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Getting out of jury duty (1 Viewer)

You do want to check the evening before. Here they have a website and sometimes they won’t need certain groups to actually report. Other times you will go but never even get picked to enter a court, you will just be in the waiting room all day. It really depends on how many jurors show up, how busy the dockets are, how picky those attorneys are.
 
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I've lived in the same place for 25 years and only got called once.
In my near 30 years in the area I have only been called twice. But I am batting 1.000 as I made it to the jury both times. One was a two day trial on DUI that had a twist and the other was a 3 month long murder trial.

The DUI case was a twist because they guy was found asleep (passed out?) in the driver's seat and the cop never actually saw him drive. Unfortunately for the defendant he was at the bottom of a hill and the cop was patrolling the area and the car wasn't there on his way up and was there on his way back down (15 minutes later). His story also didn't match his BAC. He said he was so tired he couldn't drive anymore (it was 11pm) so he pulled over to sleep a bit. But he coudldn't sleep so he decided to pound a 40 oz Corona to help him sleep and it "tasted so good" he had a second 40 oz'er. The guy wasn't the sharpest tool in the shed. Both attorney's were in their first ever trials so it was a bit fun watching them fumble all over the place. The prosecutor was terrible. The defense attorney was pretty good. If we were ruling on competency of the lawyers the defense wins easy. Unfortunately for him the evidence was just too strong against him that he was screwed no matter what. We deliberated less than an hour.
Some real "I thought the cop was a prostitute" energy here.
 
Just show up, hope you aren’t first, and see what the judge and lawyers are dismissing people for
The one time I got picked they were pretty much letting people go for anything
 
In Baltimore City, I got called every 2 years like clockwork. Made it into the pool multiple times. Most times, the defense attorneys didn't want any white men on the jury. It was pretty obvious.
 
Which state? In CA apparently nothing happens if you don't show up.

What makes you say this? I get jury duty like clockwork every three years and I show up and they're very serious about it. I don't think they could be more serious. Maybe you're talking Northern California or urban areas. I'm in a sprawling exurb. They need us on that wall.
Dirty little secret in San Diego is as long as courts are getting adequate numbers for jury trials, they do not run down no-shows. There was an article in the Union Tribune a few years back about the issue if you subscribe to that rag.
 
I think they still excuse people for covid.
Just need a doctors note
I thought they still let people self-identify. I had jury duty about a year ago and the reporting instructions told people not to report if they, or someone in their house had covid.
Maybe. Wayne County said you need a doctors note. I only know because I recently had jury duty and they were on people’s asses for trying to get out of the case. The only people who got dismissed were people who acted like insufferable babies in voir dire. I was embarrassed for most of them. I ended up on the jury. It lasted a week but it was actually very interesting and I enjoyed it. Of course I also have a job where I am getting paid my full rate while I’m on the case so I do acknowledge I’m not experiencing any hardships by serving.
 
4) Rate the judge a 4 on the offdee scale
If the ranking is accurate the judge will be the hottest in the county.
:bigredx:

While rare, I've encountered a few jumpy&quo judges in my time. Again, it's rare, but they exist. Probably 7s or 8s on the offdee scale which makes them 10+ in the legal field.

That said, nothing compares to this bailiff I encounter from time to time in this bizarrely rural small court. She literally looks like Lara Croft. She's so attractive it's genuinely distracting to the proceedings. No clue why she's there but it makes driving to that court more palatable.
 
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Which state? In CA apparently nothing happens if you don't show up.

What makes you say this? I get jury duty like clockwork every three years and I show up and they're very serious about it. I don't think they could be more serious. Maybe you're talking Northern California or urban areas. I'm in a sprawling exurb. They need us on that wall.
Dirty little secret in San Diego is as long as courts are getting adequate numbers for jury trials, they do not run down no-shows. There was an article in the Union Tribune a few years back about the issue if you subscribe to that rag.
This is my understanding for most jurisdictions.
 
If you really have a problem with serving don't ever respond and then not show up. But unless you signed for the letter they can't prove that you ever received it in the first place. People who moved a lot probably missed notices without even realizing it.
 
