El Floppo
Footballguy
lolfwiw- I know I've seen him play worse... where he just doesn't get involved. at least he found a lot of opportunities on the night.
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***Official Soccer Discussion Thread*** (1 Viewer)
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El Floppo
Footballguy
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Qualifying for World Cup 2014 officially starts today.
CONCACAF teams Montserrat and Belize play the first leg of their round 1 matchup.
CONCACAF teams Montserrat and Belize play the first leg of their round 1 matchup.
El Floppo
Footballguy
In our current state, I hope we don't have to play either of these teams.
Senor Schmutzig
Footballguy
World rankings
The poor results of the team has seen them often frequenting the lower end of the FIFA World Rankings. The loss to Bhutan in "The Other Final" saw them fall to #203 in the rankings, becoming worst-ranked side in the world. After the addition of another two teams to FIFA, Montserrat achieved a new low of #205 between July and October 2004.In July 2006, they achieved a record high rank of #196 but they fell back down to #198 the following month. As of December 2009 Montserrat are #203 in the rankings, just ahead of American Samoa.
scoobygang
Footballguy
I actually think it's hard to say the US played all that badly last night. The passing was sharp (Jones had about 5 great long diaganol balls over the top). The defense really only had one shaky moment (some other moments that looked shaky really weren't because they held their line well to generate offsides calls). This wasn't even a game where they had possession but generated too few chances. They had bushels of chances. The finishing was just horrendous. Across the board.
Now, obviously it was Guadeloupe, so I'm not saying we should be happy or satisfied. But we were satisfied with the result against Canada, where I felt the US gave up a lot of chances. If Deuce doesn't have a stinker, this is at least a 3-0 win. Perhaps most importantly, nobody earned a yellow card suspension. At this stage of the last Gold Cup, the US C Team looked better than Mexico. Now, don't get me wrong, I think Mexico right now is a much, much better side than the US. I think Mexico has the pieces to be a top 10 side in the world if Hernandez continues to provide consistent goals. But I don't think the scores right now mean a lot other than that Mexico is taking their chances better.
Now, obviously it was Guadeloupe, so I'm not saying we should be happy or satisfied. But we were satisfied with the result against Canada, where I felt the US gave up a lot of chances. If Deuce doesn't have a stinker, this is at least a 3-0 win. Perhaps most importantly, nobody earned a yellow card suspension. At this stage of the last Gold Cup, the US C Team looked better than Mexico. Now, don't get me wrong, I think Mexico right now is a much, much better side than the US. I think Mexico has the pieces to be a top 10 side in the world if Hernandez continues to provide consistent goals. But I don't think the scores right now mean a lot other than that Mexico is taking their chances better.
CBusAlex
Footballguy
Same situation for this weekend's game, or did he buy himself some time? Jamaica's playing well right now, but they're still the sort of team we'll need to beat at home consistantly during qualifying.
CBusAlex
Footballguy
Fun fact: Although technically the home leg for Montserrat, the game will be played in Trinidad & Tobago because Montserrat's stadium (along with most of their country) was destroyed by volcanoes. These are the sort of storylines you rarely see watching American sports.
Good Posting Judge
Footballguy
Total Montserrat population is 4,655. 
The weird thing is he had a great game except for when he was around the six yard box. He may be the US's best bet to play up front along side Jozy but he's a natural mid fielder not a striker.
The Kansas Comet
Footballguy
I would hope the same situation would apply for anything short of making the final. Seeing the post-World Cup results laid out above added on to this woeful display in the Gold Cup just seem to drive home the point that he should be on a very hot seat. I still don't know why he was brought back (what top soccer nation brought back the same manager after the World Cup?), as it wasn't as if he acquitted himself exceptionally well in the World Cup. And everything since has been one giant turd in the punch bowl. Losing to Panama and scraping a 1-0 win over Guadeloupe? To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, what the hell is going on here?
The Z Machine
Footballguy
Soccer thread Christo >>> :e: Christo >>>>>>>>>>>> FFA Christo
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Here is a summary of random thoughts about what I have learned over the past year. Feel free to agree, carve this up and/or add more thoughts
1) Lets start with a positive one. Timmy is peaking. He seems stronger in the air, and his quickness and placement continue to be excellent. I hope he can hold this level through out this cycle. I know he is not the best keeper in the world but it is impossible to even think of him as an issue with the land filled sized amount of issues the team already has.
