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The Russia Investigation: Trump Pardons Flynn (6 Viewers)

I think the hard part for Democrats is going to be figuring out if Mueller testifying would help or hurt them before he actually sits down.

I don’t think he’s going to assist them here.

 
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Great part of this article..

Maddow has acknowledged that allegations of Trump-Russia collusion are unverified. But she has ignored claims that cast them in a more skeptical light. For instance, James Clapper, the former Director of National Intelligence, told NBC News on March 5 that U.S. intelligence has “no evidence” of collusion between Trump and Russia. On March 15, former CIA Director and Hillary Clinton surrogate Michael Morrell said “there is smoke, but there is no fire, at all.” Those statements have gone unmentioned.

https://theintercept.com/2017/04/12/msnbcs-rachel-maddow-sees-a-russia-connection-lurking-around-every-corner/

 
sho nuff said:
So wait...you claimed they were all wrong because he hasn’t been arrested and the first quite is talking about then possibility of it happening when he leaves office?  You think that proves your point? 

None of those things are about removing him from office or indictments while in office.  

You basically quoted things that showed your claims were inaccurate.

Also Joy Behar :lmao:
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It certainly does. There are several links I and others have included that show much discourse about Trump going to jail. You can find dozens more if you want to look. 

Do a "Walls closing in on Trump" search in google and you will find ample evidence of inaccurate media conjecture. They botched this, badly.

(I don't count Joy Behar, either.)

That doesn't even factor in the 25th Amendment nonsense.

If you don't think the media has failed in reporting on this issue, we simply will disagree.

This probably best documents the media's abject failure here, and Glenn Greenwald is no Trump fan:

https://theintercept.com/2019/01/20/beyond-buzzfeed-the-10-worst-most-embarrassing-u-s-media-failures-on-the-trumprussia-story/

 
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Don't Noonan said:
2Squirrels1Nut said:
A rebuttal of Barr's joke of an interpretation from the person that conducted the investigation. 
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Not sure if serious.  Mueller said he didn't disagree with Barr's summary only the way the media portrayed it.
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This is an irresponsible post.

You should have stated that you were actually paraphrasing Barr's description of what Mueller allegedly said to him.

If you want to have any credibility as any type of authority in this forum, you'll be more precise with your claims in the future.

 
Don't Noonan said:
Not sure if serious.  Mueller said he didn't disagree with Barr's summary only the way the media portrayed it.
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 As we stated in our meeting of March 5 and reiterated to the Department early in the afternoon of March 24, the introductions and executive summaries of our two-volume report accurately summarize this Office's work and conclusions. The summary letter the Department sent to Congress and released to the public late in the afternoon of March 24 did not fully capture the context, nature, and substance of this Office's work and conclusions. We communicated that concern to the Department on the morning of March 25. There is now public confusion about critical aspects of the results of our investigation. This threatens to undermine a central purpose for which the Department appointed the Special Counsel: to assure full public confidence in the outcome of the investigations. See Department of Justice, Press Release (May 17, 2017).

While we understand that the Department is reviewing the full report to determine what is appropriate for public release -- a process that our Office is working with you to complete -- that process need not delay release of the enclosed materials. Release at this time would alleviate the misunderstandings that have arisen and would answer congressional and public questions about the nature and outcome of our investigation. It would also accord with the standard for public release of notifications to Congress cited in your letter. See 28 C.F.R. 609(c) ("the Attorney General may determine that public release" of congressional notifications "would be in the public interest.").

 
jonessed said:
I think the hard part for Democrats is going to be figuring out if Mueller testifying would help or hurt them before he actually sits down.

I don’t think he’s going to assist them here.
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I don’t think he would hurt democrats. Because of he explains just why he thought his letter to Barr was necessary it’s bad for Barr and Trump.

 
Ack88 said:
It certainly does. There are several links I and others have included that show much discourse about Trump going to jail. You can find dozens more if you want to look. 

Do a "Walls closing in on Trump" search in google and you will find ample evidence of inaccurate media conjecture. They botched this, badly.

(I don't count Joy Behar, either.)

That doesn't even factor in the 25th Amendment nonsense.

If you don't think the media has failed in reporting on this issue, we simply will disagree.

This probably best documents the media's abject failure here, and Glenn Greenwald is no Trump fan:

https://theintercept.com/2019/01/20/beyond-buzzfeed-the-10-worst-most-embarrassing-u-s-media-failures-on-the-trumprussia-story/
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The 25th isn’t nonsense. It’s the avenue that could be available for the right reasons. 

If others provided links as you claim. I’ve not seen it. Meaning you are relying on someone i and others have ignored for being an unreasonable poster. 

