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Florida Politics (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter The Commish
- Start date
joffer
Footballguy
Uh oh. The day a lot of us in this thread have feared may be upon us:
‘If It’s Here, It’s Here’: America’s Retirees Confront the Virus in Florida
‘If It’s Here, It’s Here’: America’s Retirees Confront the Virus in Florida
The Commish
Footballguy
Beat me to it....I hope this doesn't go like I think it's going to. Their only hope is to change their collective tune towards masks (which, to this point, has been REALLY anti-mask).
JamieMurphy
Footballguy
The Commish
Footballguy
I'm really struggling to understand this mandate for schools HAVING to be open. The most often heard "logic" I hear around this topic is "because parents need to be able to work". That's cool...I get it, but has anyone been paying attention to the job situation? Here in Central Florida (not unique) we rely HEAVILY on tourism. Orange County has been collecting approx 3-5% of their tourism dollars since this thing started and it's not really getting much better. Great, everyone's at work, now what? Large companies will likely be fine though they are taking a hit, but small/medium companies are going to get really beat up partially open.
Not sure if anyone is paying attention nationally, but our name is pretty much mud in terms of handling this thing. There is zero confidence in our condition and ability to keep people safe. People are staying home and rightfully so. I just don't understand these decisions knowing we are fully entrenched in the "confidence" portion of the program and no one has any in us. I mean, the Bahamas has shut off access to their country...Florida being a big part of that decision. We seem to be floundering after being on a real strong path to success initially.
Not sure if anyone is paying attention nationally, but our name is pretty much mud in terms of handling this thing. There is zero confidence in our condition and ability to keep people safe. People are staying home and rightfully so. I just don't understand these decisions knowing we are fully entrenched in the "confidence" portion of the program and no one has any in us. I mean, the Bahamas has shut off access to their country...Florida being a big part of that decision. We seem to be floundering after being on a real strong path to success initially.
The only reason schools need to be open and the nfl needs to be playing is because Trump wants you to forget all this in november.
Grahamburn
Footballguy
Governor Ron dropping the hammer on the school board and teachers.
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
Grahamburn
Footballguy
It's a lot more than that. The part that seems to be getting lost is people still have a choice. Teachers can refuse to come in. Parents can keep their kids home and attend remotely. Mandating schools being open doesn't mean anyone actually has to go to them, but a lot of people want them to be, and do rely on them for a lot more than just a place to dump their kids.
Why is a school any different than a Publix or a Wal-Mart? Have precautions. Follow them. Adapt.
If you can't understand how putting 30 7 year olds in a room that is 30 foot by 30 foot is different than a walmart you have never been in a class room
Grahamburn
Footballguy
If the normal class size is ~30 I’d expect we would see COVID class sizes of ~15 give or take a few. Space out the desks and have them wear masks. It really isn’t that hard.
again you expect 6 and 7 year old to wear masks and socially distance? They can't even keep their fingers out of their bum
classes aren't big enought to put 6 feet between the desks. The best you could maybe do is split the class into 3 and rotate the times they come to school
I just don't think you are thinking of the complexities of this
Don't forget about all the neural atypical kids (typically 3-4 per class) who would potentially be traumatized by having to wearing masks
Sea Duck
Footballguy
This isn't a serious question, is it?
- People rarely spend more than 2 hours per week inside a store.
- Stores rarely have more than 200 people in them at a time, spread out over a very wide area.
- Store aisles have less traffic than school hallways.
- Shoppers rarely spend more than 5 minutes in any single location of a store.
- Shoppers do not sit next to people.
- Shoppers do not sit in rooms with 20-30 other people.
- Shoppers rarely use a communal restroom.
- Modern store HVAC systems circulate air better than old schools.
- Sick people are more likely to go to school than go to a store.
Schools are incubators compared to your average Wal-Mart.
Grahamburn
Footballguy
Yes? Kids come in. They sit at their desk. The teacher teaches. Lunch. Kids back to their desk. Recess. Kids come back to class. Teach. Day over.
It doesn’t have to be complex. Kids adapt a lot better than adults do in many situations. Keep it simple.
Grahamburn
Footballguy
Daycares are open.
Wal-Mart, Lowe’s, and Publix. All open. People are Congregating in these places ALL DAY LONG!
Why is the school any different?
Wal-Mart, Lowe’s, and Publix. All open. People are Congregating in these places ALL DAY LONG!
Why is the school any different?
Everyone has answered you above and it's clearly hugely different. This seems like a strange argument or you aren't reading
Grahamburn
Footballguy
Grahamburn
Footballguy
Because daycare has 6 kids under 4 years old. Those kids can sit by themselves and play like they do mostly anyway.
joffer
Footballguy
Grahamburn
Footballguy
Church based daycares have hundreds of kids. Ample staff. All open. All in close proximity. Daily. Please explain why the schools need to be closed.
Grahamburn
Footballguy
I backed off retail. Bad example apparently. Why can the huge church daycares be open but schools can’t?
I'm done...it has been explained over and over again. It's not the same thing.
In california where i live a daycare cannot have more than 12 kids with a ratio of 6:1
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The Commish
Footballguy
I can give you a laundry list of reasons why a school is different from a Publix or a Walmart, but that's not the point. I don't understand the "reason" of "getting back to work" when many of them are people who are in the tourism industry that is virtually non existent. Doesn't make sense. The other reasons kids go to school (primarily food related) can be addressed without forcing these people to choose between a job on the verge of extinction and putting their kids in a potentially dangerous situation.
Jobber
Footballguy
Mile High
Footballguy
If you take a typical school, and limit the classrooms down from 30 to 15 where are the additional classrooms going to come from to accommodate the other 15 kids?
