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Yet another Pitt Bull attack (2 Viewers)

My point is that I would like all municipalities to have strong dangerous dog laws. Not leash laws, not some basic licensing laws (even though those are fine), but strong dangerous dog laws that protect everyone from all dangerous dogs, regardless of breed. It's the only thing that makes sense to me.
If they were all equal, but they aren't.
 
Also, I was a tad harsh with the all pit owners are low lifes comments. My apologies.
No worries. :thumbup:
Even if you think they're great and the nicest dogs, realize that most people don't feel that way and you are striking some fear and intimidation even if you don't mean to with the thing. Whether you consider that irrational or not, most people don't like your dog.
I'm very clear about how people feel about my dogs, trust me. Good or bad, people are often generous with sharing their opinions. I've had all kinds of reactions. But I have to tell you, just my own experience, I get more compliments then I do complaints or nasty looks. And I've had more than one occasion where I was able to introduce my dogs to people who were apprehensive and have them walking away pleasantly surprised.I understand that some people are afraid. That's a shame, but I don't completely blame them, given what they see media wise. If they give me the opportunity, I show them the other side with my dogs. If not, I go on my merry way and I try not to inconvenience anyone else in the process.Like I said, my goal isn't to convince people that pits are the greatest dogs in the world, even though I personally believe that. My point is that I would like all municipalities to have strong dangerous dog laws. Not leash laws, not some basic licensing laws (even though those are fine), but strong dangerous dog laws that protect everyone from all dangerous dogs, regardless of breed. It's the only thing that makes sense to me.
I'm not sure if it's been discussed earlier, but do you think there are more accurate numbers on the pit population? Aren't some of these backyard breeders breeding rots and other dangerous dogs as well and why is there such a large registered rot population in comparison? I will say we go to the pet store a lot so the kids can play with the puppies (how we ended up with this lab despite not really being in the market for a dog quite yet...heh) and I have seen a rot there before. Have seen them at other pet stores as well. I have never seen a pit in any pet store here in IL. I almost never see them at the dog park, I could probably count it on one hand. I realize that your argument is that some of these guys are miscategorized in the attacks and there's a bigger population than these reports show, but the numbers that site reports are so gigantic in the pit category that it just seems it would take an awful lot to change things.
 
Also, I was a tad harsh with the all pit owners are low lifes comments. My apologies. But the pit owners I've known are typically like that. I did see one at the dog park this weekend - cool that they were taking their dog to the park and it was 2 ladies. But they had 6 dogs between them and they couldn't handle it because none of them appeared to be trained all too well. Pit came and jumped up on me at one point. Made me uncomfortable, I don't like them. You have to know that if you take that dog out in public people are going to be uneasy around it. Especially if it's trained like crap like that.

We got a yellow lab 2 weeks ago, and the guy that sold it to us was telling us he just got a new puppy. When he told me it was a pit, in the back of my head I think he has a screw missing. He knew a lot about dogs and would definitely fall into what I would think would be a good owner of the thing. Still, I think he's missing a screw and wonder what his motivation was for getting this dog.

Even if you think they're great and the nicest dogs, realize that most people don't feel that way and you are striking some fear and intimidation even if you don't mean to with the thing. Whether you consider that irrational or not, most people don't like your dog.
You have a people problem disguised as a dog problem.
 
All i can add is there is a reason pugs and other dog breeds arent used in dogfights, and a reason pitbulls are.
They were bred to kill Bulls by mauling them to death.
So if I put a bull and a pit bull in a pit, you're betting on the dog?
Im saying they were bred with the intent to continue to maul until the other creature was dead. Not hurt, not scared, not runningaway, but dead. Anything less then that was failure and the breed would then be killed by the bull or its owner.And the fights typically pitted a group of pits... but you aren't surprised by group of pits being able to kill a 3000lb pissed off bull are ya?
 
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Also, I was a tad harsh with the all pit owners are low lifes comments. My apologies. But the pit owners I've known are typically like that. I did see one at the dog park this weekend - cool that they were taking their dog to the park and it was 2 ladies. But they had 6 dogs between them and they couldn't handle it because none of them appeared to be trained all too well. Pit came and jumped up on me at one point. Made me uncomfortable, I don't like them. You have to know that if you take that dog out in public people are going to be uneasy around it. Especially if it's trained like crap like that.

