****The 2019 Carolina Panthers Thread**** We Rhule At Losing (1 Viewer)

[NCCommish]

As for Shula I think he called good games. We have some problems on offense. The right side of the line is adequate on it's best day especially at tackle. I think Gross can play another season or two on the left but we need to have his replacement waiting. In fact I would like to bring in a long term answer at LT and move Gross to RT. We can really upgrade about every position on the line but center. Hard to get someone better than Kalil. Improvements on the line will help the running game. We also need a consistent threat at WR. I would prefer a taller receiver personally as the CBs we have to face are getting taller. These needs existed before Shula called his first game. They exist today. I think he did a nice job with an aging receiver, a better than average TE, and a spotty line.

 

[The Man With No Name]

Panthers | Twenty-one players will become unrestricted free agents
Mon, 13 Jan 2014 23:11:59 -0800

The Carolina Panthers have 21 players who will become unrestricted free agents when the free-agency period begins in March. Players include WRs Domenik Hixon, Brandon LaFelland Ted Ginn Jr., QBs Derek Anderson and Jimmy Clausen, TE Ben Hartsock, OL Jordan Gross, OL Geoff Hangartner, OL Travelle Wharton, OL Garry Williams, OL Bruce Campbell, DE Greg Hardy, DT Colin Cole, LBs Jordan Senn, Jason Williams and Dan Connor, SQuintin Mikell, S Michael Mitchell, CBs Captain Munnerlyn and Drayton Florence, and KGraham Gano.

 

[The Commish]

The ONLY one they have to keep on that list is Hardy and I think they'll go the franchise tag route with him for a year and work out the deal during the upcoming year. Some of them will be retained on smaller contracts (is my feeling anyway) However, I came here to post snippets of the DG presser. A positive for sure:

Gettleman: Cam proved this year he is a franchise QB.

Gettleman: Team chemistry is so important. I don't care what anybody says. Need to keep the core.

 

[NCCommish]

The ONLY one they have to keep on that list is Hardy and I think they'll go the franchise tag route with him for a year and work out the deal during the upcoming year. Some of them will be retained on smaller contracts (is my feeling anyway) However, I came here to post snippets of the DG presser. A positive for sure:

Gettleman: Cam proved this year he is a franchise QB.

Gettleman: Team chemistry is so important. I don't care what anybody says. Need to keep the core.

I would say they also really need to try to keep Mitchell. He brought an edge to the secondary and he had good numbers. He should be cheap and he has said he wants to stay.

And Gross. We don't have anyone to replace him with. He has said he is not sure if he is going to play again but if he does the only team he will play for is the Panthers.

And Gano. Dude has really come on.

I would think Hartsock would come cheap and everyone says he is a big part of making the running game work.

 

[Jayrok]

I'd like to keep Gano too. Consistent touch backs on the kickoff is a nice weapon to have.

 

[NCCommish]

I'd like to keep Gano too. Consistent touch backs on the kickoff is a nice weapon to have.

I can't imagine they won't try to work a deal. Gano led the NFL in touchbacks IIRC.

 

[BassNBrew]

I'd like to keep Gano too. Consistent touch backs on the kickoff is a nice weapon to have.

I can't imagine they won't try to work a deal. Gano led the NFL in touchbacks IIRC.

Not possible.

He lead the league in number of kicks returned and kickoff yardage (fewest for both). Whenever you're talking touchbacks you're talking Prater. Half the games in the heavens and Manning providing plenty of kickoff ops.

 

[NCCommish]

I'd like to keep Gano too. Consistent touch backs on the kickoff is a nice weapon to have.

I can't imagine they won't try to work a deal. Gano led the NFL in touchbacks IIRC.

Not possible.

He lead the league in number of kicks returned and kickoff yardage (fewest for both). Whenever you're talking touchbacks you're talking Prater. Half the games in the heavens and Manning providing plenty of kickoff ops.

He led the league in percentage of kicks that were touchbacks at 79.7% according to ESPN.

 

[BassNBrew]

I'd like to keep Gano too. Consistent touch backs on the kickoff is a nice weapon to have.

I can't imagine they won't try to work a deal. Gano led the NFL in touchbacks IIRC.

Not possible.

He lead the league in number of kicks returned and kickoff yardage (fewest for both). Whenever you're talking touchbacks you're talking Prater. Half the games in the heavens and Manning providing plenty of kickoff ops.

He led the league in percentage of kicks that were touchbacks at 79.7% according to ESPN.

Sorry for nit picking.

 

[NCCommish]

I'd like to keep Gano too. Consistent touch backs on the kickoff is a nice weapon to have.

I can't imagine they won't try to work a deal. Gano led the NFL in touchbacks IIRC.

Not possible.

He lead the league in number of kicks returned and kickoff yardage (fewest for both). Whenever you're talking touchbacks you're talking Prater. Half the games in the heavens and Manning providing plenty of kickoff ops.

He led the league in percentage of kicks that were touchbacks at 79.7% according to ESPN.

Sorry for nit picking.

It's what we do

 

[NCCommish]

So I watched the Gettleman/Rivera presser. Didn't take Dave 7 seconds this time. Obviously they wouldn't say much meaningful about contracts or anything. However I think it's clear that at this point Ron Rivera is unlikely to do a lame duck season. After hearing everything I would be surprised if Ron doesn't get an extension soon. I wouldn't expect him to be the highest paid guy but somewhere in the middle sounds right as things stand. Not much reassurance than that on money. At this point I feel Getts would like to keep Hardy but I think he's willing to let him walk rather than mortgage away the future. I know that's the right business and long term team decision but I would hate it. I hope they can work it out. Looking back at the draft hard to find any real fault. Star, KK, AJ. all contributed. Barner was caught in a numbers crunch. And Kugbila who knows? Still 3 hits on 5 picks is pretty good. The average team gets slightly less than 3 contributors in a 7 player draft..So we performed well there. And you have to love some of the FA acquisitions.

