Official Hillary Clinton 2016 thread (6 Viewers)

[Mister CIA]

Proof require facts not innuendos.  

You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows.

 

[timschochet]

Where?

Not in a court of law, or in the court of public opinion.  So I am curious where is that "proof" requires "facts" and how are you defining "facts"?

I'm glad you brought up the courts, because this is extremely important with regard to these Clinton Foundation stories: the Supreme Court has ruled that access does not equal corruption: 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/supreme-court-rules-unanimously-in-favor-of-former-va-robert-f-mcdonnell-in-corruption-case/2016/06/27/38526a94-3c75-11e6-a66f-aa6c1883b6b1_story.html

This was a unanimous ruling from the court. So what it means for Hillary is that no matter how many meetings she had with donors to the Foundation while she was Secretary of State, she did NOTHING wrong. 

 

[Mister CIA]

I'm glad you brought up the courts, because this is extremely important with regard to these Clinton Foundation stories: the Supreme Court has ruled that access does not equal corruption: 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/supreme-court-rules-unanimously-in-favor-of-former-va-robert-f-mcdonnell-in-corruption-case/2016/06/27/38526a94-3c75-11e6-a66f-aa6c1883b6b1_story.html

This was a unanimous ruling from the court. So what it means for Hillary is that no matter how many meetings she had with donors to the Foundation while she was Secretary of State, she did NOTHING wrong. 

I'll take dictators for $600, Alex.

 

[Guest]

The point, Sand, is that it's not unethical. If she has to shut the Foundation down, it will be because she doesn't want her administration to be hampered by groups like Judicial Watch and Republican congressmen out to harass her for purely partisan reasons. I think it's awful that she might have to do this, because that foundation does nothing but good. It saves lives. 

Tim, for God's...

Rightest Wing Christian:  By golly they'z askin' us to seprate church n' state, and church does nothin' but good!  Saves lives!  Horse pockey!  

You: You wrote it.  

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Proof require facts not innuendos.  

There is this weird rubric where the Clinton attackers have set up 'they're guilty of crimes!' at one extreme and the Clinton defenders have set up 'this would never land a conviction in 5 of 5 courts of law' as the opposing standards.

Hey you know what maybe the husband of a SOS shouldn't have been partying with a Central Asia despot and collecting massive checks through his billionaire buddy's non-profit which doesn't reveal its donors.

When you get past the allegations of criminality you end up with some really dumb and conflicted behavior.

 

[Guest]

So we close a good charity that is doing good work because some right wing extremist want to throw a tantrum and throw mud at alleged ties.  In that case we need to close every catholic charity in the world after the pedo priest scandal.

No, but we must rigorously maintain the separation of church and state.  Just as we MUST separate back room influence/private wealth from government power, no matter who is in charge -- and whether Bill raped those underage girls or not.  :LolitaExpress:

 

[HellToupee]

So what's the story with her Star Trek jackets? She hiding a back brace, adult diapers, an ekg machine? What's going on back there?

I've been talking about whomever has been dressing her for months . For her age she looks ok dressed as a business woman 

 

[timschochet]

Mr CIA thinks I am supporting dictatorships. Mr Ham thinks I am arguing against the separation of church and state. 

And here I thought I was simply explains why, in order to call somebody corrupt, you kinda need to demonstrate some corruption. 

 

[Gr00vus]

I'll take dictators for $600, Alex.

Sorry, you can't get any dictators for $600. You need to up your donation by several orders of magnitude.

 

[squistion]

Mr CIA thinks I am supporting dictatorships. Mr Ham thinks I am arguing against the separation of church and state. 

And here I thought I was simply explains why, in order to call somebody corrupt, you kinda need to demonstrate some corruption. 

Mr. Ham also thinks the Clintons bribed Ken Starr to help cover up the murder of Vince Foster, which is why no one should ever take seriously anything Mr. Ham says.

 

[HellToupee]

No you didn't you changed my post and added something I never said. Please edit or delete immediately.

 

[Mister CIA]

Mr CIA thinks I am supporting dictatorships. Mr Ham thinks I am arguing against the separation of church and state. 

And here I thought I was simply explains why, in order to call somebody corrupt, you kinda need to demonstrate some corruption. 

Putin and Hillary share the same ethical pedigree, per your sparse concerns.

If I were Trump, I would award her an honorary doctorate in ethics from Trump U.

 

[squistion]

If I edited your one of your posts and attributed a quote to you that you never said, you would have a caps lock hissy fit. You went ballistic and threatened to report me just because I mentioned the name of the group NAMBLA - I can imagine your response if I started making up things that you said.

 

[HellToupee]

Haha, and Obama's mom jeans, amirite??

JFC it's a legit critique but you're always playing the D against R card . Cripes almighty . She does everything perfect , everythict , "amirite"?

 

[Gr00vus]

Mr CIA thinks I am supporting dictatorships. Mr Ham thinks I am arguing against the separation of church and state. 

