Which NFL franchise is currently the most dysfunctional? (1 Viewer)

[ScottyDog]

Where are the Cowboys on the poll?

 

[QuizGuy66]

good candidates all, but you have to give the Lifetime Achievemant award in this category to the Raiders.

Sure, if you're 10 years old. Otherwise, we're talking about a franchise with a 53.5% lifetime winning percentage, five superbowl appearances, three league championships, and a fistful of Hall of Famers (Otto, Shell, Brown, Madden, Upshaw, Biletnikoff, Long, Hendricks, Allen, pretty soon Guy, eventually Davis, and I'm sure I'm still missing some), in addition to many more HoF finalists (Brown, Wisniewski, Hayes, etc.)

Compare that to the Arizona Cardinals and their 41.9% lifetime winning percentage, who have been in existence since 1920 and have made the playoffs 8 times. Not a typo. Eight. Although, in fairness, they did win a league championship back in 1925 when it was awarded to the team with the best overall record (i.e. no postseason). They went 11-2-1 that year, with wins over the Milwaukee Badgers, Columbus Tigers, Kansas City Cowboys, Duluth Kelleys, Buffalo Bisons, Dayton City Triangles, Rock Island Independents, and Hammond Pros. It was probably the high point in franchise history.

Pottsville was robbed http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1925_NFL_season

-QG

 

[QuizGuy66]

Btw, the fact that the Bengals weren't mentioned in conjunction with disfunction until post #47 shows how much progress has been made in recent years

-QG

 

[Adam Harstad]

good candidates all, but you have to give the Lifetime Achievemant award in this category to the Raiders.

Sure, if you're 10 years old. Otherwise, we're talking about a franchise with a 53.5% lifetime winning percentage, five superbowl appearances, three league championships, and a fistful of Hall of Famers (Otto, Shell, Brown, Madden, Upshaw, Biletnikoff, Long, Hendricks, Allen, pretty soon Guy, eventually Davis, and I'm sure I'm still missing some), in addition to many more HoF finalists (Brown, Wisniewski, Hayes, etc.)

Compare that to the Arizona Cardinals and their 41.9% lifetime winning percentage, who have been in existence since 1920 and have made the playoffs 8 times. Not a typo. Eight. Although, in fairness, they did win a league championship back in 1925 when it was awarded to the team with the best overall record (i.e. no postseason). They went 11-2-1 that year, with wins over the Milwaukee Badgers, Columbus Tigers, Kansas City Cowboys, Duluth Kelleys, Buffalo Bisons, Dayton City Triangles, Rock Island Independents, and Hammond Pros. It was probably the high point in franchise history.

Pottsville was robbed http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1925_NFL_season

-QG

They should have taken care of business at home against the Providence Steam Rollers and then it wouldn't have mattered whether they violated Frankford's territorial franchise rights. Also should have known to always get everything in writing. Nobody to blame but themselves.

 

[Obie Wan]

Can not believe the Bills have not been mentioned

currently on year 15 without sniffing the playoffs

outside of the Kelly and Kemp years, the team has sucked donkey balls since inception.

While the owner is being kept on life support at age 94, the marketing guy from the Marlins baseball team is running the show

Perception sure is a fickel thing

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

good candidates all, but you have to give the Lifetime Achievemant award in this category to the Raiders.

I dont get this, Al Davis was great in him prime, sure he got old n senile.

The worst franchise ever has to be the Chi/Stl/Ariz Cardinals.

The Lions & Browns dominated the 50s, so at least they have some record of being dominate teams

 

[QuizGuy66]

good candidates all, but you have to give the Lifetime Achievemant award in this category to the Raiders.

Sure, if you're 10 years old. Otherwise, we're talking about a franchise with a 53.5% lifetime winning percentage, five superbowl appearances, three league championships, and a fistful of Hall of Famers (Otto, Shell, Brown, Madden, Upshaw, Biletnikoff, Long, Hendricks, Allen, pretty soon Guy, eventually Davis, and I'm sure I'm still missing some), in addition to many more HoF finalists (Brown, Wisniewski, Hayes, etc.)