A good season indeed.

The future looks bright.

 

[pantherclub]

So I watched the Gettleman/Rivera presser. Didn't take Dave 7 seconds this time. Obviously they wouldn't say much meaningful about contracts or anything. However I think it's clear that at this point Ron Rivera is unlikely to do a lame duck season. After hearing everything I would be surprised if Ron doesn't get an extension soon. I wouldn't expect him to be the highest paid guy but somewhere in the middle sounds right as things stand. Not much reassurance than that on money. At this point I feel Getts would like to keep Hardy but I think he's willing to let him walk rather than mortgage away the future. I know that's the right business and long term team decision but I would hate it. I hope they can work it out. Looking back at the draft hard to find any real fault. Star, KK, AJ. all contributed. Barner was caught in a numbers crunch. And Kugbila who knows? Still 3 hits on 5 picks is pretty good. The average team gets slightly less than 3 contributors in a 7 player draft..So we performed well there. And you have to love some of the FA acquisitions.

A good season indeed.

The future looks bright.

I would bet a perma ban from this board that Gettleman doesnt let Hardy walk. You game?

There is absolutely no chance they let Hardy get away.

 

[NCCommish]

So I watched the Gettleman/Rivera presser. Didn't take Dave 7 seconds this time. Obviously they wouldn't say much meaningful about contracts or anything. However I think it's clear that at this point Ron Rivera is unlikely to do a lame duck season. After hearing everything I would be surprised if Ron doesn't get an extension soon. I wouldn't expect him to be the highest paid guy but somewhere in the middle sounds right as things stand. Not much reassurance than that on money. At this point I feel Getts would like to keep Hardy but I think he's willing to let him walk rather than mortgage away the future. I know that's the right business and long term team decision but I would hate it. I hope they can work it out. Looking back at the draft hard to find any real fault. Star, KK, AJ. all contributed. Barner was caught in a numbers crunch. And Kugbila who knows? Still 3 hits on 5 picks is pretty good. The average team gets slightly less than 3 contributors in a 7 player draft..So we performed well there. And you have to love some of the FA acquisitions.

A good season indeed.

The future looks bright.

I would bet a perma ban from this board that Gettleman doesnt let Hardy walk. You game?

There is absolutely no chance they let Hardy get away.

I think if they can't make a deal that the Panthers can afford he will. Gettleman made it pretty clear he doesn't intend to run this club back into cap hell. Now maybe they franchise him and of course my preference is that they do a long term deal so I hope you are right.

 

[JFS171]

I would imagine a lot of the cap quotes from the presser are more "grandstanding" than anything on Gettleman's part. What's he supposed to say? We've got tons of money to spend!

My point isn't that the cap isn't going to be an ongoing issue - it's still something to navigate. But the situation was far more dire last year, IMO, and GMan put together a strong roster. I have faith he'll do the same again this year.

My guess is they exercise Cam's 5th year option to make sure he's under contract for another season, and put off his long-term deal until next year. I know GMan said he's the franchise guy, and I don't doubt that he is. But I do think there's enough hint of a question as to whether he's a legit franchise cornerstone that they'd like to see him play with more talent on offense before 100% paying him like he's a franchise cornerstone. My point - at this point a lot of saying Cam is a franchise QB is based on him ironing out the inconsistencies and the skills he displays continuing to be refined and enhanced by a better supporting cast. But what if the inconsistencies don't improve? What if he's more Tony Romo-level guy than Brady/Manning/Rodgers level guy?

After that, I'd think Gross and Hardy are the top priorities, but GMan isn't going to mortgage the future to keep Hardy now. He's certainly an important player -- no doubt. And the Giants model was always based on dominating with the front 4 and patching the secondary together. If that's the model for this team, Hardy becomes even more important. But GMan also has to be realistic, and I think yesterday accomplished the goal of putting that thought in the fans' collective mindset and in Hardy's group's mindset - they'll let him walk if they have to.

Regardless - GMan has earned my trust... should be an interesting offseason indeed.

 

[BassNBrew]

So I watched the Gettleman/Rivera presser. Didn't take Dave 7 seconds this time. Obviously they wouldn't say much meaningful about contracts or anything. However I think it's clear that at this point Ron Rivera is unlikely to do a lame duck season. After hearing everything I would be surprised if Ron doesn't get an extension soon. I wouldn't expect him to be the highest paid guy but somewhere in the middle sounds right as things stand. Not much reassurance than that on money. At this point I feel Getts would like to keep Hardy but I think he's willing to let him walk rather than mortgage away the future. I know that's the right business and long term team decision but I would hate it. I hope they can work it out. Looking back at the draft hard to find any real fault. Star, KK, AJ. all contributed. Barner was caught in a numbers crunch. And Kugbila who knows? Still 3 hits on 5 picks is pretty good. The average team gets slightly less than 3 contributors in a 7 player draft..So we performed well there. And you have to love some of the FA acquisitions.

A good season indeed.

The future looks bright.

I would bet a perma ban from this board that Gettleman doesnt let Hardy walk. You game?

There is absolutely no chance they let Hardy get away.

I'm not confident enough to make that bet. But I think it's unlikely they do a long term deal. I've always been a Hardy fan and couldn't believe he didn't get more pt his rookie season, but how much of his success is due to Star and CJ? Also the Giants seemed to be able to find stud after stud on the DL so I think Gettleman has confidence in his ability to find a replacement.

More often than not, when these guys sign big contracts and change teams they don't live up to the money. Peppers unachieved his Chicago contract. I can't even remember the name of the stud that moved from Houston to Buffalo.

 

[NCCommish]

I would imagine a lot of the cap quotes from the presser are more "grandstanding" than anything on Gettleman's part. What's he supposed to say? We've got tons of money to spend!

My point isn't that the cap isn't going to be an ongoing issue - it's still something to navigate. But the situation was far more dire last year, IMO, and GMan put together a strong roster. I have faith he'll do the same again this year.

