCAA tourney and manage those digital properties.  In some respects they are the #2 non-major network sports network today.  I generally find their production of those events perfectly fine and in some cases the best in the business (they generally hire smart broadcasters who they let talk in free form ways).    

My guess is the viewers aren't there for this type of package, but TNT does have better reach than any of the Fox Sports branded entities (just behind ESPN FWIW) and knows how to stream things on the web.

 
shader said:
I feel disappointed in ESPN for not bidding on it.  In my opinion, ESPN is making a huge mistake in this area.  This is perfect for them..
Click to expand...
ESPN did bid on it.  They supposedly came in way ahead of the Fox bid in terms of both $ and exposure but the Turner bid was still significantly higher.

 
shader said:
I feel disappointed in ESPN for not bidding on it.  In my opinion, ESPN is making a huge mistake in this area.  This is perfect for them.

The problem with the CL on Turner is that they don't have the ability to "expand the game" all that much. 

But ESPN can really expand the game.  I feel like ESPN could devote Sportscenter time to the CL, and could help America realize how big of an event this is worldwide.

Take me for instance.  4 years ago, I honestly never heard of the Champions League.  Had no idea it existed, even though I consider myself an avid sports fan.  ESPN could change that (slowly).  Turner doesnt' have the same ability. 

It's a shame that one of the biggest sporting events in the world is almost unknown by most American sports fans.  There needs to be a general awakening of the public to this event, and then you could see the numbers spike.
Click to expand...
I'll play devils advocate on Champions League.  It is a great competition in many ways, but is really more of an exhibition and I'm not certain the value is all that great for a US-based network. The obvious difficulty with Champions League is the timing - every game other than the final is a weekday afternoon in the US. The fact is that even big fans are going to find it difficult to watch the great majority of the games. But I think there are a few less-obvious factors as well.  Many of the group stage games are either lopsided or are cagey cautious games involving teams trying to do just enough to get a result midweek. The final game or two in many of the groups each year are mathematically meaningless. Then you get into the tactics of a two-leg knock out round, which often renders many games less interesting. The fact of Champions League is there are a dozen hours of relatively meaningless or lopsided football for every hour of great drama. I find myself mostly just watching the highlight shows on matchweeks, then trying to catch select knockout games when I can.

 
CletiusMaximus said:
I'll play devils advocate on Champions League.  It is a great competition in many ways, but is really more of an exhibition and I'm not certain the value is all that great for a US-based network. The obvious difficulty with Champions League is the timing - every game other than the final is a weekday afternoon in the US. The fact is that even big fans are going to find it difficult to watch the great majority of the games. But I think there are a few less-obvious factors as well.  Many of the group stage games are either lopsided or are cagey cautious games involving teams trying to do just enough to get a result midweek. The final game or two in many of the groups each year are mathematically meaningless. Then you get into the tactics of a two-leg knock out round, which often renders many games less interesting. The fact of Champions League is there are a dozen hours of relatively meaningless or lopsided football for every hour of great drama. I find myself mostly just watching the highlight shows on matchweeks, then trying to catch select knockout games when I can.
Click to expand...
Good points; that makes sense.

 
CletiusMaximus said:
I'll play devils advocate on Champions League.  It is a great competition in many ways, but is really more of an exhibition and I'm not certain the value is all that great for a US-based network. The obvious difficulty with Champions League is the timing - every game other than the final is a weekday afternoon in the US. The fact is that even big fans are going to find it difficult to watch the great majority of the games. But I think there are a few less-obvious factors as well.  Many of the group stage games are either lopsided or are cagey cautious games involving teams trying to do just enough to get a result midweek. The final game or two in many of the groups each year are mathematically meaningless. Then you get into the tactics of a two-leg knock out round, which often renders many games less interesting. The fact of Champions League is there are a dozen hours of relatively meaningless or lopsided football for every hour of great drama. I find myself mostly just watching the highlight shows on matchweeks, then trying to catch select knockout games when I can.
Click to expand...
I agree that the format of the Champions League could use some adjusting.  100% agree.  However, I don't agree that it's an "exhibition".  It's the elite club competition, is it not?  

