Roethlisberger Accused of Sexual Assault Again (2 Viewers)

[Couch Potato]

We just don't know. With the little we know right now Ben could be a rapist/woman beater, the woman could be a golddigger or the reality may be somewhere in between.

Based on the facts that we know I really dont think this is the case. She would have to put together a plan really quickly and have her story airtight before she went to the cops. By all accounts she immediately went to the cops and the hospital. Plus who the hell wants that type of publicity? I am not saying he is guilty but I am saying I doubt she is making all of this up for money.

I don't know. They entourage had been there all night. For all we know, she and her friends were sitting out front and heard the story of Big Ben hanging out in the VIP room. Maybe they know of his troubles in Reno. They (or she) decides this is an opportunity. They check out Ben's profile on their iPhones and work hard shaking their tails to get invited back to the VIP room. A little heavy flirtation with Mr. Ben to get him all interested, a little 'come-hither' on the way to the ladies room. Some more dna gathering in the ladies room and a stop short. A little choreographed slip and fall. "Whoops, I'm so clumsy, let me go get some ice for this..." An hour later the cops show up looking for a "6'5", 241 lb" sex offender.

wow dude

Yeah, wow indeed. I'm sure this sort of character assassination of the victim is just what Pig Pen's lawyers are going to go with. I just hope none of the guys who think this way ever have a daughter who is one day the victim of some overpowering sexual predator.

 

[Workhorse]

We just don't know. With the little we know right now Ben could be a rapist/woman beater, the woman could be a golddigger or the reality may be somewhere in between.

Based on the facts that we know I really dont think this is the case. She would have to put together a plan really quickly and have her story airtight before she went to the cops. By all accounts she immediately went to the cops and the hospital. Plus who the hell wants that type of publicity? I am not saying he is guilty but I am saying I doubt she is making all of this up for money.

I don't know. They entourage had been there all night. For all we know, she and her friends were sitting out front and heard the story of Big Ben hanging out in the VIP room. Maybe they know of his troubles in Reno. They (or she) decides this is an opportunity. They check out Ben's profile on their iPhones and work hard shaking their tails to get invited back to the VIP room. A little heavy flirtation with Mr. Ben to get him all interested, a little 'come-hither' on the way to the ladies room. Some more dna gathering in the ladies room and a stop short. A little choreographed slip and fall. "Whoops, I'm so clumsy, let me go get some ice for this..." An hour later the cops show up looking for a "6'5", 241 lb" sex offender.

wow dude

Not saying it happened, just that you're foolish to dismiss it.

Use Occam's razor on this situation. Which is more likely:(a) A professional athlete, who is rumored to be a jerk and has exhibited mind-numbingly poor judgement in the past involving reckless behavior, alcohol and women, got a little worked up and sexually assaulted a 20 year old woman in a bar;

or,

(b) A 20 year old college student hatched a complicated plot to extort money from a famous person and staged a sexual assault while she was drinking underage in a bar.

 

[Scooby1974]

We just don't know. With the little we know right now Ben could be a rapist/woman beater, the woman could be a golddigger or the reality may be somewhere in between.

Based on the facts that we know I really dont think this is the case. She would have to put together a plan really quickly and have her story airtight before she went to the cops. By all accounts she immediately went to the cops and the hospital. Plus who the hell wants that type of publicity? I am not saying he is guilty but I am saying I doubt she is making all of this up for money.

I don't know. They entourage had been there all night. For all we know, she and her friends were sitting out front and heard the story of Big Ben hanging out in the VIP room. Maybe they know of his troubles in Reno. They (or she) decides this is an opportunity. They check out Ben's profile on their iPhones and work hard shaking their tails to get invited back to the VIP room. A little heavy flirtation with Mr. Ben to get him all interested, a little 'come-hither' on the way to the ladies room. Some more dna gathering in the ladies room and a stop short. A little choreographed slip and fall. "Whoops, I'm so clumsy, let me go get some ice for this..." An hour later the cops show up looking for a "6'5", 241 lb" sex offender.

wow dude

Yeah, wow indeed. I'm sure this sort of character assassination of the victim is just what Pig Pen's lawyers are going to go with. I just hope none of the guys who think this way ever have a daughter who is one day the victim of some overpowering sexual predator.

You think much more highly of drunk sorority chicks than the rest of us if you think they could pull that off without a hitch.

 

[ScottyFargo]

We just don't know. With the little we know right now Ben could be a rapist/woman beater, the woman could be a golddigger or the reality may be somewhere in between.

Based on the facts that we know I really dont think this is the case. She would have to put together a plan really quickly and have her story airtight before she went to the cops. By all accounts she immediately went to the cops and the hospital. Plus who the hell wants that type of publicity? I am not saying he is guilty but I am saying I doubt she is making all of this up for money.

