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I'm still undecided.


Mr.Pack

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1 minute ago, Terminalxylem said:

Like I said, I’ve never been, but if it’s like much of the rest of the upper Midwest (read, terrible weather and geography) I’d be hard pressed to find an excuse to visit. You like it better than NC?

I have lived in Minnesota and spent a lot of time in western Wisconsin. I like NC too, but would have no issues with moving back to the upper Midwest. 

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7 minutes ago, Mr.Pack said:

Off the top of my head.... 

Tax cuts for businesses and lower bracket income earners

Bombing the crap out of Isis, weakening them bigly

Upping Military spending

Taking care of our Veterans

Just to name a few. I'm not happy there is no ACA replacement plan tho. While I'm glad they're dismantling it, i would really like to hear the replacement and hopefully it has an emphasis on the first A - Affordable which Obamacare never was.

 

Can you elaborate why you think this is a good thing? Do you believe our military is underfunded?

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2 minutes ago, Terminalxylem said:

Can you elaborate why you think this is a good thing? Do you believe our military is underfunded?

Not sure we need to spend much on military at all. The blueprint to conquer America is being played out right now. Divide us, introduce a virus and will will kill ourselves. 

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4 minutes ago, Drunken Cowboy said:

I have lived in Minnesota and spent a lot of time in western Wisconsin. I like NC too, but would have no issues with moving back to the upper Midwest. 

Fair enough. I’ve lived in NC and MI, and definitely preferred the former. But I’ll take the friendly, no-nonsense demeanor of the stereotypical Midwesterner over so-called Southern hospitality any day.

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13 hours ago, lazyike said:

I believe you will vote for Trump. If after seeing President Trump retweeted a ridiculous conspiracy theory suggesting VP Biden attempted to have Seal Team Six killed so they wouldn’t let us know that Osama Bin Ladin wasn’t killed and is still alive, you still can’t decide on your own he doesn’t belong in the Oval Office I can’t see how anyone here can help you decide. 

I did not see this tweet. I admit I don't follow politics every single day of my life so i miss things and I don't read about this stuff every day either.

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Just now, yak651 said:

It’s a retweet, not sure why that would explain his sharing a conspiracy theory tweet, but that’s his reasoning...

I literally laughed out loud when he said that.  That one statement shows what a complete dope he is - anybody who buys that excuse is just not a very intelligent person.

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14 minutes ago, AAABatteries said:

It’s always impressive how people want to blame anonymous people on the Internet for why they’ll have to vote for an incompetent pathological liar.

Help me out here. The origination of this post was Ghost saying there is no way he was voting for Trump and was considering voting 3rd party, so how are you making this leap? 

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13 hours ago, Leroy Hoard said:

And yet the "undecided" seem to be ok with it. If they were not, they wouldn't be undecided.

I want a President to get #### done. Would I like a Presidential President? Absolutely, but if it's a choice between one who get stuff done and one who doesn't and act's like a petulant child I'm probably opting for the one that gets stuff done. I think that's where  I was at coming into this election year. However the way he's acting is out of control and I don't know if I want that anymore. I don't know how much Biden can get done if the Repubs retain Congress.

I'm just unsure

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1 minute ago, Mr.Pack said:

I want a President to get #### done. Would I like a Presidential President? Absolutely, but if it's a choice between one who get stuff done and one who doesn't and act's like a petulant child I'm probably opting for the one that gets stuff done. I think that's where  I was at coming into this election year. However the way he's acting is out of control and I don't know if I want that anymore. I don't know how much Biden can get done if the Repubs retain Congress.

I'm just unsure

I would argue that you shouldn’t vote for someone who enriches himself at the expense of a children’s cancer charity. He doesn’t deserve your vote.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/danalexander/2017/06/06/how-donald-trump-shifted-kids-cancer-charity-money-into-his-business/

 

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2 minutes ago, Mr.Pack said:

. I don't know how much Biden can get done if the Repubs retain Congress.

Yes you do.  Look at the last 2 years of Obama’s term (6 years really if you count the split Congress and stagnation that causes now an days).  

