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RB David Johnson, Retired (1 Viewer)

I see a lot of talk about the Cardinals not playing DJ when he returns because they are "out of it".  Is there really precedent for a team to sit players who are deemed healthy because they are our out of contention?  I hear the same thing with Luck.  Can't imagine a team says to its fan thanks for purchasing the tickets, we're going to put our backups on the field.  Also people fighting for their jobs.

 
djmich said:
I see a lot of talk about the Cardinals not playing DJ when he returns because they are "out of it".  Is there really precedent for a team to sit players who are deemed healthy because they are our out of contention?  I hear the same thing with Luck.  Can't imagine a team says to its fan thanks for purchasing the tickets, we're going to put our backups on the field.  Also people fighting for their jobs.
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Not to mention the message it sends to other players on the team. Who's not "worth risking" and who is?

 
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djmich said:
I see a lot of talk about the Cardinals not playing DJ when he returns because they are "out of it".  Is there really precedent for a team to sit players who are deemed healthy because they are our out of contention?  I hear the same thing with Luck.  Can't imagine a team says to its fan thanks for purchasing the tickets, we're going to put our backups on the field.  Also people fighting for their jobs.
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Players use their hands/arms to break their fall when being tackled. He is a franchise player. I would be shocked if he sees the field again this year. Only way I foresee that is if they are in contention. Wouldn't be surprised if they put him on season ending IR this week.

 
They almost lost him to a major knee injury last year in week 17 when he played a meaningless game. 

I tend to think they would IR him for the rest of the year if they are out of it when he returns.

 
JuniorNB said:
Players use their hands/arms to break their fall when being tackled. He is a franchise player. I would be shocked if he sees the field again this year. Only way I foresee that is if they are in contention. Wouldn't be surprised if they put him on season ending IR this week.
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I don't think there any such thing anymore.  Any player put on IR can later be brought back, provided the team hasn't already brought 2 players back from IR.

 
ghostguy123 said:
They almost lost him to a major knee injury last year in week 17 when he played a meaningless game. 

I tend to think they would IR him for the rest of the year if they are out of it when he returns.
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People talk about this with players every year with these kind of injuries, but it doesn't seem like it ever happens.  I'm blanking on the examples now but I seem to recall every year some guy coming back off an injury worse than DJ's to play in "meaningless" games at the end of the year.

It's his wrist.  Even if he re-injured it somehow in week 17 it wouldn't carry over into next season's training camp.

If he's healthy enough, he will play.

 
djmich said:
I see a lot of talk about the Cardinals not playing DJ when he returns because they are "out of it".  Is there really precedent for a team to sit players who are deemed healthy because they are our out of contention?  I hear the same thing with Luck.  Can't imagine a team says to its fan thanks for purchasing the tickets, we're going to put our backups on the field.  Also people fighting for their jobs.
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Well the team doesn't go out and SAY all that, but it's easy to read between the lines.

If my team is out of playoff contention I'd rather they give the centerpiece of the offense extra rest than force him out there for no good reason.

 
I am a little surprised this hasn't been talked to death but rather hardly at all. - What are Sharks doing here, holding? - The IR designation ends around Week 10, right? Is anyone taking that comment from Arians about Christmas aka Week 16 to heart?

 
Chris Johnson's ability as three-down back will keep him on field

@joshweinfuss you seem to be the only one saying CJ2K will have more carries than Williams. Why do you think that?

— Hoppy By Nature (@BobbyCristo) September 13, 2017

TEMPE, Ariz. -- Before I go into my answer, one thing needs to be stipulated: I believe the Arizona Cardinals will go with a running back by committee without David Johnson.

With that said, I think it’ll come down to who can produce over the course of a game and, in my opinion, that will be Chris Johnson. Kerwynn Williams is a good speed back. He’ll be good on first and second down. But Johnson is a pounder. He’s a three-down back who will chip away at a first down and get three, four, five yards a carry. He’s also a running back who thrives on rhythm. He’ll get into a groove during a drive. But he won’t be as productive if he’s only on the field for specific downs, whereas the other running backs could be.

Johnson is 31, but as long as he can keep his hands on the ball, he could average about 75 yards a game. But the Cards’ running back room is diverse, which each back owning a specific trait that makes them valuable to the offense. Williams can stretch plays to the outside and sneak behind the offensive line. Andre Ellington is the best receiving running back currently in the room, so the Cards can still run some of the same passing plays with Ellington that they would have run with Johnson. Eli Penny is a big, bruising back who can block as a fullback or pick up tough yards in short-yardage situations. And D.J. Foster is a running back who can do a little bit of everything.