Compare that to the Arizona Cardinals and their 41.9% lifetime winning percentage, who have been in existence since 1920 and have made the playoffs 8 times. Not a typo. Eight. Although, in fairness, they did win a league championship back in 1925 when it was awarded to the team with the best overall record (i.e. no postseason). They went 11-2-1 that year, with wins over the Milwaukee Badgers, Columbus Tigers, Kansas City Cowboys, Duluth Kelleys, Buffalo Bisons, Dayton City Triangles, Rock Island Independents, and Hammond Pros. It was probably the high point in franchise history.

Pottsville was robbed http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1925_NFL_season

-QG

They should have taken care of business at home against the Providence Steam Rollers and then it wouldn't have mattered whether they violated Frankford's territorial franchise rights. Also should have known to always get everything in writing. Nobody to blame but themselves. time-traveling Roger Goodell.

Fixed.

-QG

 

[Adam Harstad]

good candidates all, but you have to give the Lifetime Achievemant award in this category to the Raiders.

Sure, if you're 10 years old. Otherwise, we're talking about a franchise with a 53.5% lifetime winning percentage, five superbowl appearances, three league championships, and a fistful of Hall of Famers (Otto, Shell, Brown, Madden, Upshaw, Biletnikoff, Long, Hendricks, Allen, pretty soon Guy, eventually Davis, and I'm sure I'm still missing some), in addition to many more HoF finalists (Brown, Wisniewski, Hayes, etc.)

Compare that to the Arizona Cardinals and their 41.9% lifetime winning percentage, who have been in existence since 1920 and have made the playoffs 8 times. Not a typo. Eight. Although, in fairness, they did win a league championship back in 1925 when it was awarded to the team with the best overall record (i.e. no postseason). They went 11-2-1 that year, with wins over the Milwaukee Badgers, Columbus Tigers, Kansas City Cowboys, Duluth Kelleys, Buffalo Bisons, Dayton City Triangles, Rock Island Independents, and Hammond Pros. It was probably the high point in franchise history.

Pottsville was robbed http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1925_NFL_season

-QG

They should have taken care of business at home against the Providence Steam Rollers and then it wouldn't have mattered whether they violated Frankford's territorial franchise rights. Also should have known to always get everything in writing. Nobody to blame but themselves. time-traveling Roger Goodell.

Fixed.

-QG

That's actually what I'd written originally, but time-travelling Roger Goodell stole my password and edited it out.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

A lot of these teams, maybe all of them ,we're really talking about ownership.

Ownership can and often does change.

Often? It's pretty much the biggest constant.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Btw, the fact that the Bengals weren't mentioned in conjunction with disfunction until post #47 shows how much progress has been made in recent years

-QG

....and the Jets only have 1.88% of the vote.

 

[FUBAR]

good candidates all, but you have to give the Lifetime Achievemant award in this category to the Raiders.

I dont get this, Al Davis was great in him prime, sure he got old n senile.

The worst franchise ever has to be the Chi/Stl/Ariz Cardinals.

The Lions & Browns dominated the 50s, so at least they have some record of being dominate teams

The last year the Lions won the NFL Championship - Osama Bin Laden and Hamid Karzai were born.

Coincidence?

 

[Faust]

good candidates all, but you have to give the Lifetime Achievemant award in this category to the Raiders.

Sure, if you're 10 years old. Otherwise, we're talking about a franchise with a 53.5% lifetime winning percentage, five superbowl appearances, three league championships, and a fistful of Hall of Famers (Otto, Shell, Brown, Madden, Upshaw, Biletnikoff, Long, Hendricks, Allen, pretty soon Guy, eventually Davis, and I'm sure I'm still missing some), in addition to many more HoF finalists (Brown, Wisniewski, Hayes, etc.)

Compare that to the Arizona Cardinals and their 41.9% lifetime winning percentage, who have been in existence since 1920 and have made the playoffs 8 times. Not a typo. Eight. Although, in fairness, they did win a league championship back in 1925 when it was awarded to the team with the best overall record (i.e. no postseason). They went 11-2-1 that year, with wins over the Milwaukee Badgers, Columbus Tigers, Kansas City Cowboys, Duluth Kelleys, Buffalo Bisons, Dayton City Triangles, Rock Island Independents, and Hammond Pros. It was probably the high point in franchise history.

