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***Official 2025 Pro Cycling Thread*** - This year a Grand Prize!!! (2 Viewers)

Stage 21
Stage Winners
  1. Brettdj
  2. Jaysus
  3. Jaysus (2)
  4. BobbyLayne
  5. BobbyLayne (2)
  6. Jaysus (3)
  7. Da Raiders
  8. Cheeseypoof
  9. Da Raiders (2)
  10. Sand
  11. BobbyLayne (3)
  12. BobbyLayne (4)
  13. Brettdj (2)
  14. BobbyLayne (5)
  15. Sand (2)
  16. Jaysus (4)
  17. Sand (3)
  18. Nick Vermeil
  19. BobbyLayne (6)
  20. Cheeseypoof (2)
  21. BobbyLayne (7)
BL - 7
J - 4
S - 3
D - 2
Br - 2
C - 2
N - 1
 
End-of-Tour Points

Final Standings - Velogames FBGs Giro d’Italia
 
Enjoy the week off! See you guys next weekend.

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RoundDeadlineRaceCategory

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Last edited:
EF basically made the same blunder as well (though to a lesser extent). I get that they were trying to make Del Toro respond, but when he didn’t Carapaz had to get back to Yates. Maybe it wouldn’t have mattered though.
Carapaz played it fine. There is really no difference for him between 2nd and 3rd. He played chicken and put the onus on Del Toro.
I'm new to the strategy, but I can't agree with this.
The real crux is that one of Yates or Carapaz was getting away from Del Toro given Del Toro's form. Ultimately, if Del Toro decides to sit on Carapaz's wheel, there's not much Carapaz can do and I know while I was watching, I thought Carapaz was smart for letting Yates go as I was assuming he'd quickly drop Del Toro and join him.

Almost all the blame here goes to UAE. I know they told Del Toro to ride Carapaz's wheel at the start of the stage, but once they know Yates had Wout up the road and that it looked like Wout would get over the climb (which they knew at the bottom), the correct strategy was to chase Yates down with Carapaz. Once he doesn't do that, it was game over at the top of the climb since there was no way Del Toro and Carapaz were pulling back the needed time with Yates being able to recover behind Wout while those two further burying themselves.

Carapaz's only real blunder waiting a tad too long and not pulling Yates back the second time, but I think he was at his limit when he did try. He needed himself and Yates to crest together with Wout pulling, but without Del Toro.
 
EF basically made the same blunder as well (though to a lesser extent). I get that they were trying to make Del Toro respond, but when he didn’t Carapaz had to get back to Yates. Maybe it wouldn’t have mattered though.
Carapaz played it fine. There is really no difference for him between 2nd and 3rd. He played chicken and put the onus on Del Toro.
I'm new to the strategy, but I can't agree with this.
The real crux is that one of Yates or Carapaz was getting away from Del Toro given Del Toro's form. Ultimately, if Del Toro decides to sit on Carapaz's wheel, there's not much Carapaz can do and I know while I was watching, I thought Carapaz was smart for letting Yates go as I was assuming he'd quickly drop Del Toro and join him.

Almost all the blame here goes to UAE. I know they told Del Toro to ride Carapaz's wheel at the start of the stage, but once they know Yates had Wout up the road and that it looked like Wout would get over the climb (which they knew at the bottom), the correct strategy was to chase Yates down with Carapaz. Once he doesn't do that, it was game over at the top of the climb since there was no way Del Toro and Carapaz were pulling back the needed time with Yates being able to recover behind Wout while those two further burying themselves.

Carapaz's only real blunder waiting a tad too long and not pulling Yates back the second time, but I think he was at his limit when he did try. He needed himself and Yates to crest together with Wout pulling, but without Del Toro.
I question this....https://youtu.be/0DRDpC8M1rw?si=926fW1A85Ch4FHcC&t=136

I think Del Toro had the legs but was just being stubborn.
 
