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The Tazmanian Devil, Phillip Lindsay


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I will say this though, it feels good to be right about the Denver RB situation more times than Cecil Lammy

Given his track record with Broncos RBs, this could be the kiss of death for Freeman and Lindsay.

this thread. while you continue to worry about him eventually getting hurt, I'll keep putting him in at RB2 / flex and racking up the free points Im getting from him. 


 

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Cecil Lammey @CecilLammey

Melvin Gordon out here for final practice of #BroncosCamp -- once again Phillip Lindsay has changed #Broncos plans at RB. This has looks of 50/50 split and perhaps even "hot hand" approach @1043TheFan

https://twitter.com/cecillammey/status/1302046107116085248?s=21

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Are Lindsay owners flexing him week one or doing a wait and see approach? I guess it largely depends on how solid your options are but right now I have him in over the likes of James White, Boston Scott,  Manny Sanders, Robby Anderson. Not intending to be a disguised WDIS but moreso trying to gauge how others feel about starting him week one and if so over who. 

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3 hours ago, NajehHejan said:

Are Lindsay owners flexing him week one or doing a wait and see approach? I guess it largely depends on how solid your options are but right now I have him in over the likes of James White, Boston Scott,  Manny Sanders, Robby Anderson. Not intending to be a disguised WDIS but moreso trying to gauge how others feel about starting him week one and if so over who. 

I may end up rolling with him at flex in a few leagues. The list of RBs that have rushed for more yards than he has over the last 2 years is a very very short list. Why the Broncos brought in Gordon I'll never fully understand. 

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5 minutes ago, ffmail4me said:

I may end up rolling with him at flex in a few leagues. The list of RBs that have rushed for more yards than he has over the last 2 years is a very very short list. Why the Broncos brought in Gordon I'll never fully understand. 

Too much ex-elite jock-ism in the room, maybe. 

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10 minutes ago, ffmail4me said:

I may end up rolling with him at flex in a few leagues. The list of RBs that have rushed for more yards than he has over the last 2 years is a very very short list. Why the Broncos brought in Gordon I'll never fully understand. 

I think that was more a Royce Freeman issue then Lindsay issue.

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1 hour ago, metoo said:

Gordon should be on the do not draft list. Lindsay is value.

bostonfred's usual good points aside, I lean this way. But having a guy that can get it done at the goal line and block in pass pro for a team looking to be three-wide a lot is huge for the Broncos, and Gordon fits that bill. I'm torn. I passed on both guys in my drafts, actually, because I've never been impressed with Gordon as a runner. Plain and simple just don't trust his talent. We'll see if I'm right, wrong, or if he's in another well-suited situation to be fed the rock like in San Diego/LA. 

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2 hours ago, rockaction said:

Too much ex-elite jock-ism in the room, maybe. 

This comment reminded me of Billy Beane, As GM. If you know the Moneyball story, he went the opposite way. he’s basically if Elway had failed as an NFL player and then become a front office guy and wasn’t looking for the next Elway.  Interesting dichotomy between their 2 careers. 

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Just now, IHEARTFF said:

This comment reminded me of Billy Beane, As GM. If you know the Moneyball story, he went the opposite way. he’s basically if Elway had failed as an NFL player and then become a front office guy and wasn’t looking for the next Elway.  Interesting dichotomy between their 2 careers. 

Very familiar with the Moneyball story. Used to read Rob Neyer back in '98 on ESPN about baseball and he and others totally changed my thinking about the game and who to revere, etc. I think maybe Elway is falling into the success trap and looking for elite traits in a three-down back like he had in Terrell Davis. Melvin Gordon is not Terrell Davis.

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1 minute ago, rockaction said:

Very familiar with the Moneyball story. Used to read Rob Neyer back in '98 on ESPN about baseball and he and others totally changed my thinking about the game and who to revere, etc. I think maybe Elway is falling into the success trap and looking for elite traits in a three-down back like he had in Terrell Davis. Melvin Gordon is not Terrell Davis.

Yep, exactly. Surprisingly these billionaires aren’t as savvy and competitive as you might think. Some just enjoy the fat pro sports money and don’t care about winning or building a great organization. Not calling out Denver, necessarily, but they aren’t using all their resources. 

