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"Official" Donald Trump for President: Great Wall of Mexico (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter Ministry of Pain
- Start date
- Status
Ditkaless Wonders
Footballguy
I believe it was particularly ineffective since its purpose was to restrain minds and ideas. Rather than restrain them it made imaginations take flight. Also, I am told it had ends around which people could and did go.
Galileo
Footballguy
Serious question here...How much of Trump's image problems stem from the fact that he is just not a very good orator vs. genuinely being a person of such poor character as he is portrayed by some? It seems to me that he tries to address valid concerns in the public interest, concerns that are obviously shared by many others (thus his popularity), but he is just not very eloquent about it. When I listen to him speak it just seems like such a struggle for him to communicate his ideas in a cohesive manner. Is it possible that his lack of oratory skills just leaves him more susceptible to having words twisted, misunderstood, and/or misrepresented so that he is perceived as a bigot/racist/sexist/fill in the blank-ist, but really isn't? Or is it as simple as "walks like a duck, talks like a duck..."
For the record, I am not a Trump supporter, but I do love the idea of a "non-politician" being in the mix. Unfortunately, this still leaves me hopelessly looking for other options not named Hillary.
For the record, I am not a Trump supporter, but I do love the idea of a "non-politician" being in the mix. Unfortunately, this still leaves me hopelessly looking for other options not named Hillary.
dfsguy
Footballguy
The answer is neither. Trump's image problem comes from constant attack from dishonest people in power/media that don't want someone winning that can't be controlled. Coyote News is one of the biggest offenders in this. Their real goal is having someone win that is open borders and tree trade, even though that kills the middle class.
![[scooter]](/data/avatars/m/22/22287.jpg?1659477690){kind=avatar}
[scooter]
Footballguy
dfsguy
Footballguy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IyV7BnBTSok
Ted Cruz Braveheart gets destroyed with a single question "will you support Donald Trump"
Ted Cruz Braveheart gets destroyed with a single question "will you support Donald Trump"
timschochet
Footballguy
The fact that you ask such a question indicates to me that I doubt I could explain my answer to you in any way you can accept. But let me put it very simply and bluntly: 300 years of a history of slavery, Jim Crow, and general treatment makes it OK for black voters to vote as a bloc, and for politicians to attempt to appeal to that bloc, and none of this is racism. White identity politics is, however, racism.
timschochet
Footballguy
The Berlin Wall was successful at keeping people in, not out.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
Since Tim won't answer I'd like to know what others think. The article by his communications director today made me rethink it. He may be terrified, or he may be avaricious and is greedily trying everything he can which might explain the erratic behavior.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Anyone that thinks Clinton wins in a landslide and the GOP loses control of the House and Senate with the current state of things including but not limited to...
-Obamacare: I can't find 5 people on the street who will openly endorse or say good things about it. My mother in law who is way under the poverty line couldn't wait to get this and signed up for it. She went to the doctors several times to get check ups and things she had put off for a long time, then she started getting bills after she was re-adjusted shall we say in the program after she started using more of the features. And the cost were too much and she dropped coverage and now has none like she did prior. But for a lot of folks, the health premiums have increased, care/choices decreased(we are paying double what we used to pay for same coverage). This is a sore spot for many and something the GOP if you believe them says they will CHANGE
-Islamic Terrorism: There I said it. One side of the aisle can't even bring themselves to say it and the answer when and as it is happening is to dine and tango in a country ruled by a brutal dictator and the brother trashes you the second you leave town. "The Empire" actually was a great term Fidel used. Will Hilary Clinton even bring this topic up? Is she legally allowed to say it? Then there's the e-mails but we better just keep going here. People are looking for a CHANGE here vs the current administration's passive policies. I would remind folks though that Obama has kept us out of harm's way largely and also teamed up with Putin to destroy the Euro by flooding them with immigrants. Brilliant depending on your POV but again most Americans will want CHANGE on this issue.
-Society/Lifestyle choices: They have been heaped on the American people left and right over the last many years, most of these bills on lifestyle choices would never pass in at large vote the way we elect a President. It's not like 75% of the country is begging for gay marriage to be legalized, religions deemed too taboo to discuss, the human emotion of anger has been outlawed, at a certain point people are going to push back. I'm a little shocked more people seem so surprised by it all.
-Banks are evil: The Federal Reserve is not actually run by the Federal Government, you know that right? It's a private bank of sorts and you should really check into it because the end of the world is upon us. ("MOP, that's not on the talking points bulletin") Sorry, I thought I was in the Art Bell forum, just scratch that last one kids.
