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2018-19 NBA Thread: Magic Johnson leaves Lakers in order to pursue other jobs to be completely terrible at (6 Viewers)

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trader jake said:
The Sixers need to move Fultz.  The addition of Butler makes Philly a win now team for the next 3 seasons and they can't be hand-holding a kid in need of...whatever Fultz needs.

Hanlen has a great reputation and that report is a really poor sign for Fultz.  I've generally given him the benefit of the doubt - until now.  It's one thing to be eating cheese fries in Vegas during Summer league rather than getting in some run, but the recent footage of him shooting combined with that Hanlen report are huge, huge red flags.

Time to sell Fultz to some lottery bound team for shooting before the market drop league wide occurs.  Somebody is always buying hope and talent out there.  It's time for Elton Brand to find them and maximize the Fultz sunk cost.
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y first two red flags on Fultz was a kid who was all state on the East Coast went to a West coast school (Hardly ever happens in Basekeball) and part of it we found out wy in the FBI NCAA investigation of payment to recruits. The next was the fact after he left Washington played and looked a lot better. I have a cousin who lives out there and he was already concerned about the Sixers interest in Fultz before the draft. Now add in this and the dude is done. He's cooked like a turkey damaged goods. Maybe they can move him to another team and get a second or some used Jock straps and let him start new and see if he figures it out. Him staying in Philly does him or the Club no good. 

 
General Malaise said:
Better NBA career:

Fultz

Anthony Bennett

Derrick Williams 

Hasheen Thabeet

Omer Asik
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He had a few good yrs with the Bulls. His issue was an injury nerve issue or he'd still be playing. SO I don't know if it's fair to lump him in here. Its like a BS article I saw the other day where they talked about NFL Biggest draft busts. One was Tebow who I feel doesn't deserve it because he was way over drafted and not even hyped to go as high as he was, another was Kevin Kolb who was out of Football do to concussion and there was another one do to injury. I feel it's unfair to lump guys in there like that It's like asking someone who had the better NBA Career in the guys listed and putting Brandon Roy in there. 

 
Capella said:
Seems like the warning signs were there when his team went something like 6-36 in a god awful season for the PAC-10. I don’t want to be all Bill Simmonsy here but I think you want your top pick to win more than 6 games in a train wreck of a conference. 
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Then the next year after he leaves the team improved win wise. On the old board I was on a poster who watches a lot of PAC games mentioned this. A lot of the people blew him on it 

 
modogg said:
i think from a league perspective, it will be enjoyable to watch. If everything turns out to work great it will be enjoyable to watch. If it goes south, it will probably be more entertaining, because i am positive Embiid, and Simmons too, won't shy away from confronting Jimmy if it gets heated. No matter who came in, the team is Embiid's and Simmons's (likely Embiid if we need one, but both are so key. that injury to Embiid last year where Simmons stepped up in that winning streak was a nice spot for Ben).

I just know it won't be quiet, or things will be swept under the rug if there are issues. Philly sports media won't help either if there is a whisper of discontentment, they will love to stir the pot to get a quote
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No offense but Ben seems way to soft to into someone. Ben seems like the type of guy Jimmy goes after first. Joel I agree with you and JJ won't be far behind because he can never miss out on a chance acting tougher then he is and complain. Definitely could see Amir in there with them as well. 

 
trader jake said:
That's probably overstated in today's game.  Another example - Ben Simmons' LSU team missed the tournament and he looked uninterested a majority of the time (if anything, that's an understatement).  He also seemed suspect on defense.  Despite the obvious issues with his outside shot, Simmons has been a stud on both sides of the court in the NBA without leading his college team to many victories.

MMQB pick for Philly is clearly Jason Tatum, but at the time 99% of NBA pundits were saying Fultz was the pick at #1 regardless of which team won the lottery.  The overall universal agreement on that can't be understated.