And here I thought I was simply explains why, in order to call somebody corrupt, you kinda need to demonstrate some corruption. 

Avoiding any real securities regulation and supporting the TPP are nice starts. Securities & Investment and Entertainment are 2 of the top 4 industry demographic contributors to her campaign.   But hey, those micro transactions and lopsided IP laws are really working for all U.S. citizens. Bless her non-corrupt heart.

 

[timschochet]

Avoiding any real securities regulation and supporting the TPP are nice starts. Securities & Investment and Entertainment are 2 of the top 4 industry demographic contributors to her campaign.   But hey, those micro transactions and lopsided IP laws are really working for all U.S. citizens. Bless her non-corrupt heart.

So anybody who supports the TPP is corrupt? 

 

[Gr00vus]

So anybody who supports the TPP is corrupt? 

No, I'm sure many are just misguided. But who cares about anybody? Someone who's taken $17.7+M just from the entertainment industry for their campaign, yeah, probably corrupt.

 

[timschochet]

No, I'm sure many are just misguided. But who cares about anybody? Someone who's taken $17.7+M just from the entertainment industry for their campaign, yeah, probably corrupt.

Is President Obama corrupt then? I'm not sure, but I would guess he took quite a bit of money from the entertainment industry over the years. 

 

[Sand]

The point, Sand, is that it's not unethical. If she has to shut the Foundation down, it will be because she doesn't want her administration to be hampered by groups like Judicial Watch and Republican congressmen out to harass her for purely partisan reasons. I think it's awful that she might have to do this, because that foundation does nothing but good. It saves lives. 

The activities surrounding the CF are hugely unethical.  That's the reason we're seeing so much consternation and even massively liberal rags like Huffington calling for the CF to be shut down.  And, coincidentally, why they are (ostensibly) changing who can donate to the Foundation.  You know, if she gets to POTUS.

 

[cstu]

There is this weird rubric where the Clinton attackers have set up 'they're guilty of crimes!' at one extreme and the Clinton defenders have set up 'this would never land a conviction in 5 of 5 courts of law' as the opposing standards.

Hey you know what maybe the husband of a SOS shouldn't have been partying with a Central Asia despot and collecting massive checks through his billionaire buddy's non-profit which doesn't reveal its donors.

When you get past the allegations of criminality you end up with some really dumb and conflicted behavior.

This is what Hillary is guilty of.

Her and Bill a simply a mess when it comes to acting like normal human beings.  I honestly think both want of them 'want' to do good but their total pursuit of power (and #####) has led them down some shady paths.

 

[cstu]

No, I'm sure many are just misguided. But who cares about anybody? Someone who's taken $17.7+M just from the entertainment industry for their campaign, yeah, probably corrupt.

Receiving money isn't in and of itself corruption. 

BTW, I support TPP and no one has paid me anything. 

 

[bueno]

This is what Hillary is guilty of.

Her and Bill a simply a mess when it comes to acting like normal human beings.  I honestly think both want of them 'want' to do good but their total pursuit of power (and #####) has led them down some shady paths.

You are judged by your actions, not your intent.

 

[squistion]

Brian Fallon ‏@brianefallon 3h3 hours ago

Charity watchdog declares to CNN that @ClintonFdn is "one of the great humanitarian charities of our generation"

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Brian Fallon ‏@brianefallon 3h3 hours ago

Charity watchdog declares to CNN that @ClintonFdn is "one of the great humanitarian charities of our generation"

Which watchdog?

 

[squistion]

Which watchdog?

Charity Watch https://www.charitywatch.org/home

Charity Watch gives Clinton Foundation an 'A' rating:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEUD8kgIhzs

 

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

Which watchdog?

Daniel Borochoff of Charity Watch

 

[Politician Spock]

So anybody who supports the TPP is corrupt? 

Hillary was corrupt before the TPP was even just an idea.

 

[timschochet]

Hillary angrily responded to Trump's accusations tonight regarding the Foundation: she did nothing wrong, nothing criminal. The Foundation does good work. Hillary asserted that she was NEVER influenced to do anything as Secretary of State that was not on behalf of the American people. 

Just listened to her say this; I can't remember ever hearing her so angry. 

 

[timschochet]

Hillary was corrupt before the TPP was even just an idea.

Prove it. 

 

[Politician Spock]

Prove it. 

She's a politician. Done.

 

[timschochet]

She's a politician. Done.

You know, some politicians actually do take money to do stuff, and some of them go to prison. Ask Saints about some of the Louisiana guys (scratch that, ask Saints about MOST of the Louisiana guys, LOL). 

Hillary has never done anything like that. Despite your cynicism, some of our leaders really are more honest than others. 

 

[rodg12]

Wanted to place this here after adding it to the Trump thread.

https://www.hillaryclinton.com/briefing/factsheets/2016/08/23/hillary-clinton-will-make-life-easier-for-small-business-at-every-step-of-the-way/

Hillary worked with Mark Cuban and his experiences with small businesses on Shark Tank guys to come up with this.