I don't know. They entourage had been there all night. For all we know, she and her friends were sitting out front and heard the story of Big Ben hanging out in the VIP room. Maybe they know of his troubles in Reno. They (or she) decides this is an opportunity. They check out Ben's profile on their iPhones and work hard shaking their tails to get invited back to the VIP room. A little heavy flirtation with Mr. Ben to get him all interested, a little 'come-hither' on the way to the ladies room. Some more dna gathering in the ladies room and a stop short. A little choreographed slip and fall. "Whoops, I'm so clumsy, let me go get some ice for this..." An hour later the cops show up looking for a "6'5", 241 lb" sex offender.

wow dude

Yeah, wow indeed. I'm sure this sort of character assassination of the victim is just what Pig Pen's lawyers are going to go with. I just hope none of the guys who think this way ever have a daughter who is one day the victim of some overpowering sexual predator.

Fans who think like that deserve B.R. as their QB. That's a disgusting little fantasy.

 

[Idiot Boxer]

Use Occam's razor on this situation. Which is more likely:(a) A professional athlete, who is rumored to be a jerk and has exhibited mind-numbingly poor judgement in the past involving reckless behavior, alcohol and women, got a little worked up and sexually assaulted a 20 year old woman in a bar;or,(b) A 20 year old college student hatched a complicated plot to extort money from a famous person and staged a sexual assault while she was drinking underage in a bar.

I am not the one who dismissed either as a possibility. I need not choose between a or b because I have not foreclosed the option of either being the truth. Occam's Razor does not apply as I am not attempting to decide which is true, I am merely listing possibilities at this point.pantherclub...and now scooby...have both already dismissed it as a possibility.

 

[Idiot Boxer]

Fans who think like that deserve B.R. as their QB. That's a disgusting little fantasy.

Let's not get personal. It is a hypothetical and while not more likely than anything else, not outside the realm of possibility.Neither you nor I were there. We don't know. So please refrain from telling me what I deserve, because similarly, you do not know me or who I am.

I will accord you with the same respect even though at this moment I am fairly incensed with your inability to comprehend the meaning of my original comment.

 

[ScottyFargo]

Fans who think like that deserve B.R. as their QB. That's a disgusting little fantasy.

Let's not get personal. It is a hypothetical and while not more likely than anything else, not outside the realm of possibility.Neither you nor I were there. We don't know. So please refrain from telling me what I deserve, because similarly, you do not know me or who I am.

I will accord you with the same respect even though at this moment I am fairly incensed with your inability to comprehend the meaning of my original comment.

Concocting complicated fairy tales may offer some comfort for you now, but I find them particularly offensive in the face of the extent and severity of the known facts of this investigation. Continuing to play the "what if" game underscores the seriousness in my opinion. Your original point is better served with a simple "we don't know" rather than a fictional narrative used as an example of what might have been. If you're stewing, I think it might have something more to do with the idea that you know just how hollow the framework on which you decided to hang the night in question really is.

 

[pantherclub]

Use Occam's razor on this situation. Which is more likely:(a) A professional athlete, who is rumored to be a jerk and has exhibited mind-numbingly poor judgement in the past involving reckless behavior, alcohol and women, got a little worked up and sexually assaulted a 20 year old woman in a bar;or,(b) A 20 year old college student hatched a complicated plot to extort money from a famous person and staged a sexual assault while she was drinking underage in a bar.

I am not the one who dismissed either as a possibility. I need not choose between a or b because I have not foreclosed the option of either being the truth. Occam's Razor does not apply as I am not attempting to decide which is true, I am merely listing possibilities at this point.pantherclub...and now scooby...have both already dismissed it as a possibility.

I have totally dismissed this as a possibility. There is no way that what you implied could have happened did indeed happen. Do you realize the depth of the lie and planning that would have to evolve in a short time period all the while they are drinking?

 

[Couch Potato]

Yeah, wow indeed. I'm sure this sort of character assassination of the victim is just what Pig Pen's lawyers are going to go with. I just hope none of the guys who think this way ever have a daughter who is one day the victim of some overpowering sexual predator.

You think much more highly of drunk sorority chicks than the rest of us if you think they could pull that off without a hitch.

Huh? Please explain. Pull what off? I'm not saying she planned anything. I said his lawyers would use that tactic. I'm totally on the girl's side on this, and have been since the beginning of this thread. My instincts have told me from the beginning that he assaulted her.

 

[ScottyFargo]

Yeah, wow indeed. I'm sure this sort of character assassination of the victim is just what Pig Pen's lawyers are going to go with. I just hope none of the guys who think this way ever have a daughter who is one day the victim of some overpowering sexual predator.

You think much more highly of drunk sorority chicks than the rest of us if you think they could pull that off without a hitch.

Huh? Please explain. Pull what off? I'm not saying she planned anything. I said his lawyers would use that tactic. I'm totally on the girl's side on this, and have been since the beginning of this thread. My instincts have told me from the beginning that he assaulted her.

