Coaching Youth Sports - Crazy ### Parents (1 Viewer)

[General Malaise]

not sure if it was the heat (upper 80s, dewpoints 70+) or what but what a ####show at the soccer game last night. 

we usually have a ref. typically a 14-16 year old boy or girl. didn't have one last night. usually they blow the whistle a few times per game. make sure goal kicks and free kicks are setup (which consists of blowing the whistle, gathering the ball and setting it on the ground). determine throw ins and corners.

because the ref is hired by the league, the ref gives a game report back to the league. that seems to be the cap on parent behavior that people need.

no ref last night = parents going absolutely freaking berserk for 45 minutes.

holy ####. i've never heard so much screaming and complaining. these are SIX AND SEVEN YEAR OLD boys & girls. you'd have thought it was a prize fight with the crowd being split between two groups of people in a blood feud.

since we didn't have a ref & the other coach was a woman in flip flops who..... was not in shape... i volunteered to "ref". before long three parents gathered on the sidelines next to her to "help". which meant screaming at their kids because they felt like they were assistants last night.

at some point, middle of the 1st quarter a kid form the other team went down while action went the other way. i paused to check on him.. he was just tying his shoes.. play on. in the meantime one of my kids, who doesn't listen at all (who tries to sneak on the field during the run of play CONSTANTLY) scored a goal. yay team!

some fat #### on the sideline starts SCREAMING "THAT'S NOT A GOAL! THAT'S NOT FAIR! HE WAS OFFSIDES! YOUR TEAM IS CHEATING! YOU'RE CHEATING! YOU TAUGHT YOUR KIDS TO CHEAT! THAT'S NOT FAIR! WE'RE NOT COUNTING THAT GOAL! THAT'S NOT A GOAL!!!" while turning purple in the face, screaming at my kids who were celebrating like mad.... because they're 6 & 7.

i'm totally bewildered so i walk over and say "what??" to which he responds (screaming) "THAT KID WAS OFFSIDES! HE'S CHEATING! HE WAS WAY OFFSIDES THE WHOLE TIME! YOU TOLD YOUR KIDS TO CHEAT!!!!"

to which i responded "dafuq?"

to which he responded "HE TOLD ME YOU TOLD HIM TO STAND THERE AND WAIT FOR THE BALL SO HE COULD SCORE! THAT'S CHEATING! YOU'RE CHEATING!"

trying to set a good example by not throat punching the fat ####, i say "i didn't tell him any such thing. we can disallow the goal. nobody is keeping score anyways. the kids don't know the difference."

he gave me an eye roll and yelled "YOU'RE CHEATING! WE'RE NOT COUNTING THAT GOAL, GUYS! WE'RE NOT GOING TO LOSE BECAUSE THEY CHEAT!"

jesus ####### christ, ace. your special little sunflower won't remember this game come snack time in 20 minutes. unless you bet the mortgage on the outcome tonight, i think you'd better slow down before you choke on your own tongue.
 

the whole night was that way. parents calling out the smallest infractions as though someone was committing murder.

we had a situation where their goalie made a really nice stop, picked up the ball and immediately 15 people were screaming for him to do something different. he was waffling between running, throwing and kicking the ball so quickly that it looked like a computer animation glitching. after a solid 30 seconds he finally settled on putting the ball down in the goalie box, then ran up to boot it.... directly in to one of my kids who reflexively put his arms up to protect his face.  the ball deflected off my kid, i immediately called a hand ball and a free kick... which set off a chorus of cries that my kids were cheating, that i was teaching them to hit the ball with their hands, etc. etc.

it was unbelievable

because we had no whistles & i wasn't keeping time (no watch) we had a parent call out the quarter breaks. at halftime he yelled "HALF! BREAK!" but over the din of the other screaming parents and the kids adrenaline pumping they didn't hear it. so play continued on as i kept repeating "break! break! that's half! but that was apparently drowned out by the parents screaming, and i mean, screaming, that my team was cheating by trying to prevent the ball from going in our goal... even though it was halftime.

it was like listening to 20 drill instructors scream at Marines on day 1, simultaneously.

finally one of my girls just full on dove on top of the ball, got kicked, and the action stopped while the other teams parents screamed "HAND BALL!! THAT'S NOT FAIR!!"

jesus. i'm going to line up all the parents next week and punch every one of them in their face.

Jesus....that's utter chaos.  Not sure if it's different where you are, but generally there's a league board that operates all the clubs.  These boards will have a code of conduct for parents, coaches and players and violations can result in hearings.  Sounds like there were several violations here that need to be brought to the board.  I serve as the VP which chairs the judiciary arm of the league.  If I stumbled across a report like this, there would be calls to coaches and parents immediately with orders to halt further behavior like this or risk being expelled from attending future games.  This is utterly insane.  You need to take this to your board asap.

 

[dino259]

Have seen similar from parents at my kids soccer game when we were in a similar situation of no ref showing up.... however, we had a whistle.  Our coach agreed to ref.. and like you, these were 7 year old kids playing, maybe 8.   Parents got a little nutso, maybe not as bad as what you had from the sounds of it, but at one point, our coach blew the whistle to stop play, walked over to one particular loud parent from the other side, and handed them the whistle and told them they could ref the game since they were calling it anyway ----   pure silence.  It was perfect and it definitely reduced the sideline chatter.

This should definitely have been done.  That or make all the parents leave and play the game without parents.

 

[mr. furley]

Jesus....that's utter chaos.  Not sure if it's different where you are, but generally there's a league board that operates all the clubs.  These boards will have a code of conduct for parents, coaches and players and violations can result in hearings.  Sounds like there were several violations here that need to be brought to the board.  I serve as the VP which chairs the judiciary arm of the league.  If I stumbled across a report like this, there would be calls to coaches and parents immediately with orders to halt further behavior like this or risk being expelled from attending future games.  This is utterly insane.  You need to take this to your board asap.

there's a "board" but it's really 3 people who coordinate the entire league. from scheduling, to uniforms, to rosters, etc. it's SAY soccer, if anyone knows what that is.

considered joining this year to beef up the board ranks but their meeting times & dates this year were not at all convenient.

firing off a letter to them now, though

 

[Megla]

there's a "board" but it's really 3 people who coordinate the entire league. from scheduling, to uniforms, to rosters, etc. it's SAY soccer, if anyone knows what that is.

