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Martz in talks to be Lions OC (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter azgroover
- Start date
Line... probably not, but this can be addressed.
T
trader jake
Guest
this would instantly make all detroit lion skill position players overvalued (except whoever the starting QB is - that's the only spot that ADP will = production imo due to guaranteed passing yardage every game). the cutler hype would hit a reggie bush level if martz and he both end up in detroitmartz is a great offensive mind but there's still a lot of work to do in detroit
BoulderBob
Footballguy
Not cool, I don't want to see what he can do with the offensive talent in Detroit. Would be a great hire...
Exactly. Tough, disciplined head coach to control him as OC.How they actually could meld Martz's offense with all that "Power running. Control the game offense" comments Marinelli made when he got the job, I don't know.
But if Martz can get these Kitties to put up points, he becomes more attractive as a HC candidate.
Captain Blowhard
Footballguy
For those that say "there's a lot of work to do" in Detroit...there's not as much as you might think. Martz would be a major coup for the Lions. What a staff: Marinelli, Henderson, Martz...nice!
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Foosball God
Foos
This would be great. I absolutely did not want Martz here as the head coach, but it's an awesome hire as the offensive coordinator if this comes true.
grandmaster192
Shining Greatness
I want him to be a hc somewere. If the lions don't plan on being passing team it would be a waste. with mike you need to pass about 36-40 times a game.
Captain Blowhard
Footballguy
I understand your logic, but I think it means the exact opposite: the Lions go get a veteran qb not currently on the roster. Martz, if he does come, won't be there long and he'll want the offense to work NOW not three years from now after Cutler learns the ropes.The Lions (especially Millen) aren't in a "start all over" mode of thinking.
Captain Blowhard
Footballguy
Somehow, I think Marinelli can handle it
Just a weird "intuition" 
Blackjacks
Footballguy
If Detroit can get him to be their offensive coordinator I think they'll be doing pretty good for themselves. I think it skyrockets they wr's value as well as Jones. As for the qb position, if this happens with Martz, I don't think Joey's going anywhere. Like someone else just mentioned he'll have a window of 1 or at the most 2 years there. He isn't going to waste time with a rookie. I guess bringing in a vetern could happen but I think Martz will want to work with Joey and it might sound crazy but I think Joey can excel with a good offensive coach. If Martz goes there and Joey is the guy I put him up in my top ten with an outside shot to get in the top 5. 
D-BO
Footballguy
It's going to take alot more then Martz tto put Harrington in the top 10. O-Line, & these underachieving WRs actually catching the ball & making plays would help.If Detroit can get him to be their offensive coordinator I think they'll be doing pretty good for themselves. I think it skyrockets they wr's value as well as Jones. As for the qb position, if this happens with Martz, I don't think Joey's going anywhere. Like someone else just mentioned he'll have a window of 1 or at the most 2 years there. He isn't going to waste time with a rookie. I guess bringing in a vetern could happen but I think Martz will want to work with Joey and it might sound crazy but I think Joey can excel with a good offensive coach. If Martz goes there and Joey is the guy I put him up in my top ten with an outside shot to get in the top 5.
Blackjacks
Footballguy
I don't remember the rams offense being anything great either before Martz. The Lions have alot more talent than the 98 Rams did on their roster right now. I guess you knew that Kurt Warner, the undrafted grocery stock boy was going to do what he did. If Martz could turn him into a fantasy god think what he could do with a #3 pick in Joey. The Lions offense has been pretty bland the last couple years. How do you expect Joey to be a standout when they don't really give him alot of chances to do so. Your right though, the wr's do need to hold onto the ball more but you get Mike, in his 2nd year, Roy healthy for a whole year and Charles off the crack and you'll see fireworks up in Mo-town.It's going to take alot more then Martz tto put Harrington in the top 10. O-Line, & these underachieving WRs actually catching the ball & making plays would help.If Detroit can get him to be their offensive coordinator I think they'll be doing pretty good for themselves. I think it skyrockets they wr's value as well as Jones. As for the qb position, if this happens with Martz, I don't think Joey's going anywhere. Like someone else just mentioned he'll have a window of 1 or at the most 2 years there. He isn't going to waste time with a rookie. I guess bringing in a vetern could happen but I think Martz will want to work with Joey and it might sound crazy but I think Joey can excel with a good offensive coach. If Martz goes there and Joey is the guy I put him up in my top ten with an outside shot to get in the top 5.
