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2015 Oakland Raiders Thread (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Raiderfan32904
- Start date
massraider
Footballguy
DE and WR are both needs. I don't really have any problem with a DE at #4, and I could make a pretty good argument that DE is in much worse shape than WR, and is a more pressing need.
msommer
Footballguy
massraider
Footballguy
I was looking at that, specifically the DEs that could be available to us.
Going by the consensus, which is dangerous, it seems like the DEs that may be available to us that we should be looking at are Preston Smith and Oawamagbe Odighizuwa. Both are probably considered 4-3 base ends, strong side types, which we can use.
I may post some links later, but Matt Waldman did a full game scouting report on Odighizuwa on Youtube that's pretty awesome. If I thought we could get this guy in the 2nd, I would LOVE Cooper at #4.
Hankmoody
Footballguy
I'd much rather Fowler in the 1st and a guy like Nelson Algohor or Devin Smith in the 2nd, Lockett/Greene in the 3rd (or both). The best way to improve 4 guys in the secondary is to get 1 beastly pass rusher. One move makes the entire pass defense better. If Carr is the man he will make the WR's better. I am of the mind this WR corp is better than people are expecting. If Carr makes strides this won't be an area of weakness.
Chaka
Footballguy
The WR corps is the biggest weakness on the team and it doesn't seem to be close. People can talk up Streater and Holmes as much as they want but neither of them are a legitimate #1 WR in the NFL, heck they weren't legitimate #1 WRs in college (fine Holmes had 100+ receptions and 11 TDs in the GLIAC. GO CHARGERS!!!) However I agree with you about Carr, he can do a lot to make them better. Although if they go defense at 1.4 they definitely need a 2nd or 3rd round WR to make it easier for him.
massraider
Footballguy
You wanna fill that RG spot with a mid-rounder, check out this dude:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQOWX2mv2AU
Shaq Mason. About a minute in, he blows Denzel Perryman off his feet, onto his back.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQOWX2mv2AU
Shaq Mason. About a minute in, he blows Denzel Perryman off his feet, onto his back.
Raiderfan32904
Footballguy
[SIZE=small]ROBERT MYERS | Tennessee[/SIZE] State 6046|326 lbs|5SR LaVergne, Tenn. (LaVergne HS) 12/26/1991 (age 23) #70
[SIZE=small]2010: Redshirted GRADE[/SIZE] 6th-7th Round
[SIZE=small]2011: (10/1) 1 RT MEASUREABLES[/SIZE] Arm: 33 3/4 | Hand: 09 1/2 | Wingspan: 80 5/8
[SIZE=small]2012: (10/8) 8 RT COMBINE[/SIZE] 40-YD: 5.44 | 10-YD: 1.82 | 20-YD: 3.10 | VJ: 27 1/2 | BJ: 07’10” | SS: 4.91 | 3C: 8.10
[SIZE=small]2013: (14/14) 14 RT [/SIZE]PRO DAY VJ: 26 1/2 | BJ: 07’06”
[SIZE=small]2014: (12/12) 10 RG,[/SIZE] 2 RT
[SIZE=small]Total (46/35) 25 RT, 10 RG[/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]BACKGROUND: A no-star offensive[/SIZE] line recruit out of high school, Myers had limited options out of the prep ranks and enrolled at Tennessee State, redshirting in 2010. He spent the 2011 season as a reserve, but did earn his first start at right tackle. Myers started eight games as a sophomore in 2012 before becoming the full- time starter there as a junior, starting all 14 games in 2013. He started the 2014 season at right tackle before moving inside to right guard and was the only offensive player to start every game for the Tigers, earning Second Team All-OVC honors. Myers earned an invitation to the 2015 Senior Bowl.
[SIZE=small]STRENGTHS: Possesses NFL size with[/SIZE] well-proportioned bulk, stock thighs and adequate arm length – engulfing wingspan…naturally wide base to cover a large area and anchor at the point of attack…good set-up quickness, sinking his hips with flexibility to absorb contact…uses his reach to meet defenders when he uses correct placement…uses his lower body and hips to plant-and-drive, moving bodies as a run blocker…looks to punish his target with a nasty streak…works hard to sustain with a raw understanding of blocking combinations…charismatic with a positive attitude…versatile experience starting double-digit games at both right tackle (25) and right guard (10).
