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2020 MLB Spring Training (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter TheIronSheik
- Start date
rockaction
Footballguy
I think everyone doing this defending shtick is still doing it and are Astros fans. That says a lot.
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rockaction
Footballguy
No. You wouldn't. You'd be rooting for them to fall flat on their face so everyone could sleep well about what a sham it was instead of the reality, which is a blurred line.The country will lose its #### if the Astros win the WS again this year. Honestly, even if I wasn't an Astros fan, I'd be pulling for that.
cobalt_27
Footballguy
Yup. Whoops, that one got away. For all of Manfred’s bluster about not tolerating retaliation, the league really can’t legislate a stiff fastball in Bregman’s ribs or a cleat in Altuve’s thigh any differently than anyone else. These guys know what’s coming and there’s not really a thing they can do about it.
Manfred’s cowardice ultimately puts players in a position where they’ll just take it upon themselves.
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rockaction
Footballguy
The taint is never going away, whether Astros and Red Sox fans (me among them) want to get used to it or not. And they were tainted, sadly.
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rockaction
Footballguy
118*
I wonder what Mookie's new teammates think of him.
I wonder what Mookie's new teammates think of him.
DJackson10
Footballguy
It's the same thing. you're being a hypocrite if you are gonna defend what happened with Came yet say what the Astros did was bad. That's like all these MLB writers who defended all the PED cheaters back in the day but now won't vote them into the HoF do to their cheating. NCAA has a rule banning teams from paying players or their families. Auburn broke that rule. Cheating is cheating. Altuve stole an MVP award Cam stole a Heisman as he should've been ineligible to play. At the sometime Auburn should've had their title voided for that season too.
DJackson10
Footballguy
No different then Selig knowing about the huge issue of players using PEDs. Selig in those days they took an easy way to gain back fans and revenue. The Astros after everything in Hou was going on became a feel good story. With the Phillies so bad I found myself watching Astros games because I liked a lot of their players and had Cole and ALtuve on my dynasty team. I didn't root for them simple because of the feel good story either. They were genuinely an exciting team. After this came out I say the team can go #### themselves. The players are pissed that the MLB just gave the players involved a slap on the wrist. Awards weren't taken away. The excuse given for not doing so is an absolute copout too.
NREC34
Footballguy
Nah. There’s different degrees of cheating. What the Astros did was the worst thing in history and what your team did wasn’t really that bad.
It is a crazy mob right now. Everywhere.
bigmarc27
Footballguy
DJackson10
Footballguy
People love being hyocrites plus they'll defend it with it made the game more exciting. Which is outrageous. Didn't Pitcher Daryle Kyle die from using some sort of banned steroid? It's why I think it's laughable when these writers don't put Bonds/Clemens etc in the HoF because of PED use yet these same writers kept quite for yrs then acted surprised when it came out the whole scandal. They are hypocrites. Not that I don't agree with them from not voting them in because I've been saying for yrs they shouldn't be in.
Hell I'm big on a the 3 Strikes and you are banned for life. First offense 81 games and you are ineligible for post season play if your team makes it that year. If the suspension is carried into next year you are also inglible for that year. 2nd offense it's a year ban. 3rd You are banned for life. Not only would I suspend the player I would also rule the player pays whatever money back to the team for the amount of games missed. SO if a player is in his 2nd ban thats a full seasons salary he pays back.
DJackson10
Footballguy
Not sure what you mean by my team. I'm not an Astros fan. Cheating is cheating no matter how you slice it. You're a hypocrite if you are gonna defend one form of cheating but not the other. Doesn't matter how bad it was. Auburn played a full year of football with an ineligible player who I believe if they didn't have don't even make the NCAA Title game. How is this any different? People pick and choose what they want to be an angry mob over. Most of the time its for the dumbest things too. The fans complaining the most about the Astros are LA fans which I'm not surprised because after the Phillies kept knocking them out I heard every excuse in the book why we didn't win and LA lost it. Or other teams fans like the Yankees. Yet the Nationals had to deal with the same thing and won? Also I bet you more then half of these players complaining are taking some illegal substance that has gotten by testing. So its pretty rich when I hear some of these players complaining about cheating. These teams knew what was going on but weren't smart like the Cats were?
