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Cleveland Browns (5 Viewers)

Peak said:
They each said in a PC that the other wasn't their "first choice", but they had to learn to work together.  I read different articles online throughout the day, and visit different boards.  I'd have to go back and look for the actual quotes.
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I thought about it more after I asked and think I remember hearing about Gregg saying something like that.  One of them at least.

 
Bobcat10 said:
I'm all for Freddie staying on board, just not sure it's going to work out with the new HC.  Doesn't feel like it's going to be Gregg, so how does Dorsey marry the new HC and Freddie?  I see the Arians angle where he let's Freddie call the plays, but I haven't heard a sniff about him.  Any of the other offensive minds will likely call their own plays...so does Freddie stay on board as their non-playcalling OC+QB coach?  I think that might even be more realistic than trying to marry him to a defensive coach.  

I suppose the HC could be Freddie too and maybe that's why they're having Stefanski in.  While he's a rising name, I'm fairly confident saying Stefanski's interview isn't really for HC duties.  Dorsey is adding a new page to his binder and/or he has something cooking in his mind that was impossibly there a few months ago....
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Similar to making Mayfield the #1 pick?

 
Below is the list of HC interviewees to date for CLE, as reported on Twitter and by the team:

Gregg Williams - Browns IHC/DC - interviewed Jan 1.
Jim Caldwell - former Lions HC - interviewed Jan 2
Kevin Stefanski - Vikings OC - interviews Jan 3
Dan Campbell - Saints TEc - interviews Jan 4
Brian Flores - Patriots DC - interviews rumored for this weekend
Mike McCarthy - former Packers HC - interviews next week
Freddie Kitchens - Browns AHC/OC - interviews next week -- also, Dorsey denying other teams to interview him as OC.
Mike Munchak - Steelers OLineC
Matt Eberflus - Cots DC
Nick Sirianni - Colts OC
Josh McDaniels, Pats OC - per JLC reports


At this point, I think it's safe to say Arians is not a viable candidate, as CLE still hasn't reached out to him.  So unless something is happening under the cover of darkness, I think it's safe to rule him out at this point.

McDaniels was just added last night, based on Twitter rumors started by JLC.  I haven't heard this reported by the Browns, or by any of the media who cover them.  I'm sure McD has shown some interest, but I really wonder if that interest is mutual.  With Dorsey and Ballard being close, I have to think the whole Indy debacle weighs heavily on McD's candidacy.

Very interested on the new, young OC/DC names (Stefanski, Eberflus, Sirianni) as possible candidates.  I would have to think Kitchens has a leg up on them, if only due to the familiarity with Baker and the team in general.  Possibly interviewing as potential OC or DC fits for one of the other candidates?  What if one, or more, of these were paired with Kitchens as HC?  Talk about a young, but innovative coaching staff.

Not a fan of Flores - I've seen enough of the BB tree and don't want to go back to that well.  Romeo, Weis, Mangini, McD, O'Brien, Patricia - no thanks.  Not interested.

Not a fan of Munchak - great OL coach, but he doesn't seem like a HC fit here.

McCarthy I was completely off board with and wanted no part of when he was released from GB.  Now that the dust has settled and more information has come out about his time there, I'm starting to think he may have been a victim of circumstance.  Articles have stated that Rodgers would rather "improvise" instead of run the plays as designed.  He was always known as a great improviser, but now I wonder if that went to his head.  It sounds like his ego became bigger than the team/coaches, which led to the falling out with McCarthy.  

McCarthy is the play caller, but because Rodgers is so intelligent and such a good improvisational player, the quarterback has the green light to change plays on the field as he see fit. He does, so often that it can be hard for McCarthy to get into a rhythm as the play caller. McCarthy might call the same play three times in a game, without the play actually being run as he called it. And if McCarthy calls a play that Rodgers doesn’t like early in the game, that can sour the mood for the rest of the game. Several sources familiar with the inner workings of the organization say that it devolved into a competition over who can call the better play, and both want the credit when things go right.
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There are examples of how McCarthy would use some of the same formations used by the Rams and Chiefs, yet the outcomes weren't the same.  I saw somewhere, I'll have to find it, that Rodgers leads the league in Sacks when a QB holds the ball longer than 2.5 seconds.  That's a lifetime back there for an OL, and Rodgers just runs around looking to make something happen.  It ties directly into the article giving it a little more credibility.  If I were to say that a SB winning HC with a record of 135-82-2 wants to be the HC of the Browns, would anyone believe me?  That's what McCarthy brings to the table.  As long as he's willing to stay creative and be open to other inputs/suggestions, and Dorsey trusts him, then I would be for it.

