For those that voted for Obama - how do you feel (2 Viewers)

[rct]

Not sure this is a a great arena for me. Not many fans here anymore, which I don't need. I just need non-biased input as far as the opinion of the debaters is concerned. Can I get that? Regardless, I'm game.

If you were really looking for non-biased input, perhaps it might have been better not to refer to Obama as a reptile in the OP.

 

[datonn]

Sober as a judge. Not hard to figure out. When I use its a lot of work. Costs me about $100 a day. I don't have time to embarrass liberals in here.

On another not those "happy" with their vote should be lobotomized. You're a danger to your wife and kids and more importantly my country.

Care to unpack that one little sentence? What's a lot of work? Typing? Insulting people? Projecting bravado to cover-up some type of emptiness or inadequacy issues you're feeling inside?

Am I happy with the current state of the country? No. Do I like everything Obama's done while in office? No. Do I blame Obama for a lot of the stuff that's happened (or hasn't happened) the past five years? No. I blame all the sheep/lemmings on BOTH sides of the aisle, all the millions of partisan hacks and/or the people who were lobotomized after Clinton couldn't remember what the definition of 'is' is. Dividing our nation in two. And would I change my votes for POTUS in 2008 or 2012? No.

Liberals *AND* Conservatives are destroying our nation. Only those folks on the poles can't see the planks in their own eyes...all they can see (and talk about) are the specks on the other side of the aisle. Moderates/Independents are the only people with a friggin' clue, and any hope of saving this country. Everything else is just But you can't see that either. Imagine my surprise.

When I use drugs its a lot of work. I was responding to someone claims I am loaded. Once again: read, comprehend, then reply.

and...

I'll say it once again: read my posts, try to comprehend them, don't skim them, then reply. I have never once in any of my posts defended our typical conservatives or the GOP candidates or any other mainstream conservative...except the Great Dr. Savage.

When you use drugs, it is a lot of work (I assume you meant to type "it's"). So using drugs is a lot of work?! Drugs is the "it?" Because drowning your liver, snorting some white powder, smoking some pot, or sticking a needle into one of your veins doesn't seem like much/any work. Seems more likely that doing something *after* you're high is what is the work. Like this comprehension thing you keep referring to. You know...so you don't post two replies to the same message (#191 and #195) within 20 minutes of one another, going 0-for-2 in having either of them be very relevant to the question(s) at hand.

But hey, this is your fishing trip...so you do it any way you want to do it. It's been more entertaining than sad, so knock yourself out.

 

[timschochet]

But Finless, if your posts about Obama aren't shtick, then they're just weird. Can you provide specific examples of how he has been such a disaster?

Bump. This goes for anyone else here too. Ghost Rider- though you seem to hate to respond to me.But I'm just not getting the "disaster" part. I've had this same conversation with conservative friends and relatives who hate Obama- when challenged, they start with Obamacare, and basically have nothing beyond that. And even with Obamacare all they can do is spout conservative rhetoric without any real knowledge of the facts. In the final analysis, it appears that they hate Obama because they hate Obama.

Yeah I can list a few.

Still waiting...

 

[The Commish]

Of what the GOP presented, Huntsman was probably the most reasonable candidate. Granted, we don't know what skeletons are in his closet like we do Romney, but I don't think it was reasonable for the GOP to go "used car salesman / slick politician" given what was going on at the time.

Do you think Huntsman would have won the general? If not, then my point remains the same. If so, go get yourself checked out.

Sorry...what was YOUR point? I thought you were talking about the reasonableness of the candidate, not who was most likely to win the election. The GOP is so far out of whack at the moment, picking a reasonable candidate is probably step one in getting things turned around. You have to stop digging if you want to get out of the hole. The GOP has a lot of work to do, but I can assure you...going down this same path isn't going to fix anything for them, thus my comment regarding Huntsman. The GOP has to convince onlookers that they are about change not SSDD. Huntsman would have been a much better choice towards that end game than Romney.

 

[TPW]

Not sure this is a a great arena for me. Not many fans here anymore, which I don't need. I just need non-biased input as far as the opinion of the debaters is concerned. Can I get that? Regardless, I'm game.

I think you're spot on.

My posts havent changed a bit. I was saying this before he was voted in and was always accused of fishing. Guess I'm still fishing. Would like to just hear some of you guys say "yeah, he fooled me. I voted for a reptilian scum bag". We were warned about this man.

Good luck getting people to admit they were wrong. Liberals in particular tend seem to suffer from ego driven solipsism.

 

[timschochet]

Not sure this is a a great arena for me. Not many fans here anymore, which I don't need. I just need non-biased input as far as the opinion of the debaters is concerned. Can I get that? Regardless, I'm game.

I think you're spot on.

My posts havent changed a bit. I was saying this before he was voted in and was always accused of fishing. Guess I'm still fishing. Would like to just hear some of you guys say "yeah, he fooled me. I voted for a reptilian scum bag". We were warned about this man.

Good luck getting people to admit they were wrong. Liberals in particular tend seem to suffer from ego driven solipsism.