Also, Washington was a really rough watch during Fultz's season.  They would always play two non-shooting bigs that just mucked up everything on offense and were slow to move on D.  Fultz had to pull some moves out of his backside to facilitate open looks in that scheme (his dribble spins were especially ridiculous).  His effort on defense was garbage, but that's not why his NBA future is so muddled right now.
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Ben's nightly plus minus says otherwise plus I think Philly's defense hides a lot of Ben's defensive flaws. He's always playing against PG and not banging around with the bigs who absolutely swallowed him uo

I guess I'm in the minority who thought Tatum was the clear #1. I was never sold on Fultz at all. 

On the 3rd point after Fultz left Washington actually improved. I didn't watch them so what I got was from a cousin out there who had concerns about Fultz already and from a guy  talked to on another forum who follows the PAC religiously. I don't know if they changed the personal more or what but people said they looked greatly improved without Fultz. 

 
tjnc09 said:
Ben Simmons was also a 6'10" player with decent guard skills and did other things that translate well to NBA success like 11.8 rpg.

Fultz is a 6'4" guard who put ~20 ppg in a conference full of weaker defenses.  Guys like that are a dime a dozen, certainly not athletically or physically gifted enough to warrant a first overall pick.

It goes to show even guys who do this for a career swing and miss, but him being consensus #1 was always bizarre to me 
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I always had my issues with Ben but they were never oh he wouldn't be a good NBA player. I just never bought he's the next LeBron hype. I think he's more of a Rudy Gay good. He's good enough to warrant playing but someone will overpay him based on that drummed up LeBron potential. For me yeah he stuffs the stat sheet nightly but doesn't score enough to my liking and I think the 76ers defense helps hide some weaknesses. This is not saying Ben Simmons sucks as a player by any means. HE SHOULD BE AN NBA PLAYER. I just think theres people who overrate him incredible similar to how I think a lot of people overrate Cam Newton as a QB. 

Yeah Fultz always had the bigger warning signs. I just never bought into it or saw how they could even say that about him but it does show you the professionals swing and miss too. 

 
DJackson10 said:
On the 3rd point after Fultz left Washington actually improved. I didn't watch them so what I got was from a cousin out there who had concerns about Fultz already and from a guy  talked to on another forum who follows the PAC religiously. I don't know if they changed the personal more or what but people said they looked greatly improved without Fultz. 
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That's because they finally got rid of Romar.

 
DJackson10 said:
I always had my issues with Ben but they were never oh he wouldn't be a good NBA player. I just never bought he's the next LeBron hype. I think he's more of a Rudy Gay good. He's good enough to warrant playing but someone will overpay him based on that drummed up LeBron potential. For me yeah he stuffs the stat sheet nightly but doesn't score enough to my liking and I think the 76ers defense helps hide some weaknesses. This is not saying Ben Simmons sucks as a player by any means. HE SHOULD BE AN NBA PLAYER. I just think theres people who overrate him incredible similar to how I think a lot of people overrate Cam Newton as a QB. 

Yeah Fultz always had the bigger warning signs. I just never bought into it or saw how they could even say that about him but it does show you the professionals swing and miss too. 
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Cam Newton won an MVP.  Ben Simmons is already better than Rudy Gay's best dream.  

 
Frostillicus said:
Cam Newton won an MVP.  Ben Simmons is already better than Rudy Gay's best dream.  
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Cam Newtons defense won him the MVP plus get back to me when Cam finally dives for a football in the SB. That Year Kaepernick was benched and Cam won the MVP their numbers through the same games were almost similar. Throw Ck on the Carolina team and Cam on SF and people are questioning Cam being benched. Cam just went off and had a Madden like 2nd half similar to what Vick first half of I believe the 2012 season for the Eagles was before he fell back down to earth. Look all I'm saying is things can be deceiving. in the NFL it's always the QB for the record wise. Cam had a tremendous team around him that year that helped get him out of his slow start. Kaepernick that year had no talent to pick him up defensively. And I'm not a CK fan at all and think he should be out of the league. Just saying I don't think people realize how similar their stats are because people were so jaded by their record. I don't want to junk up an NBA thread though with this discussion Simple putting this comparison there for you 

