Thunderlips
Footballguy
Was that Vince Russo who just came running in there with the folding chair?
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***Official Pro Wrestling Thread*** (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter NewlyRetired
- Start date
Hoos First
Footballguy
That took way too long
KiddLattimer
Footballguy
dschuler
Footballguy
Jeremy
Footballguy
Will he have to vacate it like the Ultimate Warrior did the IC title when he beat Hogan for the world title?Anyone else stoked Rollins has both belts?
Jeremy
Footballguy
Some are guessing Kane.I'm calling for Sting to make an appearance in the Taker match tonight
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dschuler
Footballguy
That would be my second guess.Some are guessing Kane.I'm calling for Sting to make an appearance in the Taker match tonight
KiddLattimer
Footballguy
Terrible ending, terrible ppv overall
dschuler
Footballguy
Thunderlips
Footballguy
I don't have a problem with the Undertaker winning. He's a throwback to another era, and more or less should just be viewed as an exhibition match. I mean come on....kids watching it see the Undertaker as a Living Legend.....adults watching it know that Lesnar would wipe the floor in about 10 seconds in a real fight. I don't see the need to "save face" for Lesnar with an unclean win for the Taker. Just give the Taker a legit win and have the rubber match at WM30. The way this went down doesn't give Lesnar any pop.....cheapens The Taker and is confusing as hell.
Very good match ruined by a ####ty ending.
Very good match ruined by a ####ty ending.
KiddLattimer
Footballguy
Agreed, I pretty much assumed he was going to win but this ending was a special level of dumb
Jeremy
Footballguy
There was a lot to like. The New Day winning back the belts in a fun match, Owens/Cesaro, and the wrestling itself in the world title match and the main event. But the goofy endings really made it a lot less enjoyable.
dschuler
Footballguy
Thunderlips
Footballguy
Taker match was good; particularly when compared to the WM match. They both brought it and sold it....there were some good pop moments and both guys didn't hurt their image and set themselves up for a third match. Except for that ending......
dschuler
Footballguy
Taker really did look a lot better than other times over the last few years. I still want a Sting vs Taker dream match though at WM
Thunderlips
Footballguy
I can't see how they're not. A clean Lesnar win gives them the ability to get out of it without a third one.Surely they aren't setting this up for a Lesnar / Taker 3 are they?
Jeremy
Footballguy
Yeah, the Undertaker gets nothing from that. He lost. In no way could he feel good about that. It's like the Packers/Seahawks game during the ref strike a couple years ago. The "fail mary" game. The record book will show one thing, but we all know that's now what really happened. In fans minds, Lesnar is 2-0 against the Undertaker.
KiddLattimer
Footballguy
JB Breakfast Club
Footballguy
My theory is that he saw the reverse camera angle on the TitanTron, and he rang the bell to protect Taker since the ref didn't see it.
I would disagree with that. It isn't like Jon Stewart is now WWE champion. Stewart's interference tells a good story, and keeps Cena looking like the best(which I hate, but it was always going to be either a schmozz or lol Cena wins.) I thought it was the 2nd best match of the weekend.
Rollins actually got to wrestle a non overbooked match for a change, and to the surprise of nobody anywhere, looked like a million bucks. He's gonna be the face of the company someday.
Speaking of celebrities, I was pretty impressed by Stephen Amell. That tag match was a lot better than it needed to be, and was in my opinion, better than half the card.
They should mic up Xavier Woods, I was 100X more interested in what he was saying than any of the announcers. New Day is a highlight of every show, and have been since they turned heel months ago.
Lesnar/Taker was better than expected, much like Rollins/Cena, the finish is lame, but makes sense telling the story that Taker is overmatched and can't beat Brock clean, and it was obviously going to be a setup for a 3rd match.
The women's match was lousy in my opinion. The setup was dumb, and the team format is lame and pointless. I've noticed the Bellas tend to be decent to good at wrestling when they are going to win, and very careless when they aren't. Comes off very childish..
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The NXT women's title match is my favorite match of 2015, the match was amazing, and the story may have been even better. I could go on about everything I loved about it, but instead I'll just copy/paste what Brandon Stroud thought of it, because it says everything I want to say and more:
NXT isn’t afraid to give us perfect moments.
When I explain being a wrestling fan to people, I often say that about 80% of it is garbage. Wrestling is terrible, almost exclusively. It’s regressive, it’s stupid, it’s insulting, it’s embarrassing. We sit through three hours of Raw every week, watching the same bad idea get sewn and reworn, watching the same people distract the same opponents in the same way as last week. Being a wrestling fan is like being Sisyphus, pushing a rock up a hill only for it to roll back down the other side. Sometimes, though, wrestling is great. When wrestling is great — truly, undeniably great — it’s the perfect human artform. It says what nothing else can say, and makes you feel like nothing else can. It takes the love you’ve put into it and funnels it back to you, finally, at long last. Being a wrestling fan is wading through the garbage to get to those moments, because you know they’re coming. You don’t know when, or for how long, but you know they’re there.