[SIZE=small]WEAKNESSES: Heavy mover and struggles to mirror in space and adjust [/SIZE]to counters, especially inside moves, causing his feet to be tied up…inconsistent balance and ends up on the ground too much…powerful punch, but catches too much and needs to keep his elbow and hands inside…struggles to land and sustain initial block due to poor timing with limbs, allowing rushers to attack his body and knock him off his feet – needs target practice…raw instincts and needs to develop his recognition skills…tends to fatigue throughout four quarters and conditioning needs monitored…limited mobility and struggles when trying to go inside out against linebackers…all of his experience has come at the FCS-level and faces a substantial jump in competition at the next level…minor durability concerns – couldn’t lift during the pre-draft process due to a pectoral injury.
[SIZE=small]SUMMARY: A three-year starter,[/SIZE] Myers, nicknamed “Snacks,” didn’t play football until his junior year in high school and had only one scholarship offer, but showed consistent improvement over his Tennessee State career, although he is still raw in areas, which showed at the Senior Bowl. He has the upper body power to punch and control with his limbs, but can also be a turnstile when he doesn’t use his hands correctly. Despite most of his experience coming at tackle, Myers is better suited for guard at the next level and has the make-up to develop into a quality player if he focuses on the details – late round prospect.
[SIZE=small]2010: Redshirted GRADE[/SIZE] 6th-7th Round
[SIZE=small]2011: (10/1) 1 RT MEASUREABLES[/SIZE] Arm: 33 3/4 | Hand: 09 1/2 | Wingspan: 80 5/8
[SIZE=small]2012: (10/8) 8 RT COMBINE[/SIZE] 40-YD: 5.44 | 10-YD: 1.82 | 20-YD: 3.10 | VJ: 27 1/2 | BJ: 07’10” | SS: 4.91 | 3C: 8.10
[SIZE=small]2013: (14/14) 14 RT [/SIZE]PRO DAY VJ: 26 1/2 | BJ: 07’06”
[SIZE=small]2014: (12/12) 10 RG,[/SIZE] 2 RT
[SIZE=small]Total (46/35) 25 RT, 10 RG[/SIZE]
[SIZE=small]BACKGROUND: A no-star offensive[/SIZE] line recruit out of high school, Myers had limited options out of the prep ranks and enrolled at Tennessee State, redshirting in 2010. He spent the 2011 season as a reserve, but did earn his first start at right tackle. Myers started eight games as a sophomore in 2012 before becoming the full- time starter there as a junior, starting all 14 games in 2013. He started the 2014 season at right tackle before moving inside to right guard and was the only offensive player to start every game for the Tigers, earning Second Team All-OVC honors. Myers earned an invitation to the 2015 Senior Bowl.
[SIZE=small]STRENGTHS: Possesses NFL size with[/SIZE] well-proportioned bulk, stock thighs and adequate arm length – engulfing wingspan…naturally wide base to cover a large area and anchor at the point of attack…good set-up quickness, sinking his hips with flexibility to absorb contact…uses his reach to meet defenders when he uses correct placement…uses his lower body and hips to plant-and-drive, moving bodies as a run blocker…looks to punish his target with a nasty streak…works hard to sustain with a raw understanding of blocking combinations…charismatic with a positive attitude…versatile experience starting double-digit games at both right tackle (25) and right guard (10).
[SIZE=small]WEAKNESSES: Heavy mover and struggles to mirror in space and adjust [/SIZE]to counters, especially inside moves, causing his feet to be tied up…inconsistent balance and ends up on the ground too much…powerful punch, but catches too much and needs to keep his elbow and hands inside…struggles to land and sustain initial block due to poor timing with limbs, allowing rushers to attack his body and knock him off his feet – needs target practice…raw instincts and needs to develop his recognition skills…tends to fatigue throughout four quarters and conditioning needs monitored…limited mobility and struggles when trying to go inside out against linebackers…all of his experience has come at the FCS-level and faces a substantial jump in competition at the next level…minor durability concerns – couldn’t lift during the pre-draft process due to a pectoral injury.
[SIZE=small]SUMMARY: A three-year starter,[/SIZE] Myers, nicknamed “Snacks,” didn’t play football until his junior year in high school and had only one scholarship offer, but showed consistent improvement over his Tennessee State career, although he is still raw in areas, which showed at the Senior Bowl. He has the upper body power to punch and control with his limbs, but can also be a turnstile when he doesn’t use his hands correctly. Despite most of his experience coming at tackle, Myers is better suited for guard at the next level and has the make-up to develop into a quality player if he focuses on the details – late round prospect.
Hankmoody
Footballguy
It's at least close. The D line is a joke as is the secondary. With as young-and-promising as Carrie/Hayden/McGill are, they are terrible by starting NFL standards. Nate Allen got cheered by Eagles fans - for signing with "anyone but us". I didn't say ignore the WR corp, I definitely advocate getting Carr more weapons, I'm just pointing out that there will be very strong options later, while the pass rushers go fast and the talent level drop hard. If there's a shot at an elite one, you take it.Chaka said:
massraider
Footballguy
I don't buy the talk about Miami trading up with Oakland. Especially because they are supposedly going after a WR.