Cam Newton Vs Colin Kapernick stats wise

 
DJackson10 said:
Cam Newtons defense won him the MVP plus get back to me when Cam finally dives for a football in the SB. That Year Kaepernick was benched and Cam won the MVP their numbers through the same games were almost similar. Throw Ck on the Carolina team and Cam on SF and people are questioning Cam being benched. Cam just went off and had a Madden like 2nd half similar to what Vick first half of I believe the 2012 season for the Eagles was before he fell back down to earth. Look all I'm saying is things can be deceiving. in the NFL it's always the QB for the record wise. Cam had a tremendous team around him that year that helped get him out of his slow start. Kaepernick that year had no talent to pick him up defensively. And I'm not a CK fan at all and think he should be out of the league. Just saying I don't think people realize how similar their stats are because people were so jaded by their record. I don't want to junk up an NBA thread though with this discussion Simple putting this comparison there for you 

Cam Newton Vs Colin Kapernick stats wise
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2010 Eagles. 2012 was the 4-12 team that quit on Andy.

 
DJackson10 said:
Cam Newtons defense won him the MVP plus get back to me when Cam finally dives for a football in the SB. That Year Kaepernick was benched and Cam won the MVP their numbers through the same games were almost similar. Throw Ck on the Carolina team and Cam on SF and people are questioning Cam being benched. Cam just went off and had a Madden like 2nd half similar to what Vick first half of I believe the 2012 season for the Eagles was before he fell back down to earth. Look all I'm saying is things can be deceiving. in the NFL it's always the QB for the record wise. Cam had a tremendous team around him that year that helped get him out of his slow start. Kaepernick that year had no talent to pick him up defensively. And I'm not a CK fan at all and think he should be out of the league. Just saying I don't think people realize how similar their stats are because people were so jaded by their record. I don't want to junk up an NBA thread though with this discussion Simple putting this comparison there for you 

Cam Newton Vs Colin Kapernick stats wise
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Come on, man.  Cam was awesome in 2015.  And you're going to have to back up why Colin Kaepernick shouldn't be in the league. 

 
Is this the World Cup, Lebron is flopping left and right out there.  Then he acts out the supposed injury afterward, holding his slightly grazed forehead.  Good lord.  He whined so much they handed out a flagrant the next time he was fouled.  The limp went away after the free throws, weird.

As he passes Wilt Chamberlain in all-time scoring.  Wilt could've used these rules, along with the 3 steps.

 
Frostillicus said:
Come on, man.  Cam was awesome in 2015.  And you're going to have to back up why Colin Kaepernick shouldn't be in the league. 
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Carolina played the easiest schedule in the league that year.  We saw what he did when he faced the #1 defense (hint: nothing)

Kaepernick is terrible.  He was blessed to play on a team already built for the SB.

 
The Kansas Comet said:
He was an absolute beast.  They needed to bring 2x4's to try to stop him last night.  It was also good to see signs of life from Caldwell-Pope.  
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I liked some of the stuff Lonzo was doing even though he didn't pull all of it off. Uptick in the aggression on his part, was good to see.

Seems like Chandler and James have established a pretty solid bond. That pick up could be a big plus for the Lakers this year.

 
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General Malaise said:
How'd they do before and after him?  Watch his playoff game victory over Green Bay where he SET RECORDS and tell me how terrible he was. 
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Green Bay's defense against the run was one of the worst in that year.  

What are you talking about before and after him?  They were two Kyle Williams fumbles away from the SB the year before.  They were as good as the Giants and probably would have beat the Patriots.

Kaepernick was 1-10 as a starter in 2016 and SF won more games in 2017.   :lmao:   :lmao:   :lmao:

 
Frostillicus said:
Awesome recruiter.  Terrible coach.  IMO.
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He turned Pepperdine around in 3 years, took St. Louis to the dance in his first year and he launched the career of Randy Bennett, who has been very successful at St. Mary's (another moribund WCC school prior to that hire).  He had some big failures at UW, most notably the dismal performance as a #1 seed, but the guy is not a terrible coach. 