Soccer Association for Youth

 

[Kafka]

not sure if it was the heat (upper 80s, dewpoints 70+) or what but what a ####show at the soccer game last night. 

we usually have a ref. typically a 14-16 year old boy or girl. didn't have one last night. usually they blow the whistle a few times per game. make sure goal kicks and free kicks are setup (which consists of blowing the whistle, gathering the ball and setting it on the ground). determine throw ins and corners.

because the ref is hired by the league, the ref gives a game report back to the league. that seems to be the cap on parent behavior that people need.

no ref last night = parents going absolutely freaking berserk for 45 minutes.

holy ####. i've never heard so much screaming and complaining. these are SIX AND SEVEN YEAR OLD boys & girls. you'd have thought it was a prize fight with the crowd being split between two groups of people in a blood feud.

since we didn't have a ref & the other coach was a woman in flip flops who..... was not in shape... i volunteered to "ref". before long three parents gathered on the sidelines next to her to "help". which meant screaming at their kids because they felt like they were assistants last night.

at some point, middle of the 1st quarter a kid form the other team went down while action went the other way. i paused to check on him.. he was just tying his shoes.. play on. in the meantime one of my kids, who doesn't listen at all (who tries to sneak on the field during the run of play CONSTANTLY) scored a goal. yay team!

some fat #### on the sideline starts SCREAMING "THAT'S NOT A GOAL! THAT'S NOT FAIR! HE WAS OFFSIDES! YOUR TEAM IS CHEATING! YOU'RE CHEATING! YOU TAUGHT YOUR KIDS TO CHEAT! THAT'S NOT FAIR! WE'RE NOT COUNTING THAT GOAL! THAT'S NOT A GOAL!!!" while turning purple in the face, screaming at my kids who were celebrating like mad.... because they're 6 & 7.

i'm totally bewildered so i walk over and say "what??" to which he responds (screaming) "THAT KID WAS OFFSIDES! HE'S CHEATING! HE WAS WAY OFFSIDES THE WHOLE TIME! YOU TOLD YOUR KIDS TO CHEAT!!!!"

to which i responded "dafuq?"

to which he responded "HE TOLD ME YOU TOLD HIM TO STAND THERE AND WAIT FOR THE BALL SO HE COULD SCORE! THAT'S CHEATING! YOU'RE CHEATING!"

trying to set a good example by not throat punching the fat ####, i say "i didn't tell him any such thing. we can disallow the goal. nobody is keeping score anyways. the kids don't know the difference."

he gave me an eye roll and yelled "YOU'RE CHEATING! WE'RE NOT COUNTING THAT GOAL, GUYS! WE'RE NOT GOING TO LOSE BECAUSE THEY CHEAT!"

jesus ####### christ, ace. your special little sunflower won't remember this game come snack time in 20 minutes. unless you bet the mortgage on the outcome tonight, i think you'd better slow down before you choke on your own tongue.
 

the whole night was that way. parents calling out the smallest infractions as though someone was committing murder.

we had a situation where their goalie made a really nice stop, picked up the ball and immediately 15 people were screaming for him to do something different. he was waffling between running, throwing and kicking the ball so quickly that it looked like a computer animation glitching. after a solid 30 seconds he finally settled on putting the ball down in the goalie box, then ran up to boot it.... directly in to one of my kids who reflexively put his arms up to protect his face.  the ball deflected off my kid, i immediately called a hand ball and a free kick... which set off a chorus of cries that my kids were cheating, that i was teaching them to hit the ball with their hands, etc. etc.

it was unbelievable

because we had no whistles & i wasn't keeping time (no watch) we had a parent call out the quarter breaks. at halftime he yelled "HALF! BREAK!" but over the din of the other screaming parents and the kids adrenaline pumping they didn't hear it. so play continued on as i kept repeating "break! break! that's half! but that was apparently drowned out by the parents screaming, and i mean, screaming, that my team was cheating by trying to prevent the ball from going in our goal... even though it was halftime.

it was like listening to 20 drill instructors scream at Marines on day 1, simultaneously.

finally one of my girls just full on dove on top of the ball, got kicked, and the action stopped while the other teams parents screamed "HAND BALL!! THAT'S NOT FAIR!!"

jesus. i'm going to line up all the parents next week and punch every one of them in their face.

tldr; The ref sucked.

 

[El Floppo]

let me explain. no, there is too much. let me sum up.

"gfy, you lot. if youse act out of line next week i'm knuckling each of you down and then siccing my pit bull on your genitals. YIC, furlinho"  @El Floppo

I reiterate

eta: you cheating cheater

 

[Skipdog77]

Man...and I thought it was bad when at my son's Little League District tournament game the other night, an opposing parent started screaming and actually wadded up money and threw it at one of the umps after a close call at first didn't go their way.  

You win. 

 

[SwampDawg]

One of my favorite moments from soccer a couple seasons ago, https://youtu.be/SbrIcrYTvGg?t=47s lady had be complaining to the ref about every call, he finally has enough and tells her if she doesn't want to watch she can go to her car. Background we played this team earlier in the year at their field, ref let everything go and you could tell the team was coached to be physical (this is U9 mind you) we must have had 5 injury stoppages but still won 4-3. The video was from the playoffs, now had a ref and two line judges and they were more experienced, 10 minutes in this big bruiser just lowers his shoulder and trucks our sweeper (who happens to be my son) after he had taken the ball away. Ref yellow cards the kid on the spot, kid comes off crying and this lady (assuming it was his mom) was on the guy until he finally shut her down.

 

[mr. furley]

tldr; The ref sucked.

effing amateur, that guy

 

[mr. furley]

One of my favorite moments from soccer a couple seasons ago, https://youtu.be/SbrIcrYTvGg?t=47s lady had be complaining to the ref about every call, he finally has enough and tells her if she doesn't want to watch she can go to her car. Background we played this team earlier in the year at their field, ref let everything go and you could tell the team was coached to be physical (this is U9 mind you) we must have had 5 injury stoppages but still won 4-3. The video was from the playoffs, now had a ref and two line judges and they were more experienced, 10 minutes in this big bruiser just lowers his shoulder and trucks our sweeper (who happens to be my son) after he had taken the ball away. Ref yellow cards the kid on the spot, kid comes off crying and this lady (assuming it was his mom) was on the guy until he finally shut her down.

fantastic

 

[Godsbrother]

Just in regards to Crazy ### Parents and Youth Sports....My son is on a 10U select baseball team which has 5 coaches, who also have son's on the team. The team has been together for a few years now - so we all know each other on and off the field.  Now granted, some coaches know they're there to help with practices and maybe warm up a pitcher during a game.  With that said, there is one Dad/Coach who has all the parents wondering what is going on in his head.  