My guess is they exercise Cam's 5th year option to make sure he's under contract for another season, and put off his long-term deal until next year. I know GMan said he's the franchise guy, and I don't doubt that he is. But I do think there's enough hint of a question as to whether he's a legit franchise cornerstone that they'd like to see him play with more talent on offense before 100% paying him like he's a franchise cornerstone. My point - at this point a lot of saying Cam is a franchise QB is based on him ironing out the inconsistencies and the skills he displays continuing to be refined and enhanced by a better supporting cast. But what if the inconsistencies don't improve? What if he's more Tony Romo-level guy than Brady/Manning/Rodgers level guy?

After that, I'd think Gross and Hardy are the top priorities, but GMan isn't going to mortgage the future to keep Hardy now. He's certainly an important player -- no doubt. And the Giants model was always based on dominating with the front 4 and patching the secondary together. If that's the model for this team, Hardy becomes even more important. But GMan also has to be realistic, and I think yesterday accomplished the goal of putting that thought in the fans' collective mindset and in Hardy's group's mindset - they'll let him walk if they have to.

Regardless - GMan has earned my trust... should be an interesting offseason indeed.

If they exercise the option they pay Cam like a franchise QB anyway. It's pretty equivalent to the tag as far as how his price next year is figured.

 

[NCCommish]

So I watched the Gettleman/Rivera presser. Didn't take Dave 7 seconds this time. Obviously they wouldn't say much meaningful about contracts or anything. However I think it's clear that at this point Ron Rivera is unlikely to do a lame duck season. After hearing everything I would be surprised if Ron doesn't get an extension soon. I wouldn't expect him to be the highest paid guy but somewhere in the middle sounds right as things stand. Not much reassurance than that on money. At this point I feel Getts would like to keep Hardy but I think he's willing to let him walk rather than mortgage away the future. I know that's the right business and long term team decision but I would hate it. I hope they can work it out. Looking back at the draft hard to find any real fault. Star, KK, AJ. all contributed. Barner was caught in a numbers crunch. And Kugbila who knows? Still 3 hits on 5 picks is pretty good. The average team gets slightly less than 3 contributors in a 7 player draft..So we performed well there. And you have to love some of the FA acquisitions.

A good season indeed.

The future looks bright.

I would bet a perma ban from this board that Gettleman doesnt let Hardy walk. You game?

There is absolutely no chance they let Hardy get away.

I'm not confident enough to make that bet. But I think it's unlikely they do a long term deal. I've always been a Hardy fan and couldn't believe he didn't get more pt his rookie season, but how much of his success is due to Star and CJ? Also the Giants seemed to be able to find stud after stud on the DL so I think Gettleman has confidence in his ability to find a replacement.

More often than not, when these guys sign big contracts and change teams they don't live up to the money. Peppers unachieved his Chicago contract. I can't even remember the name of the stud that moved from Houston to Buffalo.

And their success is based at least partly on Hardy's play.

 

[JFS171]

I would imagine a lot of the cap quotes from the presser are more "grandstanding" than anything on Gettleman's part. What's he supposed to say? We've got tons of money to spend!

My point isn't that the cap isn't going to be an ongoing issue - it's still something to navigate. But the situation was far more dire last year, IMO, and GMan put together a strong roster. I have faith he'll do the same again this year.

My guess is they exercise Cam's 5th year option to make sure he's under contract for another season, and put off his long-term deal until next year. I know GMan said he's the franchise guy, and I don't doubt that he is. But I do think there's enough hint of a question as to whether he's a legit franchise cornerstone that they'd like to see him play with more talent on offense before 100% paying him like he's a franchise cornerstone. My point - at this point a lot of saying Cam is a franchise QB is based on him ironing out the inconsistencies and the skills he displays continuing to be refined and enhanced by a better supporting cast. But what if the inconsistencies don't improve? What if he's more Tony Romo-level guy than Brady/Manning/Rodgers level guy?

After that, I'd think Gross and Hardy are the top priorities, but GMan isn't going to mortgage the future to keep Hardy now. He's certainly an important player -- no doubt. And the Giants model was always based on dominating with the front 4 and patching the secondary together. If that's the model for this team, Hardy becomes even more important. But GMan also has to be realistic, and I think yesterday accomplished the goal of putting that thought in the fans' collective mindset and in Hardy's group's mindset - they'll let him walk if they have to.

Regardless - GMan has earned my trust... should be an interesting offseason indeed.

If they exercise the option they pay Cam like a franchise QB anyway. It's pretty equivalent to the tag as far as how his price next year is figured.

That's not the point. The point is that they push Cam's deal off another year with an action taken in this offseason (exercising the option) without having to use the franchise tag next year. What it does is allow them to still have his rookie contract counting against the 2014 cap instead of the first year of his long-term deal. In 2015, they'd have the first year of his long-term contract (as I'd expect they would resign him at that point) as opposed to having to have the space for the franchise tag. Point being - it buys them time to navigate the cap situation without having Cam entering the final year of his deal and heading for FA.

 

[elbowrm]

This conversation just serves as another reminder that Hurney and tannenbaum are neck and neck for worst gm in nfl history. Well, outside of Matt Millen and jerry jones I guess.

 

[NCCommish]

I would imagine a lot of the cap quotes from the presser are more "grandstanding" than anything on Gettleman's part. What's he supposed to say? We've got tons of money to spend!

My point isn't that the cap isn't going to be an ongoing issue - it's still something to navigate. But the situation was far more dire last year, IMO, and GMan put together a strong roster. I have faith he'll do the same again this year.

My guess is they exercise Cam's 5th year option to make sure he's under contract for another season, and put off his long-term deal until next year. I know GMan said he's the franchise guy, and I don't doubt that he is. But I do think there's enough hint of a question as to whether he's a legit franchise cornerstone that they'd like to see him play with more talent on offense before 100% paying him like he's a franchise cornerstone. My point - at this point a lot of saying Cam is a franchise QB is based on him ironing out the inconsistencies and the skills he displays continuing to be refined and enhanced by a better supporting cast. But what if the inconsistencies don't improve? What if he's more Tony Romo-level guy than Brady/Manning/Rodgers level guy?

