Player Spotlight: David Wilson, RB, New York Giants (1 Viewer)

[Tanner9919]

Giants avg'd 4.6yc in two of last three seasons..they had 480 r/a in 2010 and I expect them to come somewhere near that number this season, lets say 450. Andre. Brown is nothing more than a filler at RB at this point, he simply cant stay healthy, and this means a ton of carries for Wilson. People are overthinking this...when

a) Giants draft a rb in first round , they plan to use him .a lot.

b) when they let Bradshaw walk it was a good indication of what they plan to do with Wilson.

Wilsons talents are off the charts..as someone else mentioned he had some long runs last season..thats the sign of good things to come as the Giants will use him like Tiki Barber, i.e., upwards of 300-310 carries..the reason I believe this is because of the lack of depth at rb - other than an oft-injured Brown, there isnt anyone there to steal carries from him.they havent signed a vet, and probably wont.and they dont draft rbs in first round to have them sit. Please dont mention Ryan Torrain - since when is he a threat to steal carries from anyone? There is a reason he has bounced around the NFL..and he is more injury prone than Brown..

as one poster mentioned Wilson is going to be a top five pick in '14..i suspect that after the first preseason game Wilson is going to become a familiar name, and by draft day, he should be a high draft pick..he isnt going to be a cheap 5th rounder by then..he is going to be a well known commodity..

dont worry about him not being used at the goalline he is going to score his tds from 10+yards out anyways.

12tds

300 1560 5.2 per carry,

 

[Touchdown There]

Giants avg'd 4.6yc in two of last three seasons..they had 480 r/a in 2010 and I expect them to come somewhere near that number this season, lets say 450. Andre. Brown is nothing more than a filler at RB at this point, he simply cant stay healthy, and this means a ton of carries for Wilson. People are overthinking this...when

a) Giants draft a rb in first round , they plan to use him .a lot.

b) when they let Bradshaw walk it was a good indication of what they plan to do with Wilson.

Wilsons talents are off the charts..as someone else mentioned he had some long runs last season..thats the sign of good things to come as the Giants will use him like Tiki Barber, i.e., upwards of 300-310 carries..the reason I believe this is because of the lack of depth at rb - other than an oft-injured Brown, there isnt anyone there to steal carries from him.they havent signed a vet, and probably wont.and they dont draft rbs in first round to have them sit. Please dont mention Ryan Torrain - since when is he a threat to steal carries from anyone? There is a reason he has bounced around the NFL..and he is more injury prone than Brown..

as one poster mentioned Wilson is going to be a top five pick in '14..i suspect that after the first preseason game Wilson is going to become a familiar name, and by draft day, he should be a high draft pick..he isnt going to be a cheap 5th rounder by then..he is going to be a well known commodity..

dont worry about him not being used at the goalline he is going to score his tds from 10+yards out anyways.

12tds

300 1560 5.2 per carry,

Ballsy. I like it.

 

[Biabreakable]

Giants avg'd 4.6yc in two of last three seasons..they had 480 r/a in 2010 and I expect them to come somewhere near that number this season, lets say 450. Andre. Brown is nothing more than a filler at RB at this point, he simply cant stay healthy, and this means a ton of carries for Wilson. People are overthinking this...when

a) Giants draft a rb in first round , they plan to use him .a lot.

b) when they let Bradshaw walk it was a good indication of what they plan to do with Wilson.

Wilsons talents are off the charts..as someone else mentioned he had some long runs last season..thats the sign of good things to come as the Giants will use him like Tiki Barber, i.e., upwards of 300-310 carries..the reason I believe this is because of the lack of depth at rb - other than an oft-injured Brown, there isnt anyone there to steal carries from him.they havent signed a vet, and probably wont.and they dont draft rbs in first round to have them sit. Please dont mention Ryan Torrain - since when is he a threat to steal carries from anyone? There is a reason he has bounced around the NFL..and he is more injury prone than Brown..

as one poster mentioned Wilson is going to be a top five pick in '14..i suspect that after the first preseason game Wilson is going to become a familiar name, and by draft day, he should be a high draft pick..he isnt going to be a cheap 5th rounder by then..he is going to be a well known commodity..

dont worry about him not being used at the goalline he is going to score his tds from 10+yards out anyways.

12tds

300 1560 5.2 per carry,

Ballsy. I like it.

He also has him ranked over AD from that spotlight thread-

you can put him down for roughly 1400 rush yards and 12 TDs once again. he's going to come back to the pack this season ( won't approach 2k yards)..a very dependable first round pick.

So Wilson is projected to run for more yards than Peterson. Alrighty then!

 

[Koya]

300 carries??? Not going to happen.

 

[meyerj31]

300 carries??? Not going to happen.

Yea, this is dumb. Shocked if he went over 240. You don't run the ball 300 times with one guy when you have Eli Manning, Victor Cruz, and Hakeem Nicks, and a below average run blocking front line.

Dumb.

 

[Eminence]

300 carries??? Not going to happen.

Yea, this is dumb. Shocked if he went over 240. You don't run the ball 300 times with one guy when you have Eli Manning, Victor Cruz, and Hakeem Nicks, and a below average run blocking front line.

Dumb.

...and with a RB that weighs 205lbs. What concerns me is that there are some big hitters in this league that will send him flying.

 

[Sabertooth]

300 carries??? Not going to happen.