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10 minutes ago, Mr.Pack said:

I want a President to get #### done. Would I like a Presidential President? Absolutely, but if it's a choice between one who get stuff done and one who doesn't and act's like a petulant child I'm probably opting for the one that gets stuff done. I think that's where  I was at coming into this election year. However the way he's acting is out of control and I don't know if I want that anymore. I don't know how much Biden can get done if the Repubs retain Congress.

I'm just unsure

Petulant children rarely get things done.

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33 minutes ago, Mr.Pack said:

I want a President to get #### done. Would I like a Presidential President? Absolutely, but if it's a choice between one who get stuff done and one who doesn't and act's like a petulant child I'm probably opting for the one that gets stuff done. I think that's where  I was at coming into this election year. However the way he's acting is out of control and I don't know if I want that anymore. I don't know how much Biden can get done if the Repubs retain Congress.

I'm just unsure

And that is why I think this is a great thread. I fall into the same camp. I voted for Trump in 2016, but his performance (or lack thereof) during this pandemic has completely soured me on him. I believe his empowerment of anti-maskers has contributed to the needless deaths of thousands of Americans and the prolonging of this terrible virus--bottom line.  In the same token, i won't vote for President Biden/Harris, so my wife and I are leaning third party in this election for the first time ever.

I am frankly more interested and involved in the state/local ballot issues such as Prop 113--the Popular Vote mandate. We have a hotly contested taxation of vaping products. Colorado has the close Senate battle between Gardner and Hickenlooper. Then we have the US Representative battle between an Independent Mitsch-Bush (who I think is insane) vs a very Right leaning candidate Boebert (who I think is insanely hot).

The most important thing is for people to vote. There is something for everyone in this election cycle. 

Edited by Courtjester
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Just now, Courtjester said:

And that is why I think this is a great thread. I fall into the same camp. I voted for Trump in 2016, but his performance (or lack thereof) during this pandemic has completely soured me on him. I believe his empowerment of anti-maskers have contributed to the needless deaths of thousands of Americans and the prolonging of this terrible virus--bottom line.  In the same token, i won't vote for President Biden/Harris, so my wife and I are leaning third party in this election for the first time ever.

I am frankly more interested and involved in the state/local ballot issues such as Prop 113--the Popular Vote mandate. We have a hotly contested taxation of vaping products. Colorado has the close Senate battle between Gardner and Hickenlooper. Then we have the US Representative battle between an Independent Mitsch-Bush (who I think is insane) vs a very Right leaning candidate Boebert (who I think is insanely hot).

The most important thing is for people to vote. There is something for everyone in this election cycle

I’m amazed every cycle at us having so many people that don’t vote.  I don’t get it.

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27 minutes ago, Mr.Pack said:

I want a President to get #### done. Would I like a Presidential President? Absolutely, but if it's a choice between one who get stuff done and one who doesn't and act's like a petulant child I'm probably opting for the one that gets stuff done. I think that's where  I was at coming into this election year. However the way he's acting is out of control and I don't know if I want that anymore. I don't know how much Biden can get done if the Repubs retain Congress.

I'm just unsure

it wont matter, Packie. the govt which made this President possible aint fixing itself on the people's behalf no matter who's running it. approximately the same number & kind of people will suffer or thrive. we've been played for suckers, all "consensus"es have been engineered and the stasis which allows the foxes to not only pillage but operate the henhouse is in place. i couldnt vote for Biden because he doesnt even represent his party (i was the FIRST Buttigieg guy on this board but, remember next time, he got bought off to block the leftists), only the power structure behind it. but i aint voting for the guy who embarrasses not only our nation but the human race every day. i voted Bull Moose because i vote, it was on the ballot and Teddy Roosevelt is the kinda guy we could use today. that vote matters no less than yours or the fantasy politickers who populate this forum. the game has already been decided and that will remain so til it crashes, dont kid yourself.

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Biden will at least put the interests of the country first whereas Trump constantly puts himself first. Just look at how Trump has handled the pandemic. First he brushed it off saying dems were making a big deal out of nothing. Then when it inevitably became a big deal he politicized it and divided the country over something as mundane as mask wearing. His eye was so off the ball that he himself got it and even that couldn't get him to be responsible as he's currently holding large rallies and spouting nonsense during the debate and town hall. In a way the pandemic was a chance for him to show the country how adept he was at handling a major crisis. Instead it showed him to be completely incapable. The damage done due to the lack of federal leadership will be felt for decades not to mention the unnecessary loss of life. Enough is enough.