I agree what the Astros did is up there with the worst things a team can do cheating wise. But let's not down play these other leagues/teams/universities. For crying out loud FSU literally Covered up their best player raping two women all because they were in a national title game. NCAA didn't do a dam thing because FSU was making the NCAA money. The QB won a national title when he should've been behind bars. Where's the outrage on that? Instead all people did was slut shame the girls and we got Dannel Kennel on ESPN saying the girls should pay back the money they got from the university. Thats pretty reprehensible and probably IMHO been more of an uproar then what the Astros did. I mean it was't that long ago before that we had PSU covering up one of their coaches diddling kids for over 35 yrs and the hC covering it up with the University and possible people in the state government. Lets go back to MLB for minute where we had the PED scandal. PED's kill people or make people kill or harm others or themselves if they are addicted or mix certain products they shouldn't. Yet people weren't in an uproar and many fans and media defended the entire thing. Yet what the Astros did was worse? I'm sorry but there's a ton of hypocrites out there right now trying to play the moral card and I'm not buying what they are trying to sell.
NREC34
Footballguy
@DJackson10 I mean “you” just as a general term and not you specifically and far as I know Daryl Kile died from a heart attack in his hotel room, not from anything to do with steroids.
DJackson10
Footballguy
I'm going for an under here. Given how strict baseball is with the bean balls these days you bet your ### after the first 3 bean balls to Astros players MLB will step in and put an end to it fast. Every team who plays the Astros this year will get their warning before the series against them starts and first sign of funny business the umps are gonna start sending managers and pitchers for an early shower. I agree something like bean balls should happen but lets not get carried away. I think the players need to pick a few guys on each team and hit one of the Soros best players but not make it so blatantly. We can't be having every team throw at these guys every game. It becomes too obvious and MLB will put a quick end to it. Gotta be smart about it.
DJackson10
Footballguy
I maybe thinking of another pitcher who died from a PED issue then. yep looked it up Steve Belcher was the guy who died from a cream PED substance I believe.
NREC34
Footballguy
You want to talk about guys dying...seems to me that what happened with the Angels last year is another thing mlb has swept under the rug.
DJackson10
Footballguy
I would go with that too. I just think it's incredible naive to take these leagues for their word. It's why I didn't believe a single word of David Stern when Donaghey and the ref scandal happened. I'm not a guy wearing a tinfoil hat who yells conspiracies all day and listens to Alex Jones but theres some pretty damming stuff Donaghey has said and fans and others bigger into this then I am have come away with a ton of different games that fit what that dude has said. Stern and the NBA swept that under the rug real quick. If I was Comisoner wouldn't I want to really cooperate with a government investigation and tell the FBI or say I'm concerned others are in on this please look into this further for our leagues integrity? What he did is no different then Goodell having the NFL Security destroy the Patriots tapes. Wouldn't I want to show the fans hey please have faith in us still?
ChiefD
Footballguy
Rodrigo Duterte
Footballguy
The over/under on the amount of people that actually read all of Jackson's posts is 2 1/2, which includes him.
NREC34
Footballguy
fred_1_15301
Footballguy
This story is getting washed away in the midst of all the scandal talk. This is one of the oddest stories I've read in a while. The lady appears to be a highly successful woman (founder and CEO of an innovative company) and has just gone bat #### crazy.
cosjobs
Footballguy
Say what you want about the Astros, they never conspired to physically injure other players.
TBH, cheating seems innocuous compared to physical injury
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DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
Encyclopedia Brown
Footballguy
And conversely, if Altuve suddenly turns into Bill Doran, and Bregman into Art Howe, it will reinforce what is believed to be the advantage they had with cheating.The country will lose its #### if the Astros win the WS again this year. Honestly, even if I wasn't an Astros fan, I'd be pulling for that.
bigmarc27
Footballguy
It doesn’t even have to go that far, if their production declines 10%, that would be a pretty significant number. No one is saying they weren’t talented and no one is saying they couldn’t have competed for the title no one won in 2017. That’s what makes all this the more irritating when they argue it didn’t help. If it didn’t help, then you wouldn’t have done it.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
This is true. Even though these guys are elite players who were top draft picks and have consistently hit well at every park they play in, it's safe to assume that was probably all aided by cheating. The long con that started back in their little league days, spread all over the world. Who would ever suspect that? It was the perfect crime.
Thanks a lot, Mike Fiers.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
NREC34
Footballguy
Plus we all know they were doing it in 2019, Sheik. Even guys like Brantley were doing it Pre-Astros.This is true. Even though these guys are elite players who were top draft picks and have consistently hit well at every park they play in, it's safe to assume that was probably all aided by cheating. The long con that started back in their little league days, spread all over the world. Who would ever suspect that? It was the perfect crime.
Thanks a lot, Mike Fiers.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
Bull Dozier
Footballguy
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
I heard that JR Richard was stealing the signs of the batters and that's how he knew what to throw.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
Yeah, but that's not as funny as my scenario. In fact, I'm not sure yours is funny at all.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
This is a good point and I hadn't thought about it. I guess a lot will depend on what the "investigation" will find, but the Dodgers seem to be the most irate towards players and now they have a possible offender on their team.