Yea, this is dumb. Shocked if he went over 240. You don't run the ball 300 times with one guy when you have Eli Manning, Victor Cruz, and Hakeem Nicks, and a below average run blocking front line.

Dumb.

...and with a RB that weighs 205lbs. What concerns me is that there are some big hitters in this league that will send him flying.

Enjoy starting Sjax over Lesean McCoy this year then I guess. Lot's of little backs in the NFL.

 

[meyerj31]

300 carries??? Not going to happen.

Yea, this is dumb. Shocked if he went over 240. You don't run the ball 300 times with one guy when you have Eli Manning, Victor Cruz, and Hakeem Nicks, and a below average run blocking front line.

Dumb.

...and with a RB that weighs 205lbs. What concerns me is that there are some big hitters in this league that will send him flying.

Enjoy starting Sjax over Lesean McCoy this year then I guess. Lot's of little backs in the NFL.

Yea, weight isn't an issue. Charles is only 199 lbs and everyone has him pegged for 300+ touches. CJ, many others are Wilson's weight or smaller and can take higher workloads.

Offensive philosophy and need are two of the main reasons he isn't going to touch the ball 300 times. Plus I'm sure Coughlin thinks he'll be more effective mixing him in with their aerial attack and keeping it all balanced. I like the Giants this year just for the fact that they have all the pieces you need to win and nobody is talking about them.

 

[Leonidas]

300 carries??? Not going to happen.

Yea, this is dumb. Shocked if he went over 240. You don't run the ball 300 times with one guy when you have Eli Manning, Victor Cruz, and Hakeem Nicks, and a below average run blocking front line.

Dumb.

...and with a RB that weighs 205lbs. What concerns me is that there are some big hitters in this league that will send him flying.

I suppose you are concerned with these guys for being too light?

Chris Johnson: 190 lbs

Jamaal Charles: 199 lbs

Lesean McCoy: 207 lbs

Maurice Jones-Drew: 207 lbs

I've been watching and reading the back and forth about Wilson for awhile and I just can't get over how the guys who are low on Wilson misrepresent facts (or get them downright incorrect, notably regarding fumbles) or get all 'concerned' about things like the above that just seems like grasping at straws.

 

[TheFanatic]

I don't know. I was just stating that with more touches and more yards also COULD arise a negative.

In what world does more touched and yards possible equal a negative. All we want from all our players is more touches and yards, and hopefully more trips to the endzone...

 

[TheFanatic]

Giants avg'd 4.6yc in two of last three seasons..they had 480 r/a in 2010 and I expect them to come somewhere near that number this season, lets say 450. Andre. Brown is nothing more than a filler at RB at this point, he simply cant stay healthy, and this means a ton of carries for Wilson. People are overthinking this...when

a) Giants draft a rb in first round , they plan to use him .a lot.

b) when they let Bradshaw walk it was a good indication of what they plan to do with Wilson.

Wilsons talents are off the charts..as someone else mentioned he had some long runs last season..thats the sign of good things to come as the Giants will use him like Tiki Barber, i.e., upwards of 300-310 carries..the reason I believe this is because of the lack of depth at rb - other than an oft-injured Brown, there isnt anyone there to steal carries from him.they havent signed a vet, and probably wont.and they dont draft rbs in first round to have them sit. Please dont mention Ryan Torrain - since when is he a threat to steal carries from anyone? There is a reason he has bounced around the NFL..and he is more injury prone than Brown..

as one poster mentioned Wilson is going to be a top five pick in '14..i suspect that after the first preseason game Wilson is going to become a familiar name, and by draft day, he should be a high draft pick..he isnt going to be a cheap 5th rounder by then..he is going to be a well known commodity..

dont worry about him not being used at the goalline he is going to score his tds from 10+yards out anyways.

12tds

300 1560 5.2 per carry,

Ballsy. I like it.

He also has him ranked over AD from that spotlight thread-

you can put him down for roughly 1400 rush yards and 12 TDs once again. he's going to come back to the pack this season ( won't approach 2k yards)..a very dependable first round pick.

So Wilson is projected to run for more yards than Peterson. Alrighty then!

I own both ADP and Wilson in one league. I full expect ADP to fall back to the mean this year. I also expect a big year from Wilson. Wouldn't surprise me at all if Wilson had more yards than ADP. I don't think he will do it, but I don't think he will be all that far from ADP in terms of yardage...

 

[Leonidas]

I own both ADP and Wilson in one league. I full expect ADP to fall back to the mean this year. I also expect a big year from Wilson. Wouldn't surprise me at all if Wilson had more yards than ADP. I don't think he will do it, but I don't think he will be all that far from ADP in terms of yardage...

Would that be his career-mean of 1,730 yards from scrimmage per year?

 

[TheFanatic]

I own both ADP and Wilson in one league. I full expect ADP to fall back to the mean this year. I also expect a big year from Wilson. Wouldn't surprise me at all if Wilson had more yards than ADP. I don't think he will do it, but I don't think he will be all that far from ADP in terms of yardage...

Would that be his career-mean of 1,730 yards from scrimmage per year?

Sure. I see Wilson being within a couple hundred yards from that...

 

[Monsters of the Midway]

I can't quit David Wilson. Reached for him last year, suffered through Grampa Coughlin's irrational, "cut off nose to spite face" benching, lowered my expectations.

Well, they are back up again. I think that he presents a huge value right now going off the board at http://subscribers.footballguys.com/apps/adp.php?viewpos=rb&sortby=consensus'>RB 20. I do think that will rise as we go through the preseason.

