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2020 MLB Spring Training (8 Viewers)
- Thread starter TheIronSheik
- Start date
NREC34
Footballguy
Yes.
My beef with MLB is why don’t they investigate NY like they did Houston to see how far and how long it went.
I’m really tired of seeing their sanctimonious fans tweets, etc.
RUSF18
Footballguy
Because in one case there’s clear evidence of the rule breaking after they were told to cut it off? And in the others, there isn’t?
This is almost exactly how and why the Patriots got pinched for Spygate when others didn’t.
Anarchy99
Footballguy
That's the main thing that people forget about Spygate. The league essentially grandfathered in anything (without penalty) that went on prior to Week 1 of the 2007 season in their cease and desist memo they sent out to all 32 teams. The Patriots got ratted out by NYJ head coach Eric Mangini (the former NE defensive coordinator) when NE played the Jets the first week of the 2007 season. So when NE supplied the league with years and years worth of videotapes from prior seasons, the Pats had really only been in clear violation of a direct order for that one game.
Just like in baseball, there were rules on illegal drug use for many years. There was a rule added specifically on the books in 1990/1991 that stated steroids and PED's were not allowed . . . but they did not test for it. So while technically illegal, there was no way to enforce the rule. Obviously that all changed with the Mitchell report and subsequent testing in 2003/2004. There was no way to retroactively penalize MLB players that acted covertly and unchecked for years.
JaxBill
Footballguy
@Ken_Rosenthal: Involvement of third team also possible in #RedSox-#Dodgers blockbuster, source tells The Athletic. Again: Betts and Price would go to Dodgers, Alex Verdugo and others to Boston.
Mike Damone
Footballguy
I don’t mind trading Mookie if he wanted 10/420 but I’d rather them eat Price and get a bigger return for Betts
Mike Damone
Footballguy
3 way between Sox/Dodgers/Twins
JaxBill
Footballguy
@Ken_Rosenthal: #Dodgers sending RHP Kenta Maeda to #MNTwins for RHP Brusdar Graterol, who will be part of package going to #RedSox, source tells The Athletic.
BeTheMatch
Footballguy
I don't know anything about Maeda, but, boy, Twins brass must think he can do more than he ever has. Dodgers fans saying he was nothing but a spot starter. Giving up Graterol is pretty shocking.
ETA: Apparently they view Maeda as a No. 3 starter and felt Graterol was nothing more than a one-trick pony in the bullpen. And Maeda is ultra cheap. If it works, they're geniuses. If it doesn't, they're morons!
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Mike Damone
Footballguy
Joc Pederson to the Angels for Rengifo
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wikkidpissah
Footballguy
Hate to see mookie go, but we were losing him anyway and i think i have verdugo & graterol on every one of my dynasty teams (gore and mize are the only prospect arms i have higher). most importantly, David Price has sucked the oxygen out of Fenway for the last time
fruity pebbles
Footballguy
whoknew
Footballguy
fruity pebbles
Footballguy
Feel he’s not worth 35 mil a year for ten plus years I guess. More important issue is getting under the luxury tax which would have been near impossible by signing him. Three years in a row over the threshold and the penalties are pretty severe. 50% tax on every dollar over, loss of draft picks, reduced amount of money they can spend internationally etc.
whoknew
Footballguy
Really? I just assumed it was a money issue. They lose draft picks and international spending money? Ok.
Cowboysfan8
Footballguy
fruity pebbles
Footballguy
Same thing really, isn’t it? Yeah they’d move back 10 spots for their highest draft pick. Also they’d get less draft compensation when they lose future free agents and they would lose about a million in international pool money when they sign free agents. Add in the roughly 50% tax on every dollar over the threshold and the penalties are nothing to sneeze at. They’d be paying Mookie 50 million year one if his salary is the one over the threshold. Get under 208 one year and it all resets. Dombrowski saddled them with some bad contracts. Bloom is looking to reset and start fresh.
Capella
Footballguy
The Red Sox owners own Liverpool which is going through one of the great runs in soccer history and are printing them billions. They can afford 50M for Mookie, quite easily. It’s pretty ridiculous anybody is taking this line of argument.
RUSF18
Footballguy
Certain Boston journalists carry the team’s water and have done the work to convince the fanbase that there was no other choice. Pretty effective bunch.