Miami is at 14, not a bad spot to take BPA in this draft, but there's a good chance that the top 3 WR and all the decent edge guys are gone by then.
Only way a trade down seems possible to me is if Mariota was there, and we moved down to Jets or Bears spot, picking up a high 2nd. I figure that'd be worth it. And I don't even think that is likely, both teams look like they gonna roll with their QB for this year.
And a Miami trade up would have to be for a big deal. No discounts like 2013, where no one wanted to move up. Seems much more likely that Miami makes a smaller deal in the back half of the top 10.
Miami is at 14, not a bad spot to take BPA in this draft, but there's a good chance that the top 3 WR and all the decent edge guys are gone by then.
Only way a trade down seems possible to me is if Mariota was there, and we moved down to Jets or Bears spot, picking up a high 2nd. I figure that'd be worth it. And I don't even think that is likely, both teams look like they gonna roll with their QB for this year.
And a Miami trade up would have to be for a big deal. No discounts like 2013, where no one wanted to move up. Seems much more likely that Miami makes a smaller deal in the back half of the top 10.
massraider
Footballguy
Screwing around on Draft Breakdown, looking at WR vids. Watched DeVante Parker vs. FSU's good corners, Darby and Williams. Not blown away. Pretty happy we aren't going in that direction. Would love Darby as a slot CB, by the way.
Watching Cooper vs West Virginia.
Wanna fall in love? Go to 4:07.
Watching Cooper vs West Virginia.
Wanna fall in love? Go to 4:07.
Chaka
Footballguy
I agree that both areas need help but would argue that both the DL and the secondary have improved this offseason. Loosing Woodley and A.Smith is no big deal and adding D.Williams is unquestionably an upgrade (bringing back CJ Wilson is okay too). Throw in M.Smith and Lofton and the LB corps looks deep, which will only help the guys up front and, at worst, they are as good as last year (I say they are better). And say what you will about Nate Allen, he is better than Tyvon Branch sitting on the trainer's table. I also disagree with your assessment of Carrie & particularly Hayden (jury is out on McGill more than the other two). The offensive line is improved with Hudson and Lee Smith and Trent Richardson may suck but is he really worse than what MJD and McFadden did last year?
WR is the only position that the team has done nothing to bolster and they let D.Moore walk (V.Brown too but who cares?), which probably says more about their intentions in the draft than anything. While I would definitely take Leonard Williams ahead of any other player in the draft (just too much talent and versatility to ignore) I think for Oakland the next guy on that list has to be Amari Cooper.
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This is another draft where high potential WRs will be available for quite awhile. No rush to draft the 1 or 3 that you need. Tre or Bell in the fourth or so will do nicely. If Mariota falls to the Raiders pick it's pretty certain to be a trade down and then neither White nor Cooper should last until the Raiders figure to pick.
Sarlakticacid
Footballguy
He should be called Roller Boogie coz he is getting everyone on their skates
good interview with him on the Ross Tucker Podcast this week
Hankmoody
Footballguy
Strongly disagree. First, you can't wait until the 4th - 2nd round at the latest. I wouldn't hate Cooper at 4, would prefer DL if they are there though. It's not certain to trade down at all - someone's gotta want to come down, and must be willing to give enough to pay for the downgrade they will take.
Why would anyone trade up to Oakland's pick for Mariota? They could just trade up to the Redskins pick at 5 instead knowing Oakland won't be taking Mariota.
cstu
Footballguy
Chaka
Footballguy
Because they don't know who else the Raiders (or Washington or the Jets etc) are on the phone with.
Maybe Chip is worried that they won't be able to make a deal with division rival Washington and/or are worried that Cleveland has a better shot at making a deal with them. That makes his best shot at landing Mariota a trade with Oakland.
massraider
Footballguy
Packers matched offer sheet to Sean Richardson. We'll see how this gets spun to be a genius move by the Pack, after being called a dumb move by Oakland.
I just don't think a trade down is a possibility.... If its the Eagles that want Mariota then maybe....but any other team will just try and trade to the 5th pick.
Regardless, if we stay put I think the pick is Cooper which I am more than ok with.... He could be Tim Brown 2.0 similar size, nothing flashy just really consistent which is what Carr needs.
Regardless, if we stay put I think the pick is Cooper which I am more than ok with.... He could be Tim Brown 2.0 similar size, nothing flashy just really consistent which is what Carr needs.