I'm not worried about another knee jerk benching and I'm also not worried about concussed journeyman Andre Brown. I'm a cautious drafter (to a fault probably) but I'm holding my 2nd round pick for Wilson in redraft. And I agree with whoever said that he will be a 1st round pick next year.

 

[Leonidas]

Full disclosure...as of two days ago I am now a Wilson owner. I took him with the 50th pick (5.10), RB21, in a public Yahoo money league, as my primary RB2 (RBBC for my RB2 spot, took Sproles and McFadden at picks 70/71)

Seems worthwhile to me.

 

[Eminence]

300 carries??? Not going to happen.

Yea, this is dumb. Shocked if he went over 240. You don't run the ball 300 times with one guy when you have Eli Manning, Victor Cruz, and Hakeem Nicks, and a below average run blocking front line.

Dumb.

...and with a RB that weighs 205lbs. What concerns me is that there are some big hitters in this league that will send him flying.

I suppose you are concerned with these guys for being too light?

Chris Johnson: 190 lbs

Jamaal Charles: 199 lbs

Lesean McCoy: 207 lbs

Maurice Jones-Drew: 207 lbs

I've been watching and reading the back and forth about Wilson for awhile and I just can't get over how the guys who are low on Wilson misrepresent facts (or get them downright incorrect, notably regarding fumbles) or get all 'concerned' about things like the above that just seems like grasping at straws.

Considering the discussion was whether or not he'd rush the ball over 300 times, I think you're the only one misrepresenting the facts here. Chris Johnson and Maurice Jones-Drew are the only players on your list that have ever ran the ball over 300 times in a given season. More often than not, they haven't and it's not close.

My point is, I've seen this guy get tackled and get thrown; abused:

http://www.dallascowboys.com/multimedia/videos/Cowboys-Force-Fumble/a2e7fe0e-1746-4ace-8e1e-7d928f9f642a

It's not that I'm ignoring the big plays he busted off last-year. But like I've said before, these are plays that guys like Leon Washington or Jerious Norwood could have made. Perfect blocking, sprint down the lane, footrace with the safety. That's great and all, but you have to remember these are plays a Rookie made against defenses that had been playing full-time all season.

THESIS: I don't think Wilson can remain nearly as explosive over a 16-game schedule and I don't think he has enough moves in his arsenal to avoid hits; rather he embraces contact which is a very bad thing for a back that weighs 205lbs.

If he had a vicious juke or spin-move I'd be right on bored, but besides that all he can hope for is to run by everyone like a scatback.

 

[TheFanatic]

If he had a vicious juke or spin-move I'd be right on bored, but besides that all he can hope for is to run by everyone like a scatback.

Are we watching the same film? I don't see him nearly that one dimensional...

 

[Koya]

If he had a vicious juke or spin-move I'd be right on bored, but besides that all he can hope for is to run by everyone like a scatback.

Are we watching the same film? I don't see him nearly that one dimensional...

He is not a "small" back, nor a "scat back" nor one dimensional. He actually has surprising power and great shiftiness.

That said, he is not a bowling ball ala MJD (who is packing that weight on a 5'5" frame) and while not small, he is not big, either, nor does he "run mad" like Ahmad Bradshaw.

Regardless, anyone thinking he is getting 300 carries must be on crack or not know of his role, the team nor watched him play.

 

[SWC]

he will not get three hondo carries hell there is a better chance that i get three hondo carries this year and believe me no one wnats to see this old dog line up and take a snap and then get blasted into infinity by clay matthews so i think he gets about two hondo carries and averages over 4 and gets a mess of long tds because he is a burner take that to the bank brohans

 

[Eminence]

he will not get three hondo carries hell there is a better chance that i get three hondo carries this year and believe me no one wnats to see this old dog line up and take a snap and then get blasted into infinity by clay matthews so i think he gets about two hondo carries and averages over 4 and gets a mess of long tds because he is a burner take that to the bank brohans

...I actually 100% agree.

 

[Sabertooth]

David Wilson is the most talented back the Giants have had since Tiki. Those thinking he's going to be eased in our kid gloved are mistaken. He's the real deal. He was rated right next to Doug Martin last season and you know what, he belongs there still. Nothing has changed. He's better than any back from this class by a good margin.

I think we see roughly (assuming 16 games)

260 carries

1200 yards

40 receptions

250 yards

11 total touchdowns.

 

[dewaser]

Can't decide on who to keep as my last keeper... Wilson or Lamar Miller. Wilson has some extreme upside, but I feel like in his 2nd season we're not gonna see his full potential. It may take a few years for Coughlin to give Wilson the amount of carries that would make him a top 5 back. Miller on the other hand, will probably have Leach as his fullback, which is very tempting, and will have no competition for carries. What are some thoughts on this issue? Its gonna be a tough decision

 

[Biabreakable]

I just moved SWC up to sleeper pick in this years hondo competition.

 

[netnalp]

If he had a vicious juke or spin-move I'd be right on bored, but besides that all he can hope for is to run by everyone like a scatback.

Are we watching the same film? I don't see him nearly that one dimensional...

He is not a "small" back, nor a "scat back" nor one dimensional. He actually has surprising power and great shiftiness.

That said, he is not a bowling ball ala MJD (who is packing that weight on a 5'5" frame) and while not small, he is not big, either, nor does he "run mad" like Ahmad Bradshaw.