After that, I'd think Gross and Hardy are the top priorities, but GMan isn't going to mortgage the future to keep Hardy now. He's certainly an important player -- no doubt. And the Giants model was always based on dominating with the front 4 and patching the secondary together. If that's the model for this team, Hardy becomes even more important. But GMan also has to be realistic, and I think yesterday accomplished the goal of putting that thought in the fans' collective mindset and in Hardy's group's mindset - they'll let him walk if they have to.

Regardless - GMan has earned my trust... should be an interesting offseason indeed.

If they exercise the option they pay Cam like a franchise QB anyway. It's pretty equivalent to the tag as far as how his price next year is figured.

That's not the point. The point is that they push Cam's deal off another year with an action taken in this offseason (exercising the option) without having to use the franchise tag next year. What it does is allow them to still have his rookie contract counting against the 2014 cap instead of the first year of his long-term deal. In 2015, they'd have the first year of his long-term contract (as I'd expect they would resign him at that point) as opposed to having to have the space for the franchise tag. Point being - it buys them time to navigate the cap situation without having Cam entering the final year of his deal and heading for FA.

What it seems most likely is they franchise Hardy. He has already said there would be no hard feelings in fact it seems he almost expects it. And they get Cam his deal this year. Your QB shouldn't be a lame duck because it looks like a vote of no confidence. Now that's fine if you are worried but I don't think anyone in the Panthers org is worried that Cam isn't their guy.

 

[The Commish]

Is it delusional to think Benjamin, Beckham and Hearst would all be available as picks to the Panthers? Not sure Beckham would be big enough for my liking, but that guy can get open.

 

[NCCommish]

Is it delusional to think Benjamin, Beckham and Hearst would all be available as picks to the Panthers? Not sure Beckham would be big enough for my liking, but that guy can get open.

The mocks I have seen put Benjamin, Allen and Cooks in our range. I would like Allen or Benjamin personally. Benjamin is raw but you can't teach 6'5" and fast. I would prefer him over Allen and Allen over Cooks. Cooks though may be a game breaker. They are calling him Tavon 2.0.

 

[JFS171]

I would imagine a lot of the cap quotes from the presser are more "grandstanding" than anything on Gettleman's part. What's he supposed to say? We've got tons of money to spend!

My point isn't that the cap isn't going to be an ongoing issue - it's still something to navigate. But the situation was far more dire last year, IMO, and GMan put together a strong roster. I have faith he'll do the same again this year.

My guess is they exercise Cam's 5th year option to make sure he's under contract for another season, and put off his long-term deal until next year. I know GMan said he's the franchise guy, and I don't doubt that he is. But I do think there's enough hint of a question as to whether he's a legit franchise cornerstone that they'd like to see him play with more talent on offense before 100% paying him like he's a franchise cornerstone. My point - at this point a lot of saying Cam is a franchise QB is based on him ironing out the inconsistencies and the skills he displays continuing to be refined and enhanced by a better supporting cast. But what if the inconsistencies don't improve? What if he's more Tony Romo-level guy than Brady/Manning/Rodgers level guy?

After that, I'd think Gross and Hardy are the top priorities, but GMan isn't going to mortgage the future to keep Hardy now. He's certainly an important player -- no doubt. And the Giants model was always based on dominating with the front 4 and patching the secondary together. If that's the model for this team, Hardy becomes even more important. But GMan also has to be realistic, and I think yesterday accomplished the goal of putting that thought in the fans' collective mindset and in Hardy's group's mindset - they'll let him walk if they have to.

Regardless - GMan has earned my trust... should be an interesting offseason indeed.

If they exercise the option they pay Cam like a franchise QB anyway. It's pretty equivalent to the tag as far as how his price next year is figured.

That's not the point. The point is that they push Cam's deal off another year with an action taken in this offseason (exercising the option) without having to use the franchise tag next year. What it does is allow them to still have his rookie contract counting against the 2014 cap instead of the first year of his long-term deal. In 2015, they'd have the first year of his long-term contract (as I'd expect they would resign him at that point) as opposed to having to have the space for the franchise tag. Point being - it buys them time to navigate the cap situation without having Cam entering the final year of his deal and heading for FA.

What it seems most likely is they franchise Hardy. He has already said there would be no hard feelings in fact it seems he almost expects it. And they get Cam his deal this year. Your QB shouldn't be a lame duck because it looks like a vote of no confidence. Now that's fine if you are worried but I don't think anyone in the Panthers org is worried that Cam isn't their guy.

How is picking up the option on his rookie deal a vote of no confidence? It's extending his contract by a year, through the 2015 season, instead of letting him play out the last year of his deal this year, then franchise tagging him.

The franchise tag route could be seen as lacking confidence in Cam, sure. I could buy that. But, picking up his option wouldn't seem to be IMO.

Plus, let's consider the financial impacts. The 5th year option is the average of the top 10 QB contracts. Franchise tag would be the average of the top 5 QB contracts. While it may not be a huge difference, it's financially smarter to exercise the option than employ the franchise tag.

 

[BassNBrew]

This conversation just serves as another reminder that Hurney and tannenbaum are neck and neck for worst gm in nfl history. Well, outside of Matt Millen and jerry jones I guess.

Which conversation?

The one about re-signing picks Hurney knocked out of the park?

 

[BassNBrew]

I would imagine a lot of the cap quotes from the presser are more "grandstanding" than anything on Gettleman's part. What's he supposed to say? We've got tons of money to spend!

My point isn't that the cap isn't going to be an ongoing issue - it's still something to navigate. But the situation was far more dire last year, IMO, and GMan put together a strong roster. I have faith he'll do the same again this year.