TPW, perhaps you want to take on the challenge which everyone else has so far refused. What SPECIFIC actions of Obama have been disastrous for the country?

 

[humpback]

Of what the GOP presented, Huntsman was probably the most reasonable candidate. Granted, we don't know what skeletons are in his closet like we do Romney, but I don't think it was reasonable for the GOP to go "used car salesman / slick politician" given what was going on at the time.

Do you think Huntsman would have won the general? If not, then my point remains the same. If so, go get yourself checked out.

Sorry...what was YOUR point? I thought you were talking about the reasonableness of the candidate, not who was most likely to win the election. The GOP is so far out of whack at the moment, picking a reasonable candidate is probably step one in getting things turned around. You have to stop digging if you want to get out of the hole. The GOP has a lot of work to do, but I can assure you...going down this same path isn't going to fix anything for them, thus my comment regarding Huntsman. The GOP has to convince onlookers that they are about change not SSDD. Huntsman would have been a much better choice towards that end game than Romney.

If you look at his post that I responded to (the one you said was pretty much spot on), he said that "any decent, reasonable candidate" would have beaten Obama. Even if you think Huntsman was "more reasonable", he certainly wasn't going to win the election.

 

[humpback]

When did "uncertainty" replace "the homosexual agenda" as the new liberal boogeyman?

Back in the day, businesses knew exactly what was coming next. Wars? Bursting market bubbles? Environmental disasters? Elections? They saw it coming a decade away. But now there's all this uncertainty. Thanks a lot, Obama!

Obviously there is always a level of uncertainty. However, if you don't think that there's been more uncertainty over the last several years than normal, you must not be paying attention (regardless of who you want to blame for that).

I think it's myopic to look at the uncertainty we faced in the wake of 2008 and point to Dodd-Frank and the ACA as the cause or even a significant contributor (not that you were doing that, but I have seen people do it).

Right, I'm not doing that, but it's also myopic to pretend that there hasn't been any more uncertainty than usual (again, regardless of the cause or who you want to blame).

 

[TPW]

Not sure this is a a great arena for me. Not many fans here anymore, which I don't need. I just need non-biased input as far as the opinion of the debaters is concerned. Can I get that? Regardless, I'm game.

I think you're spot on.

My posts havent changed a bit. I was saying this before he was voted in and was always accused of fishing. Guess I'm still fishing. Would like to just hear some of you guys say "yeah, he fooled me. I voted for a reptilian scum bag". We were warned about this man.

Good luck getting people to admit they were wrong. Liberals in particular tend seem to suffer from ego driven solipsism.

TPW, perhaps you want to take on the challenge which everyone else has so far refused. What SPECIFIC actions of Obama have been disastrous for the country?

The correct phrasing of your question is not "have been". It's "will be".

Obamacare, amnesty for illegals, massive accumulation of debt, the debasing of the traditional institution of marriage, attacks against the religious freedoms of various faiths and institutions, unconstitutional recess appointments, the stirring up of racial animus by inserting himself into local law enforcement cases, the use of military force without the consultation of congress....

I could go on and on. None of these things in and of themselves are a disaster but their combined effects are going to result in a lower standard of living for most Americans in decades to come and the weakening of the rule of law. I'm just glad I won't live to see the worst of it.

 

[HellToupee]

Of what the GOP presented, Huntsman was probably the most reasonable candidate. Granted, we don't know what skeletons are in his closet like we do Romney, but I don't think it was reasonable for the GOP to go "used car salesman / slick politician" given what was going on at the time.

this is such . You bought into that meme hook line & sinker. Mitt is farthest from your description . Guy is a straight talking , genuine ,wholesome family man. Cripes

 

[The Commish]

Of what the GOP presented, Huntsman was probably the most reasonable candidate. Granted, we don't know what skeletons are in his closet like we do Romney, but I don't think it was reasonable for the GOP to go "used car salesman / slick politician" given what was going on at the time.

Do you think Huntsman would have won the general? If not, then my point remains the same. If so, go get yourself checked out.

Sorry...what was YOUR point? I thought you were talking about the reasonableness of the candidate, not who was most likely to win the election. The GOP is so far out of whack at the moment, picking a reasonable candidate is probably step one in getting things turned around. You have to stop digging if you want to get out of the hole. The GOP has a lot of work to do, but I can assure you...going down this same path isn't going to fix anything for them, thus my comment regarding Huntsman. The GOP has to convince onlookers that they are about change not SSDD. Huntsman would have been a much better choice towards that end game than Romney.

If you look at his post that I responded to (the one you said was pretty much spot on), he said that "any decent, reasonable candidate" would have beaten Obama. Even if you think Huntsman was "more reasonable", he certainly wasn't going to win the election.

ok?? Did I make a claim that he would??

 

[The Commish]

Of what the GOP presented, Huntsman was probably the most reasonable candidate. Granted, we don't know what skeletons are in his closet like we do Romney, but I don't think it was reasonable for the GOP to go "used car salesman / slick politician" given what was going on at the time.

this is such . You bought into that meme hook line & sinker. Mitt is farthest from your description . Guy is a straight talking , genuine ,wholesome family man. Cripes

meme?? what would that meme be??

