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The investigation investigations: DOJ exonerates McCabe (2 Viewers)

The Z Machine said:
Ah, so there is a criminal statute against meddling with the IG, which extends all the way to the leader of the executive branch.  That meddling would also cover dictating the date and distribution of the release of reports from the IG? That was the original intent of my inquiry.
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There are statues prohibiting obstruction of justice generally.

 
Joe Summer said:
It's also well established that the Trump administration doesn't show much respect for things that are well established.
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He doesn't have to show respect for his lack of authority in order to be made impotent by it.

Disrespecting gravity doesn't mean you can fly.

 
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The Z Machine said:
No offense @Maurile Tremblay, but your analogies aren't very good on this one.  You describe physical impossibilities, but Trump circumventing laws is certainly not that.
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I don't know what your contention is. Are you saying that you think Trump is capable of dictating what will be in the Horowitz report? If so, what's your basis for thinking that he's capable of it?

(And the analogy to physical impossibility is apt. It is physically impossible -- not just illegal -- for Trump to control what goes into the IG report since Trump doesn't have physical custody of the report. Illegality was no part of my argument. You brought illegality up and I answered questions about it; but illegality isn't why Trump is powerless to edit the report to his liking.)

 
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Maurile Tremblay said:
I don't know what your contention is. Are you saying that you think Trump is capable of dictating what will be in the Horowitz report? If so, what's your basis for thinking that he's capable of it?

(And the analogy to physical impossibility is apt. It is physically impossible -- not just illegal -- for Trump to control what goes into the IG report since Trump doesn't have physical custody of the report. Illegality was no part of my argument. You brought illegality up and I answered questions about it; but illegality isn't why Trump is powerless to edit the report to his liking.)
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Really, I'm asking about the laws and norms around the Inspector General and how the office functions, as I am not a lawyer and have no real frame of reference here. 

Furthermore, I don't really trust Trump and the leaders in the executive branch to do the right thing, like uphold norms and not bend/break laws that benefit them.

Let me pose a hypothetical here.  Say Trump gets wind that the IG's report contains some unflattering news for him and that contributes to his ongoing problems rather than reinforcing a positive narrative for him.  Say he calls Horowitz and invites him to dinner, and during that dinner asks him to, "see if he can let the report sit for a few days."  Trump doesn't tell him to change his report, he doesn't order him to not release it, and he actually never gives a specific order.

What does Horowitz do?  Does he refuse the President, who gives Horowitz his job as a direct appointee and can take it away at any time?  Does he report this behavior to anyone, including Barr?

This is what I was really asking.  What governs the behavior of the IG?  Are there any laws specifically creating the position that instruct those behaviors and operations?

 
The Z Machine said:
Really, I'm asking about the laws and norms around the Inspector General and how the office functions, as I am not a lawyer and have no real frame of reference here. 

Furthermore, I don't really trust Trump and the leaders in the executive branch to do the right thing, like uphold norms and not bend/break laws that benefit them.

Let me pose a hypothetical here.  Say Trump gets wind that the IG's report contains some unflattering news for him and that contributes to his ongoing problems rather than reinforcing a positive narrative for him.  Say he calls Horowitz and invites him to dinner, and during that dinner asks him to, "see if he can let the report sit for a few days."  Trump doesn't tell him to change his report, he doesn't order him to not release it, and he actually never gives a specific order.

What does Horowitz do?  Does he refuse the President, who gives Horowitz his job as a direct appointee and can take it away at any time?  Does he report this behavior to anyone, including Barr?

This is what I was really asking.  What governs the behavior of the IG?  Are there any laws specifically creating the position that instruct those behaviors and operations?
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In that situation, there is no chance that Horowitz would have dinner with Trump. (Trump tricked Comey, but it won't work twice.) So Trump tells Barr to ask Horowitz to hold off. There's a slight chance that Barr does so (slight because even Barr has his limits). In that event, Horowitz tells Barr to go fly a kite, and adds that episode to his report. Romney votes to remove and Trump loses reelection in a landslide.

 
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Maurile Tremblay said:
In that situation, there is no chance that Horowitz would have dinner with Trump. (Trump tricked Comey, but it won't work twice.) So Trump tells Barr to ask Horowitz to hold off. There's a slight chance that Barr does so (slight because even Barr has his limits). In that event, Horowitz tells Barr to go fly a kite, and adds that episode to his report. Romney votes to remove and Trump loses reelection in a landslide.
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The bolded sounds like a fantasy, IMO.  Trump has shown the ability to undermine and circumvent safeguards in place to prevent such contemptible behavior.  I don't trust him, nor Barr, nor Congress to be able to hold Trump accountable for his transgressions.

I hope I'm wrong on a lot of levels.  Thanks for the responses, BTW.  I had an actual constructive and educational conversation on here...