I think the media has done their job reporting on the issue with news. I think many are conflating opinion pieces with news pieces as often happens.  

 
sho nuff said:
You see that word “might” in his quote in the link?  And “I think”?
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I do. That was reported and conflated with actual news. MSM has blown this, misrepresenting opinions as news for the express purpose of hurting Trump. Countless examples of this is linked and demonstrably shows how poor the performance of the MSM has been on this story.

 
Ack88 said:
I do. That was reported and conflated with actual news. MSM has blown this, misrepresenting opinions as news for the express purpose of hurting Trump. Countless examples of this is linked and demonstrably shows how poor the performance of the MSM has been on this story.
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Exactly, but Sho puts anyone that posts things that don't support his beliefs on ignore. He admits it. 

 
sho nuff said:
The 25th isn’t nonsense. It’s the avenue that could be available for the right reasons. 

If others provided links as you claim. I’ve not seen it. Meaning you are relying on someone i and others have ignored for being an unreasonable poster. 

I think the media has done their job reporting on the issue with news. I think many are conflating opinion pieces with news pieces as often happens.  
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The 25th is, of course, a legal option. In this case, there is no evidence that supports it's use. It has been weaponized to besmirch a president that many do not like.

Whom you choose to believe is your option.

Ok- we can agree to disagree on the 3rd point. The conflation here is rampant, though. At least I hope you can see this. 

 
John Blutarsky said:
CNN had 3 reporters resign for reporting false information. 

https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/liberal-medias-mueller-collusion-coverage-turns-out-to-be-titanic-of-media-disasters
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You're referring to the Scaramucci story? CNN fired those journalists but arguably they should not have. It later proved to be true. In fact the connection that CNN reported on ended up in the Mueller report, that between Scaramucci and Dmitriev. 

Shortly after the Seychelles meeting, Mr. Dmitriev met with Anthony Scaramucci, then an informal Trump adviser, at the 2017 World Economic Forum in Davos, Switzerland. In an interview afterward with TASS, a Russian news agency, Mr. Scaramucci criticized the Obama administration’s economic sanctions on Russia as ineffective and suggested that the Trump administration and Russia could find common ground on numerous issues.
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NYT

- Dimitriev of course later texted Peskov after the election that "Putin has won." (Mueller report).

That story alone is so complex it would take us all Sunday to go through and I'm sure we don't want to do that. But it just goes to show the incredibly complex job journlists have had in this scandal.

 
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John Blutarsky said:
CNN had 3 reporters resign for reporting false information. 

https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/liberal-medias-mueller-collusion-coverage-turns-out-to-be-titanic-of-media-disasters
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There is a going to be a 180 degree difference on how this post is regarded: 

Conservatives  such as yourself are going to read that link and say, “you see? As if we didn’t know already, CNN and the rest of the mainstream media is biased against Trump and conservatives and this is obvious, clear proof.” 

People like myself, and liberals, are going to read that link and say, “the fact that they were fired (forced to resign) proves that the media does its best to be neutral and objective; if they were really that biased, nobody would have ended up resigning.” 

I’m not sure how to bridge this gap that separates us. It strikes me that, apart from the fundamental issue of abortion, there is no single point that divides liberals and conservatives in this county so completely as whether or not the media is biased. 

 
timschochet said:
There is a going to be a 180 degree difference on how this post is regarded: 

Conservatives  such as yourself are going to read that link and say, “you see? As if we didn’t know already, CNN and the rest of the mainstream media is biased against Trump and conservatives and this is obvious, clear proof.” 

People like myself, and liberals, are going to read that link and say, “the fact that they were fired (forced to resign) proves that the media does its best to be neutral and objective; if they were really that biased, nobody would have ended up resigning.” 

I’m not sure how to bridge this gap that separates us. It strikes me that, apart from the fundamental issue of abortion, there is no single point that divides liberals and conservatives in this county so completely as whether or not the media is biased. 
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I have posted many links where the media was wrong on Trump and Russia. 

 
Ack88 said:
I would say just the opposite. 

What is interesting is that you choose not to address the claims regarding hyperbolic projections for Trump, and how spectacularly wrong many news sources were. 

What I do know is true, despite repeated declarations that Trump was going to jail, is that he has been charged with nothing- in diametric opposition to scores of claims made by the media sources. 

I would be interested to see data sources to the contrary.
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Well I just posted on the Scaramucci story. It's tough to go through the quantity given how much there is. But I think it's pretty interesting to look at this stuff how it turned up in the Mueller report, or if it did or did not. Glad to discuss any particular story.

I think besides the Scaramucci story another one that came up was the Buzzfeed story that the OSC itself rejected. However the way that story was reported by Mueller was even more damning.