-Obamacare: I can't find 5 people on the street who will openly endorse or say good things about it. My mother in law who is way under the poverty line couldn't wait to get this and signed up for it. She went to the doctors several times to get check ups and things she had put off for a long time, then she started getting bills after she was re-adjusted shall we say in the program after she started using more of the features. And the cost were too much and she dropped coverage and now has none like she did prior. But for a lot of folks, the health premiums have increased, care/choices decreased(we are paying double what we used to pay for same coverage). This is a sore spot for many and something the GOP if you believe them says they will CHANGE
-Islamic Terrorism: There I said it. One side of the aisle can't even bring themselves to say it and the answer when and as it is happening is to dine and tango in a country ruled by a brutal dictator and the brother trashes you the second you leave town. "The Empire" actually was a great term Fidel used. Will Hilary Clinton even bring this topic up? Is she legally allowed to say it? Then there's the e-mails but we better just keep going here. People are looking for a CHANGE here vs the current administration's passive policies. I would remind folks though that Obama has kept us out of harm's way largely and also teamed up with Putin to destroy the Euro by flooding them with immigrants. Brilliant depending on your POV but again most Americans will want CHANGE on this issue.
-Society/Lifestyle choices: They have been heaped on the American people left and right over the last many years, most of these bills on lifestyle choices would never pass in at large vote the way we elect a President. It's not like 75% of the country is begging for gay marriage to be legalized, religions deemed too taboo to discuss, the human emotion of anger has been outlawed, at a certain point people are going to push back. I'm a little shocked more people seem so surprised by it all.
-Banks are evil: The Federal Reserve is not actually run by the Federal Government, you know that right? It's a private bank of sorts and you should really check into it because the end of the world is upon us. ("MOP, that's not on the talking points bulletin") Sorry, I thought I was in the Art Bell forum, just scratch that last one kids.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
NorvilleBarnes
Footballguy
I agree - but then who gets it? If it's someone who's not even running (Romney, Ryan, etc) that's difficult to imagine. If it's someone who was running and lost (Bush, Rubio, Kasich, etc) that would be kind of pitiful. And I honestly think Cruz would be worse than Trump - he's only benefited by avoiding the scrutiny a front runner gets. There's no GOP version of Elizabeth Warren waiting in the wings that would be acceptable to the rank and file voters. This is the problem with democracy - if you let the people decide you might not like who they vote for.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
Dude you are dreaming. Donald cannot articulate the problems or solutions. I saw him on Fox/Bolling tonight largely on foreign policy and he was indecipherable, ranting.
Anyway it doesn't matter, Donald is talking about Heidi Cruz, Megyn Kelly, his hands, being treated unfairly, and right now he is trying to take down a wife and mother of two, Amanda Carpenter. That's what he spends an enormous amount of time on.
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Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
We can't so instead let's put a moratorium on anyone coming in here from the Middle East, excellent point!
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
chauncey
Footballguy
Part of his problem is that he speaks off the cuff. He does not use prepared speeches (other than the AIPAC one) written by experts every time he is in front of a camera like other politicians (with the possible exception of Bernie). This is a double edged sword. It is very appealing to some people because they see him as an authentic candidate speaking about the issues this country faces. He is bashed by others because his tone isn't "presidential" and he speaks in plain language, often repeating sentences, which they assume means he lacks intelligence.
The "doesn't sound presidential" argument is odd but understandable. We have been conditioned to think that reciting a speech or canned response someone else wrote is an indicator of strong leadership. Trump's rambling style is more suited to one on one or small group interactions like making deals or social gatherings.
I would recommend checking out one of his rally rambles in its entirety. He is all over the place, but his message is clear and delivered with confidence and charm. Also, if you watch an entire rally speech you get an honest look at his tone towards protesters, immigrants, women, etc. Spoiler alert: it is the opposite of what the media and SJWs want you to believe.
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chauncey
Footballguy
I hate to break it to you Saints but that article is bogus. She was not his communications director and was never affiliated with the Trump campaign. She was part of a PAC that Trump disavowed and reported to the FEC. She is nothing but a bitter attention and possibly money seeking #####.
