Has ProFootballTalk gotten more reputable as a news source? (1 Viewer)

[GregR_2]

Some may not agree with my starting premise here, and that's ok if you don't because it's just how I feel.

My lasting impression of PFT for some time has been that they were a site that would report anything they heard without any reall attempt at verification. My impression was too much of what they posted never turned out to be more than rumor or gossip. But at times that they did report something before the news organizations that would have to go verify it, PFT would whine about not getting credit for breaking the story.

It left me wary of trusting PFT's reports, and also disliking them for their behavior.

The last year or two though, NBC Sports has started partnering with PFT on Sunday night broadcasts. Florio appears fairly regularly on NFL Network. In short, the mainstream sports media are starting to turn to PFT as a legitimate source. I see PFT sourced on a lot more things now which turn out to be legitimate, and in some cases I'm getting the feeling they seem to be as good of a source as anywhere else.

So my question... I don't read PFT regularly, only going there when someone links to a particular story of interest. Have their reporting standards increased? Or is it just that the other media are starting to use them and so lend Florio legitimacy by proxy but they are not any more accurate than before? Or was I just plain wrong about what PFT was like in the past?

 

[hook014]

This is only my 2nd season checking in there but it seems like they are a lot more accurate now. Don't know the reasons.

Their "one liners" are the only thing I really look at and they are mostly links to local sources, providing some info I may use.

 

[Jason Wood]

Long time Shark Poolers know that I was HIGHLY critical of Mike Florio and PFT for years. Simply put, he was running a gossip column under the guys of "football talk." While that certainly invited supporters, I found him all too willing to blur the lines between outright speculation, false (and often unsourced) rumor, and real news. But to his credit he did exactly what he set out, he got eyeballs. A lot of them. And as a result Florio not only got acquired by NBC Interactive, but he became one of their lead NFL reporters, and went from gossip to legitimately plugged in reporter with big resources. Like any good business man, he appears to have realized that he now has different access and different opportunities, and while he still has the occasionally salacious headline, for the most part he REPORTS now instead of SPECULATES.

I have to tip my cap to him.

 

[GregR_2]

Long time Shark Poolers know that I was HIGHLY critical of Mike Florio and PFT for years. Simply put, he was running a gossip column under the guys of "football talk." While that certainly invited supporters, I found him all too willing to blur the lines between outright speculation, false (and often unsourced) rumor, and real news. But to his credit he did exactly what he set out, he got eyeballs. A lot of them. And as a result Florio not only got acquired by NBC Interactive, but he became one of their lead NFL reporters, and went from gossip to legitimately plugged in reporter with big resources. Like any good business man, he appears to have realized that he now has different access and different opportunities, and while he still has the occasionally salacious headline, for the most part he REPORTS now instead of SPECULATES.I have to tip my cap to him.

Thanks Wood, appreciate the opinion. That's pretty much what I'd been sensing, but I haven't visited the site enough in the last few years to really be able to tell if it was a real change or just an appearance of change now that I only see him on NBC, etc.

 

[coolnerd]

In order for PFT to go beyond a niche site Florio was going to have to change. In his earlier days he never repsresnted the site as anything but snarky, gossip mongering. still people read and judged him as though he were a harder news site.

 

[GregR_2]

In order for PFT to go beyond a niche site Florio was going to have to change. In his earlier days he never repsresnted the site as anything but snarky, gossip mongering. still people read and judged him as though he were a harder news site.

I'll disagree with the "never represented the site as anything but snarky gossip mongering" part. I remember a number of cases where he'd make snide comments when something he'd gossiped about started to get reported in the press and PFT didn't get credit for "breaking the story". It just struck me as wanting to be treated like a serious news site without living up to being a serious news site, and was the biggest reason I've stayed away from there.

 

[massraider]

I think it is THE best news resource for football now.

I also think Florio and his Rosenthal buddy aren't close to as funny as they think they are. They force these awful lines, just for the sake of being irreverent, it seems to me. I'd like to slap both of them.

Great website.

 

[mcintyre1]

Isn't Gregg Rosenthal the really young guy? I thought he was like 18 when he started contributing to the site.

 

[coolnerd]

In order for PFT to go beyond a niche site Florio was going to have to change. In his earlier days he never repsresnted the site as anything but snarky, gossip mongering. still people read and judged him as though he were a harder news site.