But Johnson’s experience will shine during the next few weeks. I think he’ll establish himself as the main running back option sooner rather than later.
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Weebs210 said:
@SaintsInDome2006 "Chris Johnson is a pounder" welp guess we can ignore what this guy has to say.
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Well he's the Cards reporter for ESPN. I like the guy from ESPN who covers the Saints so I figured his colleague was at least worth considering. You make a good point. I don't know why Arians doesn't rely on a single back, it's true he often does not but I thought the POV at least worth posting.

 
SaintsInDome2006 said:
Well he's the Cards reporter for ESPN. I like the guy from ESPN who covers the Saints so I figured his colleague was at least worth considering. You make a good point. I don't know why Arians doesn't rely on a single back, it's true he often does not but I thought the POV at least worth posting.
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For sure was semi kidding. I still think Williams gets his "shot" at 60%+ of the workload. Should be interesting to see how it plays out. CJ couldn't even beat out Eli Penny who runs like a 4.8 40.

 
SaintsInDome2006 said:
I am a little surprised this hasn't been talked to death but rather hardly at all. - What are Sharks doing here, holding? - The IR designation ends around Week 10, right? Is anyone taking that comment from Arians about Christmas aka Week 16 to heart?
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Well, to be fair; this is, yet again, a quote being taken out of context and spun by twitter, rotoworld, etc.

Here's the actual quote:

“He’s scheduled for surgery this week and hopefully, as miraculously as he came back from that knee injury last year, I’m hoping we can possibly get him back by Thanksgiving or Christmas,”
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but rotoworld, twitter, etc are reporting it as Christmas being the earliest "hope" to have him back, when the quote is obviously pointing at the earliest "hope" being a month earlier.

Johnson could be activated by week 9 (8 weeks after being put on IR) which is 11/9.  Thanksgiving would put him back in week 12, on 11/26 (11 weeks).  I would hope for an early December return for the FF playoffs as a DJ owner.

 
SaintsInDome2006 said:
Well he's the Cards reporter for ESPN. I like the guy from ESPN who covers the Saints so I figured his colleague was at least worth considering. You make a good point. I don't know why Arians doesn't rely on a single back, it's true he often does not but I thought the POV at least worth posting.
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I previously posted this in the Kerynn Williams thread, but the bolded isn't true.  Arians usually employs a RBBC, as opposed to having 1 work-horse back.

Not sure why you don't see it.  Until he got DJ, Arians has used RBBC pretty much all the time he was OC or HC.  2010 with Mendenhall (in Pitt) & 2007 with Fast Willie Parker (Pitt) were the only exceptions.  So, 3/11 years Arians has been a 1-RB guy.  The rest of the time, he mixes & matches.
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So am I crazy or does it seem more likely for CJ2K to get the first shot at being the starter/getting majority of the carries? The only real argument against him is that he was cut this year. But that happens to guys with such a bellcow talent in front of them when they don't offer a specialized skill or aren't willing to play that role for the team (or ask for too much money for such a specialized role, perhaps). 

This happened to DeAngelo Williams as well and does anyone really think the Steelers wouldn't call on DWill if Bell suffered a season-ending injury?

Fact is, teams don't like to hold a backup bellcow "in case" #### happens. It's not financially feasible to do so. But if that guy isn't signed when their bellcow goes bye-bye, they will typically sign him back for the same role given they don't have a young guy they think can handle that load. 

But they definitely don't sign that guy back just to be a backup (or they would have signed him to be their bellcow's backup).

Make sense?

 
Weebs210 said:
Considering Arians just said Williams is the starter week 2 I would say no.
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Idk why CJ2K would be starting immediately, that hardly ever happens. But why sign a guy into a backup role who likely comes at a hefty price if you don't think you need him?

 
ATB said:
Idk why CJ2K would be starting immediately, that hardly ever happens. But why sign a guy into a backup role who likely comes at a hefty price if you don't think you need him?
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Hefty price???? He is a cheap depth move at this point in his career lol.

 
ATB said:
So am I crazy or does it seem more likely for CJ2K to get the first shot at being the starter/getting majority of the carries? The only real argument against him is that he was cut this year. But that happens to guys with such a bellcow talent in front of them when they don't offer a specialized skill or aren't willing to play that role for the team (or ask for too much money for such a specialized role, perhaps).

This happened to DeAngelo Williams as well and does anyone really think the Steelers wouldn't call on DWill if Bell suffered a season-ending injury?