Grahamburn
Footballguy
Grahamburn
Footballguy
I’m assuming the parents of half the student body have decided to learn remotely as most surveys suggested they would do.
Grahamburn
Footballguy
My kids go to a daycare with hundreds of other kids separated by rooms and “teachers.” It very much is basically the exact same thing.
Grahamburn
Footballguy
Osaurus
Footballguy
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I don’t agree with everything you’ve posted in this thread, but I hate the way these debates always boil down to “Schools must reopen full time” vs. “We absolutely can’t open schools at all.” For one thing, I don’t agree with either position, and I suspect I’m not alone there. Both options have major potential downsides.
But more importantly, that’s not the debate we should be having. What we need to be discussing is what steps we need to start taking right now if we want to reopen schools next month. It’s not going to be easy (which is my main point of disagreement with your posts) and if Florida is unable to get its daily case count down below 10K it almost certainly won’t happen at all, at least not in any of the major population centers.
And that’s my main problem with the Trump (and to a slightly lesser extent DeSantis) position. You can’t reopen schools by fiat and simply hand wave away all the complications. I want to hear a lot more about how they’re setting safety benchmarks that schools have to meet in order to reopen and making sure they have the resources to meet them.
Jobber
Footballguy
Great post. In places without runaway infections, a hybrid (A day, B day) model is what I’m pulling for.
Yeah I think that may be realistic. The current plan for Miami — which almost certainly won’t happen unless things improve rapidly — would make a lot of sense in the kinds of places you’re talking about: if a school is below 75% capacity, it can bring students back full time. If it’s over that number, it has to use a hybrid model. But it’s still going to be hard to pull this off safely
Not bad. He's showing some flexibility about how schools open.
One caveat about preschools and daycare not closing: the state didn't close them, but many shut down on their own. Some re-opened and then closed again, such as the on-site daycare/pre-school where I work. Contact tracing from all students in some of those schools that stayed open would be useful to help make decisions.
Blue Dot Orange Dot
Footballguy
Lebron James is helping to raise money so people can pay off fines to be able to vote.
https://www.politico.com/states/florida/story/2020/07/24/lebron-james-joins-push-to-turn-out-ex-felon-vote-in-florida-1303417
This is the organization that’s been raising money - over $1.6M so far:
https://wegotthevote.org/finesandfees/
https://www.politico.com/states/florida/story/2020/07/24/lebron-james-joins-push-to-turn-out-ex-felon-vote-in-florida-1303417
This is the organization that’s been raising money - over $1.6M so far:
https://wegotthevote.org/finesandfees/
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The Commish
Footballguy
Seems like grassroots groups are starting to pop up all over. We have two small ones here in my town that I just ran across. Now the problem will be, "determining the amount of money people actually owe" as a stall tactic....some have been told "we need to figure out what you owe" and then been told it could take years.
Blue Dot Orange Dot
Footballguy
I agree, knowing how much people owe is a problem because the state can’t even figure that out.
Sea Duck
Footballguy
What's stopping the State from fabricating ridiculously high fees? What's stopping judges from imposing million dollar fines for all but white-collar felonies?
What could his money actually accomplish at this point? GOP legislators and DeSantis aren’t going to change their minds. Only way to fix it is by electing more Dems this year and defeating DeSantis in ‘22 ... and expanding the electorate, particularly to people who now have all the motivation in the world to vote these people out, seems like a good way to accomplish that.
Jobber
Footballguy
One thing the GOP is short sighted in again (surprise surprise) is they may be successful in this ONE election interfering with these people’s voting rights. I guarantee all of these (million?) ex-felons will remember just who ####ed with them. Their close friends and families as well.
‘I’d rather be Trump than Biden.’ Why Florida should be close in 2020, despite polls
Whole lotta spin going on in this article, but I mostly agree with the conclusions. Biden could certainly win Florida, particularly if he maintains as big a lead as he has right now. But I don't really get the sense that he's unlocked the state. Specifically, based on everything I've read, Trump has done a much better job targeting the Latino vote. He won't win it, but he could certainly hold Biden's margins down while turning out his base of Cubans, rural voters and Villages retirees. That's what has driven GOP's historical success here, including in 2018 when Florida looked a lot more like the GOP base states where Trump super-charged turnout, rather than Blue Wave states where he got swamped in the suburbs.
Whole lotta spin going on in this article, but I mostly agree with the conclusions. Biden could certainly win Florida, particularly if he maintains as big a lead as he has right now. But I don't really get the sense that he's unlocked the state. Specifically, based on everything I've read, Trump has done a much better job targeting the Latino vote. He won't win it, but he could certainly hold Biden's margins down while turning out his base of Cubans, rural voters and Villages retirees. That's what has driven GOP's historical success here, including in 2018 when Florida looked a lot more like the GOP base states where Trump super-charged turnout, rather than Blue Wave states where he got swamped in the suburbs.
![[scooter]](/data/avatars/m/22/22287.jpg?1659477690){kind=avatar}
[scooter]
Footballguy
Food for thought: in early August 2016, Hillary Clinton led in the polls in Florida by around 3.5 points. By election day, Trump had gained around 4 points and was leading in the polls, and he ended up winning Florida by 1.2 points. That's a total swing of around 4.7 points.
Biden's current lead in Florida polls is 6.7 points.
The point is: polls may not guarantee anything, but they give you an idea of A) how much ground a candidate is likely to make up in 100 days, and B) how many points a former underdog is likely to make up on election day.
So, I'm not saying that Trump can't erase a 6.7-point-deficit in 96 days.....but his own history is working against him here.
The Commish
Footballguy
Id really like to believe this but i just can't. Funny tidbit ...people have been trying to set up a pro trump display of support at a busy intersection here. Just as they get set up the skies open up and dump on them. every single day....
Drunken Cowboy
Footballguy
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