I think he was referring to Gil Grissom's mental reenactment:

For all we know, she and her friends were sitting out front and heard the story of Big Ben hanging out in the VIP room. Maybe they know of his troubles in Reno. They (or she) decides this is an opportunity. They check out Ben's profile on their iPhones and work hard shaking their tails to get invited back to the VIP room. A little heavy flirtation with Mr. Ben to get him all interested, a little 'come-hither' on the way to the ladies room. Some more dna gathering in the ladies room and a stop short. A little choreographed slip and fall. "Whoops, I'm so clumsy, let me go get some ice for this..." An hour later the cops show up looking for a "6'5", 241 lb" sex offender.

 

[Idiot Boxer]

Fans who think like that deserve B.R. as their QB. That's a disgusting little fantasy.

Let's not get personal. It is a hypothetical and while not more likely than anything else, not outside the realm of possibility.Neither you nor I were there. We don't know. So please refrain from telling me what I deserve, because similarly, you do not know me or who I am.

I will accord you with the same respect even though at this moment I am fairly incensed with your inability to comprehend the meaning of my original comment.

Concocting complicated fairy tales may offer some comfort for you now, but I find them particularly offensive in the face of the extent and severity of the known facts of this investigation. Continuing to play the "what if" game underscores the seriousness in my opinion. Your original point is better served with a simple "we don't know" rather than a fictional narrative used as an example of what might have been. If you're stewing, I think it might have something more to do with the idea that you know just how hollow the framework on which you decided to hang the night in question really is.

Again. You don't know me. All you know is I'm a Steeler fan and from that you make some sort of assumption about my motive. There is no 'hollow framework' because I am not trying to make the case to exonerate him. I am trying to make the case that it is foolhardy to dismiss ANY number of options of what may have happened. If you are so naive to think that a 20 year old woman is incapable of taking advantage of a compromised athlete, fine, but I think that's a pretty narrow world view. If I were pushing the argument that I thought it impossible that a self-consumed egotistical horndog professional athlete were incapable of sexually assaulting a young woman (which I am not) I would expect to be called out on it. The point of the narrative was to create AN EXTREME example and demonstrate that even THAT, as extreme as it is, exists within the realm of possibility as to what WE (you and I and the rest of the dorks on this messageboard) actually KNOW. If we establish that THAT EXTREME EXAMPLE could have happened (no matter how unlikely) then everything between IT on one side to everything the accuser said as being 100% true on the other side exists as a possibility. Ruling ANY of it out WITHOUT further evidence is absolutely irresponsible.

 

[Couch Potato]

Gil Grissom. LOL. OK, I hope so, cuz I'm with you guys. No way was this choreographed on her part.

She was just some local college coed who, like everyone else there, learned a big time celeb was there and wanted to have a chance to hang with him. Whatever happened from there happened, but this big conspiracy theory to extort poor poor Ben is just pathetic.

 

[Scooby1974]

Yeah, wow indeed. I'm sure this sort of character assassination of the victim is just what Pig Pen's lawyers are going to go with. I just hope none of the guys who think this way ever have a daughter who is one day the victim of some overpowering sexual predator.

You think much more highly of drunk sorority chicks than the rest of us if you think they could pull that off without a hitch.

Huh? Please explain. Pull what off? I'm not saying she planned anything. I said his lawyers would use that tactic. I'm totally on the girl's side on this, and have been since the beginning of this thread. My instincts have told me from the beginning that he assaulted her.

I'm with you, Couch. And I'm with the girl at this point too, something is amiss. I was simply stating how outlandish it would be for a bunch of partying chicks to concoct and pull off such an elaborate plan all the while trying to get more drinks with their fake ID's.

 

[Scooby1974]

Boxer, take it in stride dude. It is obvious to us that you're smart enough to realize that there is no conclusion to come to right now given the lack of facts and testimony. It was obvious your narrative was purposely outlandish to show both extremes. Somewhere in the middle lies the truth.

 

[ScottyFargo]

Concocting complicated fairy tales may offer some comfort for you now, but I find them particularly offensive in the face of the extent and severity of the known facts of this investigation. Continuing to play the "what if" game underscores the seriousness in my opinion. Your original point is better served with a simple "we don't know" rather than a fictional narrative used as an example of what might have been. If you're stewing, I think it might have something more to do with the idea that you know just how hollow the framework on which you decided to hang the night in question really is.

