Hawkeye21
Footballguy
McFadden and Morris are not all that good. I think the Cowboys have one of the weaker groups of back up RBs in the league. I think they get more credit because of the OL they've had.
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ZEKE SUSPENDED 6 GAMES BY NFL (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Hairy Snowman
- Start date
Cowboysfan8
Footballguy
I don't care who gets the credit frankly. Just move the chains.
In '15 McFadden did pretty well with complete junk at QB.
We'll see how it goes. Obviously I'd rather Elliott was back there but he's not, and I'm not super worried....yet
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
If you're a Cowboys fan then I'm sure you're not too worried. I could see them losing at least one game due to not having Zeke though.
Stealthycat
Footballguy
they will have Zeke the entire 2017/18 season
appeals, lawsuits etc will last 12 months at least
appeals, lawsuits etc will last 12 months at least
The Big Donkey
Footballguy
Doubtful. Zeke needs to not put his hands on a women. These athletes could have the best lives imaginable. No sympathy for the ones that make the bad choices.
Stealthycat
Footballguy
kodycutter - where is the conviction he did that? trial? arrest ?
you mean its like something you heard?
you mean its like something you heard?
The Big Donkey
Footballguy
6 game suspension would be the conviction here. Why, what did you hear?
it reads that the four advisers, who worked with commissioner Roger Goodell, “were of the view that there is substantial and persuasive evidence supporting a finding that [Elliott] engaged in physical violence against Ms. [Tiffany] Thompson on multiple occasions during the week of July 16, 2016.”
it reads that the four advisers, who worked with commissioner Roger Goodell, “were of the view that there is substantial and persuasive evidence supporting a finding that [Elliott] engaged in physical violence against Ms. [Tiffany] Thompson on multiple occasions during the week of July 16, 2016.”
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Stealthycat
Footballguy
I heard Roger "God" Goodell try and be politically correct by being the jury and judge on something that then police and district prosecuting attorneys and witnesses all resulted in nothing
12-16 months of appeals, arbitration and lawsuits a coming
12-16 months of appeals, arbitration and lawsuits a coming
Sorry if this has been discussed but so many Elliot threads running around right now hard to locate.
Question is about the appeal process. Deflategate bored me and I did not pay close enough attention to it. On that note can anyone tell me why Brady was allowed to take his case to court and delay his suspension a year but other players only avenue for appeal seems to be with the league office? Put another way can Elliot seek remedy through the courts as Brady did? The answer to this question is something we should all want to know.
Question is about the appeal process. Deflategate bored me and I did not pay close enough attention to it. On that note can anyone tell me why Brady was allowed to take his case to court and delay his suspension a year but other players only avenue for appeal seems to be with the league office? Put another way can Elliot seek remedy through the courts as Brady did? The answer to this question is something we should all want to know.
Every now and then the backup to the backup works out but that is what you are drafting, Mcfaddens backup.
TheFanatic
Footballguy
And how many carries did McFadden get last year? Seems Al was used more in relief in 2016, but I didn't pay too close attention.
Pretty sure ESPN ran another long story about Spygate 2 days ago. Pretty sure they can't let it go first.
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/20284825/the-tom-brady-bill-belichick-shift-how-2007-new-england-patriots-super-bowl-spygate-changed-everything
HTH
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
Keeping your head above water with a 2nd round spot sitting on your bench for 6 weeks is no easy task. And it's going to throw off the rest of your draft too since you know you'll have to take another RB earlier than you would have otherwise. Add in the propensity for guys getting hurt after coming off of suspensions and there is some pretty huge risk using a 2nd on him.
NYRAGE
Footballguy
I hate snake drafts. You're basically stuck with about a list of 3 potential guys per each round depending on your draft spot. At least this suspension adds a little intrigue and mixes things up now in the first round. You can potentially get a steal if this suspension gets reduced or even postponed on appeal ala Brady.