Sami Zayn winning the NXT Championship was a perfect moment. It took him 18 months to get there. We watched him earn Cesaro’s respect in a loss, we watched him take his eyes off the prize and lose Championship matches by being too nice. We watched him struggle with his conscience, and the reality that every successful WWE Champion has been a total jerks. The Rock, Stone Cold Steve Austin, Triple H, Hulk Hogan … they were all basically heels who justified their actions because they were being cheered, whether it was the right thing to do or not. They’d take shortcuts, cheat, beat up managers, whatever. Ruthless aggression is what they call it sometimes. Zayn didn’t have that. He wanted to be a Good Dude and win the title on his own terms. At the end of his match he held the NXT Championship in his hands and was ready to use it as a weapon, but threw it down. He wasn’t going to sell out. 18 months brought him here and made him the man he is for a reason. He won, and the good guy was actually a good guy, and it mattered.
At TakeOver: Brooklyn, we got the end of the Sasha Banks vs. Bayley story they’ve spent two years telling. Two years ago, they were enhancement talent. They worked hard and came up on two different paths — Sasha looked into the NXT Oculus, sold her soul and became “The Boss” to create a false air of confidence that’d carry her through the tough decisions of becoming NXT Champion; Bayley stayed true to herself, handed out headbands to special needs kids and hugged little girls cosplaying as her in the front row. She got turned on time and again by every woman she considered a friend. Sasha became champ, got called up to Raw and tapped out the Divas Champion in the main event. Bayley stayed down here in oblivion, getting beaten up by Dana Brooke. Bayley vs. Charlotte happened and Bayley lost, and we got footage of her standing at ringside crying because she’d let her friends and family down. The Divas Revolution started, and Bayley broke her hand. The pre-match video package of her being Back to the Future’d out of the Four Horsewomen of NXT photo says it all.
I don’t know if I’ve been as emotionally invested in a match in my adult life.
NXT isn’t afraid to give us perfect moments.
There are three moments that get me. The first is after Sasha has dismantled Bayley’s wrist guard and started wrecking her hand. She gets Bayley in the Banks Statement, and when Bayley goes for the ropes, Sasha starts stomping her hand. That moment of visceral, competitive rage is the single moment you point to as an example of what NXT does differently with female wrestlers, and how women who wrestle can be everything the men can be if they’re talented, and are given the time, story and audience of the men. This is beyond what the men are doing … this is pro wrestling at its best, where the little things feel life and death, and the physicality of drama becomes everything.
The other two moments come one after the other. Bayley hits a reverse hurricanrana from the top rope, and Sasha comes down on the top of her head. It’s a death blow. Bayley stands up, aggressively throws her scrunchie down and adjusts her pony. This isn’t the Bayley we know who is kinda awkward on the microphone and doesn’t know when to pull the trigger in the ring … this is a CHAMPION. This is a woman who knows she just hit the biggest move of her life and is ready to win. It’s a plasma cannon of goosebumps. The final moment comes seconds after the pin, when Bayley’s on her knees. Everyone’s looking at Bayley, the new champion, but look at Sasha. Watch her face.
She’s crying.
It’s not a cry of sadness, or of happiness, or relief. It’s everything. It’s all the things. It’s the rush of emotion from having wrestled one of the best women’s wrestling matches in WWE history, in front of NXT’s biggest-ever crowd, at its biggest-ever event. It’s finishing a story. It’s the end. It’s the last moment they’ll be them before the curtain call. Everything’s changing. The NXT Women’s Division is becoming the Raw and Smackdown Divas Division, and their job descriptions are changing. They’re not gonna be independent wrestlers trying their best in a Performance Center anymore. They’re gonna be world-traveled millionaires, TV stars, the works. This is the moment when that absolutely happens. This is the reward for years of hard work, for dedication in the face of impossibility, for standing up and making a difference in a sport that has never treated women right, and may never. It’s something. It’s raging against the dying of a light until an entire arena is bright as hell. Also, it’s being dropped on your head and getting Belly-to-Bayley’d out of your shoes. It’severything. All of it.
I loved this match. This is my favorite match of the year. An absolute classic, and the end of an era.
Here’s to hoping the next era knows how to fill those shoes, and that Bayley’s the one to show it how.
NXT isn’t afraid to give us perfect moments.