I complained last year that the CL didn't feel "big enough" and was poked fun at on this board for that opinion.  I suspect that opinion is one that you could have here in America, because we aren't surrounded by the "excitement" of the CL on a daily basis.  There aren't water-cooler discussions, it's not on ESPN, etc.

All that being said though, I do feel that there are significant ways to improve the CL and I hope they'll do that in the future.  

 
The Revs might be the worst run soccer organization in the US but damn, I have to give them props for their season ticket package that I just received in the mail.

For $285, this is what I got:

* 1 Season pass to The Fort (supporters section in Gillette) for 17 regular season home games

* A ticket and bus transportation to an away game (typically one of the NY games)

* a Revolution jacket, sticker price of $90

* free parking at every regular season game

 
I am a little disappointed the Fox Champions League "Red Zone" copycat - "Multimatch 90" - never really caught on.  It seemed like a great idea in theory, but in the end was very hard to get into in real life. On the rare occasion I found myself at home on a Champions League group stage matchday, where I didn't care enough about any one game to want to watch it, but was nonetheless willing and able to sit on the couch for 2+ hours switching among all the live games, it was pretty awesome.  Honestly, its a very good thing that wasn't around back when I was in college. Me, my roomies and our bong would have never left the house on group stage afternoons.

 
Don Garber officially announced at the DC United stadium ground breaking that he is likely to die before retiring.

========================

“Our league needed one of its most historic — if not its most historic team — to be a frontrunner as opposed to being one of those teams that just couldn’t get it done,” Garber said.“So we have one more to do in New England,” Garber said, smiling. “I think that’s the one where I might hang up the cleats, at that groundbreaking.”

 
El Floppo said:
:wub:  
Click to expand...
I think nearly every single NE fan agrees with most of what he has to say.  Even if it would suck to lose the team, eventually you can not trade on items that happened 13 years ago while the rest of the league moves forward.   

And this is far from a case of incompetence, these are not dumb men who own the Revs, they simply don't care.  As long as the Revs balance sheet is some where in the +/- $1 million range, they don't care what else happens.

 
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So this is all too exciting to not share... (hey look at me)

Philly Union is going to be sending some scouts down to my youngest son's club to scout him for potentially adding him to their youth academy.  It's all pretty surreal for me right now, but I'm so proud of him for even being recognized as a potential candidate for their academy.  I can't believe a fricken' MLS team is coming down to see my 8yr old play soccer.  

It started with a couple emails from his coach this weekend and has quickly moved to them setting him up to train/play with his club's 2006 A team (he's a 2008) in prep for the scouts coming to see him in a few weeks.  They want him to show well with the 2006's since that's more on par with what they expect out of their 2008 boys.  He's been doing really well in that 04/05 urban league I'm coaching (got his first goal and an assist on Sunday), so hopefully he'll keep that up in the coming weeks.   

It's killing me to not tell him about it, but I don't see any upside in telling him about it.  I did tell him that coach wants him to start working with the 06 team, but I didn't tell him about the scouts.  No need to add that pressure, IMO.  I'll let him in on it if (or when) they want to personally meet him, but I'm assuming the scouting will just be on the sidelines watching him do his thing... :shrug:  

If anyone has any thoughts/tips on how to handle this, I'm all ears - this is uncharted territory for us.

 
Ned said:
So this is all too exciting to not share... (hey look at me)

Philly Union is going to be sending some scouts down to my youngest son's club to scout him for potentially adding him to their youth academy.  It's all pretty surreal for me right now, but I'm so proud of him for even being recognized as a potential candidate for their academy.  I can't believe a fricken' MLS team is coming down to see my 8yr old play soccer.  

It started with a couple emails from his coach this weekend and has quickly moved to them setting him up to train/play with his club's 2006 A team (he's a 2008) in prep for the scouts coming to see him in a few weeks.  They want him to show well with the 2006's since that's more on par with what they expect out of their 2008 boys.  He's been doing really well in that 04/05 urban league I'm coaching (got his first goal and an assist on Sunday), so hopefully he'll keep that up in the coming weeks.   