Oh, I see. So Salty Haters posting in plenty of other threads accusing the Patriots is fine, but I'm not allowed to bring up Deflategate in this particular thread, even though the media has already brought up the parallels. Got it.
http://thebiglead.com/2017/08/07/cris-carter-believes-information-will-come-out-on-ezekiel-elliott-suspension-coming-within-48-hours/
https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/nfl-owners-reportedly-pressuring-roger-goodell-to-suspend-cowboys-zeke-elliott/
OK; just obsessing over it if that makes you happy. Good luck with that.Oh, I see. So Salty Haters posting in plenty of other threads accusing the Patriots is fine, but I'm not allowed to bring up Deflategate in this particular thread, even though the media has already brought up the parallels. Got it.
http://thebiglead.com/2017/08/07/cris-carter-believes-information-will-come-out-on-ezekiel-elliott-suspension-coming-within-48-hours/
https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/nfl-owners-reportedly-pressuring-roger-goodell-to-suspend-cowboys-zeke-elliott/
Yup, you caught me: I personally told Cris Carter to mention Deflategate when he was breaking the Zeke story. Just so I could post again about Deflategate on the Zeke threads here.
Like I said before, if everyone let Spygate/Deflategate go first, then I'd do the same.
DropKick
Footballguy
Let it go... Brady is in his head.Yup, you caught me: I personally told Cris Carter to mention Deflategate when he was breaking the Zeke story. Just so I could post again about Deflategate on the Zeke threads here.
Like I said before, if everyone let Spygate/Deflategate go first, then I'd do the same.
Hey man, whatever makes you happy.Yup, you caught me: I personally told Cris Carter to mention Deflategate when he was breaking the Zeke story. Just so I could post again about Deflategate on the Zeke threads here.
Like I said before, if everyone let Spygate/Deflategate go first, then I'd do the same.
mquinnjr
Footballguy
Things are moving fast with the Ezekiel Elliott story. I caught up to our Footballguys Legal Expert, Ari Ingel and Ari laid out this timeline for us. Here's what he's seeing.
- 6 game suspension handed down
- Then 3 days to appeal (Elliott would be allowed to play until appeal is done)
- The League has to schedule an appeals hearing within 10 days
- After the appeals hearing, the League has to issue its ruling within a practical amount of time. Very murky timeline. Could be days or weeks.
- League could lessen games or hold to 6. Either way, that becomes final and Elliot is not allowed to play
- Elliott could file an action in court stating that the League violated the CBA. He then needs to seek an injunction in order to play. If he doesn't get one, he doesn't play. For a domestic violence case like this, will the courts give one? They gave an injunction for Tom Brady, but that was a very different offense. They did with Adrian Peterson. Although it was a child and not a woman which may be seen as more egregious. Bottom line, getting an injunction is a wildcard.
- If an injunction grants that Elliott can play, STILL Goodell can just put him on the Commissioners Exempt list. This can be even more than 6 games. Goodell can use this to punish essentially. So Elliott gets paid but doesn't play.
- Unfortunately for Elliott, the Brady case ended up going in the Leagues favor in the courts and clarified that Goodell can punish as he sees fit and is allowed to be judge, jury and executioner. The players negotiated that fairly in the CBA. So Elliott very well may not get the injunction.
- One last very important point. The court case will not be about whether or not Elliott did it. It will be about whether or not the NFL violated the CBA. So it's about the process used. People kept getting tripped up about that in the Brady case and is the reason the appeals court overruled the first judge who erroneously made it about the innocent or guilt.
There you have it ... now we wait. Ari's Personal opinion .... Elliott will miss games. That may start Week 1 or Week 3. But he will miss time. He's not Tom Brady, far from it. And if Goodell can go up against Tom Brady and Robert Kraft, he can go up against Ezekiel Elliott and Jerry Jones.