 
General Malaise said:
He turned Pepperdine around in 3 years, took St. Louis to the dance in his first year and he launched the career of Randy Bennett, who has been very successful at St. Mary's (another moribund WCC school prior to that hire).  He had some big failures at UW, most notably the dismal performance as a #1 seed, but the guy is not a terrible coach. 
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Ok fine, Mrs. Romar.

 
tjnc09 said:
Green Bay's defense against the run was one of the worst in that year.  

What are you talking about before and after him?  They were two Kyle Williams fumbles away from the SB the year before.  They were as good as the Giants and probably would have beat the Patriots.

Kaepernick was 1-10 as a starter in 2016 and SF won more games in 2017.   :lmao:   :lmao:   :lmao:
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San Francisco was boring under Alex Smith and they were happy to move him to KC.  Kaep elevated that team and nearly won them a Super Bowl.  You can blame him for their failures after Harbaugh left, but I think the bigger problem was the collapse of their defense and no direction under Jim Tomsula (one of the worst coaching hires in the history of football...this was Rich Kotitian level bad).  

He put up good numbers his last year in San Francisco too.  He didn't play defense for them.  16 TD vs 4 INT.  :shrug:

 
General Malaise said:
San Francisco was boring under Alex Smith and they were happy to move him to KC.  Kaep elevated that team and nearly won them a Super Bowl.  You can blame him for their failures after Harbaugh left, but I think the bigger problem was the collapse of their defense and no direction under Jim Tomsula (one of the worst coaching hires in the history of football...this was Rich Kotitian level bad).  

He put up good numbers his last year in San Francisco too.  He didn't play defense for them.  16 TD vs 4 INT.  :shrug:
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:lmao:  When the 49ers built a SB caliber team with the #1 OL, top 5 rushing game, top 5 defense, a legit receiving core and being two plays away from the SB the year before, Kaepernick gets credit as the reason they almost won a SB.  

When the 49ers sucked, it wasn't his fault because the defense and coaching were bad.

I swear people who continue to defend Kaepernick don't watch football.

 
tjnc09 said:
:lmao:  When the 49ers built a SB caliber team with the #1 OL, top 5 rushing game, top 5 defense, a legit receiving core and being two plays away from the SB the year before, Kaepernick gets credit as the reason they almost won a SB.  

When the 49ers sucked, it wasn't his fault because the defense and coaching were bad.

I swear people who continue to defend Kaepernick don't watch football.
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Look, there's an entire thread devoted to Kaepernick we can pollute.  I think he's a good QB.  You don't.  You want to resort to insults, I don't.   You can probably find dance partners willing to do so in that thread, though.

 
tjnc09 said:
I don't think anyone looked like a clear #1 in that class.  Trade the picks and wait until someone like Zion comes along.
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:lmao:   Oooooooooooh, savvy!  Why hasn't anyone thought of this before?  And why aren't you a NBA GM with this type of 4D chess logic?!

 
DJackson10 said:
Cam Newtons defense won him the MVP plus get back to me when Cam finally dives for a football in the SB. That Year Kaepernick was benched and Cam won the MVP their numbers through the same games were almost similar. Throw Ck on the Carolina team and Cam on SF and people are questioning Cam being benched. Cam just went off and had a Madden like 2nd half similar to what Vick first half of I believe the 2012 season for the Eagles was before he fell back down to earth. Look all I'm saying is things can be deceiving. in the NFL it's always the QB for the record wise. Cam had a tremendous team around him that year that helped get him out of his slow start. Kaepernick that year had no talent to pick him up defensively. And I'm not a CK fan at all and think he should be out of the league. Just saying I don't think people realize how similar their stats are because people were so jaded by their record. I don't want to junk up an NBA thread though with this discussion Simple putting this comparison there for you 

Cam Newton Vs Colin Kapernick stats wise
Click to expand...
:lmao:

Lead the league in points scored with Ginn as his WR1 and rookie Funchess.  Defense was ranked 6th, Seattle 1st.  