His son isn't the most athletic and can't play many positions outside of pitcher.  The kid is too slow for the OF and doesn't field the ball well enough for the IF.   His son hasn't seen much playing time over the last couple of years, so the Dad taught his son how to throw a curveball with the thought that it will entrench him as a starting pitcher on the team.  When his son pitches, he doesn't "coach" any other player but his son.  When I say "coach", I don't mean in the traditional sense.  He waits for his son to enter the dugout with a water bottle and towel.  He then proceeds to hold the water bottle at an angle for his son to drink out of, similar to what you would see in a hamster cage.  He holds it there for all to see, and then when his son is done he takes the towel to wipe down his face, or if its hot, he'll put the towel in ice water and then press it against his son's head and hold it there.  This crazyiness goes on all the time in the dugout between these two, with the rest of the team and coaches having to walk around it - everyone just staring at them.  The parents have noticed this enough time from the sidelines that it is now comical and a little unnerving.  

He is also one of those "dads" who complains because his son doesn't play enough on the team.  Yet his son has logged the most innings pitched by a large margin, and has had a solid amount of playing time in the field.  Something like this just makes me laugh, as I've never heard of a coach complaining that his son doesn't play enough and then turns around and feed him water like a baby in between innings.  I love watching my son play ball, but I'm starting to enjoy the games a little more just to see what this guy does next!  

curveballs at 10U?   When my kids were in youth sports they weren't allowed.  I understand this is a select league but that is still surprising to me.

 

[Ned]

tldr; The ref sucked.

 

[roadkill1292]

One of my favorite moments from soccer a couple seasons ago, https://youtu.be/SbrIcrYTvGg?t=47s lady had be complaining to the ref about every call, he finally has enough and tells her if she doesn't want to watch she can go to her car. Background we played this team earlier in the year at their field, ref let everything go and you could tell the team was coached to be physical (this is U9 mind you) we must have had 5 injury stoppages but still won 4-3. The video was from the playoffs, now had a ref and two line judges and they were more experienced, 10 minutes in this big bruiser just lowers his shoulder and trucks our sweeper (who happens to be my son) after he had taken the ball away. Ref yellow cards the kid on the spot, kid comes off crying and this lady (assuming it was his mom) was on the guy until he finally shut her down.

Man, 9-year-old kids are good these days. Sometimes I feel like I grew up in another century. Wait!

 

[SwampDawg]

curveballs at 10U?   When my kids were in youth sports they weren't allowed.  I understand this is a select league but that is still surprising to me.

We don't allow it even on our tournament teams at that age but some places do. Once we got into the Cal Ripken Districts and States we saw a few teams that had 10U kids throwing curves because it wasn't prohibited. Honestly at that age we didn't see one that could throw it effectively for a strike on any basis. From 46 feet with a 10 year old's power it's not going to be much more then an intimidation pitch to try and get the kid to back out of the box.

 

[Cowboysfan8]

not sure if it was the heat (upper 80s, dewpoints 70+) or what but what a ####show at the soccer game last night. 

we usually have a ref. typically a 14-16 year old boy or girl. didn't have one last night. usually they blow the whistle a few times per game. make sure goal kicks and free kicks are setup (which consists of blowing the whistle, gathering the ball and setting it on the ground). determine throw ins and corners.

because the ref is hired by the league, the ref gives a game report back to the league. that seems to be the cap on parent behavior that people need.

no ref last night = parents going absolutely freaking berserk for 45 minutes.

holy ####. i've never heard so much screaming and complaining. these are SIX AND SEVEN YEAR OLD boys & girls. you'd have thought it was a prize fight with the crowd being split between two groups of people in a blood feud.

since we didn't have a ref & the other coach was a woman in flip flops who..... was not in shape... i volunteered to "ref". before long three parents gathered on the sidelines next to her to "help". which meant screaming at their kids because they felt like they were assistants last night.

at some point, middle of the 1st quarter a kid form the other team went down while action went the other way. i paused to check on him.. he was just tying his shoes.. play on. in the meantime one of my kids, who doesn't listen at all (who tries to sneak on the field during the run of play CONSTANTLY) scored a goal. yay team!

some fat #### on the sideline starts SCREAMING "THAT'S NOT A GOAL! THAT'S NOT FAIR! HE WAS OFFSIDES! YOUR TEAM IS CHEATING! YOU'RE CHEATING! YOU TAUGHT YOUR KIDS TO CHEAT! THAT'S NOT FAIR! WE'RE NOT COUNTING THAT GOAL! THAT'S NOT A GOAL!!!" while turning purple in the face, screaming at my kids who were celebrating like mad.... because they're 6 & 7.

i'm totally bewildered so i walk over and say "what??" to which he responds (screaming) "THAT KID WAS OFFSIDES! HE'S CHEATING! HE WAS WAY OFFSIDES THE WHOLE TIME! YOU TOLD YOUR KIDS TO CHEAT!!!!"

to which i responded "dafuq?"

to which he responded "HE TOLD ME YOU TOLD HIM TO STAND THERE AND WAIT FOR THE BALL SO HE COULD SCORE! THAT'S CHEATING! YOU'RE CHEATING!"

trying to set a good example by not throat punching the fat ####, i say "i didn't tell him any such thing. we can disallow the goal. nobody is keeping score anyways. the kids don't know the difference."

he gave me an eye roll and yelled "YOU'RE CHEATING! WE'RE NOT COUNTING THAT GOAL, GUYS! WE'RE NOT GOING TO LOSE BECAUSE THEY CHEAT!"

jesus ####### christ, ace. your special little sunflower won't remember this game come snack time in 20 minutes. unless you bet the mortgage on the outcome tonight, i think you'd better slow down before you choke on your own tongue.
 

the whole night was that way. parents calling out the smallest infractions as though someone was committing murder.