My guess is they exercise Cam's 5th year option to make sure he's under contract for another season, and put off his long-term deal until next year. I know GMan said he's the franchise guy, and I don't doubt that he is. But I do think there's enough hint of a question as to whether he's a legit franchise cornerstone that they'd like to see him play with more talent on offense before 100% paying him like he's a franchise cornerstone. My point - at this point a lot of saying Cam is a franchise QB is based on him ironing out the inconsistencies and the skills he displays continuing to be refined and enhanced by a better supporting cast. But what if the inconsistencies don't improve? What if he's more Tony Romo-level guy than Brady/Manning/Rodgers level guy?

After that, I'd think Gross and Hardy are the top priorities, but GMan isn't going to mortgage the future to keep Hardy now. He's certainly an important player -- no doubt. And the Giants model was always based on dominating with the front 4 and patching the secondary together. If that's the model for this team, Hardy becomes even more important. But GMan also has to be realistic, and I think yesterday accomplished the goal of putting that thought in the fans' collective mindset and in Hardy's group's mindset - they'll let him walk if they have to.

Regardless - GMan has earned my trust... should be an interesting offseason indeed.

If they exercise the option they pay Cam like a franchise QB anyway. It's pretty equivalent to the tag as far as how his price next year is figured.

That's not the point. The point is that they push Cam's deal off another year with an action taken in this offseason (exercising the option) without having to use the franchise tag next year. What it does is allow them to still have his rookie contract counting against the 2014 cap instead of the first year of his long-term deal. In 2015, they'd have the first year of his long-term contract (as I'd expect they would resign him at that point) as opposed to having to have the space for the franchise tag. Point being - it buys them time to navigate the cap situation without having Cam entering the final year of his deal and heading for FA.

Cam can be had at a discount this year. The earlier you get him a nice signing bonus, the less he'll command in total dollars.

If Cam is your guy you can risk him missing time in camps. Hardee could walk into the locker the first Monday before the regular season and you wouldn't be able to tell a difference.

 

[The Commish]

Is it delusional to think Benjamin, Beckham and Hearst would all be available as picks to the Panthers? Not sure Beckham would be big enough for my liking, but that guy can get open.

The mocks I have seen put Benjamin, Allen and Cooks in our range. I would like Allen or Benjamin personally. Benjamin is raw but you can't teach 6'5" and fast. I would prefer him over Allen and Allen over Cooks. Cooks though may be a game breaker. They are calling him Tavon 2.0.

That'd be round one....I was going to rounds two and three as well. If Benjamin is there, it's a no brainer IMO. I don't want Cooks for two reasons...small (been there, done that) not #1 material IMO. If they keep Ginn he'd do just fine as the "game breaker" for the team....#2 I'm not sure he's not a system guy (i.e. product of the system he was in more than talented). But looking past round 1, is it realistic to get the others in later rounds or just a pipe dream?

 

[NCCommish]

Is it delusional to think Benjamin, Beckham and Hearst would all be available as picks to the Panthers? Not sure Beckham would be big enough for my liking, but that guy can get open.

The mocks I have seen put Benjamin, Allen and Cooks in our range. I would like Allen or Benjamin personally. Benjamin is raw but you can't teach 6'5" and fast. I would prefer him over Allen and Allen over Cooks. Cooks though may be a game breaker. They are calling him Tavon 2.0.

That'd be round one....I was going to rounds two and three as well. If Benjamin is there, it's a no brainer IMO. I don't want Cooks for two reasons...small (been there, done that) not #1 material IMO. If they keep Ginn he'd do just fine as the "game breaker" for the team....#2 I'm not sure he's not a system guy (i.e. product of the system he was in more than talented). But looking past round 1, is it realistic to get the others in later rounds or just a pipe dream?

Benjamin is the only one of those 3 that may drop into the second. He is very raw. But he won't drop far in the second. Now this class is receiver heavy so there are certainly more than a few choices and there may be some guys that are very good in later rounds. Especially given how many teams are supposedly looking to grab QBs this time around. By the way Cooks is the same size as the most dynamic offensive player pre-Cam this team has ever had.

 

[stbugs]

I haven't seen it mentioned, but I would put Ginn as a priority resign as well. It just seemed like on returns or as a WR, he just seemed to make big plays when needed. I know LaFell may be more prototypical of a WR, but if they snag someone like Benjamin and put Smith in the slot, I would rather have Ginn as a burner WR3 than LaFell and have Ginn's return ability as well. I don't think Ginn will cost much either.

ETA: If a WR like Benjamin pans out, it seems like Ds having to concentrate on Olsen, Smith, Cam running and Benjamin will mean that Ginn is going to be wide open on a lot of deep balls.

 

[NCCommish]

I haven't seen it mentioned, but I would put Ginn as a priority resign as well. It just seemed like on returns or as a WR, he just seemed to make big plays when needed. I know LaFell may be more prototypical of a WR, but if they snag someone like Benjamin and put Smith in the slot, I would rather have Ginn as a burner WR3 than LaFell and have Ginn's return ability as well. I don't think Ginn will cost much either.

ETA: If a WR like Benjamin pans out, it seems like Ds having to concentrate on Olsen, Smith, Cam running and Benjamin will mean that Ginn is going to be wide open on a lot of deep balls.

I think its far more likely Ginn is on this team next year than LaFell. I like LaFell. I like that he is fine blocking. But he had his chance to show up and he admitted he couldn't beat the coverages that Steve beats every game. He can't get separation from coverage. He is at best a 3rd or 4th receiver. If he doesn't want to be paid like one I think he will playing elsewhere next season.

 

[stbugs]

I haven't seen it mentioned, but I would put Ginn as a priority resign as well. It just seemed like on returns or as a WR, he just seemed to make big plays when needed. I know LaFell may be more prototypical of a WR, but if they snag someone like Benjamin and put Smith in the slot, I would rather have Ginn as a burner WR3 than LaFell and have Ginn's return ability as well. I don't think Ginn will cost much either.