Fact is, teams don't like to hold a backup bellcow "in case" #### happens. It's not financially feasible to do so. But if that guy isn't signed when their bellcow goes bye-bye, they will typically sign him back for the same role given they don't have a young guy they think can handle that load.

But they definitely don't sign that guy back just to be a backup (or they would have signed him to be their bellcow's backup).

Make sense?
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It was literally just announced by BA that Williams will start and get the first crack followed by Ellington. It's certainly possible that CJ leads the backfield at some point but I think it's more likely we see a RBBC.

Honestly, CJ looked pretty bad during preseason action. He's turning 32 in a week, has dealt with some series injuries over the past two years (after being super durable during his career) and has something like 2,500 career touches. Your logic is sound but I have to imagine the odds that he returns serious value this year are slim.

 
Weebs210 said:
Hefty price???? He is a cheap depth move at this point in his career lol.
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I seriously doubt he came cheap. Whatever he was asking for that made the Cards decline to keep him was likely increased seeing as they were the party in need after DJ's abrupt injury. 

 
SameSongNDance said:
It was literally just announced by BA that Williams will start and get the first crack followed by Ellington. It's certainly possible that CJ leads the backfield at some point but I think it's more likely we see a RBBC.

Honestly, CJ looked pretty bad during preseason action. He's turning 32 in a week, has dealt with some series injuries over the past two years (after being super durable during his career) and has something like 2,500 career touches. Your logic is sound but I have to imagine the odds that he returns serious value this year are slim.
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Agree with all that but I'm focusing on that logic you said is sound. I just don't see why you'd sign a guy like that if you intend to use them in the way you likely were going to use him when you declined to keep him in the first place. 

 
ATB said:
I seriously doubt he came cheap. Whatever he was asking for that made the Cards decline to keep him was likely increased seeing as they were the party in need after DJ's abrupt injury. 
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WRONG. He signed for vet minimum with no signing bonus.

 
ATB said:
Idk why CJ2K would be starting immediately, that hardly ever happens. But why sign a guy into a backup role who likely comes at a hefty price if you don't think you need him?
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You think a guy that was on a cheap contract and cut without anyone picking him up is now demanding a hefty price?

 
ATB said:
I seriously doubt he came cheap. Whatever he was asking for that made the Cards decline to keep him was likely increased seeing as they were the party in need after DJ's abrupt injury. 
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He was already signed when they cut him. They didn't cut him because he was asking for more money.

 
Weebs210 said:
Actually I'm WRONG. Was a bad source but I would bet good money that he signed for cheap.
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See I dunno. I'm just assuming he didn't because business is business. Gotta pay for what you let slide if you now need it and have lost your advantage. 

 
Weebs210 said:
Than they say okay we will sign any other vet that sucks like you.
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And CJ2K's agent states the truth: "You got no other RB out there who is familiar with your system nor has proven successful in that system. You lost your bellcow and have an injury-prone, undersized pass-catching back and an unproven youngster as your main backs. Good luck finding someone more suitable for your current needs than my client... CLICK."

 
ATB said:
And CJ2K's agent states the truth: "You got no other RB out there who is familiar with your system nor has proven successful in that system. You lost your bellcow and have an injury-prone, undersized pass-catching back and an unproven youngster as your main backs. Good luck finding someone more suitable for your current needs than my client... CLICK."
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Chris Johnson had two choices:

1. Take his last decent paycheck from the only team in the NFL that wanted him.

2. Sit and couch with a bag of chips.

there is no chance this was a big money signing. I'm not saying there's no way CJ doesn't see the bulk of carries at some point, but this was adding depth with some one that was in camp and knows the system. He's not a difference maker anyomore and is in no position to play hardball over a contract.

 
ATB said:
And CJ2K's agent states the truth: "You got no other RB out there who is familiar with your system nor has proven successful in that system. You lost your bellcow and have an injury-prone, undersized pass-catching back and an unproven youngster as your main backs. Good luck finding someone more suitable for your current needs than my client... CLICK."
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If only the RB position wasn't the easiest postion to just step into and produce.

 
Weebs210 said:
Considering Arians just said Williams is the starter week 2 I would say no.
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Correct; he also said Williams will retain his ST role.  How many starting RBs are also the KR AND PR for their team?

Something will have to give; I doubt he can continue to fill both riles

 
Bayhawks said:
Correct; he also said Williams will retain his ST role.  How many starting RBs are also the KR AND PR for their team?

Something will have to give; I doubt he can continue to fill both riles
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Probably not. Will be interesting to see what happens.

 
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