Jason Wood
Zoo York
I wouldn't count out the impact of Martz on any QB. Honestly, if you had asked 20 GMs to evaluate Kurt Warner, Trent Green, Marc Bulger and Ryan Fitzpatrick on their pro potential absent their history of success in Martz' system, it would be a motley and critical set of reviews.For a long time now we've been collectively railing against the Lions not because they're terrible, but because they seemingly have tons of talent and yet are terrible. No one is going to convince me that Martz won't have that offense far more productive even if he's left with the same parts. But more likely, he'll have "his guy" at QB sooner rather than later.It's going to take alot more then Martz tto put Harrington in the top 10. O-Line, & these underachieving WRs actually catching the ball & making plays would help.If Detroit can get him to be their offensive coordinator I think they'll be doing pretty good for themselves. I think it skyrockets they wr's value as well as Jones. As for the qb position, if this happens with Martz, I don't think Joey's going anywhere. Like someone else just mentioned he'll have a window of 1 or at the most 2 years there. He isn't going to waste time with a rookie. I guess bringing in a vetern could happen but I think Martz will want to work with Joey and it might sound crazy but I think Joey can excel with a good offensive coach. If Martz goes there and Joey is the guy I put him up in my top ten with an outside shot to get in the top 5.
Chris Smith
The Head Goon!
The year before Mike Martz became offensive coordinator in St. Louis in 1998, the Rams put up these numbers...(courtesy of Pro Football Reference... where else)
1998 Season
Points Scored: 285 (rank 24th out of 30)
Passing Yardage: 3,381 (rank 21st)
Passing Touchdowns: 12 (rank 28th)
Rushing Yardage: 1,385 (rank 29th)
Rushing Touchdowns: 17 (rank 9th)
Key players included Tony Banks, Isaac Bruce (only played in five games), Ricky Proehl and no running backs to speak of...
1999 season
Points Scored: 526 (rank 1st)
Passing Yardage: 4,580 (rank 1st)
Passing Touchdowns: 42 (rank 1st)
Rushing Yardage: 2,059 (rank 5th)
Rushing Touchdowns: 13 (rank 14th)
Key players included Kurt Warner, Marshall Faulk, Isaac Bruce, A.Z. Hakim and rookie Torry Holt
I have never been a fan of Mike Martz when it comes to his head coaching ability but he has the creativity and knowledge necessary to do an outstanding job as an offensive coordinator.
Nobody saw the Rams doing what they did as an offensive powerhouse prior to his arrival. Kurt Warner was a nobody, Marshall Faulk was an excellent running back, Isaac Bruce was coming off of two very disappointing seasons and Torry Holt was a rookie receiver.
Detroit's skill weapons (Harrington, Kevin Jones, Roy Williams, Charles Rogers - maybe and Mike Williams) may not be the equal of the Rams weapons back in the turn around season of 1999 but they don't appear to be that far off as well.
This would be a great hire for Lion fans and great (fabulous in fact) news for Roy Williams owners in keeper/dynasty leagues.
if this happens for the Lions.
1998 Season
Points Scored: 285 (rank 24th out of 30)
Passing Yardage: 3,381 (rank 21st)
Passing Touchdowns: 12 (rank 28th)
Rushing Yardage: 1,385 (rank 29th)
Rushing Touchdowns: 17 (rank 9th)
Key players included Tony Banks, Isaac Bruce (only played in five games), Ricky Proehl and no running backs to speak of...
1999 season
Points Scored: 526 (rank 1st)
Passing Yardage: 4,580 (rank 1st)
Passing Touchdowns: 42 (rank 1st)
Rushing Yardage: 2,059 (rank 5th)
Rushing Touchdowns: 13 (rank 14th)
Key players included Kurt Warner, Marshall Faulk, Isaac Bruce, A.Z. Hakim and rookie Torry Holt
I have never been a fan of Mike Martz when it comes to his head coaching ability but he has the creativity and knowledge necessary to do an outstanding job as an offensive coordinator.