2) Bless he his heart and determination and playing a position he is not really suited for but I think the days of Boca at left back have to come to an end. Not specifically because of his defense, but more about his ever reducing mobility to get forward. If Bradley had a system where the wing backs could remain at home I would be ok, but the tactics demand that the wing backs get forward. Right now the US is too unbalanced when Boca plays out left offensively
3) Landon is a different player. I am not saying he has all of a sudden gone from the best player on the team to the worst, but he is different. I hate using baseball analogies but he almost appears to look like a power pitcher in baseball who knows he can't blow batters away with a fast ball and instead develops more guile. There have been about 6-7 chances for Landon over the first 3 games, that a few years ago, he would have said, "FU try and stay with me" as he ran at and past defenders. Now every single time he turns and plays the ball square or back. And I don't think it is tactics either, he is doing this at club level as well. He can obviously still be a decent player but he can not be considered the best on the team, by a long shot, if he turns into a free kick crosser and the guy who passes to Cherundolo 20 times a game.
4) I know this one is going to be controversial, and I know this seems like an excuse but I can't help but wonder....I feel like the US has run through a patch of being unlucky in the player availability department. It is impossible for me not to think that if Benny, Davies, and Holden were healthy, and if Chandler was available and if Rossi chose the US, we would be looking at a significantly different team right now. I know all teams battle this stuff, but with the US's lack of depth, this is a large group of quality players that IMO would have helped the team.
5) Bradley is in a tough spot. I believe he is going to be in jeopardy to lose his job if we get dumped in the quarters when it is combined with the lack luster first round and the pretty poor run up of games we have had that I listed earlier in the thread. This is obviously not good for development of players. Instead of letting players like Ream and Agudelo work through their issues, he is forced to put a team that can win this minute and some of these players are not going to be around in 2014. That being said, I think Gus Hiddink is still available
6) I was happy that Bradley gave a second shot to Wondo last night. He certainly did not make the most of it but I hate seeing players being judged on just a couple of minutes of play. And Wondo is not in the same classification as Ream and Agudelo. He is 28 years old, and his development from this stage is not going to be great. He was either going to be a hit or not. With both Agudelo and Wondo not producing and Dempsey have a near nightmare game, Bradley has to be scratching his head.
7) With as bad as the strikers have been. Jozy showing signs of life has been welcomed. I am not talking about the crap goal or the nice goal. The two plays that meant the most to me were his assist to Dempsey and that play last night where he simply was a rock in the box and would not allow himself to be moved off the ball. He can be such a strong physical player but he rarely plays that way.
1) Lets start with a positive one. Timmy is peaking. He seems stronger in the air, and his quickness and placement continue to be excellent. I hope he can hold this level through out this cycle. I know he is not the best keeper in the world but it is impossible to even think of him as an issue with the land filled sized amount of issues the team already has.
2) Bless he his heart and determination and playing a position he is not really suited for but I think the days of Boca at left back have to come to an end. Not specifically because of his defense, but more about his ever reducing mobility to get forward. If Bradley had a system where the wing backs could remain at home I would be ok, but the tactics demand that the wing backs get forward. Right now the US is too unbalanced when Boca plays out left offensively
3) Landon is a different player. I am not saying he has all of a sudden gone from the best player on the team to the worst, but he is different. I hate using baseball analogies but he almost appears to look like a power pitcher in baseball who knows he can't blow batters away with a fast ball and instead develops more guile. There have been about 6-7 chances for Landon over the first 3 games, that a few years ago, he would have said, "FU try and stay with me" as he ran at and past defenders. Now every single time he turns and plays the ball square or back. And I don't think it is tactics either, he is doing this at club level as well. He can obviously still be a decent player but he can not be considered the best on the team, by a long shot, if he turns into a free kick crosser and the guy who passes to Cherundolo 20 times a game.
4) I know this one is going to be controversial, and I know this seems like an excuse but I can't help but wonder....I feel like the US has run through a patch of being unlucky in the player availability department. It is impossible for me not to think that if Benny, Davies, and Holden were healthy, and if Chandler was available and if Rossi chose the US, we would be looking at a significantly different team right now. I know all teams battle this stuff, but with the US's lack of depth, this is a large group of quality players that IMO would have helped the team.
5) Bradley is in a tough spot. I believe he is going to be in jeopardy to lose his job if we get dumped in the quarters when it is combined with the lack luster first round and the pretty poor run up of games we have had that I listed earlier in the thread. This is obviously not good for development of players. Instead of letting players like Ream and Agudelo work through their issues, he is forced to put a team that can win this minute and some of these players are not going to be around in 2014. That being said, I think Gus Hiddink is still available
6) I was happy that Bradley gave a second shot to Wondo last night. He certainly did not make the most of it but I hate seeing players being judged on just a couple of minutes of play. And Wondo is not in the same classification as Ream and Agudelo. He is 28 years old, and his development from this stage is not going to be great. He was either going to be a hit or not. With both Agudelo and Wondo not producing and Dempsey have a near nightmare game, Bradley has to be scratching his head.