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49 minutes ago, Mr.Pack said:

I want a President to get #### done. Would I like a Presidential President? Absolutely, but if it's a choice between one who get stuff done and one who doesn't and act's like a petulant child I'm probably opting for the one that gets stuff done. I think that's where  I was at coming into this election year. However the way he's acting is out of control and I don't know if I want that anymore. I don't know how much Biden can get done if the Repubs retain Congress.

I'm just unsure

If Biden wins there is also a good chance the dems take Congress. They seem to be at similar spots in the odds.

https://www.electionbettingodds.com

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On 10/17/2020 at 11:28 AM, Mr.Pack said:

I did not see this tweet. I admit I don't follow politics every single day of my life so i miss things and I don't read about this stuff every day either.

Thats understandable. I have xm radio in my vehicles and equipment so I spend alot of time listening to politics( probably too much) I know there are many whose lives are so busy that don't allow them to listen to the news. I am glad you have an open mind. He was challenged on this topic at his town hall meeting this week.

Edited by lazyike
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16 hours ago, lazyike said:

I believe you will vote for Trump. If after seeing President Trump retweeted a ridiculous conspiracy theory suggesting VP Biden attempted to have Seal Team Six killed so they wouldn’t let us know that Osama Bin Ladin wasn’t killed and is still alive, you still can’t decide on your own he doesn’t belong in the Oval Office I can’t see how anyone here can help you decide. 

That's a bit unfair. He could still end up voting for Jorgensen or another candidate.

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4 hours ago, Mr.Pack said:

Off the top of my head.... 

Tax cuts for businesses and lower bracket income earners

Bombing the crap out of Isis, weakening them bigly

Upping Military spending

Taking care of our Veterans

Just to name a few. I'm not happy there is no ACA replacement plan tho. While I'm glad they're dismantling it, i would really like to hear the replacement and hopefully it has an emphasis on the first A - Affordable which Obamacare never was.

 

For these two concerns, I don't think you could have gotten a better candidate from among the crowd of the initial Democratic group. As a liberal myself, one the larger drawbacks to Biden for me was his unwillingness to commit to less military spending. I also think he'll continue to persecute eliminating ISIS, I think he'd actually be better at it than Trump (for example Trump's handling of the Kurdish situation a few years ago actually strengthened ISIS - that's not a foreign policy mistake Biden would make).

Edited by Gr00vus
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6 hours ago, gianmarco said:

You are definitely not voting Trump. You are obviously against him.

You aren't sure about Biden.

The way Trump wins is if Biden doesn't get enough votes. That's what happens when you vote anyone else. Might as well not show up.

This isn't the year to place a symbolic vote, especially if you live in a state that matters. Trump needs to be overwhelmingly defeated if you are against him.

On one hand, I don't disagree. But on the other, this binary mindset is a major reason we are where are and it must die if we are to change. 

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6 hours ago, gianmarco said:

I've never once advocated not voting for a 3rd party candidate. This is the first year. Only because I've never felt someone was a danger as President like the situation we are in now.

So, no, for me, it's not every election. 

I would love to get rid of the two party system. I agree with a lot of what you wrote.

But not this year. Not this election.

Agree to disagree. 

5 hours ago, Widbil83 said:

You’re suddenly safer from being bullied on this board for being a Trump supporter than you are for being an undecided voter.  

What undecideds are getting bullied? :confused:

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45 minutes ago, tonydead said:

Really?  You dont understand that the point of WilBil's question describes many US cities right now. Wow. 

Oh, I understood his point, especially the lumping blm and antifa on the same line.  I wouldn't agree with the "many" cities, and it doesn't apply to Madison if Mr. Pack went there tonight.  But keep trying to paint the image that there are a lot of Portlands around the country.  

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15 minutes ago, jamny said:

I like when someone says me leaving the top of the ticket blank is a vote for Trump.

 

Gun to my head and I have to vote for one? I'm voting Trump.

 

Still want me to make a choice?