Nobody saw the Rams doing what they did as an offensive powerhouse prior to his arrival. Kurt Warner was a nobody, Marshall Faulk was an excellent running back, Isaac Bruce was coming off of two very disappointing seasons and Torry Holt was a rookie receiver.
Detroit's skill weapons (Harrington, Kevin Jones, Roy Williams, Charles Rogers - maybe and Mike Williams) may not be the equal of the Rams weapons back in the turn around season of 1999 but they don't appear to be that far off as well.
This would be a great hire for Lion fans and great (fabulous in fact) news for Roy Williams owners in keeper/dynasty leagues.
if this happens for the Lions.SoloMatisse
Footballguy
It'll be a COLD day in Detroit when Mike Martz' ego allows him to take a postion as OC there. Not gonna happen, not in Detroit, not this year, not ever. He'll be working for the NFL network next year or for some other team.
Tau837
Footballguy
This could mean a lot to Kevin Jones, regardless of who the QB is. Jones strikes me as capable of catching the ball well, even though his statistics don't show that so far in his career.I could easily see him excelling in a Faulk-like role: 15-18 carries, 3-6 catches per game. Not that he will be as good as Faulk, but this could definitely help him reach the top 10, where many felt he was headed in 2005.
Captain Blowhard
Footballguy
Charles Rogers is the only wr of the three you can peg as having been a true "underachiever." Mike Williams was a rookie wr last year. Let's not right him off just yet. Roy Williams just finished his second season. Let's not write him off just yet either--especially given he's had 16 tds in essentially one full season (collectively) of healthy games. Everyone who wants to write these Detroit wrs off seems to be forgetting they are still VERY young and inexperienced.It's going to take alot more then Martz tto put Harrington in the top 10. O-Line, & these underachieving WRs actually catching the ball & making plays would help.If Detroit can get him to be their offensive coordinator I think they'll be doing pretty good for themselves. I think it skyrockets they wr's value as well as Jones. As for the qb position, if this happens with Martz, I don't think Joey's going anywhere. Like someone else just mentioned he'll have a window of 1 or at the most 2 years there. He isn't going to waste time with a rookie. I guess bringing in a vetern could happen but I think Martz will want to work with Joey and it might sound crazy but I think Joey can excel with a good offensive coach. If Martz goes there and Joey is the guy I put him up in my top ten with an outside shot to get in the top 5.
Captain Blowhard
Footballguy
Perhaps--but his ego is also the one thing that draws him to this job. The Detroit OC job is very attractive to anyone with a massive ego. I can almost here his inner monologue: "All that talent and no results yet? Damn, what I could do with those boys!"You think his ego will prevent him from taking the gig, but I think just the opposite: his ego attracts him to the job.
Captain Blowhard
Footballguy
They need work, don't get me wrong. But they don't need a roster overhaul by any means. They need to beef up the o-line, add a DE, resolve the qb position. The rest of the "issues" can be handled by upgrading the coaching staff and the play calling.Seriously.What team have you been watching?
For all their ineptness this year, they GAVE away 3-4 games in the final two minutes of play. This team didn't get blown out that much this year--despite some of the most woeful play calling ever seen in the pro ranks and a gaggle of injuries.
Blackjacks
Footballguy
100% agree and also if he wants to become a head coach again it will look pretty impressive that he can say he turned Detroit around. And by the way let's never compare K. Jones to M. Faulk again on this website please. Kevin Jones has never been a reciever from his days at Va. Tech and his first two years in the NFL. He also is much more of a straight ahead runner who will try to run you over compared to Marshall who would catch everything in sight and dance around you. The 2 basically just aren't very comparable. But back to the point I agree that if Martz's ego is involved that could only help him settling for this job.
Tau837
Footballguy
If you reread my post, you'll notice that I didn't compare them. I said I think Jones could excel in a Faulk-like role.I also noted that Jones has not been a pass catching RB thus far in his career. That doesn't mean he can't do it. You are saying because he never has before, he can't. I disagree.
