Judge Smails
Footballguy
Doesn’t make him terrible. Strong word. Blake Bortles last year was terrible. Couldn’t throw a spiral
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QB Jameis Winston, NO (7 Viewers)
- Thread starter massraider
- Start date
Foosball God
Foos
Judge Smails
Footballguy
So who would you bring in if you don’t sign him? Cam? Eli? Joe is gone first pick in the draft. Ain’t gettin him. Hurts? What’s the alternative? I’m sure Josh Rosen is available. Maybe Trubisky.
rockaction
Footballguy
Given the state of quarterbacking, you're going to have to hope to pay him a reasonable starter's salary and go from there. He's proven he's too good when he's good Jameis to not be deserving of a second contract.
He won't get max, but he'll get Cousins money.
wgoldsph
Footballguy
Herbert, fromm, Eason. Bridgwater as a bridge qb for a later round pick.
You forget cousins money was record breaking money when he signed.
All teams he had his worst weeks against.
Punxsutawney Phil
Footballguy
Yeah, if you looked at the schedule before the season it was easy to see the 2nd half was soft, and made softer due to ATL sucking. I think a second year in Arians system will work wonders for this guy like it did Carson Palmer and Peyton Manning. I don't think Jameis is as smart as Manning so I didn't expect it all to click year one for him. If they can get better outside blocking he could be a perennial pro-bowler.
Judge Smails
Footballguy
wgoldsph
Footballguy
And he threw 5int against car and 4int against No at home.
Can't win a championship with him.
ShamrockPride
Footballguy
Eh, he's going to get franchised.
I'd prefer to see them go after Cam if he were proven to look back to his old self after surgery, and he can throw a ball more than 20 yards again.
I'd prefer to see them go after Cam if he were proven to look back to his old self after surgery, and he can throw a ball more than 20 yards again.
The Big Donkey
Footballguy
No Evans, possibly no Godwin....I'm still starting him week 16. FantasyGold! Outscored Lamar!
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Punxsutawney Phil
Footballguy
We have seen pretty mediocre QBs win championships and great ones never win one. It's a team effort.wgoldsph said:
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ShamrockPride
Footballguy
Lol well luckily Tampa doesn't need to worry about those kinds of things with their bottom rung pass defense which they've had for probably nearing a decade now...
rockaction
Footballguy
With due respect, no, I didn't. I also said Foles would get Cousins-esque money because he was the best available and Cousins has set a new market. Cousins did, it's just that Jameis won't set a new market.wgoldsph said:
wgoldsph
Footballguy
As someone who's not worth respecting I take quite a bit of insult.
Does Dak reset the market this offseason? There's no one else I can remember off the top of my head who needs a new contact who's going to get paid.
A question better asked in another thread - is this year the year we finally see a qb tie their salary to the cap, considering it's bound to get a big raise with the new cba coming up?
wgoldsph
Footballguy
Those mediocre qbs were trent dilfer types. Guys who game managed. Closest gunslinger I can think of who won a superbowl was Farve and Jamis will never be that good.
Judge Smails
Footballguy
Arians offense does not call for a Trent Dilfer game manager. Plenty of QBs who threw lots of picks won SuperBowls in their careers. Peyton, Big Ben, etc. Regardless, he’s a starter in the NFL and will get paid based on how he’s finishing this year. Like it or not.
wgoldsph
Footballguy
You know, I went through the numbers... Peyton threw a lot more picks then I thought. His first four years - at least stats wise - look a lot like Jamis. Problem with that comp is the difference in era.
You're right though, someone is going to sign Jamis as their starter. It'll probably be Tampa. And it's pretty clear I don't like it.
Capella
Footballguy
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wgoldsph
Footballguy
There's four non-burrows rookies I like better in the draft, and a Bridgewater 2021 rookie combo also works.
Capella
Footballguy
Ok well it’s not going to happen. You don’t toss qbs putting these numbers aside in the hope it might get marginally better 3 years from now. That’s ridiculous.
wgoldsph
Footballguy
Judge Smails
Footballguy
Nobody's ever thrown for more than 450 yards in back to back games, let alone playoffs. In my league (6 point TD league, -2 for interceptions) he's got me 47 and 45 points the past two weeks. Huge.
Joe Summer
Footballguy
Anyone remember Billy Volek in 2004?
Week 14: 426 yards, 4 TDs
Week 15: 492 yards, 4 TDs
Of course, if you do remember those two weeks, then you probably also remember that he only threw for 111 yards (with 2 INTs) in Week 16.
Week 14: 426 yards, 4 TDs
Week 15: 492 yards, 4 TDs
Of course, if you do remember those two weeks, then you probably also remember that he only threw for 111 yards (with 2 INTs) in Week 16.
Grahamburn
Footballguy
Grahamburn
Footballguy
No Evans. Probably no Godwin. No Scotty Miller. Line is in shambles.
I’d start the Hell out of him. He’s making Breshad Perriman relevant. BRESHAD PERRIMAN!