If you really have a problem with serving don't ever respond and then not show up. But unless you signed for the letter they can't prove that you ever received it in the first place. People who moved a lot probably missed notices without even realizing it.
Ehhh I'd be careful with this advice. This may be jurisdiction specific.
 
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If you really have a problem with serving don't ever respond and then not show up. But unless you signed for the letter they can't prove that you ever received it in the first place. People who moved a lot probably missed notices without even realizing it.
Ehhh I'd be careful with this advice.
So in your experience as a lawyer you've seen people being prosecuted for not acknowledging a jury duty notice?
 
If you really have a problem with serving don't ever respond and then not show up. But unless you signed for the letter they can't prove that you ever received it in the first place. People who moved a lot probably missed notices without even realizing it.
Ehhh I'd be careful with this advice.
So in your experience as a lawyer you've seen people being prosecuted for not acknowledging a jury duty notice?
Rare, but I think I have seen it (years ago) and definitely heard of it. Again, I think it's very jurisdiction specific and may also turn on what you mean by "prosecuted" as it could just be a civil fine or something.
 
If you really have a problem with serving don't ever respond and then not show up. But unless you signed for the letter they can't prove that you ever received it in the first place. People who moved a lot probably missed notices without even realizing it.
Ehhh I'd be careful with this advice.
So in your experience as a lawyer you've seen people being prosecuted for not acknowledging a jury duty notice?
Rare, but I think I have seen it (years ago) and definitely heard of it. Again, I think it's very jurisdiction specific and may also turn on what you mean by "prosecuted" as it could just be a civil fine or something.
It just seems like a really hard thing to prove. It's not like everyone is responsible for delivering their own mail.
 
If you really have a problem with serving don't ever respond and then not show up. But unless you signed for the letter they can't prove that you ever received it in the first place. People who moved a lot probably missed notices without even realizing it.
Ehhh I'd be careful with this advice.
So in your experience as a lawyer you've seen people being prosecuted for not acknowledging a jury duty notice?
Rare, but I think I have seen it (years ago) and definitely heard of it. Again, I think it's very jurisdiction specific and may also turn on what you mean by "prosecuted" as it could just be a civil fine or something.
It just seems like a really hard thing to prove. It's not like everyone is responsible for delivering their own mail.
I believe there's a statute in my jurisdiction that mail from the government is sufficient notice for things like this and a legal presumption is created.
 
If you really have a problem with serving don't ever respond and then not show up. But unless you signed for the letter they can't prove that you ever received it in the first place. People who moved a lot probably missed notices without even realizing it.
Ehhh I'd be careful with this advice.
So in your experience as a lawyer you've seen people being prosecuted for not acknowledging a jury duty notice?
Rare, but I think I have seen it (years ago) and definitely heard of it. Again, I think it's very jurisdiction specific and may also turn on what you mean by "prosecuted" as it could just be a civil fine or something.
It just seems like a really hard thing to prove. It's not like everyone is responsible for delivering their own mail.
I believe there's a statute in my jurisdiction that mail from the government is sufficient notice for things like this and a legal presumption is created.
If that's true, does that seem fair to you? Presuming that someone got a piece of mail when then might not have?
 
If you really have a problem with serving don't ever respond and then not show up. But unless you signed for the letter they can't prove that you ever received it in the first place. People who moved a lot probably missed notices without even realizing it.
Ehhh I'd be careful with this advice.
So in your experience as a lawyer you've seen people being prosecuted for not acknowledging a jury duty notice?
Rare, but I think I have seen it (years ago) and definitely heard of it. Again, I think it's very jurisdiction specific and may also turn on what you mean by "prosecuted" as it could just be a civil fine or something.
It just seems like a really hard thing to prove. It's not like everyone is responsible for delivering their own mail.
I believe there's a statute in my jurisdiction that mail from the government is sufficient notice for things like this and a legal presumption is created.
If that's true, does that seem fair to you? Presuming that someone got a piece of mail when then might not have?
No. But I'm not on the legislature.
 
Wish I could be a professional juror
I actually think it would benefit everyone. In a perfect world I would expect there to be a process where you interview, test, etc to show you are unbiased, can think logically, understand basic principles, etc and then get hired. It seems like it would streamline the process some and lead to more just results. Maybe have term limits so you don't get numb to things and gloss over stuff.