Dan Campbell is another name that I'd be interested in seeing as HC.  He has Parcells support, and has been studying under Payton for a number of years.  I wonder if a HC/OC pairing of Campbell/Kitchens would work here?  Both are from the Parcells tree, and both are young/hungry and "leader of men".  Could this fit what Dorsey is looking for?

 
I think the McCarthy noise is media and agent fueled spin - the cocoon.  Even if you give him a pass for the Rodgers stuff his game theory and management is unacceptable.  Like most of these guys, I'm not going to judge him for what he does Monday-Saturday.  I don't know.  But I know what I see on Sunday's.  It's a product of someone not prepared and with major flaws in how the game is now vs. when he came up in the coaching ranks.

I think he's the type of guy that would be best suited to take a year or two off and reflect on what went wrong then adjust.  If he really does then I think he could bounce back.  If not...

 
Dizzy said:
As an outsider-looking-in (Steelers fan), how can Gregg Williams not be considered as the front runner to retain the HC job? The team's response to him as El Hefe seemed instantaneous. I realize the NFL wants to change to this flag football, trickshot offense driving everything but the AFCN still a black & blue division in my eyes. Williams' approach seems a perfect fit for the division and Baker's demeanor.

They seemed to really have a good thing going second half of the season. Why mess with it?
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Well, Peak, MAC and few others covered it but I'll throw my $.02 in as well

Peak said:
I've thought the same way, and my first reaction was to "keep Williams and Kitchens no matter what - don't mess with what works!"

After stepping away from the ledge, it hit me that the reason Gregg's HC tenure worked so well was because this team needed discipline - it craved it.  You could see it the first couple of weeks, there was a disconnect between the way the Defense played (with passion) and the Offense played (more lackadaisical).  Gregg instills a need for discipline and accountability.  When he installed that as a whole, he got players attention and a new found work ethic.  That's something I want/expect a HC to do with a team.
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Pretty much this and as MAC said, Williams was the right coach at the right time to kick the team in the ### and instill some much needed disciple into the organization. I haven't looked but one of the major things I used to bang the drum on was penalties and more pointedly, drive stalling penalties. Those times when it was 2nd and 5 and someone would jump offsides...multiple times. There was nothing that got me going more than that bull#### and it all points back to lack of disciple on the practice field which translated to lack of disciple on the playing field. Hue was never that guy. You saw it when half the ####### team was riding bikes during training camp! Immediately when Williams took over that stuff stopped.

Also to MAC's point, I think Gregg has gone about as far as he is capable of right now. You saw a few of the bad time management calls this year and I think it was an arranged marriage between him & Kitchens but long term I'm not 100% it lasts. Both knew it was in their best interests to shine in their respective positions so why wouldn't you bury hatchets and hold hands for a few games?

It was a magical ride and a lot of fun to see what I think we all knew was capable with the roster we have right now but there is still a lot of room for improvement. That defense has a ton of potential but some of those schemes really had me scratching my head. And you can go back to last year with Peppers playing in the 3rd row of the Dawg Pound. Not only do I think that Williams isn't the answer going forward, I question his DC capabilities at this point.

 
amnesiac said:
be still my heart. 

so, they maybe roll the dice on a qb later in the draft?  you think they carry 3 qbs?
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Under this cba I dont see the point. At least making it a priority anyway. There will definitely be a young body in camp but beyond that? It's tough. Just not enough meaningful reps. 

I think a wave 2 free agent is more likely and probably a more natural fit. 

 
Too bad the Browns didn't try one of those screen passes that the Chargers just ran vs Baltimore at the end of the 1st half with Baltimore doing their blitz everyone on every play to try and keep Chargers from getting a FG to end the half.  It didn't work for them this time like it did vs us.

 
MAC_32 said:
Under this cba I dont see the point. At least making it a priority anyway. There will definitely be a young body in camp but beyond that? It's tough. Just not enough meaningful reps. 

I think a wave 2 free agent is more likely and probably a more natural fit. 
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if they keep Stanton, i’d rather they try to find someone in the draft than carrying a retread as their 3rd QB. 

 i think they’re probably a year away from overpaying a backup QB anyway. 

so it might make more sense to try to develope a backup for a year and see what happens. 