Regardless, anyone thinking he is getting 300 carries must be on crack or not know of his role, the team nor watched him play.

He can juke, has a good spin move and will make those trying to arm tackle him look silly. In the Highlights below, Wilson even tosses a DB I believe out of his way with one arm. Knocks a Saints defender loopy too.

http://www.bigblueinteractive.com/2013/07/01/pre-training-camp-a-look-at-the-running-backs/

Looking at the Brown highlights, I can't help thinking "Wilson takes that to the house." on many of the runs.

 

[Khy]

Man this thread has more misguided generalizations of a player, team and system then I've ever seen. Here's the list I've gathered so far:

1) Wilson is to small to take a full load: What? As mentioned several times here: Jamaal Charles, McCoy, CJ all the same size and stature and nobody is mentioning them as a injury risk. This is just silly, Wilson has zero history of injuries and there is no reason to think he'll see them with a full load.

2) He can't get 300 carries because of the system: Tiki Barber saw 357 carries in 2005 and 327 carries in 2006. In those years Eli through for 522 attempts in 2005 and 529 attempts in 2006. To compare the last 3 seasons Eli has gone for 539, 589, 536. In 2005 and 2006 the Giants ran for 29.3 carries per game and 28.4 carries per game. In 2010 they attempted 30 carries per game, 2011 they had 25.6 (the worst rushing season for the team in the past decade) and in 2012 they had 25.6. The simple fact is when the running game works, the Giants will always opt to over utilize it. This is a proven 100% fact, Tom Coughlin loves to run. The past two years the rushing attack has been horrible for the team and that's why the carries per game have plummeted. That said Eli's attempts haven't really jumped all that much besides 2011. Realize also an effective running game also means more overall plays run per game. I'm not saying he will see 300 carries but it's 100% a possibility and in no way something I see as impossible.

3) He will be put in the doghouse after he fumbles again: What possible proof is there for this? If anything all the proof is against it in a Coughlin run offense. Sure, if he comes out in Week 1 and fumbles 3 times this maybe an issue. But if he comes out in Week 1 and fumbles he's not going to be benched. Coughlin has proven this every season he's been the Giants head coach. Tiki, Jacobs and Bradshaw have all had significant fumble numbers and not been pulled from their carries. He wasn't sat last year because of the fumble. He was sat because of his immaturity in handling of the situation he was placed in after that fumble. There is a HUGE difference. This is probably the biggest misconception of all of them. Bradshaw was released... Hernandez has a better chance of beating his murder case than Brown does of staying healthy for a full season. David Wilson is T-H-E G-U-Y. Nobody else he will see a large majority of the carries this season and as I said above I think he will be a guarantee for 250 and has the upside of 300 carries.

4) Wilson's high running style is a problem for him: As someone mentioned above Peterson and also Foster have a very high running style. Sure in most backs it causes problems for them while trying to break tackles. But watching Wilson's college and highlights from last season you can see he breaks tackles fairly frequently. He also isn't afraid to drop his shoulder and truck someone.

 

[SWC]

khy do not try to influence me with your stats and stuff like that man this is about yelling at people and being cool try to get with the program brohan good post actually but i still disagree with him ever getting three hondo carries eli throws much more now than when tiki the trash talking loser was there and the wrs they have a really good right now i just do not see them saying hey we have all of these weapons all over the joint lets just run every time also the game has changed a lot since tiki the trash talking losers time and not many teams go feature back its all spread o and chuck it around and hey that is how the giants won super bowls so that is my thought on that brohan but like i said good post but i do not think those stats are applicable today any more take that to the bank

 

[Pigskin Fanatic]

Man this thread has more misguided generalizations of a player, team and system then I've ever seen. Here's the list I've gathered so far:

1) Wilson is to small to take a full load: What? As mentioned several times here: Jamaal Charles, McCoy, CJ all the same size and stature and nobody is mentioning them as a injury risk. This is just silly, Wilson has zero history of injuries and there is no reason to think he'll see them with a full load.

2) He can't get 300 carries because of the system: Tiki Barber saw 357 carries in 2005 and 327 carries in 2006. In those years Eli through for 522 attempts in 2005 and 529 attempts in 2006. To compare the last 3 seasons Eli has gone for 539, 589, 536. In 2005 and 2006 the Giants ran for 29.3 carries per game and 28.4 carries per game. In 2010 they attempted 30 carries per game, 2011 they had 25.6 (the worst rushing season for the team in the past decade) and in 2012 they had 25.6. The simple fact is when the running game works, the Giants will always opt to over utilize it. This is a proven 100% fact, Tom Coughlin loves to run. The past two years the rushing attack has been horrible for the team and that's why the carries per game have plummeted. That said Eli's attempts haven't really jumped all that much besides 2011. Realize also an effective running game also means more overall plays run per game. I'm not saying he will see 300 carries but it's 100% a possibility and in no way something I see as impossible.

3) He will be put in the doghouse after he fumbles again: What possible proof is there for this? If anything all the proof is against it in a Coughlin run offense. Sure, if he comes out in Week 1 and fumbles 3 times this maybe an issue. But if he comes out in Week 1 and fumbles he's not going to be benched. Coughlin has proven this every season he's been the Giants head coach. Tiki, Jacobs and Bradshaw have all had significant fumble numbers and not been pulled from their carries. He wasn't sat last year because of the fumble. He was sat because of his immaturity in handling of the situation he was placed in after that fumble. There is a HUGE difference. This is probably the biggest misconception of all of them. Bradshaw was released... Hernandez has a better chance of beating his murder case than Brown does of staying healthy for a full season. David Wilson is T-H-E G-U-Y. Nobody else he will see a large majority of the carries this season and as I said above I think he will be a guarantee for 250 and has the upside of 300 carries.