Foosball God
Foos
Because he's been so successful in Houston?
footballguide1
Footballguy
First off let me say that if the Lions do land Martz and finally sign Donnie then on paper they have the workings of a great coaching crew, possibly one of the top 10 in the NFL on paper. I stress the on paper part because collectively the coaches have been very successful at their own coaching positions, but the mash of them may not work, but if it does work, wow! Secondly I think that the talk of Martz wanting a HC position may be a little overatted. The HC position requires about 80-90 hours a week worth of work and I have read that it has led to an excessive amount of heart conditions in HCs. Case in point; Mike Martz, who had a heart infection. Having to only deal with an OC position would only require a normal workweek of about 50-60 hours and may be the reason he stepped out of the Raiders HC contention.
Footballhead
WWPRD?
Martz could excel in Detroit as a OC.
acefootball
Footballguy
Expect Martz to turn down the Detroit job. Will be shocked if he takes it. I think he is still up in the air in his mind what he wants to do. He really needs to take a year off and let his head clear, and his health improve as well IMO. The man is a competitor though, and that just may draw him back in.
D-BO
Footballguy
Where in my post am I writing off these WRs? All I said is that they are underachieving & they are. For Harrington or any other QB to succeed here he'll need these guys to play to their potential which is First round billing. Roy has had some good games & some nice catches along with some bad drops but he's still underachieving.Charles Rogers is the only wr of the three you can peg as having been a true "underachiever." Mike Williams was a rookie wr last year. Let's not right him off just yet. Roy Williams just finished his second season. Let's not write him off just yet either--especially given he's had 16 tds in essentially one full season (collectively) of healthy games. Everyone who wants to write these Detroit wrs off seems to be forgetting they are still VERY young and inexperienced.It's going to take alot more then Martz tto put Harrington in the top 10. O-Line, & these underachieving WRs actually catching the ball & making plays would help.If Detroit can get him to be their offensive coordinator I think they'll be doing pretty good for themselves. I think it skyrockets they wr's value as well as Jones. As for the qb position, if this happens with Martz, I don't think Joey's going anywhere. Like someone else just mentioned he'll have a window of 1 or at the most 2 years there. He isn't going to waste time with a rookie. I guess bringing in a vetern could happen but I think Martz will want to work with Joey and it might sound crazy but I think Joey can excel with a good offensive coach. If Martz goes there and Joey is the guy I put him up in my top ten with an outside shot to get in the top 5.
Captain Blowhard
Footballguy
The Henderson hire is now official. Click on the link and read near the end of the article:http://lions.scout.com/2/494304.html
Captain Blowhard
Footballguy
As it takes any wr 3-4 years to find himself in the NFL, I don't know how you can say his 16 tds in two years is "underachieving"? And what should Mike Williams have done as a rookie wr who had been out of football nearly two years? Charles Rogers? I completely agree.You can't pin that label on Roy and Mike unless you also pin it on every first and second year wr who has ever played. People act like Roy and Mike have been busts or something. They're both still learning the ropes.Where in my post am I writing off these WRs? All I said is that they are underachieving & they are. For Harrington or any other QB to succeed here he'll need these guys to play to their potential which is First round billing. Roy has had some good games & some nice catches along with some bad drops but he's still underachieving.Charles Rogers is the only wr of the three you can peg as having been a true "underachiever." Mike Williams was a rookie wr last year. Let's not right him off just yet. Roy Williams just finished his second season. Let's not write him off just yet either--especially given he's had 16 tds in essentially one full season (collectively) of healthy games. Everyone who wants to write these Detroit wrs off seems to be forgetting they are still VERY young and inexperienced.It's going to take alot more then Martz tto put Harrington in the top 10. O-Line, & these underachieving WRs actually catching the ball & making plays would help.If Detroit can get him to be their offensive coordinator I think they'll be doing pretty good for themselves. I think it skyrockets they wr's value as well as Jones. As for the qb position, if this happens with Martz, I don't think Joey's going anywhere. Like someone else just mentioned he'll have a window of 1 or at the most 2 years there. He isn't going to waste time with a rookie. I guess bringing in a vetern could happen but I think Martz will want to work with Joey and it might sound crazy but I think Joey can excel with a good offensive coach. If Martz goes there and Joey is the guy I put him up in my top ten with an outside shot to get in the top 5.