7) With as bad as the strikers have been. Jozy showing signs of life has been welcomed. I am not talking about the crap goal or the nice goal. The two plays that meant the most to me were his assist to Dempsey and that play last night where he simply was a rock in the box and would not allow himself to be moved off the ball. He can be such a strong physical player but he rarely plays that way.
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This is my problem with Jozy. Not saying the comparison is fair or not, but he has the physique to be Drogba-like. The sort of player who just wears out the center backs over the course of a game. Drogba scores a lot of late goals because defenders have been beat up the entire game. Last night Jozy had the great goal early but then seemed to shy away from the ball for most of the game. He should be screaming for the ball to be played into him just like Drogba does. And when it, is he should be attacking it.
CBusAlex
Footballguy
Not really. [/FFAChristo]
scoobygang
Footballguy
Drogba wasn't that player at Jozy's age either. He was playing for a Ligue 2 side. He didn't sign his first professional contract until he was 21 and didn't really have a big year in Ligue 1 until he was 23-24. I think it would be surprising if Jozy could consistently dominate grown men physically at his age.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
This is very heartening. Good info.
The Z Machine
Footballguy
It's also disheartening to think that the USMNT doesn't have a decent striker between the age of 23-30. That's a long stretch with no striking talent.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
. But your point stands on it's own. It is a very large gap.
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El Floppo
Footballguy
'scoobygang said:
For the sake of US players, I tend to compare Jozy to his predecessor, Eddie Johnson. EJ just didn't have the soccer smarts to produce at a higher level: no anticipation of what the the 2nd or 3rd ball was going to be and where and when he needed to make his runs. He was a big, physical and fast guy who had a nose for goal and a modicum of skills.Jozy... having watched them both play live a number of times- it's almost not fair my even making the comparison. He knows the game and can anticipate the game several plays ahead. His physical and ball skills are pretty solid for the slasher type of player he best shows. He does show flashes of overthinking (passing when he should be shooting- although that hasn't been in evidence in this GC) and was frustratingly static last night when he needed to be showing hard for the ball, not standing around waiting for it, or jogging to it.
I still haven't quite figured out what type of forward he needs to partner up with- he and Davies combined really well, but Davies had a fantastic/rare combo of being able to be a hold-up player using his wrestling strength/agility AND stretch teams with his pace. Buddle, Findley, Agudelo and Wondo haven't brought out the best from Jozy by any means, or vice-versa. Seems to me, he needs somebody who can play closer to him to allow for more short-passing combinations- even if it's the attacking central MF.
Steve Tasker
Footballguy
I still maintain that EJ is the worst player I've ever seen when he doesn't have the ball.
El Floppo
Footballguy
Totally agree- although GK hasn't exactly been a weak spot for the US. But yeah- his shot-blocking has always been fantastic, but agree that his ability to handle the cross has improved a ton since moving to Everton.'NewlyRetired said:
I think too that Boca seems to read the field better from the middle. I agree that he's not the answer at LB.
I hope you're wrong, but having pointed it out, I see what you're saying.
Benny and Holden out hurts the US a lot. A couple of us looked up last night wondering what personnel was there on the bench to actually make a difference in the game for the US. Bedoya brought hustle, but I'm stll not sold on the kid and his decision making or skills (went at multiple players too many times without success- I appreciate the guts, but not if it's not working). Sascha...
. They need Holden and Benny healthy or that MF is paper thin. Davies... sigh. I hope he can return to the player he was- I really do. I'm extremely doubtful, based on what I've seen so far and based on the injuries he suffered. Why the #### did he get in that car?! 
and as always... #### Rossi.Again, I've been a supporter of Bradley straight along. I played against his Princeton teams and got to see first hand how he was able to get an inferior group of players competing through tactical discipline. I feel like it's been the same for the US; he's slightly tweaked the formation over the years to try and get the most out of our best players while keeping the defensive shape intact against the better teams. But there's been no real progress at the national level. The team seems to have stagnated and those results andy posted are pretty eye-opening (at least for me) after a tepid WC. Add in that the US routinely starts poorly and concedes goals and possession out the gate... a lot of that has to be put on the coach if it keeps happening the way it has.5) Bradley is in a tough spot. I believe he is going to be in jeopardy to lose his job if we get dumped in the quarters when it is combined with the lack luster first round and the pretty poor run up of games we have had that I listed earlier in the thread. This is obviously not good for development of players. Instead of letting players like Ream and Agudelo work through their issues, he is forced to put a team that can win this minute and some of these players are not going to be around in 2014. That being said, I think Gus Hiddink is still available
Barring a strong run in the remainder of the GC, I'm starting to finally shift to the mindset that the team needs a new direction from the coach. That said- even a guy like Hiddink or Klinsmann isn't going to squeeze diamonds out of the coal-mine of US players available to him. But something has to change for teh better, and soon.