Again. You don't know me. All you know is I'm a Steeler fan and from that you make some sort of assumption about my motive. There is no 'hollow framework' because I am not trying to make the case to exonerate him. I am trying to make the case that it is foolhardy to dismiss ANY number of options of what may have happened. If you are so naive to think that a 20 year old woman is incapable of taking advantage of a compromised athlete, fine, but I think that's a pretty narrow world view. If I were pushing the argument that I thought it impossible that a self-consumed egotistical horndog professional athlete were incapable of sexually assaulting a young woman (which I am not) I would expect to be called out on it. The point of the narrative was to create AN EXTREME example and demonstrate that even THAT, as extreme as it is, exists within the realm of possibility as to what WE (you and I and the rest of the dorks on this messageboard) actually KNOW. If we establish that THAT EXTREME EXAMPLE could have happened (no matter how unlikely) then everything between IT on one side to everything the accuser said as being 100% true on the other side exists as a possibility. Ruling ANY of it out WITHOUT further evidence is absolutely irresponsible.

I know that there is almost 0% chance that B.R. is the victim in this scenario, and the buzzwords and callousness of the language you chose to paint the scenario with are the sort of muckraking that I would expect not from a fan, but from one of the lawyers who will attempt to spin this around and blame the victim.Take a look at what you wrote again:

shaking their tails, Some more dna gathering.

In the world of extreme examples, the situation you came up with is overwrought and, frankly, offensive. This isn't to say that he's already been found guilty, but that if the situation is not the worst case scenario the truth will be found in the gray area that is assent.

 

[mcintyre1]

Yeah, wow indeed. I'm sure this sort of character assassination of the victim is just what Pig Pen's lawyers are going to go with. I just hope none of the guys who think this way ever have a daughter who is one day the victim of some overpowering sexual predator.

You think much more highly of drunk sorority chicks than the rest of us if you think they could pull that off without a hitch.

Huh? Please explain. Pull what off? I'm not saying she planned anything. I said his lawyers would use that tactic. I'm totally on the girl's side on this, and have been since the beginning of this thread. My instincts have told me from the beginning that he assaulted her.

I'm with you, Couch. And I'm with the girl at this point too, something is amiss. I was simply stating how outlandish it would be for a bunch of partying chicks to concoct and pull off such an elaborate plan all the while trying to get more drinks with their fake ID's.

Ok, let's be fair to everyone here. The 'plan' is hardly rocket science. Let's see:1. Rich guy w/ previous sexual harassment problems spotted. 2. Flirt with said guy. 3. Get him to a place where they're alone. 4. Do the 'deed'.5. ProfitAm I saying this is LIKELY? No. It is so ridiculous as to be impossible? Absolutely not. Quit jumping all over IB here.

 

[AhrnCityPahnder]

 

[Godsbrother]

Concocting complicated fairy tales may offer some comfort for you now, but I find them particularly offensive in the face of the extent and severity of the known facts of this investigation.

I would be very interested to hear what known facts of the investigation you have been made privvy to. The police and both lawyers have been very tight-lipped about the investigation and all we have heard about the incident is a few things leaked by the media and we all know how unreliable those can be at times.It won't surprise me a bit to find out that BB is indeed guilty but again I ask what the downside is to waiting to hear the results of the official investigation?

 

[ScottyFargo]

Concocting complicated fairy tales may offer some comfort for you now, but I find them particularly offensive in the face of the extent and severity of the known facts of this investigation.

I would be very interested to hear what known facts of the investigation you have been made privvy to. The police and both lawyers have been very tight-lipped about the investigation and all we have heard about the incident is a few things leaked by the media and we all know how unreliable those can be at times.It won't surprise me a bit to find out that BB is indeed guilty but again I ask what the downside is to waiting to hear the results of the official investigation?

She was injured. She claims she was sexually assaulted. They searched the bathroom for DNA evidence. Roethlisberger refused to provide his DNA. Roethlisberger claims he had consented sexual contact with the woman. I have no doubt that I.B. was simply painting one example of what might have been, it simply jumped out to me (and others) as being highly unlikely and a little callous. You and he are right, of course, that there is no downside to waiting to here the results. Roethlisberger could very well be vindicated, however, even in his vindication, it is almost impossible that he's the victimin this case. It seems like night and day from the civil case he is already facing.

 

[McBokonon]

I ask what the downside is to waiting to hear the results of the official investigation?

We'd have to find another way to waste time at work?

 

[Christo]

The girl went to the hospital for a head injury. It is reported that Ben says she slipped and fell. Do you believe him?

Does anybody know off the top of their head if Ben lied about anything when questioned about that motorcycle accident he was in? I tend to not think somebody is lying unless it is blatantly obvious or they have a history of lying.

I'm probably jaded, since both my sisters were in abusive relationships. But when I here "She slipped and fell" my first thoughs are, You're lying .

Or he's telling the truth but not the whole truth. Possible scenario: They were in the bathroom. He was putting on the moves. She may have been into it, she may have not. At some point she decided she wanted to leave. She pushed past him, he might have tried to grab her. She lost her balance, slipped and fell.

 

[Steelers4Life]

All I can say at this point is that people who spout off the anti-Ben bull#### sound as stupid as the ones trying to paint the girl as a scam artist.