Also, I just realized the All Star Game this year is in LA. So some of the Astros will get to walk into the Thunderdome at Chavez Ravine.
rockaction
Footballguy
Yeah, my mother even turned to us at a dinner celebration and asked us what we thought the Dodgers would think of movie. This scandal has hit even the most casual of sports fans. Like you said, Turner and Kershaw today took aim at the players aspect of this all. Never mind that the Sox beat the Dodgers in 2018 and Mookie was a large part of that.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
If we can all take a step back for a second and take a deep breath, I want to point out that it's ridiculous that people are fuming over Manfred calling the trophy a "piece of metal." I get that he probably shouldn't have called it that, but who cares? Why in this day and age does everyone want to be offended by words? I mean, I get everyone is upset and already ready to explode on any piece of news that comes out. But to get upset over a word? And not a word about you, but a word about, well, a piece of metal? I mean that's crazy talk.
rockaction
Footballguy
He essentially extended his disregard of the trophy to the actual job of winning the title itself, if you look at the trophy in a symbolic way, which nearly everybody does. Whatever the status of the trophy is, surely it is emblematic of the effort and fortitude required to win it.
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Capella
Footballguy
I’m guessing the players are upset because it’s what a lot of them are working so hard to achieve and some pencil pushing dork who never played the game called it a piece of metal in an attempt to demean it?
NREC34
Footballguy
It feels like to me that LA and their fans are so much angrier at Houston because they came really close to winning that WS whereas the Boston series was 4-1. So maybe in their minds they actually could have came out on top in that one.
That and once a guy starts wearing your laundry any past sins are forgiven. See NY, Gerrit Cole.
rockaction
Footballguy
Yeah, it really does feel that way. Plus, Houston has its share of personalities that can rub another team the wrong way; the Red Sox less so.
And yeah about the laundry, though some guys might never get past it if you give them a certain issue. See Mark Portugal and unions and replacement players that came in during the strike of '95.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
I get all of that. But to be offended over words to describe it is stupid. He didn't take a crap on it. And he didn't call it an offensive name on purpose.
Can we all stop getting upset over words, please?
rockaction
Footballguy
Boston largely skipped on the steroid scandal, too, while the Yankees got it full bore in the Mitchell Report. No doubt Boston had guys that took steroids, with Manny being Exhibit A.
Ortiz will always have that question of pre-testing flags, too. He just had really good PR. Come to think of it, the Sox have really good PR, which isn't surprising given the importance of fan goodwill for them.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
Wait. What?
Before this scandal, the Astros were considered the nicest guys in the sport. Well, not Bregman. But everyone else. Now they rub people the wrong way?
rockaction
Footballguy
I don't think it's the grammar, vocab, or syntax that got him in trouble. It's how easily that line of thinking can be seen as denigrating the effort of the guys. If you're simply calling it language, I'm not sure how to put it. Language doesn't exist in a vacuum. It has meaning, and it was pretty clear what he meant.
rockaction
Footballguy
Were you not there when Gurriel made the Asian face/slanty eyes thing after he hit the home run back in the 2017 ALCS or WS?
Capella
Footballguy
No? If people stopped saying stupid things then people wouldn’t get upset over it. I understand why those guys are mad, it’s the ultimate goal in their lifetime of work and this idiot insulted it. I don’t know what you do for a living but imagine trying to obtain that ultimate goal and somebody (who is supposed to be in charge) telling you it’s worthless. It’s moronic for him to even think of saying that.
Capella
Footballguy
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
I think you guys want to be upset. No offense.
He didn't call it something offensive. He didn't disrespect it. If anything, it might have been a poor choice of words, but honestly, I don't even think it was that. We live in a time now where everyone wants to be the victim.
If people are offended because someone called a trophy a piece of metal, they need to get thicker skin. This is stuff that children get upset over. We are past "name calling" now and we've moved on to being offended by "misspeaking while describing an object." That's lunacy. And you can try to justify it all you want by saying it's a symbol or whatever BS you claim, but the fact is if you are getting upset and offended over the words used to describe a trophy, you are being ridiculous.
He didn't call it something offensive. He didn't disrespect it. If anything, it might have been a poor choice of words, but honestly, I don't even think it was that. We live in a time now where everyone wants to be the victim.
If people are offended because someone called a trophy a piece of metal, they need to get thicker skin. This is stuff that children get upset over. We are past "name calling" now and we've moved on to being offended by "misspeaking while describing an object." That's lunacy. And you can try to justify it all you want by saying it's a symbol or whatever BS you claim, but the fact is if you are getting upset and offended over the words used to describe a trophy, you are being ridiculous.