We got a yellow lab 2 weeks ago, and the guy that sold it to us was telling us he just got a new puppy. When he told me it was a pit, in the back of my head I think he has a screw missing. He knew a lot about dogs and would definitely fall into what I would think would be a good owner of the thing. Still, I think he's missing a screw and wonder what his motivation was for getting this dog.

Even if you think they're great and the nicest dogs, realize that most people don't feel that way and you are striking some fear and intimidation even if you don't mean to with the thing. Whether you consider that irrational or not, most people don't like your dog.
You have a people problem disguised as a dog problem.
We all know our share of these type of people, and they own dogs across all breeds. It's just that the pit owners almost invariably fall in that group. :)
 
All i can add is there is a reason pugs and other dog breeds arent used in dogfights, and a reason pitbulls are.
They were bred to kill Bulls by mauling them to death.
So if I put a bull and a pit bull in a pit, you're betting on the dog?
Im saying they were bred with the intent to continue to maul until the other creature was dead. Not hurt, not scared, not runningaway, but dead. Anything less then that was failure and the breed would then be killed by the bull or its owner.

And the fights typically pitted a group of pits... but you aren't surprised by group of pits being able to kill a 3000lb pissed off bull are ya?
How many five year old pit bulls could a bull take in a fight?
 
Also, I was a tad harsh with the all pit owners are low lifes comments. My apologies. But the pit owners I've known are typically like that. I did see one at the dog park this weekend - cool that they were taking their dog to the park and it was 2 ladies. But they had 6 dogs between them and they couldn't handle it because none of them appeared to be trained all too well. Pit came and jumped up on me at one point. Made me uncomfortable, I don't like them. You have to know that if you take that dog out in public people are going to be uneasy around it. Especially if it's trained like crap like that.

We got a yellow lab 2 weeks ago, and the guy that sold it to us was telling us he just got a new puppy. When he told me it was a pit, in the back of my head I think he has a screw missing. He knew a lot about dogs and would definitely fall into what I would think would be a good owner of the thing. Still, I think he's missing a screw and wonder what his motivation was for getting this dog.

Even if you think they're great and the nicest dogs, realize that most people don't feel that way and you are striking some fear and intimidation even if you don't mean to with the thing. Whether you consider that irrational or not, most people don't like your dog.
You have a people problem disguised as a dog problem.
We all know our share of these type of people, and they own dogs across all breeds. It's just that the pit owners almost invariably fall in that group. :)
:penalty:
 
I think the real question people have to ask is would you let your 4 year old child play with a pit bull that was not yours?
I think you are pretty ####### stupid to let your child play with any dog you are unfamiliar with.
this is the correct answer. I'm not letting my kid play with a weiner dog that doesn't know him and I don't care that if he attacks, my kid will only need some stitches to the face.
 
I think the real question people have to ask is would you let your 4 year old child play with a pit bull that was not yours?
I think you are pretty ####### stupid to let your child play with any dog you are unfamiliar with.
I'm not letting my 4 year old kid play with a pitbull that they are familiar with. Or rott, or several other breeds of dog. I don't trust the kid enough to not put the dog in a bad situation. My tolerance grows with smaller dogs.
 
I think the real question people have to ask is would you let your 4 year old child play with a pit bull that was not yours?
I think you are pretty ####### stupid to let your child play with any dog you are unfamiliar with.
I'm not letting my 4 year old kid play with a pitbull that they are familiar with. Or rott, or several other breeds of dog. I don't trust the kid enough to not put the dog in a bad situation. My tolerance grows with smaller dogs.
My experience rehabing dogs has taught me that a lot of those scary bigger breeds are much better with and have a higher tolerance for children.
 