 

[humpback]

Of what the GOP presented, Huntsman was probably the most reasonable candidate. Granted, we don't know what skeletons are in his closet like we do Romney, but I don't think it was reasonable for the GOP to go "used car salesman / slick politician" given what was going on at the time.

Do you think Huntsman would have won the general? If not, then my point remains the same. If so, go get yourself checked out.

Sorry...what was YOUR point? I thought you were talking about the reasonableness of the candidate, not who was most likely to win the election. The GOP is so far out of whack at the moment, picking a reasonable candidate is probably step one in getting things turned around. You have to stop digging if you want to get out of the hole. The GOP has a lot of work to do, but I can assure you...going down this same path isn't going to fix anything for them, thus my comment regarding Huntsman. The GOP has to convince onlookers that they are about change not SSDD. Huntsman would have been a much better choice towards that end game than Romney.

If you look at his post that I responded to (the one you said was pretty much spot on), he said that "any decent, reasonable candidate" would have beaten Obama. Even if you think Huntsman was "more reasonable", he certainly wasn't going to win the election.

ok?? Did I make a claim that he would??

You said "pretty much spot on" to a post that did. Let's move on.

 

[The Man Who Met Andy Griffith]

Yes, I'm extremely happy with my decision overall

Things I'm delighted about

-We avoided a second Great Depression, almost entirely due to the stimulus plan that Obama passed and which McCain opposed

-America has begun closing the gap vs. the rest of the civilized world in access to--and cost effectiveness of--health care, which McCain opposed

-We have not engaged in any ruinous wars (I find it almost implausible that McCain would not have started a ground war with Iran)

-We stopped torturing people (McCain would have done this too)

-We appointed one great supreme court justice (Kagan), and one pretty good one (Sotomayor) (I don't know what McCain would have done)

Things I'm not delighted about

-Guantanamo

-Fiscal stimulus has been way too limited (e.g., in comparison to FDR, or to China) thus causing growth to be slower than it should be

-Monetary policy (QE) has been too loose IMO although this one is tricky

Of those three, the first is largely Obama's responsibility. With #2 he did all he could considering the lunatics in congress. #3 is Bernanke.

The biggest problem in the last five years has been the Tea Party, but I don't blame Obama for that. People act like Republican insanity is some sort of response to Obama (or his race), but they were just as insane interpersonally when Clinton was around, although their policies weren't nearly as insane back then (recall that the PPACA was a close copy of the Republican health care plan under Gingrich).

 

[timschochet]

Not sure this is a a great arena for me. Not many fans here anymore, which I don't need. I just need non-biased input as far as the opinion of the debaters is concerned. Can I get that? Regardless, I'm game.

I think you're spot on.

My posts havent changed a bit. I was saying this before he was voted in and was always accused of fishing. Guess I'm still fishing. Would like to just hear some of you guys say "yeah, he fooled me. I voted for a reptilian scum bag". We were warned about this man.

Good luck getting people to admit they were wrong. Liberals in particular tend seem to suffer from ego driven solipsism.

TPW, perhaps you want to take on the challenge which everyone else has so far refused. What SPECIFIC actions of Obama have been disastrous for the country?

The correct phrasing of your question is not "have been". It's "will be".

Obamacare, amnesty for illegals, massive accumulation of debt, the debasing of the traditional institution of marriage, attacks against the religious freedoms of various faiths and institutions, unconstitutional recess appointments, the stirring up of racial animus by inserting himself into local law enforcement cases, the use of military force without the consultation of congress....

I could go on and on. None of these things in and of themselves are a disaster but their combined effects are going to result in a lower standard of living for most Americans in decades to come and the weakening of the rule of law. I'm just glad I won't live to see the worst of it.

That's what I figured. So basically it's Obamacare and a whole bunch of crapola. Oh and as far as your point about amnesty for illegals- IF ONLY.

 

[bonesman]

I am disappointed in his performance. He has carried over some of Bush's policies and has not taken enough action on others.

I would not take back my votes. The alternative I still feel would have been worse

I clearly remember mobs of of people. The collective thought and platform from which this slimy snake sprang was "change" a new day in America is dawning...an age of light and equality - where education and the people would be more important than the agenda of the machine. The blacks partying in the streets as if this was going to somehow be the end of the oppression they'd always lived with. People would have jobs, free health insurance for everyone.

This may go down as the worst decision our Country has ever made. The wolf in sheep's clothing. Reminds me of the devil coming out of nowhere with his silver tongued rhetoric not on fooling the masses on the outwardly but actually crawling into their hearts and souls making them believe for the first time in a decade that the people will have hope and Obama was going to spearhead this New golden age.

My posts havent changed a bit. I was saying this before he was voted in and was always accused of fishing. Guess I'm still fishing. Would like to just hear some of you guys say "yeah, he fooled me. I voted for a reptilian scum bag". We were warned about this man.