4) Wilson's high running style is a problem for him: As someone mentioned above Peterson and also Foster have a very high running style. Sure in most backs it causes problems for them while trying to break tackles. But watching Wilson's college and highlights from last season you can see he breaks tackles fairly frequently. He also isn't afraid to drop his shoulder and truck someone.

Agree with the overall sentiment, two additions here tho to your statements. On #2 SWC already summarized pretty much what I was gonna say. I don't see anyway he gets 300+ carries, otherwise agree with the statements, both Khy's and SWC's. On #4 I totally agree with this, but that last part of your statement, he isn't afraid to drop his shoulder and truck someone, that worries me. A lot. Someone else mentioned this earlier in the thread, some backs just know how to avoid hard contact to end their runs. At least last year Wilson was too willing to lower the shoulder. I don't see this as a good thing for the longetivity of a running back of any size, let alone this guy. Just my two cents.

Love the optimism across the board, can't wait for the training camps to open.

 

[Koya]

Could Wilson develop into a guy who ges 300 carries? Sure, possible.

Next year? Not going to happen.

These are "generalizations" made by a die hard giants fan who wants Wilson to succeed but recognizes there are others in the backfield, they guy is not a tank but well built and he is still earning trust and the offense is a passing offense.

 

[Monsters of the Midway]

On #2 SWC already summarized pretty much what I was gonna say.

Could you translate it for me?

 

[Khy]

Could Wilson develop into a guy who ges 300 carries? Sure, possible.

Next year? Not going to happen.

These are "generalizations" made by a die hard giants fan who wants Wilson to succeed but recognizes there are others in the backfield, they guy is not a tank but well built and he is still earning trust and the offense is a passing offense.

Yeah but trust can form pretty fast through the season. Look at... Victor Cruz for a good example. He started 2011 as the third string guy and ended as the #1 WR on the team. Wilson may start the season with the coaching staff projection him for 225 carries and finish with 300 carries. If he showcases the talent he put on the field last year with consistency. It's not that crazy to see happen. Again, I'm not saying he'll get 300 carries. I personally think he's a pretty good shot for 270 or so though. With 300 being that upside "We can't not give this guy the ball" type of mentality that could happen if he blows up like a lot of us are thinking he will.

And again, no he isn't a tank. But you don't have the be MJD to take 300 carries. Tiki was an inch taller and the same weight as Wilson is currently. Wilson's build is more or less the exact type of build you look for in a solid RB. Big enough to not die on contact, but slim enough to provide outstanding agility and quickness. He's not a bowling ball and he's not Chris Johnson he's that nice calm middle ground that you look for in a RB.

 

[netnalp]

I recall there being an article either on FBGs or from one of the mags that presented evidence that RBs around the 205 lb and 5'10" range tend to stay healthier during their careers than larger RBs. I'll try to find it.

 

[Pigskin Fanatic]

Antrel Rolle was on NFL Radio this morning on XM and they asked him about David Wilson. Two things he said caught my attention, one that they are asking him to split the load with Brown so they want him to do more as a running back than last year and two that he is a force on special teams and want him to build on the success on his return game. I may be reading into it too much since he isn't a coach or even on offense, but this sounds like Andre Brown is definitely in the mix in a bigger way that I would hope and that he will continue his role in special teams which I would hope stops to keep his legs fresh for the offensive role. He did say the team expects Wilson to be one of the leaders though, so that's somewhat promising.

 

[silentcoach]

Antrel Rolle was on NFL Radio this morning on XM and they asked him about David Wilson. Two things he said caught my attention, one that they are asking him to split the load with Brown so they want him to do more as a running back than last year and two that he is a force on special teams and want him to build on the success on his return game. I may be reading into it too much since he isn't a coach or even on offense, but this sounds like Andre Brown is definitely in the mix in a bigger way that I would hope and that he will continue his role in special teams which I would hope stops to keep his legs fresh for the offensive role. He did say the team expects Wilson to be one of the leaders though, so that's somewhat promising.

Brown at rb #33 and adp 6.12 looks intriguing. We already saw what he can do when he carries the ball more than sparingly.

13 carries or more last year.

13 for 71yds 1 td (2 receptions for 19 yds)

20 for 113yds and 2 tds (3 rec for 17 yds)

13 for 64 yds and 1 td

Brown is a worst a must handcuff to Wilson, but maybe more.

 

[Touchdown There]

50/50 is what you say in the pre-season to not piss anyone off as a teammate. Fluff.

 

[Biabreakable]

Antrel Rolle was on NFL Radio this morning on XM and they asked him about David Wilson. Two things he said caught my attention, one that they are asking him to split the load with Brown so they want him to do more as a running back than last year and two that he is a force on special teams and want him to build on the success on his return game. I may be reading into it too much since he isn't a coach or even on offense, but this sounds like Andre Brown is definitely in the mix in a bigger way that I would hope and that he will continue his role in special teams which I would hope stops to keep his legs fresh for the offensive role. He did say the team expects Wilson to be one of the leaders though, so that's somewhat promising.