Super Bowl XLIII might contend for the high point in their franchise history.

 

[⚡DEADHEAD⚡]

Criteria:

Value: The Cowboys increase in value even in the worst of times. Not the Cowboys.

Fanbase: The Browns sellout, even in the worst of times. Not the Browns.

Legacy: The Jaguars still feel like an expansion team and there is no history to live up to. Not the Jaguars.

The answer is the Raiders. They do nothing right. The stadium revision is a travesty. The relationship with the city is awful. The relationship with the fanbase is schizophrenic (the Raiders want families to go to games but they have to embrace the thuggery; they don't sell out). The ownership was the league's laughing stock when Al was around, now it's rudderless. The management is looking incapable (looking at Schaub was so predictable and mirrors other personnel decisions the Raiders have made in the last decade). The Raiders were a storied franchise; now they are rewriting the record books for futility.

It's the Gruden Curse.

 

[Rushmore]

Btw, the fact that the Bengals weren't mentioned in conjunction with disfunction until post #47 shows how much progress has been made in recent years

-QG

Lol. Came in here to post the same thing. I figured most of us Bengal fans were thinking that while reading through the thread, because we would've been among the first organizations mentioned several years ago.

 

[Adam Harstad]

good candidates all, but you have to give the Lifetime Achievemant award in this category to the Raiders.

Sure, if you're 10 years old. Otherwise, we're talking about a franchise with a 53.5% lifetime winning percentage, five superbowl appearances, three league championships, and a fistful of Hall of Famers (Otto, Shell, Brown, Madden, Upshaw, Biletnikoff, Long, Hendricks, Allen, pretty soon Guy, eventually Davis, and I'm sure I'm still missing some), in addition to many more HoF finalists (Brown, Wisniewski, Hayes, etc.)

Compare that to the Arizona Cardinals and their 41.9% lifetime winning percentage, who have been in existence since 1920 and have made the playoffs 8 times. Not a typo. Eight. Although, in fairness, they did win a league championship back in 1925 when it was awarded to the team with the best overall record (i.e. no postseason). They went 11-2-1 that year, with wins over the Milwaukee Badgers, Columbus Tigers, Kansas City Cowboys, Duluth Kelleys, Buffalo Bisons, Dayton City Triangles, Rock Island Independents, and Hammond Pros. It was probably the high point in franchise history.

Super Bowl XLIII might contend for the high point in their franchise history.

Fun fact: the Arizona Cardinals have won 6 playoff games in their entire history. 3 of them came following the 2008 season.

 

[ghostguy123]

Criteria:

Value: The Cowboys increase in value even in the worst of times. Not the Cowboys.

Fanbase: The Browns sellout, even in the worst of times. Not the Browns.

Legacy: The Jaguars still feel like an expansion team and there is no history to live up to. Not the Jaguars.

The stadium selling out (as far as the Browns) has NOTHING to do with how dysfunctional the franchise is, and is a horrible criteria to use to say they are not the most dysfunctional.

Because, by that definition, it would be IMPOSSIBLE for the Browns to be the most dysfunctional. We could go 0-16 for the next decade with 10x the dysfunction we have now and still sell out.

 

[johnadams]

OAK wins this one hand down.

Criteria:

Value: The Cowboys increase in value even in the worst of times. Not the Cowboys.

Fanbase: The Browns sellout, even in the worst of times. Not the Browns.

Legacy: The Jaguars still feel like an expansion team and there is no history to live up to. Not the Jaguars.

The answer is the Raiders. They do nothing right. The stadium revision is a travesty. The relationship with the city is awful. The relationship with the fanbase is schizophrenic (the Raiders want families to go to games but they have to embrace the thuggery; they don't sell out). The ownership was the league's laughing stock when Al was around, now it's rudderless. The management is looking incapable (looking at Schaub was so predictable and mirrors other personnel decisions the Raiders have made in the last decade). The Raiders were a storied franchise; now they are rewriting the record books for futility.

It's the Gruden Curse.

Ding ding ding. Here's the winner.