 
Tyrod Taylor sucks enough we might be able to retain him cheap.  With an improved team he MIGHT be able to win a game or two in a pinch.  

 
amnesiac said:
if they keep Stanton, i’d rather they try to find someone in the draft than carrying a retread as their 3rd QB. 

 i think they’re probably a year away from overpaying a backup QB anyway. 

so it might make more sense to try to develope a backup for a year and see what happens. 
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Development sounds like a good idea between January and May, but in practice it doesn't really work unless you intend for that guy to eventually get a shot at starting. There aren't enough reps. And there are basically none once September rolls around. 

I think the March priorities are wave one types - free agents and trades. Worry about wave two when we get there. Draft? If you really like a day 3 type then whatever. But if you don't spend picks elsewhere then bring in udfa's to push Stanton (plus?).

 
ghostguy123 said:
Tyrod Taylor sucks enough we might be able to retain him cheap.  With an improved team he MIGHT be able to win a game or two in a pinch.  
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You're not wrong. Just dont get tied down to names. Let the market shake out the names then decide if they fit. 

 
MAC_32 said:
You're not wrong. Just dont get tied down to names. Let the market shake out the names then decide if they fit. 
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For a backup though, a guy who was just here all year would be a plus because the reps will be few and far between.

If they change systems, well, then who cares.

 
Soulfly3 said:
Get Flacco on the low low. 
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What mushroom are you eating that makes you think Flacco will be anywhere near low let alone low low? :rolleyes:

ghostguy123 said:
Tyrod Taylor sucks enough we might be able to retain him cheap.  With an improved team he MIGHT be able to win a game or two in a pinch.  
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:goodposting: Why not keep him? Agree we shouldn't get into a bidding war but I'm fine with him being the backup. Literally haven't heard his or Stanton's name this season, I like that.

 
Per Rapoport: The #Browns are not finished with head-coach interviews yet, as they are slated to talk to OC Freddie Kitchens this week. Should happen today or tomorrow, and he does have a realistic shot at it.

Hoping the extra time was done on purpose for him to build out his plans, make a few calls to assimilate a potential staff and make a strong case.  He has a similar resume of NFL duration as Eberflus, and already has the ear and trust of Baker and this offense.  I wouldn't mind seeing Freddie take the reigns and run with it.

Along other coaching news, McCarthy should be scheduled to interview this week.  However, PFT reporting that this pairing may not happen:

Someone told me today John Dorsey knows who he wants but isn’t saying. I have a feeling it’s not Mike McCarthy.

I wonder if a Kitchens staff would include Leftwich or Lindley at OC and pull in Bowles as DC.  That would be a solid foundation, especially with a proven DC who has a little bit of HC experience to lean on.

 
Peak said:
I wonder if a Kitchens staff would include Leftwich or Lindley at OC and pull in Bowles as DC.  That would be a solid foundation, especially with a proven DC who has a little bit of HC experience to lean on.
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I think a requirement of a Freddie based staff would be a top DC.  Without one in his pocket I doubt he gets the gig.

 
MAC_32 said:
I think a requirement of a Freddie based staff would be a top DC.  Without one in his pocket I doubt he gets the gig.
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Agreed.

Altho recent news has Bowles and Leftwich going to TB, as it appears Arians is putting the band back together....

Can actually confirm this from a decent source. Expect Bowles as DC, Harold Goodwin as OC, Leftwhich QB’s, Amos Jones ST, and Kevin Ross on staff as well. Will post more as I hear it.

At least he's taking Amos Jones with him.  That is the one coach I can't wait to replace.  :yuck:

 
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Confirmed and completed interviews are?  Eberflus, Freddie, DCampbell, Flores, Williams, Caldwell, and Stefanski?

Not really the list I expected to see after wild card weekend.  Also can't imagine most of these names being on the Dorsey pre-Cle (or even pre-September 2018) HC list.  The last 3 really don't inspire me at all.  I'd be good with the first 3, with Flores as a relative unknown from my perspective in the middle.  

 
MAC_32 said:
Decoded - someone from the Browns wants Mary Kay to report this, but whether it's real or not?  Good question.
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Heard from my brother's cousin's uncle that Dorsey was at Hopkins airport and gave a thumbs up when someone yelled to him: "Hire Freddie!"    :lmao:

In all seriousness, I have read a few different sources saying the same thing.  Kitchens interviewed very well, and there is a solid movement behind him being the next HC.  The idea that Stefanski is back in CLE today meeting with the group could be more for an OC role under Kitchens, as he is not under contract right now.  I've also heard that if Kitchens gets the role, then look at Tuna's coaching tree for potential DCs.  Pagano and Fox are two that came up in conversation, especially if Bowles is going to TB with Arians.

