WagesOfZin
Footballguy
ThisIts almost like all of this stuff wasn't discussed extensively a couple of months ago. Piling on...
Dalvin Cook: When character concerns aren’t concerning
ThisIts almost like all of this stuff wasn't discussed extensively a couple of months ago. Piling on...
Dalvin Cook: When character concerns aren’t concerning
Thanks Biabreakable! As someone who hasn't really been in this thread much aside from this month, I don't know what's been discussed extensively a couple of months ago. I know I can go back and read 15 pages of discussion on this guy, but to be honest my time is limited and sometimes it's great when someone more versed in a thread like you can point a more uninformed person like myself to a few select links or posts that would answer my question.Its almost like all of this stuff wasn't discussed extensively a couple of months ago. Piling on...
Dalvin Cook: When character concerns aren’t concerning
All good. Thanks.My apologies for any friction I've created. For what it's worth, my intent was actually to avoid an argument and friction.
No one is unbiased but here is my take on his character risk.Doubledown1313 said:Cook's legal issues date back to his time at Miami Central High School: The Orlando Sentinel reported that Cook was arrested as a juvenile and charged with robbery in 2009, though prosecutors later dropped the case. He also was arrested a year later and charged with firing a weapon and possession of a weapon at an event on school property. Those chargers were either dropped or abandoned, the newspaper reported.
Cook was charged with criminal mischief in June 2014 after he was one of several players involved in an alleged shooting with a BB gun that caused property damage. Cook was given pretrial intervention. Sports Illustrated reported that Cook also was issued a citation in July 2014 for a violation of animal care after he allegedly left three pit bull puppies chained up by the neck outside.
In July 2015, a woman accused Cook of punching her while outside of a Tallahassee bar. He was charged with misdemeanor battery and suspended indefinitely from the football team. He was found not guilty -- the jury delivered the verdict in less than 25 minutes after a daylong trial -- and immediately reinstated to the team.
Though Cook has no convictions on his record, the multiple charges and brushes with the law will give NFL teams pause.
I am curious about the charge of firing a weapon at a school event. Any school I know of, that would be an automatic expulsion. So I wonder if the investigation clearly showed he was not the person that had and fired the weapon or if he got some kind of special treatment because of his football skill.No one is unbiased but here is my take on his character risk.
There is a risk and people should factor that into his value, as the Vikings themselves did. There is little doubt that without the character risk he would have been a first round pick. So value him where he is--a highly regarded second round RB. If you give more weight to upside than floor, then value him slightly higher.
Regarding specifics, I personally see the risk as pretty limited for the following reasons:
1. He has never actually been convicted of anything. People get charged with things all the time, especially young, black men. The most serious charge was the assault and it took a jury 25 minutes to acquit--that's pretty telling.
2. The dog issue is a non-issue in my book. He didn't engage in dog fighting or actual harm to the animals. We don't know how long the dogs were chained up outside but that is not at all unusual behavior.
3. A bb gun? Really? That's kid play and meaningless.
4. The robbery sounds concerning but again, not convicted.
What I take from all of this is that he ran with the wrong crowd but didn't do anything bad himself. He did put himself in some situations that could have gone bad, which shows poor judgement. But I also think some of those charges may not have been brought against a white, middle class kid. And I put a lot of weight on the fact that no charges ever stuck.
You guys be cool. Mavis - you've created a reputation here where some people would rather avoid a discussion. You can change that by being way less confrontational. But it takes a while. Mavis is apparently trying. Let's see if you can do it. Please let's move on.
Don't forget the Vikes jumped two spots ahead of Philly to draft him. They believed Philly was going to get him and they moved to get the guy they wanted. Says a lot in my mind.
The whole purpose of having this discussion forum revolving around Dalvin Cook is his fantasy appeal and his potential on-field value in term of dynasty and redraft formats. For the record, I did draft him at 1.05 in my 12-teams PPR dynasty league. Based on everything I have read about him is that he's tailor-made for Vikings' OC Pat Shumur's west-coast offense. And that's why Vikings made him as first draft selection this year.
Pleasure boat days are overIn the link above that I posted you hear the other side of the character issues from his coaches who say he is a good team mate and team leader. Very high work ethic as a football player. I think these things offset some of the other things somewhat.
Since he was drafted by the Vikings Xavier Rhodes and others have taken Cook under their wing. I think he has positive team mates to associate with and hopefully keep him out of trouble.
Yeah that was a long time ago.Pleasure boat days are over
I've been watching that Documentary on Florida St. and I'm more confident then ever that Cook will be fine. His team mates constantly spoke about him being their mentor and roll model. The coaches everyone spoke so highly of him then when you see how he carries himself it's off the charts!Yeah that was a long time ago.
I am concerned about DUI issues with the Vikings as the DC certainly not setting the example there. Then them brining in Floyd.
I haven't heard anything about Cook having a drinking problem though. Skol.
....a Tallahassee jury in a trail where the star of the football team was the defendant (and kicked off the team).1. He has never actually been convicted of anything. People get charged with things all the time, especially young, black men. The most serious charge was the assault and it took a jury 25 minutes to acquit--that's pretty telling.
Cook looks like he’s playing on another level over his competition, and there have been some pretty clear instances of him navigating muck without getting touched. He has demonstrated patience and vision, as well as a fair amount of agility.
I am a NC State so I was reading this to read about Samuels, but thought Cook fans might be interested.I wanted to determine: Is Jaylen Samuels the most unique “all-purpose” player in modern ACC history*?
...I selected 6 categories with which to analyze the 341 players that met the criteria: rushing yards per game, rushing yards per attempt, rushing touchdowns, receiving yards per game, receiving yards per attempt, and receiving touchdowns. Using these 6 categories, my goal was to calculate how much of a difference there was between any given player and the player that most resembled them (this is a fairly common statistical method called nearest neighbor search).