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13 minutes ago, IHEARTFF said:

Yep, exactly. Surprisingly these billionaires aren’t as savvy and competitive as you might think. Some just enjoy the fat pro sports money and don’t care about winning or building a great organization. Not calling out Denver, necessarily, but they aren’t using all their resources. 

I agree, with a minor caveat. The quantification analysis used by baseball is a little different because of the nature of the isolation of the pitcher and batter from the rest of the play, though. I think resources in the NFL are best spent using f(x) and other sport science stuff like that. But yes, the Elway signing of Gordon makes me think of old men in a room doing things the same old way. And maybe, to a degree, that way is a good way. bostonfred points out that pass pro -- and catching the ball and other qualities Gordon has -- might keep him on the field and benefit the offense by simply making the defense think about the offense's diversity and method.

But really, advanced eye scouting benefits and favors Lindsay, and I pooh-poohed him in this very thread, I think. I think he's good and maybe not big enough to be a feature back, but that's me. Things like Yards Before Contact, now becoming a quantifiable stat, encompasses vision and quickness in tight areas. Lindsay has had two very good years of that stat, one putting him in the top five of the past four years for it. (Matt Breida is another YBC guy.) It's those kind of stats that recontextualize the position and help us see what's in front of our eyes. They're going farther with less carries even if they're smaller or not prototypical. Just something to think about. Gordon, to me, looks like the sacrifice bunt in the eighth in the regular season. Lindsay might be one of the three true outcomes (if you dig the nineties SABR baseball lingo). 

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ESPN's Adam Schefter reports Broncos RB Phillip Lindsay is dealing with a "mild" turf toe.

His status for Week 2 against the Steelers is questionable. Melvin Gordon shared the load with Lindsay while the two were healthy on Monday night, but it was Gordon who out-snapped Royce Freeman 22 to 6 once Lindsay exited the game. The Steelers' front-seven is arguably the league's worst to attack on the ground, but Gordon will rank as a usage-based RB3 if Lindsay can't go on Sunday.

RELATED: 

Melvin Gordon

SOURCE: Adam Schefter on Twitter

Sep 15, 2020, 8:49 AM ET

 

 

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Speaking Tuesday, Broncos coach Vic Fangio declined to update Phillip Lindsay's (toe) status. 

No news is usually bad news with injuries, but we won't have to wait long for an official update. The Broncos will issue their first injury report of Week 2 on Wednesday. A limited session would have Lindsay tentatively on track to play through his "mild" turf toe, but an absence seems more likely. Fantasy players should not be planning to have Lindsay in their FLEX spot against the Steelers. 

SOURCE: Ryan O'Halloran on Twitter 

Sep 15, 2020, 2:15 PM ET

 

 

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NFL Network's Ian Rapoport reports Phillip Lindsay (turf toe) is expected to miss the "next few weeks."

Lindsay is getting a second opinion but it looks like he's going to miss at least one week. The good news is the Broncos don't view it as a long-term injury. Lindsay's absence means more touches for Melvin Gordon in a Week 2 matchup with the Steelers. Royce Freeman will replace Lindsay as the No. 2 back.

RELATED: 

Melvin Gordon

, Royce Freeman

SOURCE: NFL Network

Sep 16, 2020, 11:22 AM ET

 

 

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Coach Vic Fangio called Phillip Lindsay (toe) "day to day" and wouldn't rule him out for Week 2 against the Steelers.

NFL Network's Ian Rapoport reported earlier Wednesday that Lindsay was expected to miss the "next few weeks." Coaches always try to hide stuff, so we could easily see RapSheet's report still being correct. Lindsay isn't practicing Wednesday. We'd consider him doubtful to face the Steelers this upcoming Sunday, leaving Melvin Gordon as the clear lead back followed by Royce Freeman.

SOURCE: Ryan O'Halloran on Twitter

Sep 16, 2020, 2:16 PM ET

 

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Phillip Lindsay (toe) remained sidelined on Thursday. 

All signs are pointing toward Lindsay missing Sunday's difficult matchup against the Steelers. Royce Freeman will serve as Melvin Gordon's caddie. 