Link
There are rumors of a Cruz mole in the Trump camp being outed and fired though. It would be disappointing if it turns out to be Hurricane Katrina.
chauncey
Footballguy
For any BernieTrash or BLKKK supporters out there here is a job opportunity in Janesville, WI that pays $15/hr to harass people attending the Trump rally:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CerZwwsW8AA6eNC.jpg
Article
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CerZwwsW8AA6eNC.jpg
Article
McGarnicle
Footballguy
Does watching the entire speech put the ignorant remarks into better context? How would this work exactly? Is "Mexicans are rapists" canceled out because later he says he's a huge fan of the Jews?
Also what is the media doing to paint a false picture of him exactly? He makes a speech or gives an interview and they cover it. His own words are why people think he's a bigot, or a misogynist, or clueless about foreign affairs.
McGarnicle
Footballguy
You poor Trump guys are treated so unfairly in here. Clearly all you want is a fair and respectful discourse on the issues.
McGarnicle
Footballguy
You know what's becoming crystal clear to me -- the true believers in Trump really are buying into a brand and not caring about the message. You're basically saying don't worry about anything he says, just trust him because he's terrific. He acts like it's beneath him to have to pretend to care about people or to learn about foreign policy. Just elect me and everything will be great, because I'm the smartest person in the world. Everything sucks and I'll fix it. Everyone in government is a moron and I'll make them see the light. Details? Don't worry about those. This is where his fatal character flaw is coming into sharp focus. The narcissist is offended that you'd question his greatness. He doesn't need to explain himself, or consult with anyone, or polish his message. Leave me alone fools, I've got deals to make.
Gee, no risk in letting that guy become leader of the free world right? Just because he has no experience and has a rudimentary understanding of the issues and no apparent desire to learn anything and his greatest advisor is himself. Hmm, but what if he's wrong about something really important and everyone in his cabinet says he's wrong but he unilaterally decides to make a horrible decision because he can never be wrong? I mean....can ya maybe see that happening? Like, maybe often? If I'm not connecting the dots correctly here please, someone, anyone, explain how this works.
Gee, no risk in letting that guy become leader of the free world right? Just because he has no experience and has a rudimentary understanding of the issues and no apparent desire to learn anything and his greatest advisor is himself. Hmm, but what if he's wrong about something really important and everyone in his cabinet says he's wrong but he unilaterally decides to make a horrible decision because he can never be wrong? I mean....can ya maybe see that happening? Like, maybe often? If I'm not connecting the dots correctly here please, someone, anyone, explain how this works.
McGarnicle
Footballguy
chauncey
Footballguy
Hillary supporters sing Donald Trump a song (NSFW language)
I think I counted 23 death threats. Imagine the reaction from the hypocrites if someone made a video like this about Hillary.
I think I counted 23 death threats. Imagine the reaction from the hypocrites if someone made a video like this about Hillary.
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jamny
Footballguy
I'm not a Trump supporter but I don't believe he's a bigot or a racist.
I actually could be persuaded to vote for him if he could show the slightest grasp on any real issues. Sure, he could surround himself with good people but I'm not voting for them and I have no idea what they stand for. Ultimately, the decision rests on the President and if he doesn't really know enough to make an informed decision he doesn't deserve to be the most powerful man in the world.
I actually could be persuaded to vote for him if he could show the slightest grasp on any real issues. Sure, he could surround himself with good people but I'm not voting for them and I have no idea what they stand for. Ultimately, the decision rests on the President and if he doesn't really know enough to make an informed decision he doesn't deserve to be the most powerful man in the world.
He's done it again.Its all about , well you know who
Tim did exactly what MOP encouraged people to do...bring up legitimate issues for discussion. Then MOP (just like I knew he would) avoided answering the question and had every excuse in the book. Heaven forbid the topic of bigotry be mentioned in here. Trump supporters avoid it because they know they have no real answers. It is the single most important topic related to Trump and yet MOP, who claims he wants to discuss the issues, refuses to answer.
Just be honest and change the title to something like "discuss anything but no mention of bigotry " because Trump supporters know they have no answers.
Face facts...MOP wants another Trump circle jerk thread. If it was REALLY about the issues, the most talked about and most important one (bigotry) would be open for discussion.
jamny
Footballguy
I thought he answered Tim on the first page?
Tim did exactly what MOP encouraged people to do...bring up legitimate issues for discussion. Then MOP (just like I knew he would) avoided answering the question and had every excuse in the book. Heaven forbid the topic of bigotry be mentioned in here. Trump supporters avoid it because they know they have no real answers. It is the single most important topic related to Trump and yet MOP, who claims he wants to discuss the issues, refuses to answer.