I'll disagree with the "never represented the site as anything but snarky gossip mongering" part. I remember a number of cases where he'd make snide comments when something he'd gossiped about started to get reported in the press and PFT didn't get credit for "breaking the story". It just struck me as wanting to be treated like a serious news site without living up to being a serious news site, and was the biggest reason I've stayed away from there.

I never took those remaks are more than tongue in cheek at the time. In fact, my signature came about as a jab at people who took Florio more seriously than i thought florio used to take himself. I have had 6-8 Florio quotes through it over time including one that went someting along the lines of "now that we are reporting more hard news means that we still don't monger rumors." It of course was about the time he started to change the vision of the site from wiseace lawyer with time on his hands to being a somewhat responsible source of news. i always read it as entertainment that news broke out of every once in awhile.

 

[craxie]

it might be more 'trustworthy', but it's a heck of a lot more boring

it hardly deserves the title 'rumor mill'

so pft has moved on to the 'legit' side, we need a site devoted to the rumors like pft used to be

 

[Drink G2]

Still can't stand to read anything that is actually said, the info is nice though.

 

[fatness]

This is only my 2nd season checking in there but it seems like they are a lot more accurate now. Don't know the reasons.

Florio hung around long enough and talked to enough people that he's developed many more reliable sources than he used to have. I've always enjoyed PFT but it's better now than it was.

 

[GroveDiesel]

The funny thing is that I think PFT does seem more legit, but they also are breaking way fewer stories and being much more careful in what they report. In the past, there would be a story in the mainstream media talking about unnamed players testing positive at the combine but nobody would name names or speculate. That's where PfT would step up and speculate or report the rumors of who it was. Now, PFT seems reluctant to do that now that they're with NBC.

Seems more like a news aggregator now to me than a breaking news and rumor site.

 

[blackbird001]

I've been reading PFT since before the NBC merger and I voted 'never thought they weren't trustworthy'. I get the attitude problems that people have with Florio (and now rosenthal's writing). There are times when I think he is crafting a headline or spinning an issue for hits, but as has been mentioned, that's how the media works. There are simply not enough stories to fill a 24/7 news cycle, let alone enough for several websites or media conglomerates to compete over. This means that opinion comes in a lot.

Florio has always been upfront when he was reporting a rumor, or speculation, or fact. When he's been wrong (Terry Bradshaw being dead), he's fallen all over himself not only retracting, but explaining ad nauseum how and why it happened. It's his lawyer background and his integrity which at times makes for lengthy posts about journalistic integrity. I'm a fan of Seinfeld and The Office and very much appreciate his tireless references to both shows.

But in the end, there simply is no other site that is as plugged in, or whom covers as much as they do. It's not all good, but they never stop. The NFL and NBC had to take him seriously. Every day that passed without them doing so, just made them look that much further behind the times.

I don't like Rosenthal much at all. I put up with him because it's PFT.

 

[Mello]

Better than before Florio got paid by NBC, but it's still the TMZ of football media. Once free agency starts, they will be back to being the tools of any agent or exec by passing along any rumor no matter how unlikely.

 

[Reaper]

I think Florio had to become more legit AND at the same time the rest of the sports media has become "Florio'd" and have their own rumor mongers and sensationalist stories to generate traffic.

Florio's biggest trick was to always put up some claim about a team or fanbase just to get them riled up and posting comments. He knew right away that kicking the Jets was going to spark a lot of New York interest.. Of course a Pats story always gave him the site traffic..

I bet the whole Jets / Pats / Spygate / Tuck Rule stuff alone made Florio's career - He milked that stuff for every drop.

Now I see local guys like Rich Cimini writing articles that sound like Florio years ago...

If you're in the media and simply report the facts then you are nobody but a ticker.....

Jason La Canafor seems like a rumor monger, throw #### against the wall guy out of the Florio mold.

 

[Mark Wimer]

IMO PFT is much more credible these days. I'm not a big fan of their style, but the substance has become much more on-target as Jason detailed above.

 

[Zimm]

I always thought PTF was a joke awhile back but they have seemed to have turned a corner and actually produce some good information.....It is now my 2nd look after Rotoworld for football news. I think ESPN is now the joke of the inside sports world....Its pretty sad when Ed Werder is still following around Brett Farve trying to find out who he signs with!

 

[massraider]

Better than before Florio got paid by NBC, but it's still the TMZ of football media. Once free agency starts, they will be back to being the tools of any agent or exec by passing along any rumor no matter how unlikely.

This is old and now completely untrue opinion.