I think the real question people have to ask is would you let your 4 year old child play with a pit bull that was not yours?
I think you are pretty ####### stupid to let your child play with any dog you are unfamiliar with.
I'm not letting my 4 year old kid play with a pitbull that they are familiar with. Or rott, or several other breeds of dog. I don't trust the kid enough to not put the dog in a bad situation. My tolerance grows with smaller dogs.
My experience rehabing dogs has taught me that a lot of those scary bigger breeds are much better with and have a higher tolerance for children.
Even if a weiner dog was ten times as likely to attack it is pretty easy to see it still isnt as dangerous. Impossible to deny.
 
Here's the fatal dog bite statistics.

http://www.dogsbite.org/dogsbite-recent-dog-bite-statistics.php

Pitbulls account for 71% of them in 2011, while accounting for less than 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 67% in 2010, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 44% in 2009, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 65% in 2008, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 60% in 2008, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 60% in 2007, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 58% in 2006, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 57% in 2005, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Not only is the dog far more dangerous than others on average, but it's getting worse
You're not going to list the actual number of deaths? Why? Is it because it's really not that many? 2011 - 31 deaths ALL BREEDS

2010 - 33 deaths ALL BREEDS

2009 - 32 deaths ALL BREEDS

2008 - 23 deaths ALL BREEDS

Considering that there are over 313 MILLION people currently living in the US, I'd say you guys advocating that pitbulls should be banned should find another cause.

It's really not that big of a deal.

 
Guy I work with just adopted a Pit Bull. He took ten vacation days off of work to make sure he could lay down some ground rules and set the tone so to speak. I have zero issues with somebody like this owning a Pit. He is very dilligent and will care for this dog properly and be very aware at all times. He is the rare exception though.
why would anyone want a dog like this?
or any dog period
i dont trust anyone who doesnt like dogs
I have a tendency to not like things which have had me hospitalized. :shrug:
 
Guy I work with just adopted a Pit Bull. He took ten vacation days off of work to make sure he could lay down some ground rules and set the tone so to speak. I have zero issues with somebody like this owning a Pit. He is very dilligent and will care for this dog properly and be very aware at all times. He is the rare exception though.
why would anyone want a dog like this?
or any dog period
i dont trust anyone who doesnt like dogs
I have a tendency to not like things which have had me hospitalized. :shrug:
If you got mugged/robbed/beat up by a person of (insert race of your choosing), would you forever not like people of that race?
 
Guy I work with just adopted a Pit Bull. He took ten vacation days off of work to make sure he could lay down some ground rules and set the tone so to speak. I have zero issues with somebody like this owning a Pit. He is very dilligent and will care for this dog properly and be very aware at all times. He is the rare exception though.
why would anyone want a dog like this?
or any dog period
i dont trust anyone who doesnt like dogs
I have a tendency to not like things which have had me hospitalized. :shrug:
If you got mugged/robbed/beat up by a person of (insert race of your choosing), would you forever not like people of that race?
If they were bred specifically to kill, yes.
 
A good dog owner understands that 99.9% of what the dog does wrong is their fault. Dog digs in your yard? Your fault. Dog chews furniture? Your fault. Dog jumps on people? Your fault. Dog barks all night? Your fault. Dog attacks someone? Your fault.

The problem is that the vast majority of owners do not realize this. They figure it is the dogs fault so they hit it, scream at it or punish it some other way. This does nothing build fear in the dog and when dogs are scared, it is fight or flight. Some dogs prefer the fight option which is when you get bites/attacks.

Then there are the idiots who watch the Dog Whisper and decide that they need to dominate their dogs and call themselves an Alpha.

 
Guy I work with just adopted a Pit Bull. He took ten vacation days off of work to make sure he could lay down some ground rules and set the tone so to speak. I have zero issues with somebody like this owning a Pit. He is very dilligent and will care for this dog properly and be very aware at all times. He is the rare exception though.
why would anyone want a dog like this?
or any dog period
i dont trust anyone who doesnt like dogs
I have a tendency to not like things which have had me hospitalized. :shrug:
If you got mugged/robbed/beat up by a person of (insert race of your choosing), would you forever not like people of that race?
If they were bred specifically to kill, yes.
If you are referring to pitbulls, whoever bred them did a horrible job based on the number of fatalities and the number of pitbulls in the US.What's your point?
 