You're just coming off as racist dude. Yea, he's a reptile. So was the alternative. I didn't vote for him so I'm not standing up for him, but what do you think would have been so different if a ® was in office?

"The blacks".... lol, WTF

 

[jamny]

Of what the GOP presented, Huntsman was probably the most reasonable candidate. Granted, we don't know what skeletons are in his closet like we do Romney, but I don't think it was reasonable for the GOP to go "used car salesman / slick politician" given what was going on at the time.

this is such . You bought into that meme hook line & sinker. Mitt is farthest from your description . Guy is a straight talking , genuine ,wholesome family man. Cripes

The massive amount of lies put through by social media memes about Romney is what killed him. Obama won by lies spewed about Romney. He was the best thing that could have happened for this country. I can't see a more qualified candidate. From now on it'll have to be Idiocracy showmanship to win. Not who you are and what you can do but what image you can portray.

 

[lod01]

While I voted for Gary Johnson, I rooted for the democrat to win. My investments show that the right party is in the WH. The bottom line is my bottom line and it's a helluva lot better with a democrat in the WH than it was for 8 years of republican WH occupation. Anyone saying differently is a loser.

 

[jamny]

While I voted for Gary Johnson, I rooted for the democrat to win. My investments show that the right party is in the WH. The bottom line is my bottom line and it's a helluva lot better with a democrat in the WH than it was for 8 years of republican WH occupation. Anyone saying differently is a loser.

I can totally respect that. Everyone has their gauge. I just hope you can change your perspective if the market tanks since it seems obvious that the main reason it's had this run is because of the Fed input. Crazy balance between economy and market bubble coming.

 

[Willie Neslon]

My wife and I did not vote for the president but we thought it would be fun to give him our grade. So we judged him in a number of catagories like foreign policy, domestic, likeness, wars and a few others. We averaged our two scores together for a final grade. We ended up giving him a 71 which if was a school grade would be a C minus.

 

[ffldrew]

Of what the GOP presented, Huntsman was probably the most reasonable candidate. Granted, we don't know what skeletons are in his closet like we do Romney, but I don't think it was reasonable for the GOP to go "used car salesman / slick politician" given what was going on at the time.

this is such . You bought into that meme hook line & sinker. Mitt is farthest from your description . Guy is a straight talking , genuine ,wholesome family man. Cripes

The massive amount of lies put through by social media memes about Romney is what killed him. Obama won by lies spewed about Romney. He was the best thing that could have happened for this country. I can't see a more qualified candidate. From now on it'll have to be Idiocracy showmanship to win. Not who you are and what you can do but what image you can portray.

Nothing like a little straight talk on the 47% - and of course he was real genuine here when he thought the cameras were off

 

[jamny]

Of what the GOP presented, Huntsman was probably the most reasonable candidate. Granted, we don't know what skeletons are in his closet like we do Romney, but I don't think it was reasonable for the GOP to go "used car salesman / slick politician" given what was going on at the time.

this is such . You bought into that meme hook line & sinker. Mitt is farthest from your description . Guy is a straight talking , genuine ,wholesome family man. Cripes

The massive amount of lies put through by social media memes about Romney is what killed him. Obama won by lies spewed about Romney. He was the best thing that could have happened for this country. I can't see a more qualified candidate. From now on it'll have to be Idiocracy showmanship to win. Not who you are and what you can do but what image you can portray.

Nothing like a little straight talk on the 47% - and of course he was real genuine here when he thought the cameras were off

Yes, he blew it and was absolutely right in that video and should have campaigned like that. He shouldn't have tried to deny his wealth or how he got there.

 

[The Commish]

Of what the GOP presented, Huntsman was probably the most reasonable candidate. Granted, we don't know what skeletons are in his closet like we do Romney, but I don't think it was reasonable for the GOP to go "used car salesman / slick politician" given what was going on at the time.

this is such . You bought into that meme hook line & sinker. Mitt is farthest from your description . Guy is a straight talking , genuine ,wholesome family man. Cripes

The massive amount of lies put through by social media memes about Romney is what killed him. Obama won by lies spewed about Romney. He was the best thing that could have happened for this country. I can't see a more qualified candidate. From now on it'll have to be Idiocracy showmanship to win. Not who you are and what you can do but what image you can portray.

What lies are we talking about specifically? From where I'm standing, Romney's own actions are what killed him. Changing his position on the things that you could actually get him to take a position on in the first place, being so vague in his platform and the double standard of transparency was more than enough for me. Are you suggesting that he wasn't any of those things? I don't think we even need to get into his choice to try and be someone he wasn't do we??

 

[joffer]

Romney might be the biggest panderer ever to run for President

 

[HellToupee]

Romney might be the biggest panderer ever to run for President

Mitt made mistakes in his campaign but you can't compare his pandering with Obama's. There were no Romey phones

 

[jamny]

Of what the GOP presented, Huntsman was probably the most reasonable candidate. Granted, we don't know what skeletons are in his closet like we do Romney, but I don't think it was reasonable for the GOP to go "used car salesman / slick politician" given what was going on at the time.

this is such . You bought into that meme hook line & sinker. Mitt is farthest from your description . Guy is a straight talking , genuine ,wholesome family man. Cripes

The massive amount of lies put through by social media memes about Romney is what killed him. Obama won by lies spewed about Romney. He was the best thing that could have happened for this country. I can't see a more qualified candidate. From now on it'll have to be Idiocracy showmanship to win. Not who you are and what you can do but what image you can portray.