Based on things I have been reading, the coach speak from the Giants RB coach. He talks about Wilson needing to improve in pass protection and running routes. He says that Brown is well versed in these roles but that Wilson needs more work in this area.

That is telling me that going into training camp that Brown is the 3rd down RB, the goal line RB and will split time with Wilson in the rest of the roles. This adds up to Brown getting more touches than Wilson does unless Wilson can take over the 3rd down role imo.

But Brown will likely get hurt again, so then it will not matter.

Will the Giants bring in McGahee? Are there any other free agent RB they might add? I still feel like they need another RB. That guy plays for the Colts now however.

 

[Matty2D]

Antrel Rolle was on NFL Radio this morning on XM and they asked him about David Wilson. Two things he said caught my attention, one that they are asking him to split the load with Brown so they want him to do more as a running back than last year and two that he is a force on special teams and want him to build on the success on his return game. I may be reading into it too much since he isn't a coach or even on offense, but this sounds like Andre Brown is definitely in the mix in a bigger way that I would hope and that he will continue his role in special teams which I would hope stops to keep his legs fresh for the offensive role. He did say the team expects Wilson to be one of the leaders though, so that's somewhat promising.

Based on things I have been reading, the coach speak from the Giants RB coach. He talks about Wilson needing to improve in pass protection and running routes. He says that Brown is well versed in these roles but that Wilson needs more work in this area.

That is telling me that going into training camp that Brown is the 3rd down RB, the goal line RB and will split time with Wilson in the rest of the roles. This adds up to Brown getting more touches than Wilson does unless Wilson can take over the 3rd down role imo.

But Brown will likely get hurt again, so then it will not matter.

Will the Giants bring in McGahee? Are there any other free agent RB they might add? I still feel like they need another RB. That guy plays for the Colts now however.

I disagree that Brown will get more touches as a third down, change of pace back.

I think David Wilson is a very talented, explosive runner, but I believe that Andre Brown will be a big factor and cut into the upside of Wilson. The Giants have ran the ball just under 400 times the last couple of years, and I see no real change in philosophy or personnel that would change that number. I believe it will be about a 3:2 split in favor of Wilson, however he will concede goal line carries to Brown as well as receiving yards when the Giants are down in passing situations. Brown is clearly ahead of Wilson is terms of pass protection, and was very successful in short yardage last year. Brown recorded 8 TD's against just 12 goal line carries which is extremely efficient.

As a football fan, I enjoy watching Wilson, but I don't see me owning him this year with some ADP's show him as a late second or third round pick. I would hate seeing him move down the field, only to see Brown vulture a score. Brown will get his carries to keep both him and Wilson fresh, but for me, this screams RBBC and I don't really want part of it.

My projection:

Rushing - 225 carries, 4.8 YPC = 1080 Yards, 7 TD's

Receiving - 14 receptions, 8.3 YPC = 116 Yards 1 TD

Misc. - 2 Fumbles Lost & 1 Kick Return TD = 169 standard FP

 

[Biabreakable]

"I disagree that Brown will get more touches as a third down, change of pace back."

You may be correct. It would be more accurate for me to say the most snaps. Not necessarily more touches.

That is just going into training camp as well. The competition can change things. Just saying what it looks like going into training camp to me.

Ryan Torrain is perhaps better than my opinion of him is as well.

 

[TheFanatic]

Could Wilson develop into a guy who ges 300 carries? Sure, possible.

Next year? Not going to happen.

These are "generalizations" made by a die hard giants fan who wants Wilson to succeed but recognizes there are others in the backfield, they guy is not a tank but well built and he is still earning trust and the offense is a passing offense.

Is he going to get 300 carries. Probably not. Only 5 guys got that many last year. Only 2 in 2011 and 7 in 2010. 2009 saw 6 and 2008 there were 5. So 5 seems about average.

In the games that he got double digit carries, he averaged 13.33 carries per game. If he gets a slight bump in that to 15, over 16 games that's 240 carries. But I don't see him only getting 15 carries a game. I see 17 as more realistic and 272 for the season. I also expect him to catch 20 balls, which will take him close to 300 overall touches.

I'm guessing 1300 yards rushing, 150 yards receiving, and 12 TD's.

Andre Brittle Brown is not a threat for significant carries or for goal line touches. The guy is as brittle as they come. Do you really want him fighting for the tough yards? He did pretty well at it last year........ UNTIL..... wait for it..... he got hurt.

 

[Phenix]

Seen this dude traded for D. Thomas straight up the other day. THis hype must stop people have lost their mind on an unproven guy who the coaches don't even have faith in. Oh, and Brown will be a factor.

1,055 rushing yards with 30 catches for 315 receiving yards and 7 total TDs

 

[TheFanatic]

Seen this dude traded for D. Thomas straight up the other day. THis hype must stop people have lost their mind on an unproven guy who the coaches don't even have faith in. Oh, and Brown will be a factor.

What the coaches say and what they (and the team) do are two different things. The RB coach says Wilson has a lot to work on, yet they didn't work out a single other RB. Not Bush, not SJax, not Turner. Nobody. They didn't bring the BEST blocking RB in the league last year.

Look at what they do and not what they say. The former will paint a much more accurate picture.

 

[Matty2D]

I don't see how he can reach over 250 carries unless Brown is out for an extended time. Brown will get well over 100 carries and goal line carries are for real. Even if Brown plays in 2/3 of the games and scores a touchdown at the same rate, that's about 7 touchdowns taken away from Wilson when they get close. There is no way he will score 12 TD's.