EF basically made the same blunder as well (though to a lesser extent). I get that they were trying to make Del Toro respond, but when he didn’t Carapaz had to get back to Yates. Maybe it wouldn’t have mattered though.
Carapaz played it fine. There is really no difference for him between 2nd and 3rd. He played chicken and put the onus on Del Toro.
I'm new to the strategy, but I can't agree with this.
The real crux is that one of Yates or Carapaz was getting away from Del Toro given Del Toro's form. Ultimately, if Del Toro decides to sit on Carapaz's wheel, there's not much Carapaz can do and I know while I was watching, I thought Carapaz was smart for letting Yates go as I was assuming he'd quickly drop Del Toro and join him.

Almost all the blame here goes to UAE. I know they told Del Toro to ride Carapaz's wheel at the start of the stage, but once they know Yates had Wout up the road and that it looked like Wout would get over the climb (which they knew at the bottom), the correct strategy was to chase Yates down with Carapaz. Once he doesn't do that, it was game over at the top of the climb since there was no way Del Toro and Carapaz were pulling back the needed time with Yates being able to recover behind Wout while those two further burying themselves.

Carapaz's only real blunder waiting a tad too long and not pulling Yates back the second time, but I think he was at his limit when he did try. He needed himself and Yates to crest together with Wout pulling, but without Del Toro.
I question this....https://youtu.be/0DRDpC8M1rw?si=926fW1A85Ch4FHcC&t=136

I think Del Toro had the legs but was just being stubborn.
For some reason that whole thing reminds me of Cadel a number of years back. He was in a position where he had to simply ride himself back into the race and he did. The opposite of what Del Toro did. That guy is going to look back at this in 10 years and wonder what the hell he was thinking. This is a Vandevelde type event - you don't see it very often, but you sure never forget it.
 
EF basically made the same blunder as well (though to a lesser extent). I get that they were trying to make Del Toro respond, but when he didn’t Carapaz had to get back to Yates. Maybe it wouldn’t have mattered though.
Carapaz played it fine. There is really no difference for him between 2nd and 3rd. He played chicken and put the onus on Del Toro.
I'm new to the strategy, but I can't agree with this.
The real crux is that one of Yates or Carapaz was getting away from Del Toro given Del Toro's form. Ultimately, if Del Toro decides to sit on Carapaz's wheel, there's not much Carapaz can do and I know while I was watching, I thought Carapaz was smart for letting Yates go as I was assuming he'd quickly drop Del Toro and join him.

Almost all the blame here goes to UAE. I know they told Del Toro to ride Carapaz's wheel at the start of the stage, but once they know Yates had Wout up the road and that it looked like Wout would get over the climb (which they knew at the bottom), the correct strategy was to chase Yates down with Carapaz. Once he doesn't do that, it was game over at the top of the climb since there was no way Del Toro and Carapaz were pulling back the needed time with Yates being able to recover behind Wout while those two further burying themselves.

Carapaz's only real blunder waiting a tad too long and not pulling Yates back the second time, but I think he was at his limit when he did try. He needed himself and Yates to crest together with Wout pulling, but without Del Toro.
I question this....https://youtu.be/0DRDpC8M1rw?si=926fW1A85Ch4FHcC&t=136

I think Del Toro had the legs but was just being stubborn.
For some reason that whole thing reminds me of Cadel a number of years back. He was in a position where he had to simply ride himself back into the race and he did. The opposite of what Del Toro did. That guy is going to look back at this in 10 years and wonder what the hell he was thinking. This is a Vandevelde type event - you don't see it very often, but you sure never forget it.
I think UAE was cooked. I suspect that carapaz’s attacks spent his and del Toro’s big gear power. And when they hit the valley floor, wout just pulled away from everyone. It was almost landis-esqe the way wout and Yates just rode away from what ended up being a decent sized chase group.
 
EF basically made the same blunder as well (though to a lesser extent). I get that they were trying to make Del Toro respond, but when he didn’t Carapaz had to get back to Yates. Maybe it wouldn’t have mattered though.
Carapaz played it fine. There is really no difference for him between 2nd and 3rd. He played chicken and put the onus on Del Toro.
I'm new to the strategy, but I can't agree with this.
The real crux is that one of Yates or Carapaz was getting away from Del Toro given Del Toro's form. Ultimately, if Del Toro decides to sit on Carapaz's wheel, there's not much Carapaz can do and I know while I was watching, I thought Carapaz was smart for letting Yates go as I was assuming he'd quickly drop Del Toro and join him.