What lies are we talking about specifically? From where I'm standing, Romney's own actions are what killed him. Changing his position on the things that you could actually get him to take a position on in the first place, being so vague in his platform and the double standard of transparency was more than enough for me. Are you suggesting that he wasn't any of those things? I don't think we even need to get into his choice to try and be someone he wasn't do we??

How about the lies about what Romney said about Detroit and the bankruptcy

How about that Bain video that was full of inaccuracies and outright lies

How about Harry Reid saying he had proof of Romney cheating on his taxes

How about the disputed $5 trillion dollar tax cut issue - never adding that it included cutting loopholes.

and that Romney's health care plan didn't have consideration for pre-existing conditions.

just a couple of things. If you didn't see during all that time that there was a concerted effort in social media to hack and distort Romney's positions during the election, you weren't paying attention. Unfortunately, that's the way elections have to be from now on. Perception over reality and bash, bash, bash.

 

[ffldrew]

Romney might be the biggest panderer ever to run for President

Mitt made mistakes in his campaign but you can't compare his pandering with Obama's. There were no Romey phones

Yes there were - he gave out gold plated ones to all his buddies in the 1% for donating to the campaign - what did you do with yours?

 

[jamny]

Of what the GOP presented, Huntsman was probably the most reasonable candidate. Granted, we don't know what skeletons are in his closet like we do Romney, but I don't think it was reasonable for the GOP to go "used car salesman / slick politician" given what was going on at the time.

this is such . You bought into that meme hook line & sinker. Mitt is farthest from your description . Guy is a straight talking , genuine ,wholesome family man. Cripes

The massive amount of lies put through by social media memes about Romney is what killed him. Obama won by lies spewed about Romney. He was the best thing that could have happened for this country. I can't see a more qualified candidate. From now on it'll have to be Idiocracy showmanship to win. Not who you are and what you can do but what image you can portray.

What lies are we talking about specifically? From where I'm standing, Romney's own actions are what killed him. Changing his position on the things that you could actually get him to take a position on in the first place, being so vague in his platform and the double standard of transparency was more than enough for me. Are you suggesting that he wasn't any of those things? I don't think we even need to get into his choice to try and be someone he wasn't do we??

How about the lies about what Romney said about Detroit and the bankruptcy

How about that Bain video that was full of inaccuracies and outright lies

How about Harry Reid saying he had proof of Romney cheating on his taxes

How about the disputed $5 trillion dollar tax cut issue - never adding that it included cutting loopholes.

and that Romney's health care plan didn't have consideration for pre-existing conditions.

just a couple of things. If you didn't see during all that time that there was a concerted effort in social media to hack and distort Romney's positions during the election, you weren't paying attention. Unfortunately, that's the way elections have to be from now on. Perception over reality and bash, bash, bash.

and I'll agree that he totally blew it by trying to be something he wasn't. He should have owned up to being a successful businessman/politician and not try to be an everyman but I think his team didn't grasp the power of social media and the internet.

 

[AAABatteries]

I'm convinced my life would be no different now than it would have been if Obama lost either of the times. They all suck - all of them.

 

[Politician Spock]

at discussing politics and asking "what lies?"

 

[cstu]

Romney might be the biggest panderer ever to run for President

Mitt made mistakes in his campaign but you can't compare his pandering with Obama's. There were no Romey phones

Though nicknamed after the president, the program was started in 1985 under President Ronald Reagan (applied to land lines for the elderly, at the time) and was expanded to cover cellphone service in 2005 under President George W. Bush.

Read more: http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/money/2013/08/29/obama-phone-program-is-critical-to-latinos-and-should-be-expanded-lulac-argues/#ixzz2dVr91hDX

 

[top dog]

These "disasters" of Obama's presidency have largely been avoided thankfully to our Republican's in congress blockading his proposals as much as possible.

 

[Steve Tasker]

Of what the GOP presented, Huntsman was probably the most reasonable candidate. Granted, we don't know what skeletons are in his closet like we do Romney, but I don't think it was reasonable for the GOP to go "used car salesman / slick politician" given what was going on at the time.

this is such . You bought into that meme hook line & sinker. Mitt is farthest from your description . Guy is a straight talking , genuine ,wholesome family man. Cripes

The massive amount of lies put through by social media memes about Romney is what killed him. Obama won by lies spewed about Romney. He was the best thing that could have happened for this country. I can't see a more qualified candidate. From now on it'll have to be Idiocracy showmanship to win. Not who you are and what you can do but what image you can portray.

I don't know Romney, so he very well may be a very genuine person, but he came off as one of the smarmiest, most fake mother####ers I've ever seen.