I think that a person wanting to be there would be more attentive and hold the process in higher standard (as it should be done already). I would definitely sign up for this (especially in retirement as I would expect it wouldn't pay much).
 
As a lawyer I believe I would champion professional jurors provided there were some limitations and trainings put in place.

My experience with grand jury is they tend to get a bit numb to the process and rubber-stampish.
 
If you really have a problem with serving don't ever respond and then not show up. But unless you signed for the letter they can't prove that you ever received it in the first place. People who moved a lot probably missed notices without even realizing it.
That's an good point. If you moved, unless someone is returning to sender, how would they know you're not receiving it. I would expect normally you get one notice, then a 2nd if you don't respond (like Nipples said he got) at which point a warrant is issued if you don't respond to that. Probably could still claim you didn't receive either if you get before a judge initiated by a traffic citation and get away with no fine, but do you really want to have to go through all of that. But maybe that's not the way it works at all.
 
If the defense attorney asks if you have friends/family in law enforcement and you say yes. Or if you just demonstrate a belief that the police dont ever lie and always go by the book. In the case I almost got pulled into, the defense's main argument was that the police had cut some corners and that the evidence chain of custody wasn't properly followed. One woman whose number got called said she had 2 uncles and a brother who were cops and she immediately got dismissed.
Years ago I was called for jury duty on a police brutality case. Told them my dad was a former cop. Ended up jury foreman. :loco:
 
If you really have a problem with serving don't ever respond and then not show up. But unless you signed for the letter they can't prove that you ever received it in the first place. People who moved a lot probably missed notices without even realizing it.
Although some jurisdictions don't chase down people who don't respond to a summons, the "I didn't get my mail" claim won't fly. Mail is presumed to be delivered.
 
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Entire thing seems antiquated to me. We had it written into our union contract that we are still paid if called but before that you could easily lose thousands of dollars or use your vacation time to sit in a courtroom. The $13 a day they pay doesn’t even cover the parking fee.
 
As a lawyer I believe I would champion professional jurors provided there were some limitations and trainings put in place.

My experience with grand jury is they tend to get a bit numb to the process and rubber-stampish.
Yep. I'd be all in favor of professional jurors. Seems like a pool of retirees looking to make some extra cash would be a great idea.

Plenty of things you could do to not cause financial strain on the majority of people. Retirees, make it part of unemployment…….
 
As a lawyer I believe I would champion professional jurors provided there were some limitations and trainings put in place.

My experience with grand jury is they tend to get a bit numb to the process and rubber-stampish.

I'm certainly for people doing this sort of civic duty....but under certain circumstances, the burden is just insane.

Right in the heart of COVID, my college roommate got called into federal grand jury duty in Trenton. For upwards of EIGHTEEN months, he had to be on call to go in every week to hear cases.....in TRENTON. And he had to go pretty often (I believe it was like 60-70% of the time if I remember correctly)

I mean, that's absolutely absurd. For certain people, being unavailable/unreliably available 1 day a week for that long could be a career-killer. Luckily he was at a job he hated anyway and left shortly after, but there absolutely zero reason for someone to be forced to do that. I'd say literally anything to get out of that.
 
Entire thing seems antiquated to me. We had it written into our union contract that we are still paid if called but before that you could easily lose thousands of dollars or use your vacation time to sit in a courtroom. The $13 a day they pay doesn’t even cover the parking fee.
So what's your fix?
 
Entire thing seems antiquated to me. We had it written into our union contract that we are still paid if called but before that you could easily lose thousands of dollars or use your vacation time to sit in a courtroom. The $13 a day they pay doesn’t even cover the parking fee.
So what's your fix?

Hire people to do it? Make it part of unemployment benefits? Pay a living wage to those chosen? Use retirees collecting social security? State laws provide paid maternity and paternity leave, make it employer paid for jury duty? Right now it’s basically labor without pay. Like I said, it no longer a big deal to me but I can see it being devastating to many. 30% of Americans live paycheck to paycheck.
 