 

 

Totally agree. I'm voting Biden but am not trying to convince friends and family who would normally vote Republican to vote for a Democrat. I'm trying to convince them to vote third party for President or just leave that one blank. 

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27 minutes ago, jamny said:

I like when someone says me leaving the top of the ticket blank is a vote for Trump.

 

Gun to my head and I have to vote for one? I'm voting Trump.

 

Still want me to make a choice?

 

 

Not sure why I’d put a gun to your head, you seem like a nice guy (person, you may be female for all I know).  You threatening my family or something? And if so who you’re voting for is the least of my concerns at that point.  😉

Edited by dkp993
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5 hours ago, AAABatteries said:

I’m amazed every cycle at us having so many people that don’t vote.  I don’t get it.

Until this election I had little interest in politics, and didn’t want to invest the time to make an informed decision. My basic assumptions were neither party fully represented my views and behind-the-scenes money was far too influential. Fundamentally, I just couldn’t bring myself to vote for “the lesser of two evils.”

I also thought there were enough checks and balances to prevent someone truly horrendous from being elected and harming the country.

I was wrong. My POTUS selection is a no-brainer, but I’m still struggling with other positions. My wife, a registered Republican who previously voted the party line without much thought, is also having a tough time educating herself about all the candidates (at my behest.)

How much time do you guys devote to learning the platforms of all candidates on the ballot?

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I am not undecided, I will be voting Biden.

But here’s the thing, in a lot of circumstances, I would lean Republican. I just despise Trump. I despised him before he ever took office. He’s a crook, scam artist, liar, and cheater. He’s a horrible person and a terrible president. 

he doesn’t even know what it means to be president. He idolizes Kim Jong Un and idolizes Putin. He thinks being president means being king, or dictator. Listen to how he refers to entities that belong to the country, saying “My military...” or “My generals...” everything is “me” or “my” or “I”. That’s because everything he does is solely influenced by what he will get out of it. Every. Single. Thing. 

he has zero compassion. Zero empathy. Zero self awareness. Zero understanding of what it means to serve others. 

Biden may not be the perfect candidate. But Trump is a divisive influence and a global embarrassment. We have a chance to erase the mistake made 4 years ago, and take some steps back toward unity and respectability.

And that’s what my vote will be for. 

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48 minutes ago, Terminalxylem said:

Until this election I had little interest in politics, and didn’t want to invest the time to make an informed decision. My basic assumptions were neither party fully represented my views and behind-the-scenes money was far too influential. Fundamentally, I just couldn’t bring myself to vote for “the lesser of two evils.”

I also thought there were enough checks and balances to prevent someone truly horrendous from being elected and harming the country.

I was wrong. My POTUS selection is a no-brainer, but I’m still struggling with other positions. My wife, a registered Republican who previously voted the party line without much thought, is also having a tough time educating herself about all the candidates (at my behest.)

How much time do you guys devote to learning the platforms of all candidates on the ballot?

Usually quite a bit. This year? None. The republican party needs reformed and the only way that may happen is if they get blown out. 

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7 hours ago, Mr.Pack said:

 

On 10/16/2020 at 1:55 PM, BobbyLayne said:

I have missed Friday threads. Good effort.

Thanks for stopping by. There's got to be a Biden rally somewhere out there for you

If only I was back home in west Michigan; two Trump rallies in Muskegon the last week. Only 20 miles from my hometown. Trump hasn’t held a rally that close to his hometown in 5 years. I’d go, who doesn’t love a good spectacle.

There’s been 8K Covid-19 cases reported in WI the last two days (record # reported both days.) There are outbreaks even in rural areas. Is that influencing your thinking even a little bit?

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7 hours ago, Drunken Cowboy said:
7 hours ago, Terminalxylem said:

Like I said, I’ve never been, but if it’s like much of the rest of the upper Midwest (read, terrible weather and geography) I’d be hard pressed to find an excuse to visit. You like it better than NC?

I have lived in Minnesota and spent a lot of time in western Wisconsin. I like NC too, but would have no issues with moving back to the upper Midwest. 

Beautiful states, as is Michigan. Great boating, fishing, golf, hunting, skiing, snowmobiling. Amazing natural beauty and the best people in the world.

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