I'd have to think Wondo did enough in training, combined with Agudelo's play, to warrant a start in Bradley's eyes. He sure as hell didn't show me much through the TV screen.Speaking of Agudelo- just as people were yelling at Jozy to go to the ball last night, I've been yelling at Agudelo to make certain runs the first two games. It's harder to determine what's going on through the TV vs live, but even on screen, I see plays opening up and he stays ball-watching for too long. He's still young, and is soooo talented and seemingly willing to work hard for his team- I just want those runs made dammit.
I agree- goals aside, he's showing a lot of those flashes that got us all excited about him. I feel like he's been turning and taking guys on a number of times these first games and showing some nice touch in the process. He also, as I mentioned earlier, has been combining well with the central MF- either Jones or Bradley- when one of them pushes forward. The hold-up game is still not there obviously- and it may never be. And yeah- that play in the box andy mentioned was pretty great- even though I would've liked to have seen him touch the ball to wide-open Wondo square when it got caught under foot, rather than take the time/touch to try to open up his own shot.... but I also am liking the selfishness that a forward needs when they get in the box.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
he was arguably the laziest player I ever saw. He never ever ran. And what a shame because when he did actually move, he was pretty fluid.This is part of the great gap that Z was referring to earlier. It was the first group of US players that got way too cocky way to young and went down wrong paths. The two top offensive players at this age group at the U17 level were Eddie Johnson and Santino Quaranta. Both kids went pro very early and were not protected from the lifestyle. Each of these players got into trouble with drugs and alcohol, Santino enough that he was basically out of the sport before he got cleaned up.EJ was such a mess in Dallas that the league had to institute some protection for kids being drafted so young so that they could still have a family structure.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Believe me, I don't want to be more wrong about anything but this has been nagging at me for 6 months now.
I like Bedoya more than you do. He made some decent runs and basically put a goal on Dempsey's foot that your son would have buried. I also saw that he did take on too many players at once, but some times that is better than always going backwards. At least they have to think about it. He is getting some decent playing time for a kid that did not even make the roster initially.He is playing and playing very well in a minor European league, so hopefully he is a kid that can keep developing. We need it because he is in the age group that will be important at WC2014, when our current side is going to have too many players >32.
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And it's not like it's been a slow decline. It's like LD hit a wall.
El Floppo
Footballguy
Yeah- seemed like that gear was there for the WC, and *poof*
El Floppo
Footballguy
I always hope for the best for all the US young guns (and old ones too). And like you say, he wasn't even supposed to be in this camp, and even still has beaten out other guys for playing time. He's clearly showing Bradley things in training that Rogers and Adu must not be.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
This is great in that I am not going crazy. This blows because maybe it is as bad as I think it is :(I have not noticed a single media member mentioning this and they cover the team day in and day out so I am hoping that maybe it is just an illusion to some of us.One scary thing is that Prefontaine has always posed the theory that Bradley tactics were in place to enhance LD's specific skill set. If he no longer uses one of the best weapons from that set, do the tactics even make sense any more?
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El Floppo
Footballguy
To be honest- I haven't seen an Gal games this year other than vs BullMetros, so I'm basing my LD observations just on USMNT play... and even that is highly colored by these last three games where he really hasn't seemed to have the step.
El Floppo
Footballguy
IMO, it seems like it's for LD and Dempsey both.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
We will have an excellent chance to witness this first hand on Sunday. RFK is reportedly going to have a very large ELS crowd for the second game. Will be interesting to see if they come and root for the US or only show up for the second game.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
All 5 Mexican players who failed the drug test in May were retested and all passed. CONCACAF has requested a second set of samples from the failed May test to retest them.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Meteoric rise for Chandler
Supporters of Bob Bradley's U.S. team don't have to worry about a possible Chandler defection -- a spokesman of the German Football Association told SI.com that Chandler, who has dual-citizenship, is no longer under consideration for a call-up. (FIFA regulations allow players to switch sides before their first competitive match). "He was being looked at," the spokesman said, "but after his debut for the U.S .and his statements about identifying with America we don't see him playing for Germany in the future." It's Joachim Löw's loss, really. After Philipp Lahm's switch to the left-back position, Germany is crying out for a decent right back.