 

[ConstruxBoy]

Long time Shark Poolers know that I was HIGHLY critical of Mike Florio and PFT for years. Simply put, he was running a gossip column under the guys of "football talk." While that certainly invited supporters, I found him all too willing to blur the lines between outright speculation, false (and often unsourced) rumor, and real news. But to his credit he did exactly what he set out, he got eyeballs. A lot of them. And as a result Florio not only got acquired by NBC Interactive, but he became one of their lead NFL reporters, and went from gossip to legitimately plugged in reporter with big resources. Like any good business man, he appears to have realized that he now has different access and different opportunities, and while he still has the occasionally salacious headline, for the most part he REPORTS now instead of SPECULATES.I have to tip my cap to him.

Agree 100% and was with you 3-4 years ago too. They've become a real source.

 

[shader]

I swore myself off Florio about 7 years ago when I emailed him to let him know I thought a story was wrong and he "cussed me out" in response. However I finally went back to the site a few months ago and realized that he runs a great, legitimate site now.

From rumor monger to reporter. A great example of a nobody becoming a somebody and giving hope to couch potatoes everywhere.

 

[Chicago Hooligan]

Bad writer, not funny, etc. but I guess he's completed writing more novels than me so hey.

 

[GroveDiesel]

As an addendum to what I posted earlier, I think the rise of Twitter has really made PFT almost irrelevant IMO. I can get tons of news, info and rumors updating constantly from tons of different sources all in one spot rather than PFT which is the blog of two guys.

I can get stuff from more credible guys like Schefter and Mortenson alongside rumors from la Canforna with a nice dose of breaking news, rumors and inside info from local beat reporters.

 

[Truman]

Better than before Florio got paid by NBC, but it's still the TMZ of football media. Once free agency starts, they will be back to being the tools of any agent or exec by passing along any rumor no matter how unlikely.

This is old and now completely untrue opinion.

Their reports are a lot more accurate now than what we see from 'sources' on ESPN and sometimes Yahoo! or SI - SI truth and rumors in particular is absolute garbage (current rumor is Delhomme to back up Tebow).Almost everything on PFT now is linked to the original source and it has been for at least 3 years. It's been a long time since I've seen a 'Terry Bradshaw is Dead' story on their website - and that one was reported through other outlets as well.

 

[cr8f]

How about Never thought they were trustworthy

Too much gossip and un-substantiated sources in the NFL

 

[Mello]

Better than before Florio got paid by NBC, but it's still the TMZ of football media. Once free agency starts, they will be back to being the tools of any agent or exec by passing along any rumor no matter how unlikely.

This is old and now completely untrue opinion.

When free agency starts, keep a scorecard on how many rumors end up being correct.

 

[Go DC Yourself]

Once PFT was acquired by NBC, I imagine it had no choice but to become more legit. NBC has a contract with the NFL to broadcast games.

 

[GroveDiesel]

Well, this seems like good timing on this. PFT reported last night that the Packers have informed their players to be ready to be at the facility on Sunday.

Adam Schefter tweeted this morning that the NFL has not given teams permission to contact players yet and Aaron Rodgers tweeted that he has NOT been contacted by the Packers.

So far, Florio is sticking to his report (which was confirmed to him by an ESPNMilwaukee reporter).

These types of stories and how PFT handles them seems to be the crux of what we're discussing here. If the story is true and he did his due diligence, then it would seem to back up what the OP is saying. If he turns out not to be true and Florio tries to defend his report, then that would sort of make him look bad and like he hasn't changed all THAT much.

 

[GregR_2]

Well, this seems like good timing on this. PFT reported last night that the Packers have informed their players to be ready to be at the facility on Sunday.

Adam Schefter tweeted this morning that the NFL has not given teams permission to contact players yet and Aaron Rodgers tweeted that he has NOT been contacted by the Packers.

So far, Florio is sticking to his report (which was confirmed to him by an ESPNMilwaukee reporter).

These types of stories and how PFT handles them seems to be the crux of what we're discussing here. If the story is true and he did his due diligence, then it would seem to back up what the OP is saying. If he turns out not to be true and Florio tries to defend his report, then that would sort of make him look bad and like he hasn't changed all THAT much.

I'd even give them a bit of a pass if they actually heard about this from two or more sources. It doesn't bother me terribly if a media outlet gets a story wrong every once in awhile. As long as they tried to confirm it before running with it, they did what they should have. Sometimes there are multiple sources saying the same wrong thing, it can't be helped.It's when they throw something against the wall without any kind of confirmation that makes me wary of trusting a site. With the ESPNMilwaukee thing it sounds like there are at least multiple sources that were saying this, if true.

