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Rules Question (1 Viewer)

Dt's Mules

Footballguy
Got to thinking about this tonight and figured the pool would surely have the answer for me.

Does the clock stop if the ball is fumbled out of bounds (in situations where if the ball carrier goes out of bounds would stop the clock). I do know that the clock doesn't always stop when a runner goes out of bounds so let's just assume it's a situation where the clock would normally stop.

If the answer to the above is yes, why wouldn't a team attempt this:

Situation: the clock winding down and the team with the ball is out of timeouts. Typically the middle of the field is wide open. How about running something over the middle and instead of the receiver trying frantically to get out of bounds, he simply chuncks it out of bounds (must be a lateral obviously). Let's say 5 yards backwards, just to be safe....but couldn't someone conceivably do this?

Now is there any kind of rule that a potential lateral option must be in the vicinity (like intentional grounding)?

Just curious.

 
Got to thinking about this tonight and figured the pool would surely have the answer for me.Does the clock stop if the ball is fumbled out of bounds (in situations where if the ball carrier goes out of bounds would stop the clock). I do know that the clock doesn't always stop when a runner goes out of bounds so let's just assume it's a situation where the clock would normally stop.If the answer to the above is yes, why wouldn't a team attempt this:Situation: the clock winding down and the team with the ball is out of timeouts. Typically the middle of the field is wide open. How about running something over the middle and instead of the receiver trying frantically to get out of bounds, he simply chuncks it out of bounds (must be a lateral obviously). Let's say 5 yards backwards, just to be safe....but couldn't someone conceivably do this?Now is there any kind of rule that a potential lateral option must be in the vicinity (like intentional grounding)?Just curious.
I believe that this would be ruled a delay of game in the NFL but I'm not positive for college.Good thought though.
 
Don't know about NCAA or NFL, but I'm a high school official and that exact play (as long as it's not fumbled forward) is allowed. I'm surprised more teams aren't coached about this as a means to stop the clock. A backwards pass can never be grounding, so simply throwing the ball backward out of bounds prior to being tackled inbounds is a great legal way to stop the clock if you're desperate.

 
Found this from NFL referee Jerry Markbreit:

On the penultimate play of the final USC drive, the quarterback was hit by a Notre Dame player in bounds and fumbled out of bounds. Should the clock have continued to run? Would it make a difference under NFL rules? -- John Davis, Fairfax, Va.

Under NCAA rules, the clock should have been stopped and was stopped correctly because the ball was fumbled out of bounds. Under NFL rules, a forward fumble out of bounds is returned to the spot of the fumble and the clock will start on the ready-for-play. Under NCAA rules, the clock correctly started on the snap. If the fumble, under NFL rules, is backwards and out of bounds, the clock would start on the snap.
It's not a direct answer, but the fact that Jerry doesn't say it's illegal is a sign that it's probably legal.
 
From the NFL rulebook:

Rule 4 Game Timing, Section 3, Article 10, Supplemental Notes

(6) During a play from scrimmage a backward pass going out of bounds during the last two minutes of a half stops the game clock. Time is in with the Referee's whistle (clock signal) when the ball is ready for play.

 
From the NFL rulebook:Rule 4 Game Timing, Section 3, Article 10, Supplemental Notes(6) During a play from scrimmage a backward pass going out of bounds during the last two minutes of a half stops the game clock. Time is in with the Referee's whistle (clock signal) when the ball is ready for play.
i would think more teams would try this...Thanks for the responses all.
 
From the NFL rulebook:Rule 4 Game Timing, Section 3, Article 10, Supplemental Notes(6) During a play from scrimmage a backward pass going out of bounds during the last two minutes of a half stops the game clock. Time is in with the Referee's whistle (clock signal) when the ball is ready for play.
i would think more teams would try this...Thanks for the responses all.
Well, the player has to be able to throw the ball out of bounds successfully. And if he's hit as he's trying to do so, there is an increased chance of a turnover.It is an interesting thing to consider, but I'm not sure I'd want to try it as a coach unless we were really short on time.
 