 

[top dog]

Of what the GOP presented, Huntsman was probably the most reasonable candidate. Granted, we don't know what skeletons are in his closet like we do Romney, but I don't think it was reasonable for the GOP to go "used car salesman / slick politician" given what was going on at the time.

this is such . You bought into that meme hook line & sinker. Mitt is farthest from your description . Guy is a straight talking , genuine ,wholesome family man. Cripes

The massive amount of lies put through by social media memes about Romney is what killed him. Obama won by lies spewed about Romney. He was the best thing that could have happened for this country. I can't see a more qualified candidate. From now on it'll have to be Idiocracy showmanship to win. Not who you are and what you can do but what image you can portray.

I don't know Romney, so he very well may be a very genuine person, but he came off as one of the smarmiest, most fake mother####ers I've ever seen.

Pretty much describes every politician.

 

[jamny]

Of what the GOP presented, Huntsman was probably the most reasonable candidate. Granted, we don't know what skeletons are in his closet like we do Romney, but I don't think it was reasonable for the GOP to go "used car salesman / slick politician" given what was going on at the time.

this is such . You bought into that meme hook line & sinker. Mitt is farthest from your description . Guy is a straight talking , genuine ,wholesome family man. Cripes

The massive amount of lies put through by social media memes about Romney is what killed him. Obama won by lies spewed about Romney. He was the best thing that could have happened for this country. I can't see a more qualified candidate. From now on it'll have to be Idiocracy showmanship to win. Not who you are and what you can do but what image you can portray.

I don't know Romney, so he very well may be a very genuine person, but he came off as one of the smarmiest, most fake mother####ers I've ever seen.

and that right there was the problem. Yes, he's a robot. But a loveable one. I see him as a really nice, sincere family guy. He just wasn't made for these times.

 

[Steve Tasker]

I don't know Romney, so he very well may be a very genuine person, but he came off as one of the smarmiest, most fake mother####ers I've ever seen.

Pretty much describes every politician.

Oh, they're all fake. Some are just better/worse at hiding it.

 

[5Rings]

Hopefully you morher####ers that voted for this piece of #### feel proud to be part of the 51% living off my paycheck. This is an embarrassing time to be an American

 

[Steve Tasker]

Hopefully you morher####ers that voted for this piece of #### feel proud to be part of the 51% living off my paycheck. This is an embarrassing time to be an American

lol tell us how you really feel

 

[timschochet]

I still don't know what these "disasters" are. So far TPW named Obamacare and the debt. But while I think Obamacare is a rotten idea, we have yet to see DISASTROUS results (and I don't think we will). And it's hard to blame Obama for the debt when it was largely caused by Bush- Obama's only real contribution to the debt was the stimulus package, and that was recommended by most economists. Obama repealed some of the Bush tax cuts, against the wishes of many conservatives, and that actually helped serve to lower the debt.

TPW also mentioned gay marriage, illegal immigration, and some other irrelevancies (irrelevant because however you feel about those issues, Obama's role has been pretty much as a bystander.)

So where are the disasters?

 

[Koya]

Hopefully you morher####ers that voted for this piece of #### feel proud to be part of the 51% living off my paycheck. This is an embarrassing time to be an American

Not sure your point. If anything, the wealthy have only gotten wealthier.

On a personal level, it's certainly looking a lot better now than at anytime since Clinton.

 

[datonn]

Hopefully you morher####ers that voted for this piece of #### feel proud to be part of the 51% living off my paycheck. This is an embarrassing time to be an American

Not sure your point. If anything, the wealthy have only gotten wealthier.

On a personal level, it's certainly looking a lot better now than at anytime since Clinton.

Again, not to ruin a good fishing trip...but millions upon millions of Republican voters have received food stamps, welfare, unemployment, social security (before they are 66-67, such as disability), etc.

It is true though...Democrats as a group tend to be receiving benefits at a higher rate than Republicans. With food stamps, as an example, 22% of Democrats have received food stamps at some point in their lives, while only 10% of Republicans could say the same. My wife and I were receiving Federal/State assistance for a brief period around 2004 after her mom died (her not working), and her being pregnant with what would have been our second child (died in the womb). But I wasn't part of the 22% at the time...I was part of the 10%.

Anyway, bile such as "...the 51% living off my paycheck" has no place in reality, or any intelligent discussion. I keep forgetting though, threads like this aren't the place for intelligent discussion. So flame on!

Edited to add: Looks like 55% of Americans have received at least one of welfare, medicaid, food stamps, medicare, social security, or unemployment. And if you include veterans benefits? 70% of Americans have received government assistance in some way, shape, or form. So how come Democrats aren't absolutely destroying Republicans at the polls every election cycle? Since we all know that people are only voting with #1 in mind (me, myself and I), right? And come to think of it, if you count "benefits" such as massive tax deductions for things such as "dressage?" Probably 100% of Americans are receiving government assistance. So why aren't 100% of our elected representatives Democrats?