- 6 game suspension handed down
- Then 3 days to appeal (Elliott would be allowed to play until appeal is done)
- The League has to schedule an appeals hearing within 10 days
- After the appeals hearing, the League has to issue its ruling within a practical amount of time. Very murky timeline. Could be days or weeks.
- League could lessen games or hold to 6. Either way, that becomes final and Elliot is not allowed to play
- Elliott could file an action in court stating that the League violated the CBA. He then needs to seek an injunction in order to play. If he doesn't get one, he doesn't play. For a domestic violence case like this, will the courts give one? They gave an injunction for Tom Brady, but that was a very different offense. They did with Adrian Peterson. Although it was a child and not a woman which may be seen as more egregious. Bottom line, getting an injunction is a wildcard.
- If an injunction grants that Elliott can play, STILL Goodell can just put him on the Commissioners Exempt list. This can be even more than 6 games. Goodell can use this to punish essentially. So Elliott gets paid but doesn't play.
- Unfortunately for Elliott, the Brady case ended up going in the Leagues favor in the courts and clarified that Goodell can punish as he sees fit and is allowed to be judge, jury and executioner. The players negotiated that fairly in the CBA. So Elliott very well may not get the injunction.
- One last very important point. The court case will not be about whether or not Elliott did it. It will be about whether or not the NFL violated the CBA. So it's about the process used. People kept getting tripped up about that in the Brady case and is the reason the appeals court overruled the first judge who erroneously made it about the innocent or guilt.
There you have it ... now we wait. Ari's Personal opinion .... Elliott will miss games. That may start Week 1 or Week 3. But he will miss time. He's not Tom Brady, far from it. And if Goodell can go up against Tom Brady and Robert Kraft, he can go up against Ezekiel Elliott and Jerry Jones.
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Koya
Footballguy
Don't see any way litigation stops this. There is certainly an amount of evidence, as noted in the letter... and it's the NFL's near total discretion here, as I understand it.tonydead said:
Sounds like he deserves it, but regardless, from a legal and will Jerry fight perspective, the NFL will put 4 on the table and the 'boys will grab it.
Is there a difference between domestic violence and physical force? Because it seems the league chose it's words carefully and everyone else including Ari are still calling it domestic violence.
DropKick
Footballguy
You may be right but that's the part that bothers me; the appeal and subsequent reduction. Makes you think its a dog and pony show. I don't necessarily agree with giving him 6 games but, if that's what you decide, stick with it.
Bojang0301
Omar4Heisman
I agree with the argument that they gave him 6 to get it to 4. It still doesn't make any sense in my mind. It's pretty clear this woman is a liar. In any case, that's his fault for the company he kept. The NFL is going to have a litany of issues the next CBA. Hope it's worth it to have a lockout/strike.
Koya
Footballguy
I agree in principle, but this has always been a negotiation, which by its nature is disingenuous. You never go into a negotiation with your final offer (even if you feel it's fair, or right)... you ask for a little more, assuming at the least the opposing party will do the same.
In addition, disturbing as these incidents appear to be, there were no charges and four games seems fair within the NFL conduct policy context.
Koya
Footballguy
Which women, and lying which time? The NFL letter alone mentions multiple incidents.
Don't believe the NFL would go this heavy unless they felt not only that he likely did it, but they have some damning evidence to that point, perhaps inadmissible in a court of law, but enough for them to make a fair judgement under their policy.
DropKick
Footballguy
I agree with that...
So just give him 4 games. On the flip side, the Elliott camp would just accept that and get ready for week 5. Move on and let the story die from an NFL perspective.
I only appeal if I'm innocent. More publicity means all kinds of things can bubble to the surface.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
I don't think any lawyer would advise that. They will always tell you to plead not guilty regardless of guilt. You can always fight and lessen a punishment but they will not punish you more for doing so.
Bojang0301
Omar4Heisman
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Hawkeye21
Footballguy
Nope. Not looking to get political at all. I just don't really see either side being pretty clear since we haven't seen all the info the NFL has seen.