SOURCE: Ryan O'Halloran on Twitter 

Sep 17, 2020, 2:15 PM ET

 

 

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Broncos RB Phillip Lindsay (toe) won't play in Week 2 against the Steelers.

It remains unclear if Lindsay will miss any time beyond Week 2. Sunday makes for a terrible matchup against Pittsburgh's front-seven, which limited Saquon Barkley to six yards on 15 carries in Week 1, but Melvin Gordon did out-snap Royce Freeman 22 to 6 once Lindsay exited on Monday night. Gordon still qualifies as a usage-based RB2/3 despite the terrible matchup.

RELATED: 

Melvin Gordon

SOURCE: James Palmer on Twitter

Sep 18, 2020, 3:47 PM ET

 

 

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NFL Network's Ian Rapoport reports Broncos RB Phillip Lindsay (toe) is out 2-4 weeks.

Lindsay suffered a toe sprain in Week 1 versus the Titans that will keep him out until at least Week 4. Melvin Gordon will serve as Denver's three-down back in his absence. The Broncos were reluctant to let Royce Freeman get much work as Gordon's backup after Lindsay went down. He played on just six snaps and saw a single carry plus a catch. Gordon's matchup versus Pittsburgh is brutal but the volume he should see makes him an RB2/3. 

SOURCE: Ian Rapoport on Twitter

Sep 20, 2020, 9:25 AM ET

 

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Broncos RB Phillip Lindsay (toe) will not practice Thursday. 

Lindsay is trending toward missing a second game with his toe injury, leaving Melvin Gordon as the Broncos' workhorse runner against the Bucs. Only 12 running backs have a higher share of offensive snaps than Gordon through two weeks. Without Lindsay in Week 2, Gordon commanded 35 percent of the Broncos’ total opportunity (rushes and targets combined) -- the 12th highest mark of the week. He's a sneaky good play against Tampa this week even if negative game script. 

RELATED: 

Melvin Gordon

SOURCE: Jeff Legwold on Twitter 

Sep 24, 2020, 2:06 PM ET

 

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How do you think Lindsay's long term value has changed now?

Do you think he bounces back and becomes a viable flex? He was, what, Top 20 last year among backs?

Or do you think he's toast even if he does return?

Trying to gauge his value as he's on the wire now, and for the life of me can't really get a handle on how I value him compared to who I may have to drop.

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16 minutes ago, Stompin' Tom Connors said:

Trying to gauge his value as he's on the wire now, and for the life of me can't really get a handle on how I value him compared to who I may have to drop.

Someone just dropped him in my redraft, and I’m trying to decide if he’s worth a claim. 

and going through the same mental gymnastics wondering if he’ll be better than anyone i could drop. 🤔 

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For me it's between guys like Cohen and Rojo. Cohen has been disappointing in PPR but with Robinson wanting off the team and Cohen's contract, my hope is that they actually start using him again. RoJo looks like he may permanently be in the back seat to Fournette, but who knows, I've seen this ride with Arians between Rojo and Barber. 

I like the prospect of Lindsay when he heals but his first game out the gate was a stinker, and he may be in a three-back timeshare when he returns, which to me is at par or worse than the guys I am looking to drop him for.

You?

 

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7 hours ago, Stompin' Tom Connors said:

For me it's between guys like Cohen and Rojo. Cohen has been disappointing in PPR but with Robinson wanting off the team and Cohen's contract, my hope is that they actually start using him again. RoJo looks like he may permanently be in the back seat to Fournette, but who knows, I've seen this ride with Arians between Rojo and Barber. 

I like the prospect of Lindsay when he heals but his first game out the gate was a stinker, and he may be in a three-back timeshare when he returns, which to me is at par or worse than the guys I am looking to drop him for.

You?

 

everything you wrote is what we are all going through.   Just don't have a solid answers right now, it's all speculation.   Hell in my ffpc league I had/have to sit J. Jones, de. Adams, Chark this week.

Damn!   holding Brown for now but appears Rams are RB by committee and I don't see that changing unless injury.