Here's the fatal dog bite statistics.

http://www.dogsbite.org/dogsbite-recent-dog-bite-statistics.php

Pitbulls account for 71% of them in 2011, while accounting for less than 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 67% in 2010, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 44% in 2009, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 65% in 2008, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 60% in 2008, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 60% in 2007, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 58% in 2006, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 57% in 2005, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Not only is the dog far more dangerous than others on average, but it's getting worse
You're not going to list the actual number of deaths? Why? Is it because it's really not that many? 2011 - 31 deaths ALL BREEDS

2010 - 33 deaths ALL BREEDS

2009 - 32 deaths ALL BREEDS

2008 - 23 deaths ALL BREEDS

Considering that there are over 313 MILLION people currently living in the US, I'd say you guys advocating that pitbulls should be banned should find another cause.

It's really not that big of a deal.
Plus the attacks attributed to Pitbulls (at that lame dogsbites site) are over 50% in error. 19 of the fatal maulings in one of those years were reported to be unknown or mixed breeds and the lady who runs that site called 18 of them Pitbulls. That lady is no expert though she was attacked by a Pit in 07 before launching her cause online. The 5% of the population figure being Pits is her estimate based on UKC Pitty registrations. So only registered purebred American Pit Bull Terriers are reported in the national population but every unknown breed that attacks is called a Pit by her. She has a cause and her SEO skills have caused a lot of misinformation to flourish.There is a much better site for the stats that actually contacts authorities and victims in every fatal mauling and seeks to correctly identify the breeds... that's where I get the 50% error figure for dogsbites. I can't think of the name atm, but it's out there and well research, albeit with a cause of its own -- accuracy.

 
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Guy I work with just adopted a Pit Bull. He took ten vacation days off of work to make sure he could lay down some ground rules and set the tone so to speak. I have zero issues with somebody like this owning a Pit. He is very dilligent and will care for this dog properly and be very aware at all times. He is the rare exception though.
why would anyone want a dog like this?
or any dog period
i dont trust anyone who doesnt like dogs
I have a tendency to not like things which have had me hospitalized. :shrug:
If you got mugged/robbed/beat up by a person of (insert race of your choosing), would you forever not like people of that race?
If they were bred specifically to kill, yes.
I'd guess at least 40 breeds were bred specifically to kill, including all sighthounds and all terriers.
 
Y'know people foolishly tried to eradicate all bacteria and they only ended up making them much stronger.

You have been warned.

 
Guy I work with just adopted a Pit Bull. He took ten vacation days off of work to make sure he could lay down some ground rules and set the tone so to speak. I have zero issues with somebody like this owning a Pit. He is very dilligent and will care for this dog properly and be very aware at all times. He is the rare exception though.
why would anyone want a dog like this?
or any dog period
i dont trust anyone who doesnt like dogs
I have a tendency to not like things which have had me hospitalized. :shrug:
If you got mugged/robbed/beat up by a person of (insert race of your choosing), would you forever not like people of that race?
If they were bred specifically to kill, yes.
I'd guess at least 40 breeds were bred specifically to kill, including all sighthounds and all terriers.
Not true. You may be thinking of fighting, protecting or hunting. Or maybe for varmints?They couldn't even get another dog breed to kill the bulls, that's why the Pits were bred.
 
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Here's the fatal dog bite statistics.

http://www.dogsbite.org/dogsbite-recent-dog-bite-statistics.php

Pitbulls account for 71% of them in 2011, while accounting for less than 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 67% in 2010, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 44% in 2009, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 65% in 2008, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 60% in 2008, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 60% in 2007, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 58% in 2006, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Pitbulls account for 57% in 2005, while accounting for about 5% of the dog population.

Not only is the dog far more dangerous than others on average, but it's getting worse
You're not going to list the actual number of deaths? Why? Is it because it's really not that many? 2011 - 31 deaths ALL BREEDS

2010 - 33 deaths ALL BREEDS

2009 - 32 deaths ALL BREEDS

2008 - 23 deaths ALL BREEDS

Considering that there are over 313 MILLION people currently living in the US, I'd say you guys advocating that pitbulls should be banned should find another cause.