Almost all the blame here goes to UAE. I know they told Del Toro to ride Carapaz's wheel at the start of the stage, but once they know Yates had Wout up the road and that it looked like Wout would get over the climb (which they knew at the bottom), the correct strategy was to chase Yates down with Carapaz. Once he doesn't do that, it was game over at the top of the climb since there was no way Del Toro and Carapaz were pulling back the needed time with Yates being able to recover behind Wout while those two further burying themselves.

Carapaz's only real blunder waiting a tad too long and not pulling Yates back the second time, but I think he was at his limit when he did try. He needed himself and Yates to crest together with Wout pulling, but without Del Toro.
I question this....https://youtu.be/0DRDpC8M1rw?si=926fW1A85Ch4FHcC&t=136

I think Del Toro had the legs but was just being stubborn.
For some reason that whole thing reminds me of Cadel a number of years back. He was in a position where he had to simply ride himself back into the race and he did. The opposite of what Del Toro did. That guy is going to look back at this in 10 years and wonder what the hell he was thinking. This is a Vandevelde type event - you don't see it very often, but you sure never forget it.
I think UAE was cooked. I suspect that carapaz’s attacks spent his and del Toro’s big gear power. And when they hit the valley floor, wout just pulled away from everyone. It was almost landis-esqe the way wout and Yates just rode away from what ended up being a decent sized chase group.
Totally agree...like I said, I'm 100% convinced one of Carapaz or Yates was getting away from Del Toro if the other one of Yates or Carapaz was willing to force Del Toro to ride. Yes if none of them attacked, maybe Del Toro stays on the wheel the entire time, but I also don't think he'd riding a sub-hour climb by himself like Yates did. The blunder (at least for winning) was not recognizing Yates was the bigger threat once he came back to them.
 
Fantasy Dauphine 2025 Entries


Fantasy Dauphine 2025 Slackers




League Name: FBGs League Code: 37515764

Stage Race begins Sunday






Superclasico Fantasy Sixes

resumes on Sunday June 8th as well

Round 22
2025-06-08 12:15:00
Brussels Cycling Classic

Cat 2


Different contest, same league code

Please set your lineup
 
Everybody in except @Jaysus

:oldunsure:

Think he missed a round or two earlier in the year & said he doesn’t check the board on weekends

Still got 33.5 hours

4:10 a.m. start if you’re watching Stage 1
 
Looks like BL only picked one of the big four

It’s a bold strategy Cotton, let’s see how it works out for him
Big four were Pogacar, Jonas, Remco, Matteo. Looks like you have two of them. Half our league went Pogacar/Matteo. You will be in a dog fight everyday with your second tier riders being critical. Looks like you share Martinez and Lipowitz with da Raiders.
 
Over 80% of the velogames contestants to Pogacar. He's got to start pushing him into the 30s and get that down to 50%. I toyed with leaving him off, but their were too many 6 point riders I liked and the 8 and 12 credits ranks were thin.
 
No clue what to do on the Brussels 1.Pro race

I have a team but these one day races parallel to a major stage race are tough

Still, pretty strong field considering everyone is gearing up for TdF & Critérium du Dauphiné is a big part of the prep for most GC guys

Top competitors​

So actually you had some clue.

Girmay about to make my "do not roster" list.
 
No clue what to do on the Brussels 1.Pro race

I have a team but these one day races parallel to a major stage race are tough

Still, pretty strong field considering everyone is gearing up for TdF & Critérium du Dauphiné is a big part of the prep for most GC guys

Top competitors​

So actually you had some clue.

Girmay about to make my "do not roster" list.
Agreed. I initially didn’t have him but changed up last to add him.
 
No clue what to do on the Brussels 1.Pro race

I have a team but these one day races parallel to a major stage race are tough

Still, pretty strong field considering everyone is gearing up for TdF & Critérium du Dauphiné is a big part of the prep for most GC guys

Top competitors​

So actually you had some clue.

Girmay about to make my "do not roster" list.

