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3 guys watching the draft together drew a similar conclusion albeit at different times. The wrap around hug/deep pec rub from behind for one, the deep shoulder massage as Lynch bawls his eyes out for another, and last but not least the intimate neck kiss at some point in the insanity for another. TO had a Garcia related quote for this I think.
Interesting that the Jets passed on him and targeted Hackenberg in the 2nd round. I guess we'll find out if they were right in a few years.
I think in their case it may not just have been a question of Hackenberg vs. Lynch (though it is certainly possible they liked the former better straight up?), but Darron Lee PLUS Hackenberg vs. Lynch PLUS ???
), after the NYJ pick #51 used on Hackenberg, the next two consecutive picks were Deion Jones and Su'a Cravens by ATL and WAS, respectively (listed as LBs, though Cravens a S/LB hybrid like ATL first rounder Keanu Neal, similar to Deone Bucannon and Mark Barron last year). Than not another LB pick until #83 - Jordan Jenkins to the Jets (though OAK is currently listing pick #75, Shilique Calhoun as a LB).
Well, I DO have to say when I saw him at the draft I thought "this guy is either going to be another Johnny Manzell or Joe Namath".
I love Lee. Targeted him in my dynasty rookie drafts and went 2 for 3 in getting him (missed him in one when the team ahead of me took him right before I was). I actually like him better than Smith or Jack simply because there is no injury concern there. Now, obviously sans injury issues both Smith and Jack are clearly better prospects but in the risk vs reward of a boom or bust proposition with Smith and Jack- you then have Lee who in my view was the safest LB bet you could make. Not as high of an upside but really not a very low downside at all.I think in their case it may not just have been a question of Hackenberg vs. Lynch (though it is certainly possible they liked the former better straight up?), but Darron Lee PLUS Hackenberg vs. Lynch PLUS ???
Also interestingly (to me at least
Lee was one of my favorite defensive players in the draft (along with fallen, former top 5-10 overall prospects, fellow LBs Jaylon Smith to DAL and Myles Jack to JAX, as well as JAX CB/S Jalen Ramsey and OAK SS Karl Joseph), and Bowles seems pretty high on him, too - may remind him of a squeaky clean Daryl Washington, former All-Pro ILB in ARI before spousal battery and drug-related indefinite suspensions left his career in jeopardy. So if the Jets liked Hackenberg almost as much as Lynch (let alone more), it would have made this a fairly easy decision from that perspective.
I liked Paxton early on but got caught up studying his game. Lots of details but the bottom line is I saw two things that made me back off the Lynch bandwagon.
Yeah, I don't have a good read on this kid due to the level of competition and what other QBs have done in the same system having similar individual and team success. Its really difficult to say throws that he made in ND translate and he is late pulling the trigger on many throws and doesn't keep his feet moving so he takes time to reset if his primary doesn't get separation from what I noticed.
Interesting. Why is that? Wentz doesn't do anything better than Lynch now, why you think he'll be better?
This is the point where if I were waffling between these two players I would gamble on the one that went 24 picks higher. I know people will throw out Smith and Rodgers as an example, but, in general, drafting rookies is all a crap shoot anyway. Why delude yourself into thinking you know better than the majority of NFL scouts?
Better then one team. Just one.Braktastic said:
You're right, we are talking about different things. I never said that no one had any idea where players were going. You are arguing a very small point that I didn't even make.
). I think I'm pretty clear on what you are and aren't saying in relation to the context of these different but related points.
You can't overdraft QB's if they are good. If Lynch is a good starting QB then he should have went 1.3.
I think what the scouting community thought was shaped by group think, and they all have a sudden tendency to change their ratings up and down at the same time. Funny how that works. Yes, the scouting community all had Wentz ranked very high--late in the process, when it was apparent where he was going. The scouting community, none of them were ran king him highly, and when buzz began, outside of the scouting community, they all got on board, and frankly, overrated Wentz, IMO. However, because the scouting community called where these guys were going to be drafted (when it became clear to everyone through news, not through their own scouting), doesn't mean that every NFL team would have taken them in this order.Maybe I misinterpreted the below:
"Better then one team. Just one.
The entire NFL didn't collectively decide to draft Wentz."
I get that YOU think Lynch is close or better, but don't think it is very ambiguous what the scouting community thought, and that is reflected in their respective pedigrees. Goff and Wentz are very close together at 1 & 2, Lynch not so much in the 20s. Again, not questioning your subjective opinion (or right to it), just that we had no idea where Wentz was going to go. A separate issue from your individual scouting beliefs (which may be right?
You still seem to be conflating destination with scouting grade.
What we do know, unassailably, is that Lynch DID drop. We DO have information that every team until DEN traded up passed. If more teams had valued Lynch as the #1 QB in the class of '16, why would he have fallen BELOW even where E.J. Manuel was taken a few years ago, in what I think was historically low or at least rare kind of low for a top QB? I'm not seeing a good explanation for that, and why we should see things like you that Lynch was really a #1 in class-type QB prospect but misunderstood or underappreciated. Is your point that all the teams before DEN traded up were also plagued by "groupthink"?
Ball wobbles a bit in comparison to Siemians. His arm looks in a weird spot pre throw and release is a bit slower then Siemians. He moved well and kept out of harms way nicely. Siemian always looked smaller and that tackle was bad for his build - he got tossed like a ragdoll. And it was all on the OLine early - they were lost on a couple of plays picking up the wrong blocks. I think we are OK with Lynch and was happy to see Kubiak put some faith in him early and letting him throw - including a nice bomb try to DT but DT was called for interference. He can throw it long so if you want to - let him grip it and rip it - it is almost like a punt if it gets picked off. Atlanta can be thrown on so I expect them to wing it around a bit. It will be interesting to see if the prep work during the week reaches starter #'s.
First of all, Fox isn't the coach.
Wally Pipp was a starter for 10 years and nearly a career .300 hitter when Gehrig stepped in. Siemian has had one good game and Lynch was a first-round pick that they understandably should be are curious to see what they have. Wally Pipp doesn't apply here imo.
Have to believe that's a huge factor in Kubiak saying he's still the starter.
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