 

[GroveDiesel]

According to a "high level source" in the Packers organization, the Packers have NOT contacted any players. They've simply made internal contingency plans for contacting them when an agreement is made.

However, the last blurb about veteran players being able to contact other players about traveling to GB for medical checkups on Saturday seems a bit odd to me. How would the veteran players know anything about that if the Packers hadn't said anything? Or were the Packers just able to tell everyone via ESPN's reporting?

http://m.espn.go.com/nfl/story?storyId=6783490

 

[Chicago Hooligan]

I think contact with team medical staff is and has been allowed.

Notably, whatever Jason Wilde tweeted about "100% accurate" he later deleted.

 

[GregR_2]

I think contact with team medical staff is and has been allowed.

Notably, whatever Jason Wilde tweeted about "100% accurate" he later deleted.

I believe players who were injured during the season can work with the team medical staff for rehab. But anything that happened outside of the season, like Peyton Manning's neck surgery, he can't work with the team. But so yes, there is some contact allowed for rehab.

 

[GroveDiesel]

I think contact with team medical staff is and has been allowed.

Notably, whatever Jason Wilde tweeted about "100% accurate" he later deleted.

I believe players who were injured during the season can work with the team medical staff for rehab. But anything that happened outside of the season, like Peyton Manning's neck surgery, he can't work with the team. But so yes, there is some contact allowed for rehab.

I'm not sure that's the case. I think that ALL players were prevented from meeting or talking with team medical staffs.LINK

Teams also want to see if injured players have properly rehabilitated, and if not, what type of rehab and treatments are needed. One GM, whose team has several players coming off surgical procedures, said his team could be at a competitive disadvantage because the medical staff hasn't been able to track players' status during the lockout.

If some of those players have suffered setbacks or sprouted new injuries during their rehab, their ability to contribute could be compromised, he said. This GM was one of a handful who said he's also prepared for surprise injuries and unforeseen conditions that no one will know about until players report

One last edit: After some more reading, it sounds like the training staff can talk to third party medical providers to coordinate treatment with players. So in a sense they can keep tabs on players and treatment, they just can't provide it directly or talk directly to the players. (I would think that relaying information to them to be at a team facility at a certain date would be a violation of the current rules)

Ironically, one of the articles I came upon when trying to verify this was this one from PFT that says that team doctors ARE allowed to stay in contact with players and monitor them which is quite clearly false.

 

[massraider]

Better than before Florio got paid by NBC, but it's still the TMZ of football media. Once free agency starts, they will be back to being the tools of any agent or exec by passing along any rumor no matter how unlikely.

This is old and now completely untrue opinion.

When free agency starts, keep a scorecard on how many rumors end up being correct.

Well, in this same thread people were complaining about not enough rumors coming from PFT. I have been really harsh critics of theirs in the past, and have often thought they were tools of agents, who fed them items that forwarded their agenda. But it's been a long time since I thought that. When I look past the annoying writing style, and focus on the content, they are hard to beat. They know what is news, and what people want to read about. The FBG news blogger is tough, like KFFL's, because it is everything, and you sometimes have to read the same item 5 times because Player X is being looked at by 5 teams. Not knocking it, it's great to have so much info, but for me it is just too much to sort through. PFT has not engaged in constant rumor-mongering in a long, long time. This is simply an outdated opinion. The guys that used to make declarations, then make up some absurd story for why it didn't happen don't behave like that any more. They often still do the tired routine of making a baseless speculation based on a harmless story, just to sizzle it up a little bit.

A good rule of thumb when reading PFT is to ignore the last paragraph, or sentence. That's usually where Florio or Rosenthal's snarky or unfunny comment is located.

 

[drater]

so pft has moved on to the 'legit' side, we need a site devoted to the rumors like pft used to be

http://deadspin.com/They broke the Stergen/Favre/Crocs/C*^K debacle as well as the Rex Ryan's foot fetish story. Couple other less notable ones as well. Never seemed to let facts get in the way of publishing something.

 

[GregR_2]

I think contact with team medical staff is and has been allowed.

Notably, whatever Jason Wilde tweeted about "100% accurate" he later deleted.

I believe players who were injured during the season can work with the team medical staff for rehab. But anything that happened outside of the season, like Peyton Manning's neck surgery, he can't work with the team. But so yes, there is some contact allowed for rehab.

