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Miami at Baltimore (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Maurile Tremblay
- Start date
With Cutler out, Dolphins had to ensure that at least one p###y made it on to the field
voiceofunreason
Footballguy
The Jacket
Footballguy
I'm not watching (I'd rather kill myself I think) but how does Allen steal so many carries from a clearly far superior player?
Rove!
Footballguy
Biabreakable
Footballguy
Collins has a lot of subtle moves that likely do require he expend a lot of energy to string all those moves together, and he finishes his runs hard when contract does come.
So some of them I can understand them giving Collins a breather.
Most of Allens runs are just straight up the middle, which became more effective as the game goes on.
But I still think it is poor coaching decisions for the most part.
Collins showed he is a very capable receiver in this game as well, so that isn't it.
Maybe Allen is better at pass protection? I can't say I saw him with many pass pro assignments.
It isn't because of ball security.
Collins is clearly the better runner and they should use him more.
I got tired of saying then Buck Allen comes in after Collins had a good run after the third or 4th time. Kept happening.
Football Jones
Footballguy
That's my general feeling, as well. QBs complain about getting popped, yet slide at the very last millisecond. If you drop down & slide at the last split second, the defender may have no other choice but to come in contact with your head. Bang-bang play & it was close, but if Flacco didn't want to get hit at all, he should've slid sooner. He wanted to get the 1st down & not get hit. Sometimes it doesn't work that way.
I love Romo, but I disagreed with his assessment of the play & preferred how Deion & Cowher looked at it.
JaxBill
Footballguy
I agree that he slid too late and should expect some contact but that doesn't explain following through with the elbow and shoulder to the head.
Dirty play and suspension worthy
saintfool
Dead sexy
it wasn't even him spearing or helmet-to-helmet. he hit with his shoulder. it's a penalty, i guess, but it was far from dirty.
Da Guru
Fair & Balanced
Flacco was going for the first down marker. At the last second he knew he was not going to make it and started his slide. Had he continued to run he would have been tackled in the waist area and brought down. Sanders is correct...The is no way a defender can be running full speed and pull up in a split second.
He had enough time to drop down in a split second but not pull up? Flacco definitely slid late, but gtfo with all of these "he had no choice but to take off his head" responses.
Da Guru
Fair & Balanced
Slow motion yes he had time. Game speed no.
What as Flacco doing after the hit? Looked like he was asking a waiter for his tab.
Tom Skerritt
Footballguy
I just don't understand the need for these players to go after each other in such an aggressive manner. It was just unnecessary for Alonso to go after Flacco that way. You know the guy is going to go down. You just don't need to go after a guy like that.
These guys talk all the time about how they are a brotherhood and they don't like to see other players get hurt. And I get that. This is how these guys make a living. And I also understand that football is a violent sport. But that hit last night was an intentional act to injure somebody, and that''s the part that bothers me. Regardless of whether or not it was legal/illegal or if it was dirty... it was simply unnecessary, negligent and reckless.
These guys talk all the time about how they are a brotherhood and they don't like to see other players get hurt. And I get that. This is how these guys make a living. And I also understand that football is a violent sport. But that hit last night was an intentional act to injure somebody, and that''s the part that bothers me. Regardless of whether or not it was legal/illegal or if it was dirty... it was simply unnecessary, negligent and reckless.
Da Guru
Fair & Balanced
He's ~4 yards away from him, running upright, when he sees him begin his slide. He literally has to make the conscious decision to drop down in order to hit him.
Da Guru
Fair & Balanced
Both players 4 yards away in total running full speed at each other = millisecond. Again..I am going with the pro players viewpoint.
He's ~4 yards away from him, running upright, when he sees him begin his slide. He literally has to make the conscious decision to drop down in order to hit him.
Well, one wasn't running full speed, he was starting to slide. Again, he definitely starting it a little later than he should have, but it's utter nonsense to think that Alonso couldn't have avoided that hit. No one is asking him to come to a dead stop, just don't drop down and target the head with your shoulder. That was totally avoidable, he chose not to.