One
Not Allowed In Mexico
massraider
Footballguy
Give me Cooper and Digi in the second.
Watching NFL rewind, our pass rush is Mack. That's it. He needs another guy helping him out
Watching NFL rewind, our pass rush is Mack. That's it. He needs another guy helping him out
LawFitz
Footballguy
4.3x speed, 6'1'' with decent BMI, polished route runner, elite SEC production, soft spoken team guy, gym rat.
Cordarelle Patterson is flashy. I'll take these qualities over flashy all day long.
Raiderfan32904
Footballguy
Cooper or White for me is the pick. We can't hope to develop Williams from his current status as a 2 down lineman, and the edge rushers are nice, but we can get a decent edge rusher in the 2nd round. We need to get Carr some help and the top 2 guys in this draft are primed to step onto the field as defacto #1 WR's.
RaiderBones
Footballguy
massraider
Footballguy
Leonard Williams? Or Dan?Raiderfan32904 said:
If we drafted Williams, he's not a 2 down lineman. I would guess he would play left end, across from Tuck, and slides inside on passing down, really providing value at two spots we have needs, base end, and inside pass rush. And I am not convinced he wouldn't be an effective rusher at end, I just think the best four rushers would be some combo of Mack/Tuck/Williams/Mayowa. Maybe McGee or Shelby or some rookie DT could knock Mayowa off that list, but we can't count on that.
Watching Williams play, the thing you notice is, he goes whereever he wants. Never gets shoved out of the play. He gets his hands on a lineman, gets his head up, diagnoses, then chucks the guy out of the way, and goes where he wants. There's a lot of plays where he's the last one off the ball, but that's not because his first step is slow. There's plenty of plays where he fires off first, shoots a gap, and disrupts--which I think he'll be asked to do more of in the NFL. I think he, a lot of the time, takes his time getting off the ball, because he can. He doesn't need to win with his first step. He can let the play develop, lose his blocker, and go after the ball.
I don't buy this nonsense about taking plays off. He didn't have 9.5 TFL, 7 sacks, and 80 total tackles because he was taking plays off.
As far as White and Cooper, I think the gap between Cooper and White is a lot bigger than people think. The ONLY thing you can say White can do better than Cooper, IMO, is win contested balls. And I think that might be because White doesn't get open nearly as much as Cooper. Not nearly. Cooper doesn't have a bunch of contested balls to fight for, because he left the corner grasping at air back at the line of scrimmage. Cornerbacks got their hands on White regularly, not so with Cooper.
I'd be hoping for Odighizuwa in the 2nd, but Preston Smith would make sense. Not nearly as explosive as Williams or Digi, but can play stronside end, and slide inside as well. He looks like a McKenzie pick too, 6'5", 270, big strong boy.
RaiderBones
Footballguy
Fallon Smith @FallonSmithCSN 10m10 minutes ago
Multiple sources confirm Michael Crabtree is in fact signing with the #Raiders.
Multiple sources confirm Michael Crabtree is in fact signing with the #Raiders.
massraider
Footballguy
Too many times last year, this team counting on Holmes and Moore.
Add a rookie to Crabtree_Streater_Jones_Butler_Holmes and we can't be mad at that.
I think this signing doesn't change the #4 pick at all, but might be a hedge in case we DO go Leo Williams at #4.
Pretty apparent we going defense in this draft, boys. Definitely a young WR, and maybe a G or a T late, but otherwise....defense, defense, defense.
massraider
Footballguy
Between Crabtree and Richardson, we are on pace for least popular fantasy roster ever. When does Sidney Rice get to town??
Raiderfan32904
Footballguy
LOL funny how you mention Sidney Rice. If we take Kevin White, that's pretty much him.
Raiderfan32904
Footballguy
Not a fan of this signing, regardless of "low risk" terms. Carr's a young QB who needs to command the huddle as an alpha dog. Crabtree brings his selfish antics, whining, diva attitude. More of a negative energy than anything. At least it's a one year deal.
massraider
Footballguy
Cam Inman @CamInman 4m4 minutes ago
Cam Inman retweeted Adam Caplan
He wouldn't work with new #49ers. Mutual parting, more so than Harbaugh. If healthy, positive option. Not a diva
Cam Inman retweeted Adam Caplan
He wouldn't work with new #49ers. Mutual parting, more so than Harbaugh. If healthy, positive option. Not a diva
BoltBacker
Footballguy
Do raider fans think it's as crazy as I do so many people have oak drafting a RB relatively high?