Value: Last in the NFL despite a rich history and a very wealthy potential fanbase.

Recent record: 53-123 over the last 11 years. Only STL has been as been as bad.

Stadium: With local rival niners moving into fancy new digs, o.co is easily the worst stadium left. Last multi use stadium around. No end in sight, either.

Fans: OK, the true Raider fans are actually fantastic and there are bunch on these boards. But blackouts are common and there is a very bad vibe at the game itself. I know a lot of Raider fans who don't go to the games because of the vibe at the game.

Recent history of debacles: The Raiders have always been a bit dysfunctional, but they were winning. My personal recent fave was Al Davis using an overhead projector to defend firing Lane Kiffin when everybody already knew that Kiffin was terrible. Sprinkle in Tom Walsh, former director of operations and head coach for the Mobile Admirals, the head coach sending an assitant coach to the hospital with a broken jaw, the Palmer trade which will be mentioned as top five worst NFL trade for years to come, their PR guy losing it in a room full of reporters, Tommy Boy as owner, Randy Moss's admission of weed smoking, Jawalrus and the purple drank, oh the humanity, I could keep going. I'm not sure why McKenzie and Allen seem to be getting a pass after back to back 4-12 seasons.

The problem for the Raiders is that there is almost no light at the end of the tunnel. Their stadium will still suck in ten years, their overall value will still be in the bottom five of the league, they'll still struggle to attract top FAs at market value. Maybe their huge cap room this year will be a harbinger of better days, but I'm not counting on it.

 

[msudaisy26]

I understand the different opinions if we are going short term but how can anyone go against the Lions if you go back 20, 30 or even 50 years.

Here are some of the highlights: I am doing this off the top of my head so please don't kill me if I am slightly off, just correct my mistake.

One of only 2 teams to go winless in an NFL season, they are the only team to do it in a 16 game season and the Bucs were an expansion team when they did it.

They have 1 playoff win in the last 50+ years. Let that sink in for a minute. ONE!!!

They drafted 4 receivers in the first round in a span of about 7 years.

Since 1989 that I can remember not one of the Lions head coaches has been rehired as a head coach in the NFL, unless you count **** Jauron but he wasn't hired as their head coach he was the interim head coach when they fired Mooch.

The fans have organized walk outs during games to show their displeasure with management.

They gave Matt Millen a contract extension.

After they fired Millen they hired his right hand man to be the new GM.

I can't think of any more right now.

 

[ghostguy123]

I dont think any of the Browns head coaches since 1999 is even still in the league in ANY capacity. Well, Shurmur I guess. Give that one time.

I had this friend a while back who was a girl. She dated some guy, he broke up with her, and she ended up being the last girl he ever dated, cause he switched to men. Being a Browns coach has apparently done the same thing to these guys. Being a Browns coach is the last NFL experience they seem to want, and afterwards they get out of the NFL altogether and explore other avenues.

That was probably a horrible analogy, but I laughed to myself as I was typing it so...............

 

[ghostguy123]

I also don't think this can be measured just by team success. You have to take everything into account here. And again, we are talking about RECENT.

If we are going for a lifetime award, then my Browns are not even close to being in the discussion. If we are going back 1, 2, 5, 10, or 15 years, then we would win at least a few of those awards.

 

[grateful zed]

oakland, even with al gone.

 

[ghostguy123]

You know it is bad though when fans of their own teams are in here lobbying for their own teams to get the dysfunctional award.

I mean, you would think we would be bashing each others teams, but no.................it's just THAT bad. If I wear glasses, I can't make fun of you for wearing glasses.

 

[⚡DEADHEAD⚡]

Criteria:

Value: The Cowboys increase in value even in the worst of times. Not the Cowboys.

Fanbase: The Browns sellout, even in the worst of times. Not the Browns.

Legacy: The Jaguars still feel like an expansion team and there is no history to live up to. Not the Jaguars.

The stadium selling out (as far as the Browns) has NOTHING to do with how dysfunctional the franchise is, and is a horrible criteria to use to say they are not the most dysfunctional.

Because, by that definition, it would be IMPOSSIBLE for the Browns to be the most dysfunctional. We could go 0-16 for the next decade with 10x the dysfunction we have now and still sell out.