It's killing me to not tell him about it, but I don't see any upside in telling him about it.  I did tell him that coach wants him to start working with the 06 team, but I didn't tell him about the scouts.  No need to add that pressure, IMO.  I'll let him in on it if (or when) they want to personally meet him, but I'm assuming the scouting will just be on the sidelines watching him do his thing... :shrug:  

If anyone has any thoughts/tips on how to handle this, I'm all ears - this is uncharted territory for us.
Click to expand...
Awesome.  I wouldn't tell him either.  No need to make him nervous and possibly play bad.  

 
Ned said:
So this is all too exciting to not share... (hey look at me)

Philly Union is going to be sending some scouts down to my youngest son's club to scout him for potentially adding him to their youth academy.  It's all pretty surreal for me right now, but I'm so proud of him for even being recognized as a potential candidate for their academy.  I can't believe a fricken' MLS team is coming down to see my 8yr old play soccer.  

It started with a couple emails from his coach this weekend and has quickly moved to them setting him up to train/play with his club's 2006 A team (he's a 2008) in prep for the scouts coming to see him in a few weeks.  They want him to show well with the 2006's since that's more on par with what they expect out of their 2008 boys.  He's been doing really well in that 04/05 urban league I'm coaching (got his first goal and an assist on Sunday), so hopefully he'll keep that up in the coming weeks.   

It's killing me to not tell him about it, but I don't see any upside in telling him about it.  I did tell him that coach wants him to start working with the 06 team, but I didn't tell him about the scouts.  No need to add that pressure, IMO.  I'll let him in on it if (or when) they want to personally meet him, but I'm assuming the scouting will just be on the sidelines watching him do his thing... :shrug:  

If anyone has any thoughts/tips on how to handle this, I'm all ears - this is uncharted territory for us.
Click to expand...
:thumbup:

 
Very cool, Ned.  If you'd like to prepare him for the experience, I specialize in detailed criticisms of 8 year olds' games. 

"Shocking first touch.  No screen time for you this week."

 
I feel the internet problems yesterday prevented us from laughing at that ridiculous goal that brought Newcastle level.   Hysterical that it's probably going to be the most important moment in deciding who wins the Championship (which doesn't really matter as I'm guessing Brighton goes up automatically too, but ...).

 
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
I feel the internet problems yesterday prevented us from laughing at that ridiculous goal that brought Newcastle level.   Hysterical that it's probably going to be the most important moment in deciding who wins the Championship (which doesn't really matter as I'm guessing Brighton goes up automatically too, but ...).
Click to expand...
:lmao:  I saw it live and thought of this place immediately. :sadbanana:  

Yedlin looked like the same Yedlin to me.  I'm not sure where the hype is coming from :shrug:  

He did put in a good cross right before half time, but otherwise he was the same speedy character that gave the ball up too easily.  He looked like a 10yr old just booting the ball for the sake of kicking it.  His D was pretty solid, though.  He got the better of Murphy for the most part.

 
Ned said:
:lmao:  I saw it live and thought of this place immediately. :sadbanana:  

Yedlin looked like the same Yedlin to me.  I'm not sure where the hype is coming from :shrug:  

He did put in a good cross right before half time, but otherwise he was the same speedy character that gave the ball up too easily.  He looked like a 10yr old just booting the ball for the sake of kicking it.  His D was pretty solid, though.  He got the better of Murphy for the most part.
Click to expand...
So, you are saying your kid belongs on the USMNT over Yedlin?  I could see that.

 
Poke_4_Life said:
Ned said:
So this is all too exciting to not share... (hey look at me)

Philly Union is going to be sending some scouts down to my youngest son's club to scout him for potentially adding him to their youth academy.  It's all pretty surreal for me right now, but I'm so proud of him for even being recognized as a potential candidate for their academy.  I can't believe a fricken' MLS team is coming down to see my 8yr old play soccer.  

It started with a couple emails from his coach this weekend and has quickly moved to them setting him up to train/play with his club's 2006 A team (he's a 2008) in prep for the scouts coming to see him in a few weeks.  They want him to show well with the 2006's since that's more on par with what they expect out of their 2008 boys.  He's been doing really well in that 04/05 urban league I'm coaching (got his first goal and an assist on Sunday), so hopefully he'll keep that up in the coming weeks.   