Hov34
Eephus's Great Great Great Love Child
As a Twins fan I was upset with letting go of Graterol. His slider was filthy and add that with 100+ fastball, but the more I've read and think about this I don't know that he could ever hold up in the rotation. His ceiling is way higher than Maeda, but he's already had TJ surgery and has only one season with over 100 innings pitched. May be a dominate closer one day, but I guess the Twins feel their window is now.BeTheMatch said:
And looking at Maeda he is way more than just a "spot starter". He's a legit #3 who got pushed to the bullpen late in the season and in the playoffs because the Dodgers had a enough starting pitching to do that. (must be nice). He will be 32 this year, but has 4 more years of his contract at 3 mil a year. Sort of a bargain for a mid rotation guy.
Maeda reminds me of Ervin Santana. Hope it works for the Twins.
Anarchy99
Footballguy
Apparently some people think all teams have printing presses hidden in their clubhouses (to go along with their electronic signal stealing equipment). Here are a list of 10 horrible contracts the Red Sox issued over the last decade . . .
Price $217M
Gonzalez $154M
Sale $145M
Crawford $142M
Pedroia $110M
Sandoval $95M
HRamirez $88M
Porcello $83M
Castillo $72M
Eovaldi $68M
That adds up to almost $1.2 BILLION. They got off some of those contracts and they had to subsidize others. Some they continue to pay and some have deferred payments. The bottom line is, they didn't get much out of those players. Yes, they were probably dumb moves . . . but no one knew they were dumb moves until well after the fact. I don't care who you are . . . that much money is a SERIOUS chunk of change. Heck, they are still paying Manny Ramirez $2 million a year. IIRC, one of those seasons Boston was paying more dead money on contracts than some teams entire rosters.
I already mentioned previously that at the FRONT end of these mega deals, fans of the signing team will jump for joy . . . but at the end of them fans will scream how did my team get stuck with a bum collecting all that money. Do Tigers fans cheer for Cabrera as a cornerstone player? Do Angels fans love having Pujols?
Betts told the Red Sox multiple times he wanted to become a free agent and he wanted the best contract he could possibly get. Boston would become one of 30 teams bidding on his services. He hasn't backed off of his request of a 12 year, $420 million contract and wants to sign for the most he can get. If he actually gets that, the back end of that deal is going to look really bad when we get that far.
Boston can still have a potent offense and building blocks with Boegarts / Devers / Martinez. They certainly get more financial flexibility moving forward ($16 million under the tax threshold for this year). The Yankees and Dodgers each shed salary 4 or 5 years ago and both came back as powerhouse teams. If BOS stays under the luxury tax this year, they have shown as long as they are not always in the max tax tier they will go over the tax line. They currently are $64 million under the luxury tax number for next year.
No one knows if the two new guys they got will turn into anything. Maybe they will, maybe they won't. But Boston has to extend Devers and Rodriquez soon and teams can only keep so many guys. (Yes, Betts is better than those two but the Sox may be able to keep them around.) Boston was operating under the belief that 1) Betts wasn't going to stick around without breaking the bank, 2) they would only have him for one more year, 3) they didn't think they could win WITH him this year, and 4) they would rather get something for him over letting him walk for close to nothing.
What was funny last night on sports talk TV, they pointed out that the Red Sox ownership group won 4 titles in 15 seasons . . . yet the fan base doesn't particularly like them and that will only get worse after moving Betts. Everyone is torching the Red Sox for making the trade. Clearly Boston is weaker this year, but who knows moving forward. If Boston falls from 84 wins to 75 wins this year . . . does that really make any difference in the short term? We won't know how this plays out FOR YEARS, if not A DECADE.
Price $217M
Gonzalez $154M
Sale $145M
Crawford $142M
Pedroia $110M
Sandoval $95M
HRamirez $88M
Porcello $83M
Castillo $72M
Eovaldi $68M
That adds up to almost $1.2 BILLION. They got off some of those contracts and they had to subsidize others. Some they continue to pay and some have deferred payments. The bottom line is, they didn't get much out of those players. Yes, they were probably dumb moves . . . but no one knew they were dumb moves until well after the fact. I don't care who you are . . . that much money is a SERIOUS chunk of change. Heck, they are still paying Manny Ramirez $2 million a year. IIRC, one of those seasons Boston was paying more dead money on contracts than some teams entire rosters.
I already mentioned previously that at the FRONT end of these mega deals, fans of the signing team will jump for joy . . . but at the end of them fans will scream how did my team get stuck with a bum collecting all that money. Do Tigers fans cheer for Cabrera as a cornerstone player? Do Angels fans love having Pujols?