Ok. Still, Browns disfunction is nothing compared to the Raiders.

 

[⚡DEADHEAD⚡]

OAK wins this one hand down.

Criteria:

Value: The Cowboys increase in value even in the worst of times. Not the Cowboys.

Fanbase: The Browns sellout, even in the worst of times. Not the Browns.

Legacy: The Jaguars still feel like an expansion team and there is no history to live up to. Not the Jaguars.

The answer is the Raiders. They do nothing right. The stadium revision is a travesty. The relationship with the city is awful. The relationship with the fanbase is schizophrenic (the Raiders want families to go to games but they have to embrace the thuggery; they don't sell out). The ownership was the league's laughing stock when Al was around, now it's rudderless. The management is looking incapable (looking at Schaub was so predictable and mirrors other personnel decisions the Raiders have made in the last decade). The Raiders were a storied franchise; now they are rewriting the record books for futility.

It's the Gruden Curse.

Ding ding ding. Here's the winner.

Value: Last in the NFL despite a rich history and a very wealthy potential fanbase.

Recent record: 53-123 over the last 11 years. Only STL has been as been as bad.

Stadium: With local rival niners moving into fancy new digs, o.co is easily the worst stadium left. Last multi use stadium around. No end in sight, either.

Fans: OK, the true Raider fans are actually fantastic and there are bunch on these boards. But blackouts are common and there is a very bad vibe at the game itself. I know a lot of Raider fans who don't go to the games because of the vibe at the game.

Recent history of debacles: The Raiders have always been a bit dysfunctional, but they were winning. My personal recent fave was Al Davis using an overhead projector to defend firing Lane Kiffin when everybody already knew that Kiffin was terrible. Sprinkle in Tom Walsh, former director of operations and head coach for the Mobile Admirals, the head coach sending an assitant coach to the hospital with a broken jaw, the Palmer trade which will be mentioned as top five worst NFL trade for years to come, their PR guy losing it in a room full of reporters, Tommy Boy as owner, Randy Moss's admission of weed smoking, Jawalrus and the purple drank, oh the humanity, I could keep going. I'm not sure why McKenzie and Allen seem to be getting a pass after back to back 4-12 seasons.

The problem for the Raiders is that there is almost no light at the end of the tunnel. Their stadium will still suck in ten years, their overall value will still be in the bottom five of the league, they'll still struggle to attract top FAs at market value. Maybe their huge cap room this year will be a harbinger of better days, but I'm not counting on it.

Man, I forgot most of that stuff. It is so bad, it almost reads like fiction.

 

[ghostguy123]

Criteria:

Value: The Cowboys increase in value even in the worst of times. Not the Cowboys.

Fanbase: The Browns sellout, even in the worst of times. Not the Browns.

Legacy: The Jaguars still feel like an expansion team and there is no history to live up to. Not the Jaguars.

The stadium selling out (as far as the Browns) has NOTHING to do with how dysfunctional the franchise is, and is a horrible criteria to use to say they are not the most dysfunctional.

Because, by that definition, it would be IMPOSSIBLE for the Browns to be the most dysfunctional. We could go 0-16 for the next decade with 10x the dysfunction we have now and still sell out.

Ok. Still, Browns disfunction is nothing compared to the Raiders.

Sorry, very much disagree. When your owner goes to prison and you have a handful of front office and coaching staff sitting at home on the couch still making tens upon tens of millions of dollars after being fired, plus signing players out of a straight jacket for 5.5 million per year, all the while maintaining a horrible record with the worst QBs and RBs known to man, we'll talk.

Just the past 2 years alone is enough to put us in a tier all by ourselves.

But hey, we sell out.

Like I had mentioned before, if we look at the last 2-3 years we win hands down. If we go the past decade you probably do. If we go the past 15 years, we do.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Criteria:

Value: The Cowboys increase in value even in the worst of times. Not the Cowboys.

Fanbase: The Browns sellout, even in the worst of times. Not the Browns.

Legacy: The Jaguars still feel like an expansion team and there is no history to live up to. Not the Jaguars.