When I explain being a wrestling fan to people, I often say that about 80% of it is garbage. Wrestling is terrible, almost exclusively. It’s regressive, it’s stupid, it’s insulting, it’s embarrassing. We sit through three hours of Raw every week, watching the same bad idea get sewn and reworn, watching the same people distract the same opponents in the same way as last week. Being a wrestling fan is like being Sisyphus, pushing a rock up a hill only for it to roll back down the other side. Sometimes, though, wrestling is great. When wrestling is great — truly, undeniably great — it’s the perfect human artform. It says what nothing else can say, and makes you feel like nothing else can. It takes the love you’ve put into it and funnels it back to you, finally, at long last. Being a wrestling fan is wading through the garbage to get to those moments, because you know they’re coming. You don’t know when, or for how long, but you know they’re there.
Sami Zayn winning the NXT Championship was a perfect moment. It took him 18 months to get there. We watched him earn Cesaro’s respect in a loss, we watched him take his eyes off the prize and lose Championship matches by being too nice. We watched him struggle with his conscience, and the reality that every successful WWE Champion has been a total jerks. The Rock, Stone Cold Steve Austin, Triple H, Hulk Hogan … they were all basically heels who justified their actions because they were being cheered, whether it was the right thing to do or not. They’d take shortcuts, cheat, beat up managers, whatever. Ruthless aggression is what they call it sometimes. Zayn didn’t have that. He wanted to be a Good Dude and win the title on his own terms. At the end of his match he held the NXT Championship in his hands and was ready to use it as a weapon, but threw it down. He wasn’t going to sell out. 18 months brought him here and made him the man he is for a reason. He won, and the good guy was actually a good guy, and it mattered.
At TakeOver: Brooklyn, we got the end of the Sasha Banks vs. Bayley story they’ve spent two years telling. Two years ago, they were enhancement talent. They worked hard and came up on two different paths — Sasha looked into the NXT Oculus, sold her soul and became “The Boss” to create a false air of confidence that’d carry her through the tough decisions of becoming NXT Champion; Bayley stayed true to herself, handed out headbands to special needs kids and hugged little girls cosplaying as her in the front row. She got turned on time and again by every woman she considered a friend. Sasha became champ, got called up to Raw and tapped out the Divas Champion in the main event. Bayley stayed down here in oblivion, getting beaten up by Dana Brooke. Bayley vs. Charlotte happened and Bayley lost, and we got footage of her standing at ringside crying because she’d let her friends and family down. The Divas Revolution started, and Bayley broke her hand. The pre-match video package of her being Back to the Future’d out of the Four Horsewomen of NXT photo says it all.
I don’t know if I’ve been as emotionally invested in a match in my adult life.
NXT isn’t afraid to give us perfect moments.
There are three moments that get me. The first is after Sasha has dismantled Bayley’s wrist guard and started wrecking her hand. She gets Bayley in the Banks Statement, and when Bayley goes for the ropes, Sasha starts stomping her hand. That moment of visceral, competitive rage is the single moment you point to as an example of what NXT does differently with female wrestlers, and how women who wrestle can be everything the men can be if they’re talented, and are given the time, story and audience of the men. This is beyond what the men are doing … this is pro wrestling at its best, where the little things feel life and death, and the physicality of drama becomes everything.
The other two moments come one after the other. Bayley hits a reverse hurricanrana from the top rope, and Sasha comes down on the top of her head. It’s a death blow. Bayley stands up, aggressively throws her scrunchie down and adjusts her pony. This isn’t the Bayley we know who is kinda awkward on the microphone and doesn’t know when to pull the trigger in the ring … this is a CHAMPION. This is a woman who knows she just hit the biggest move of her life and is ready to win. It’s a plasma cannon of goosebumps. The final moment comes seconds after the pin, when Bayley’s on her knees. Everyone’s looking at Bayley, the new champion, but look at Sasha. Watch her face.
She’s crying.
It’s not a cry of sadness, or of happiness, or relief. It’s everything. It’s all the things. It’s the rush of emotion from having wrestled one of the best women’s wrestling matches in WWE history, in front of NXT’s biggest-ever crowd, at its biggest-ever event. It’s finishing a story. It’s the end. It’s the last moment they’ll be them before the curtain call. Everything’s changing. The NXT Women’s Division is becoming the Raw and Smackdown Divas Division, and their job descriptions are changing. They’re not gonna be independent wrestlers trying their best in a Performance Center anymore. They’re gonna be world-traveled millionaires, TV stars, the works. This is the moment when that absolutely happens. This is the reward for years of hard work, for dedication in the face of impossibility, for standing up and making a difference in a sport that has never treated women right, and may never. It’s something. It’s raging against the dying of a light until an entire arena is bright as hell. Also, it’s being dropped on your head and getting Belly-to-Bayley’d out of your shoes. It’severything. All of it.
I loved this match. This is my favorite match of the year. An absolute classic, and the end of an era.
Here’s to hoping the next era knows how to fill those shoes, and that Bayley’s the one to show it how.