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D-BO
Footballguy
Well, we both agree on Rogers. As far as the Williams's go, Roy's 16 TDs are nice but the rest of it isn't for a #7 overall pick. He has 99 career catches, should be more. His durability & dedication have to be in question along with his attitude. As far as Mike, 350 yards & 1 TD isn't underachieving for a #10 overall pick? I don't care if he was out of football, we still drafted him & he didn't show anything other then being slow, not having good hands, & being overall disinterested in football. Not what I want from a 10th overall pick his rookie season.Bottom line, other then Roys 16 TDs you can't as a Lions fan be satisfied with these 3 first round WRs overall.As it takes any wr 3-4 years to find himself in the NFL, I don't know how you can say his 16 tds in two years is "underachieving"? And what should Mike Williams have done as a rookie wr who had been out of football nearly two years? Charles Rogers? I completely agree.You can't pin that label on Roy and Mike unless you also pin it on every first and second year wr who has ever played. People act like Roy and Mike have been busts or something. They're both still learning the ropes.Where in my post am I writing off these WRs? All I said is that they are underachieving & they are. For Harrington or any other QB to succeed here he'll need these guys to play to their potential which is First round billing. Roy has had some good games & some nice catches along with some bad drops but he's still underachieving.Charles Rogers is the only wr of the three you can peg as having been a true "underachiever." Mike Williams was a rookie wr last year. Let's not right him off just yet. Roy Williams just finished his second season. Let's not write him off just yet either--especially given he's had 16 tds in essentially one full season (collectively) of healthy games. Everyone who wants to write these Detroit wrs off seems to be forgetting they are still VERY young and inexperienced.It's going to take alot more then Martz tto put Harrington in the top 10. O-Line, & these underachieving WRs actually catching the ball & making plays would help.If Detroit can get him to be their offensive coordinator I think they'll be doing pretty good for themselves. I think it skyrockets they wr's value as well as Jones. As for the qb position, if this happens with Martz, I don't think Joey's going anywhere. Like someone else just mentioned he'll have a window of 1 or at the most 2 years there. He isn't going to waste time with a rookie. I guess bringing in a vetern could happen but I think Martz will want to work with Joey and it might sound crazy but I think Joey can excel with a good offensive coach. If Martz goes there and Joey is the guy I put him up in my top ten with an outside shot to get in the top 5.
One word: Underachieving
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Blackjacks
Footballguy
okay, your right you never said that but if he could do it most likely someone would have caught on by now and let him take a chance at catching more passes. He is not a good reciever I've seen him drop many of passes but I still think he upgrades in Martz's system.
Spartans Rule
Footballguy
The biggest reason Jones doesn't catch more passes is because he sucks at blitz pickup, and thus Bryson plays passing downs.
SoloMatisse
Footballguy
Let's not give this guy credit for a single thing....not a single thing. For the length of time he's been in house, I wouldnt praise him for a second until one of his teams wins atleast 10 or 11 games....seriously. With any other team, any other organization, and any other owner YOUNGER THAN 90, he'd have been sitting in Paul McGuire's worthless seat this past season. Further, on the Martz situation, and comparing the level of talent with Detroit to the Rams.....one word comes to mind that those two teams DO NOT have in common....SPEED. Torry Holt starting getting things done his ROOKIE year. It didnt take him 3 or 4 years to become a player. His skill was evident his 1st year, and the guy had major speed, along with Bruce and Az Hakim, and Ricky Proehl....those were some devasting receivers to match up with. Marshall Faulk was one of the fastest, most versatile backs in the league, and probably the most difficult single player to cover in the league. Comparing the scrubs on this Lions team to those Rams teams Martz was priveleged to coach is not a conversation anyone needs to take part in.
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