I'm not sure that's the case. I think that ALL players were prevented from meeting or talking with team medical staffs.LINK

Teams also want to see if injured players have properly rehabilitated, and if not, what type of rehab and treatments are needed. One GM, whose team has several players coming off surgical procedures, said his team could be at a competitive disadvantage because the medical staff hasn't been able to track players' status during the lockout.

If some of those players have suffered setbacks or sprouted new injuries during their rehab, their ability to contribute could be compromised, he said. This GM was one of a handful who said he's also prepared for surprise injuries and unforeseen conditions that no one will know about until players report

One last edit: After some more reading, it sounds like the training staff can talk to third party medical providers to coordinate treatment with players. So in a sense they can keep tabs on players and treatment, they just can't provide it directly or talk directly to the players. (I would think that relaying information to them to be at a team facility at a certain date would be a violation of the current rules)

Ironically, one of the articles I came upon when trying to verify this was this one from PFT that says that team doctors ARE allowed to stay in contact with players and monitor them which is quite clearly false.

Odd, I'm positive I'd heard otherwise. I just did some googling and found this in the Washington Post... sounds like they can talk to the people helping with the rehab, but not with the player himself:

But according to the NFL, lockout rules permit trainers to speak with third-party medical providers to assist players recovering from football injuries.

 

[coolnerd]

http://sportsblognet.com/2010/10/22/for-those-who-believe-incarcerated-bob-is-a-credible-source/

There is always this guy if you want totally baseless rumors. Incarcerated Bob

 

[Chicago Hooligan]

Let's also mention PFT's largely prohibitively stupid commenters.

 

[slayer666]

Have their reporting standards increased?

Without question. They still report a lot of fluff garbage (filler), but the legitimate stories are almost always on point.

 

[Andrew Garda]

Long time Shark Poolers know that I was HIGHLY critical of Mike Florio and PFT for years. Simply put, he was running a gossip column under the guys of "football talk." While that certainly invited supporters, I found him all too willing to blur the lines between outright speculation, false (and often unsourced) rumor, and real news. But to his credit he did exactly what he set out, he got eyeballs. A lot of them. And as a result Florio not only got acquired by NBC Interactive, but he became one of their lead NFL reporters, and went from gossip to legitimately plugged in reporter with big resources. Like any good business man, he appears to have realized that he now has different access and different opportunities, and while he still has the occasionally salacious headline, for the most part he REPORTS now instead of SPECULATES.I have to tip my cap to him.

What Wood said...

 

[TheDirtyWord]

Are they more reputable now? Absolutely, that comes with having NBC as your corporate parent. And to be fair, even prior to the acquisition, it was clear that they were no longer just rumor mongers.

But count me amongst those who actually miss those days. Right now, I see the re-cycling alot of stories that are put out by other media sources. And tat's fine...they are really diligent about giving credit to whomever breaks the story. But I also think that because they are now looped in with the big boys, they probably withhold alot more information, even if it was simply scuttlebutt.

 

[GroveDiesel]

And this is the kind of garbage from Mike Florio that still keeps him from being a truly legit source:

Bills fear Fitzpatrick's leverage will only increase

Really? Where is there anything in that article that suggest that the Bills actually "fear" Fitzpatrick being more valuable? They're going to be forced to spend about $20-30M more next year than they have currently on their payroll this year. So they already know they have to shell out a large chunk of money. Why in the world would they be afraid that they found their franchise QB?

And again, not one source in the organization, not one quote, not one off the record employee, not one other media person is included in the article even saying the Bills are afraid of Fitzpatrick's leverage. It's simply a lazy article that perpetuates the stereotype of Ralph Wilson as a cheap owner. Horrible. Florio is a total hack.

Also, he has another blog post up (as well as commented on it after the SNF game) about instant replay being used after the end of the Oakland/Buffalo game. He said that instant replay was used 10 minutes after the game was ended and it shouldn't have been, blah blah blah. The head official has already said that what really happened was he got a buzz 10 minutes after the game to go review the play and went out to look under the hood. When he did, none of the equipment was on and so he called upstairs to figure out what was going on. They then told him that they accidentally buzzed him and that the play was NOT to be reviewed since it was a clear INT and that the game was over. This information has been out for over 2 hours now and was reported on by several Buffalo media members. Florio looks like a moron going on national tv to rant about this when he has the facts completely wrong.