If it is Kitchens, we should know quickly (24-48hrs).  If this conversation goes into the weekend, then odds are it will be someone outside the organization like Eberfus, as we'll have to wait for the teams to conclude playing.

Exciting time as some smoke is finally coming out of Berea.

 
MAC_32 said:
Decoded - someone from the Browns wants Mary Kay to report this, but whether it's real or not?  Good question.
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fair point, but what would the motivation be?

its not going to make anyone who hasnt interviewed yet any more likely to come in. 

salary negotiation?  ugh, i sure hope not. 

maybe there’s someone they want who won’t commit yet?  trying to force their hand?  

someone who is reluctant to keep Kitchens?

none of these are great scenarios. 

 
If it's Kitchens then I agree they have all the incentive to do this asap.  Stefanski's contract just expired, so ink him before he re-signs with Minnesota. And try to get Bowles before Arians.

 
amnesiac said:
fair point, but what would the motivation be?

its not going to make anyone who hasnt interviewed yet any more likely to come in. 

salary negotiation?  ugh, i sure hope not. 

maybe there’s someone they want who won’t commit yet?  trying to force their hand?  

someone who is reluctant to keep Kitchens?

none of these are great scenarios. 
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No clue. It's just since Dorsey took over absolutely nothing comes out of that building that's actually true.  

 
MAC_32 said:
If it's Kitchens then I agree they have all the incentive to do this asap.  Stefanski's contract just expired, so ink him before he re-signs with Minnesota. And try to get Bowles before Arians.
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Bowels is super loyal to Arians and Arians is super loyal to Bowles - if he knows Arians is getting the TB job then he's going there imo (although the Browns have more to work with).

 
Dr. Octopus said:
Bowels is super loyal to Arians and Arians is super loyal to Bowles - if he knows Arians is getting the TB job then he's going there imo (although the Browns have more to work with).
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Between that last point and also having worked with Kitchens before I think it's well within the range of potential outcomes. 

 
Rapoport is saying Stefanski and Kitchens are the (known) finalists.  

Something has got to be crossed there.  They aren't bringing Stefanski back to Berea to pit him against Kitchens.  Maybe it's the old "follow up / 2nd interview" I guess.  I'd say odds are they're working on an arranged marriage.  

 
Bobcat10 said:
Rapoport is saying Stefanski and Kitchens are the (known) finalists.  

Something has got to be crossed there.  They aren't bringing Stefanski back to Berea to pit him against Kitchens.  Maybe it's the old "follow up / 2nd interview" I guess.  I'd say odds are they're working on an arranged marriage.  
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If I'm reading right Stefanski's contract ends today, so I imagine they can't formally "interview" him for OC until tomorrow.

 
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Bobcat10 said:
Rapoport is saying Stefanski and Kitchens are the (known) finalists.  

Something has got to be crossed there.  They aren't bringing Stefanski back to Berea to pit him against Kitchens.  Maybe it's the old "follow up / 2nd interview" I guess.  I'd say odds are they're working on an arranged marriage.  
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I think the 2nd interview for HC is an assumption, since he's the only one brought back to Berea.  I have to think that it's to see if he can be an OC under Freddie.  Stefanski worked in KC under Childress, and also with Favre in GB (i think).  So I'm sure he was a dark horse candidate Dorsey had on his list.  It'll be interesting to see if an arrangement can be made.  Two pretty good offensive minds, 1 that worked directly with Baker, and another who worked with a similarly skilled QB in Favre.  

I'm guessing...but if FK is hired as HC, majority of the offensive staff will remain:

HC: Kitchens

OC: Stefanski?

TE: ???

QB: Lindley or Zampese?

WR: Henry

OL: Wylie

ST: Amos is gone!!!

DC: Fox? Bowles? Pagano?

 
Dr. Octopus said:
Bowels is super loyal to Arians and Arians is super loyal to Bowles - if he knows Arians is getting the TB job then he's going there imo (although the Browns have more to work with).
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Trevor Sikkema‏Verified account @TampaBayTre 3m3 minutes ago

Can confirm that #Bucs new head coach Bruce Arians will be bringing former #Jets head coach Todd Bowles on staff as defensive coordinator. Team finalizing Bowles' contract now.

 
Arians is running offense. Had Bowles lined up. Leftwich passing game coordinator.

McDaniels would have done same with the offense.

Seems like a real good chance Freddie was priority #1 based on who we did and didn’t interview.

Burning the midnight oil in Berea?

 
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