It's killing me to not tell him about it, but I don't see any upside in telling him about it.  I did tell him that coach wants him to start working with the 06 team, but I didn't tell him about the scouts.  No need to add that pressure, IMO.  I'll let him in on it if (or when) they want to personally meet him, but I'm assuming the scouting will just be on the sidelines watching him do his thing... :shrug:  

If anyone has any thoughts/tips on how to handle this, I'm all ears - this is uncharted territory for us.
Click to expand...
Awesome.  I wouldn't tell him either.  No need to make him nervous and possibly play bad.  
Click to expand...
agree. just let him play, and let the play speak for itself. if they do introduce themselves or request anything- make sure he does whatever they ask.

I'm remembering a strange national team tryout held for my state team when I was 15. Usually they just scouted tournaments between states and regions and pulled players that way. not sure what happened this year, but they had our state hastily schedule a game for them to watch. We played against the u19 state cup champs and I remember thinking this was a possible once in a lifetime opportunity to get in front of the US staff... so I was going to go all out. except... I was playing on the flank and the opposing player on my side only had one arm and made crazy wheezing sounds when he ran (ahuuuuh, ahuuuuh). the whole thing completely freaked me out and took my off my game. I didn't make the national team. but that is where I got the nice comment about my skills from one of them (to my coach). 

so I guess my advice is to ####### run if ned jr sees a wheezing one-armed kid on the field.

 
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El Floppo said:
agree. just let him play, and let the play speak for itself. if they do introduce themselves or request anything- make sure he does whatever they ask.

I'm remembering a strange national team tryout held for my state team when I was 15. Usually they just scouted tournaments between states and regions and pulled players that way. not sure what happened this year, but they had our state hastily schedule a game for them to watch. We played against the u19 state cup champs and I remember thinking this was a possible once in a lifetime opportunity to get in front of the US staff... so I was going to go all out. except... I was playing on the flank and the opposing player on my side only had one arm and made crazy wheezing sounds when he ran (ahuuuuh, ahuuuuh). the whole thing completely freaked me out and took my off my game. I didn't make the national team. but that is where I got the nice comment about my skills from one of them (to my coach). 

so I guess my advice is to ####### run if ned jr sees a wheezing one-armed kid on the field.
Click to expand...
:lmao:  

Very cool you had that experience, though. 

 
herculez gomez ✔@herculezg

Mexican officials will look at eliminating Pro/Relegation, looking for more economic growth & stability.

 
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
@roadkill1292 just became a Trump supporter.
Click to expand...
Never. I don't know how the futbol climate is down there on the local level but we're still making a huge mistake not moving aggressively in the Pro/Rel direction. You want to dominate talent procurement in Argentina and Brazil? Then have a giant national system with lots of clubs for those guys to play for. After you've survived the slums of Sao Paulo, even Altoona will look good.

 
roadkill1292 said:
Never. I don't know how the futbol climate is down there on the local level but we're still making a huge mistake not moving aggressively in the Pro/Rel direction. You want to dominate talent procurement in Argentina and Brazil? Then have a giant national system with lots of clubs for those guys to play for. After you've survived the slums of Sao Paulo, even Altoona will look good.
Click to expand...
I grew up in the favela... preach, brother.

 
Speaking of the magic of Pro/Rel -- In Barry Hearn's last match as owner in 2015, Leyton Orient were penalty kicks away from being promoted to the Championship.  He sold to an Italian businessman, they got relegated last season, and they're being wound down today. 

 
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
Speaking of the magic of Pro/Rel -- In Barry Hearn's last match as owner in 2015, Leyton Orient were penalty kicks away from being promoted to the Championship.  He sold to an Italian businessman, they got relegated last season, and they're being wound down today. 
Click to expand...
You know that the financial stability argument is never gonna be a winner with me. It's all about the ecstasy and the agony. It's about dreams of promotion glory and going up to play Binghamton or Jonesboro next season. It's about my growing potential Leeds boner.

 
Ned said:
It's killing me to not tell him about it, but I don't see any upside in telling him about it.
Click to expand...
100% agree with this Ned.  No matter what happens or how far this goes, make it all seem as normal as possible for him.

 
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