Ten-second runoff if it's in the final minute of either half, and the clock starts on the official's signal.

Rule 4, Section 3, Article 10:

Action to Conserve Time

A team is not permitted to conserve time inside of one minute of either half by committing any of the following acts: fouls by either team that prevent the snap (i.e., false start, encroachment, etc.), intentional grounding, an illegal forward pass thrown from beyond the line of scrimmage with the intent to conserve time, throwing a backward pass out of bounds with the intent to conserve time, and any other intentional foul that causes the clock to stop.

Penalty: Loss of five yards unless a larger distance penalty is applicable. When actions referred to above are committed by the offensive team with the clock running, officials will run 10 seconds off the game clock before permitting the ball to be put in play on the ready for play signal. The clock will start on the ready for play signal. If the offensive team has timeouts remaining, it will have the option of using a timeout in lieu of a 10-second runoff. If the action is by the defense, the play clock will be reset to 40 seconds and the game clock will start on the ready signal. If the defense has time outs remaining, it will have the option of using a time out in lieu of the game clock being started.
http://blogmedia.thenewstribune.com/media/...%20RULEBOOK.pdf
 
Here is my crazy idea to circumvent the spirit of the rules in these situations. On a long pass completed over the middle of the field, all of the offensive players except for the receiver on the play and another WR downfield stop dead in their tracks. Then one WR snaps the ball to the other WR who then spikes the ball.

Obviously, there is an illegal formation penalty, but that would be negated by encroachment on the defense. There's no failure to report penalty because no one enters the game. I also think the 10-second runoff is avoided, as it is not a foul that causes the clock to stop. A play is not blown dead due to illegal formation. That's why all the other players have to stop dead. A false-start penalty would invoke the runoff rule, and be enforced before a defensive encroachment could occur. But as long as everyone is still, I think we're left with off-setting penalties and a stopped clock.

 
Crazy, quirky idea :goodposting:

However, don't the refs wait till everyone is at the line, or at least in the vicinity, before spotting the ball and 'readying' it for play?

 
Crazy, quirky idea :thumbup: However, don't the refs wait till everyone is at the line, or at least in the vicinity, before spotting the ball and 'readying' it for play?
A better option is to have a 2nd string O-line 30-40 yards downfield on the sideline ready to go in and have your 1st string step off the field.RB/WR/QB/TE can get down there in time.
 
Ten-second runoff if it's in the final minute of either half, and the clock starts on the official's signal.

Rule 4, Section 3, Article 10:

Action to Conserve Time

A team is not permitted to conserve time inside of one minute of either half by committing any of the following acts: fouls by either team that prevent the snap (i.e., false start, encroachment, etc.), intentional grounding, an illegal forward pass thrown from beyond the line of scrimmage with the intent to conserve time, throwing a backward pass out of bounds with the intent to conserve time, and any other intentional foul that causes the clock to stop.

Penalty: Loss of five yards unless a larger distance penalty is applicable. When actions referred to above are committed by the offensive team with the clock running, officials will run 10 seconds off the game clock before permitting the ball to be put in play on the ready for play signal. The clock will start on the ready for play signal. If the offensive team has timeouts remaining, it will have the option of using a timeout in lieu of a 10-second runoff. If the action is by the defense, the play clock will be reset to 40 seconds and the game clock will start on the ready signal. If the defense has time outs remaining, it will have the option of using a time out in lieu of the game clock being started.
http://blogmedia.thenewstribune.com/media/...%20RULEBOOK.pdf
thanks. Do you know if it is the same for college? Really, that would only come into play in college if someone is not going to make it to the first down marker.With regard to the Nfl rules above, it seems like intent to conserve time is the key there....Let's say you design a play similar to hook n' latter, but have the guy set to receive it simply "miss" it as it goes out of bounds. I think you'd be ok in that situation.

 

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