 

[5Rings]

Hopefully you morher####ers that voted for this piece of #### feel proud to be part of the 51% living off my paycheck. This is an embarrassing time to be an American

Not sure your point. If anything, the wealthy have only gotten wealthier.

On a personal level, it's certainly looking a lot better now than at anytime since Clinton.

We have more people sucking on the government teat than at any other time in history. 51% live offyournpaycheck. How do you feel about that?

To answer your question--and I'm drunk as a skunk otherwise I avoid these topics--I am kicking ### but I'm working more hours than ever. But the illegal on welfare just got 22s on his truck and a 60 in the crib while choosing not to work. What is wrong with this picture?

 

[timschochet]

Hopefully you morher####ers that voted for this piece of #### feel proud to be part of the 51% living off my paycheck. This is an embarrassing time to be an American

Not sure your point. If anything, the wealthy have only gotten wealthier.

On a personal level, it's certainly looking a lot better now than at anytime since Clinton.

We have more people sucking on the government teat than at any other time in history. 51% live offyournpaycheck. How do you feel about that?

To answer your question--and I'm drunk as a skunk otherwise I avoid these topics--I am kicking ### but I'm working more hours than ever. But the illegal on welfare just got 22s on his truck and a 60 in the crib while choosing not to work. What is wrong with this picture?

What is wrong with this picture is that it's a false stereotype. Most illegal immigrants work harder and longer hours than those here legally. And very few of them are able to receive welfare.

It really bothers me that this lie continues to spread. People ignore the truth about illegals and are willing to believe the worst. It's maddening. I can only speculate that there is a deep-seated racism involved, which most people that feel this way won't even admit to themselves.

 

[top dog]

All shtick aside.. I can tell you that my opinion of welfare has changed dramatically since my wife has worked in the public housing industry. She is a property manager for HUD based housing apartments. She has worked in a number of different complexes ranging from a pretty upstanding neighborhood in a prosperous community to the worst of the worst. The pattern of abuse is across the board. Claiming 0 income when there is obvious income coming in... Kids with no sheets on the beds but the parents having the latest Jordans... Now everyone and their brother is getting on SSI benefits. The system is broke. A resident can come into her office and say, "I quit my job." and they have to reduce their rent to 0. Where is the incentive?? Don't tell me that it doesn't happen. She sees it every day.

 

[Mello]

All shtick aside.. I can tell you that my opinion of welfare has changed dramatically since my wife has worked in the public housing industry. She is a property manager for HUD based housing apartments. She has worked in a number of different complexes ranging from a pretty upstanding neighborhood in a prosperous community to the worst of the worst. The pattern of abuse is across the board. Claiming 0 income when there is obvious income coming in... Kids with no sheets on the beds but the parents having the latest Jordans... Now everyone and their brother is getting on SSI benefits. The system is broke. A resident can come into her office and say, "I quit my job." and they have to reduce their rent to 0. Where is the incentive?? Don't tell me that it doesn't happen. She sees it every day.

It happens, but it's not the norm. Would you rather hemorrhage money by trying to micromanage the system so that no one can abuse it? Or you rather them all be on the street begging you for money, or worse? Out of all the wastes of our governments, to me this should be way down the list on things to address.

 

[timschochet]

All shtick aside.. I can tell you that my opinion of welfare has changed dramatically since my wife has worked in the public housing industry. She is a property manager for HUD based housing apartments. She has worked in a number of different complexes ranging from a pretty upstanding neighborhood in a prosperous community to the worst of the worst. The pattern of abuse is across the board. Claiming 0 income when there is obvious income coming in... Kids with no sheets on the beds but the parents having the latest Jordans... Now everyone and their brother is getting on SSI benefits. The system is broke. A resident can come into her office and say, "I quit my job." and they have to reduce their rent to 0. Where is the incentive?? Don't tell me that it doesn't happen. She sees it every day.

It happens, but it's not the norm. Would you rather hemorrhage money by trying to micromanage the system so that no one can abuse it? Or you rather them all be on the street begging you for money, or worse? Out of all the wastes of our governments, to me this should be way down the list on things to address.

It's so amazing that people focus on this, and foreign aid, and the NPR budget. Etc. These are minor budget items.

 

[top dog]

All shtick aside.. I can tell you that my opinion of welfare has changed dramatically since my wife has worked in the public housing industry. She is a property manager for HUD based housing apartments. She has worked in a number of different complexes ranging from a pretty upstanding neighborhood in a prosperous community to the worst of the worst. The pattern of abuse is across the board. Claiming 0 income when there is obvious income coming in... Kids with no sheets on the beds but the parents having the latest Jordans... Now everyone and their brother is getting on SSI benefits. The system is broke. A resident can come into her office and say, "I quit my job." and they have to reduce their rent to 0. Where is the incentive?? Don't tell me that it doesn't happen. She sees it every day.

It happens, but it's not the norm. Would you rather hemorrhage money by trying to micromanage the system so that no one can abuse it? Or you rather them all be on the street begging you for money, or worse? Out of all the wastes of our governments, to me this should be way down the list on things to address.

It is absolutely the "norm" in these communities. Trust me.