Entire thing seems antiquated to me. We had it written into our union contract that we are still paid if called but before that you could easily lose thousands of dollars or use your vacation time to sit in a courtroom. The $13 a day they pay doesn’t even cover the parking fee.
So what's your fix?

Hire people to do it? Make it part of unemployment benefits? Pay a living wage to those chosen? Use retirees collecting social security? State laws provide paid maternity and paternity leave, make it employer paid for jury duty? Right now it’s basically labor without pay. Like I said, it no longer a big deal to me but I can see it being devastating to many. 30% of Americans live paycheck to paycheck.
This is why a judge is supposed to consider financial hardship.
 
As a lawyer I believe I would champion professional jurors provided there were some limitations and trainings put in place.

My experience with grand jury is they tend to get a bit numb to the process and rubber-stampish.

I'm certainly for people doing this sort of civic duty....but under certain circumstances, the burden is just insane.

Right in the heart of COVID, my college roommate got called into federal grand jury duty in Trenton. For upwards of EIGHTEEN months, he had to be on call to go in every week to hear cases.....in TRENTON. And he had to go pretty often (I believe it was like 60-70% of the time if I remember correctly)

I mean, that's absolutely absurd. For certain people, being unavailable/unreliably available 1 day a week for that long could be a career-killer. Luckily he was at a job he hated anyway and left shortly after, but there absolutely zero reason for someone to be forced to do that. I'd say literally anything to get out of that.
Ugh, they didn't let him do grand jury by Zoom??
 
Entire thing seems antiquated to me. We had it written into our union contract that we are still paid if called but before that you could easily lose thousands of dollars or use your vacation time to sit in a courtroom. The $13 a day they pay doesn’t even cover the parking fee.
So what's your fix?

Hire people to do it? Make it part of unemployment benefits? Pay a living wage to those chosen? Use retirees collecting social security? State laws provide paid maternity and paternity leave, make it employer paid for jury duty? Right now it’s basically labor without pay. Like I said, it no longer a big deal to me but I can see it being devastating to many. 30% of Americans live paycheck to paycheck.
This is why a judge is supposed to consider financial hardship.

It’s a financial hardship to most if the employer isn’t paying you. I’m not living paycheck to paycheck but I certainly don’t want to give up a grand a day or my yearly vacation to hang at the courthouse for several weeks. Judging by the daily pay rate, it was a system developed long ago and seems time to come up with an alternative. There’s a reason everyone tries to get out of it.
 
Entire thing seems antiquated to me. We had it written into our union contract that we are still paid if called but before that you could easily lose thousands of dollars or use your vacation time to sit in a courtroom. The $13 a day they pay doesn’t even cover the parking fee.
So what's your fix?

Hire people to do it? Make it part of unemployment benefits? Pay a living wage to those chosen? Use retirees collecting social security? State laws provide paid maternity and paternity leave, make it employer paid for jury duty? Right now it’s basically labor without pay. Like I said, it no longer a big deal to me but I can see it being devastating to many. 30% of Americans live paycheck to paycheck.
This is why a judge is supposed to consider financial hardship.
Yeah, sure, but quite frankly for basically anyone who isn't retired it's a financial hardship vs what they'd be doing otherwise.
 
I think jury duty would actually save me money bc I'd be using pto so not spending thousands on vacations but I'd much rather be going on vacations.
 
As a lawyer I believe I would champion professional jurors provided there were some limitations and trainings put in place.

My experience with grand jury is they tend to get a bit numb to the process and rubber-stampish.

I'm certainly for people doing this sort of civic duty....but under certain circumstances, the burden is just insane.

Right in the heart of COVID, my college roommate got called into federal grand jury duty in Trenton. For upwards of EIGHTEEN months, he had to be on call to go in every week to hear cases.....in TRENTON. And he had to go pretty often (I believe it was like 60-70% of the time if I remember correctly)

I mean, that's absolutely absurd. For certain people, being unavailable/unreliably available 1 day a week for that long could be a career-killer. Luckily he was at a job he hated anyway and left shortly after, but there absolutely zero reason for someone to be forced to do that. I'd say literally anything to get out of that.
Ugh, they didn't let him do grand jury by Zoom??
Nope. In person. Full mask the whole time.