Basically, who is the most similar player and just how similar are they. I didn’t allow players to match with themselves from a different year. I made sure to weight the 6 categories equally, so a big difference in rushing yards per game was equivalent to a comparable difference in rushing touchdowns...
Jaylen finished the analysis ranked as the 3rd most unique player in modern ACC history (top 1%). The only 2 players ahead of him were Clinton Lynch of Georgia Tech and Dalvin Cook of Florida State, both last year.
Thanks for the link, which I found it to be a very good read. I particularly like the statement from this article.
“We are running the same thing,” Cook said, referencing the similarities between the Florida State and Minnesota Vikings offense. “Zone, inside zone, outside zone, utilizing me to catch the football.”
Ethan Young with OaSIS Intel and Inside the Pylon summarized why Cook is such a great fit for a zone-running scheme:
Dalvin Cook is the full package of what you look for in an open field zone back. He is a patient runner, who wins with slow play followed by stellar feet and lightning change of direction skills. He sets up his moves well too, and has great vision to boot. His natural feel as a runner is close to unparalleled at times, and that is vital to bring together that skillset in zone heavy scheme.
I knew they drafted him to be the face and the engine of the franchise and quick...but didnt think even this quick. He is going to be their centerpiece and it starts week 1. I was high on Murray even after they drafted Cook and with his ankle injury because of Zimmer and his style, but it appears they really want to make it about Cook from everything I read and watched.The fact that the Vikings are installing a run block scheme similar to Florida State is another sign that Cook is going to get a lot of run.
I'm not all that sure most in here are fanboys.......seems to me a pretty even split amongst fans/detractors......we need some non-fanboys in here.
I have talked myself into becoming a fan. We cant deny the stuff we have been hearing is all good and with the injuries to Murray it makes him likely to be ahead of him in learning the offense.we need some non-fanboys in here.
I was hoping to draft Mixon, but I ended up with Cook. So he's the greatest thing ever now.we need some non-fanboys in here.
Yeah, me too. Originally I worried about Murray. Now, not so much. I get the feeling Cook'll have a 2nd-3rd round ADP in August.I have talked myself into becoming a fan. We cant deny the stuff we have been hearing is all good and with the injuries to Murray it makes him likely to be ahead of him in learning the offense.
One negative to bring up is pass blocking. I think this is one of cooks draw backs at the moment. Murray is a very good pass blocker so this could be something to think about. DJ was in this same boat and didn't see much playing time until week 12 due to his pass blocking but injuries forced Cardinals hand. On the other hand Cook is a great receiver so he could run routes instead of blocking.we need some non-fanboys in here.
errrr pretty sure he wasnt on the field as much because CJ?K was playing out of his mind, and Arians has a reputation for not handing a rookie the keys to anythingOne negative to bring up is pass blocking. I think this is one of cooks draw backs at the moment. Murray is a very good pass blocker so this could be something to think about. DJ was in this same boat and didn't see much playing time until week 12 due to his pass blocking but injuries forced Cardinals hand. On the other hand Cook is a great receiver so he could run routes instead of blocking.
While I appreciate this the Vikings need for a RB who can block is higher than a lot of other teams right now because of their poor pass blocking offensive line.I wouldn't worry too much about pass blocking. If Cook is a better runner/receiver than Murray and McKinnon, then he will get plenty of touches. Rich Hribar recently tweeted the % that NFL backs pass block and it's much much less than one might think. Doug Martin, Frank Gore and J Stewart have about the highest longterm averages of any NFL RBs at around 30% of passing plays. Zeke, DJ, Bell, Gurley, Howard and Gordon were all around 15%.
Asiata has been at the upper end at 29%. Mckinonn in the lower range (19%) near Riddick, Duke and Perkins.While I appreciate this the Vikings need for a RB who can block is higher than a lot of other teams right now because of their poor pass blocking offensive line.
It is always a cat and mouse game between the offense and defense. If the defense can find a weakness they will try to exploit it by bringing the blitz more. If the QB can burn the defense when they blitz then they will do it less.
I think Cook is best used as a receiver and Bradford has shown he can get the ball out fast, so maybe it isn't that big of an issue. The Vikings offensive line is not Dallas or Pittsburgh though.
Out of curiosity how often did the Vikings RB block? I would expect this to be more than most because Kyle Rudolph is really terrible at it. David Morgan will get this assignment a lot similar to RHett Ellison in the past, but when the Vikings do not have 2 TE on the field the RB will need to check for the blitz more.
MANKATO, Minn. — You don’t need to be Ron Wolf to see what’s happening. On one play, Dalvin Cook gets skinny inside the hole and makes three defenders miss without covering more than five yards. On another, he’s split left, and his speed commands enough respect from the defense to clear out space underneath for everyone else.
I like Cook but testing so poorly would seem to attest to a lack of talentThe issue with Cook is/was not talent...it is if his head is screwed on straight...that is why his draft stock slipped...if he has matured he will be a very good RB...there should be little doubt about the talent...
Then it may have seemed as though Jerry Rice had a lack of talent heading into the NFL as well, no?I like Cook but testing so poorly would seem to attest to a lack of talent
Perhaps. Other than his slow 40 I don't remember his other test results and whether he tested as poorly as Cook across the board. It's really hard to say if Cook has Rice's other worldly work ethic or perfect team circumstance to get the most from what talent he has.Then it may have seemed as though Jerry Rice had a lack of talent heading into the NFL as well, no?
Say what?????Then it may have seemed as though Jerry Rice had a lack of talent heading into the NFL as well, no?