Da Guru
Fair & Balanced
You don`t make decide and choices in a millisecond. You react..Flacco wanted the first down and went down too late. I am all for player safety but if you are giving yourself up you run out of bounds or go down sooner. Been much better of just taking the regular tackle.
It wasn't a millisecond, and yes, he reacted by dropping down and targeting the head. He could have reacted by missing him completely. Of course Flacco could have gone down earlier, or went out of bounds, or even taken a knee on the play and it may have all been avoided. That doesn't change the fact that Alonso chose to take him out when he could have made a different choice. It's silly to pretend that he couldn't have avoided it.
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Da Guru
Fair & Balanced
Look at Flaccos hip and knee positions in frames 1-2. That proves how fast it was. Listening to all the players on the NFL Network they are in agreement it was just unavoidable.
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ATB
Footballguy
Wasn't unavoidable. Alonso definitely had time to pull-up slightly, not entirely but slightly. However, Flacco also made a conscious decision to try for more yards because he was short of the first down.
Alonso made him pay for that decision.
I believe that was his thought process too. It's his job to make a QB pay for running out of the pocket. He knew Flacco was going for the first and lunged to make him regret that decision.
Not his fault Flacco delayed his slide.
treat88
Footballguy
I really thought Alonso dropped down and tried to rotate away from contact when he saw Flacco go down. Obviously the result was ugly, but it looked to me like he was really trying to avoid contact and that resulted in an uglier hit than if he hadn't tried to react at all.
These head/neck area contact rules are so tough on defenders. Half of the hit is generated by the offensive players actions, yet the defender takes all of the blame for the outcome. Obviously it was an illegal outcome, but I just don't believe Alonso went in with bad intentions.
These head/neck area contact rules are so tough on defenders. Half of the hit is generated by the offensive players actions, yet the defender takes all of the blame for the outcome. Obviously it was an illegal outcome, but I just don't believe Alonso went in with bad intentions.
treat88
Footballguy
Nah man. Not trying to start anything here either.Has to be.
Full speed it just really looked to me like he was trying to twist and miss him. If you check the Zapruder footage above from slides 2 to 3 and notice how vertical Alonso's shoulders got to the field, I interpreted that as trying to rotate and miss him even after he had committed to the hit.
Not defending Alonso at all, like I say the outcome was bad. It just wasn't my impression he really went for the intentional kill shot.
djmich
Footballguy
Head/neck area contact rules are even tougher when a sliding players head and neck are where their legs usually are. Maybe there should be a rule that QB's are considered down by contact with two hand touch.
FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
Joe Summer
Footballguy
There's no such thing as "down by contact" when a runner slides (feet first). The slide itself is what downs the player.
If you start a slide (feet first), you cannot get up and keep running, even if no other player touches you. You're down.
That's why Alonso doesn't have much of a case. Once Flacco started his slide, Alonso was supposed to let up and avoid touching him.
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I can't decide if this is more or less compelling than the "he was trying to avoid him" schtick. Considering you also wrote that he slid 1/2 yd. from Alonso who had already "launched", I think I'll go with "less".
Todem
Footballguy
Agreed. They play at full speed and when you see a QB you are going full speed to lay the wood...he slid at the very last possible moment and Kiko had already made his decision at full speed to lower his shoulder and make a tackle.
It’s a physical game and this happens. Or we can just put freaking flags on QB’s and WR’s coming across the middle and just remove all their helmets and we will not have this stuff happen.
He will be fined. But no way he is suspended. It was not dirty. It was unfortunate. Big difference.
Todem
Footballguy
Very hard to do when you are going full speed and your brain tells your body...launch and hit. He made that decision before he started his slide.
Look.....absolutely a penalty, and the right call was made. But suspension? No way. I have seen far worse and far more dirty than this.
Yes, it's hard to do when your brain tells your body "punish him". You are correct, he made that decision before he started his slide, which was when he was ~4 yards away from him.Todem said:
The question of how dirty it was or if he should be suspended is an open one- whether he could have avoided hitting him in the head is not. He absolutely could have.
Todem
Footballguy
Agree 100% very subjective. Tough call to make. But Kiko has no history of being a dirty player. So some benefit of the doubt can be given as a first time offense. He will get a heavy fine though. That is certain in my mind.
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