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RBM
Footballguy
Travdogg -
As right as you are about Sasha and that match being MOTY (it is), you're wrong about the Jon Stewart thing. Vince just crapped on both titles with that one. It didn't tell a good story at all. Vince has to go. If NXT is Triple H's show and WWE is obviously all Vince, this weekend it couldn't be more clear Triple H >>>>>>>>>> Vince.
As right as you are about Sasha and that match being MOTY (it is), you're wrong about the Jon Stewart thing. Vince just crapped on both titles with that one. It didn't tell a good story at all. Vince has to go. If NXT is Triple H's show and WWE is obviously all Vince, this weekend it couldn't be more clear Triple H >>>>>>>>>> Vince.
Bogart
Footballguy
Great article travdogg on the NXT Women's match. Really couldn't have said it any better.
The curtain call was the best moment I think I will see all year, best thing since Bryan winning at WM. I had no problem with Sasha breaking kayfabe. We know what's going on these days, and that moment was bigger than any storyline being told.
It really makes me wish they would have gone Team WWE vs. Team NXT when they split up the Diva on the main roster, but it is what it is. Calling it now, Bailey debuts on RAW after WM, if not on WM itself.
The curtain call was the best moment I think I will see all year, best thing since Bryan winning at WM. I had no problem with Sasha breaking kayfabe. We know what's going on these days, and that moment was bigger than any storyline being told.
It really makes me wish they would have gone Team WWE vs. Team NXT when they split up the Diva on the main roster, but it is what it is. Calling it now, Bailey debuts on RAW after WM, if not on WM itself.
Gary Coal Man
Footballguy
His finisher will be "Your Moment of Zen". Vince is still debating whether to bring in Colbert and give them a run with the tag straps.
Jeremy
Footballguy
When I opened the internet this morning there was Stewart's "heel turn" right on the front page of the news. That was my "ah ha!" moment. They wanted to get mainstream attention, and mission accomplished. Still annoying from a storytelling perspective though. It was made worse by Stewart not really selling it correctly. Instead of looking back and forth from Cena to Rollins he should have been lining up Rollins the whole time right before turning and hitting Cena. And I think he clowned it up a little too much.
Deranged Hermit
Not cool & Pissed
lardonastick
Footballguy
My thoughts on most of the matches from the specials this weekend:
Liger/Breeze: *** Cool seeing Liger in a WWE ring/environment. Only nitpick is Breeze should've gone over.
Blake & Murphy/Vaudevillains: ***1/4 Fun, well worked match. Blue Pants is more over than most of the main roster.
Baron Corbin/Samoa Joe: **3/4 Joe's best match in NXT, and Corbin's also. Nice heavyweight match.
Sasha Banks/Bayley: ***** Match of the year for me so far. The build, storytelling and character work were all perfect. The match itself had a flaw or two, but that's easily overlooked for me due to the high emotional impact.
Finn Balor/Kevin Owens: **** Really good ladder match that unfortunately had to follow the women's match. Major props to Owens and Balor for getting the crowd back and delivering.
Missed chunks of a few SummerSlam matches, so here is what I saw in its entirety:
Rusev/Ziggler: **1/4 I'm so over Ziggler at this point.
Rollins/Cena: ***1/2 Great match, s*** finish. Rollins is so, so good.
Cesaro/Owens: ***1/4 Nice match, but underwhelming. I feel like these two have a match better match in them; hopefully we see it down the road.
Lesnar/Undertaker: ***3/4 Again, great match, s*** finish. Taker held his own, but his act has worn thin with me. He's so limited in what he can do, both physically and character wise. Please retire.
Liger/Breeze: *** Cool seeing Liger in a WWE ring/environment. Only nitpick is Breeze should've gone over.
Blake & Murphy/Vaudevillains: ***1/4 Fun, well worked match. Blue Pants is more over than most of the main roster.
Baron Corbin/Samoa Joe: **3/4 Joe's best match in NXT, and Corbin's also. Nice heavyweight match.
Sasha Banks/Bayley: ***** Match of the year for me so far. The build, storytelling and character work were all perfect. The match itself had a flaw or two, but that's easily overlooked for me due to the high emotional impact.
Finn Balor/Kevin Owens: **** Really good ladder match that unfortunately had to follow the women's match. Major props to Owens and Balor for getting the crowd back and delivering.
Missed chunks of a few SummerSlam matches, so here is what I saw in its entirety:
Rusev/Ziggler: **1/4 I'm so over Ziggler at this point.
Rollins/Cena: ***1/2 Great match, s*** finish. Rollins is so, so good.
Cesaro/Owens: ***1/4 Nice match, but underwhelming. I feel like these two have a match better match in them; hopefully we see it down the road.
Lesnar/Undertaker: ***3/4 Again, great match, s*** finish. Taker held his own, but his act has worn thin with me. He's so limited in what he can do, both physically and character wise. Please retire.
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