 
Prediction: no real criminal actions, no sinister plot uncovered, but a few unsavory details uncovered (like wire taps or other communications monitoring) that make headlines and give further fuel for POTUS to crow about people out to get him.

 
The Hill 4h

#BREAKING: Justice Dept report expected to clear FBI of misdeeds in Russia probe http://hill.cm/R7xevKT
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People familiar with the report told the Los Angeles Times that the contents of the report will not only exonerate the FBI but also largely dismiss claims from the Trump administration and its allies that the federal agency broke the law in search of evidence and purposely went after Trump's campaign.
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Weird huh?

 
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This article catalogs a lot of the predictions made by Sean Hannity, Sara Carter, Cory Lewandowski, Jason Chaffetz, and QAnon about what the IG report would show. We'll see how many of their predictions prove to be correct...

 
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Maurile Tremblay said:
This article catalogs a lot of the predictions made by Sean Hannity, Sara Carter, Cory Lewandowski, Jason Chaffetz, and QAnon about what the IG report would show. We'll see how many of their predictions prove to be correct...
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Sounds like its gonna be big:

“We still have Michael Horowitz, the inspector general. He is to report back on FISA abuse, we already know that did take place,” Hannity told his audience. “We know that the president has five different buckets of information that he's holding, in his hand, that will reveal corruption at levels we never dreamed or we never thought of.”

Or not (from Fox News):

IG report finds mistakes but no political bias in FBI’s bid to spy on Trump campaign staffer

 
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Amused to Death said:
Sounds like its gonna be big:

“We still have Michael Horowitz, the inspector general. He is to report back on FISA abuse, we already know that did take place,” Hannity told his audience. “We know that the president has five different buckets of information that he's holding, in his hand, that will reveal corruption at levels we never dreamed or we never thought of.”
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From what I'm seeing, the FBI is largely exonerated, though they could have done things a lot better. In total, another L for Trump's campaign that he'll try to spin to a W.

 
quick-hands said:
I m working a lot but im looking forward to dec 9.
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I'm genuinely interested in hearing Trump supporters' take on this report.  Since you're the most recent person to express this, I'm quoting you, but I'm open to everyone.

Does this end the issue for you?

 
Bucky86 said:
Bill Barr trying a re-do of his Mueller report statement:

This AG Barr statement: “The Inspector General’s report now makes clear that the FBI launched an intrusive investigation of a U.S. presidential campaign on the thinnest of suspicions that, in my view, were insufficient to justify the steps taken.”

10:02 AM · Dec 9, 2019·Twitter for iPhone
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In my view :lol:

Maybe that’s why there’s an IG report, Bill.

 
Bucky86 said:
Julia Macfarlane

@juliamacfarlane

BREAKING: ABC News can confirm that the Trump “family member” referenced in the Inspector General report who had a friendship with dossier author Chris Steele, was Ivanka. She met him in 2007 at a dinner in London when he was still working for MI6.
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<Insert laughing emoji here>

 
Bucky86 said:
Let's not forget that there is still a totally non-partisan and unbiased investigation being overseen by Bill Barr.

https://twitter.com/ryanjreilly/status/1204105392646737921?s=20

NEW: John Durham says they "do not agree with some of the report’s conclusions as to predication and how the FBI case was opened.”
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Bill Barr is a sycophant. He cannot be trusted to carry out an impartial investigation any more than Gollum could be trusted at any point in Frodo's journey.

 
Barr and Durham just have higher standards for the DOJ than what Horowitz deemed acceptable.  Nothing wrong with that. 

 
Bucky86 said:
Julia Macfarlane

@juliamacfarlane

BREAKING: ABC News can confirm that the Trump “family member” referenced in the Inspector General report who had a friendship with dossier author Chris Steele, was Ivanka. She met him in 2007 at a dinner in London when he was still working for MI6.
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Ivanka the whistleblower?

 
Why in the world would Durham comment for anything but to set a political narrative?

I get why Barr felt the need since he's got to be seen as always defending Trump, but shouldn't Durham at least pretend he's not a Trump lapdog?

What possible purpose does his comment serve?

And isn't the IG the ultimate arbiter of the process being correct?

 
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Max Power said:
So they should have lower standards?
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No.

At any rate, it's not really about whether law enforcement "should" have higher or lower standards. The point is that the FBI needed to meet the standard set by the laws and protocols in place at the time. And Bill Barr does not dispute that the FBI did in fact meet those standards.

 
Max Power said:
What do you base this on?
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The man's own history. USA Today(I know it's not Fox news, but bear with me) went into the man's history of what he did when he was tasked with investigating the NYPD. Most of what I just posted was lifted from people quoted in the article.

 
I mean, Bill Barr is basically saying that it's too easy for FBI to investigate suspected criminals.

And law-and-order Republicans throughout the country are nodding their heads.

 
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