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7 hours ago, Stompin' Tom Connors said:

 

I like the prospect of Lindsay when he heals but his first game out the gate was a stinker, and he may be in a three-back timeshare when he returns, which to me is at par or worse than the guys I am looking to drop him for.

You?

 

The league I’m looking at him is IDP, so I have broader options, like dropping a quality LB4 or DB3, which I don’t really want to do. They get banged up a lot. 

On offense, Cohen is my top candidate, Duke Johnson after that. I told myself I’d wait until Duke’s ankle healed & the Texans schedule loosened up after PIT.  Cohen, same logic as you - they paid him so they must want to use him at some point. 

Unfortunately, applying good logic to bad teams isn’t always good logic. :shrug: 

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Phillip Lindsay (toe) remained "limited" on Tuesday. 

The Broncos didn't actually practice on Tuesday, but they have no estimated Lindsay as "limited" back-to-back days. He got in a "limited" session last Friday before failing to suit up against the Bucs. He is probably on the wrong side of questionable for Thursday night's game against the Jets. If he can go, 10-12 touches will be a real possibility with the Broncos certain to lean on their running game with Brett Rypien under center. 

Sep 29, 2020, 4:08 PM ET

 

 

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1 minute ago, Buffaloes said:

still the best RB on the team. this is a lost season and he is hurt so I think buying low in dynasty is the move

I agree. He's on the wire in my redraft league and my team is sucking wind at RB so wondering if it's worth it to snag him for long term or go for a guy like Carlos Hyde who can be useful for 1 or 2 weeks but who knows how long after that.

 

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Broncos coach Vic Fangio said Phillip Lindsay (toe)  is “close to returning.”

Lindsay is practicing on a limited basis this week. He’s trending toward returning after missing the last two games. Getting Lindsay back would cut into Melvin Gordon’s workload in what projects as a run-heavy matchup with the Jets.

SOURCE: KOA Colorado

Sep 30, 2020, 10:47 AM ET

 

 

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12 hours ago, Stompin' Tom Connors said:

I agree. He's on the wire in my redraft league and my team is sucking wind at RB so wondering if it's worth it to snag him for long term or go for a guy like Carlos Hyde who can be useful for 1 or 2 weeks but who knows how long after that.

 

I picked him up over a few handcuffs I have on my bench. Specifically D Williams of KC. 
 

I think he’s definitely worth checking out and holding this week if he plays. 

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Phillip Lindsay (toe) is questionable for Week 4 against the Jets Thursday night.

Lindsay's absence the last two weeks has allowed Melvin Gordon to be a true every-down back, but Lindsay looks like he's going to be back either tomorrow night or Week 5 at the latest. Gordon fantasy managers would love to get Gordon against the Jets at an 80 percent-plus snap share and 20-plus touches. Lindsay's return would throw a wrench into that.

Sep 30, 2020, 2:48 PM ET

 

 

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Broncos RB Phillip Lindsay (toe) is unlikely to play Thursday. 

Lindsay has practiced this week and traveled with the team to New York for Thursday's epic showdown with the Jets. There remains a small chance he could be activated, though it's looking like Melvin Gordon will once again function as the workhorse. Nearly 47 percent of plays run against the Jets defense this season have been rushes -- the sixth highest rate in the NFL. Gordon should be in fantasy lineups even if Lindsay is able to play. 

RELATED: 

Melvin Gordon

SOURCE: Tom Pelissero on Twitter 

Oct 1, 2020, 10:31 AM ET

 

 

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Phillip Lindsay (toe) practiced in full ahead of the Broncos' Week 5 contest against the Patriots.

Lindsay has been sidelined since Week 1 after touching the ball just eight times. His return to the lineup throws a bit of a wrench in Melvin Gordon III's workload, as the 2020 free agent signing averaged 20 touches while Lindsay missed time due to injury.

Oct 7, 2020, 7:24 PM ET

 

 

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1 hour ago, VikingFrog said:

Could pay big dividends for those that held him through his injury and the Melvin Gordon news.

Question is will he be able to stay healthy or run the risk of re-aggravating it.  Turf toes are tough.  Plus, Gordon will not likely miss any time this season because of the DUI. 

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