Just be honest and change the title to something like "discuss anything but no mention of bigotry " because Trump supporters know they have no answers.
Face facts...MOP wants another Trump circle jerk thread. If it was REALLY about the issues, the most talked about and most important one (bigotry) would be open for discussion.
BustedKnuckles
Footballguy
it amazes me how hard people work at trying to convince others what to think or feel
Ditka Butkus
Footballguy
Ditka Butkus
Footballguy
[scooter]
Footballguy
Ditka Butkus
Footballguy
Ditka Butkus
Footballguy
BustedKnuckles
Footballguy
What is not said in this article is that most of the Muslims in Germany and France are from Turkey which in the past were mostly Mecca Muslims and not the Medina Muslims we are seeing now invading Europe. Previous Muslims were better educated than those now coming. So the chances of getting employed and not being a burden were much better. Still, over the past 10 years while polls about Muslims are mostly positive in Europe, the unemployment for them in France is around 40 percent. Because of this France has seen hundreds of small enclaves of Muslims that have not assimilated and have embraced Sharia law. The community in Brussels where they just captured the Paris killer this last week is a known hotbed of Muslim terrorists.
Refugee benefits in Denmark until recently when the conservatives took over was approx 20,000 per refugee. Now that amount is half, but the flow of refugees unwanted continues. Between shutting borders, sending out leaflets to please go home, and actually paying refugees to leave, the flow of mostly men that are not educated continues. Additionally only half are actually running for their lives, with a growing number coming for the money and benefits. The latter group will not qualify to stay, but how does Europe send them back? Denmark and Sweden each have 80,000 that do not qualify to stay. Where do they send them back and who pays? Think how many flights that will be. Merkel with her open door policy has created a huge mess and has forever changed the face of Europe. They will run out of money, accommodations and patience. These refugees have sued for their rights. The ugly is just beginning.
- quoted from another board ...not sure how much is true and can be substantiated but who in gods name ,besides Tim of course , wants THIS mess in America? and for what reason would you ?
Refugee benefits in Denmark until recently when the conservatives took over was approx 20,000 per refugee. Now that amount is half, but the flow of refugees unwanted continues. Between shutting borders, sending out leaflets to please go home, and actually paying refugees to leave, the flow of mostly men that are not educated continues. Additionally only half are actually running for their lives, with a growing number coming for the money and benefits. The latter group will not qualify to stay, but how does Europe send them back? Denmark and Sweden each have 80,000 that do not qualify to stay. Where do they send them back and who pays? Think how many flights that will be. Merkel with her open door policy has created a huge mess and has forever changed the face of Europe. They will run out of money, accommodations and patience. These refugees have sued for their rights. The ugly is just beginning.
- quoted from another board ...not sure how much is true and can be substantiated but who in gods name ,besides Tim of course , wants THIS mess in America? and for what reason would you ?
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
It does? First election/visit to a message board?
That's kind of the whole deal with this crazy democracy thing. The candidates try to convince people to vote for them, and then those supporters debate the issues with each other to try to sway support or convince undecided voters to support their preferred candidate. It's kind of a key part of the whole system, part of the vetting process. If we didn't do it the presidential election could be won by almost any moron with a talent for self-promotion. Like say for example some narcissistic reality TV star who has no idea how government works.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Anyone saying I didn't answer Tim's question...I'm still waiting on this one.
And please don't assume that someone is dodging a question, ask for clarity again. Some people go and do things and then check back in a few hours so relax.
It's not a Trump circle jerk, some days we will be having some very critical discussions but we would like a chance to get off the ground without the attacks.
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
Good call. You never hear about any terrorist activity, tensions between religious groups or discrimination/human rights issues in that delightful paradise. An excellent model for what we should strive to achieve.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
Ok first of all thanks for replying with some attempt at discussing facts, and actually this one's on me, I apologize. I got the facts wrong there, I said 'communications director' and you're right she was communications director for the Super-PAC. However she was forthright about her former position in her article:
Now that happened.
A couple other simple non-controversial things she says happened: the PAC met at Trump Towers and the PAC closed by internal decision. A candidate cannot have the FEC shut down a PAC, they did that on their own to boost Donald's outsider image. There is no evidence whatsoever that Donald had the FEC order this PAC shut down, that would be a big deal and there should be some documentation behind it. There is none.