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Should I be happy or are the Gerry's doing a "pay no attention to the man behind the curtain"?
Supporters of Bob Bradley's U.S. team don't have to worry about a possible Chandler defection -- a spokesman of the German Football Association told SI.com that Chandler, who has dual-citizenship, is no longer under consideration for a call-up. (FIFA regulations allow players to switch sides before their first competitive match). "He was being looked at," the spokesman said, "but after his debut for the U.S .and his statements about identifying with America we don't see him playing for Germany in the future." It's Joachim Löw's loss, really. After Philipp Lahm's switch to the left-back position, Germany is crying out for a decent right back.
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Should I be happy or are the Gerry's doing a "pay no attention to the man behind the curtain"?
For the last three or four years it made sense because those two were clearly head and shoulders above the rest of the team.
prefontaine
Footballguy
And despite those two seeming to fall off, no one is really clamoring to take that mantle at the moment. I could see that changing maybe if Holden gets healthy for qualifying. But unfortunately, there isn't a real guy you build a team around out there. Mikey is a worker bee. Who else is there really? We have a very depressing roster at the moment. Lot of very average players with no wings and no forwards. I'm not sure what tactics would even make sense but you certainly have to consider a change. But I'm not entirely convinced LD isn't just sick honestly. But Andy sees him more so now I'm a bit worried. Dempsey has certainly played better but he's amazingly inconsistent for us so I expect he'll bounce back.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
I am going to hold out final judgement until the MLS season is done on Landon. I may very well just be convincing myself of short term problem into a permanent one. I would love to actually see him take some one on or even get behind the defense once against Jamaica. It will make me feel better. With Cherundolo overlapping at every chance, Landon never seems to get a chance though.
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Dempsey has fallen off? He just has his best year as a pro.
El Floppo
Footballguy
Yeah- true. But this goes back to country vs club for Dempsey. I still maintain that he has typically worked harder for club than country- Ive seen him in identical situations for each within weeks, and he just consistently makes the extra effort for the cottagers. That said- it seems like he's upped his game for the US and has been our most consistent player... last night's whoops-fest aside (and actually, I agree with Christo who thought Demps played a solid game on the night outside of the 6 yard box).
El Floppo
Footballguy
THis was exactly the sequence of thoughts I had. But now I'm still in the worried camp... thanks andy.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Never listen to the pessimist on the thread
Until Ives, Wahl or Goff write something on this I am going to assume this is a figment of my [eore voice]"The US is doomed"[\eore voice] imagination.
prefontaine
Footballguy
Hard to say honestly. He hasn't played well over the last 4 game span that everyone is freaking about. Is he awful? No, of course not (finishing notwithstanding). He's still a class above just about everyone else. He's honestly one of the few bright players we have. When he doesn't bring his best, it makes us as a team look poor. But he's always been a bit inconsistent for the Nats. Part of that is we expect him to take on more of a creative role than Fulham does because we have no other players that can. We put a lot on his shoulders. If you match up our best performances over the last few years, it's when Dempsey is truly outstanding. More so than Donovan imo (mostly because LD is more consistent). But you are right, falling off is harsh.
The Z Machine
Footballguy
My wife said in reference to Dempsey, "He's like a government worker. He knows he can't be fired for sucking at his job."
Good Posting Judge
Footballguy
Montserrat goes down 5-2 in front of a "home" crowd of 150. :(
http://www.fifa.com/worldcup/news/newsid=1453094/
Does anyone have a link to how the WC qualifying works? 632 games is pretty intense.
http://www.fifa.com/worldcup/news/newsid=1453094/
Does anyone have a link to how the WC qualifying works? 632 games is pretty intense.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Wiki is the best site. Note that every region is different in how they handle qualifying. Wiki breaks it all down nicelyhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_FIFA_World_Cup_qualification
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Here is a good stat to help jinx the US.
Jamaica has never won an elimination game in the Gold Cup
Jamaica has never won an elimination game in the Gold Cup
Good Posting Judge
Footballguy
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
This article coupled with what we are now going to call the "Z Gap" is very disconcerting. I had not realized that even as MLS has expanded that the amount of young players playing was so little.
http://www.socceramerica.com/article/42581/wheres-the-future-talent.html
http://www.socceramerica.com/article/42581/wheres-the-future-talent.html
El Floppo
Footballguy
He's not under 23 (he IS 23), but Austin da Luz has looked pretty good for the StarBulls during the GC, now in his 2nd year (after being injured a lot of his rookie season). He seems to be a natural lefty, flank MF with nice skills and vision. I guess he's "older" because he went through college. Hah- college.
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