The stadium selling out (as far as the Browns) has NOTHING to do with how dysfunctional the franchise is, and is a horrible criteria to use to say they are not the most dysfunctional.

Because, by that definition, it would be IMPOSSIBLE for the Browns to be the most dysfunctional. We could go 0-16 for the next decade with 10x the dysfunction we have now and still sell out.

Ok. Still, Browns disfunction is nothing compared to the Raiders.

Sorry, very much disagree. When your owner goes to prison and you have a handful of front office and coaching staff sitting at home on the couch still making tens upon tens of millions of dollars after being fired, plus signing players out of a straight jacket for 5.5 million per year, all the while maintaining a horrible record with the worst QBs and RBs known to man, we'll talk.

Just the past 2 years alone is enough to put us in a tier all by ourselves.

But hey, we sell out.

Like I had mentioned before, if we look at the last 2-3 years we win hands down. If we go the past decade you probably do. If we go the past 15 years, we do.

So do you think it's the Browns?

 

[QuizGuy66]

off topic, but the comparison of the Raiders to the Rams of recent years made me realize what a slam dunk for the Hall of Fame Kurt Warner should be.

Rams record in 9 years before Warner: 45-99 (.313)

3 Warner years (years he led team in passing): 37-11 (.771)

Rams record in 12 years after Warner: 70-121-1 (.367)

The Rams don't fit the description for dysfunction outlined here but they've managed to be a model franchise in terms of losing for most of the last 24 years. Kinda impressive.

-QG

 

[Dr. Octopus]

off topic, but the comparison of the Raiders to the Rams of recent years made me realize what a slam dunk for the Hall of Fame Kurt Warner should be.

Rams record in 9 years before Warner: 45-99 (.313)

3 Warner years (years he led team in passing): 37-11 (.771)

Rams record in 12 years after Warner: 70-121-1 (.367)

The Rams don't fit the description for dysfunction outlined here but they've managed to be a model franchise in terms of losing for most of the last 24 years. Kinda impressive.

-QG

...and then look at what Arizona did before, during and after Warner's tenure. I supposed it would be similar.

 

[Adam Harstad]

off topic, but the comparison of the Raiders to the Rams of recent years made me realize what a slam dunk for the Hall of Fame Kurt Warner should be.

Rams record in 9 years before Warner: 45-99 (.313)

3 Warner years (years he led team in passing): 37-11 (.771)

Rams record in 12 years after Warner: 70-121-1 (.367)

The Rams don't fit the description for dysfunction outlined here but they've managed to be a model franchise in terms of losing for most of the last 24 years. Kinda impressive.

-QG

...and then look at what Arizona did before, during and after Warner's tenure. I supposed it would be similar.

Not quite as dramatic. Arizona was 32-32 in the four seasons Warner led them in passing. They were 31-65 the 6 years before Warner arrived, went 5-11 in the middle of Warner's stint with Leinart leading them in passing, and have gone 28-36 since.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

good candidates all, but you have to give the Lifetime Achievemant award in this category to the Raiders.

Sure, if you're 10 years old. Otherwise, we're talking about a franchise with a 53.5% lifetime winning percentage, five superbowl appearances, three league championships, and a fistful of Hall of Famers (Otto, Shell, Brown, Madden, Upshaw, Biletnikoff, Long, Hendricks, Allen, pretty soon Guy, eventually Davis, and I'm sure I'm still missing some), in addition to many more HoF finalists (Brown, Wisniewski, Hayes, etc.)

Compare that to the Arizona Cardinals and their 41.9% lifetime winning percentage, who have been in existence since 1920 and have made the playoffs 8 times. Not a typo. Eight. Although, in fairness, they did win a league championship back in 1925 when it was awarded to the team with the best overall record (i.e. no postseason). They went 11-2-1 that year, with wins over the Milwaukee Badgers, Columbus Tigers, Kansas City Cowboys, Duluth Kelleys, Buffalo Bisons, Dayton City Triangles, Rock Island Independents, and Hammond Pros. It was probably the high point in franchise history.

Super Bowl XLIII might contend for the high point in their franchise history.