It's really not that big of a deal.
It also leaves out the number of serious injuries and maimings as well. The death toll doesn't give us an entirely accurate scope of the problem, but does demonstrate that one specific dog is far more likely to be the culprit. They do lead in maimings as well (also by a lot) according to other figures I've seen. I'd definitely agree that this probably isn't high on the list of things causing injury and death to people in the country and probably doesn't merit a ton of resources being thrown at it. But that doesn't change the fact that these dogs are more dangerous than other dogs, whatever the reason for that may be.

 
Y'know people foolishly tried to eradicate all bacteria and they only ended up making them much stronger.You have been warned.
So people will just start breeding super pitbulls and call them something else?
People didn't breed super bacteria, the bacteria adapted.You have been warned...again.
Yeah, and we've wiped out practically all of the natural predators for deer and things. We have a pretty good track record for eradicating animals we don't care for. Unfortunately for them, they can't adapt as quickly as bacteria.
 
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Guy I work with just adopted a Pit Bull. He took ten vacation days off of work to make sure he could lay down some ground rules and set the tone so to speak. I have zero issues with somebody like this owning a Pit. He is very dilligent and will care for this dog properly and be very aware at all times. He is the rare exception though.
why would anyone want a dog like this?
or any dog period
i dont trust anyone who doesnt like dogs
I have a tendency to not like things which have had me hospitalized. :shrug:
If you got mugged/robbed/beat up by a person of (insert race of your choosing), would you forever not like people of that race?
Another brutal analogy. Humans /= dogs. Humans have the ability to rationalize their actions. A dog just a dog.
 
Guy I work with just adopted a Pit Bull. He took ten vacation days off of work to make sure he could lay down some ground rules and set the tone so to speak. I have zero issues with somebody like this owning a Pit. He is very dilligent and will care for this dog properly and be very aware at all times. He is the rare exception though.
why would anyone want a dog like this?
or any dog period
i dont trust anyone who doesnt like dogs
I have a tendency to not like things which have had me hospitalized. :shrug:
If you got mugged/robbed/beat up by a person of (insert race of your choosing), would you forever not like people of that race?
People do tend to be more wary if they travel through a geographic region that shows a propensity towards a particular crime. People tend to behave differently if driving through Boca Raton, Florida in comparison to East St. Louis.
 
Guy I work with just adopted a Pit Bull. He took ten vacation days off of work to make sure he could lay down some ground rules and set the tone so to speak. I have zero issues with somebody like this owning a Pit. He is very dilligent and will care for this dog properly and be very aware at all times. He is the rare exception though.
why would anyone want a dog like this?
or any dog period
i dont trust anyone who doesnt like dogs
I have a tendency to not like things which have had me hospitalized. :shrug:
If you got mugged/robbed/beat up by a person of (insert race of your choosing), would you forever not like people of that race?
Another brutal analogy. Humans /= dogs. Humans have the ability to rationalize their actions. A dog just a dog.
You're right about a dog not being a human.... Dogs can be trained and unfortunately, there are a lot of dogs out there whose owners don't bother to provide sufficient training and then you have dogs attacking humans.But yeah, let's just blame the breed and not the dip#### owner. :thumbup:
 
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/02/06/dog-breed-or-owner_n_818031.html

Dangerous Dogs: Breed Or Owner To Blame? Most Say Owner

SUE MANNING 02/ 3/11 05:02 AM ET

LOS ANGELES — The majority of American pet owners believe a well-trained dog is safe – even if it comes from one of the "bully breeds."

Some dog breeds, such as pit bulls or Rottweilers, are considered truly dangerous by 28 percent of American pet owners, but an Associated Press-Petside.com poll found that 71 percent said any breed can be safe if the dogs are well trained.

"It's not the dog. It's the owner that's the problem," said Michael Hansen, a 59-year-old goldsmith from Port Orchard, Wash. "The dog will do whatever it can to please the owner, right down to killing another animal for you."