Murray/Helu/Reece seems like a strong group to me even if you got NOTHING out of Richardson(and who knows if the coin drops there). The most comical example of what I'm seeing is at draftsite.com who has oak burning an early 2nd rounder on Gurley and an early third rounder on J.Allen(USC).
I would think RB is so far down down the list of needs they couldn't possibly draft one before the 6th based on needs elsewhere, no?
Raiderfan32904
Footballguy
Anyone who has Gurley dropping to the second rd is kind of nutso. But you're right, RB is not likely I this draft. Team has many needs.
massraider
Footballguy
Agree completely. I would say 4th earliest, but that's splitting hairs. Now, if there was a trade-down, and they picked up a 3rd or something, that might change things.
I think Richardson is alot like Crabtree. Filling holes that are there. Raiders only had one back after the season. They needed two more, and got two more. I think TRich is crap, and hope some late round or UDFA back beats him out. I would like to see a RB get drafted, for sure, but not early.
I think DL and WR are the first two picks (in whatever order), and I think they'd love to get another guard, corner, and maybe a penetrating DT before a RB.
I think they want to give Carr a good running game as much as more passing weapons, and watching MJD and DMC stumble around hurt the offense more than the lack of passing weapons.
If Ajayi or someone like that was there in the 3rd, I wouldn't be mad, but that seems unlikely.
massraider
Footballguy
I'm all over Dorsett in this draft. Wonder if he can last till the 3rd. Lotta WRs in this draft.
Terrified of Perriman.
Terrified of Perriman.
massraider
Footballguy
Crabtree 2014 routes:
Screen: 11/14,52,0TD
Slant/Cross/Flat: 18/20,138,1TD
In/Out/Stop/Comeback: 34/53,350,3TD
Go/Post/Corner: 5/15,158,1TD
Crabtree 2014:
Rating on targets to him: 91.1 (52nd/90)
Yards Per Route Run: 1.47 (58th/90)
Drop Rate: 10 drops/78 catchable (80th/90)<-------------that's not good.
Screen: 11/14,52,0TD
Slant/Cross/Flat: 18/20,138,1TD
In/Out/Stop/Comeback: 34/53,350,3TD
Go/Post/Corner: 5/15,158,1TD
Crabtree 2014:
Rating on targets to him: 91.1 (52nd/90)
Yards Per Route Run: 1.47 (58th/90)
Drop Rate: 10 drops/78 catchable (80th/90)<-------------that's not good.
massraider
Footballguy
RT @AdamSchefter: Raiders are giving former 49er WR Michael Crabtree a 1-year, $3 million deal, with another $2M in incentives, per source.
joey
Footballguy
was feeling ok about this "prove it" deal until reading this post. ugh.
thanks for nothin', massraider
Raiderfan32904
Footballguy
Considering tthose terms, now it's just bitterness over his past that makes me hate him. Reggie stood on a lowball take-it-or-leave-it standing offfer and Crabtree caved. At that salary, he's like Trent Richardson, not even guaranteed a roster spot. A "prove-it" deal. If this soon to be 28 yo diva wants to continue living his diva ways, he's going to have to have to earn it. We will be getting a highly motivated player.
If he busts or becomes a locker room or practice field nuisance, Jack will send him packing STAT. If he falls out of the starting rotation, we're only out $3 million. If he has a dream season and leaves us for a big contract with another team, we got one good year at a bargain price. Maybe a comp pick?
massraider
Footballguy
Chaka
Footballguy
All it takes is for one team to want him and think that another team wants him two.
Phili wants him - Check
Cleveland seems like they want him. - Check
I don't think the Raiders will trade down either, but the pieces are there.
Chaka
Footballguy
Thank you.
He's the most versatile and dominant DL in the draft. If he's there, you take him. If he busts, he busts but it is unquestionably the right move to take him.
massraider
Footballguy
And of course, McShay was on SportsCenter just now, saying he think Dorsett could sneak into the first round based on what he's hearing.
Someone brought up Fowler earlier, I haven't really considered him if he's there. I should. I just assumed it would be Leo or Amari. And everyone keeps mocking Fowler to Jax, which is not a given--at all. They could love Dupree or Beasley or Gregory for all we know.
I don't think Gregory or Beasley is a possibility for us, but Jax runs a different D. If it went Winston-Williams-Beasley, I wonder. I think the team views DE as just as much a need as WR, and I don't think McKenzie loves taking WRs early. It's a guess, but Green Bay's drafting of WRs while he was there, and his drafting here, I think they view WR as a spot you can get later. Gonna look at him some more.
massraider
Footballguy
He and Cooper are the guys I have watched that I think, "That's an NFL player right there." Whatever that's worth.