1-3-6-20-28-98
  • Brussels Cycling Classic Score: 1222
  • Brussels Cycling Classic Rank: 120 of 4002
no idea how that happened

switched to Biniam - even though I posted here he’s barely training & enjoying his newborn

#doasIsaynotasIdo

Round 22
  1. 1222 points Boerum Hill Big Ringing BobbyLayne
  2. 1143 points RB Brownwings WGUAFC Jaysus
  3. 1086 points 45 Excuses Sand
  4. 1042 points Armstrong’s Needle Da Raiders
  5. 989 points Squeaky Wheels Cheeseypoof
  6. 877 points Spokes `n Tokes Nick Vermeil
  7. 747 points Sand`s Saddle Sores BassNBrew
  8. 45 points Late to the Party BrettDJ




Big 4 per Velogames & @BassNBrew
  1. Tadej 28 cr
  2. Jonas 22 cr
  3. Remco 20 cr
  4. Matteo 18 cr
per PCS points

Top competitors

sorted by their position in the PCS ranking.

Pos. Rider Team Points #

1 Pogačar Tadej UAE Team Emirates - XRG 4229 1
2 Evenepoel Remco Soudal Quick-Step 2701 2
3 van der Poel Mathieu Alpecin - Deceuninck 1527 10
4 Mas Enric Movistar Team 1430 12
5 Vingegaard Jonas Team Visma | Lease a Bike 1413 14
6 Jorgenson Matteo Team Visma | Lease a Bike 1309 18
7 Cort Magnus Uno-X Mobility 1199 20

8 Milan Jonathan Lidl - Trek 990 32
9 Rodríguez Carlos INEOS Grenadiers 944 38
10 Buitrago Santiago Bahrain - Victorious 925 40

15 Lipowitz Florian Red Bull - BORA - hansgrohe 829 53
19 Martinez Lenny Bahrain - Victorious 751 62
23 Trentin Matteo Tudor Pro Cycling Team 601 85
56 Campenaerts Victor Team Visma | Lease a Bike 330 198
83 Armirail Bruno Decathlon AG2R La Mondiale Team 178 363

per UCI World Ranking

UCI World Ranking

Pos. Rider Team Points #

1 POGAČAR Tadej UAD 10545 1
2 EVENEPOEL Remco SOQ 5972 2
3 VAN DER POEL Mathieu ADC 3703 6
4 MAS Enric MOV 3095 10
5 VINGEGAARD Jonas TVL 2982 13
6 JORGENSON Matteo TVL 2494 20
7 CORT Magnus UXM 1962 30

8 HEALY Ben EFE 1814 31
9 RODRÍGUEZ Carlos IGD 1624 35
10 LIPOWITZ Florian RBH 1588 38
18 MARTINEZ Lenny TBV 1243 63
29 TRENTIN Matteo TUD 869 101
57 CAMPENAERTS Victor TVL 495 199
69 ARMIRAIL Bruno DAT 309 294
97 POLITT Nils UAD 167 484

Big 4 All-time points & @BobbyLayne


Points
11 17 ▲6 POGAČAR Tadej UAE Team Emirates - XRG 1565.5
46 49 ▲3 EVENEPOEL Remco Soudal Quick-Step 875.7
68 90 ▲22 VAN DER POEL Mathieu Alpecin - Deceuninck 7
118 124 ▲6 VINGEGAARD Jonas Team Visma | Lease a Bike 572.8
260 263 ▲3 TRENTIN Matteo Tudor Pro Cycling Team
428 460 ▲32 CORT Magnus Uno-X Mobility 255.3
806 1044 ▲238 JORGENSON Matteo Team Visma | Lease a Bike 146.2
 
By
Big 4* riders per team
  1. BassNBrew - 2
  2. Jaysus - 3
  3. Cheeseypoof - 2
  4. Nick Vermeil - 2
  5. BrettDJ - 2
  6. BobbyLayne - 1
  7. Da Raiders - 1
  8. Sand - 1

Pogi, Jonas, Remco, MvdP
I would agree with you on one day race, but in a stage race with mountains MVDP isn't one of the big 4.

Odds to win

Pogacar 4/7
Jonas 15/8
Remco 5
Matteo 25
Lipowitz 25

Everyone else 40 or less.