We don't know.

Gut feelings and made up stories are pretty much useless, because none of us know.

Could she have planned the whole thing? Sure she could have. Saying that the guy who attacked her was 6 foo 5, 241 pounds is beyond just a coincidence to me and very, very suspicious.

Could Ben have assaulted her? Sure he could have. A few drinks, horny, maybe he just didn't take rejection well or she started something she ended up not wanting to finish and he got ticked off.

None of us know anything. And any attempt to sound like you KNOW what happened doesn't do anything but make YOU sound stupid in all of this.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

So with Ben saying he didnt "have intercourse" with her, but that he did "have contact" with her, and then she "slipped and hit her head" I think it's one of two situations.

1. He's pulling a Clinton with his words. They went into the bathroom and she went down on him, and he finished in a way she told him not too. Hence the DNA evidence request. He laughed at her and pushed her away or something and being strong and drunk pushed her harder than he thought and she got hurt. (or perhaps she gagged and fell)

2. He tried to pull some moves on her and was groping her and in her struggle to get away from him, she fell. (this doesnt explain DNA, unless they checked under her fingernails for evidence of a struggle)

 

[JerseyToughGuys]

Concocting complicated fairy tales may offer some comfort for you now, but I find them particularly offensive in the face of the extent and severity of the known facts of this investigation. Continuing to play the "what if" game underscores the seriousness in my opinion. Your original point is better served with a simple "we don't know" rather than a fictional narrative used as an example of what might have been. If you're stewing, I think it might have something more to do with the idea that you know just how hollow the framework on which you decided to hang the night in question really is.

Again. You don't know me. All you know is I'm a Steeler fan and from that you make some sort of assumption about my motive. There is no 'hollow framework' because I am not trying to make the case to exonerate him. I am trying to make the case that it is foolhardy to dismiss ANY number of options of what may have happened. If you are so naive to think that a 20 year old woman is incapable of taking advantage of a compromised athlete, fine, but I think that's a pretty narrow world view. If I were pushing the argument that I thought it impossible that a self-consumed egotistical horndog professional athlete were incapable of sexually assaulting a young woman (which I am not) I would expect to be called out on it. The point of the narrative was to create AN EXTREME example and demonstrate that even THAT, as extreme as it is, exists within the realm of possibility as to what WE (you and I and the rest of the dorks on this messageboard) actually KNOW. If we establish that THAT EXTREME EXAMPLE could have happened (no matter how unlikely) then everything between IT on one side to everything the accuser said as being 100% true on the other side exists as a possibility. Ruling ANY of it out WITHOUT further evidence is absolutely irresponsible.

I know that there is almost 0% chance that B.R. is the victim in this scenario, and the buzzwords and callousness of the language you chose to paint the scenario with are the sort of muckraking that I would expect not from a fan, but from one of the lawyers who will attempt to spin this around and blame the victim.Take a look at what you wrote again:

shaking their tails, Some more dna gathering.

In the world of extreme examples, the situation you came up with is overwrought and, frankly, offensive. This isn't to say that he's already been found guilty, but that if the situation is not the worst case scenario the truth will be found in the gray area that is assent.

I, too, am overwrought with the muckraking in the gray area that is consent.

 

[JerseyToughGuys]

Did both sides sit down for a 20/20 interview and I missed it?

Seems like people have a lot of the inner details figured out already.

 

[Coffee Sippin Guy]

Tim Tebow would never rape anyone (at least I don't think he would).

 

[Sanchize Fan]

Suddenly my wiener gobbling seems like small potatoes eh? I'll bet a lot of you folks WISH that Ben had just spent his time gobbling wieners.

 

[Frot]

Suddenly my wiener gobbling seems like small potatoes eh? I'll bet a lot of you folks WISH that Ben had just spent his time gobbling wieners.

I know I do!

 

[phthalatemagic]

Am I being overly dramatic in stating that the Steelers franchise and their two most recent Super Bowls are currently on the verge of being completely disgraced

What the Patriots did was cheat at a game. It has been argued by objective football people that the taping brought little value

Oh, lord this is rich.

I'm not here to excuse Roeth but to see a Pats fan bring that to the table is a joke.

Any attempts to defend Spygate is unacceptable. What the Patriots did was inexcusable and their run in the 2000s is forever tainted.

 

[fatness]

Some random observation by some unknown source and the knee jerk reactionaries go nuts.

So far I have missed the part where the knee jerk reactionaries were going nuts. As threads about 'scandal' and 'character' topics go in the Shark Pool, this has been one of the best. Seems like a lot more posting and discussion of information than screaming and going nuts.