ETA: If a WR like Benjamin pans out, it seems like Ds having to concentrate on Olsen, Smith, Cam running and Benjamin will mean that Ginn is going to be wide open on a lot of deep balls.

I think its far more likely Ginn is on this team next year than LaFell. I like LaFell. I like that he is fine blocking. But he had his chance to show up and he admitted he couldn't beat the coverages that Steve beats every game. He can't get separation from coverage. He is at best a 3rd or 4th receiver. If he doesn't want to be paid like one I think he will playing elsewhere next season.

Agreed. I think Ginn has a nicer skill set for being that fourth option. Think Meachem/Henderson/Stills in NO. Ginn has the speed to get behind the coverage when they concentrate on the others and Cam has the arm to hit him deep. The problem was this year that they only needed to concentrate on Smith and Olsen. NO has Colston, Graham and Moore/Sproles/PT, so Stills and even Meachem again regularly got single coverage and ended up wide open for long TDs.

 

[BassNBrew]

I haven't seen it mentioned, but I would put Ginn as a priority resign as well. It just seemed like on returns or as a WR, he just seemed to make big plays when needed. I know LaFell may be more prototypical of a WR, but if they snag someone like Benjamin and put Smith in the slot, I would rather have Ginn as a burner WR3 than LaFell and have Ginn's return ability as well. I don't think Ginn will cost much either.

ETA: If a WR like Benjamin pans out, it seems like Ds having to concentrate on Olsen, Smith, Cam running and Benjamin will mean that Ginn is going to be wide open on a lot of deep balls.

I think its far more likely Ginn is on this team next year than LaFell. I like LaFell. I like that he is fine blocking. But he had his chance to show up and he admitted he couldn't beat the coverages that Steve beats every game. He can't get separation from coverage. He is at best a 3rd or 4th receiver. If he doesn't want to be paid like one I think he will playing elsewhere next season.

So basically he's more of a very undersized guard than a WR. He should be thankful if he gets offered a veteran min salary. His next stop should involve the words "Would you like fries with that."

 

[stbugs]

I haven't seen it mentioned, but I would put Ginn as a priority resign as well. It just seemed like on returns or as a WR, he just seemed to make big plays when needed. I know LaFell may be more prototypical of a WR, but if they snag someone like Benjamin and put Smith in the slot, I would rather have Ginn as a burner WR3 than LaFell and have Ginn's return ability as well. I don't think Ginn will cost much either.

ETA: If a WR like Benjamin pans out, it seems like Ds having to concentrate on Olsen, Smith, Cam running and Benjamin will mean that Ginn is going to be wide open on a lot of deep balls.

I think its far more likely Ginn is on this team next year than LaFell. I like LaFell. I like that he is fine blocking. But he had his chance to show up and he admitted he couldn't beat the coverages that Steve beats every game. He can't get separation from coverage. He is at best a 3rd or 4th receiver. If he doesn't want to be paid like one I think he will playing elsewhere next season.

So basically he's more of a very undersized guard than a WR. He should be thankful if he gets offered a veteran min salary. His next stop should involve the words "Would you like fries with that."

Yeah, he is easily replaceable. He hasn't seemed to take that next step to be the guy in the final years of Smith's career. He is a backup and they need to find a solid WR that can help the offense get better. Ginn can't do it either, but he is a much better choice to be the third WR go deep/big play guy.

 

[NCCommish]

I haven't seen it mentioned, but I would put Ginn as a priority resign as well. It just seemed like on returns or as a WR, he just seemed to make big plays when needed. I know LaFell may be more prototypical of a WR, but if they snag someone like Benjamin and put Smith in the slot, I would rather have Ginn as a burner WR3 than LaFell and have Ginn's return ability as well. I don't think Ginn will cost much either.

ETA: If a WR like Benjamin pans out, it seems like Ds having to concentrate on Olsen, Smith, Cam running and Benjamin will mean that Ginn is going to be wide open on a lot of deep balls.

I think its far more likely Ginn is on this team next year than LaFell. I like LaFell. I like that he is fine blocking. But he had his chance to show up and he admitted he couldn't beat the coverages that Steve beats every game. He can't get separation from coverage. He is at best a 3rd or 4th receiver. If he doesn't want to be paid like one I think he will playing elsewhere next season.

So basically he's more of a very undersized guard than a WR. He should be thankful if he gets offered a veteran min salary. His next stop should involve the words "Would you like fries with that."

To be fair he did spring some big plays with his down field blocking ad he did make a few big catches. Still he is not consistent enough to be anything but a 4 or 5 so I do agree with the vet minimum .

 

[The Commish]

Is it delusional to think Benjamin, Beckham and Hearst would all be available as picks to the Panthers? Not sure Beckham would be big enough for my liking, but that guy can get open.

The mocks I have seen put Benjamin, Allen and Cooks in our range. I would like Allen or Benjamin personally. Benjamin is raw but you can't teach 6'5" and fast. I would prefer him over Allen and Allen over Cooks. Cooks though may be a game breaker. They are calling him Tavon 2.0.

That'd be round one....I was going to rounds two and three as well. If Benjamin is there, it's a no brainer IMO. I don't want Cooks for two reasons...small (been there, done that) not #1 material IMO. If they keep Ginn he'd do just fine as the "game breaker" for the team....#2 I'm not sure he's not a system guy (i.e. product of the system he was in more than talented). But looking past round 1, is it realistic to get the others in later rounds or just a pipe dream?

Benjamin is the only one of those 3 that may drop into the second. He is very raw. But he won't drop far in the second. Now this class is receiver heavy so there are certainly more than a few choices and there may be some guys that are very good in later rounds. Especially given how many teams are supposedly looking to grab QBs this time around. By the way Cooks is the same size as the most dynamic offensive player pre-Cam this team has ever had.

I know he is, but there's not a single person on this planet that has the drive of said player and that's what makes him special. I know there are a lot of WRs in this draft and I'm hoping they grab more than one because of it.