This came down to if invest in guys like Cort, MVDP, and Milan would yield enough points in the first 3 stages to offset the difference between end of contest GC points and green jersey points. They were going to need some GC bonus points on the first three stages to make up that difference. If you went GC, the decision was top heavy GC or deep GC. I stayed away from top heavy because I didn't expect the top dogs to be pulling in GC points until after the TT.

Notice that Ourseilen and Theirrey managed to drop 7 minutes today after being in the break. Obviously positioning themselves for KOM.
 
By
Big 4* riders per team
  1. BassNBrew - 2
  2. Jaysus - 3
  3. Cheeseypoof - 2
  4. Nick Vermeil - 2
  5. BrettDJ - 2
  6. BobbyLayne - 1
  7. Da Raiders - 1
  8. Sand - 1

Pogi, Jonas, Remco, MvdP
I would agree with you on one day race, but in a stage race with mountains MVDP isn't one of the big 4.

Odds to win

Pogacar 4/7
Jonas 15/8
Remco 5
Matteo 25
Lipowitz 25

Everyone else 40 or less.

This came down to if invest in guys like Cort, MVDP, and Milan would yield enough points in the first 3 stages to offset the difference between end of contest GC points and green jersey points. They were going to need some GC bonus points on the first three stages to make up that difference. If you went GC, the decision was top heavy GC or deep GC. I stayed away from top heavy because I didn't expect the top dogs to be pulling in GC points until after the TT.

Notice that Ourseilen and Theirrey managed to drop 7 minutes today after being in the break. Obviously positioning themselves for KOM.

OK

The Big 4 finished 1-2-3-4 today
 
Critérium du Dauphiné official X account

Romain Bardet continues his farewell tour, posing for a selfie at the start line with the Big 3 of cycling (L-R, MdvP, Pogi, Jonas)

not sure where the gold helmet guy was at



overhead still shot of Jonas' final attack - MdvP and Pogi follow, peloton is going 55 kph, and Remco - who had just been brought to the front - bridges across the flat by himself

what an awesome stage - the top 3 GC contenders for TdF and the only guy to be Wold Champion in three different disciplines (7x Cyclo Cross, Gravel, Road)



WvA has won 1 monument (9 GT stage wins, versus 2 for MvdP)

113 riders have won two or more Monuments, including Remco and Alexander Kristoff

50 riders have won three or more Monuments - there are only two active riders on this list

MvdP is in a two-way tie for 7th place in career Monument wins with 8 wins (first 2 this year)

Pogacar is in a four-way tie for 3rd place in career Monument wins with 9 wins (last 2 this year)



Most wins - active riders

Pos. Rider Team Wins View
1 KRISTOFF Alexander Uno-X Mobility 97 wins
2 DÉMARE Arnaud Arkéa - B&B Hotels 97 wins
3 POGAČAR Tadej UAE Team Emirates - XRG 95 wins
4 ROGLIČ Primož Red Bull - BORA - hansgrohe 91 wins
5 VIVIANI Elia Lotto 90 wins
6 GROENEWEGEN Dylan Team Jayco AlUla 77 wins
7 BENNETT Sam Decathlon AG2R La Mondiale Team 71 wins
8 EVENEPOEL Remco Soudal Quick-Step 61 wins
9 MERLIER Tim Soudal Quick-Step 57 wins
10 VAN DER POEL Mathieu Alpecin - Deceuninck 54 wins
11 PEDERSEN Mads Lidl - Trek 54 wins
12 COQUARD Bryan Cofidis 53 wins
13 GAVIRIA Fernando Movistar Team 52 wins
14 PHILIPSEN Jasper Alpecin - Deceuninck 52 wins
15 QUINTANA Nairo Movistar Team 51 wins
16 MARECZKO Jakub Mazowsze Serce Polski 50 wins
17 VAN AERT Wout Team Visma | Lease a Bike 50 wins
18 ULISSI Diego XDS Astana Team 48 wins
19 DEGENKOLB John Team Picnic PostNL 48 wins
20 FROOME Chris Israel - Premier Tech 46 wins
21 JAKOBSEN Fabio Team Picnic PostNL 46 wins
22 ALAPHILIPPE Julian Tudor Pro Cycling Team 44 wins
23 MATTHEWS Michael Team Jayco AlUla 43 wins
24 LUTSENKO Alexey Israel - Premier Tech 41 wins
25 ACKERMANN Pascal Israel - Premier Tech 41 wins
26 KOOIJ Olav Team Visma | Lease a Bike 41 wins
27 WELLENS Tim UAE Team Emirates - XRG 39 wins
28 VINGEGAARD Jonas Team Visma | Lease a Bike 38 wins
29 YATES Simon Team Visma | Lease a Bike 35 wins
30 CORT Magnus Uno-X Mobility 34 wins
31 GANNA Filippo INEOS Grenadiers 34 wins
 