 
General Malaise said:
Look, there's an entire thread devoted to Kaepernick we can pollute.  I think he's a good QB.  You don't.  You want to resort to insults, I don't.   You can probably find dance partners willing to do so in that thread, though.
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No thanks.  I've already tried logic in that other thread and the delusion is even more frightening.  He's not a good QB and people only want to pretend he is so he can live on as some type of martyr.

 
coyote5 said:
:lmao:   Oooooooooooh, savvy!  Why hasn't anyone thought of this before?  And why aren't you a NBA GM with this type of 4D chess logic?!
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With all of the media available on high school talent now, it shouldn't be "chess logic".   He has been in the news for years now.  How many 6'7" 285 guys with an NCAA football father and sprinter mother that move like him will come around?

I'm specifically talking about #1 picks.  How many players come around truly worth that pick?  One every four or five years?  

 
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tjnc09 said:
With all of the media available on high school talent now, it shouldn't be "chess logic".   He has been in the news for years now.  How many 6'7" 285 guys with an NCAA football father and sprinter mother that move like him will come around?

I'm specifically talking about #1 picks.  How many players come around truly worth that pick?  One every four or five years?  
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You're going to have to go ahead and explain to me how you can just keep trading your #1 pick for a future overall #1 pick down the road when the next LeBron comes along, given that:

1:  There is a draft lottery so you have no reasonable way to identify who to trade with to acquire the future #1 overall, and

2:  No team is trading their #1 overall pick when the next LeBron is in that draft. 

 
coyote5 said:
You're going to have to go ahead and explain to me how you can just keep trading your #1 pick for a future overall #1 pick down the road when the next LeBron comes along, given that:

1:  There is a draft lottery so you have no reasonable way to identify who to trade with to acquire the future #1 overall, and

2:  No team is trading their #1 overall pick when the next LeBron is in that draft. 
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There are a lot of terrible GMs in the league.  How many draft picks did the Celtics fleece from other teams?  The Cavs had LeBron, three #1 picks and two #4 picks in four years and barely won one championship.

It's no guarantee a team will trade their pick ensuring the next LeBron, but if you offer 3-4 really high picks for it, it won't be an instantaneous rejection, that's for sure.

 
tjnc09 said:
There are a lot of terrible GMs in the league.  How many draft picks did the Celtics fleece from other teams?  The Cavs had LeBron, three #1 picks and two #4 picks in four years and barely won one championship.

It's no guarantee a team will trade their pick ensuring the next LeBron, but if you offer 3-4 really high picks for it, it won't be an instantaneous rejection, that's for sure.
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Ya, you've already told us how you're better than most of them.  Coyote's post is relevant.  Philly wasn't trading the #3 pick this year for a future #1 pick that chances are doesn't even have the top pick.  The chances of someone trading for someone's NEXT year top pick is as close to impossible as it gets in sports.  At the time it was a good pick according to the best, most experienced scouts in the game.  Don't be hindsight guy.  No one likes hindsight guy.

 
Deamon said:
Ya, you've already told us how you're better than most of them.  Coyote's post is relevant.  Philly wasn't trading the #3 pick this year for a future #1 pick that chances are doesn't even have the top pick.  The chances of someone trading for someone's NEXT year top pick is as close to impossible as it gets in sports.  At the time it was a good pick according to the best, most experienced scouts in the game.  Don't be hindsight guy.  No one likes hindsight guy.
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I think most people had Fultz as the #1 pick that year. But he was not a game changer selection. And trading up to get a guy like that was not a good move. 

 
Leeroy Jenkins said:
I think most people had Fultz as the #1 pick that year. But he was not a game changer selection. And trading up to get a guy like that was not a good move. 
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Fully agree.  He was the right pick given that we moved up to #1.  Moving up to #1 costed us Sacramento's 1st rounder next year though.  Which might not even be top 10 at this point.

 
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