 

[fatness]

I don't know. They entourage had been there all night. For all we know, she and her friends were sitting out front and heard the story of Big Ben hanging out in the VIP room. Maybe they know of his troubles in Reno. They (or she) decides this is an opportunity. They check out Ben's profile on their iPhones and work hard shaking their tails to get invited back to the VIP room. A little heavy flirtation with Mr. Ben to get him all interested, a little 'come-hither' on the way to the ladies room. Some more dna gathering in the ladies room and a stop short. A little choreographed slip and fall. "Whoops, I'm so clumsy, let me go get some ice for this..." An hour later the cops show up looking for a "6'5", 241 lb" sex offender.

Since you're being realistic, don't forget the part where she invites the children high-profile athletes into her home to eat the gingerbread walls, and throws them in the oven.

 

[Dexter Manley]

2. He tried to pull some moves on her and was groping her and in her struggle to get away from him, she fell. (this doesnt explain DNA, unless they checked under her fingernails for evidence of a struggle)

Hair is also DNA evidence.

 

[Jason Wood]

And the suppositions continue.

"Maybe the girl did ...."

"Maybe Ben's buddies said this... "

The facts will come out in due course. With each passing day, things look more serious for Ben, that much is certain. But whether he actually is guilty of something or not? We still don't know.

One thing IS for certain though, having two buddies, who happen to be cops, say they saw nothing unusual is absolutely worthless in the court of public opinion. Especially if, by most accounts, whatever went down happened in the girls bathroom. I'm sure this isn't the first time Ben went into a bathroom at a club to hook up with a girl, so that would hardly be considered "unusual."

This will be interesting. Do the Rooneys give him the benefit of the doubt? Can they afford not to?

 

[Peggy Starfish]

And the suppositions continue.

"Maybe the girl did ...."

"Maybe Ben's buddies said this... "

The facts will come out in due course. With each passing day, things look more serious for Ben, that much is certain. But whether he actually is guilty of something or not? We still don't know.

One thing IS for certain though, having two buddies, who happen to be cops, say they saw nothing unusual is absolutely worthless in the court of public opinion. Especially if, by most accounts, whatever went down happened in the girls bathroom. I'm sure this isn't the first time Ben went into a bathroom at a club to hook up with a girl, so that would hardly be considered "unusual."

This will be interesting. Do the Rooneys give him the benefit of the doubt? Can they afford not to?

To make it even more interesting this is an uncapped year so there'd be no cap hit from cutting him. Moreover, they might even be able to get some bonus back from him by citing the morals clause in his contract.

 

[FavreCo]

I don't know. They entourage had been there all night. For all we know, she and her friends were sitting out front and heard the story of Big Ben hanging out in the VIP room. Maybe they know of his troubles in Reno. They (or she) decides this is an opportunity. They check out Ben's profile on their iPhones and work hard shaking their tails to get invited back to the VIP room. A little heavy flirtation with Mr. Ben to get him all interested, a little 'come-hither' on the way to the ladies room. Some more dna gathering in the ladies room and a stop short. A little choreographed slip and fall. "Whoops, I'm so clumsy, let me go get some ice for this..." An hour later the cops show up looking for a "6'5", 241 lb" sex offender.

Man I already won this bet. I called her out for this stunt the day the news broke.

 

[Godsbrother]

And the suppositions continue.

"Maybe the girl did ...."

"Maybe Ben's buddies said this... "

The facts will come out in due course. With each passing day, things look more serious for Ben, that much is certain. But whether he actually is guilty of something or not? We still don't know.

One thing IS for certain though, having two buddies, who happen to be cops, say they saw nothing unusual is absolutely worthless in the court of public opinion. Especially if, by most accounts, whatever went down happened in the girls bathroom. I'm sure this isn't the first time Ben went into a bathroom at a club to hook up with a girl, so that would hardly be considered "unusual."

This will be interesting. Do the Rooneys give him the benefit of the doubt? Can they afford not to?

To make it even more interesting this is an uncapped year so there'd be no cap hit from cutting him. Moreover, they might even be able to get some bonus back from him by citing the morals clause in his contract.

No friggin' way they are gong to cut him until he has his day in court, assuming he has one.

 

[Peggy Starfish]

And the suppositions continue.

"Maybe the girl did ...."

"Maybe Ben's buddies said this... "

The facts will come out in due course. With each passing day, things look more serious for Ben, that much is certain. But whether he actually is guilty of something or not? We still don't know.

One thing IS for certain though, having two buddies, who happen to be cops, say they saw nothing unusual is absolutely worthless in the court of public opinion. Especially if, by most accounts, whatever went down happened in the girls bathroom. I'm sure this isn't the first time Ben went into a bathroom at a club to hook up with a girl, so that would hardly be considered "unusual."

This will be interesting. Do the Rooneys give him the benefit of the doubt? Can they afford not to?

To make it even more interesting this is an uncapped year so there'd be no cap hit from cutting him. Moreover, they might even be able to get some bonus back from him by citing the morals clause in his contract.