Fun fact: the Arizona Cardinals have won 6 playoff games in their entire history. 3 of them came following the 2008 season.

I think I was trying to say something like this. It's about ownership, compare the record of the Cards under Bidwell Jr. vs the old man. Same goes for the Colts with Irsay Jr. vs Irsay Sr. - Irsay Sr. was a disaster as an owner. Both he and Bidwell Sr. took their teams out of town to boot. - I think the Raiders can have the same transition with the younger Davis, while teams like the Cowboys and Redskins are in for a very long ride of mediocrity. The Lions are the worst of all in this regard.

I do believe it's the QB but the main point is you have ownership that is willing to turn over decisions and autonomy to a capable GM and coach, assuming they hire one. I honestly think the Jags and Browns can do this, but it appears that Ross in MIA is gaining a rep for not allowing this.

(ETA, a note on the Cards: they did win the NFLC in 1947 and I think they made it to the NFLC game in 48 as well, so it really hasn't been since 1925. They also had some success under Coryell in the early 1970's).

 

[DiStefano]

Players come, players go; coaches come, coaches go; GM's come, GM's go; but Danny Boy goes on forever.

Redskins.

 

[JaxBill]

bump with today's news

 

[Faust]

bump with today's news

Once again, the Browns are hitting the reset button on their franchise.

 

[QuizGuy66]

Almost makes this Bengals fan feel sorry for them....almost.

-QG

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

bump with today's news

Once again, the Browns are hitting the reset button on their franchise.

Well that's it, I'm changing my vote.

 

[MoveToSkypager]

Still Miami.

 

[GroveDiesel]

Well, at least the Browns are winning at something.

 

[Raiderfan32904]

Browns have 3 GMs and 3 HC's in the span of 407 days. I thought Al Davis was crazy there at the end, but Cleveland takes the cake.

 

[Faust]

Twitter:

Albert Breer ‏@AlbertBreer

Since 2010, Browns have employed Holmgren and Banner as upper-level execs, Kokinis, Heckert, Lombardi and now Farmer as GMs. Unreal.

Albert Breer ‏@AlbertBreer

Kokinis was 2009. So in the last 5 years ... Holmgren, Banner, Kokinis, Heckert, Lombardi, Farmer, Mangini, Shurmur, Chudzinski and Pettine.

 

[Long Ball Larry]

It has to be the Browns. If all of the past few years is Haslam's doing, he really has outdone the other owners. Ross, Snyder and Jones (particularly the latter 2) at least seem to double-down on their convictions, as stupid as they might be.

Haslam seems like a complete lunatic.

 

[False Start]

Is it a debate at this point?

 

[Faust]

Browns owner responds to our poll:

Jimmy Haslam: Cleveland Browns aren't dysfunctional

By Marc Sessler

Around the League Writer

Hours after sweeping CEO Joe Banner and general manager Michael Lombardi out the door, Browns owner Jimmy Haslam faced the media Tuesday to unpack the latest overhaul in Cleveland.

Aware that his team is perceived by some as a constantly churning clown car, Haslam dismissed the notion that the organization has sunk into complete dysfunction.

"I will just tell you that the people I talked to around the country do not think this isn't an outstanding opportunity here in Cleveland, whether it's to coach, play or work," said Haslam. "And I continue to hear that."

Simultaneously, the Browns are the first NFL team to fire both their head coach and general manager after just one season on the job, according to ESPN.

Aware of how it all looks to the fans and larger football community, Haslam insisted: "I will accept comments and criticism about change. There is no primer for being an NFL owner. It is learn-as-you-go."

Here's what else we heard from Haslam and the team's newly appointed general manager, Ray Farmer:

1. Haslam acknowledged that the previous front office setup was "cumbersome," sharing that "Joe and I mutually agreed that it was best for the organization if we streamline things." Haslam said the team won't hire another CEO, meaning Banner effectively talked himself out of a job if we're to believe the owner's version of events.

2. Haslam graciously lauded Banner and Lombardi, but his words also pointed to tangible differences between the trio. Asked about Banner's comments last month, when he admitted he was disappointed that the Browns didn't stage a second interview with Seattle Seahawks defensive coordinator Dan Quinn, Haslam said point blank: "I was really committed to Pettine."