we had a situation where their goalie made a really nice stop, picked up the ball and immediately 15 people were screaming for him to do something different. he was waffling between running, throwing and kicking the ball so quickly that it looked like a computer animation glitching. after a solid 30 seconds he finally settled on putting the ball down in the goalie box, then ran up to boot it.... directly in to one of my kids who reflexively put his arms up to protect his face.  the ball deflected off my kid, i immediately called a hand ball and a free kick... which set off a chorus of cries that my kids were cheating, that i was teaching them to hit the ball with their hands, etc. etc.

it was unbelievable

because we had no whistles & i wasn't keeping time (no watch) we had a parent call out the quarter breaks. at halftime he yelled "HALF! BREAK!" but over the din of the other screaming parents and the kids adrenaline pumping they didn't hear it. so play continued on as i kept repeating "break! break! that's half! but that was apparently drowned out by the parents screaming, and i mean, screaming, that my team was cheating by trying to prevent the ball from going in our goal... even though it was halftime.

it was like listening to 20 drill instructors scream at Marines on day 1, simultaneously.

finally one of my girls just full on dove on top of the ball, got kicked, and the action stopped while the other teams parents screamed "HAND BALL!! THAT'S NOT FAIR!!"

jesus. i'm going to line up all the parents next week and punch every one of them in their face.

 

[General Malaise]

Any soccer leagues that operate under the auspices of USSF are going to be in for some big changes this fall and I for one cannot wait for the backlash from parents and coaches.  To wit:

- There will be no goalies for 2nd Grade/U8 soccer anymore.  4 v 4 with a build-out line which means all opposing team players will have to remain behind the line for goal kicks and won't be allowed to attack the ball until it crosses the build-out line.  
- For U9-U10 format is 7 v 7 also with a build-out line. There are goal-keepers, but goalies may not longer punt/drop-kick the ball in the air.  He/she must roll, throw or pass the ball back into play after the opponents have retreated.  

Nobody under U12 is allowed to head the ball on purpose.  Purposeful heading results in an indirect free-kick for the opposing team.  

The angry emails and furor over the further wussification of America should make for great reading.

 

[[scooter]]

No ref = no game. Period.

 

[mr. furley]

Any soccer leagues that operate under the auspices of USSF are going to be in for some big changes this fall and I for one cannot wait for the backlash from parents and coaches.  To wit:

- There will be no goalies for 2nd Grade/U8 soccer anymore.  4 v 4 with a build-out line which means all opposing team players will have to remain behind the line for goal kicks and won't be allowed to attack the ball until it crosses the build-out line.  
- For U9-U10 format is 7 v 7 also with a build-out line. There are goal-keepers, but goalies may not longer punt/drop-kick the ball in the air.  He/she must roll, throw or pass the ball back into play after the opponents have retreated.  

Nobody under U12 is allowed to head the ball on purpose.  Purposeful heading results in an indirect free-kick for the opposing team.  

The angry emails and furor over the further wussification of America should make for great reading.

at the coaches meeting pre-season they rolled out some new rules (no headers for under.. i think it was 11 or 12, coaches stay on the sidelines at any level above 6/7, etc.).

pretty civil group but a couple coaches were nitpicking and making a stink.  

change is hard

 

[SwampDawg]

Any soccer leagues that operate under the auspices of USSF are going to be in for some big changes this fall and I for one cannot wait for the backlash from parents and coaches.  To wit:

- There will be no goalies for 2nd Grade/U8 soccer anymore.  4 v 4 with a build-out line which means all opposing team players will have to remain behind the line for goal kicks and won't be allowed to attack the ball until it crosses the build-out line.  
- For U9-U10 format is 7 v 7 also with a build-out line. There are goal-keepers, but goalies may not longer punt/drop-kick the ball in the air.  He/she must roll, throw or pass the ball back into play after the opponents have retreated.  

Nobody under U12 is allowed to head the ball on purpose.  Purposeful heading results in an indirect free-kick for the opposing team.  

The angry emails and furor over the further wussification of America should make for great reading.

Maybe they weren't mandatory but most of those went into effect last year at least with the league our club plays in along with dumb new age cutoff on calendar year instead of school year. The format changes I've got no problem with but they should have started it at U8 and changed as they moved up. For example my sons team was U9 in 2015, and played under the old rules. Last year because they wanted to keep the team together they played U11 (2006) because although they are all in the same grade the team was split between 2006 and 2007 birthdays and hence still had 9v9. However because of numbers a few kids from the year before ended playing U10 (2007), they went from playing the year before 9v9 with regular goalie rules to now playing 7v7 with these new rules, I know one kid who was a pretty good goalie the year before for us said he was done soccer and playing baseball this fall because he felt like he moved backward last year even though he went up an age division.

 

[Ned]

Any soccer leagues that operate under the auspices of USSF are going to be in for some big changes this fall and I for one cannot wait for the backlash from parents and coaches.  To wit:

- There will be no goalies for 2nd Grade/U8 soccer anymore.  4 v 4 with a build-out line which means all opposing team players will have to remain behind the line for goal kicks and won't be allowed to attack the ball until it crosses the build-out line.  
- For U9-U10 format is 7 v 7 also with a build-out line. There are goal-keepers, but goalies may not longer punt/drop-kick the ball in the air.  He/she must roll, throw or pass the ball back into play after the opponents have retreated.  

Nobody under U12 is allowed to head the ball on purpose.  Purposeful heading results in an indirect free-kick for the opposing team.  

The angry emails and furor over the further wussification of America should make for great reading.

This went into effect this past season  

I applauded the changes.

 

[[scooter]]

- There will be no goalies for 2nd Grade/U8 soccer anymore.  4 v 4 with a build-out line which means all opposing team players will have to remain behind the line for goal kicks and won't be allowed to attack the ball until it crosses the build-out line.  
- For U9-U10 format is 7 v 7 also with a build-out line. There are goal-keepers, but goalies may not longer punt/drop-kick the ball in the air.  He/she must roll, throw or pass the ball back into play after the opponents have retreated.  

The good players have learned to exploit the build-out line, especially when the goalie is prevented from drop-kicking the ball. The opposing team can overload the area where the goalie is going to throw the ball, then just wait until the ball rolls past the penalty area, then immediately charge in and steal the ball.

 

[General Malaise]

This went into effect this past season  

I applauded the changes.