 

[JFS171]

Is it delusional to think Benjamin, Beckham and Hearst would all be available as picks to the Panthers? Not sure Beckham would be big enough for my liking, but that guy can get open.

The mocks I have seen put Benjamin, Allen and Cooks in our range. I would like Allen or Benjamin personally. Benjamin is raw but you can't teach 6'5" and fast. I would prefer him over Allen and Allen over Cooks. Cooks though may be a game breaker. They are calling him Tavon 2.0.

That'd be round one....I was going to rounds two and three as well. If Benjamin is there, it's a no brainer IMO. I don't want Cooks for two reasons...small (been there, done that) not #1 material IMO. If they keep Ginn he'd do just fine as the "game breaker" for the team....#2 I'm not sure he's not a system guy (i.e. product of the system he was in more than talented). But looking past round 1, is it realistic to get the others in later rounds or just a pipe dream?

Benjamin is the only one of those 3 that may drop into the second. He is very raw. But he won't drop far in the second. Now this class is receiver heavy so there are certainly more than a few choices and there may be some guys that are very good in later rounds. Especially given how many teams are supposedly looking to grab QBs this time around. By the way Cooks is the same size as the most dynamic offensive player pre-Cam this team has ever had.

I know he is, but there's not a single person on this planet that has the drive of said player and that's what makes him special. I know there are a lot of WRs in this draft and I'm hoping they grab more than one because of it.

After what we saw GMan do last year on the DL, I'm hoping the same thing, whether addressed through FA and the draft or solely through the draft. Of course, his focus could also be on the OL where we may see a few guys drafted toward fixing that issue.

Regardless, while we don't have a huge sample size, I think we've seen GMan throw a lot of options at the problems identified to attempt to make the weakness a strength. That was with premium draft picks at DT, a bunch of FAs at CB.

I'm certainly hoping it's OL and WR that are the identified issues.

 

[NCCommish]

Is it delusional to think Benjamin, Beckham and Hearst would all be available as picks to the Panthers? Not sure Beckham would be big enough for my liking, but that guy can get open.

The mocks I have seen put Benjamin, Allen and Cooks in our range. I would like Allen or Benjamin personally. Benjamin is raw but you can't teach 6'5" and fast. I would prefer him over Allen and Allen over Cooks. Cooks though may be a game breaker. They are calling him Tavon 2.0.

That'd be round one....I was going to rounds two and three as well. If Benjamin is there, it's a no brainer IMO. I don't want Cooks for two reasons...small (been there, done that) not #1 material IMO. If they keep Ginn he'd do just fine as the "game breaker" for the team....#2 I'm not sure he's not a system guy (i.e. product of the system he was in more than talented). But looking past round 1, is it realistic to get the others in later rounds or just a pipe dream?

Benjamin is the only one of those 3 that may drop into the second. He is very raw. But he won't drop far in the second. Now this class is receiver heavy so there are certainly more than a few choices and there may be some guys that are very good in later rounds. Especially given how many teams are supposedly looking to grab QBs this time around. By the way Cooks is the same size as the most dynamic offensive player pre-Cam this team has ever had.

I know he is, but there's not a single person on this planet that has the drive of said player and that's what makes him special. I know there are a lot of WRs in this draft and I'm hoping they grab more than one because of it.

After what we saw GMan do last year on the DL, I'm hoping the same thing, whether addressed through FA and the draft or solely through the draft. Of course, his focus could also be on the OL where we may see a few guys drafted toward fixing that issue.

Regardless, while we don't have a huge sample size, I think we've seen GMan throw a lot of options at the problems identified to attempt to make the weakness a strength. That was with premium draft picks at DT, a bunch of FAs at CB.

I'm certainly hoping it's OL and WR that are the identified issues.

Not sure how it could really be anything else. You declared Cam the Franchise QB. So now get him some weapons and help him stay upright.

 

[JFS171]

Is it delusional to think Benjamin, Beckham and Hearst would all be available as picks to the Panthers? Not sure Beckham would be big enough for my liking, but that guy can get open.

The mocks I have seen put Benjamin, Allen and Cooks in our range. I would like Allen or Benjamin personally. Benjamin is raw but you can't teach 6'5" and fast. I would prefer him over Allen and Allen over Cooks. Cooks though may be a game breaker. They are calling him Tavon 2.0.

That'd be round one....I was going to rounds two and three as well. If Benjamin is there, it's a no brainer IMO. I don't want Cooks for two reasons...small (been there, done that) not #1 material IMO. If they keep Ginn he'd do just fine as the "game breaker" for the team....#2 I'm not sure he's not a system guy (i.e. product of the system he was in more than talented). But looking past round 1, is it realistic to get the others in later rounds or just a pipe dream?

Benjamin is the only one of those 3 that may drop into the second. He is very raw. But he won't drop far in the second. Now this class is receiver heavy so there are certainly more than a few choices and there may be some guys that are very good in later rounds. Especially given how many teams are supposedly looking to grab QBs this time around. By the way Cooks is the same size as the most dynamic offensive player pre-Cam this team has ever had.

I know he is, but there's not a single person on this planet that has the drive of said player and that's what makes him special. I know there are a lot of WRs in this draft and I'm hoping they grab more than one because of it.

After what we saw GMan do last year on the DL, I'm hoping the same thing, whether addressed through FA and the draft or solely through the draft. Of course, his focus could also be on the OL where we may see a few guys drafted toward fixing that issue.

Regardless, while we don't have a huge sample size, I think we've seen GMan throw a lot of options at the problems identified to attempt to make the weakness a strength. That was with premium draft picks at DT, a bunch of FAs at CB.

I'm certainly hoping it's OL and WR that are the identified issues.

Not sure how it could really be anything else. You declared Cam the Franchise QB. So now get him some weapons and help him stay upright.