Critérium du Dauphiné official X account

Romain Bardet continues his farewell tour, posing for a selfie at the start line with the Big 3 of cycling (L-R, MdvP, Pogi, Jonas)

not sure where the gold helmet guy was at



overhead still shot of Jonas' final attack - MdvP and Pogi follow, peloton is going 55 kph, and Remco - who had just been brought to the front - bridges across the flat by himself

what an awesome stage - the top 3 GC contenders for TdF and the only guy to be Wold Champion in three different disciplines (7x Cyclo Cross, Gravel, Road)



WvA has won 1 monument (9 GT stage wins, versus 2 for MvdP)

113 riders have won two or more Monuments, including Remco and Alexander Kristoff

50 riders have won three or more Monuments - there are only two active riders on this list

MvdP is in a two-way tie for 7th place in career Monument wins with 8 wins (first 2 this year)

Pogacar is in a four-way tie for 3rd place in career Monument wins with 9 wins (last 2 this year)



Most wins - active riders

Pos. Rider Team Wins View
1 KRISTOFF Alexander Uno-X Mobility 97 wins
2 DÉMARE Arnaud Arkéa - B&B Hotels 97 wins
3 POGAČAR Tadej UAE Team Emirates - XRG 95 wins
4 ROGLIČ Primož Red Bull - BORA - hansgrohe 91 wins
5 VIVIANI Elia Lotto 90 wins
6 GROENEWEGEN Dylan Team Jayco AlUla 77 wins
7 BENNETT Sam Decathlon AG2R La Mondiale Team 71 wins
8 EVENEPOEL Remco Soudal Quick-Step 61 wins
9 MERLIER Tim Soudal Quick-Step 57 wins
10 VAN DER POEL Mathieu Alpecin - Deceuninck 54 wins
11 PEDERSEN Mads Lidl - Trek 54 wins
12 COQUARD Bryan Cofidis 53 wins
13 GAVIRIA Fernando Movistar Team 52 wins
14 PHILIPSEN Jasper Alpecin - Deceuninck 52 wins
15 QUINTANA Nairo Movistar Team 51 wins
16 MARECZKO Jakub Mazowsze Serce Polski 50 wins
17 VAN AERT Wout Team Visma | Lease a Bike 50 wins
18 ULISSI Diego XDS Astana Team 48 wins
19 DEGENKOLB John Team Picnic PostNL 48 wins
20 FROOME Chris Israel - Premier Tech 46 wins
21 JAKOBSEN Fabio Team Picnic PostNL 46 wins
22 ALAPHILIPPE Julian Tudor Pro Cycling Team 44 wins
23 MATTHEWS Michael Team Jayco AlUla 43 wins
24 LUTSENKO Alexey Israel - Premier Tech 41 wins
25 ACKERMANN Pascal Israel - Premier Tech 41 wins
26 KOOIJ Olav Team Visma | Lease a Bike 41 wins
27 WELLENS Tim UAE Team Emirates - XRG 39 wins
28 VINGEGAARD Jonas Team Visma | Lease a Bike 38 wins
29 YATES Simon Team Visma | Lease a Bike 35 wins
30 CORT Magnus Uno-X Mobility 34 wins
31 GANNA Filippo INEOS Grenadiers 34 wins
What an amazing stage. Not sure what these guys were thinking and it's not really smart, but dog gone it, it sure is great for the sport and spectators. Glad to see these guys are friends too.

I suppose that win total win at least be tied by next Sunday unless Kristoff or Demare are racing some local crit this week.
 

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