Some leagues might have implemented the changes for spring, but the mandates go into place for fall soccer of this year in order for leagues to receive sanctioning.

I think disallowing the goalies to punt the ball is pretty stupid, but hey, I'm a roll with it kind of guy. 

ETA:  Here's USSF's updated Player Development Initiative - all changes are mandated for Aug. 2017.

 

[General Malaise]

The good players have learned to exploit the build-out line, especially when the goalie is prevented from drop-kicking the ball. The opposing team can overload the area where the goalie is going to throw the ball, then just wait until the ball rolls past the penalty area, then immediately charge in and steal the ball.

Yeah, I fully expect that coaches/players will learn how to exploit the new rules and that there will be some re-thinking on this.  The game of soccer didn't really need this much overhaul, IMHO.  I mean, how long before we implement a rule that no balls are allowed in the air period?  It's getting pretty silly.  

 

[General Malaise]

No ref = no game. Period.

I don't think that's fair to the kids at all. I've reffed games or had an assistant coach ref games where we had a no-show and twice where we had a ref leave the game for heat exhaustion or bottle flu.  Just communicate the situation and try to do your best.  This is rec soccer; it's not the World Cup.  If parents can't grasp that, they can leave the field of play.  The kids want to play and it's not fair to take that away from them, nor is it fair to the parents who paid for a full season's worth of games.  Rescheduling is a friggin beyotch.

 

[Ned]

The good players have learned to exploit the build-out line, especially when the goalie is prevented from drop-kicking the ball. The opposing team can overload the area where the goalie is going to throw the ball, then just wait until the ball rolls past the penalty area, then immediately charge in and steal the ball.

Yup.  Having a good ball handler in the back is paramount, whether that's your CB, CM, or whatever.  You gotta put the ball on a capable foot.  Which reinforces what they're trying to accomplish with this rule (playing out of the back).

I saw a lot of coaches skirting the rule by having the keeper roll it to their kid with the biggest foot who'd in turn just bomb it downfield anyway - turning it back into kick and run soccer.  

 

[bigbottom]

One of my favorite moments from soccer a couple seasons ago, https://youtu.be/SbrIcrYTvGg?t=47s lady had be complaining to the ref about every call, he finally has enough and tells her if she doesn't want to watch she can go to her car. Background we played this team earlier in the year at their field, ref let everything go and you could tell the team was coached to be physical (this is U9 mind you) we must have had 5 injury stoppages but still won 4-3. The video was from the playoffs, now had a ref and two line judges and they were more experienced, 10 minutes in this big bruiser just lowers his shoulder and trucks our sweeper (who happens to be my son) after he had taken the ball away. Ref yellow cards the kid on the spot, kid comes off crying and this lady (assuming it was his mom) was on the guy until he finally shut her down.

Dang, some sweet scoring in that championship game!

 

[glvsav37]

One of my favorite moments from soccer a couple seasons ago, https://youtu.be/SbrIcrYTvGg?t=47s lady had be complaining to the ref about every call, he finally has enough and tells her if she doesn't want to watch she can go to her car. 

As an ice hockey ref, going on 17 years now, i've heard pretty much everything. Most stuff I just let slide and laugh it off, parents can be idiots. 

one rink I work has the stands up above the top of glass level, so they can basically be right above you yelling down. One particular game, i was lining and had my back to the boards on that side. This parent was behind me raining insults down on me b/c I didn't call a penalty on the kid who did something to her kid. "WTF Ref...get the whistle out of your ### and call a penalty!" "F@cking guy only calls it one way!" "JFC ref, you gonna call something tonight?!!"

Finally I had enough and turned round and said "Listen lady...you see any orange on these sleeves?? No..because I'm a linesman and I don't call penalties! Do us all a favor and take your kid and go back to the soccer field!" 


Another time I worked a mite game (5-6 year olds) and the visiting team was from Philly. In NY we had at the time a special rule where a high stick was an automatic 2 and 10 min penalty. This one Philly kid, unintentionally but loud enough for the arena to hear it, hits another players helmet and I had to call it. Game goes on, no issues. After in the ref locker room, I hear some commotion outside the door and then it gets pushed in. The kids father come at me in the room screaming "Why the F did he drive 5 hours just to watch his kid sit in the box 'all F'ing game'!!" and he was trying to get at me, but other fathers were holding him back. It wasn't easy but I had to explain the NYS rule to him as calmly as I could all the while waiting for him to punch me in the face. 

Last one...Varsity playoff game, 2 really good teams Sachem vs Ward Melville. Sachem gets smoked 7-0 and on the handshake line, at center ice, the Sachem goalie just steps up and clocks the first guy he sees. All hell breaks loose. I grab the goalie and we go to the ice, i'm on his back and in his ear saying "its the ref...its over....chill out" type stuff. I then feel something tapping on my back and when I look up, I see the off-ice league officials dragging a guy off. Turn out it was the goalies father, and he charged the ice and was trying to throw hay makers at me while i was on his kid. Ironic twist, I find out afterward that the goalie requested special permission from his parole officer to remove the ankle monitor he had so he could play in the game.    

good times.....

 

[mr. furley]

Having a good ball handler in the back is paramount

keep it clean in here, fella

 

[General Malaise]

Yup.  Having a good ball handler in the back is paramount, whether that's your CB, CM, or whatever.  You gotta put the ball on a capable foot.  Which reinforces what they're trying to accomplish with this rule (playing out of the back).

I saw a lot of coaches skirting the rule by having the keeper roll it to their kid with the biggest foot who'd in turn just bomb it downfield anyway - turning it back into kick and run soccer.  

I dunno, if I'm a coach and I don't have a supreme ball handler to carry the ball out of my zone and the ball in play is being descended upon by a mob of attackers, why would you fault the coach for wanting to clear it?  I mean...that is part of soccer, right?  Clearing the ball out of danger?  Not sure why you'd fault a coach for not wanting to give up easy shots on goal.  

 

[Kafka]

keep it clean in here, fella

Do everyone a favor; quit ref'ing.

 

[Jayrod]

Reffed 5 Jr High basketball games last night without any real incidents.  A few of the typical "call it both ways!" and a lot of "foul!" calls out of the stands, but nothing that was a problem.  The facility is run by a really good basketball official and parents know their place.