I spent a lot time trying to figure out how big of a check I'd write to buy my way out of that nightmare
 
Entire thing seems antiquated to me. We had it written into our union contract that we are still paid if called but before that you could easily lose thousands of dollars or use your vacation time to sit in a courtroom. The $13 a day they pay doesn’t even cover the parking fee.
So what's your fix?

Hire people to do it? Make it part of unemployment benefits? Pay a living wage to those chosen? Use retirees collecting social security? State laws provide paid maternity and paternity leave, make it employer paid for jury duty? Right now it’s basically labor without pay. Like I said, it no longer a big deal to me but I can see it being devastating to many. 30% of Americans live paycheck to paycheck.
This is why a judge is supposed to consider financial hardship.

It’s a financial hardship to most if the employer isn’t paying you. I’m not living paycheck to paycheck but I certainly don’t want to give up a grand a day or my yearly vacation to hang at the courthouse for several weeks. Judging by the daily pay rate, it was a system developed long ago and seems time to come up with an alternative. There’s a reason everyone tries to get out of it.
You make a grand a day?

Look at Mr Hot Shot over here.
 
Entire thing seems antiquated to me. We had it written into our union contract that we are still paid if called but before that you could easily lose thousands of dollars or use your vacation time to sit in a courtroom. The $13 a day they pay doesn’t even cover the parking fee.
So what's your fix?

Hire people to do it? Make it part of unemployment benefits? Pay a living wage to those chosen? Use retirees collecting social security? State laws provide paid maternity and paternity leave, make it employer paid for jury duty? Right now it’s basically labor without pay. Like I said, it no longer a big deal to me but I can see it being devastating to many. 30% of Americans live paycheck to paycheck.
This is why a judge is supposed to consider financial hardship.

It’s a financial hardship to most if the employer isn’t paying you. I’m not living paycheck to paycheck but I certainly don’t want to give up a grand a day or my yearly vacation to hang at the courthouse for several weeks. Judging by the daily pay rate, it was a system developed long ago and seems time to come up with an alternative. There’s a reason everyone tries to get out of it.
You make a grand a day?

Look at Mr Hot Shot over here.

Not as great as it sounds, they are 16 hour night shifts in a trauma center.
 
Other benefit to paid juries is that you could have them go through a training class.

There's a reason that very few civil cases go to trial. Juries are wildly unpredictable and aren't that great at following instructions. We get to poll juries after trial or when a case settles during trial. The reasoning that they discuss with us for their verdicts or intended decisions is sometimes just wacky.
 
As a lawyer I believe I would champion professional jurors provided there were some limitations and trainings put in place.

My experience with grand jury is they tend to get a bit numb to the process and rubber-stampish.
Yep. I'd be all in favor of professional jurors. Seems like a pool of retirees looking to make some extra cash would be a great idea.

Exactly. Especially with the increase of technical, statistical, and scientific evidence being so crucial to so many cases. It would be to everyone's benefit to have a jury that understands concepts like DNA, IP addresses, the limits of surveillance video resolution, and maybe even how to use a cell phone.
 
I got called once, was in the big room with the judge and all the people who'd been called, and they explained that the case was about drunken driving. When it got to the "raise your hand if you don't think you can be objective" I raised my hand. I got my chance to approach the bench and explain why I couldn't be impartial: "As a member of a family with significant addiction issues of multiple family members, I figure by the time someone got arrested for drunk driving they've already done it 10 or more times before, so they're guilty." I got out of jury duty without lying or acting.

The other time I got called I repeatedly put if off until I got a stern letter from the court to call them, so I did and talked to the woman in charge who told me to pick a week in the next X months I could serve. So I checked a calendar and picked a week with a national holiday so I'd only have 4 shots at being called instead of 5. Each of those 4 days I got up, called the number to see if I needed to report, and was never needed.

Any jurisdiction that doesn't have some phone or internet way people can find out last-minute whether they have to report or not is a backwards jurisdiction that probably worships snails.
 
Which state? In CA apparently nothing happens if you don't show up.