Punxsutawney Phil
Footballguy
ShamrockPride
Footballguy
Wrong, but thanks. He's a great leader. There's plenty to dislike about his past, but that's for other to decide. I'm not even discussing that here. He's too careless with the football. End of story. He's averaging a pick a game for his career. He's averaging 10 fumbles a season for his career. That's 26 INTs/fumbles per season. That's not acceptable at all. And spare me the it'll improve stuff. He's 5 full years in. He is who he is. Mechanics can change, even work ethic can change. Know what can't change? Mentality and a guy's natural instincts. Jameis just doesn't have them when it comes to ball security.
Capella
Footballguy
The franchise is 7-7 and somewhat good for the first time in years. They haven’t made the playoffs since 2007. You don’t kick the can down the road another 3 years. Try selling that to an owner trying to sell tickets. What you’re saying just isn’t realistic in the real world.
rockaction
Footballguy
Mariota, Dak, and Winston, Dalton, Bridgewater, Tannehill, and somebody of note I'm forgetting all go into the pool, but those none of those guys should reset the market and it seems likely that the pitch will be exactly what you said about trying -- note that they'll try -- to tie the salary to the salary cap. I think Cousins is now the market and you negotiate around that guarantee.
zamboni
Footballguy
rockaction
Footballguy
I think we'll find out whether Arians thinks he can. So far, publicly and with no reason to do so, Arians has really backed the guy in some seemingly indefensible situations. I said upthread this may be a case of Arians's ego thinking he can fix anything (I don't know of any source indicating this is the case) or Arians really believes in the guy. Either way, Tampa has been an exciting team to watch under Koetter and then Arians/Leftwich the past two years.
Nice talent.
One of the few teams that an All-22 would be cool for.
Grahamburn
Footballguy
I don't know why Cam would be your guy then? He hasn't been that much better in the turnover department (108 INTs and 55 fumbles in 124 games). He also isn't even in the same universe with Winston as a passer. Especially now, and if he can't run we've seen how worthless he is.
Judge Smails
Footballguy
I’ve lived and died with every snap from him this year. I do think he’s showing improvement. He threw balls away yesterday or took sacks of needed. He’s worse with picks with Evans in there because he feels compelled to get him the ball, even in jump ball situations. Evans didn’t help him in those.
He’s good at 1:1 coverage reads and man can he make every throw with accuracy. Unlike Josh Allen wildly missing 12 yard down and outs. Winston doesn’t do that. Where he struggles is zone coverage and short throws over the middle. Completes plenty of them, but will miss linebackers baiting him from the weak side. Needs to clean that up. Arians thinks he’ll clean that up in year 2 of his offense.
He’s good at 1:1 coverage reads and man can he make every throw with accuracy. Unlike Josh Allen wildly missing 12 yard down and outs. Winston doesn’t do that. Where he struggles is zone coverage and short throws over the middle. Completes plenty of them, but will miss linebackers baiting him from the weak side. Needs to clean that up. Arians thinks he’ll clean that up in year 2 of his offense.
Foosball God
Foos
I don't think he is a guy to build around, but agree there isn't a lot of options out there. They could certainly do worse, but if I were them I'd be buying on a QB in pretty much every draft in the mid rounds. Comparing Winston to Payton in their first few years is a bit disingenuous imo. Maybe you compare him to a guy like Stafford, but I personally don't think the guy is going to stop throwing boatloads of interceptions, it's just who he is. Bridge deal is the way to go for them, maybe a 5 year contract with some easy ways to get out after year 2. If Winston isn't willing to take that kind of deal then I think it would be foolish for Tampa to overpay. There may not be great options out there, but there are other ones.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
all i have to say is one more big week please
Alex P Keaton
Footballguy
Easy call. Winston doesn’t have anyone left to throw to. Watson does - and he can run if needed. Tampa’s pass defense is abysmal.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
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If I make it out of this week I just need 1 more good week from him. Without Evans he put up great numbers but I am worried that Godwin will be out because the injury looked bad.
Alex Keaton is right that Watson over him is an easy call but he might be my best option if i make the finals because the only other QB that I could probably start is Trubisky against the Chiefs.
Alex Keaton is right that Watson over him is an easy call but he might be my best option if i make the finals because the only other QB that I could probably start is Trubisky against the Chiefs.
One
Not Allowed In Mexico
I look at this as I'm starting Winston/Arians. The volume will be there. Expect a fire fight between TB and Houston.
Judge Smails
Footballguy
I own Winston and would probably take Watson. Can’t run on the Bucs so Watson should burn them with Hopkins and Fuller. Jameis will chuck it but it will be harder without premium weapons. Still possible with Perriman, Watson, Howard and Brate but will have to be efficient. Both teams should throw a ton
wgoldsph
Footballguy
I do, he won me my fantasy playoffs
Much higher upside
What sells more tickets than "first round rookie qb!" to a team that still isn't making the playoffs
Also can I note how Wilson admits to groping an Uber driver and that hasnt come up once? Because it really should.
Judge Smails
Footballguy
Sounds like if he threw less picks you would overlook the Uber incident. First you’ve brought it up. Out of on the field or market arguments?
Capella
Footballguy
Whoa that came out of left field. Running out of argument already huh. Nobody is comparing the guy to Jesus.
Cowboysfan8
Footballguy
wgoldsph
Footballguy
Just saw a Kaepernick thread is all. Personally I'm a play ball kind of guy, just making a casual observance as to what is and is not okay when it comes to non-football conduct.
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