Organizations run by parents who don't get it are the biggest problem, IMO.  Without good leadership, the inmates will run the asylum.  Goes all the way through high school sports.  When a HS coach has free reign to act however he chooses without any repercussions, it makes things difficult for officials.  Biggest problem in my state (Missouri) is that the HS officials are rated by the coaches.  Sometimes they get too long of a leash because of that.  Refs are afraid their ratings will be poor and they won't get to work playoff games if they give a coach a technical or unsportsmanlike foul.

 

[DallasDMac]

Sounds like soccer brings out the worst in people. Should probably just be banned outright.

 

[glvsav37]

Reffed 5 Jr High basketball games last night without any real incidents.  A few of the typical "call it both ways!" and a lot of "foul!" calls out of the stands, but nothing that was a problem.  The facility is run by a really good basketball official and parents know their place.

Organizations run by parents who don't get it are the biggest problem, IMO.  Without good leadership, the inmates will run the asylum.  Goes all the way through high school sports.  When a HS coach has free reign to act however he chooses without any repercussions, it makes things difficult for officials.  Biggest problem in my state (Missouri) is that the HS officials are rated by the coaches.  Sometimes they get too long of a leash because of that.  Refs are afraid their ratings will be poor and they won't get to work playoff games if they give a coach a technical or unsportsmanlike foul.

offa..thats a bad policy. Thankfully I work under USA hockey and they have a whole internal development and evaluation system. Each league has assignors who 'know their guys' and don't really listen to coaches or parents unless its something real serious. Coaches have no say on who works their games or not and the the assignors are in charge of weeding out of their leagues any poor officials.  

And any coach has to be USAH certified and go though classroom training each season.

I actually have both cards, I'm a Level 3 official (out of 4) and a level 1 coach b/c my son plays and i help his team. 

 

[Gally]

Any soccer leagues that operate under the auspices of USSF are going to be in for some big changes this fall and I for one cannot wait for the backlash from parents and coaches.  To wit:

- There will be no goalies for 2nd Grade/U8 soccer anymore.  4 v 4 with a build-out line which means all opposing team players will have to remain behind the line for goal kicks and won't be allowed to attack the ball until it crosses the build-out line.  
- For U9-U10 format is 7 v 7 also with a build-out line. There are goal-keepers, but goalies may not longer punt/drop-kick the ball in the air.  He/she must roll, throw or pass the ball back into play after the opponents have retreated.  

Nobody under U12 is allowed to head the ball on purpose.  Purposeful heading results in an indirect free-kick for the opposing team.  

The angry emails and furor over the further wussification of America should make for great reading.

This was put into play last year in our area and it led to a lot more dangerous play.  Instead of heading a ball every kid was trying to kick the ball at head level.  It made play very dangerous.  It also made corners essentially useless.  I still think instead of outlawing this type of play they should work on teaching the kids the proper way to head the ball.  Or limit the no heading rule to long sustained kicks like goal kicks or goalie punts.  That is the most destructive as far as concussions are concerned.    

 

[Ned]

I dunno, if I'm a coach and I don't have a supreme ball handler to carry the ball out of my zone and the ball in play is being descended upon by a mob of attackers, why would you fault the coach for wanting to clear it?  I mean...that is part of soccer, right?  Clearing the ball out of danger?  Not sure why you'd fault a coach for not wanting to give up easy shots on goal.  

Teach the team spacing and quick/simple passing. They're not going to learn much playing kick and run. 

 

[parasaurolophus]

Any soccer leagues that operate under the auspices of USSF are going to be in for some big changes this fall and I for one cannot wait for the backlash from parents and coaches.  To wit:

- There will be no goalies for 2nd Grade/U8 soccer anymore.  4 v 4 with a build-out line which means all opposing team players will have to remain behind the line for goal kicks and won't be allowed to attack the ball until it crosses the build-out line.  
- For U9-U10 format is 7 v 7 also with a build-out line. There are goal-keepers, but goalies may not longer punt/drop-kick the ball in the air.  He/she must roll, throw or pass the ball back into play after the opponents have retreated.  

Nobody under U12 is allowed to head the ball on purpose.  Purposeful heading results in an indirect free-kick for the opposing team.  

The angry emails and furor over the further wussification of America should make for great reading.

I support any rule that gets rid of goalies for youth soccer. I feel bad for kids that end up in goal for 8 years only to be replaced by a more athletic kid in high school soccer. 

 

[Peak]

curveballs at 10U?   When my kids were in youth sports they weren't allowed.  I understand this is a select league but that is still surprising to me.

It's not against the rules, but it is frowned upon.  We've been in games where a pitcher has warmed up on the mound and parents sitting in the bleachers behind home plate would loudly "Booooooo" every time the kid through a curveball.  Parents are against it, and our coach was against it for awhile.  His dad (the asst coach) kept telling people that it was a special "change-up" and that he would never teach his kid a curveball.  But you can see the difference when he throws it - he would just never admit it.  The boys on the team knew he was doing it, just because 10 yr olds talk and brag.  

@SwampDawg I completely agree that it's an intimidation pitch.  The kid doesn't throw hard to begin with (maybe 47mph), and his curve comes in slower than that.  The younger, more inexperienced teams are scared of the movement - or can't figure it out.  The more experienced teams have trouble with the timing of it as they're used to the faster pitchers (55+mph).  The one thing I've noticed is that with the more experienced teams, it only takes one time through the lineup before everyone has figured it out and begins holding out for his slow "fastball" and tees off on it.  I've always told my son to work on accuracy first.  Once you can hit all the corners of the strikezone with consistency, that's when you can take time to learn a curveball.  Until then, just throw a Fastball and maybe a Changeup - which even at this age is more like another fastball to him because he can't grip it correctly.

 

[Gally]

Just like with everything moderation is key.  To say no 11 year old should throw a curveball ever isn't necessary.  It is part of learning how to pitch.  

As others have said, spotting pitches is the first skill that must be developed but as a kid matures and can hit his spots you start change of speeds.  Once that has been developed mixing in a curve ball is not the end of the world.  I have allowed my 11 yr olds to throw 3 or 4 (out of 50-60 pitches) in an outing.  It is part of learning how to pitch.

The bigger detriment to kids arms is overuse and not getting recovery time.  Throwing 80 pitches on Saturday and coming back to throw 50 more on Sunday and doing that for 12 months a year is a bigger injury concern than throwing curveballs.  Arms need to recover and that includes taking a few months off every year. 