What makes you say this? I get jury duty like clockwork every three years and I show up and they're very serious about it. I don't think they could be more serious. Maybe you're talking Northern California or urban areas. I'm in a sprawling exurb. They need us on that wall.
Dirty little secret in San Diego is as long as courts are getting adequate numbers for jury trials, they do not run down no-shows. There was an article in the Union Tribune a few years back about the issue if you subscribe to that rag.
This is my understanding for most jurisdictions.
This was in Carlsbad, but the law talking court guy at the start of day told the jury pool thanks for coming, roughly 15% of the people show, and there’s nothing that happens to those that don’t come, so really thanks for showing up. I’ve also been told that by various plaintiff bar lawyers here as well who simply throw their summons out.

I mean I still get mail (IRS and other official docs) for the previous owner…and he sold us this place 4.5 years ago, so “official records” are very unofficial.
 
A friend is mine’s grandpa, a true red blooded American. That was a career navy officer that served in WWII. Buried at Arlington. Told his grandson, at a young age, to just throw the summons away. Never answer it. Don’t tear it in half. Just toss it. That grandson has had a few summons, but none in the last 20+ years. So far so good. But the grandson told me that he’d love to do it once he was retired. :shrug:
 
I have two quick stories about inadvertently, but honestly, getting out of jury duty.

1) Back in the 90s, I was called for jury duty shortly after I move out of my parents' suburban house. I was still getting mail there while I lived in another parish -- namely, New Orleans. I got the summons from the mail at my parents', showed up in the suburban parish's courthouse, and got picked with a few others to go into the courtroom and field some small-talk questions from the judge. I assume voir dire was to follow, but I didn't get that far.

The judge was asking everyone where they lived and what they did for a living. Everyone else identifiably lived in the suburban parish. When it got to me, I told the judge, completely off-the-cuff and with no expectations, that I lived in "Mid-City" -- a New Orleans neighborhood. The judge stopped me immediately and dismissed me on the spot. I had to sign some boilerplate on the way out (99% sure not an affidavit) but was never asked to prove that I lived out of the parish.

2) A few years later, my mom went to jury duty and made it to voir dire for a murder case. One of the attorneys asked asked her if she knew anyone on Louisiana's death row. She replied "yes" and was quickly dismissed by the attorney.

At some point shortly after, a court officer/bailiff passed her a message from the judge: "Who do you know on death row?" He may have profiled my mom as a middle-aged lady living in a nice neighborhood that might have been trying to play an angle. Or maybe the judge was just curious.

In the mid-80s, there was a kid in our neighborhood that my brother hung out with a lot. The kid grew up and stayed in the area, but kind of floundered with life after high school. In the late '90s, he killed someone at a bar (I don't have the details, not sure if firearms or premeditation was involved). He got the death penalty, and was on death row at the time of my mom's jury duty. She gave the judge his name, and it checked out.
 
Jury duty is so weird. My wife has NEVER been summoned. I haven't been summoned in 20 years. There was a 5 year period I was summoned FIVE times. I felt I was going through jury orientation so much it was a factor in my life. I'll tell you how every single situation went.

Lawyer, "So you were an Army Sgt that currently works for the Bureau of Prisons?"

Me, "Yes Sir."

Judge, "You can leave."

Giant waste of time. Ha ha
 
If you really have a problem with serving don't ever respond and then not show up. But unless you signed for the letter they can't prove that you ever received it in the first place. People who moved a lot probably missed notices without even realizing it.
Ehhh I'd be careful with this advice.
So in your experience as a lawyer you've seen people being prosecuted for not acknowledging a jury duty notice?
Rare, but I think I have seen it (years ago) and definitely heard of it. Again, I think it's very jurisdiction specific and may also turn on what you mean by "prosecuted" as it could just be a civil fine or something.
It just seems like a really hard thing to prove. It's not like everyone is responsible for delivering their own mail.
I believe there's a statute in my jurisdiction that mail from the government is sufficient notice for things like this and a legal presumption is created.
If that's true, does that seem fair to you? Presuming that someone got a piece of mail when then might not have?
Life isn't fair, and the reason why we can't take your word on it is because you've already told us that you'll lie about this sort of thing.
 

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