Sure, he is explosive and will get his touchdowns from outside the 20, but if you give him 12 TD's, you have to give the Giants squad 20+ rushing TD's and in that offense I don't buy it.

 

[TheFanatic]

I don't see how he can reach over 250 carries unless Brown is out for an extended time. Brown will get well over 100 carries and goal line carries are for real. Even if Brown plays in 2/3 of the games and scores a touchdown at the same rate, that's about 7 touchdowns taken away from Wilson when they get close. There is no way he will score 12 TD's.

Sure, he is explosive and will get his touchdowns from outside the 20, but if you give him 12 TD's, you have to give the Giants squad 20+ rushing TD's and in that offense I don't buy it.

So if BRown gets 100 carries, you don't think it's possible for the Wilson to get 250? You expect them to pass 700 times?

 

[Matty2D]

I don't see how he can reach over 250 carries unless Brown is out for an extended time. Brown will get well over 100 carries and goal line carries are for real. Even if Brown plays in 2/3 of the games and scores a touchdown at the same rate, that's about 7 touchdowns taken away from Wilson when they get close. There is no way he will score 12 TD's.

Sure, he is explosive and will get his touchdowns from outside the 20, but if you give him 12 TD's, you have to give the Giants squad 20+ rushing TD's and in that offense I don't buy it.

So if BRown gets 100 carries, you don't think it's possible for the Wilson to get 250? You expect them to pass 700 times?

The Giants ran 947 offensive plays last year, so I say they pass around 540 times which leaves about 400 carries for RB's. I said Brown will get well over 100 carries, not just 100. I'm thinking he's going to get somewhere in the 140-150 range, leaving Brown with 250 at the very most. Don't forget guys like DaRel Scott or Hynoski take about 20-30 attempts between them over the season.

 

[TheFanatic]

I don't see how he can reach over 250 carries unless Brown is out for an extended time. Brown will get well over 100 carries and goal line carries are for real. Even if Brown plays in 2/3 of the games and scores a touchdown at the same rate, that's about 7 touchdowns taken away from Wilson when they get close. There is no way he will score 12 TD's.

Sure, he is explosive and will get his touchdowns from outside the 20, but if you give him 12 TD's, you have to give the Giants squad 20+ rushing TD's and in that offense I don't buy it.

So if BRown gets 100 carries, you don't think it's possible for the Wilson to get 250? You expect them to pass 700 times?

The Giants ran 947 offensive plays last year, so I say they pass around 540 times which leaves about 400 carries for RB's. I said Brown will get well over 100 carries, not just 100. I'm thinking he's going to get somewhere in the 140-150 range, leaving Brown with 250 at the very most. Don't forget guys like DaRel Scott or Hynoski take about 20-30 attempts between them over the season.

When Brown was the secondary back (under double digit carries) he averaged 5.3 carries a game. I ommitted the weeks he had 0 carries. 5.3 carries over 16 games is about 86 carries. You expect double that? You expect the guy to get 9-10 carries a game?

 

[Matty2D]

I don't see how he can reach over 250 carries unless Brown is out for an extended time. Brown will get well over 100 carries and goal line carries are for real. Even if Brown plays in 2/3 of the games and scores a touchdown at the same rate, that's about 7 touchdowns taken away from Wilson when they get close. There is no way he will score 12 TD's.

Sure, he is explosive and will get his touchdowns from outside the 20, but if you give him 12 TD's, you have to give the Giants squad 20+ rushing TD's and in that offense I don't buy it.

So if BRown gets 100 carries, you don't think it's possible for the Wilson to get 250? You expect them to pass 700 times?

The Giants ran 947 offensive plays last year, so I say they pass around 540 times which leaves about 400 carries for RB's. I said Brown will get well over 100 carries, not just 100. I'm thinking he's going to get somewhere in the 140-150 range, leaving Brown with 250 at the very most. Don't forget guys like DaRel Scott or Hynoski take about 20-30 attempts between them over the season.

When Brown was the secondary back (under double digit carries) he averaged 5.3 carries a game. I ommitted the weeks he had 0 carries. 5.3 carries over 16 games is about 86 carries. You expect double that? You expect the guy to get 9-10 carries a game?

I do not think 8-9 carries plus a couple receptions is unrealistic. Your 5.3 carries a game stat is a bit flawed because you are not counting the Tampa Bay and Cincinnati game where he came in as the secondary runner. Bradshaw started both those games, and his carries shouldn't be discounted because he had the most attempts. If you factor in those numbers, the number jumps up to 7.6. And by all accounts, he is going to come into the season as the third down back. Being the third down back is going to get you a few more touches during the course of the game.

Coughlin is no stranger to committee situations. Their most prolific rushing years came when guys like Jacobs, Bradshaw, and Ward were all splitting carries. Brown and Wilson are two different style runners, perfect for having a change of pace back.

Let me be clear I do not dislike Wilson, he is far more talented than Brown, but in my opinion the situation dictates a likely timeshare with Brown getting the goal line carries.

 

[jacobo_moses]

Timeshare or not. And whether Wilson doesn't get as many carries as one would hope. I don't think matters. Wilson has proven over the last 4 weeks of last season you don't need a lot of carries to produce.

Wk14 13 car for 100 yds

Wk15 12 car for 55 yds

Wk16 3 car for 17 yds

Wk17 15 car for 75 yds

So giving Wilson 14 to 18 carries and 8 to 10 carries for Brown is totally doable. And Wilson can still be a low end RB1 or high end RB2 with that kind of work.