Betts told the Red Sox multiple times he wanted to become a free agent and he wanted the best contract he could possibly get. Boston would become one of 30 teams bidding on his services. He hasn't backed off of his request of a 12 year, $420 million contract and wants to sign for the most he can get. If he actually gets that, the back end of that deal is going to look really bad when we get that far.
Boston can still have a potent offense and building blocks with Boegarts / Devers / Martinez. They certainly get more financial flexibility moving forward ($16 million under the tax threshold for this year). The Yankees and Dodgers each shed salary 4 or 5 years ago and both came back as powerhouse teams. If BOS stays under the luxury tax this year, they have shown as long as they are not always in the max tax tier they will go over the tax line. They currently are $64 million under the luxury tax number for next year.
No one knows if the two new guys they got will turn into anything. Maybe they will, maybe they won't. But Boston has to extend Devers and Rodriquez soon and teams can only keep so many guys. (Yes, Betts is better than those two but the Sox may be able to keep them around.) Boston was operating under the belief that 1) Betts wasn't going to stick around without breaking the bank, 2) they would only have him for one more year, 3) they didn't think they could win WITH him this year, and 4) they would rather get something for him over letting him walk for close to nothing.
What was funny last night on sports talk TV, they pointed out that the Red Sox ownership group won 4 titles in 15 seasons . . . yet the fan base doesn't particularly like them and that will only get worse after moving Betts. Everyone is torching the Red Sox for making the trade. Clearly Boston is weaker this year, but who knows moving forward. If Boston falls from 84 wins to 75 wins this year . . . does that really make any difference in the short term? We won't know how this plays out FOR YEARS, if not A DECADE.
NREC34
Footballguy
Since they made this deal, I would have to think LA wants him long term and will try to lock him up. If they don’t win this year and don’t re-sign him I think it hurts them.
Cowboysfan8
Footballguy
Jackstraw
Footballguy
fruity pebbles
Footballguy
Man In The Box
Footballguy
Yep. Maeda is a super solid number 3. Also has the versatility to pitch out of the bullpen. Good deal for the Twins.
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NREC34
Footballguy
Listened to WFAN a little today. This guy Evan says there’s never been a clearer 2 best teams.
Guess we might as well just skip to the World Series.
He said the Twins getting Maeda didn’t matter. Might beat them in 4 instead of 3 now. Also said they could bring back Walter Johnson and Ruth (I think) and they couldn’t beat the mighty Yankees.
Guess we might as well just skip to the World Series.
He said the Twins getting Maeda didn’t matter. Might beat them in 4 instead of 3 now. Also said they could bring back Walter Johnson and Ruth (I think) and they couldn’t beat the mighty Yankees.
Paxton out till mid-season
Yankees rotation going to be tough to figure out. Severino was hurt all last year, German and Paxton out for a good part of the first half of the year and who knows how Paxton will be when he comes back with a balky back. Tanaka is always a wild card. Do you get lights out Tanaka or BP Tanaka
After Cole, there's a whole lotta questions.
Yankees rotation going to be tough to figure out. Severino was hurt all last year, German and Paxton out for a good part of the first half of the year and who knows how Paxton will be when he comes back with a balky back. Tanaka is always a wild card. Do you get lights out Tanaka or BP Tanaka
After Cole, there's a whole lotta questions.
shadyridr
Footballguy
Cole, Tanaka, Severino, Happ, Montgomery is fine for a few months in the regular season. And then German and Paxton come back.
wikkidpissah
Footballguy
Cowboysfan8
Footballguy
DJackson10
Footballguy
Wanted to get under the Luxury tax and Mookie when they came to him on extension was not interested. To keep him Bos was gonna have to let other guys go making more holes to fill on the roster.
Hov34
Eephus's Great Great Great Love Child
Yeah, I was watching this today https://youtu.be/1pBeMfIXT9o?t=330Roberts rarely lets anyone go more than 5
and Roberts takes him out in the 7th with 12 strikeouts and only 85 pitches??? I don't get it.
Frostillicus
Footballguy
BeTheMatch said:
As a Twins fan, I'm just fine with the move because they have a deep farm system and they have a rare "win now" window and they're going for it. That said, the above is absolutely true.
Frostillicus
Footballguy
Eventually you gotta take some risks and go for it when you aren't a FA destination. Now sounds good. Hope is a good thing.
Frostillicus
Footballguy
Frostillicus
Footballguy
Also #### the Yankees and Red Sox. And Cardinals too.