 

[Bull Dozier]

Just like with everything moderation is key.  To say no 11 year old should throw a curveball ever isn't necessary.  It is part of learning how to pitch.  

As others have said, spotting pitches is the first skill that must be developed but as a kid matures and can hit his spots you start change of speeds.  Once that has been developed mixing in a curve ball is not the end of the world.  I have allowed my 11 yr olds to throw 3 or 4 (out of 50-60 pitches) in an outing.  It is part of learning how to pitch.

The bigger detriment to kids arms is overuse and not getting recovery time.  Throwing 80 pitches on Saturday and coming back to throw 50 more on Sunday and doing that for 12 months a year is a bigger injury concern than throwing curveballs.  Arms need to recover and that includes taking a few months off every year. 

I tend to agree with this.  I cannot stand how my local Babe Ruth league uses their pitchers.  First, they go by inning count, which means nothing.  In a game where one team wins 15-0 in five innings, the winning pitcher and losing pitcher certainly did not put the same stress on their arms, but according their league they did.  They also over use their kids in tournaments because at least at our league, they reset inning counts every two games.  Thus, when they play double headers, they pitch in back to back days constantly.  Coaches that don't have a concern for the kids long term health #1 drive me nuts.  My son played on a 10U travel team one year, and at that point it was a 3 inning max per game.  I was counting pitches on an app to keep myself occupied, and when I told the coach one of his pitchers threw over 100 pitches in one game, he had no idea, and acted like he didn't care. 

 

[General Malaise]

Teach the team spacing and quick/simple passing. They're not going to learn much playing kick and run. 

How do you propose teaching that concept to every mom/dad volunteer rec soccer coach who doesn't grasp the game as well as you?  

 

[Ned]

Teach the team spacing and quick/simple passing. They're not going to learn much playing kick and run. 

How do you propose teaching that concept to every mom/dad volunteer rec soccer coach who doesn't grasp the game as well as you?  

Maybe the board of directors could offer some materials to help adjust to the new rules once the league announces the changes.  Offer some drills and talking points for the coaches so they can be prepared once practices open up.  

 

[CletiusMaximus]

How do you propose teaching that concept to every mom/dad volunteer rec soccer coach who doesn't grasp the game as well as you?  

There's no question its a challenging proposition for US Soccer. We have hundreds of thousands of kids playing soccer, but most of them are coached by well-meaning, hard-working volunteer parents who don't have a great amount of training or experience with youth development in the sport (and in many cases, no training or experience in soccer.) The volunteer parent coach is a tremendous resource for youth soccer in our country to keep costs down and provide opportunities for so many kids to play, but it does come with a cost. This is a baby-steps thing.  The "play from the back" mandate is a small step meant to encourage youth coaches to teach ball skills, technique and develop confidence on the ball.  Many youth clubs have had this policy in place for many years - banning their coaches from allowing GK's to punt or kick the ball out, at least at the younger ages. I think they understand there will be some frustration and pain associated with this.

 

[Peak]

I tend to agree with this.  I cannot stand how my local Babe Ruth league uses their pitchers.  First, they go by inning count, which means nothing.  In a game where one team wins 15-0 in five innings, the winning pitcher and losing pitcher certainly did not put the same stress on their arms, but according their league they did.  They also over use their kids in tournaments because at least at our league, they reset inning counts every two games.  Thus, when they play double headers, they pitch in back to back days constantly.  Coaches that don't have a concern for the kids long term health #1 drive me nuts.  My son played on a 10U travel team one year, and at that point it was a 3 inning max per game.  I was counting pitches on an app to keep myself occupied, and when I told the coach one of his pitchers threw over 100 pitches in one game, he had no idea, and acted like he didn't care. 

My son's coach is really good about tracking pitch counts. I've seen some kids on other teams have up near 150 pitches over 3 games in a 1-2 day span.  To me that is ridiculous.  The Head Coach for my son's team is good to make sure if they hit a certain threshold that they rest a set # of days after they pitch (ex: 20 pitches = 1 day rest, 40 pitches = 3 days rest,etc).  He tries to make sure none of the boys overthrow, and typically caps them at 50-60 pitches/game.  He's only gone over 60 pitches in a game twice this year, and both times he made sure the parents were involved in the decision and made sure the player was physically able to keep going.  He's very careful about this, and something I do like about this team and coaches.

 

[Gally]

My son's coach is really good about tracking pitch counts. I've seen some kids on other teams have up near 150 pitches over 3 games in a 1-2 day span.  To me that is ridiculous.  The Head Coach for my son's team is good to make sure if they hit a certain threshold that they rest a set # of days after they pitch (ex: 20 pitches = 1 day rest, 40 pitches = 3 days rest,etc).  He tries to make sure none of the boys overthrow, and typically caps them at 50-60 pitches/game.  He's only gone over 60 pitches in a game twice this year, and both times he made sure the parents were involved in the decision and made sure the player was physically able to keep going.  He's very careful about this, and something I do like about this team and coaches.

Using Innings as the restriction is outdated and many leagues have gone to a pitch count with required days off after going over a certain threshold.  This is a good start, however, kids need to also get a break throughout the year to give their arms a total rest.  They should have at least a couple months of very little to no throwing coupled with different athletic activities.  Overuse in season is one aspect but overuse by never getting a break (even if monitored closely) throughout the year is also a bad thing.  Muscles/joints/tendons need recovery time.  Playing 12 months a year takes a toll on the arm and leads to injuries. 

In addition, arm conditioning (long toss) and technique will go a long way to keeping the arm healthy as well.       

 

[General Malaise]

There's no question its a challenging proposition for US Soccer. We have hundreds of thousands of kids playing soccer, but most of them are coached by well-meaning, hard-working volunteer parents who don't have a great amount of training or experience with youth development in the sport (and in many cases, no training or experience in soccer.) The volunteer parent coach is a tremendous resource for youth soccer in our country to keep costs down and provide opportunities for so many kids to play, but it does come with a cost. This is a baby-steps thing.  The "play from the back" mandate is a small step meant to encourage youth coaches to teach ball skills, technique and develop confidence on the ball.  Many youth clubs have had this policy in place for many years - banning their coaches from allowing GK's to punt or kick the ball out, at least at the younger ages. I think they understand there will be some frustration and pain associated with this.