 

[Rick James]

Wilson is a playmaker. All he needs is a hole or a lane, and his speed will take care of the rest. He also has good moves and enough of a shoulder to get extra yards.

Andre Brown is just a guy. He probably has some nice value this year. But he's just a guy, and if I'm a Wilson owner I'm not worried about him.

 

[Koya]

Could Wilson develop into a guy who ges 300 carries? Sure, possible.

Next year? Not going to happen.

These are "generalizations" made by a die hard giants fan who wants Wilson to succeed but recognizes there are others in the backfield, they guy is not a tank but well built and he is still earning trust and the offense is a passing offense.

Is he going to get 300 carries. Probably not. Only 5 guys got that many last year. Only 2 in 2011 and 7 in 2010. 2009 saw 6 and 2008 there were 5. So 5 seems about average.

In the games that he got double digit carries, he averaged 13.33 carries per game. If he gets a slight bump in that to 15, over 16 games that's 240 carries. But I don't see him only getting 15 carries a game. I see 17 as more realistic and 272 for the season. I also expect him to catch 20 balls, which will take him close to 300 overall touches.

I'm guessing 1300 yards rushing, 150 yards receiving, and 12 TD's.

Andre Brittle Brown is not a threat for significant carries or for goal line touches. The guy is as brittle as they come. Do you really want him fighting for the tough yards? He did pretty well at it last year........ UNTIL..... wait for it..... he got hurt.

You are a bit higher on him than I am, as I think you will see closer to 250 carries. Receptions is the real wildcard as he could be SO dangerous out of the backfield, but blocking will remain the #1 priority there.

Our biggest area of difference is the TDs... I'd love to see him get over 10, but I feel it's unlikely. 6-8 is more in line with what I'd expect. So, shave off 25 carries and reduce the TDs is why I think he has another year until we can expect RB#1 (or strong 1) numbers.

 

[ImTheScientist]

Could Wilson develop into a guy who ges 300 carries? Sure, possible.

Next year? Not going to happen.

These are "generalizations" made by a die hard giants fan who wants Wilson to succeed but recognizes there are others in the backfield, they guy is not a tank but well built and he is still earning trust and the offense is a passing offense.

Is he going to get 300 carries. Probably not. Only 5 guys got that many last year. Only 2 in 2011 and 7 in 2010. 2009 saw 6 and 2008 there were 5. So 5 seems about average.

In the games that he got double digit carries, he averaged 13.33 carries per game. If he gets a slight bump in that to 15, over 16 games that's 240 carries. But I don't see him only getting 15 carries a game. I see 17 as more realistic and 272 for the season. I also expect him to catch 20 balls, which will take him close to 300 overall touches.

I'm guessing 1300 yards rushing, 150 yards receiving, and 12 TD's.

Andre Brittle Brown is not a threat for significant carries or for goal line touches. The guy is as brittle as they come. Do you really want him fighting for the tough yards? He did pretty well at it last year........ UNTIL..... wait for it..... he got hurt.

You are a bit higher on him than I am, as I think you will see closer to 250 carries. Receptions is the real wildcard as he could be SO dangerous out of the backfield, but blocking will remain the #1 priority there.

Our biggest area of difference is the TDs... I'd love to see him get over 10, but I feel it's unlikely. 6-8 is more in line with what I'd expect. So, shave off 25 carries and reduce the TDs is why I think he has another year until we can expect RB#1 (or strong 1) numbers.

What will be different next year versus this year?

 

[Koya]

Could Wilson develop into a guy who ges 300 carries? Sure, possible.

Next year? Not going to happen.

These are "generalizations" made by a die hard giants fan who wants Wilson to succeed but recognizes there are others in the backfield, they guy is not a tank but well built and he is still earning trust and the offense is a passing offense.

Is he going to get 300 carries. Probably not. Only 5 guys got that many last year. Only 2 in 2011 and 7 in 2010. 2009 saw 6 and 2008 there were 5. So 5 seems about average.

In the games that he got double digit carries, he averaged 13.33 carries per game. If he gets a slight bump in that to 15, over 16 games that's 240 carries. But I don't see him only getting 15 carries a game. I see 17 as more realistic and 272 for the season. I also expect him to catch 20 balls, which will take him close to 300 overall touches.

I'm guessing 1300 yards rushing, 150 yards receiving, and 12 TD's.

Andre Brittle Brown is not a threat for significant carries or for goal line touches. The guy is as brittle as they come. Do you really want him fighting for the tough yards? He did pretty well at it last year........ UNTIL..... wait for it..... he got hurt.

You are a bit higher on him than I am, as I think you will see closer to 250 carries. Receptions is the real wildcard as he could be SO dangerous out of the backfield, but blocking will remain the #1 priority there.

Our biggest area of difference is the TDs... I'd love to see him get over 10, but I feel it's unlikely. 6-8 is more in line with what I'd expect. So, shave off 25 carries and reduce the TDs is why I think he has another year until we can expect RB#1 (or strong 1) numbers.

What will be different next year versus this year?

Another year of trust building and experience. Brown may not be here. Blocking (for third downs) could improve.

We are starting to split hairs, but I could see him in a "thunder and lightning" role this year, and more of the full Tiki Barber great years next.... now, maybe that gets accelerated, maybe not. But it would be a logical progression considering how he did not get that much play last year at all.