Meanwhile Donald is the same guy who is blaming Cruz because Liz Mair spent $200 on a Facebook ad to inform evangelical voters that their futrue First Lady posed nude. Now Mair and what was originally a Rubio-friendly independent PAC is directly tied by Donald to Cruz.
But this woman Cegielski who apparently met with "Trump's most trusted advisors" at Trump Towers has nothing to do with Donald. Apply Donald's own logic to Cegielski and proceed from there.
I just think it's weird that when confronted with stuff like this the person is purged as a liar and a mole. By the way if the Donald supporters and his camp itself is getting ready to jettison Pierson then things are getting a little cultish. I've seen Pierson defend Donald tooth and nail like a mother bear, and though I have said she is a loon and a truther there is zero doubt in my mind about her commitment to Donald. I think the problem here is she is tweeting that the Cruz allegations are "stupid" and false. The problem is obvious and it's not hers in this case.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
It's horrible what's being done to this woman. Donald's social media director Dan Scavino has been tweeting this stuff out, so attempts by Donald to "disavow" (I disavow, ok?) connection to the Cruz-NE story, which were already ridiculous, are even more ridiculous.
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SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/mar/28/donald-trump-classified-intelligence-briefing-presidential-nominee
Here's hoping he keeps his yap shut but releasing classified information to the public can carry criminal penalties.
Skoo
Footballguy
It really is something to behold. To me the biggest sign that people just like him is how willing his supporters seem to be to abandon their "conservative principles" to back him. These people went INSANE over Obamacare, but suddenly are completely on board with Universal Healthcare since Trump is for it.
The Commish
Footballguy
It's rather simple to explain, but you won't like the explanation. He's saying these things to get elected and he doesn't believe a single one of them. You're good with saying what's necessary to get the nomination right? Or does that just apply to Hillary? NOTE: This is NOT a defense of Trump rather an explanation for his behavior. I pointed out several months ago that I believed this was what he was doing. Of course this doesn't make it right, but the show you're seeing doesn't mean it's anything more than a show. You should understand this concept being a Hillary supporter.
McGarnicle
Footballguy
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
Ha right, potentially yet another issue against her which could be negated. I really doubt if Donald can even distinguish what is classified and what is not. Otoh the powers that be may recognize this and severely limit what they tell him, hopefully.Well, Hillary would beg to differ. Heyoooo!!!
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Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
apalmer
Footballguy
You do realize that if "they" (whoever they are) ask Christians, many will feel that the Ten Commandments trump the Constitution, right? And, if "they" ask Catholics, many will feel the Pope's proclamations on things like abortion trump what U.S. law says about it, right? Are we going to keep them from walking on US soil as well? Or, do those sit well with you?
Ditkaless Wonders
Footballguy
Walls amount to next to nothing in impeding human travel. Resolution, vigilance, human resources accomplish that, and only so long as they persist. Fictionally, Colonel Nathan Jessup understood this. The Chinese and Romans knew this as their walls were linked military garrisons. The East German's knew this as the wall was just a symbol of their death line, enforced not by the obstruction of the wall, but by machine guns manned vigilantly by men.
Will we arm and monitor our wall vigilantly, and with resolution to kill if necessary to enforce the barrier?
The real barrier has always been the resolution to kill to enforce a boundary. That, even absent a wall is effective, for a time, though never for long. Walls without that will to enforce the boundary are wholly ineffective, except against migrating terrestrial animals.
Will we arm and monitor our wall vigilantly, and with resolution to kill if necessary to enforce the barrier?
The real barrier has always been the resolution to kill to enforce a boundary. That, even absent a wall is effective, for a time, though never for long. Walls without that will to enforce the boundary are wholly ineffective, except against migrating terrestrial animals.
squistion
Footballguy
Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump 4m4 minutes ago
I have millions more votes/hundreds more dels than Cruz or Kasich, and yet am not being treated properly by the Republican Party or the RNC.
I have millions more votes/hundreds more dels than Cruz or Kasich, and yet am not being treated properly by the Republican Party or the RNC.
dfsguy
Footballguy
http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2016/03/28/illegal-immigrant-arrested-in-texas-for-raping-impregnating-12-year-old/
An illegal immigrant has been arrested and charged with raping and impregnating a 12-year-old Texas girl, authorities say.
GET EM OUT OF HERE.
An illegal immigrant has been arrested and charged with raping and impregnating a 12-year-old Texas girl, authorities say.
GET EM OUT OF HERE.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
How do people take the whining? Constant btching, complaining. Make America A 5 year Old Child should be his motto.
- Status