"If they are brought up in a loving household, they can flourish just like any other dog," agreed Nancy Lyman, 56, of Warwick, Mass.

Sixty percent of pet owners feel that all dog breeds should be allowed in residential communities, while 38 percent believe some breeds should be banned, according to the poll conducted by GfK Roper Public Affairs and Corporate Communications.

Denver and Miami-Dade County in Florida have pit bull bans that go back decades. The Army and Marine Corps have put base housing off limits to the dogs in the last few years.

Of the pet owners in the poll who support breed bans, 85 percent would bar pit bulls. Other breeds considered too dangerous were Rottweilers, Dobermans, German shepherds and chow chows. Seven percent said any violent, vicious or fighting dog should be banned and 2 percent said all large dogs should be outlawed.

Asked specifically about pit bulls, 53 percent of those polled said they were safe for residential neighborhoods, but 43 percent said they were too dangerous.

Age played a major role in the pit bull questions – 76 percent of those under age 30 said pit bulls were safe, compared with just 37 percent of seniors.

Janice Dudley, 81, of Culver City, Calif., was taking out her garbage when she was charged by a pit bull whose owner had been walking him in her neighborhood for years.

"He came within a few inches of my leg. It was shocking. There was nothing I could do. The owner controlled the dog and they went on their way but it was really very frightening," she said.

She goes to great lengths to avoid the man and dog now, she said. "That was as close as I've ever come and as close as I ever want to be."

Dudley would stop short of imposing a widespread breed ban, but she believes pit bulls are too dangerous. "I think it is in their nature to be more vicious than other dogs," she said.

She blames breeders for the dangerous behavior of the animals and believes the dogs are genetically at risk. "People I know who have had them maintain they are the sweetest things in the world. I don't believe it," she said.

Older pet owners were more apt to support a breed ban than younger ones – 56 percent of seniors believe some dogs should be outlawed compared with just 22 percent of those under age 30.

Parents who own pets were no more or less likely than non-parents to say certain breeds should be banned.

But Tiffany Everhart, 40, of Splendora, Texas, wouldn't have a pit bull. "I have a small child and I'm not going to take that chance." A paralegal, she also believes some dogs are too dangerous for residential areas and she would support a breed ban.

"Every dog is different and should be evaluated on its own merits," said "Dog Whisperer" Cesar Millan.

"If a pit bull has good energy, and if he is socialized early and brought up in a balanced and structured pack environment, then I would consider him perfectly safe for a family with children," Millan said.

Lyman, who has a 17-year-old, blind, deaf and crippled Shih Tzu, said any dog will bite if provoked – citing Martha Stewart's recent run-in with her own dog.

Hansen blames the pit bull's bad reputation on owners and the press.

"You have a tendency to sensationalize stories or put into them right down to the blood and gore when it isn't really necessary," said Hansen, who has two dogs, 9-year-old Lab-collie brothers named Chaz and Zach.

Still, she said Michael Vick's dogfighting operation probably helped pit bulls' bad rep because it showed that "people can reintroduce these dogs back into a society that's not going to abuse them."

"The owner is responsible for what an animal does. It's totally your behavior, whether you have a good dog that minds well and is not a problem to society or you turn it into a vicious animal that will bite the mailman, the girl next door or grandma walking down the street," Hansen said.

Betsy Adevai, 50, of Grand Rapids, Mich., said muscle dogs have become status symbols for young men who walk through her inner city neighborhood.

"You don't see people walking cockapoos or fluffy puppies. I have five boys and they all have friends around here. They walk these dogs to say, 'I'm cool,' 'I'm a badass because I got this dog,'" she said.

She thinks pit bulls "look like little football players" so she wouldn't have one, but the custom seamstress doesn't blame the dogs.

"It's the attitude behind the people who raise them, not the dog," she said.

The AP-Petside.com Poll was conducted Oct. 13-20, 2010, by GfK Roper Public Affairs and Corporate Communications. It involved landline and cell phone interviews with 1,000 pet owners nationwide, and has a margin of sampling error of plus or minus 4.0 percentage points.

___

Deputy Director of Polling Jennifer Agiesta contributed to this report.
 

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