Bojang0301
Omar4Heisman
Damning evidence? Like PacMan Jones spitting on a cop? It's pick and choose. You can even see it in the articles today. They want this as some sort of redemption attempt for Ray Rice.
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2 separate questions:
1-Zeke is likely to appeal & he can play while appeal is pending, so it's possible he doesn't start his suspension until later in year. That brings the risk that his suspension might run into FF playoffs. With that risk, doesn't that push his draft position down further?
2-Fron an NFL perspective, if he doesn't finish his suspension before the end of the regular season (& the Cowboys make the playoffs), does his suspension continue in playoffs, or carry over until 2018?
1-Zeke is likely to appeal & he can play while appeal is pending, so it's possible he doesn't start his suspension until later in year. That brings the risk that his suspension might run into FF playoffs. With that risk, doesn't that push his draft position down further?
2-Fron an NFL perspective, if he doesn't finish his suspension before the end of the regular season (& the Cowboys make the playoffs), does his suspension continue in playoffs, or carry over until 2018?
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
1 - I think that's a possibility and if it happens I would drop him in my rankings.
2 - I'm not sure how that works. I assume it goes into the playoffs.
With regards to 1, my point was that we might not know, for certain, WHEN the suspension will be served. It's already being reported he will appeal, which should be denied, since the same person who decides the punishment hears the appeal
. But when that decision is made, & if Zeke decides to use the courts to bypass the appeal, wouldn't be set in stone; I highly doubt that would all be settled by the time most of us draft/auction.Getting someone on our team who we know won't be available for the first 3, 4, 6 games of the FF season is one thing; getting someone who may not be available for the stretch run/FF playoffs is another.
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DropKick
Footballguy
In redraft, not being eligible for 6 games would be a huge tumble - regardless of where those games fall. There is no guarantee that he plays in the remaining games either as injuries and conditioning could be a factor. Play-off schedule (@Giants, @Raiders) doesn't blow me away.With regards to 1, my point was that we might not know, for certain, WHEN the suspension will be served. It's already being reported he will appeal, which should be denied, since the same person who decides the punishment hears the appeal
Getting someone on our team who we know won't be available for the first 3, 4, 6 games of the FF season is one thing; getting someone who may not be available for the stretch run/FF playoffs is another.
The result in most redrafts will boil down to when does he become a good risk/reward play? It is almost certain that someone will overpay and take him earlier than they should. Lost season or fantasy savior?
I think the majority of people in here don't realize the value of replacement player. If you're playing anyone remotely decent in place of Zeke in year full of solid options in the 5-7 rds, you're likely still getting a top 8 RB at year's end. With a top 3 rb for when it really counts.
DropKick
Footballguy
At what point would you take Zeke? That's the key question.
Suppose he has another incident? Not likely (one would think) but crazier things have happened.
SeniorVBDStudent
Footballguy
I'm undecided at this point despite initially thinking this was typical NFL being overly heavy-handed because they can.
All I really know is that I've seen the photos and I've heard Zeke's position as "oh, she got those bruises in a bar fight". Without additional info, the optics look bad. So, is there other info? Do we have third party testimony validating Zeke's explanation? Yes, I admit to being lazy.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
This is why I would drop him. The uncertainty is why he drops. I'm not taking a guy in the first two rounds if he has a chance to miss 6 games at any time but I don't get to know before the season starts. I suppose there's a chance he doesn't get suspended until next year so you could get him for the entire season for cheap but the risk is crazy.With regards to 1, my point was that we might not know, for certain, WHEN the suspension will be served. It's already being reported he will appeal, which should be denied, since the same person who decides the punishment hears the appeal
Getting someone on our team who we know won't be available for the first 3, 4, 6 games of the FF season is one thing; getting someone who may not be available for the stretch run/FF playoffs is another.