I'm not saying that "welfare" is what is hemorrhaging the country. Just providing some first hand knowledge as to how it isn't as utopia as some on the left would like to believe.

 

[timschochet]

All shtick aside.. I can tell you that my opinion of welfare has changed dramatically since my wife has worked in the public housing industry. She is a property manager for HUD based housing apartments. She has worked in a number of different complexes ranging from a pretty upstanding neighborhood in a prosperous community to the worst of the worst. The pattern of abuse is across the board. Claiming 0 income when there is obvious income coming in... Kids with no sheets on the beds but the parents having the latest Jordans... Now everyone and their brother is getting on SSI benefits. The system is broke. A resident can come into her office and say, "I quit my job." and they have to reduce their rent to 0. Where is the incentive?? Don't tell me that it doesn't happen. She sees it every day.

It happens, but it's not the norm. Would you rather hemorrhage money by trying to micromanage the system so that no one can abuse it? Or you rather them all be on the street begging you for money, or worse? Out of all the wastes of our governments, to me this should be way down the list on things to address.

It is absolutely the "norm" in these communities. Trust me.

I'm not saying that "welfare" is what is hemorrhaging the country. Just providing some first hand knowledge as to how it isn't as utopia as some on the left would like to believe.

But again, I have no idea what you're talking about. I have never in my life heard a liberal or progressive person state that our welfare system is a utopia. Not once. What they say, usually, is that despite the corruption that is inevitable with any large government program, it's worth it, because needy people are helped. And that is not an argument that you have been able to refute.

 

[tommyboy]

All shtick aside.. I can tell you that my opinion of welfare has changed dramatically since my wife has worked in the public housing industry. She is a property manager for HUD based housing apartments. She has worked in a number of different complexes ranging from a pretty upstanding neighborhood in a prosperous community to the worst of the worst. The pattern of abuse is across the board. Claiming 0 income when there is obvious income coming in... Kids with no sheets on the beds but the parents having the latest Jordans... Now everyone and their brother is getting on SSI benefits. The system is broke. A resident can come into her office and say, "I quit my job." and they have to reduce their rent to 0. Where is the incentive?? Don't tell me that it doesn't happen. She sees it every day.

It happens, but it's not the norm. Would you rather hemorrhage money by trying to micromanage the system so that no one can abuse it? Or you rather them all be on the street begging you for money, or worse? Out of all the wastes of our governments, to me this should be way down the list on things to address.

It is absolutely the "norm" in these communities. Trust me.I'm not saying that "welfare" is what is hemorrhaging the country. Just providing some first hand knowledge as to how it isn't as utopia as some on the left would like to believe.

But again, I have no idea what you're talking about. I have never in my life heard a liberal or progressive person state that our welfare system is a utopia. Not once. What they say, usually, is that despite the corruption that is inevitable with any large government program, it's worth it, because needy people are helped. And that is not an argument that you have been able to refute.

I agree. And furthermore i believe we should increase the loopholes for rich people, because even though theres rampant corruption in the tax code, its worth it because those folks only making 250k a year need the help.

 

[drummer]

All shtick aside.. I can tell you that my opinion of welfare has changed dramatically since my wife has worked in the public housing industry. She is a property manager for HUD based housing apartments. She has worked in a number of different complexes ranging from a pretty upstanding neighborhood in a prosperous community to the worst of the worst. The pattern of abuse is across the board. Claiming 0 income when there is obvious income coming in... Kids with no sheets on the beds but the parents having the latest Jordans... Now everyone and their brother is getting on SSI benefits. The system is broke. A resident can come into her office and say, "I quit my job." and they have to reduce their rent to 0. Where is the incentive?? Don't tell me that it doesn't happen. She sees it every day.

It happens, but it's not the norm. Would you rather hemorrhage money by trying to micromanage the system so that no one can abuse it? Or you rather them all be on the street begging you for money, or worse? Out of all the wastes of our governments, to me this should be way down the list on things to address.

It is absolutely the "norm" in these communities. Trust me.

I'm not saying that "welfare" is what is hemorrhaging the country. Just providing some first hand knowledge as to how it isn't as utopia as some on the left would like to believe.

But again, I have no idea what you're talking about. I have never in my life heard a liberal or progressive person state that our welfare system is a utopia. Not once. What they say, usually, is that despite the corruption that is inevitable with any large government program, it's worth it, because needy people are helped. And that is not an argument that you have been able to refute.

Once again, you're looking for an argument you can't even discuss.

Welfare or the dole isn't a Left or Right issue. It's the least damaging alternative to dealing with a society. Anybody thinking that welfare is costing a very wealthy nation in the US into the red doesn't know economics. Money given is money being spent somewhere. Money not given means even more money spent to those who wind up in the penal system. The only argument to have to cut off those on welfare is that you can make money on the other side is if they do wind up incarcerated, thus privatizing incarceration. Policing costs a helluva lot more money within municipal budgets than a Federal stipend to a county or city. Hell, take everybody in California off of welfare, and see how much more case loads the county and city courts would have.