No friggin' way they are gong to cut him until he has his day in court, assuming he has one.

You're right in that that's SOP, but I could theoretically envision there being enough evidence and a bad enough set of facts that come out where they might do that sooner than that, especially if the fan base gets pissed enough at him.

 

[omahabrad]

And the suppositions continue.

"Maybe the girl did ...."

"Maybe Ben's buddies said this... "

The facts will come out in due course. With each passing day, things look more serious for Ben, that much is certain. But whether he actually is guilty of something or not? We still don't know.

One thing IS for certain though, having two buddies, who happen to be cops, say they saw nothing unusual is absolutely worthless in the court of public opinion. Especially if, by most accounts, whatever went down happened in the girls bathroom. I'm sure this isn't the first time Ben went into a bathroom at a club to hook up with a girl, so that would hardly be considered "unusual."

This will be interesting. Do the Rooneys give him the benefit of the doubt? Can they afford not to?

To make it even more interesting this is an uncapped year so there'd be no cap hit from cutting him. Moreover, they might even be able to get some bonus back from him by citing the morals clause in his contract.

No friggin' way they are gong to cut him until he has his day in court, assuming he has one.

You're right in that that's SOP, but I could theoretically envision there being enough evidence and a bad enough set of facts that come out where they might do that sooner than that, especially if the fan base gets pissed enough at him.

Ben Roethlisberger-QB- Steelers Mar. 11 - 9:46 am et

The Rooney family of the Steelers is reportedly running out of patience with Ben Roethlisberger's sexual assault allegations.

NFL Network's Jason LaCanfora has reported that some in the organization believe another incident could end Roethlisberger's career in Pittsburgh. Big Ben isn't in danger of being cut or traded just yet, but the tide is starting to turn at the ownership level.

Source: Profootballtalk on NBCSports.com

 

[CrossEyed]

And the suppositions continue.

"Maybe the girl did ...."

"Maybe Ben's buddies said this... "

The facts will come out in due course. With each passing day, things look more serious for Ben, that much is certain. But whether he actually is guilty of something or not? We still don't know.

One thing IS for certain though, having two buddies, who happen to be cops, say they saw nothing unusual is absolutely worthless in the court of public opinion. Especially if, by most accounts, whatever went down happened in the girls bathroom. I'm sure this isn't the first time Ben went into a bathroom at a club to hook up with a girl, so that would hardly be considered "unusual."

This will be interesting. Do the Rooneys give him the benefit of the doubt? Can they afford not to?

To make it even more interesting this is an uncapped year so there'd be no cap hit from cutting him. Moreover, they might even be able to get some bonus back from him by citing the morals clause in his contract.

No friggin' way they are gong to cut him until he has his day in court, assuming he has one.

You're right in that that's SOP, but I could theoretically envision there being enough evidence and a bad enough set of facts that come out where they might do that sooner than that, especially if the fan base gets pissed enough at him.

Ben Roethlisberger-QB- Steelers Mar. 11 - 9:46 am et

The Rooney family of the Steelers is reportedly running out of patience with Ben Roethlisberger's sexual assault allegations.

NFL Network's Jason LaCanfora has reported that some in the organization believe another incident could end Roethlisberger's career in Pittsburgh. Big Ben isn't in danger of being cut or traded just yet, but the tide is starting to turn at the ownership level.

Source: Profootballtalk on NBCSports.com

Not surprising. The Rooneys historically have not put up with guys whose actions/attitude have hurt the brand. I'm sure that Ben is on notice. In fact, I would be that he was on notice after the last event, making this one possibly even more careless, even if there was no sexual assault.

 

[gheemony]

Did NOT try to wade through this entire thread to see if this article had been posted or not, but Joe linked to it on Facebook:

http://nfl.fanhouse.com/2010/03/11/big-ben...than-you-think/

 

[ookook]

To date, there is no evidence that any sort of penetration took place, right?

They would get DNA no matter what the sexual assault was.

So right now, it could be that they were getting cozy and he started to touch her places she didn't like. She said "no", he did it some more, and she tried to get away. He grabbed her and she bumped head.

He would be totally as fault and would definately be sexual assault.

We could then quibble about whether the term "rape" gets applied or not in an non-legal context.

Right now, this seems most consistent with what I have read.

 

[Mile High]

To date, there is no evidence that any sort of penetration took place, right?They would get DNA no matter what the sexual assault was. So right now, it could be that they were getting cozy and he started to touch her places she didn't like. She said "no", he did it some more, and she tried to get away. He grabbed her and she bumped head. He would be totally as fault and would definately be sexual assault. We could then quibble about whether the term "rape" gets applied or not in an non-legal context. Right now, this seems most consistent with what I have read.

This makes sense to me. I don't think he raped her. She said no and he didn't quit fast enough. Some where in there he pushed/grabbed her and she fell.