3. Haslam also dismissed the notion that Cleveland was turned down by a handful of coaching candidates, but it was more about what the owner wouldn't reveal:

Ian Rapoport ✔ @RapSheet

Oh. Jimmy Haslam won’t say if any head coach told him he wouldn’t accept the job if Banner or Lombardi was employed. That sticks out.

4. Asked why Lombardi is on the street after just one season on the job, Haslam shifted the focus to Farmer, saying: "We feel that Ray is the best person to handle the personnel side of our organization." The Browns clearly weren't comfortable with Lombardi shepherding the team's 10 draft picks in May after so many of last year's selections barely saw the field.

5. NFL Media Insider Ian Rapoport reported Tuesday that Farmer wasn't part of any coaching interviews, but the new general manager spoke of his "really good relationship with Mike Pettine," adding that he's "excited about the opportunity" and believes they'll work together well. We'd argue the more streamlined front office ultimately looms as a plus for the new coach.

6. Farmer confirmed that he'll maintain final say over the 53-man roster, but talked about drawing input from Pettine and his coordinators to import the type of players who will succeed in Cleveland's system. Whispers out of Berea suggest that Banner didn't give the coaching staff that kind of voice a season ago.

7. When Farmer was asked if Banner stood out as a smart personnel man, he paused -- for long seconds -- before saying: "Joe is a football guy; he would classify himself as a non-traditional football guy and I'd say that's a good representation."

8. Farmer insisted he wasn't cowed by the team's recent history of obsessively cleaning house. "It doesn't bother me one iota. I'm going to do what I'm supposed to do," he said, adding: "My involvement with Jimmy Haslam is ... he is a reasonable man."

On the latest edition of the "Around The League Podcast," the guys talk Michael Sam, potential big-name cap casualties and offseason forecasts for the Steelers and Jaguars.

 

[Bigboy10182000]

Twitter:

Albert Breer ‏@AlbertBreer

Since 2010, Browns have employed Holmgren and Banner as upper-level execs, Kokinis, Heckert, Lombardi and now Farmer as GMs. Unreal.

Albert Breer ‏@AlbertBreer

Kokinis was 2009. So in the last 5 years ... Holmgren, Banner, Kokinis, Heckert, Lombardi, Farmer, Mangini, Shurmur, Chudzinski and Pettine.

 

[Jeremy]

Browns have 3 GMs and 3 HC's in the span of 407 days. I thought Al Davis was crazy there at the end, but Cleveland takes the cake.

Reminds me of fans who post in the comments section of local newspaper website articles. "Well, that didn't go too well. Fire everyone!"

 

[Bob Magaw]

Browns have 3 GMs and 3 HC's in the span of 407 days. I thought Al Davis was crazy there at the end, but Cleveland takes the cake.

Most functional/stable? NE has to be up there (is Belichick longest tenured HC? Fisher had been up there in 2011).

PIT three HCs in 45 years since 1969. Crazy in comparison.

 

[ghostguy123]

Still Miami.

It was never Miami.

Weird question. So does firing these two clowns make us more or less dysfunctional that we were a few days ago?

I think the perception is more, but I now feel we are less dysfunctional without them.

 

[Faust]

Still Miami.

It was never Miami.

Weird question. So does firing these two clowns make us more or less dysfunctional that we were a few days ago?

I think the perception is more, but I now feel we are less dysfunctional without them.

Cleveland Browns’ change at GM the right call, even if timing is off

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Still Miami.

It was never Miami.

Weird question. So does firing these two clowns make us more or less dysfunctional that we were a few days ago?

I think the perception is more, but I now feel we are less dysfunctional without them.

Browns fans, I love your team's history and I'm pulling but you... have an ownership problem.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Aware that his team is perceived by some as a constantly churning clown car,

Haslam dismissed the notion that the organization has sunk into complete dysfunction.

 

[QuizGuy66]

When looking for a metaphor for dysfunction, MotorsportsTalk seems to have cast its vote: http://motorsportstalk.nbcsports.com/2014/02/11/might-panther-racing-be-the-cleveland-browns-of-indycar/

-QG