After the election, the Trump Organization sought to formally close out certain deals in advance of the inauguration.945 Cohen recalled that Trump Tower Moscow was on the list of deals to be closed out.946 In approximately January 2017, Cohen began receiving inquiries from the media about Trump Tower Moscow, and he recalled speaking to the President-Elect when those inquiries came in.947Cohen was concerned that truthful answers about the Trump Tower Moscow project might not be consistent with the “message” that the President-Elect had no relationship with Russia.948

In an effort to “stay on message,” Cohen told a New York Times reporter that the Trump Tower Moscow deal was not feasible and had ended in January 2016.949 Cohen recalled that this was part of a “script” or talking points he had developed with President-Elect Trump and others to dismiss the idea of a substantial connection between Trump and Russia.950 Cohen said that he discussed the talking points with Trump but that he did not explicitly tell Trump he thought they were untrue because Trump already knew they were untrue.951 Cohen thought it was important to say the deal was done in January 2016, rather than acknowledge that talks continued in May and June 2016, because it limited the period when candidate Trump could be alleged to have a relationship with Russia to an early point in the campaign, before Trump had become the party’s presumptive nominee.
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- There's more detail on this, but that's an example.

 
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Ack88 said:
I do. That was reported and conflated with actual news. MSM has blown this, misrepresenting opinions as news for the express purpose of hurting Trump. Countless examples of this is linked and demonstrably shows how poor the performance of the MSM has been on this story.
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Not really. When people say “I think”, it’s pretty clear it’s an opinion.

 
John Blutarsky said:
Are you serious? The media has an obligation to report the truth. Many people rely on the media to educate them on issues and topics. They have a major influence on how people get information.
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What difference does it have wrt the ongoing investigation? 

A left leaning talk show host said something that offended your delicate sensibilities 6 months ago.  I don't see how that's relevant today. If you need your safespace, you can always go to Fox News.

 
Ack88 said:
The 25th is, of course, a legal option. In this case, there is no evidence that supports it's use. It has been weaponized to besmirch a president that many do not like.

Whom you choose to believe is your option.

Ok- we can agree to disagree on the 3rd point. The conflation here is rampant, though. At least I hope you can see this. 
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Weaponized?  

The conflation is rampant as you seem to be mixing opinion and claiming it was presented as fact. 

 
SaintsInDome2006 said:
You're referring to the Scaramucci story? CNN fired those journalists but arguably they should not have. It later proved to be true. In fact the connection that CNN reported on ended up in the Mueller report, that between Scaramucci and Dmitriev. 

NYT

- Dimitriev of course later texted Peskov after the election that "Putin has won." (Mueller report).

That story alone is so complex it would take us all Sunday to go through and I'm sure we don't want to do that. But it just goes to show the incredibly complex job journlists have had in this scandal.
Click to expand...


SaintsInDome2006 said:
Yes, as I just posted.
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I knew you’d remember it.  I don’t expect we will get an admission though. 

 
sho nuff said:
Weaponized?  

The conflation is rampant as you seem to be mixing opinion and claiming it was presented as fact. 
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Weaponized? Yes- Trump is neither physically or intellectually unable to perform his duties. Unpopular with many- yes, but he was fairly elected and there is no evidence he is physically or mentally unable to serve.

 
moleculo said:
What difference does it have wrt the ongoing investigation? 

A left leaning talk show host said something that offended your delicate sensibilities 6 months ago.  I don't see how that's relevant today. If you need your safespace, you can always go to Fox News.
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Unlike liberals, I don’t need a safe place. What you posted about the media is ridiculous.

 
Ack88 said:
Weaponized? Yes- Trump is neither physically or intellectually unable to perform his duties. Unpopular with many- yes, but he was fairly elected and there is no evidence he is physically or mentally unable to serve.
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I questioned weaponized because nobody has actually done that with the 25th.

Also there is plenty of evidence he is mentally unfit.  Not enough proof and obviously never enough to oust him. But to say there is no evidence of it is inaccurate.

 
sho nuff said:
I knew you’d remember it.  I don’t expect we will get an admission though. 
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https://www.businessinsider.com/cnn-russia-scaramucci-dmitriev-meeting-new-details-2018-3  Here is info when more info was gathered about this.

"The story in question was retracted because it did not meet CNN's editorial standards," CNN said in a statement to Business Insider on Wednesday. "An investigation into the matter determined that the journalists involved in the story's publication failed to follow the network's clearly defined editorial procedures and therefore the company was unable to stand behind their reporting. Because of those reasons, CNN accepted their resignations. We stand behind that decision."

 
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