 

[ninerfan]

I'm starting to get the feeling that no matter the outcome of this mess Ben will not be the Steelers QB in a year or two.

 

[Tau837]

Did NOT try to wade through this entire thread to see if this article had been posted or not, but Joe linked to it on Facebook:

http://nfl.fanhouse.com/2010/03/11/big-ben...than-you-think/

Interesting article that explores a few things I hadn't seen discussed. It makes things sound worse for Roethlisberger IMO. And this quote seemed worthy of posting in this thread, given some of the discussion:

Keep in mind that the NFL has adopted a misguided policy where mere guilt or innocence is insufficient to keep a player from punishment. The mere perception of a pattern of wrongful action is sufficient to bring punishment. That's why regardless of what ultimately ends up happening in this case, Big Ben is going to be suspended by the league.

 

[TheFanatic]

Use Occam's razor on this situation. Which is more likely:(a) A professional athlete, who is rumored to be a jerk and has exhibited mind-numbingly poor judgement in the past involving reckless behavior, alcohol and women, got a little worked up and sexually assaulted a 20 year old woman in a bar;or,(b) A 20 year old college student hatched a complicated plot to extort money from a famous person and staged a sexual assault while she was drinking underage in a bar.

Honestly, I see either as being equally as likely. Two sides to that razor, it seems...

 

[treat88]

Concocting complicated fairy tales may offer some comfort for you now, but I find them particularly offensive in the face of the extent and severity of the known facts of this investigation.

I would be very interested to hear what known facts of the investigation you have been made privvy to. The police and both lawyers have been very tight-lipped about the investigation and all we have heard about the incident is a few things leaked by the media and we all know how unreliable those can be at times.It won't surprise me a bit to find out that BB is indeed guilty but again I ask what the downside is to waiting to hear the results of the official investigation?

She was injured. She claims she was sexually assaulted. They searched the bathroom for DNA evidence. Roethlisberger refused to provide his DNA. Roethlisberger claims he had consented sexual contact with the woman. I have no doubt that I.B. was simply painting one example of what might have been, it simply jumped out to me (and others) as being highly unlikely and a little callous. You and he are right, of course, that there is no downside to waiting to here the results. Roethlisberger could very well be vindicated, however, even in his vindication, it is almost impossible that he's the victimin this case. It seems like night and day from the civil case he is already facing.

I don't think you actually know most of what you think you know.We know she went to the hospital. We don't know she was injured. We certainly don't know the severity of any potential injuries. The hospital report will be the central piece of evidence in the decision to press charges and we have no clue what it will say.

We have an anonymous source alleging Ben said they had "contact". Ben hasn't made a public statement that I'm aware of.

http://www.ajc.com/news/report-roethlisber...ual-360890.html

We don't know that Ben has refused to provide a DNA sample. Again, where has anyone of authority publicly indicated he is refusing to provide a sample?

All we have is speculation that is being misconstrued as fact simply because it is mentioned somewhere and then gets repeated.

He may be guilty, he may not. At this point all we have is an accusation...nothing else.

I get that this is like a kid in a candy shop for the anti-Steeler/Ben crowd, but at least try to deal in the realm of facts.

 

[Godsbrother]

Did NOT try to wade through this entire thread to see if this article had been posted or not, but Joe linked to it on Facebook:

http://nfl.fanhouse.com/2010/03/11/big-ben...than-you-think/

Per speculation on what might happen if he is charged. If he isn't then Ben will walk away from this with his career intact, albeit with a tarnished image.If he is charged then Ben is screwed. He'll almost certainly be suspended and if found guilty be cut by the Steelers and possibly face a lifetime ban from the NFL.

His 28th birthday celebration may end up costing him $50+ million dollars and a shot at the HoF. I hope it was worth it...

 

[E_Smith]

Use Occam's razor on this situation. Which is more likely:(a) A professional athlete, who is rumored to be a jerk and has exhibited mind-numbingly poor judgement in the past involving reckless behavior, alcohol and women, got a little worked up and sexually assaulted a 20 year old woman in a bar;or,(b) A 20 year old college student hatched a complicated plot to extort money from a famous person and staged a sexual assault while she was drinking underage in a bar.

Honestly, I see either as being equally as likely. Two sides to that razor, it seems...

As for (a): being rumored to be a jerk does not prove much, nor do we know that he has exhibited reckless behavior w/ alcohol and women--he may simply have been falsely accused by the Tahoe woman; thus I think you weighted the scale in your presentationAs for (b): its not that complicated or rare for a woman to decide to make a false accusation for any number of reasons, only one of which is to extort money; lets add shame, attention seeking behavior, she was so drunk she doesn't know what exactly happened, revenge (they hooked up and then he dissed her), etc.

 

[Da Guru]

What was Big Ben doing in Midgeville??

 

[Peggy Starfish]

What was Big Ben doing in Midgeville??

Visiting Midge.