 

[timschochet]

Wanted to place this here after adding it to the Trump thread.

https://www.hillaryclinton.com/briefing/factsheets/2016/08/23/hillary-clinton-will-make-life-easier-for-small-business-at-every-step-of-the-way/

Hillary worked with Mark Cuban and his experiences with small businesses on Shark Tank guys to come up with this.

Excellent. 

These are CONSERVATIVE ideas. Every person here who calls himself a conservative should like these ideas. 

 

[BassNBrew]

Excellent. 

These are CONSERVATIVE ideas. Every person here who calls himself a conservative should like these ideas. 

So she's going to depart from Bill's policies and snub Wall Street?  I've got a wall to sell you.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Wanted to place this here after adding it to the Trump thread.

https://www.hillaryclinton.com/briefing/factsheets/2016/08/23/hillary-clinton-will-make-life-easier-for-small-business-at-every-step-of-the-way/

Hillary worked with Mark Cuban and his experiences with small businesses on Shark Tank guys to come up with this.

good lord she has to touch some of that reality show demo. 

 

[rodg12]

good lord she has to touch some of that reality show demo. 

To be clear here, Cuban said he worked with her on this.  Not the other way around.

 

[timschochet]

So she's going to depart from Bill's policies and snub Wall Street?  I've got a wall to sell you.

Not sure what any of this has to do with Wall Street. 

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

To be clear here, Cuban said he worked with her on this.  Not the other way around.

Ha oh ok. They're just putting it out there.

 

[BassNBrew]

Not sure what any of this has to do with Wall Street. 

Banking regs are tilted in favor of Wall Street and away from the small investor.  Once again Hilliary is being everything to everyone but those of us with some intelligence see through this.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

You know, some politicians actually do take money to do stuff, and some of them go to prison. Ask Saints about some of the Louisiana guys (scratch that, ask Saints about MOST of the Louisiana guys, LOL). 

Hillary has never done anything like that. Despite your cynicism, some of our leaders really are more honest than others. 

Uh that's where you're wrong what Hillary does is most Louisiana/Arkansas-like. You don't understand the nature of the beast.

 

[timschochet]

Uh that's where you're wrong what Hillary does is most Louisiana/Arkansas-like. You don't understand the nature of the beast.

Saints, no matter how many times you and others claim this, you need to provide a "quo" to the "quid pro quo." Nobody has. 

 

[timschochet]

Banking regs are tilted in favor of Wall Street and away from the small investor.  Once again Hilliary is being everything to everyone but those of us with some intelligence see through this.

I still don't understand how it hurts Wall Street to lower taxes and regulations to help small business start ups. 

But let's say you're right and she's lying. Paul Ryan's been pushing similar ideas for years. Suppose he pushes through a bill which is this exact plan word for word? What's Hillary going to do, veto it? 

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Saints, no matter how many times you and others claim this, you need to provide a "quo" to the "quid pro quo." Nobody has. 

Tim it's not quid pro quo. You haven't been listening or reading. It never was QPQ. That's not how it's done.

 

[timschochet]

Tim it's not quid pro quo. You haven't been listening or reading. It never was QPQ. That's not how it's done.

If that's not how its done, then there's nothing wrong. 

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

If that's not how its done, then there's nothing wrong. 

Convictions say otherwise.

 

[timschochet]

Convictions say otherwise.

We're talking about Hillary Clinton. All she has ever done that's even questionable is provide access. And the Supreme Court has ruled that access is not corruption. 

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

We're talking about Hillary Clinton. All she has ever done that's even questionable is provide access. And the Supreme Court has ruled that access is not corruption. 

I'm just establishing that QPQ in the sense of one specific thing in one hand for another specific thing in the other is not necessary for a corruption conviction. You don't understand how public corruption works (and really you don't care about it) so your assessment of the Clintons has no basis.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Pay to play is basically RICO.

In Rico there is no single thing given for a single thing. The participant in the syndicate pays a guy. That guy works for a guy who works for another guy. That guy happens to belong to an organization.

When a person puts money into a corrupt organization does he get a single 'thing' back? No. Does giving the money in a bag to some random guy constitute a crime? No. What he gets is a series of benefits over time. He gets to participate in the system and enjoy the benefits. But where is the quid pro quo in the sense of a literal thing received for a thing given? There is none.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

We're talking about Hillary Clinton. All she has ever done that's even questionable is provide access. And the Supreme Court has ruled that access is not corruption. 

Here's another thing you don't understand.

"Buying access" is yes legal but only within the system. So Monsanto of Akin Gump or Goldman Sachs or any of Hillary's corporate constituents (as you put it) can donate whatever amounts are allowed and they can buy all the access they want. That's what many politicians do.

It is when a politician receives personal benefit of any kind outside the system then they are afoul of ethics and possibly the law.

 

[tommyGunZ]

Saints still undetered.  It's apparent that he doesn't own a mirror.