It's going to be a slow process here for sure.  Asking volunteer parents to coach their players a different style of soccer than what they grew up playing or learning is a tall order and while I understand why USSF is making these changes, it's going to take some time to see the benefits to youth players.  Despite the mandates that rec soccer is about development and fun, you are ALWAYS going to have coaches who want to win above all else.  That's just the facts of life and you really can't be as selective as you want to be when you're relying on volunteers.  So again, if you have a rogue coach who instructs his players to descend upon the ball in play which might cause a 3rd grade kid to panic and turn it over deep in their zone, what's the other coach supposed to do to combat that?  Just keep letting it happen?  Pooh-poohing a coach who counters that attack with a strong footed kid booting the ball out of their zone isn't really fair to the coach who is just trying to counter.  

 

 

[Don't Noonan]

I have coached my son's club baseball team the past two years and we will start practicing next month for the 12U season.  My son is one of our best pitchers on the team but I have not taught him a curve ball or slider.  He locates his fastball well and has a good change up.  Some of the kids on our team will mess around trying to throw a curve ball in the bullpen but they don't really know what they are doing and up until this point I haven't tried to help them.  

At what point would you recommend teaching the kids a curve ball or slider?  I wasn't planning on teaching my son until high school but perhaps that it is a mistake.

 

[Bull Dozier]

I have coached my son's club baseball team the past two years and we will start practicing next month for the 12U season.  My son is one of our best pitchers on the team but I have not taught him a curve ball or slider.  He locates his fastball well and has a good change up.  Some of the kids on our team will mess around trying to throw a curve ball in the bullpen but they don't really know what they are doing and up until this point I haven't tried to help them.  

At what point would you recommend teaching the kids a curve ball or slider?  I wasn't planning on teaching my son until high school but perhaps that it is a mistake.

If you listen to Dr. James Andrew's, he says 14 for a curve ball.  There has been a lot of research done lately, and it seems to be inconclusive.  They cannot prove, either way, if throwing a curve before a certain age is detrimental or not.  I tend to think Andrews knows what he's talking about.

Slider, as far as I know, are much harder on their arm and I wouldn't let my kid throw one unless he was a physically mature high level pitcher that actually needed to add it to their arsenal to continue to be effective.  I think a fastball that can be placed, curve ball and change up are all a youth pitcher needs.  The next thing I would teach is a knuckle ball.  I know only a couple of kids that have learned to throw them effectively, but they are the most effective youth pitch I've seen other than an overpowering fast ball (which kids either have or don't).

 

[Don't Noonan]

If you listen to Dr. James Andrew's, he says 14 for a curve ball.  There has been a lot of research done lately, and it seems to be inconclusive.  They cannot prove, either way, if throwing a curve before a certain age is detrimental or not.  I tend to think Andrews knows what he's talking about.

Slider, as far as I know, are much harder on their arm and I wouldn't let my kid throw one unless he was a physically mature high level pitcher that actually needed to add it to their arsenal to continue to be effective.  I think a fastball that can be placed, curve ball and change up are all a youth pitcher needs.  The next thing I would teach is a knuckle ball.  I know only a couple of kids that have learned to throw them effectively, but they are the most effective youth pitch I've seen other than an overpowering fast ball (which kids either have or don't).

Thanks.  Pretty much my thoughts too.  We really haven't faced any kids throwing effective curve balls yet but I suspect we will see some at 12U.  I never threw a knuckle ball so I would not be able to teach them that.  

 

[CletiusMaximus]

It's going to be a slow process here for sure.  Asking volunteer parents to coach their players a different style of soccer than what they grew up playing or learning is a tall order and while I understand why USSF is making these changes, it's going to take some time to see the benefits to youth players.  Despite the mandates that rec soccer is about development and fun, you are ALWAYS going to have coaches who want to win above all else.  That's just the facts of life and you really can't be as selective as you want to be when you're relying on volunteers.  So again, if you have a rogue coach who instructs his players to descend upon the ball in play which might cause a 3rd grade kid to panic and turn it over deep in their zone, what's the other coach supposed to do to combat that?  Just keep letting it happen?  Pooh-poohing a coach who counters that attack with a strong footed kid booting the ball out of their zone isn't really fair to the coach who is just trying to counter.  

 

I agree its a problem and don't have a good solution, other than to just note the coaches will hopefully want to focus a bit more on teaching good touch/control and occupying space. I assume a GK can still boot a live ball that is kicked back by a teammate, so there is always that option.  GK's can learn to be calm with the ball.  Coaches may have to make sure their better players track back and spread out to help out.  One thing we always see in youth games in the US - when the ball is in the penalty area, all the parents are screaming at the kids to boot it out of there like its a bomb or something. Kids panic and end up being afraid of playing the ball, wanting to get rid of it like a hot potato.  What's really happening is they are giving up possession due to lack of confidence on the ball.

In youth basketball, my son played for several years with a rule that defenders can't press.  I think at 6 and 7 it was no defending until essentially the 3/4 line, at the top of the key. Then it was moved to half-court. The point could bring the ball up unmolested and get the offense set up. There was no stealing and no 3-second violation in the lane.  By 5th grade, they were only allowed to press in the backcourt in the last 2 minutes of each half. By 6th grade, they are playing with normal rules.  Maybe soccer could do something similar.

 

[General Malaise]

One thing we always see in youth games in the US - when the ball is in the penalty area, all the parents are screaming at the kids to boot it out of there like its a bomb or something. Kids panic and end up being afraid of playing the ball, wanting to get rid of it like a hot potato.  What's really happening is they are giving up possession due to lack of confidence on the ball.

So true and I am so guilty of having done that as a coach early on.  Just instinct as that's how we were taught and what I did as a defender.  But you're absolutely right in that we need to teach the defenders to view possession as a chance to set up the offense and if you have a kid that understands that, he can act as a point guard back there.  

What's kind of fun for me is that I've been coaching soccer since 2009 and have learned a LOT along the way.  I'm a way different coach today than I was early on thanks to experience and clinics and reading things here and there.  I get a second chance to start coaching all over again with a 5 year old girl and then my twins who are 2 now.  That's pretty rare to get a second chance to go back and do it all over again armed with experience and I'm really looking forward to it.  This fall I'll be coaching HS Coed Rec and Girls Micro soccer.  What a world!