Would agree it seems pretty obvious to us, but there are other deficiencies on the team -- secondary and potentially DE if Hardy leaves. Giants always focused heavily on the DL, so...

 

[NCCommish]

Is it delusional to think Benjamin, Beckham and Hearst would all be available as picks to the Panthers? Not sure Beckham would be big enough for my liking, but that guy can get open.

The mocks I have seen put Benjamin, Allen and Cooks in our range. I would like Allen or Benjamin personally. Benjamin is raw but you can't teach 6'5" and fast. I would prefer him over Allen and Allen over Cooks. Cooks though may be a game breaker. They are calling him Tavon 2.0.

That'd be round one....I was going to rounds two and three as well. If Benjamin is there, it's a no brainer IMO. I don't want Cooks for two reasons...small (been there, done that) not #1 material IMO. If they keep Ginn he'd do just fine as the "game breaker" for the team....#2 I'm not sure he's not a system guy (i.e. product of the system he was in more than talented). But looking past round 1, is it realistic to get the others in later rounds or just a pipe dream?

Benjamin is the only one of those 3 that may drop into the second. He is very raw. But he won't drop far in the second. Now this class is receiver heavy so there are certainly more than a few choices and there may be some guys that are very good in later rounds. Especially given how many teams are supposedly looking to grab QBs this time around. By the way Cooks is the same size as the most dynamic offensive player pre-Cam this team has ever had.

I know he is, but there's not a single person on this planet that has the drive of said player and that's what makes him special. I know there are a lot of WRs in this draft and I'm hoping they grab more than one because of it.

After what we saw GMan do last year on the DL, I'm hoping the same thing, whether addressed through FA and the draft or solely through the draft. Of course, his focus could also be on the OL where we may see a few guys drafted toward fixing that issue.

Regardless, while we don't have a huge sample size, I think we've seen GMan throw a lot of options at the problems identified to attempt to make the weakness a strength. That was with premium draft picks at DT, a bunch of FAs at CB.

I'm certainly hoping it's OL and WR that are the identified issues.

Not sure how it could really be anything else. You declared Cam the Franchise QB. So now get him some weapons and help him stay upright.

Would agree it seems pretty obvious to us, but there are other deficiencies on the team -- secondary and potentially DE if Hardy leaves. Giants always focused heavily on the DL, so...

True but I think Getts has shown he can recognize a weakness and attack. Look at how many WRs they churned through the team this year. He knows he has a serious deficiency.

 

[The Commish]

Rivera gets a 3 year contract extension. I've never been more wrong about a guy...glad I was though.

 

[ffldrew]

Rivera gets a 3 year contract extension. I've never been more wrong about a guy...glad I was though.

He's going to be in that Coughlin status -- From a few tough losses and everyone wants him gone vs some key wins and everyone praising him. Enjoy the roller coaster.

 

[pantherclub]

Rivera gets a 3 year contract extension. I've never been more wrong about a guy...glad I was though.

I agree totally. But there is a little part in my gut that thinks that Sean McDermott saved Ron's ### this year. The defense was absolutely incredible this year and the offense was clunky at best.

 

[NCCommish]

Rivera gets a 3 year contract extension. I've never been more wrong about a guy...glad I was though.

I agree totally. But there is a little part in my gut that thinks that Sean McDermott saved Ron's ### this year. The defense was absolutely incredible this year and the offense was clunky at best.

Well it's been widely reported that Rivera is more than a little involved with the D. We all know why the offense had struggles. A lack of playmakers on the edge and an offensive line that needed some help on the right side. Now that we have Rivera locked up I hope they find some receivers, a tackle and an above average corner for that matter.

 

[drfeelgood]

Rivera gets a 3 year contract extension. I've never been more wrong about a guy...glad I was though.

He's going to be in that Coughlin status -- From a few tough losses and everyone wants him gone vs some key wins and everyone praising him. Enjoy the roller coaster.

A lot of franchises experience that roller coaster, but if you want to focus on Coughlin, I'll take that roller coaster ride that includes two Super Bowl wins within 5 years.

 

[simey]

to Rivera for winning Coach of the Year, and to Kuechly for winning Defensive Player of the Year.

 

[NCCommish]

So Luke gets DPOY and Rivera picks up Coaching honors. Not bad at all.

Should have typed faster

 

[BassNBrew]

to Rivera for winning Coach of the Year, and to Kuechly for winning Defensive Player of the Year.

Coach of the year is well deserved. I'm happy for Kuechly but think he was gifted that award. I personally think Davis had a better year. Please feel free to correct me, that's just a gut feeling. I just remember Kuechly getting beat more often and getting the benefit of several calls.

 

[NCCommish]

to Rivera for winning Coach of the Year, and to Kuechly for winning Defensive Player of the Year.

Coach of the year is well deserved. I'm happy for Kuechly but think he was gifted that award. I personally think Davis had a better year. Please feel free to correct me, that's just a gut feeling. I just remember Kuechly getting beat more often and getting the benefit of several calls.

Which Davis we talking?

 

[The Commish]

Switching Scouting Services

 

[BassNBrew]

to Rivera for winning Coach of the Year, and to Kuechly for winning Defensive Player of the Year.

Coach of the year is well deserved. I'm happy for Kuechly but think he was gifted that award. I personally think Davis had a better year. Please feel free to correct me, that's just a gut feeling. I just remember Kuechly getting beat more often and getting the benefit of several calls.

Which Davis we talking?

Thomas

 

[NCCommish]

to Rivera for winning Coach of the Year, and to Kuechly for winning Defensive Player of the Year.

Coach of the year is well deserved. I'm happy for Kuechly but think he was gifted that award. I personally think Davis had a better year. Please feel free to correct me, that's just a gut feeling. I just remember Kuechly getting beat more often and getting the benefit of several calls.

Which Davis we talking?

Thomas

Not sure why he doesn't get more attention than he does. For sure should have gotten Comeback Player last year and definitely earned a Pro Bowl spot both years IMO.